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Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Charlie_ on June 05, 2017, 09:58:03 PM

Title: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 05, 2017, 09:58:03 PM
Hello, this thread is for me to show off my 15th century collection.

This was first started in 2015 as a Game of Thrones project, before I made the switch to fully historical. At first it was going to represent 'generic' European armies of the late 15th century, before I eventually made another change and found a niche conflict to focus on - the War of the Burgundian Succession (1477-1493).

In 2022 I started a blog, and all the new posts there are now repeated on this thread in full.
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

June 2017

Just trying out my new camera : )

(http://i.imgur.com/gHUY5F6.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/5VX9YPW.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/qFs4QZ3.jpg)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: ErikB on June 05, 2017, 10:02:52 PM
Very nice.

I need to ask, what are you using for the edging on the horses' barding (not sure if that's what it's called)?

That wavy section with the dots in the middle is especially nice.

Do you use a flat brush?  Something with a perfect and new tip? 

I have a hard time with that particular kind of detailing and would sure like to know how you did it.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Ray Rivers on June 05, 2017, 10:30:32 PM
They look excellent!  :-*

Especially the markings on the horses.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Charlie_ on June 05, 2017, 11:07:48 PM
Thanks!

I need to ask, what are you using for the edging on the horses' barding (not sure if that's what it's called)?

Well the 'dots' are actually part of the sculpt, intricate little studs. Everyone moans about painting these Perry Miniatures horses, but I don't bother painting the studs metal, I just keep them the same colour as the rest of the horse harness :) Keep things a bit easier and looks fine to me, especially on the tabletop. And I've also shaved them off on some horses, like the chestnut one here as you can see.
Admittedly horses can be a real chore to do, so I have recently honed it down to quite a simple method to get through them quickly. All the harness is done in the same colour, and the horse flesh is usually just some brown or another with a dark wash or two over it. On these examples, the middle one has a re-highlight in the original colour, but the other two are just basecoats and washes. The black leg markings are also several more coats of dark wash, rather than actually painting them black.

Especially the markings on the horses.

Yes, I'm quite pleased with how the white leg markings have photographed...
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Phil Portway on June 06, 2017, 09:02:24 AM
great paint jobs. The horses look fab, especially  :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Romark on June 06, 2017, 09:38:17 AM
Great work on those minis  :)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Breazer on June 06, 2017, 10:49:13 AM
excellent minis charlie. Great stuff.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Arlequín on June 06, 2017, 03:38:53 PM
Yes nice work on those!  :)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on June 06, 2017, 03:44:27 PM
Fantastic - well done :-*
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Charlie_ on June 06, 2017, 04:24:40 PM
Thanks everyone, glad you like them!

I'm particularly pleased with how they've photographed. This is pretty much the default settings on my new camera, with just two lamps with daylight bulbs placed either side. Seems to do the trick! I'll probably post more up here as I experiment.... I've got loads more cavalry, these are just some of my favourites.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Captain Blood on June 06, 2017, 06:01:26 PM
That's a good camera Charlie. They look great  8)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: OSHIROmodels on June 06, 2017, 06:05:32 PM
Lovely  :)

cheers

James
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Mr.J on June 06, 2017, 06:18:25 PM
Ooh very nice. The horses are particularly good.
Out of curiosity what kind of camera are you using?
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: painterman on June 06, 2017, 06:33:56 PM
Very neat and useful figures.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: henryv on June 06, 2017, 07:50:30 PM
Great stuff, but the horses really are superb.
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: SirGromit on June 07, 2017, 08:41:27 PM
Very nice especially the armour effect! :)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: dinohunterpoa on June 08, 2017, 08:40:39 PM

Perfect, CONGRATULATIONS! :-*
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Charlie_ on June 08, 2017, 11:18:36 PM
Some more, including parts from the light cavalry set (and a few very minor conversions, see if you can spot them).

(http://i.imgur.com/X1oSldO.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ITvGqZ9.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/c4snlpi.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/4KQdh9r.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/VIrzsIW.jpg)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms....
Post by: Charlie_ on June 08, 2017, 11:21:19 PM
Out of curiosity what kind of camera are you using?

Nikon Coolpix L340
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: bluechi on June 09, 2017, 04:50:08 AM
Nice painting....to look more like HRR could be usefull to take more german style helmets.... (Schaller style).
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: Arlequín on June 09, 2017, 06:17:36 AM
I really like these, especially the faces. Very impressive.  :)
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 11, 2017, 09:22:26 AM
I really like these, especially the faces.

Its the faces I put the most effort into, and enjoy doing the most!
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: Codsticker on June 11, 2017, 02:07:04 PM
Its the faces I put the most effort into, and enjoy doing the most!
The 5 o'clock shadow is very well done. :D
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: tomrommel1 on June 12, 2017, 09:57:50 AM
very nice indeed
Title: Re: Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: Breazer on June 16, 2017, 03:31:52 PM
Really love the banners man!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: GamesPoet on June 17, 2017, 01:02:10 PM
Liking the looks of these!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some Germanic men-at-arms (new additions June 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 17, 2017, 11:08:25 PM
Thanks for all the kind comments. I'm particularly pleased that you seem to like the horses, as I'm still new to painting them.

There is plenty more cavalry (28 so far), but I'll hold off on a group shot until I've upped that number and can assemble them into some good looking units.

In the meantime, here is a load of infantry!

These are all supposed to be 'generic' infantry with polearms... billmen, halberdiers, etc, with a scattering of men-at-arms (one of the units you'll see is noticeably 'heavier', with a higher number of men-at-arms). This is just how they are currently arranged into units - it will change frequently depending on what new stuff I have painted up and how I want to field them in games. All in three ranks, at least 7 wide (I think 9 wide looks the best, and I've got some unit trays for 10 wide too). There are plenty of different flags which can be switched around so it's mixed up for each new game - these are the four I have right now which look the best for these units.

Some of you may have seen some of these in a Game of Thrones thread I started on the fantasy board. That's how this project started, but I've decided to pack that in and make the switch over to proper historical. Fortunately all that really has meant is re-doing the flags, as my Game of Thrones vision was very low-fantasy (pretty much no-fantasy). Two of these flags are from the GoT project, from relatively obscure houses. One I've kept as it's very simple and generic, and the other because I think it looks great (the 'pinup' one - it was for House Piper, and the image was taken from the World Of Ice And Fire book). I'm not sure if there are any historical examples of heraldry with a scantily clad woman like this (as opposed to one more 'saintly'), but I'm inclined to keep it!

(http://i.imgur.com/6jNZLPc.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/LIcRdbb.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/SgjN8Ve.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/9vvSB1B.jpg)

And a shot of all of them together, to give you an idea of the sort of games I've been playing...

(http://i.imgur.com/3tX3Cna.jpg)

And closeups.

(http://i.imgur.com/rHK6Fk7.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ZWBl1GT.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/DBgyba9.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/yhTPSK9.jpg)


Sometimes certain faces I paint end up looking really good and full of character... even the often badly cast Perry metals! I think what on this one turned out looking like a scar down his face was some sort of miscast. But it's turned out as one of my favourite faces!

(http://i.imgur.com/YoeK2ZX.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: dinohunterpoa on June 18, 2017, 02:26:24 AM

AWESOME brushwork and unit cohesion, CONGRATULATIONS!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: levied troop on June 18, 2017, 06:11:53 AM
Brilliant group shots, that's some good painting and arranging.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Phil Portway on June 18, 2017, 08:53:21 AM
Fabulous individually, but on mass, WOW  :o :o :o 8) :o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on June 18, 2017, 08:56:27 AM
Cracking collection  :)

cheers

James
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Colonel Tubby on June 18, 2017, 10:00:26 AM
Great work, they look great ranked up together. Can't wait to see more.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Captain Blood on June 18, 2017, 03:57:36 PM
Looking good Charlie.
Some very nice plastic builds in there  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: tomrommel1 on June 19, 2017, 06:44:42 AM
 :o :o :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 21, 2017, 09:46:41 AM
Thanks, glad you all like them!

There are plenty more on the way, I'll just wait into they are 'photo ready' in suitable large units.

As said before, a lot of them are undergoing a re-arranging process. I've got just as many longbowmen as I do billmen/halberdiers, and they are being re-done as an English mercenary company.

I've also by now grown tired of painting Perry plastic infantry, in particular the bodies from the WOTR / Mercenaries boxes (I have done a LOT of them so far), so I'm now enjoying working on cavalry, and painting lots of their metal range (they seem to be getting done much quicker than the plastics for some reason).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Breazer on June 22, 2017, 08:20:45 AM
These look amazing charlie. That banner with the lady on it looks awesome too. If you wouldnt mind sharing it i'd love to use one of those for one of my projects. All of them collected looks great. you have quite the collection there.

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 22, 2017, 05:45:45 PM
That banner with the lady on it looks awesome too. If you wouldnt mind sharing it i'd love to use one of those for one of my projects.

I'd be happy to share it. PM on the way!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Loads of infantry! (June 18th)
Post by: rivers3162 on June 22, 2017, 07:11:42 PM
These really are fantastic! The big units look great - I'm trying to work up the enthusiasm to work my way through the 12 WotR infantry boxes I've accumulated and I can only hope they turn out half as nicely as yours look.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows and handguns (July 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 01, 2017, 10:37:47 PM
I'm trying to work up the enthusiasm to work my way through the 12 WotR infantry boxes I've accumulated

That's a lot of boxes! Good luck!
I don't know how many plastic Perry boxes I've got through with this project, it's  not as many as 12 of the WOTR ones, but over 12 overall, of the 5 different boxes.

This week I finished painting up some of the Perry metals - the Italian handgunners and crossbowmen, who will be welcome as mercenaries for my German project.

Nothing special here, but it's a chance to try out some brighter colours. I really like these sculpts, they are in such great poses you can't really get with the plastic kits.

(http://i.imgur.com/XpRuK1w.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/AzH0m00.jpg)

The varnish is barely dry, and they are being recruited for their first battle tomorrow! I plan to take lots of photos and write up a full battle report. Watch this space....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows and handguns (July 1st)
Post by: Marine0846 on July 02, 2017, 04:27:51 AM
Nice collection of figures.
Love them.
Plastic Perry's are great.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows and handguns (July 1st)
Post by: Sunjester on July 02, 2017, 05:29:57 AM
Very nice!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows and handguns (July 1st)
Post by: Jeff965 on July 02, 2017, 11:47:44 AM
Lovely stuff Charlie :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows and handguns (July 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 02, 2017, 06:39:49 PM
Well I had a game today, and took notes and pics for a battle report, but completely forgot to take any close-up shots except this one! (and even then it could have come out better)

(http://i.imgur.com/5oJcWyw.jpg)

Anyway, here the set-up...

This was a game with my friend Shaun who I have been getting into wargaming recently, using my collection. He's won all the games he's played so far!

The vague setting is some sort of low level border dispute / private war somewhere in medieval Germany, with lots of mercenaries involved (including the Company Of The Rose, longbowmen under veteran English soldier Sir John Doe).

(http://i.imgur.com/AOOUHeN.jpg)

The scenario saw the forces arriving on the table in two waves. The defender (Shaun, in red on the map) started with an advance guard of 10 men-at-arms and 10 crossbowmen set up within the walled fields. His light/medium cavalry entered from the far corner on turn one, and the rest of his infantry (mostly consisting of the Company of the Rose, plus his commander) entered anywhere on his table edge on turn 2. I (in green on the maps) had my army divided into two divisions, and I had to write down in secret which would enter on turn 1 (and at which entry point), and which on turn 2 (again at which entry point).

These were the forces.... First, Shaun's advance guard.

(http://i.imgur.com/8BajUhL.jpg)

And the rest of his forces - his commander and one unit of halberds, his cavalry, plus the large Company of the Rose.

(http://i.imgur.com/NmyiYGb.jpg)

My first division, featuring my commander leading the cavalry (heavier than Shaun's horse), plus some halberds and longbowmen.

(http://i.imgur.com/mwRxSgZ.jpg)

And my second division, featuring two big units of men-at-arms / bills, plus detachments of crossbows, handguns and longbows (including the new Italians).

(http://i.imgur.com/XidMqAY.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!
Post by: Charlie_ on July 02, 2017, 07:03:40 PM
So this is what happened. My commander's division entered the field opposite Shaun's horse.

(http://i.imgur.com/p6FP7Ab.jpg)

Who scurried out of the way as I advanced towards them.

(http://i.imgur.com/588Sgr6.jpg)

They had a near miss when the rest of our forces entered the game, but they managed to make it across to the other side to threaten the flank of my newly arrived infantry.
Shaun's infantry mostly formed a strong battleline to hold against my commander's division, whilst a couple of units entered the fields to assist the defenders there. Their commander watched from his horse.

There was missile fire throughout the game, but it didn't prove too game-changing on either side. I was nervous of my cavalry heading straight towards a mass of longbowmen, but it seems these apparent veterans weren't very effective at range! However two arrows did actually hit my commander, but luckily they both glanced off his armour.

(http://i.imgur.com/7vXBYTk.jpg)

I had to reform some of my forces to face the threat of Shaun's cavalry now on my flank, whilst my heaviest infantry unit assaulted the walls which were defended by some seriously outnumbered crossbowmen.... but completely failed to shift them!

Meanwhile my cavalry had charged into Shaun's right flank with infantry close behind.... But it didn't go well for them and they failed to break through.

There was skirmishing around the walls with missiles from both sides. Some of Shaun's advance guard also leapt out from their position to attack a small group of Italian handgunners at close quarters.

(http://i.imgur.com/n168uXa.jpg)

Meanwhile on my left, the infantry had come to support the failed cavalry charge but it was too late. Both of my units were broken, and I lost my commander - Shaun's infantry surged forward in pursuit.

(http://i.imgur.com/rWquDtf.jpg)

I was sure my heavy infantry unit would make it over the wall, but amazingly Shaun's defenders still held, as his commander rode up to offer his support.

However I had some brief satisfaction when my Italian handgunners managed to not only survive being assaulted by some heavily armoured men-at-arms, but managed to beat them back! Shaun's cavalry meanwhile had charged some of my longbowmen and were driving them back towards my remaining unengaged halberds, who were a bit unsure of what to do and remained in place.

However with my left wing broken and my commander dead, things didn't look good. Some Italian crossbowmen were the first to turn and run (with their employer dead, they didn't see much need to stick around!). Shaun's right wing advanced on my flank, and it was looking like I was going to be surrounded as I had failed to break through the walls. Thus I conceded defeat, and my second-in-command negotiated peace terms with the enemy!


Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: Breazer on July 03, 2017, 10:36:24 PM
Very nice battle report. I am still very impressed with the vastnes of your force. Great stuff to see.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: dinohunterpoa on July 04, 2017, 06:27:06 PM

AWESOME mins, scenery and AAR, CONGRATULATIONS!  :-*

"Sir John Doe" is PRICELESS!!!  lol lol lol lol lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: Metternich on July 04, 2017, 06:47:38 PM
Very effective painting.  A fine collection.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: rivers3162 on July 05, 2017, 07:34:47 AM
A very nice collection! Those large infantry blocks are particularly impressive. The Italian gunners and crossbowmen also look a lot nicer than I previously thought - may have to get some myself.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: Madhouse Workshop on July 05, 2017, 12:10:48 PM
Not a period I'm into, but I can appreciate the good work and dedication you put in to it.  Good stuff.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Italian crossbows/handguns (July 1st) plus AAR!!!
Post by: Charlie_ on July 05, 2017, 04:35:00 PM
I am still very impressed with the vastnes of your force.

Lots more to come! I'm currently working on bulking up the cavalry to several units worth, and starting a big pike block.

I've only played 5 battles with this collection and ruleset so far, and after every battle I analyse what 'felt right' and what didn't, and how I should adapt things. After this one I'm thinking the key is BIG units! Works better both in terms of gameplay and aesthetics. So I've been making some bigger unit trays, 10 wide this time, to make my infantry units (shown in earlier posts) all larger. Same for my formed cavalry units (it's such a shame to see one lucky round of shooting reduce them to almost half strength before they make contact).
I'm also not painting one single longbowman more. Currently my infantry is nearly 50% longbowmen, meaning all the games so far have featured large archer units. I need more handguns and crossbows, and pikes of course!

The Italian gunners and crossbowmen also look a lot nicer than I previously thought - may have to get some myself.

They really are nice models. The casts aren't very good, but if you are familiar with Perry metals you know what to expect. The sculpts themselves are brilliant though. The natural looking poses and realistic dimensions are spot on, and the distinctive Italian clothing on half of them is fun. The poses are far better than any handgun/crossbows I've managed to make out of the plastic kits.

I wish they'd made a few more sets of these.... All those Napoleonic players are spoilt rotten by the Perry twins! Imagine if the WOTR / European Armies ranges had the same treatment? We'd have specific sets for Italian crossbowmen, Swiss crossbowmen, German crossbowmen, French crossbowmen.... a set of each for 'skirmishing' poses, a set for 'advancing' poses, etc.... Then the same again for handguns. Oh how I wish they'd return to these ranges....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 16, 2017, 07:55:32 PM
I had another game this weekend. A couple of friends were visiting from London, one of whom has been very excited about having a game since I first told him I was doing this two years ago. So this was his first game, and he was very keen.
Luckily for him he won. Seems I lose every time, perhaps I'm being too soft on my friends as I want them to enjoy the games? Perhaps it's time for me to be a bit ruthless now and give them a taste of defeat!!!!

So here's the setup....

(http://i.imgur.com/A20UHj3.jpg)

I had the right-hand table edge. Two divisions of longbowmen and men-at-arms, one on the left in the walled field, and one in the centre safe behind the thick hedges, with my commander. I had a unit of billmen to the right on the other side of the hege, and a unit of light / medium cavalry.

(http://i.imgur.com/pit30dN.jpg)

Opposing me Jan had all his heavy infantry (men-at-arms / halberds, plus the Italian skirmishers) in the centre. He had his heavy cavalry out on the left flank, and some crossbowmen lurking behind the hedges on his right

(http://i.imgur.com/ehjQpmh.jpg)

My longbowmen, the Company of the Rose, hope to rush forward and take up a defensive position behind the stone wall.

(http://i.imgur.com/bhdpV3u.jpg)

The opening moves..... With both cavalry units facing eachother, there was bloodshed on turn one. My smaller, lighter unit raced forward, perhaps hoping to divert or distract Jan's heavier men-at-arms... But they answered the challenge, crashed straight into my unit and scattered them completely!
Meanwhile my left wing raced forward to claim the wall. Jan sent one infantry unit off to his right to face them, and his crossbowmen in the hedges took some pot shots. He sent his skirmishers forward, whilst his main infantry block waited patiently to see how things would unfold.

(http://i.imgur.com/zcWZnDC.jpg)

Next, his cavalry reformed ready to attack my right wing next turn - I had one rather small unit of billmen there, which attempted to fall back to face the cavalry, but got a bit disordered and messed up their formation in doing so - things didn't look good for them!
The infantry on his right flank also assaulted my defensive position at the wall, and succeeded in driving my longbowmen back, though he didn't quite break them.
My longbowmen in the centre, sheltered behind their hedge, took down some of his advancing skirmishers, but his main infantry reserve remained out of range.

(http://i.imgur.com/T2kStZB.jpg)

The inevitable happened, and Jan's cavalry crashed into the billmen on the right, and sent them running.
He decided now was the time to move in the for kill, and his infantry reserve marched forward. They took a fair few casualties as they came into range of my archers, but they did not falter.
On my left flank, the fighting in the walled field continued. Jan's crossbowmen broke cover from behind their hedge, and moved up in support.

(http://i.imgur.com/LVfkkX5.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/q4f95If.jpg)

My commander, safe in his defensive position, started to get a bit nervous as his right wing was ridden down just over the hedge to his right....

(http://i.imgur.com/32epVKJ.jpg)

And he decided to cut his losses and run, leaving just his mercenary archers on the field. With their employer fled, they were quick to lay down their weapons.

This is how the table looked at the end of the game.

(http://i.imgur.com/gk09DvG.jpg)


It was a great battle! Again, many things for me to think about on how to tweak the rules, or rather helping me see what sort of games, forces and unit sizes work best with these rules to make a gaming experience that 'feels' right.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Phil Portway on July 24, 2017, 01:06:00 PM
Nice looking game, and I like the way you "lock" the terrain boards in situ
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: von Lucky on July 24, 2017, 02:12:48 PM
Agree, good looking game.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 26, 2017, 11:42:03 PM
Nice looking game, and I like the way you "lock" the terrain boards in situ


Thanks, I'm pretty pleased with that little invention.... If you can see on the pics, the 'table' is actually two small drop-leaf tables. There are two 8-foot pieces of timber, which are bolted to another MDF board in the middle - this bridges the gap between the tables, and locks the side pieces together as a frame. It means the terrain boards and locked in pretty tight (helped by some strategically placed bits of folded card) so they are in no danger of shifting, and the whole thing is easily dismantled for storage.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on July 29, 2017, 08:49:33 PM
Superb looking table and a great set of mini's, I've followed your GOT thread and know how good your painting is. What rule set are you using for these?
I was looking at using HC for WOTR and my GOT armies, using the crossbow rules for hand gunners in  WOTR.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on July 30, 2017, 08:30:25 AM
That is one good looking game. Well done!

You might have written it somewhere but I was distracted by the pretty pictures. But are you playing homegrown rules?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Norm on July 30, 2017, 08:57:08 AM
Thanks for sharing this project from start to game - very enjoyable.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Breazer on July 31, 2017, 07:38:35 AM
This looks so good. I'm a bit jealous since I dont really have anyone to play with. You do make me want to pick up those late 15th century models again and start painting. The new banners are also a very pretty sight. As you said there are plenty more coming I'd say keep them coming!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - another BATTLE REPORT (16th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 31, 2017, 03:41:17 PM
Thanks guys, glad you are enjoying the battle reports.

But are you playing homegrown rules?

Yes, they are my own rules. I won't pretend they are completely unique, but take ideas from different games and some of my own to make a ruleset I like. I don't know whether they would appeal to every one, using singly-based models in ranked up units, and individual casualty removal... but I think they work nicely for both small skirmishes and larger massed battles.

I was looking at using HC for WOTR and my GOT armies, using the crossbow rules for hand gunners in  WOTR.

I'll be using Hail Caesar one day when I have a much bigger table and much larger forces. I prefer my rules for games at this scale, but if in the distant future I am playing on a huge table with  hundreds of models per side, HC might be more appropriate. I tried for a game at this scale, and though it worked fine, it didn't really offer anything special that my rules don't do.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 14, 2017, 09:13:14 PM
Ok, time for an update!

I've been painting lots more cavalry. I'm up to 36 now, but I'll hold off on a group shot til I have the unit looking right - currently it's a bit of a random mix, I want to get the right balance of heavy, medium and light cavalry in there.

But here's some of my favourites....

(http://i.imgur.com/VomZUwe.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/C1EwTDt.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/0zQIeAE.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/22ksDRK.jpg)

I wanted to make lots of 'medium' cavalry, rather than everything falling into the categories of 'heavy' and 'light'. Models that will look good in either sort of unit.

The most obvious method is to use the body with the livery coat and the light lance from the mounted men-at-arms box.

(http://i.imgur.com/mH8efdS.jpg)

There's also this body in the light cavalry box I really like, with riding boots and armoured legs. To make him not so 'light', I did a hand swap to give him some gloves/gauntlets.

(http://i.imgur.com/DDSuRKI.jpg)

That body is in an odd twisting-in-the-saddle position, but it can easily be cut and re-positioned like on this one. I also gave him gauntlets and a heavy lance - he looks like a 'poorer' man-at-arms to me.

(http://i.imgur.com/su8QfDk.jpg)

And this one uses the brigandine body from the light cavalry box, with armoured arms - one from the heavy cavalry box, and one (almost) matching one from the mercenary command sprue with an added besagew.

(http://i.imgur.com/cU1N3vL.jpg)


I also did a cannon. I was tempted to paint it red or some other colour, but in the end opted for just plain wood, and am glad I did. I'm very pleased with how it turned out. It was a nightmare to paint as it wasn't on a base, and to get underneath it I was having to turn it around in my hands and the paint kept rubbing off. Got there in the end though. It's basically just one shade of brown and one silver, all hit with a couple of dark washes.
I'm also pretty pleased with how the one crewman's yellow shirt turned out.

(http://i.imgur.com/V3OHKR4.jpg)



Ok, now here's some unpainted stuff I've been preparing... pikemen! I really like these metal sculpts from the Perrys (the front rank 'attacking' ones are admittedly far superior than the back rank 'advancing' ones though, better sculpts, cleaner casts and with a more interesting selection of armour).

(http://i.imgur.com/droX7zV.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/xh36ZWl.jpg)

This unit's gonna get bigger, and there will be other pike units in the future, all using these same sculpts. So to keep them fresh I've been doing some headswaps.... and have made an interesting discovery. A while back I got a couple of packs of Foundry WOTR archers and crossbowmen, hoping they would scale well with the Perry figs.... but no, they are all at least a head shorter, and so they've been sitting in a drawer for ages. But I realised they all have very usable heads, with an interesting selection of helmets... They all sawed off very easy, as did the ones on the Perry figs.... Perfect easy headswaps! I'm actually gonna order some more of these Foundry packs just for the heads!

(http://i.imgur.com/k5nugOm.jpg)

And here's some others with new Perry heads, a few plastics, plus a few which had been liberated from other models to make way for the Foundry ones.

(http://i.imgur.com/5HYRwa4.jpg)

You might also notice one of my cavalrymen up above has a Foundry head, and I've found some of them are perfect for light cavalry / mounted crossbowmen....

That's all for now folks!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Captain Blood on August 14, 2017, 09:26:28 PM
Very nice work Charlie. Some of those cavalry builds are corkers. i may even pinch a couple of those  ;)

Just need to paint the studs on the tack, eh... ?  lol (They're a pain, aren't they?!)

The gun and crew looks great too.

I need a couple more guns... I've got plenty of spare crew to paint. just need a couple more medieval field pieces from somewhere... An organ gun would be nice...  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 14, 2017, 09:32:48 PM
Just need to paint the studs on the tack, eh... ?  lol (They're a pain, aren't they?!)

Bugger that, not worth the pain! I make sure that they still stand out with some shadow around them, and think that looks good... or just shave them off. I don't paint the studs on the brigandines either!

Quote
I need a couple more guns... I've got plenty of spare crew to paint. just need a couple more medieval field pieces from somewhere... An organ gun would be nice...  :)

Yeah I'm gonna do the two Perry ones, and later probably get another one from Foundry which looks like it will fit in with them perfectly. I'll probably use the crew from the Perry bombard for that (and the actual bombard will be used more as terrain piece / objective for certain scenarios). I'd also like an organ gun - I think Old Glory do one?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: painterman on August 14, 2017, 10:04:34 PM
More lovely figures Charlie - you're building an impressive force up pretty swiftly.
Like the pike conversions too - will nab some of them for my Swiss.
Regards, Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: bluechi on August 15, 2017, 12:02:52 AM
@Charlie my workbench look the same at the moment :D

@painterman with some perry european heads 1490-xx the figures looks like the picture of the battle of Dornach...altough works the wotr plastic knights together with the hyw french infantry arms very well to make some attacking heavy helbards for the third rank. Some salet from the other plastic boxes makes it really historic.But what should i write to a profi

Stuart have some special guns in his army...
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Utgaard on August 15, 2017, 12:07:27 PM
Very lovely collection  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on August 15, 2017, 12:24:34 PM
They are all great but the guy with the 5 o'clock shadow is my favorite of the bunch.

The pike unit will look awesome once painted.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Phil Portway on August 16, 2017, 08:45:49 AM
I'm with Dr Z. with the fave figure
 :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: JollyBob on August 16, 2017, 09:20:08 AM
These are at least six kinds of awesome, absolutely stunning builds and painting.

Personally I think the Foundry figures make for some nice variety in the ranks, but yeah, the new Perry's are slightly taller.

I'd also like an organ gun - I think Old Glory do one?

I have the Ribaudequin from Redoubt (about halfway down the page):

http://www.redoubtenterprises.com/shop/?page=shop/browse&category_id=eb73981cf64d4b195808a2977a1bfb79

Crewed with the Foundry gun crew.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 16, 2017, 05:21:28 PM
Thanks guys, glad you all like them!

They are all great but the guy with the 5 o'clock shadow is my favorite of the bunch.

They always look better with a bit of stubble I find, it's tempting not to give them all a 5 o clock shadow!

It's done with just a light, careful wash of grey. Varying how much I water it down for different effects, but it's all a bit random. Though I have actually found that doing an ever-so-slight, almost imperceptibly thin wash is worth it too, and adds a little realism to the faces - I think the artilleryman firing the gun in the above pic is a good example of this.

I have the Ribaudequin from Redoubt (about halfway down the page):

http://www.redoubtenterprises.com/shop/?page=shop/browse&category_id=eb73981cf64d4b195808a2977a1bfb79

Ah yes, that's what I need. Thanks!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Corso on August 16, 2017, 06:25:07 PM
Great work Charlie :-*

The horseflesh looks very natural.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: tomrommel1 on August 17, 2017, 05:58:57 AM
nice addition
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: rivers3162 on August 19, 2017, 08:13:04 AM
Amazing work as usual. The pike block looks particularly impressive!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: Arlequín on August 19, 2017, 10:53:48 AM
Indeed, quite an impressive force you've built there Charlie!  :)

I do wonder just how well-groomed the average medieval bloke was and how often he would have shaved. We are in the 'stubble age' now, which might colour our view of things, but without triple-blade razors, various gels and what have you, the 'five o'clock shadow' might have been quite typical for everybody; even some of the women in the absence of bleaching and suchlike.

 ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: DintheDin on August 23, 2017, 06:37:14 AM
Indeed, quite an impressive force you've built there Charlie!  :)

...even some of the women in the absence of bleaching and suchlike.

 ;)

 lol

Somehow I missed this thread and just now I managed to absorb it from start to end...
Wowzers! You've done a great job! Fantastic collection and enjoyable write ups, very beautiful neat pictures, some of them are cinema-like! I wish you have many exciting games with these gorgeous figures! Congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more cavalry, and a cannon (14th August)
Post by: tancrede on August 23, 2017, 10:37:38 AM
Very nice minis here.
I especially like the way you paint horses !  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack! (6th September)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 06, 2017, 08:02:50 PM
Still working on the cavalry, here's some favourites from the latest batch.

This one I feel is simple but effective....
(https://i.imgur.com/o9ksnzp.jpg)

This one uses a metal head hacked off from a Foundry crossbowman....
(https://i.imgur.com/daBX4sk.jpg)

I want to try my hand at some different horse colours, so I gave this chap a nice palomino.
(https://i.imgur.com/Qp5DXLJ.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 06, 2017, 08:09:24 PM
So I guess it's about time to put them all together for a group shot.
I've now got enough for two heavy cavalry units, 16 strong each.

(https://i.imgur.com/I8mZkea.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wxUAjqx.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/vHe4Mza.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RhdGnRv.jpg)

Some close-ups...

(https://i.imgur.com/YfJVw5T.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/TZsHVDI.jpg)

And what happens when you put both units together?

(https://i.imgur.com/FIA4gL5.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RBLyyCP.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/mToiKAR.jpg)



This is far from it for the cavalry. I'll keep doing more, enough to make these units bigger, or start another unit or two.... I've also got some light cavalry on the go, which will be growing in number. All these are individually based, and I've got loads of different sized movement trays, so they can be arranged into any sort of units I want. And I've got other flags and banners so they can be 're-aligned' for each game!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Phil Robinson on September 06, 2017, 09:07:26 PM
Most splendid indeed  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Captain Blood on September 06, 2017, 09:09:35 PM
Nice  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: painterman on September 06, 2017, 09:59:06 PM
Lovely new figures Charlie - I have sent you a PM.
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: tomrommel1 on September 07, 2017, 07:16:13 AM
like them a lot :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Breazer on September 07, 2017, 08:05:12 AM
excellent bunch Charlie. Looks really impressive all put together
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Stuart on September 07, 2017, 09:11:53 AM
These are great, I really like the neat matt painting
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Romark on September 07, 2017, 09:23:04 AM
 :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: dinohunterpoa on September 07, 2017, 01:22:31 PM
 
IMPRESSIVE!!! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 08, 2017, 05:07:43 PM
These are great, I really like the neat matt painting

Thanks Stuart, neatness is what it's all about for me!!! I'm not actually a very neat painter in close-up, but going for an overall neat look of a finished unit is something I put effort into - both in terms of model choice and posing, and painting (choosing which parts of the models to put more time and effort into, i.e. the faces, and what parts to keep simple, i.e. all the shoes, belts and straps being just the same shade of brown with the same wash).

Glad you all like them!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: rivers3162 on September 10, 2017, 12:00:39 AM
Brilliant work as ever Charlie! They look fantastic when they're all grouped together too.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: traveller on September 10, 2017, 06:11:37 AM
Just....Awesome!!! :o :o :o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on September 10, 2017, 07:25:25 AM
 :D superb!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Heavy cavalry attack!!! (6th September)
Post by: Captain Harlock on October 21, 2017, 10:45:58 PM
These are great! I really like the metallics, the faces and the horses. And yes that miscasted one turned out to be the best character.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 10, 2017, 02:51:21 PM
Time for an update I think.

After some time of mostly painting cavalry, I've given them a break and have been back on the infantry. I have been multi-tasking, adding lots more crossbows and handguns, expanding the polearm units I showed on an earlier page, getting to work on my first pike block, and adding more artillery.... I haven't got any of these things to show you finished with this post, but rather just a select few miniatures I am rather pleased with, including lots of conversions.

First off, some of my favourites of the recent crossbowmen and handgunners. The one on the far left has a metal Foundry head, the one in the middle has had a leg-swap, and the second from right is converted from a metal pikeman.

(https://i.imgur.com/umwLwAR.jpg)

Some more. Three of these are converted from the Perry 'Italian crossbowmen' set (which I painted back on page 3) but with head swaps to 'Germanify' them - very effective and simply conversions. The one in mail has a Foundry head, the other two are from other Perry metals. Also the one on the far left has the body from the Italian command set with plastic arms and head. The one in the middle is from Conquest Miniatures - he looks a little short compared to the others, but it's just his pose really (the Conquest WOTR scultpts are good scale matches with Perrys).

(https://i.imgur.com/3EwXTiv.jpg)

Here's another two Italians with new German heads, again from Foundry sculpts.

(https://i.imgur.com/jikcJVB.jpg)

Here's a few of my favourite men-at-arms. The one on the far left is from Steel Fist, actually from one of the 16th century sets.

(https://i.imgur.com/xuY2Dbc.jpg)

And talking of Steel Fist... these three use bodies from the armoured Swiss that Oliver sculpted for Simon (painterman), who has them for sale on his blog (link (http://je-lay-emprins.blogspot.co.uk/2017/09/swiss-castings-for-sale.html)). These mix them with plastic Perry parts. The one the left is SF body with Perry arms and head.... The middle one is SF body and halberd, Perry arms and head... And the one on the right is all SF except the Perry head. I have others which I have assembled as Swiss pikemen, but they won't be painted for some time yet.

(https://i.imgur.com/BoOyCOV.jpg)



And moving on... I guess I should show you my English mercenaries, the Company Of The Rose. Now this project started as a Game of Thrones one, and I painted up lots of archers, but when I decided to switch to historical and set it in Germany, I suddenly had lots of longbowmen which I wasn't sure what to do with. So I've put most of them together as one group of mercenary English archers.

The core of the group is two 20-strong units of mixed bows and men-at-arms.

(https://i.imgur.com/8lf8yV7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pR4ISwE.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/qBzPdUp.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/SO6y4oS.jpg)

There are a few Crusader and Steel Fist sculpts in the units... Here's a close-up of three of the Crusader longbowmen. Very nice sculpts I think, and they fit in great with the Perry plastics (though note I have replaced the bow hands with plastic Perry ones).

(https://i.imgur.com/pzH7vpT.jpg)

And here's the captain of the company, the engigmatic Englishman Sir John Doe, veteran of the Hundred Years War. Well, he fought in France in the 1450s before the English were sent packing, but then stayed behind and started working for the French. These days he is finding employment in Germany where mercenaries are always welcome! He claims to be a knight, but who knows who he really is?

(https://i.imgur.com/qJjgosl.jpg)

And a group shot of the company, with some additional generic longbow units.

(https://i.imgur.com/lpTiiat.jpg)

That's it for now!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on November 10, 2017, 03:55:55 PM
Cracking stuff, excellent conversions and as always your brush work is superb  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Captain Blood on November 10, 2017, 04:15:21 PM
Tasty  :-*

Now just to touch in all those metal studs on the brigandines...  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: rivers3162 on November 10, 2017, 10:55:24 PM
Always great to see more stuff from you.  The conversions are very nice and your massed units look superb!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: commissarmoody on November 11, 2017, 04:55:13 AM
are the Foundry sculpts heads from other Foundry mins? Or do they make separate heads now?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: DintheDin on November 11, 2017, 09:43:00 AM
Great paintjob! En masse they look very realistic! I like your color palette!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 11, 2017, 09:56:14 AM
Now just to touch in all those metal studs on the brigandines..

I'll do it the same time I paint all their eyes and fingernails!

are the Foundry sculpts heads from other Foundry mins? Or do they make separate heads now?

Oh no, they are hacked off the old Foundry WOTR range, sculpted also by the Perry brothers way back in the late 80s. These two to sets, to be specific....
https://www.wargamesfoundry.com/collections/late-medieval-archers-crossbowmen-and-handgunners/products/med116-crossbowmen-advancing
https://www.wargamesfoundry.com/collections/late-medieval-archers-crossbowmen-and-handgunners/products/med122-archers-preparing-to-shoot
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: commissarmoody on November 11, 2017, 10:26:31 AM
 lol ha! that's what I figured.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Tonhel on November 11, 2017, 11:24:52 PM
Very nice units!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: ChrisB76 on November 13, 2017, 10:40:52 AM
Wow, stunning work!
As I am just starting with historic games, very inspiring ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Breazer on November 13, 2017, 01:00:42 PM
Awesome stuff Charlie... I'm amazed by the amount of models you churn out! I love the conversions and I'd love to see all your models set up once as one large force!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: Anselm van Helsing on November 14, 2017, 12:16:44 PM
Awesome work. Those head swaps work splendidly.  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Company Of The Rose, and other stuff (10th Nov)
Post by: tomrommel1 on November 15, 2017, 07:24:50 AM
great additions
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 31, 2017, 09:41:43 AM
I've finally finished my first pike block, which I promised myself I'd have done by the end of the year.

A bit of rambling before the pics....

I've been quite particular with which sculpts I choose, as I'm very fussy when it comes to posing of units, and both polearms and pikes really need to be done right in my opinion. For my previous infantry polearm blocks, I chose to have the back ranks with weapons shouldered (using the Perry plastics, shouldered pikes converted to polearms) with various different 'weapons lowered' poses for the front ranks.

For my pikes I've done it a bit different, in that they are 99% metal. I used the various metal pike/halberdier sets in the Perry European Army ranges (https://www.perry-miniatures.com/index.php?cPath=23_64&osCsid=vv115stbrebbftlkivuhihemk2). Now these are not without their problems, as the casting quality isn't great... It's mostly notable on the hands, which in some cases are really ugly mishappen things. But once painted up and put in a unit, I don't think it's an issue!
The two sets with lowered weapons are definitely the best, and very useful. The least useful is the 'armoured advancing' one, as 4 out of the 6 sculpts are in very odd leaning forward poses which makes them quite tricky to use. That leaves the 'unarmoured advancing' one for the majority of the back ranks. Here's where head swaps come in. Almost all of these sculpts are very easy to do headswaps on, either with eachother, or using both Perry plastic heads and metal heads from Foundry sculpts. So though the back ranks are made up almost entirely of the same 6 sculpts, there are no 'doubles' (actually that's a lie, there is one double in this unit). I wish, wish, WISH the Perrys would release a few more polearm/pike sets in this range, in particular just a couple more of the useful 'advancing' poses in jacks, brigandines and mail. But I don't think I should hold my breath....

Another thing I've done different here is the front two ranks are done 6 to a base, three 60mmx40mm bases. This is to make it much easier to rank them up. All my other stuff units are based individually, and the back two ranks in this unit still are. This won't be a problem for using the unit in games (my rules have individual casualty removal) as by the time it's reduced to less than half strength it's unlikely to still be on the table....

Here's some pics of front rank pikemen, all with headswaps. The first two are plastic heads, the third is a head from a different metal.

(https://i.imgur.com/KRpTpFh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/CXJJz1z.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Ncb50Wj.jpg)

And this one is a Steel Fist sculpt, with a plastic Perry head (actually the head itself is a conversion, swapping out the bevor for an unarmoured lower half).

(https://i.imgur.com/5KqQ2Jb.jpg)

There's also another conversion in the unit which uses Steel Fist arms on a plastic Perry body, and the standard bearer has a Steel Fist head.

Ok, here's the unit!

(https://i.imgur.com/K7mdu7l.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ne4B5Vy.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/KpD2Kqx.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Gw6VJ7r.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/YrY1iZP.jpg)

They are supposed to be 'generic' German or Flemish pikemen. The flag can easily be swapped out for others I have, so they can be 're-aligned' for each game as necessary.
The flag itself features the badge of one of my (fictional) German nobles.
I have a second pike block on my workbench, using much the same models but with a more Swiss flavour... But I haven't started painting yet, so that won't be finished for a long time.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 31, 2017, 09:43:27 AM
And some close-up shots.

Note the one in the blue hood - this sculpt can be head-swapped like the others, but requires a bit of green stuff to re-build the hood and a suitable head for it to work with.

(https://i.imgur.com/Tizt7zf.jpg)

I'm pretty pleased with my technique for painting yellow. This unit is much more colourful than my earlier polearm blocks, both because more of the models are in coats rather than brigandines and jacks, and I also seem to be using brighter reds and greens these days.

(https://i.imgur.com/VSHalry.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Ff8zToo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/M3w3L7Q.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 31, 2017, 09:48:33 AM
Splendid looking unit Charlie. I think the head swaps work a treat. Much as I love Michael Perry’s work across the board, I do think the plastics are better than the metals - just much better detail - and massive Perry fanboy that I am, there’s no escaping the quality problems that seem to afflict the casting of some of their metal figures.

But the end result here is a mightily impressive body of wargames figures  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on December 31, 2017, 10:05:27 AM
That is one badass looking group of pikeies.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: painterman on December 31, 2017, 03:36:46 PM
Nice work Charlie - very convincing looking unit - you've used the best poses and conversions and it looks suitably generic.
Having any separate captains/musicians with it?
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: DintheDin on December 31, 2017, 04:57:04 PM
Excellent paintjob, all together make a very realistic looking battle unit! Congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Mr.J on December 31, 2017, 06:21:00 PM
I love your painting style, very clean. The pike block looks excellent!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Corso on January 01, 2018, 07:34:45 AM
That pike block is very dynamic :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Silent Invader on January 01, 2018, 08:01:22 AM
I just had a most enjoyable catch-up.  8)

The pike block looks excellent  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Phil Robinson on January 01, 2018, 10:30:07 AM
Stirling work, old boy.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Breazer on January 01, 2018, 11:29:24 AM
Great work Charlie, It's amazing to see the size of units you churn out each update. Great stuff, keep them coming.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Axebreaker on January 01, 2018, 03:18:11 PM
Wonderful thread to follow! Very well done! :-*

Christopher
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on January 01, 2018, 03:38:14 PM
Very nice pike block - well done. :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Phillius on January 01, 2018, 07:39:06 PM
Magnificent work Charlie.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: rivers3162 on January 02, 2018, 12:14:35 AM
Fantastic work as always Charlie. The large units look very good and the thought you obviously put into their composition really shows!

What else is on the cards for 2018 apart from another pike block?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 02, 2018, 11:26:20 AM
Excellent work on the pike block, especially on the converted figures.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: 15thpanzer on January 02, 2018, 01:48:16 PM
Just spent a very enjoyable 15 mins break from work looking over your thread Charlie - great figures, really well composed, painted and finished.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 02, 2018, 08:30:13 PM
Thanks for all the comments people, I'm glad you are enjoying my project!

Having any separate captains/musicians with it?

Not for this one - I wanted as many actual pikes as possible for the wall of pikeheads look, and every model equipped differently would lessen this effect... I have got a horn-blower, halberdier and two-handed swordsman lined up for the Swiss unit though, which will be slightly larger.

What else is on the cards for 2018 apart from another pike block?

Well mostly expanded everything - making units bigger, and starting new ones. In a rough order of priority....

- Making polearm infantry units bigger.
- Start second (Swiss) pike unit.
- Adding more crossbows and handguns every now and then.
- More artillery (currently have two).
- Expand cavalry units, and then start a third one.

And at the same time, adding to the collection of different commanders and flags as we go.

Next post will probably be another look at the by then bigger, better-looking polearm blocks, and perhaps all the infantry together for a group shot!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Breazer on January 02, 2018, 09:40:39 PM
I am looking forward to those group shots
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - My first pike block!!!!!!!!! (31st Dec)
Post by: Arkiegamer on January 04, 2018, 11:33:15 AM
What a beautiful project!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Crossbows, and other bits & pieces (12th Feb)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 12, 2018, 08:04:59 PM
I promised the next post would be a look at all 5 expanded polearm blocks, but that will have to wait a week or two - they have been expanded and updated, but I just need to go over each one and touch up some of the older paintjobs so they blend in with the more recent ones better - a wash here, another coat of matt varnish there, etc...

In the meantime, here's some other stuff!


I have now got 46 crossbowmen and handgunners painted up. Currently they are arranged in two generic / German units of 14, and one Italian (mercenaries) unit of 18. These will be added to further in the future.

First off, here's some of my recent favourites. Spot the conversions!

(https://i.imgur.com/27pz6NT.jpg)

And here are the three units. I tried to make the Italians slightly more colourful. Some of these individual models you will have seen in previous posts.

(https://i.imgur.com/5zhNPGk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/055UJOT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/F53Ryzt.jpg)

The movement trays they are in are just for display purposes. In game they will be deployed in open formation.

They all mix crossbows and handguns - I made the generic units predominantly crossbows, and the Italians predominantly handguns. In game each unit will be considered to be armed with the predominant weapon featured, so the Italians will have a slightly different tactical role (less overall range, but more powerful for all of it).

(https://i.imgur.com/45dTjCk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EQulc5I.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tOemai3.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jo1Y6Ka.jpg)


And moving on, here's a small unit of light cavalry.

(https://i.imgur.com/ztNQidn.jpg)


And here's the start of my wagon fort. I plan to do several more bases of stationary wagons like this, some with pavises propped up between them.

(https://i.imgur.com/i5RBnQQ.jpg)



And finally... I got two really big trees. They are 30cm high! From The Model Tree Shop.

(https://i.imgur.com/fGNQEgb.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Crossbows, and other bits & pieces (12th Feb)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on February 15, 2018, 03:30:48 PM
Those trees look great, are they very expensive?
Your painting is superb, love the way you do horses, they look completely natural.
Thanks for keeping the updates coming.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Crossbows, and other bits & pieces (12th Feb)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 16, 2018, 06:59:25 PM
Those trees look great, are they very expensive?

Unfortunately yes they are rather pricey. For a while I was wondering whether I could justify getting some of them, but then I found them at a reduced sale price, so I thought why the hell not.
I won't ever be making a whole forest of them though, that's for sure! They will dominate the tabletop just by themselves I feel.
Here they are on the Model Tree Shop large scale trees page... you will see they are £20 each, and they have some even bigger (and pricier) ones.
https://www.themodeltreeshop.co.uk/trees/large-scale-trees.html#undefined
But here you can get two of them for £30.
https://www.themodeltreeshop.co.uk/ls300.html
There are some other really good value deals on the sale page, but to be honest this is the only one I really liked the look of.

Quote
Your painting is superb, love the way you do horses, they look completely natural.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Crossbows, and other bits & pieces (12th Feb)
Post by: Breazer on February 18, 2018, 09:43:54 PM
Excellent new additions. I really like the wagons. Very well done.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 01, 2018, 11:54:57 PM
Well as I've been stuck at home for a few days due to the snow, I've had a chance to do what I've been meaning to do for ages - smarten up all my infantry polearm units for a photoshoot.

But first.... cannons!

Here's my little artillery park as it currently stands.

(https://i.imgur.com/okOJRrZ.jpg)

The two on the left are Perry Miniatures, the one on the right is Foundry (so actually also sculpted by the Perrys way back in 1984 apparently). The Perry guns are very fragile and fiddly to assemble and paint, but worth it. The Foundry one is blockier, simpler in design and less fragile (though you do need to provide your own axle for some reason). They go well together. I've also got a larger Foundry gun and a organ gun from Old Glory which will be painted up eventually.

Here's all the artillery crew I currently have, 13 in total, so enough for 4 guns if need be. The first 8 are from the light gun sets, the next 3 are for the bombard set, and the last 2 are converted from the labourers set.

(https://i.imgur.com/lXppUoH.jpg)

And manning the guns....

(https://i.imgur.com/0A1mI4A.jpg)



Ok, now on to my infantry.

These are not all new, in fact they include some of the very first ones I painted when I started this project 2.5 years ago. Some of the older ones here were starting to luck a bit scruffy compared to the fresher ones, so over the past few days I went through them all one by one, adding a wash here, a repair there, and giving them all another coat of matt varnish so they blend in well with the newer ones.
These units I have already posted back when they smaller, on page 2 of this thread. Now they are bigger, have been re-arranged and have got new flags.
There are 5 units of halberdiers / polearm troops, which currently form the bulk of this project. Current unit sizes are a 3x8, two 3x9s, a 3x10 and a 4x10. The smaller ones will probably catch up with the bigger ones over time.

(https://i.imgur.com/UomyVhE.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ZdfmI6v.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/CRvC79Y.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lIEyhM2.jpg)

This last unit is the only one all in livery jackets. When this project started as a Game of Thrones thing, they were supposed to be House Tully troops. I wish I had kept them in 'neutral' colours now, but it doesn't matter. You see I've got lots of extra flags, so each unit can be 're-aligned' for every game, but this one will always be in red and blue. I am thinking some time in the future when the collection is much bigger I will do flags and commanders to make it work for the War of Burgundian Succession, and these could become French infantry with the addition of white crosses.

(https://i.imgur.com/5u2z92D.jpg)


Ok, here's all 5 units together plus the pike unit I showed back on page 8.

(https://i.imgur.com/bJLss2C.jpg)

Some more angles....

A forest of halberds.

(https://i.imgur.com/U3bRRuE.jpg)

From behind.

(https://i.imgur.com/ALQQBzD.jpg)

Polearm melee!

(https://i.imgur.com/0QgyWIq.jpg)

Pike vs halberd.

(https://i.imgur.com/f0TftFi.jpg)



The front ranks of these units are full of the more interesting models, both plastics and metals, including the more heavily armoured men-at-arms. The rear ranks with shouldered weapons are mostly plastics, and it's some of these that are the oldest paintjobs in the collection. Here's a few of my favourites.

(https://i.imgur.com/6N24qwk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/w9AcK1u.jpg)

I also put a few of the metal 'Swiss' sculpts in there, mostly with headswaps to make them more generic (swapping the hats and feathers for helmets). These are all wearing coats, and are generally in brighter colours compared to the plastics which mostly wear jacks and brigandines.

(https://i.imgur.com/Mm3ZAlI.jpg)



And that's it for now, hope you like the pics. The next post (give me a few more weeks) will be detailing all the commanders and explaining the flags and heraldry I use (some of which you can see here obviously).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: DintheDin on March 02, 2018, 06:04:28 AM
Wow!
A host of crispy, well painted minis in a multitude of poses, what more the wargamer wants?
And an impressive artillery park! You have an excellent collection!
Congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on March 02, 2018, 07:35:28 AM
Excellent  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on March 02, 2018, 07:41:29 AM
Excellent indeed.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Sunjester on March 02, 2018, 07:46:25 AM
Absolutely superb.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Breazer on March 02, 2018, 07:52:03 AM
They are so many. Im jealous. Great work mate.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Big Martin Back on March 02, 2018, 08:12:26 AM
They're excellent.

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: poulppy on March 02, 2018, 08:12:51 AM
So Great and so inspiring !
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Diablo Jon on March 02, 2018, 08:24:33 AM
Those are great really nice.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Captain Blood on March 02, 2018, 11:14:46 AM
That is an awesome spread Charlie. You have come a long way with that collection  :o :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: painterman on March 03, 2018, 07:02:58 PM
Charlie - thats fantastic progress (I'm defiantly in the painting slow lane) - all looking great and I like the tones you've got - nice and realistically gritty but with enough brighter colours which the medieval folk wore.
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 04, 2018, 01:47:12 PM
Glad you all like them!

nice and realistically gritty but with enough brighter colours which the medieval folk wore.

Yes I've recently brightened up my palette a bit. I've become very aware that the shiny new pikeman unit is MUCH more colourful than the drab, dirty polearm units!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Hu Rhu on March 05, 2018, 07:26:39 PM
Glad you all like them!

Yes I've recently brightened up my palette a bit. I've become very aware that the shiny new pikeman unit is MUCH more colourful than the drab, dirty polearm units!

I rather liked your subdued palette for your earlier units but I have to say that latest offerings have just that right touch of subdued clothing and bright metals that seem to be the perfect match.  Keep them coming.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Winston on March 13, 2018, 07:03:34 PM
Only just catching up with this as I edge through my own Perry plastics mountain. Love the whole collection you’ve produced - similar in style to the realistic and gritty palette I try to go for.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - 184 infantry, and 3 cannons (1st March)
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on March 15, 2018, 10:57:32 AM
Gone through every page in a bit of a blur - these are amazing. Had I the chance to redo my semi-historical/fantasy force again, I'd be tempted to jump them three hundred years forward and use the Perry miniatures as a base, rather than as bits for conversions.

Any chance of a whole army shot?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 01, 2018, 07:38:15 PM
I played a game today, and was going to post up a full battle report, but decided it didn't really make for a very good one... But I got some good close-up shots which I think worked well, so thought I'd share!

This is actually my first game in almost a year - it was last summer I had my last game! Since then the collection has grown quite a bit, which generally makes for better, more satisfactory games and more variety between games. As usual, there were various aspects of how the game flowed that gave me things to ponder on this evening, and how the rules could be tweaked and streamlined more.

(https://i.imgur.com/UbXoF4Z.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/UeKu714.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/k8C9KN5.jpg)


I've been working on expanding the cavalry lately, and later this summer should hopefully have a post to show you how it now stands (the target is 62 cavalry - just 12 more to paint!)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: Codsticker on July 02, 2018, 01:25:27 AM
Fantastic photos Charlie- your work is always a pleasure to see. :)
I've been working on expanding the cavalry lately, and later this summer should hopefully have a post to show you how it now stands (the target is 62 cavalry - just 12 more to paint!)
That will be impressive. :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: painterman on July 02, 2018, 09:07:05 AM
Great looking pictures - hope to see more of the game!
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: traveller on July 02, 2018, 09:25:12 AM
Inspiring stuff! Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: Breazer on July 02, 2018, 04:42:44 PM
lovely pictures Charlie, I always love to see your entire force on the table. Great stuff!!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: Captain Blood on July 02, 2018, 06:00:59 PM
They look great. Well done Charlie.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - just a few in-game shots (1st July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 02, 2018, 06:49:03 PM
Great looking pictures - hope to see more of the game!
Simon.

Ok, here's a brief run-down.

Shaun was defending, with fences and wagons to provide cover. I was attacking from the right of the board.

(https://i.imgur.com/nsTcr6h.jpg)

As I advanced towards him, he sent his cavalry out to meet mine.

(https://i.imgur.com/uIZ2vl9.jpg)

He managed to beat back my best cavalry unit, which included my commander (who luckily escaped harm), but my second unit rode in to save the day and together both units sent his cavalry packing. Meanwhile my side was suffering quite a bit from crossbow fire.

(https://i.imgur.com/vlhPVre.jpg)

As my cavalry chased his off the board, his pikemen were suddenly in danger of being caught in the open and outflanked.

(https://i.imgur.com/S5VUC98.jpg)

But he managed to sort his battle-line out and my weakened cavalry didn't really have much success against his infantry. Meanwhile my infantry had reached his defences, leading to several turns of melee which swung back and forth over the barricades.

(https://i.imgur.com/bWknxDA.jpg)

Though it went in his favour, and all my forces were driven back.

(https://i.imgur.com/VQLoxRX.jpg)

I reformed my troops for one final assault across the line, but it was futile and I conceded defeat!

(https://i.imgur.com/xKsqUb8.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 29, 2018, 01:18:22 PM
Ok, time to show you some of the cavalry models I've been painting lately, most of which are conversions.

The Perry cavalry plastics are great and offer all sorts of different options, but when you are painting 50+ of them you do start to wish there were even MORE options, or a third plastic cavalry set! Things like different poses for the styles of armour already available, and more 'half-harness' - things like brigandines with armoured legs and arms, or armoured bodies with riding boots, etc...
So you start converting, and here are the three things I've been doing most of....

1 - Using the few metal cavalry figures in the range. The metal horses they come with a notably smaller than the plastic ones - I put them on the plastics, which requires a little bit of green stuff to rework the saddle arrangements. There aren't a great deal of metal cavalry models (commanders and scurrers), but they easily take headswaps which always completely transforms them.

2 - Leg swaps, or giving the fully armoured men riding boots out of green stuff.

3 - Head conversions. I know there are loads of different heads provided with the plastic sets, but I want more!!! Or some metal head packs to go with them. Anyway, one great conversion I discovered is slicing apart the heads with sallets and kettle hats, including the ones with bevors. You can then put bevors on different sorts of helments, and 'un-bevor' other ones. Here is a pic of the new heads I made this way, I think it was sometime last year...

(https://i.imgur.com/Cz5tzyZ.jpg)

Also, my painting techniques have been improved since I first started this thread, most notably with how I do horse-flesh and armour, so mounted men-at-arms the best way to show what I mean. For armour, I used to paint silver (GW runefang staeel), ink black, then drybrush silver again. But it could often come out a bit 'grainy' looking... Now I paint silver, and just give TWO washes of Army Painter dark tone wash (the brush-on wash, which is NOT the same thing as the dip despite the same name). I occasionally give a quick drybrush on the top of the helmets, shoulders and weapons, but usually don't bother. This gives a MUCH smoother finish, and also results in darker armour which I personally prefer. I might go back and re-do some of the earlier cavalry this way.

Anyway, let's see what I've got.


Actually, first here are a few which are NOT converted, more or less straight from the box....

(https://i.imgur.com/ZB4Gvgp.jpg)

This is my favourite style of armour and helmet combination - gothic harness with a deep, closed-face sallet and bevor. I just recently realised I hadn't assembled any of the plastics like this yet. This body and head combo looks the best of the Perry plastics I feel, has a really nice slender appearance...

(https://i.imgur.com/tX23BON.jpg)

This guy I think looks rather menacing.

(https://i.imgur.com/KmnBRkl.jpg)

A standard bearer (my flags will be explained in a future post).


Now here's a couple of the metal ones with headswaps. The standard bearer's head is from a Foundry crossbowman.

(https://i.imgur.com/zIqGPrg.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/G2oazJe.jpg)



Here are some with the converted plastic heads...

(https://i.imgur.com/pTmAIe3.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/k8SQYJQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/JuQIIgA.jpg)

(my favourite)


And here's one with riding boots made from green stuff. I'm not very good at sculpting, and don't enjoy having to get the green stuff out. I think I pulled it off ok in this case, but am not particularly enthusiastic about having to do it again.

(https://i.imgur.com/KN1Vn7X.jpg)


And finally, here are two which have swapped legs from the knee down, one from the heavy cav box and one from the light cav box... resulting in two 'medium' cavalrymen. They also both have converted heads, and adjusted horse tack. The lighter one also has had the brigandine studs on his arms filed off to make it into coat sleeves.

(https://i.imgur.com/Zk2ZTxw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/dTTtKt5.jpg)



I haven't got any full units shots of the cavalry for this post. Last time I did that, I had 32 in total. Now I have 50..... let me paint up another 8, and I will then be able to show you them all together - three heavy units and one smaller light unit. Hopefully by the end of summer....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on July 29, 2018, 01:33:07 PM
Great stuff. I like the battle as well  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Captain Blood on July 29, 2018, 01:49:32 PM
These work ever so well Charlie. Some great looking creations there, and your painting style is so simple but effective.

Just need to go back and touch in all those studs on the horse trappings  ;)
(You might think life is too short, but it's actually dead easy to do, honest...  lol)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Silent Invader on July 29, 2018, 01:55:31 PM
Very nice update Charlie.  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on July 29, 2018, 10:07:58 PM
Your cavalry are magnificent and the way you paint tbe horses is exactly what I wish I could do.
Can't wait to see the full monty shot of ll 58!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 30, 2018, 06:04:46 PM
Just need to go back and touch in all those studs on the horse trappings  ;)
(You might think life is too short, but it's actually dead easy to do, honest...  lol)

Never! And look, they aren't even done on the box artwork!

(https://www.michtoy.com/michtoy2015/products/Perry%20Plastic%20WR60-2.jpg)

In all seriousness, I don't paint the brigandine studs, or belt buckles, or eyes, or wood grain on spears, and paint all leatherwork the same colour. I don't think any of these things are necessary for the tabletop scale of my project - if I was painting individual display models, that would be different. And actually I prefer the look of the horse trappings and brigandines painted without the studs - often I see them painted and feel it looks messy and untidy, a detail that you wouldn't actually see at any distance. I've shaved off the studs on some of the horses - perhaps I'll do more of that in future.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on July 30, 2018, 07:16:38 PM
You've convinced me!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Frostie on July 31, 2018, 05:37:30 AM
Hi Charlie,

Great work on your figures but I was interested that they started out as a Game of Thrones project.....I have a large pile of unpainted Peter Pig WoTR figures and was think of doing the opposite.

Would you have a 'colour chart' for the various factions or a good source site for the same.

Thanks and I look forward to following your progress
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on July 31, 2018, 05:51:24 PM
For GOT (ASOIAF)  try 'A wiki of Ice and Fire' excellent for all sorts some good art work, but you can't do worse than go on the fantasy board here where there is a stickie with all the threads from some fabulous model makers and painters withall the photos of their personal project of GOT. Lots of kit bashed minis, some incredible painting and shed loads of great ideas  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 31, 2018, 06:47:48 PM
Yes, try the Wiki of Ice and Fire. It has 'sigils' for all the houses that appear in the books, though for some of the really minor houses you should take it with a pinch of salt (GRRM might mention a minor house's sigil ever so briefly in his books, but where the source for the actual colours come from I'm not sure... BUT it seems most of these potential 'fan-fic' interpretations apparently have his seal of approval). Though some of the heraldry artwork there is hideous.... but then again GRRM sometimes doesn't make it easy (a lot of houses apparently feature brown and pink on their heraldry!).  When this was a GoT project I was starting with the Riverlands, including all the minor houses, so had done a bit of research and made some flags for a lot of them I'd be happy to share - just PM me if interested. Some look really cool (House Mooton - a red salmon on a white field....) but some are just condemned to be hideous and nonsensical (House Darry - a black plowman on a brown field???). Anyway, from most of these official or semi-official coats of arms you can get some livery colours for your troops (House Mooton - red and white... House Darry - brown??).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Ogrob on July 31, 2018, 07:08:46 PM
Thirding the Wiki. You can search for something like The Riverlands and open up all the different houses. I've picked various northern houses I liked the looks of when I needed non-Stark colour schemes.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: commissarmoody on August 01, 2018, 04:41:20 AM
Speaking of GOT, it looks like fireforge mins will be doing some not "North Men" multi part plastics in a kick starter in September. Along with some undead hoards.
I might pick some up, they are also planing on doing southern men (Lanasters)
I was thinking of picking some up to make some house Manderly..... if I can ever find some decent tridents for the footmen that is.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: painterman on August 03, 2018, 08:00:20 AM
More excellent figures and I like the conversions of shopping the helms with bevors to create options.
Always inspiring to see your progress with these.
Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 03, 2018, 06:52:32 PM
More excellent figures and I like the conversions of shopping the helms with bevors to create options.
Always inspiring to see your progress with these.
Simon

Glad you like them!

By the way Simon, look what arrived today...

(https://i.imgur.com/rXD6Z0r.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: painterman on August 04, 2018, 04:09:28 PM
Woo, great selection there, medieval real estate ready to go.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Breazer on August 04, 2018, 08:08:02 PM
Looking good Charlie, I'm jealous.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on August 05, 2018, 09:52:58 PM
Charliewho makes the resin buildings, I really like the farm/manor house. I'm sure I've seen it on here somewhere painted but I can't remember where.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 05, 2018, 11:29:58 PM
Charliewho makes the resin buildings, I really like the farm/manor house. I'm sure I've seen it on here somewhere painted but I can't remember where.

Hudson & Allen, see my thread on them in the workbench section - http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=111122.0

The ones you might have seen painted here in the last few weeks is by painterman, his thread here - http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=110607.0
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - cavalry conversions (29th July)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on August 07, 2018, 11:52:52 AM
Many thanks Charlie, they really do look the business when painted
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 16, 2018, 08:47:19 PM
A while back I posted my artillery, three guns.

I have just added another gun, and rebased them all. Previously I had the guns and crew all on individual bases, but I decided to go the route of putting them together on 65x90mm bases. It gives me the chance to include little bits of artillery equipment, and does look better in general.
The reason I had them individually bases before was for my rules, where the crew could be picked off, crew loss effecting the guns performance, etc. But after a test game I decided it was unnecessarily complicated, so now the gun and crew is treated as one model, and when it comes into contact with the enemy we just assume the crew are driven off / killed rather than having to resolve a combat. I made the rules for firing the guns simpler too.... Nothing like a good test game to make you think "oh well that was was silly / needs simplifiyng."

So here we have four guns in total, should be more than enough! I doubt I'll be using all four in many games.

Two of the guns are from the Perry sets. The other two are from Foundry,  also sculpted by the Perry bros way back in the 80s! They all scale well together - the old sculpts are bulkier and less detailed, easier to assemble and paint. The new sculpts are much more detailed and fiddly. The red one is bigger than the other three.

There are 16 crew in total.
- 8 from the original artillery sets.
- 1 clone  from above with a headswap.
- 2 from the bombard set.
- 3 from the labourers and wagons sets, with head swaps.
- 1 from Crusader miniatures, with a Perry head swap.
- 1 plastic conversion.

The pieces of equipment are from Front Rank and Tricorne.

(https://i.imgur.com/EPOzmlk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/PpVyWGw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/t7bZEUf.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/1tShg3y.jpg)

I'm really pleased with the posing of the crew on each base, I feel they all tell a little story. I made sure to mix them up so none of the crew combos are 'straight from the box' as it were...

This chap's getting a stern ticking off from the master gunner.

(https://i.imgur.com/kAIYx7r.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/WljizJl.jpg)


"Hurry up and load that gun!!!!"

(https://i.imgur.com/CRGRfhM.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/BVr7sxR.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/bREOSaK.jpg)

Some nice faces....

(https://i.imgur.com/HCR3lsc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/LTBenJB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EeupG1J.jpg)




And I've also got an organ gun! It's from Old Glory. I made a couple of alterations, as I feel it looked a bit too 'fantasy' in its original incarnation... I snipped off the dragon / gargoyle decorations at the front, and replaced the solid wheels with spoked ones. I put it on a smaller base with just two crew, and didn't use any equipment - I imagine it's a more mobile gun which the two of them can wheel about by hand. One crew is from the Perry bombard set, the other is a plastic conversion.

(https://i.imgur.com/f0XTs17.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/smRO3jv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ozaUBiL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/cxvo6Th.jpg)


I'd like to get another organ gun someday, but find not many companies make them. The one from Redoubt looks good, but annoyingly there is nothing else from them I want so would have to order it by itself, meaning postage would be likely as much as the gun....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on August 16, 2018, 08:50:32 PM
The guns look great. Well done :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: levied troop on August 17, 2018, 06:39:47 AM
Impressively done.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on August 17, 2018, 07:13:26 AM
Lovely stuff  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Breazer on August 17, 2018, 07:57:52 AM
Very nice cannons Charlie.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: painterman on August 17, 2018, 08:04:07 AM
Good decision to rebase and you’ve done a great job of enhancing the bases. Is the guy in close up holding the chamber from Crusader?
Cheers Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 17, 2018, 10:00:58 AM
Is the guy in close up holding the chamber from Crusader?

No, he's the Perry duplicate with a headswap - he's from the gun loading crew originally, his head is I think from one of the mounted pages?

The crusader one is on the red gun base, with the ram rod thing, red jacket and tiny hands. Crusader have three packs of 'pikemen' in standing poses with open hands, some better than others, most of which take head swaps easy - they are great for standard bearers, and gun crews as here.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Captain Blood on August 17, 2018, 10:50:32 AM
Love 'em.
I must add an organ gun. I've got 8 spare and unpainted artillerymen... Will check out the Redoubt one...
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 17, 2018, 11:08:56 AM
I must add an organ gun. I've got 8 spare and unpainted artillerymen... Will check out the Redoubt one...

The Old Glory one is great, after you've done the easy alterations I did. Here's what it looks like before the alterations...

(https://www.oldgloryminiatures.com/prodimages/WRE/Wre_5.gif)

It has 6 barrels, which seems the right number to me.

The wheels I used on it are form the Front Rank gun, which I decided was far too big - it's HUGE! And not as in a big gun, I mean it's way off scale for Perry sculpts. But  the wheels are actually just the right scale.

Strangely all the other Old Glory artillery pieces look really undersized to me.... I had a look at them at Partizan earlier this year, and decided I couldn't justify them (you can only get them in packs of 2 or 3, annoyingly - if it was just 1 for a fiver I would probably have got one!)

The Redoubt organ gun looks good from the pic on the website, but that's the only pic I can find... Apparently it has 4 barrels.
https://www.redoubtenterprises.com/product/rx-10/

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: rivers3162 on August 17, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Really like the artillery refurb and the addition of the organ gun. May have to pick one up next time I’m at a show.

Does anyone know if organ guns were used in the Wars of the Roses? I haven’t come across anything.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Griefbringer on August 17, 2018, 01:42:29 PM
I have a pair of the Redoubt organ guns, assembled but unpainted. They are nice models, though I think they required a bit of assembly work.

I have also somewhere a pair of the three-barrelled organ guns from Old Glory (the ones without a shield in front), but think they are more of 16th century in style - and the provided wheels are rather small.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: El Grego on August 17, 2018, 06:28:11 PM
The artillery is excellent.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 18, 2018, 10:58:53 PM
Thanks, glad you all like them.

I missed one pic out - I really like the pose of the crew on this one, the three assistants standing back and watching as the master gunner fires the gun.

(https://i.imgur.com/BsS4eHq.jpg)

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: DintheDin on August 19, 2018, 04:36:49 AM
I like their poses too and you managed very nice the face expressions! Cheers!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on August 19, 2018, 08:16:49 AM
They look awesome.

One minor nag however. The crews do look a bit to clean. Operating a gun is very dirty work. You could dirty up a few of the crewmen and keep the master gunners nice and clean.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: Metternich on August 19, 2018, 08:46:37 PM
An artillery park worthy of Charles the Bold himself.  Bravo.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - artillery refurb, and an organ gun (16th August)
Post by: archiduque on August 20, 2018, 11:42:51 AM
Excellent work!! :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 30, 2018, 05:31:39 PM
I made a lot of hedges.

Full pics of the actual hedges at the workbench board - http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=111669.0

But here's the fun scenic pics!

(https://i.imgur.com/ES8SVTe.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/89G4LHc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/VY0SCCU.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/OH5zP2B.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/nvAbGqL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/yKU9gpt.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: commissarmoody on August 30, 2018, 06:49:48 PM
Those are some nice hedges.  :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: DintheDin on August 30, 2018, 07:01:37 PM
You made them look so real! And offering such a flexibility to your terrain set ups! Congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on August 30, 2018, 07:03:24 PM
Great stuff looks very realistic
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: Peter d on September 02, 2018, 02:24:09 PM
Looking really nice - definitely a bustle in those hedgerows.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: Breazer on September 03, 2018, 06:44:29 AM
Very nice charlie, this will liven up your battles even more. The pictures look really well.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: tomrommel1 on September 03, 2018, 07:52:01 AM
gorgeous :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - fighting over the hedgerows (30th August)
Post by: Hu Rhu on September 03, 2018, 01:24:20 PM
Those are some seriously good terrain pieces.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 10, 2018, 07:07:20 PM
More terrain. I painted up the first of my Hudson & Allen buildings, and am very pleased with how it came out. More to come!

(https://i.imgur.com/NjI1q3Y.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/JeQ1kwb.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/A7jgenq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Wu137on.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/hpBqCUQ.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on September 10, 2018, 10:21:46 PM
Looks superb Charlie, I was nosing through the web site tonight. Some great pieces, prices are not that bad, I'm just a bit concerned how much it would cost to ship them from the states.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 10, 2018, 10:44:40 PM
Looks superb Charlie, I was nosing through the web site tonight. Some great pieces, prices are not that bad, I'm just a bit concerned how much it would cost to ship them from the states.

Have a look at my thread about these buildings in the workbench board, I say how much it all cost me.

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=111122.0

And also, interestingly, there is someone there claiming he's going to supply them in the UK!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Peter d on September 11, 2018, 12:21:59 AM
Those buildings look wonderful.  Love the polearms poking over the top.
Cheers
Peter
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Erik on September 11, 2018, 09:21:41 AM
Lovely looking buildings. I like that they have bases so you kan mark out an area as build up. I havent gotten around to basing my own buildings yet, so I always have to put up fences and hedges to mark them out.

Erik
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on September 11, 2018, 05:11:16 PM
Have a look at my thread about these buildings in the workbench board, I say how much it all cost me.

http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=111122.0

And also, interestingly, there is someone there claiming he's going to supply them in the UK!
[/equote]
Thanks Charlie will do
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: Hu Rhu on September 16, 2018, 08:48:46 AM
Lovely buildings and a great idea to combine them with the small garden and fences.  Definitely nicking 'borrowing' that idea.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Hudson & Allen building (10th September)
Post by: bluewillow on September 22, 2018, 05:44:10 PM
Fabulous brush work Charlie,

Particularly impressed with your faces, keep up the great work

Cheers

Matt
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 29, 2018, 05:37:54 PM
Thanks all.

Here's some more cavalry. First off, two 'straight out of the box'.

(https://i.imgur.com/azL5KbN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/subw84K.jpg)

The next two have converted heads, which I explain how I did back on page 10 of this thread. One head has been given a bevor where previously it didn't have one, and another has in turn lost their bevor. I'm always looking for more heads, for more variety, and am very pleased with how these simple conversions worked out.

(https://i.imgur.com/kS1wvIE.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/f9DW5zl.jpg)

For the next three, I used some of the metal WOTR sculpts that come on metal horses. Two are from the 'WR11 mounted standard bearers' set, and another from 'WR18 scurrers, lances upright', giving three new heavy armour styles to mix in with the four familiar ones that come in plastic. Two of these also have head swaps, one of which is from a Foundry sculpt.

Also, rather than give them the metal lances they come with (which will bend too easily), I gave them plastic ones. The 'light' lance is just a cut down pike, the two 'heavy' lances are form the heavy cavalry set. For one of them, I cut down the plastic hand around it to leave just the lance itself, to put into the metal hand... Problem with this is the lance handle became way too narrow and fragile, and it broke whilst painting. I had to re-attach it, and had to drill it out for a VERY thin pin to give it enough strength. For the other one, I instead cut off the metal fore-arm and glued on a plastic forearm holding the lance, which has proved a more sensible solution.

(https://i.imgur.com/zBqLJWV.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/K1GFImZ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/1aFsQOn.jpg)

I put them on the plastic horses rather than the metal ones they come with, which are just noticeably too small in comparison for my liking. This required a little saddle surgery - the metals have the rear part of the saddle on the rider rather than the horse, whilst with the plastics both front and back parts of the saddle are on the horse. So I  had to slice off the plastic rear saddle bit, attach the riders and then use a bit of green stuff to fill the gap. This meant I had to paint these ones attached to the horses, rather than separately like I normally do.

(https://i.imgur.com/icO23k4.jpg)



That's enough cavalry for now.... Here's some dismounted men-at-arms.

Some time back I switched the way I paint armour, and have been gradually repainting some of my older men-at-arms. Some of these ones are among the first minis I painted for this project. Repainting the armour on these with minimal damage to anything else was easy enough, as they are almost all armour!

(https://i.imgur.com/dWhiIGN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wlgH62q.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/WKJ2d1r.jpg)

I've actually got LOADS of dismounted men-at-arms, but don't really have much use for them. Just two or three in the front rank of each infantry block, and a few as bodyguards for commanders when they are on foot. I have loads which I don't have any use for, in particular the ones in wild poses that don't rank up easily. So I've narrowed it down to just a few (this isn't all of them), which are either in advancing poses for my front ranks (posed practically and easy to rank up) or are in standing poses for command retinues.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: DintheDin on September 29, 2018, 05:43:31 PM
They look superb! I like the metal of your armour!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: painterman on September 29, 2018, 05:55:45 PM
More impressive work Charlie - you have a pretty large collection now?
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 30, 2018, 03:55:13 PM
More impressive work Charlie - you have a pretty large collection now?
Simon.

Yes it certainly is getting that way! I keep telling myself 'one more batch' before taking stock and having a big group photo, but it never happens.... But I really think after another batch of 4 cavalry and another of 8 miscellaneous infantry it will be that time. That will give me a total of 50 heavy cavalry and 18 light cavalry... And lots of infantry.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: ArisK on October 01, 2018, 07:58:07 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/wlgH62q.jpg)
Damn if the middle one isn't Robocop a few centuries early. :-)
Thanks for the details on the conversions, always a pleasure to see how these are done!

Aris K.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: Hu Rhu on October 01, 2018, 09:14:03 PM
Great [ainting on those minis' Your armour is quite dark but I like that effect.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: Breazer on October 04, 2018, 02:16:52 PM
Very nice work on the new additions Charlie!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - yet more cavalry, and repainting armour (29th Sep)
Post by: Anselm van Helsing on October 12, 2018, 07:45:25 AM
Very nice work indeed. Very inspirational. Great painting on the armour!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 16, 2018, 11:22:34 PM
The more I read about 15th century warfare, the more I hear about static battlefield defences, which seem to normally consist of wagons from the baggage train hastily pushed together to form rather effective barricades. They would certainly be great for stopping a cavalry charge in its tracks.

So I wanted to put together enough wagons to do this, for fun scenarios such as a smaller force behind a wagon fort having to hold off the attackers long enough for reinforcements to arrive, etc....

All the wagons are from Perry Miniatures.

I put four bases together, for a total of a 70cm of wagon-fort. Certainly enough for now! I decided to have them based as the I felt the wagon models would be too fragile to be frequently handled otherwise, and it also let me put little things like barrels and pavises in to fill the gaps (the three pavises here are actually from Front Rank rather than the plastic Perry ones).

(https://i.imgur.com/C5t6ptD.jpg)

They can be used to make one long line, or be placed individually to secure flanks or barricade roads between buildings, or be arranged in curves or angles, like so....

(https://i.imgur.com/vQk16Yu.jpg)

I also painted up a few handgunners and crossbowmen on smaller bases so they would fit into the wagons themselves. I considered having them permanently attached to the wagons, but decided against it in the end in favour of more flexibility.

(https://i.imgur.com/k93Mcng.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/1LTIIdi.jpg)


I also have found a use for a number of models that had until now been sitting unused. As I've mentioned before, I'm very fussy with the posing of my units. I like my units to look consistent. All my infantry polearm/pike blocks are posed to be advancing with the front ranks weapons lowered. However I have lots of models in standing defensive poses, as if receiving a charge, both metals and some nice plastic builds - I didn't want these to go unused. Also I have a few polearm troops in standing poses (mostly Perrys, but a few of these are from Crusader Miniatures, which fit in very nicely). I've been pulling together appropriate models, repainting some older ones, into a small infantry unit in 'defence' mode. I plan to add to this, I have loads more front rank ones, and want to convert some appropriate middle rank ones too (the rear rank look strangely laid-back considering their comrades in front of them seem about to make contact with the enemy!).

(https://i.imgur.com/UfS0UgA.jpg)

This unit will be used just in scenarios where one side is defending, and they work great behind the wagon-fort, both as a unit and as individual models.

(https://i.imgur.com/DVsnmD8.jpg)



And finally here's some fun action shots! Notice that artillery fit in nicely between the wagons - I think I'll paint up a fifth cannon sometime on a bigger base with mantlets and pavises for just this purpose.

(https://i.imgur.com/dzuzSh1.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/sqvNE7I.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wu0X9jN.jpg)

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Silent Invader on November 17, 2018, 12:04:56 AM
I like it - good use of figures too  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: jamesmanto on November 17, 2018, 01:20:48 AM
Excellent.
Using the very period Perry wagons puts it over the top.
Well done.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: DintheDin on November 17, 2018, 06:37:40 AM
You are doing a great job with such precision in conversion so that each figure of yours is completely individualized!
And your paintjob is outstanding! You are creating a fantastic collection! Many congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on November 17, 2018, 07:19:31 AM
Great progress  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: tyrionhalfman on November 17, 2018, 10:44:34 AM
Very nice! Thanks for sharing :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: painterman on November 17, 2018, 05:00:37 PM
More great additions Charlie - the wagons looks very useful for defences and general baggage.
Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Tonhel on November 17, 2018, 05:08:35 PM
Very, very cool!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Breazer on November 17, 2018, 07:42:20 PM
I like the new unit. Good that you found a use for those miniatures. I wouldnt mind seeing more for them.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: El Grego on November 18, 2018, 08:24:57 PM
The metalwork of your men-at-arms is marvelous, and I need to put those wagons on my want list.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Admiral Benbow on November 19, 2018, 10:19:49 PM
Superb thread, Charlie!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 20, 2018, 05:45:10 PM
Thanks all, glad you're liking the thread!

My current list to get done by Christmas is....

- 4 more cavalry (working on now)
- re-do armour on existing units, most importantly on some of the earlier cavalry I did
- a few last command models

So then by Christmas or New Year I will have a fun photo shoot of the project as it will then stand, with a tour of my commanders and flags.

Then units to start for the new year will be...

- Big Swiss pike unit (four ranks of twelve)
- Mounted crossbowmen (which will involve some fiddly conversions)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Metternich on November 22, 2018, 03:53:05 PM
Charlie,
          What is your new method for painting armor ?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - wagon-fort!!!!! (16th November)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 22, 2018, 10:01:23 PM
Charlie,
          What is your new method for painting armor ?

Couldn't be easier. Just basecoat bright silver (GW Runefang Steel), followed by a dark wash (Army Painter Dark Tone wash - NOT the same thing as the dark tone 'dip').

Sometimes the fully armoured models will get a little but of extra wash to pick out the recesses and a quick very light silver drybrush just on the tops of the helmets and shoulders. But that's it.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 09, 2018, 08:41:11 PM
Ok, big post here.

Let me introduce you to my commanders and their flags.

To recap, this project is currently 'generic' European warfare, and I use my own made up heraldry. I have put together lots of different commanders with their own heraldry, the plan they can be mixed up for each game so it's not always the same two commanders fighting eachother. Currently I have nine commanders with coats of arms, four of which also have separate badges on livery banners. There will be more in the future.

I used the Perry Wars of the Roses command figures for most of these -  I really like these figures, they have great poses. I put a lot of thought into how to use each pose, and made sure each commander is consistent with their little retinue - either in standing / commanding poses, or leading the troops from the front line. They are all based individually, with the exception of two who are based with their standard bearers. I also conveniently made the four main ones red, green, blue and yellow.

Here's the first one - absolutely my favourite of the Perry commander sculpts. Again I put a lot of thought into matching up the mounted figures with appropriate horses, not wanting to duplicate any horses (there are only a few of these metal 'commander horse' sculpts).

(https://i.imgur.com/g1Nokom.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/rHNzrCu.jpg)

Here's his coat of arms, and his badge of a hawk's lure.

(https://i.imgur.com/BqaeLv6.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/IsoKjqs.jpg)

I have three infantry standard bearers with his badge, to align units to him.

(https://i.imgur.com/zbMX3jN.jpg)


Next up, the green commander. He's on foot, waving a battle axe, more likely to get into the thick of the fighting.

(https://i.imgur.com/zJqeYjR.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/gepS9Zn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/y7BLvYa.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/IdctnwS.jpg)

His badge is a white swan, here are his infantry standard bearers.

(https://i.imgur.com/rGFTOc5.jpg)

I also have a mounted version of him and his banner, to lead the cavalry from the front.

(https://i.imgur.com/MSq4ruk.jpg)



Next, the blue commander. This is one of the two who I decided to base with his banner-man.

(https://i.imgur.com/nH9AswQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/xKiMJBi.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/C5gQz1v.jpg)

His badge is a buckle.

(https://i.imgur.com/49hJUBx.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/WW0Kyi6.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/TaLAfFr.jpg)

I also have another version of him on foot, to lead the infantry.

(https://i.imgur.com/efhkcxq.jpg)


Here's Mr Yellow. Another one based with his banner-man.

(https://i.imgur.com/LJHtuNB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/F038QpO.jpg)

His badge is a caltrop.

(https://i.imgur.com/lgIhcUi.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/ZRS8av5.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/YMOuTnv.jpg)

And again, there is another version of him on foot to lead the infantry.

(https://i.imgur.com/o4O1072.jpg)


So those are the only four with additional livery banners. Now there are several that just have their own personal banner, so are perhaps lower-ranking.

This one is on foot, will look good leading a defending army behind fortifications. The commander himself is one of the excellent sculpts from Steel Fist Miniatures, my favourite of the batch.

(https://i.imgur.com/66ijqxN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/luBZoiU.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/JKW3CP5.jpg)


This one, also on foot, is in an attacking pose and so works well leading an infantry unit.

(https://i.imgur.com/WvY6rW9.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/nbzJVYv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7XkMZFT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wU0zlso.jpg)


Same goes for this guy.

(https://i.imgur.com/t2AYZUf.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pJK5XGk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/fh7u7XD.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Iwua7Bw.jpg)


The foot men-at-arms in their retinues aren't specifically assigned for them - I have a good collection of them that can be assigned as retinues as needed each game, or to be used as commanders themselves.

(https://i.imgur.com/YziqE7y.jpg)


I've also got a couple of banners for commanders leading the cavalry - there aren't specific commander models for them.

(https://i.imgur.com/oo0CUWG.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/xzZDeiZ.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/gQWs3M1.jpg)



Now let's see some of these flags in context.

Here's three infantry units being led by the blue commander. The commander himself and his banner is in the middle unit, and the other two units have the livery flags.

(https://i.imgur.com/rTLwlJO.jpg)


Here are the same units led by one of the lesser commanders without a badge, so the two outer units don't have any flags.

(https://i.imgur.com/BCso89Z.jpg)


And some other examples of how they could be used....

(https://i.imgur.com/KFXMY5D.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/PzrOJWH.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/G40IjcQ.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: DintheDin on December 09, 2018, 09:03:18 PM
Speechless!
Commanders, banners... all so well-studied and so beautifully done!  :-*
Many-many congrats for your work, your collection starts taking epic dimensions!
Cheers!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: painterman on December 09, 2018, 11:16:40 PM
Hi Charlie
I'm liking the generic heraldry - works well with your armies. Assume you've done them on some software package?
Nice to see that the Steel Fist figures look 'at home' there too!!  ;)
Cheers, Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 09, 2018, 11:25:47 PM
Hi Charlie
I'm liking the generic heraldry - works well with your armies. Assume you've done them on some software package?
Nice to see that the Steel Fist figures look 'at home' there too!!  ;)
Cheers, Simon.

Yeah I used this programme
http://inkwellideas.com/coat_of_arms/free-version/
Or at least as a starting point, and as a source for all the symbols. It annoyingly doesn't let you build them square-shaped (though it has a rectangles, and a variety of different shield shapes), so they all had to be then taken to GIMP (a free photoshop style thing). The ripples I did myself (took a long time to work out how to do them to look good, was worth it though I think).

And yes the Steel Fist figures fit in great - looking forward to future 15th century releases!!! Next year maybe??
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: tomrommel1 on December 10, 2018, 07:25:48 AM
Very nice indeed
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: Utgaard on December 10, 2018, 08:13:21 AM
Absolutely fantastic collection  - great work with the heraldry too!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 11, 2018, 06:07:33 PM
Glad you like it folks.

Which is your favourite flag?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: Breazer on December 13, 2018, 03:56:28 PM
These are looking great Charlie. I think I like the red ones the most. But a lot of the commanders are very dynamic. The yellow commander for instance really stands out to me with his pale blond/white hair.

What is next?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Commanders, heraldry and flags! (9th Dec)
Post by: DintheDin on December 13, 2018, 05:36:47 PM
I agree for the yellow commander, but as it regards badges, I like most the swan and the hawk's lure!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!!! 66 of them... (19th Dec)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 19, 2018, 09:48:56 PM
Ok, time to have a look at the cavalry situation.

I posted pictures of all the heavy cavalry together last September, back on page 6 of this same thread. Since then they have grown in number, so time for another group shot!

There are three heavy cavalry units, two of 16 and one of 18, plus various light cavalry, currently enough for two small units of 8.

This is just how it stands currently - I've got them to where I'm pretty happy with how they look in terms of posing and mix of different armour styles. There will be more sometime in the future, at which point no doubt they will be re-arranged with each new batch painted, but for now my attention is going to move elsewhere.

You'll recognise the flags from my last post.

(https://i.imgur.com/Si0t2hm.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/x1F8gwb.jpg)

This one features my 'green commander' from the previous post. As well as his personal banner, the unit's got a flag with his personal badge of a white swan, and several of them are in his green and white livery.

(https://i.imgur.com/yn3FcF7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/KCxs4Qj.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DIRhjUh.jpg)


A shot of the first two units put together....

(https://i.imgur.com/MTjCP4L.jpg)


And all three units together! That's fifty horsemen.

(https://i.imgur.com/g6gA47N.jpg)

And the same number, re-arranged into three ranks.

(https://i.imgur.com/mrCNURt.jpg)


Then over to the light cavalry, which are currently arrayed in two small units. One features the aforementioned swan flag, the other the 'hawk's lure' flag of my 'red commander'. I've kept most of them free of livery coats for reasons of flexibility, and I prefer the multi-coloured look. There are a few in plain red which work well in the 'red unit', but I have plan sometime off in the future to add something to the plain red for another purpose....

(https://i.imgur.com/dOKCt64.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/okdHaLo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jmCwZKc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tagmKqj.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jjt60x3.jpg)


Over the past few weeks I've been going back to all the old cavalry (the first ones I painted over a year ago), both re-doing the armour and re-varnishing them. I thought it would be a mammoth task, but in the end didn't take long, doing three every day. Was definitely worth it. I think if you go and look at some of the first pics I posted on this thread and compare the same models to how they look here, you'll agree they are vastly improved.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Ogrob on December 20, 2018, 06:38:00 AM
Your horses are really lovely. Such smooth coats and colours. Well done!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Bloggard on December 20, 2018, 11:30:36 AM
you can't beat cavalry en masse. great stuff.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Axebreaker on December 20, 2018, 11:35:06 AM
Looks great!

Christopher
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Metternich on December 20, 2018, 06:26:53 PM
Wow !  That is a mighty impressive force of cavalry !
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Tonhel on December 20, 2018, 08:00:09 PM
Simply awesome!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 21, 2018, 09:43:00 PM
you can't beat cavalry en masse.

Agreed!

Thanks all, glad you like them.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 22, 2018, 09:33:39 AM
Great show Charlie. Well done.  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: Winston on December 28, 2018, 01:04:21 PM
Looking fabulous, and inspiring! I need more horses....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry on parade!!! 66 of them... (19th December)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on December 29, 2018, 06:38:59 AM
Fantastic work Charlie, I love reading through this thread. Would be great to see a shot of the whole army together! =)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 29, 2018, 02:17:18 PM
Would be great to see a shot of the whole army together! =)

I've been meaning to do that.... but I've not had much luck with getting good photos of big army setups. Oh well, here's it all roughly thrown together in one photo!

(https://i.imgur.com/MjypMhm.jpg)

4 units of infantry / halberdiers
1 unit of pikemen
3 units of crossbows / handgunners
1 small unit infantry / halberdiers
3 units of heavy cavalry
2 small units of light cavalry
4 cannons
1 organ gun

What's not included are my longbowmen - I've been puzzling over what to do with them, and have a few ideas, but for now they are being packed away.

Also, I just finished another house / farmstead using the Hudson & Allen buildings.

(https://i.imgur.com/uxDM00a.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lB74erk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/uIZQJs1.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tzbcYC1.jpg)


And here it is with the earlier one - the start of a small village, and enough to add interest to the tabletop already.

(https://i.imgur.com/nJEvXLH.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/qMdiL1H.jpg)



So what's the plan for 2019?

Pikemen and mounted crossbowmen. I need to up the pike ratio - all future infantry units will be pikemen. I've just started the next unit.

As for mounted crossbowmen, I've decided to model them using the metal Perry horses - there are a number of useful walking/standing ones that come with the command packs, and the WOTR light cavalry metals have some good galloping ones. This is instead of using the regular plastic ones. My view of mounted crossbowmen is that they wouldn't really be seen in large numbers in pitched battles (where they would dismount to fight as infantry), so would be more likely to see action on horseback in scouting, raiding, skirmishing scenarios. They'd also ride smaller horses, not the big warhorses of 'real' cavalry, so conveniently the metal Perry horses I just mentioned are somewhat smaller than the plastics. It also means more variety in terms of poses and horse tack.
As for the riders themselves, I'm not just going to use the plastic light cavalry (which only gives you two crossbow arm options), but the excellent metal Italian mounted crossbowmen (most of which take headswaps really well), and converting the WOTR light cavalry from lancers to crossbowmen.
This does all mean I'll have to get the greenstuff out to rebuild the saddles - the plastic cavalry (the Italian metals are supposed to go on the plastic horses) and the earlier metals have different saddle configurations. I'm also planning to steal some horse from the metal Agincourt light cavalry just for more variety of poses (they scale well with the WOTR metals), but they have yet ANOTHER saddle configuration which will be even more awkward to rebuild. On the plus side, I won't be doing masses of these guys.

Here's some pics of what I've built so far - the first four are metal Italian xbows on metal WOTR light cav horses, the next three are metal WOTR light cavalry with plastic crossbows, on metal WOTR command horses. Confusing, but I think the end result should be good!

(https://i.imgur.com/UDlR4Sn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DPfJYpp.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/WTtcu0h.jpg)

I also plan to have lots more games in 2019 - I only had one this year!
The first of which should be happening tomorrow.

As the collection grows, the games should get better.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on December 29, 2018, 02:46:24 PM
Wow that army shot looks great, that is certainly a lot of figures!! It is crazy you have been able to paint up so many in such a short space of time in such high quality, my hat off to you!.

Very interested to see how your mounted crossbowmen come along. I am hoping to put on a wargames display possibly based on a group of Burgundian mounted crossbowmen who end up trying to defend a farmhouse from Swiss assualts. It was a real battle I believe though cannot remember where I read it now.

Still brainstorming figures at the moment, thinking of having quite a few dismounted dynamic action poses, but unfortunately that means lots of conversions =(.

Love your farmsteads too, the way everything is placed looks perfect, inspired me to finally pick up the Perry cottage. What did you use for your base?

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 29, 2018, 02:47:59 PM
Great spread Charlie, and the buildings work a treat.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: DintheDin on December 29, 2018, 04:40:18 PM
This is quite a review!  :-*
Unbelievable job in quality and numbers! Congrats!
And the buildings are a treat!
Eager to see all this stuff in action in your battle reports!
May all of us have a healthy and prosperous New Year!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 30, 2018, 05:02:10 PM
I am hoping to put on a wargames display possibly based on a group of Burgundian mounted crossbowmen who end up trying to defend a farmhouse from Swiss assualts. It was a real battle I believe though cannot remember where I read it now.

Still brainstorming figures at the moment, thinking of having quite a few dismounted dynamic action poses, but unfortunately that means lots of conversions =(.

Love your farmsteads too, the way everything is placed looks perfect, inspired me to finally pick up the Perry cottage. What did you use for your base?

That sounds like a really cool idea, I'd love to see it!

A word of warning on the Perry plastic cottage - if you can get hold of these Hudson & Allen buildings instead, do it. They are far superior. I got the plastic cottage and found it a nightmare to assemble properly, in terms of getting it all square and seamless, and have given up on it. Also plastic isn't the best material for this sort of thing in terms of texture for walls and thatch.... I did use the little lean-to / animal shelter from the Perry set in my farmstead posted above. Compare the thatch on it's roof with the thatch on the building and the cottage if you can. No contest!

The base is 3mm hardboard.
I was debating for a long time what thickness to use for the building bases - thinner bases means less noticeable 'step', but potentially more danger of warping. I couldn't actually find MDF thinner than 6mm... but did find 3mm hardboard. In the end I went for it, and am glad I did. The base on the first house I did was warped a bit, but I easily reversed it by painting PVA on the underside. This one hasn't significantly warped to merit the same treatment. So 3mm all the way!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Winston on December 31, 2018, 02:23:18 PM
Fantastic thread and an inspiring collection Charlie. Can't wait to see more.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on December 31, 2018, 07:32:40 PM
Thanks Charlie I have held off on the plastic cottage for now, the Hudson and Allen ones do look special. I can't really put in a big order to America at the moment so will see what comes of that chap who is importing them to the UK, hopefully won't have long to wait.

I just dug out my  2mm platicard and looking at it, it seems quite rigid but will get some 3mm to make sure.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Breazer on January 01, 2019, 11:24:01 AM
I think ive asked you twice now to show your entire collection and it does not dissapoint. Very cool to see. The farms also look really nice. Great job my friend. I hope you will be able to add at least half as much in 2019.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 03, 2019, 07:35:08 PM
I can't really put in a big order to America at the moment so will see what comes of that chap who is importing them to the UK, hopefully won't have long to wait.

Yeah I hope something comes of that, it will definitely encourage me to buy a second batch!

I hope you will be able to add at least half as much in 2019.

That is the plan!

Here's some nice shots of a game I had last Sunday. A bit blurry without the proper lighting, but I think they make for good compositions.

(https://i.imgur.com/6yYbcQ7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Rf9kkc8.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DK28gtC.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jJwma0y.jpg)

This one's not actually from the game, I just set it up while I had everything out...

(https://i.imgur.com/Qi9W2cT.jpg)



Every game leaves me with lots of things to think about, tweaks to the rules, thoughts on how the battle 'felt' and if I'm going in direction. Sometimes it can lead to 'post-game depression', do any of you ever get that? A combo of something not quite being 'right' with the game which you haven't yet put your finger on, and having everything out on the table and not really feeling up to packing it away, not helped if the game ended a bit inconclusively...

Anyway this one went well, I definitely identified a few things to think about, but in a positive way. The game was very close and could have gone either way. It had a main showdown in the middle, preceded by a fun cavalry battle off the the side  - one of my cavalry units entered the game and dramatically charged one of Shaun's infantry units, breaking them instantly and punching a hole through his lines... but then he brought on his own full strength cavalry from reserve who took mine on, after a fierce melee my guys were chased back to where they came from. Though when our infantry met, his army was a bit broken up whilst my battleline was still intact, so I was able to get a fairly solid win by the end (perhaps helped by the fact that his victorious cavalry had chased mine off the board, and failed to return!).

This game was a chance to have two evenly matched forces taking part, both of them being balanced 'mixed arms' affairs, with infantry, cavalry, and missile troops.
However on reflection, I think having the armies too balanced can make the game somewhat 'bitty', with multiple small elements rather than just big meaty divisions. So in future games, I'll be more likely to design the armies based around one thing each - all the cavalry in one army for example, rather than split up across the table. Big units look better.

So going forward, I definitely need to focus on BIG UNITS. So more infantry in big, neat blocks. There can never be enough infantry (I have enough heavy cavalry... for now at least!!). It also means when the troops are thinned out by missile fire, they are still in strong, imposing looking units, rather than being eviscerated and a bit sad-looking by the time they reach combat. Also I think I should lower the ratio of missile troops in future games for the same reason, and perhaps try some games where one side has no crossbowmen, perhaps just artillery, or no missile troops at all - it will keep the big blocks still looking big and strong throughout the game! The open order crossbow units can also make the table look a bit messy when they are too numerous.....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 03, 2019, 08:41:06 PM
Excellent  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Breazer on January 04, 2019, 11:42:30 AM
I've only once tried to create my own game before and the feeling you describe as post game depression I remember well. I also have it a little because I don't have very many people to lay historic games with. This often means I have to build and paint two armies in order to play. I remember the days where I went to a hobby store every weekend and just had a blast playing against all kinds of friendly folk.

It does look like you have quite a lot of miniatures to also play games that are already out there though!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - end of year review (29th December)
Post by: Bloggard on January 04, 2019, 12:42:10 PM
fantastic collection of figures and buildings.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 27, 2019, 09:25:36 PM
Been a while, but I've just finished a big pike block which I have been working on since Christmas. This is my second pike unit, the first one being back on page 7.  This one is bigger - 48 men, 4 ranks of 12, my biggest unit yet.

They are supposed to be a company of Swiss mercenaries, but could just as easily be used as Germans, or just generic pikemen. I added a few more distinctive Swiss touches (feathers, turbans, a horn-blower) but didn't go overboard.

I designed a flag for them - a black boar on a yellow field, with a red cross. I think it has echoes of the Swiss canton flags which works nicely, but being my own design it marks them out as an independent mercenary company.

(https://i.imgur.com/ERqF7HZ.png)

The figures are mostly the Perry metals (with lots of headswaps), like the first pike unit. There's also several Steel Fist armoured swiss, and a couple of Perry plastics with Steel Fist arms. I also mixed in some of the Foundry Swiss. Now for a long time I was considering mixing in these Foundry sculpts, but held back as I wasn't sure if they would blend in so well with the Perrys (they are shorter but with much bigger hands, and are in different sorts of poses), and they are generally a bit cartoony, with oversized heads and hideous expressions. I decided to do it though, and they do blend in perfectly well - the height difference is no issue, the big hands aren't noticeable... and the worst offending heads I have managed to hack off and replace! I've kept a few of the more 'normal-looking' ones, and the ones with deep sallets aren't a problem at all.

(https://i.imgur.com/pD10UXB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jI5epnT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tBVsgrF.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DfP1dkP.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/rEse4ni.jpg)


Here's some closeups...

(https://i.imgur.com/cxGl2ea.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/OGUqrf0.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/W18xeuH.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Dabmky4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ZE2OSmk.jpg)


And some individual models from the rear ranks...

(https://i.imgur.com/TWUKlxg.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Ku19KI0.jpg)


And here they are with the earlier pike unit, with matching flags.

(https://i.imgur.com/XwCoNRY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7WbNm8I.jpg)

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on March 27, 2019, 09:31:59 PM
Cracking work and soooo many  lol

The flag is great and certainly looks the part  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on March 27, 2019, 10:46:18 PM
Excellent work! That's a great swarm o' Swiss!

The combination of arms looks excellent in formation, and the boar standard looks great! Definitely fits the late 15th century feel!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Big Martin Back on March 28, 2019, 07:53:27 AM
Missed this before somehow. Excellent work and I love those building bases.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on March 28, 2019, 10:07:13 AM
Wow!! That looks amazing Charlie. Looking at those figures there are quite a few that look like they are from a brand new range as i cannot work out what bits are used from which manufacturer because they look so seemless and natural with your conversions. Top work!!

Very interested in how you have used the foundy figures with the perry ones, that opens up a lot of opportunities
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Griefbringer on March 28, 2019, 11:34:35 AM
That's a honking big pike block!

I have to say that those yellow jackets really stand out compared to the more muted colours on the other figures. Is this by design, or have you not yet found a duller yellow shade? I think something similar to the shade on the new boar flag would look great on the jackets. Another way to get a particularly Swiss/German look would be combine that bright yellow with black - one half of the jacket in each colour - makes painting more time consuming but might be of interest e.g. on a standard bearer.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: painterman on March 28, 2019, 06:50:03 PM
They are great Chris - nice to see the Steel Fist ones in there!
I have also thought of using Foundry and I must admit that I've found it harder than I expected to spot them - so they blend Ok and I'm convinced to add a few.
I guess it maybe relevant to the rules you're using, but I may have expected to see more depth in a pike block? I spend too long chewing these things over, re frontage, depth and basing in general when it comes to pikes!
This is a useful 'prod' for me to get mine done too.
Great work..
Cheers simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 29, 2019, 06:18:47 PM
I have to say that those yellow jackets really stand out compared to the more muted colours on the other figures. Is this by design, or have you not yet found a duller yellow shade? I think something similar to the shade on the new boar flag would look great on the jackets. Another way to get a particularly Swiss/German look would be combine that bright yellow with black - one half of the jacket in each colour - makes painting more time consuming but might be of interest e.g. on a standard bearer.

Yes, they do stand out a bit... they're not quite so vivid in real life, though they do still stand out. It would have been nice if the yellow clothing and the flag matched, but the flag was the last thing I did... it's printed, not painted, and it's next to impossible to get the printed colours to match the models. I would definitely agree the warmer yellow of the flag is nicer though - I might try and go more in that direction next time I paint yellow clothing.

As for parti-coloured clothing - I've done that before and for some reason it just doesn't sit right with me. I don't like the look.... Do you mean the yellow and black would make them look more Swiss as these colours were used as 'uniforms' for some of the Swiss Cantons? If so, I'd actively like to avoid that, as, these guys aren't Cantonal troops! Or.. do you mean that parti-coloured clothing was a notably Swiss fashion statement, regardless of colours and Cantons?

I guess it maybe relevant to the rules you're using, but I may have expected to see more depth in a pike block? I spend too long chewing these things over, re frontage, depth and basing in general when it comes to pikes!

I can always add another rank or two at a later date. The advantage of having single based models (except the front two ranks of pike blocks) is the units can always be re-arranged and re-organized. Perhaps this unit will grow in the future to get more of a true 'block' look to it.

However you mention rules - I use my own rules, and the games are supposed to represent small-scale battles, so rather than this unit representing a 3,000 strong pike block, it's something closer to what you see - perhaps a 1:5 ratio? So it's not really supposed to be a massive square formation.
As you can see on the pictures with the two pike units together, I am all about forming battlelines of multiple close order units. So the end result on the gaming table should not be lots of little squares dotted across the battlefield, bur rather big strong battlelines, made of up units of various widths and depths side by side (the rules basically mean two 30-strong units side by side will have the exact same effect as a single 60-strong unit). The depth of these battlelines may well be increased in the future.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Captain Harlock on March 31, 2019, 10:19:16 AM
I think that the best method with difficult colors such as red or yellow is to use the desired color as final highlight over a muted base tone.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Griefbringer on March 31, 2019, 12:09:09 PM
As for parti-coloured clothing - I've done that before and for some reason it just doesn't sit right with me. I don't like the look.... Do you mean the yellow and black would make them look more Swiss as these colours were used as 'uniforms' for some of the Swiss Cantons? If so, I'd actively like to avoid that, as, these guys aren't Cantonal troops! Or.. do you mean that parti-coloured clothing was a notably Swiss fashion statement, regardless of colours and Cantons?

I would consider parti-coloured clothing and livery a popular fashion across 15th century western Europe, and not specific to any certain location. I find it interesting, but if you are not comfortable with the look then it probably better that you steer away from it - especially since you are not (to my understanding) trying to depict specific historical retinues or urban contingents.

As for the combination of yellow and black, I tend to strongly associate that with German-speaking Europe of the time, since the colour combination seems to appear particularly commonly in heraldry from that area, and even forms part of the modern German flag. It is not particularly strongly associated with most Swiss cantons (like red/white or blue/white combinations), except possibly with Uri (whose flag features a black bull's head on yellow background), though there is a very famous hornblower illustrated in Schilling chronicles in yellow/black clothing - this one has been frequently reproduced in miniature, too.

As for the black clothing, it is worth keeping in mind that back in the medieval times it was expensive, due to requiring most dyeing material to produce. Full length black robes, requiring lots of expensive clothing, would be a clear indication of wealth and social standing; these appear as civilian clothing in this period, but luckily were not a battlefield fashion - purely black clothing tends to be a pain to paint, as usual shading techniques do not apply.

As for options for a darker yellow, I am not sure what paints you are using, but the shade of the flag reminds me a little bit of Vallejo colour Desert Yellow, though that would probably be a lot duller. You may need to try experimenting mixing various yellows (and maybe even oranges) to find a shade that you are comfortable with - yellows can be a bit tricky to work with, especially since some of them do not easily provide good coverage.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Klingula on March 31, 2019, 04:15:06 PM
These pikemen are very good! I like how the Perry brothers ' miniatures and the Steel Fist are combined. Surprisingly, you managed to include in this squad and miniatures from Foundry
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Breazer on April 05, 2019, 05:20:10 PM
The pike unit is looking awesome Charlie. I really like the banner too, would love to do a similar thing for my guys. The colours seem awesome.
also your collection is becoming beyond impressive.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Swiss pike attack!!! (27th March)
Post by: Anselm van Helsing on April 08, 2019, 01:02:41 PM
Superb work! Where do you find the energy to paint so many minis so consistently?

-Z
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 06, 2019, 09:47:32 PM
The other day I had a game with my friend Joe, who is new to wargaming. He likes a good game though, especially if it involves rolling dice, and seemed to thoroughly enjoy having to make tactical decisions.

I wanted to come up with a simple scenario that would be more interesting than the standard pitched battle, with some elements of randomness and surprise.... That would give Joe some choices to make, but wouldn't require any in depth knowledge of battlefield tactics or history.

Here's the layout, with Joe's army on the right, defending. I would be attacking, and the 'random' factor would be where my units enter from. I said that my vanguard had hurried on ahead and attacked rashly - they would enter on turn 1 from a random point (A, B or C). I set up the centre of Joe's army for him, with his artillery, crossbowmen and halberdiers in good positions inside the village - I then let him choose which flanks to place his cavalry and two pike units on - not knowing where I'd be coming from, he opted for pikes on each flank, and his right flank being the strongest with both the larger Swiss unit and the heavy cavalry.

(https://i.imgur.com/KmCP0Mq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/vtMpflT.jpg)

On turn one my vanguard (one heavy cavalry unit and one light cavalry unit) entered from the far end of the table, near to Joe's strong right flank. I made sure to play to fit the rash character I'd given them, and they headed straight for Joe's battleline, intending to charge. He could counter charge with his own heavy cavalry, but acted cautiously and waited, wary of my light unit outflanking him.

(https://i.imgur.com/S14n3py.jpg)

On turn 2, I rolled secretly to see where my main infantry force would be coming on... but that wouldn't be until turn 3. With that knowledge, I was now allowed to put my third cavalry unit on the table, entering from the point of my choice... The idea being that my general had sent them on ahead to avert the potential catastrophe of my vanguard's rash attack! I put them on the far right to act as a diversion.... unknown to Joe, my main infantry force would also be entering on my far left behind my vanguard. Joe sent his left-flank pike unit forward, which perhaps wasn't the wisest move. His crossbowmen and artillery were managing to weaken my units sufficiently.

(https://i.imgur.com/S0TZnmb.jpg)

On turn three my large infantry division entered, led by my general, on my left flank... So I was throwing all my weight against Joe's strong right.

(https://i.imgur.com/vmRJsVm.jpg)

Meanwhile my diversionary cavalry on my right flank avoided his pikemen and had a go at charging his guns. His halberdier unit stepped forward to defend them, and his crossbowmen inflicted severe casualties with their cross-fire as my cavalry charged in...

(https://i.imgur.com/UxPEIDC.jpg)

And were driven off....

(https://i.imgur.com/CvzGG2q.jpg)

On my left flank, the cavalry of my vanguard charged Joe's own cavalry, who countercharged..... It was tense, as they were evenly matched.... Whoever won this combat could determine how the game progressed next.....

(https://i.imgur.com/nujspbi.jpg)

It was a draw!!!! Their formations broke up as a swirling melee got under way, and my light cavalry joined in.

(https://i.imgur.com/2vJcCDo.jpg)

My infantry advanced, and my right-wing cavalry regrouped. Joe's crossbowmen were proving effective, and he moved his artillery forward to get into a better position for next turn.

(https://i.imgur.com/w8EuePu.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/d5UTUmL.jpg)

The cavalry melee actually went on for several turns... But eventually Joe's side got the upper hand. My two cavalry units were sent running.... But suddenly Joe's victorious unit found themselves about to be caught by my infantry. One of my units charged, and Joe's cavalry retreated out of the way. It was now time for his Swiss pike to step up.

(https://i.imgur.com/hugIgUj.jpg)

As my infantry and Joe's Swiss closed on eachother, I sent the remnants of my cavalry units to harass his other pike unit, but they formed square and dared me to charge... I didn't take the bait.

(https://i.imgur.com/o1QIvYF.jpg)

So it came down to the newly painted Swiss pikemen to carry the day.... They swept into my infantry, and despite being outnumbered pushed them back... and broke them! That included my general, who I like to think was captured as his men fled in disarray in the face of the Swiss onslaught.

(https://i.imgur.com/k3Hyj3s.jpg)

And with that the game was over! Joe won, which is good as nobody wants to lose their first ever game. But it was very close throughout, and there were difficult decisions for both of us to make. The game ran very smoothly....

However, despite this game being a success, I've bizarrely found my post-game thoughts leading to me wanting to completely rethink my rules and how I've based my units!!!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Hincmar on June 07, 2019, 07:15:01 AM

Superb looking game - your armies and terrain are awesome.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: DintheDin on June 07, 2019, 07:37:45 AM
Very nice presentation! And your minis are top notch!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: fred on June 07, 2019, 08:00:35 AM
Great looking armies, they look very natural.

And well done on getting a newbie in. And doubley so for ensuring he won!

Regarding rules - I do like the look of the light troops, they immediately look like light troops in a cloud rather than the solid blocks of formed troops.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Captain Blood on June 07, 2019, 11:51:37 AM
A handsome spread as usual Charlie  :)

I've bizarrely found my post-game thoughts leading to me wanting to completely rethink my rules and how I've based my units!!!

My good friend Silent Invader has precisely the same reaction after every Wars of the Roses game we've played  lol
(In fact, after almost every game we've ever played!)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Breazer on June 07, 2019, 05:15:10 PM
its such a great thing to see all those units on the field. great stuff!!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 07, 2019, 06:42:33 PM
Regarding rules - I do like the look of the light troops, they immediately look like light troops in a cloud rather than the solid blocks of formed troops.

Funnily enough... it's actually the look of the open order crossbowmen that is really bugging me. See here.... I think they'd look much better on large bases, 4 or 5 to a base...

(https://i.imgur.com/vmRJsVm.jpg)

Basically I think I'm going to switch to multi-basing, but won't be re-basing the whole collection. I'll do it in bits and pieces, the first on the list being the crossbowmen and certain commanders and retinues. My 'heavy' infantry won't be rebased any time soon as they have good movement trays, I like how they look as they are, and I still might re-shuffle how they are arranged in the future.

For rules, I'm going to keep my current command / movement system, but switch to a unit / combat system based on Hail Caesar... but not without distinctive changes of course.

My good friend Silent Invader has precisely the same reaction after every Wars of the Roses game we've played  lol
(In fact, after almost every game we've ever played!)

Glad I'm not the only one! Does it get frustrating having to learn a new set of rules for each game?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: fred on June 07, 2019, 07:05:29 PM
I see what you mean about the crossbows. It was the light cavalry who looked particularly good.

Have you looked at the ‘cloud’ style movement trays that warbases do? These are very good for irregular troops, and allow you to keep them single based giving flexibility for different rules.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Winston on June 10, 2019, 04:42:55 PM
Great looking game. Brill to see the collection out in action. Out of interest, what size table is that you are playing on? And how many minis were involved in total? I'll soon need to knock some proper boards together as a cloth on the dining table is soon going to be too small. This looks like a reasonable fit to what you have without being too vast.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a battle report (6th June)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 10, 2019, 05:48:09 PM
Great looking game. Brill to see the collection out in action. Out of interest, what size table is that you are playing on? And how many minis were involved in total? I'll soon need to knock some proper boards together as a cloth on the dining table is soon going to be too small. This looks like a reasonable fit to what you have without being too vast.

It's an 8x4ft table, and a little over 300 figures.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - re-basing madness!!! (13th June)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 13, 2019, 08:37:10 PM
Well, I took the plunge...

Here's the remains of over 50 bases which have been clipped off.

(https://i.imgur.com/UUxfjsM.jpg)

No going back now!

Well I've rebased all my crossbowmen and handgunners, and will leave it at that for the time being... I've got some good ideas of what I'm going to do with the heavy infantry, but that will require more figures to be painted up. I'm not decided yet what I'll do with the cavalry. Not everything will be re-based, some will stay on singles.

So I have six bases of crossbowmen in open order, posed to look like a skirmish screen advancing in front of the main force. They are on 50x100mm bases, with five figures per base. The idea is to usually have them in pairs, so a unit will have 10 models on a 200mm frontage. Two of the six bases are more Italian looking, the other four are generic.

(https://i.imgur.com/ckDqJzy.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/K6llkWQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/wRFvh8w.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/P0tu0qm.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/UW53EnL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/2U9r0VQ.jpg)


And then I've got another 20 crossbowmen in close order, on 50x50mm bases, 5 men to a base. Basically they take up half the footprint of the above units - they probably won't see so much action, and will just be used in defending scenarios, perhaps behind wagons and barricades. They are all in stationary shooting and loading poses.

(https://i.imgur.com/b4wkhE3.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Lqkk8Rm.jpg)



And finally I've tried out doing the same configuration for some men-at-arms and halberdiers and such.... Again these won't be used that often, just in defending scenarios. My main infantry units are in advancing poses, so these stationary / defending poses don't really get used... Shame as I have a lot of really cool models in such poses. So I've based them up together, and there will be several more bases like this.

(https://i.imgur.com/uzSqZJQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/5YH5iux.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - re-basing madness!!! (13th June)
Post by: painterman on June 13, 2019, 09:11:23 PM
Congratulations on achieving that - did it once with an army and not intending to repeat it... but I do like the posing of those 'open order' shot bases.
Cheers
Simon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - re-basing madness!!! (13th June)
Post by: Breazer on June 13, 2019, 10:08:26 PM
these are looking very good. Adding more defensive bases has my vote for sure!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - re-basing madness!!! (13th June)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 14, 2019, 05:00:28 PM
Agreed with everyone else, congratulations on achieving the rebasing! It's looking grand! I really like the option you've got of alternative skirmishing or defensive frontages for your crossbowmen though! Would you do similar with your abundance of archers you've mentioned before?

Though ooof, that must've been a task and half to do!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - re-basing madness!!! (13th June)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 14, 2019, 06:50:59 PM
Agreed with everyone else, congratulations on achieving the rebasing! It's looking grand! I really like the option you've got of alternative skirmishing or defensive frontages for your crossbowmen though! Would you do similar with your abundance of archers you've mentioned before?

Though ooof, that must've been a task and half to do!

Yes, the longbowmen will be done mostly 'close order' style, though I might do a few 'open order' ones too.

It wasn't too bad a task actually, got it done over a weekend. Hurriedly clipping off the existing plastic bases (easy with the metal models which if you're lucky can 'ping' off with one well-placed bite of the clippers , a bit more tricky with the plastics which are fixed to the plastic bases with poly cement), then taking the chance to touch up the paintjobs here and there if need be.... I repainted a lot of the sword scabbards which were previously all black, now some of them are dark red/brown (just a base coat and a wash, very quick).... Then the fun of re-positioning them and committing to sticking them back down! The actual base texturing process is a bit tedious as there are several stages that need 6+ hours of drying.

But it also meant I now have room to apply some tufts - these really a great invention for wargamers, aren't they???
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 04, 2019, 05:41:19 PM
I re-based some light cavalry, going for 2 models per 50x100mm bases. I've seen this basing done before on other blogs I follow, and really think it works well for open order cavalry. Looks better than having them on individual bases. Also leaves room for more tufts!

I've got some more light cav to be based like this, but I ran out of the actual bases.

(https://i.imgur.com/wMLn7Ht.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7Bj4IQB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/8qnZwSP.jpg)


I've also "finished" my heavy cavalry. There are now enough for 4 units (3 of 16, 1 of 18). These will remain on individual bases so the size and layout of the units can be altered for each game where needed, and flags can be swapped out. Of course they have movement trays to keep them looking neat. I considered re-basing these in doubles, but decided there would be absolutely no gain in doing so.

(https://i.imgur.com/l53XKLe.jpg)


Among the recently painted heavy cavalry, there is this new commander I'm rather pleased with - this is both my first white horse, and the first with barding.

(https://i.imgur.com/9loyZbr.jpg)

And here's a new flag for him - I intentionally went for a quartered design with lots of colours. Also a new horse colour, which I think has worked well, and his head if from the new Steel Fist 16th century light cavalry.

(https://i.imgur.com/c2Brz1N.jpg)

And another one with a Steel Fist head, plus a sword from the Steel Fist Swiss front-rankers. The heads obviously work well with the Perry plastics, though they are somewhat larger, so perhaps work best on bodies with bulkier style armour - they might look a bit overlarge on more sender bodies.

(https://i.imgur.com/Xt28fkp.jpg)



And I now have a schedule for the rest of the year. For the next month I'm painting up some batches of random infantry to fill gaps, after which I'm going to re-base the front ranks of all my polearm units. Then I can hopefully get another pike unit and 10 mounted crossbowmen done by the end of the year.

(https://i.imgur.com/Yw7EU5R.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: fred on August 04, 2019, 06:00:17 PM
Looking good, like the light cavalry basing, and the mass of heavy cavalry.

the new additions are good too.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on August 04, 2019, 06:07:00 PM
Looking good on the rebasing! And nicely done on the white horse, it's always a really tricky colour to get to work on horses!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: Captain Blood on August 04, 2019, 08:44:28 PM
Good stuff Charlie. Like the light cavalry very much.

The Steel Fist heads do look a little top heavy on the Perry plastic bodies, but that may just be the angle of the photograph.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: jamesmanto on August 04, 2019, 10:11:55 PM
Yeah the new basing scheme is looking great!
Especially the crossbows
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: von Lucky on August 05, 2019, 11:19:21 AM
Agree - more tufts isn't a bad thing for troops that would go through a little uneven ground.

And I like the white horse - well done!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: Breazer on August 06, 2019, 01:39:53 PM
very impressive... i hope we get to see the new units on here aswell!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: LCpl McDoom on August 14, 2019, 10:05:19 PM
A little late to this thread, but a hearty 'well done' from me  :)

Lots of inspiration and admiration.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - light cavalry re-basing (4th August)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on August 16, 2019, 06:32:47 PM
That massed cavalry is a sight to behold reminds me of the charge of the Rohiran!. Nice work on the light cavalry too, they look really organic as if they are chasing a fleeing army down. What are your plans after the pike block and mounted crossbowmen?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 18, 2020, 08:04:48 PM
Wow, I haven't updated this thread since last summer - time to show what I've been up to then!

As part of my rebasing project I've tackled my pikemen, and the same time added a third unit. I've also been doing my polearm infantry, but that won't be done for another couple of weeks.

Previously I had one 'generic' pike unit, and one Swiss unit. I've taken the opportunity to smarten up the first unit, re-organise both of them a bit, get rid of a few ugly models in the Swiss unit that were letting the side down, and bring to the front a few nice-looking ones that were previously hidden in shadows in the second rank.

This Swiss unit only ever appeared in one game before I was thinking about hacking them apart and rebasing them. I'm glad I did it though, they look much better. Previously there were 48 of them, in 4 ranks of 12, now it's 50 in 5 ranks of 10, so they have a bit more depth. Before I had the front two ranks based in fours on 40x40mm bases - this limited how I could pose them, and putting them in larger groups (two 40x80 bases, and 40x40) has let me get a more natural look. It's a shame that multi-basing them the first time round turns out to be just a practice, and there's always going to be a lot of wasted bases, sand, grass and tufts to get it perfect the second time round, but that just seems to be the way it is!

The rear ranks are now based in groups, some 2s, some 3s, some 6s or 8s.....I wanted to be able to remove a few to indicate casualties, though I don't actually use rules with individual casualty removal anymore, so this will just be for aesthetic purposes.

I've also taken the opportunity to put some of my new conversions in there - I have already talked about this in a separate thread, I won't repeat it here, but I'm summarised it all in two images!

The third unit is completely new.

The 'Swiss' unit is 50-strong, the other two are 40-strong. The idea is all of them can be used as German or Swiss mercenaries, and the two smaller units also as Flemish militia, as I've avoided putting any big feathers or turbans in there. They will see lots of use as all three sorts in my War of Burgundian Succession project (more on that at a later date).

The 'flag' position man of each unit is based individually so they can be swapped out, and I've got a couple of extra pike models so the units can be fielded without flags. In these pics I've go the two smaller units without flags, and the bigger one with a made-up flag of my own.

These units are pretty much all metal - funny how, like many, I started this project drawn in by the wonderful Perry plastics, but now most of my infantry units are almost entirely metal. The bulk of these are metal Perry pikemen (with headswaps everywhere), plus a few carefully chosen Foundry Swiss, some Steel Fist 'armoured Swiss front-rankers' , some plastic Perrys conversions, and a few of my Old Glory conversions.

Enjoy!

(https://i.imgur.com/iFOuhlQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/LYTTOHY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/OtDk7Hh.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/mTW1Q27.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ZKZGyh6.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/knlnPtp.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/I4noIdO.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/rkxmHCZ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Uovfu8P.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/rmQtNHG.jpg)

_____________________________________________

(https://i.imgur.com/9N5Cy4f.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/4AhDxyz.jpg)

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Atheling on January 18, 2020, 09:24:24 PM
They're worked out really well Charlie  :-*

You're righteously proud of those converted pike!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Breazer on January 18, 2020, 11:02:57 PM
See now this is what I was talking about. This looks insanely cool! All 3 of your pike blocks next to each other is a sight to behold. It also makes me very jealous. Excellent work! The conversions blend in perfectly too!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: DintheDin on January 19, 2020, 09:39:23 AM
Fantastic job!!! Congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Silent Invader on January 19, 2020, 10:07:25 AM
Nicely done - quite the array you have there 8) :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: AKULA on January 19, 2020, 10:13:19 AM
Now THAT is what a pike block looks like  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on January 19, 2020, 12:43:03 PM
Excellent work! The conversions blend in perfectly!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: jamesmanto on January 26, 2020, 06:37:22 PM
sigh...
that's how I've always wanted my Swiss to look, but they were one of my earlier armies/projects.

Nicely done. Bet they scare the crap out of Charles!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 26, 2020, 09:42:00 PM
sigh...
that's how I've always wanted my Swiss to look, but they were one of my earlier armies/projects.

Nicely done. Bet they scare the crap out of Charles!

Funnily enough, they're going to be used after the death of Charles the Bold - the War of Burgundian Succession. At first they actually fought on the 'Burgundian' side against the French, but later switched sides.
That's when they are fielded as Swiss. They will also be used as 'just' Germans, fighting on the Burgundian side.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: DintheDin on January 27, 2020, 08:34:46 AM
A sight to behold!  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - a parade of pikes!!!! (Jan 18)
Post by: Eric the Shed on January 27, 2020, 03:02:36 PM
What a wonderful thread...
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 20, 2020, 12:26:12 AM
This post doesn't have that many new figures - it's all about rebasing, reorganising, new flags and the first steps into a new project.

Up until this point this project has not been set in any real historical conflict, it's just been imaginary private wars in the late 15th century. The plan always was to do that, and later be able to adapt the same collection to interesting (and obscure) wars.

Well that has now begun, as I take the first steps into taking this collection into the War of Burgundian Succession!

I plan to write lots more about this war in the days to come, as I've been doing a lot of research. I'll briefly summarise it for you though.

Charles the Bold died in 1477, and the extensive Burgundian territories all passed to his daughter Mary. Obviously everyone then wanted to marry her, and become the next Duke of Burgundy themselves. Louis XI of France wanted her to marry his son Charles (who would become Charles VIII), but Mary was having none of it. So Louis invaded instead, planning to take back all the Burgundian lands he felt were part of France (and a few over the border too!). Mary did find a husband in Maximilian of Hapsburg, the young Duke of Austria and son of the Holy Roman Emperor, who rushed to defend her inheritance from France. Though his titles made him sound very impressive, he actually had very little money or resources (his father the Emperor just left him to it). So the newly married couple had to raise armies from their ever-rebellious subjects in the Low Countries, and mercenaries who they really couldn't afford to pay.
The French were generally successful in taking territory, though Maximilian did win the one major pitched battle of the war (Guinegate in 1479). They came to a truce in 1482 and signed the Treaty of Arras, which the French came out of much better than Mary and Maximilian. However Mary died shortly afterwards, and suddenly Maximilian was struggling to keep things together - the Flemish in particular weren't his biggest fans, and they held his son Philip. Maximilian tried to rule as Philips' regent, but didn't have an easy time of it.
However the French weren't able to make the most of the situation as Louis XI died in 1483, and his son Charles came to the throne as a minor. For most of the 1480s the French regency government were concerned with events in Brittany, so Maximilian was able to busy himself combating various rebellions in Flanders, Liege and Luxembourg. Border warfare against the French did continue, and various towns and castles changed hands. Eventually the treaty of Senlis was signed in 1493 - this time Maximilian came out of it well, and regained lots of territory, because Charles VIII, now come into his majority, was more interested in invading Italy than fighting with all his neighbours. Maximilian also was now set to become Emperor with the death of his father, and the Flemish were happy to accept his son Philip as their ruler.

This is a great conflict for wargaming in my opinion. There isn't much info on it in English, so at first I was worried all there really was to it was one battle and various treaties. But now I've managed to find some French sources and got the hang of translating them with google, I'm happy to report this war is full of all sorts of small-scale actions - sieges, ambushes, raids, night attacks.... And its populated with lots of interesting characters I'm looking forward to painting up.

The 'Burgundian' armies of Mary and Maximilian are also full of potential, with room for pretty much every type of late medieval unit. Ordonnance company cavalry, Flemish militias, German, Swiss and English mercenaries..... Everything I have so far painted up for this project can be repurposed for Maximilian's armies, or indeed rebels for him to fight against.




So, first off, here's my re-organised and re-based polearm infantry. If you've been following this thread for a while, you will have seen most of these models before - but now I have FINALLY got them arranged how I like, helped with my switch to multi-basing at last. I've got them in two units, one of 40 and one of 48. Lots of these models are very old, painted years ago, but I've been merciless and just chosen the very best - I want these units to look good from every angle, so there are quite a lot of rejects which aren't being used.

These are going to represent German mercenaries fighting for Maximilian, and so I've given them flags with the Burgundian cross.

(https://i.imgur.com/S4eoxXM.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/PPlLODg.jpg)

Some different angles and close ups....

(https://i.imgur.com/oqn90NJ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/qRYPuCO.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ZA6GMuJ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/U1t8ZeG.jpg)

I'm quite critical of the Foundry Swiss range... but this one figure is fantastic, one of my very favourites in the entire collection! The pose is just perfect.

(https://i.imgur.com/b9WsMa7.jpg)



Now, the pikemen from my last post have also been designed for this war - I now have some proper flags for them. All three pike units have the flag-bearer individually based so they can be swapped out. So I've now got enough Burgundian flags for all three units. They can all represent Germans -  the unit with all the feathers of course can be Swiss, and the two smaller units can be from the Low Countries (sometime in the future I'll do some state flags for Flanders and Brabant at least). The Swiss actually fought for both sides - they were brought in by Maximilian at first (both Germans and Swiss, which could possibly have been the same thing), but many of them switched allegience and fought for the French, which was later confirmed by a treaty. So I've also got a French flag for the Swiss unit.

(https://i.imgur.com/6aMuTZ2.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ccUFKep.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/sl2jm5Y.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/MkvKTMl.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: DintheDin on February 20, 2020, 07:46:25 AM
Apart from your excellent painting, you based your units so wonderfully! The choice of postures giving them an aggressive forward motion!
Fantastic collection! Congrats! 
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: fred on February 20, 2020, 07:51:52 AM
Looking great, I like the close ranked nature of your troops.

The individually based standard bearers is a very good move.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Stuart on February 20, 2020, 08:21:37 AM
Excellent work Charlie, I really like the idea of a seperate base for the standard bearer, that’s really neat  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Chimpfoot on February 20, 2020, 08:39:08 AM
Not that you need any more complimentary replies...but bloody crikey!
Achieving individualism on miniatures on this scale is hard ask but it's exactly what elevates these units and gives a air of realism that could have been otherwise lacking.
First rate inspiration for the rest of us.
Thanks for sharing
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Atheling on February 20, 2020, 09:52:14 AM
The individually based standard bearers is a very good move.

Excellent work Charlie, I really like the idea of a seperate base for the standard bearer, that’s really neat  :)

Agreed, it's actually a bit of a stroke of genius!  8)

I wish that I had thought of it a long time ago- it would have saved me a lot of painting time!  o_o

That pike block looks beautiful Charlie  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: painterman on February 20, 2020, 12:17:01 PM
Bravo!
being able to use your collection for different wars is fantastic and they really look the part - great to see a different campaign/war being covered too.
Cheers
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Captain Blood on February 20, 2020, 02:12:47 PM
Awesome. A winning combination of quantity as well as quality. The thought you’ve put into posing has really paid off.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Breazer on February 20, 2020, 07:21:11 PM
Awesome stuff Charlie. It's indeed a very interesting time for wargaming. I'm also really curious about the unit from Brabant (thats where i'm from and I don't ive seen many people make those). Keep up the great work!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 20, 2020, 07:21:51 PM
Great work! These blocks have turned out fantastic!

Nice job on the idea to keep them faction-agnostic too!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 21, 2020, 01:38:52 AM
Thanks all!

Yes the posing is something that I think is really worth getting right. I think having them close-packed like this really is the way to go. I love the idea of a 'forest of polearms', which is what I'm trying to achieve.
It means you've got to put more thought into getting them to rank up right, a bit like a jigsaw puzzle.

A lot of these have been re-based TWICE in the past year - the two older pike units, most of the front ranks of polearms.... Though hacking into bases with clippers seemed tough at first, and I wasted a lot of tufts to do so, I'm glad I did. First time round, too many of the best sculpts weren't positioned right and were hiding in the second rank, and too many dodgy ones were right at the front. So second time round I made sure to get all my favourite ones in prominent positions (most noticeably the front corners) and the ones I wasn't quite sure about where they could be hidden away a bit. Also I realised I needed to avoid having too much of an obvious gap between the bases (as in open space between the models either side of the join), so I made sure to position and glue them all down unit by unit, checking the joins between bases.

I'm also really curious about the unit from Brabant (thats where i'm from and I don't ive seen many people make those). Keep up the great work!

Well from what I've read, whenever Maximilian raised an army to go campaigning in the Low Countries, Brabant seems to be the most reliable in providing him with both troops and money. In contrast to troublesome Flanders. They never rebelled against him, and off the top of my head I think they provided him with troops when he marched against the rebelling Flemish, and when he sent an army to Liege.
Brabant also has a great-looking flag - a gold lion on black! So it seems worthwhile doing one Brabant flag for my pikemen at least to mix in with the Burgundian crosses.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Germans are coming!!!!! (Feb 19)
Post by: Muzfish4 on March 06, 2020, 02:02:35 AM
Wonderful thread - thanks for posting!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century -Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 05, 2020, 09:49:19 PM
Been a while since my last update, so thought I'd show what I'm currently working on. No finished units yet.

I'm currently in cavalry mode, working on opposing heavy cavalry for the French and Burgundians, for the War of Burgundian Succession (a summary of which can be found in my last post, on page 21).

When Charles the Bold died at the battle of Nancy, his army pretty much died with him. Obviously there would have been some survivors who made it home, and many who weren't at the battle scattered across his territories, but suddenly leaderless and seemingly without purpose his Ordonnance companies seem to have ceased to exist as a functioning military force. Towns were surrendering to the French occupiers in both the Low Countries and Burgundy itself, and many of his military commanders defected to the French (including his own half-brother Anthony). So when Mary and Maximilian started getting things together to resist the French, they had to raise new armies. They formed new Ordonnance companies, but they weren't able to raise them in very big numbers, and they struggled to pay them.

So both the French and 'Burgundian' sides have Ordonnance comapnies, based around mounted men-at-arms, i.e. heavy cavalry. The French were more numerous and I'd like to think better organised and motivated. At least that's how I'm going to interpret it - the Burgundian cavalry will be a bit more hit-and-miss, and should be outmatched by the French. That is indeed what happened at the Battle of Guinegate in 1479.

I already have lots of cavalry, so to 'convert' these into French and Burgundians I really just need new flags. I've decided that the French will have smart livery jackets, whilst the Burgundians will not. So I need to paint up several new standard bearers, and some French in livery jackets to scatter throughout the units (perhaps 1 in 4 will have jackets). I currently have enough cavalry for 4 units - I think a good goal will be to have 5 by the end of this, 3 French and 2 Burgundian. All my heavy cavalry are individually based on large movement trays, so the size and number of units can always be mixed up, and no doubt will be every time I paint a new figure.

The question of flags is one I pondered over for a long time. There are lots of Burgundian flags available, but almost all of them are specifically connected to Charles the Bold, often featuring his personal motto ('Je Lay Emprins'). I needed to find some Burgundian flags that are not obviously connected to him, and are more 'generic' so can be used for the decades after his death. Happily I found a few. Pete's Flags has a small sheet of 5 Burgundian cavalry flags, 3 of which are 'generic', all featuring the Burgundian cross. There is/was also a fantastic website, the name of which escapes me, which has lots of free flags, including loads of Burgundian ones. All of varying quality. I found one which was apparently captured at Grandson in 1476, but looks generic enough for my purposes, and luckily comes as a very high resolution image.

So here are three Burgundian standard bearers. The two on the left are from Pete's Flags, the one on the right from that website which doesn't seem to exist anymore.

The models themselves are a mix-up of Perry and Steel Fist. The Steel Fist late medieval men-at-arms scale perfectly with Perry, and you can happily switch the horses and riders between the two..... though not without a little saddle surgery. For a metal perry rider on a Steel Fist horse, you need to sculpt the front part of the saddle yourself. For a Steel Fist rider on a plastic Perry horse, you need to slice off both the front and back part of the saddle from the horse, as they come on the SF rider, and smooth over the join with a little putty. I've also got some metal Perry riders on plastic Perry horses - in these cases you need to remove the rear party of the saddle on the plastic horse.

The Steel Fist riders also come with separate heads, and in most of the following examples I've actually given them Perry heads instead.

So the three Burgundians... the first on the left is simply a metal Perry on a SF horse. The middle on is a SF on a plastic Perry horse, with a (metal) Perry head. The third one is just a metal Perry on a plastic Perry horse.

(https://i.imgur.com/z3Hako6.jpg)


On to the French.... There is a serious lack of French flags available for the 1450-1500 period. But 'that website' had some, including the two below. Now for some reason these came as much smaller, low-resolution images, so I wouldn't sure if they would work, but I think once on the finished models they look fine. I like the black flag in particular. They are variations of the same flags that come in the Perry plastic box sets. I believe it's St Michael fighting a dragon, surrounded by sunbursts. I don't know the historical source for these flags, but they'll do fine for me regardless.
(The guy on the left is SF rider on SF horse, with a plastic Perry head. The guy on the right is metal Perry rider (with a plastic headswap) on a plastic Perry horse.)

(https://i.imgur.com/1to4r9w.jpg)


I also made some simple flags myself on photoshop - the white cross of France on a variety of different colours, to match the liveries of their units. I'm going to have one big French unit in green and red, and most other units (both cavalry and infantry) in just red. That's the current plan anyway.
(On the left is SF rider, SF head, plastic Perry horse... On the right is SF rider, plastic Perry head, plastic Perry horse.)

(https://i.imgur.com/ZWoNrfZ.jpg)


So that's enough flags now for up to 4 French units and 3 Burgundian..... I think extra-large units will get 2 flags.


And here's a couple of new French men-at-arms I've painted in their smart green and red livery. The heads are conversions, with added plumes to make them look extra fancy. The sallet and bevor combo on the right is also a combination of two different heads.

(https://i.imgur.com/tCGueNK.jpg)


And here's a cool conversion I rather like, a captain for one of he Burgundian units. He's the Perry metal Richard III model, with a Steel Fist headswap, on a plastic Perry horse. The horse head is from the Agincourt knights set, with an added big feather from the WOTR cavalry set.

(https://i.imgur.com/FYjQ28U.jpg)


And finally..... a German light cavalryman. It seems lots of German horsemen were hired by the towns across Burgundy who resisted the French. They were paid less than men-at-arms, so presumably were a lighter / poorer sort of cavalry. I'm going to interpret them as light cavalry, in small numbers.
This guy is a metal Perry with a headswap, from the Steel Fist swiss set.... on a Steel Fist horse. I think he works rather well, and looks suitably Germanic!

(https://i.imgur.com/2pIJpFq.jpg)




So that's it for now. Hopefully I can have some finished cavalry units to show you in a few months!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 05, 2020, 11:18:57 PM
Great work! And thanks for showing off the compatibility between the Perry and SF ranges!

Silly question but how'd you do the plumes for your two liveried Men-At-Arms? Lately I've just been cannibalising feathers from the Perry Swiss heads
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Hu Rhu on May 06, 2020, 08:09:19 AM
Fantastic conversion work and some great painting as usual. Nice mix up of the two ranges, especially using the horses, which gives much greater range of poses.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Atheling on May 06, 2020, 08:21:28 AM
Top drawer Charlie  :-*

Are the plumes from the Steel Fist plume pack and/or the Swiss Front Ranker pack/s?

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: DintheDin on May 06, 2020, 10:48:15 AM
Most of your works remind oil paintings, so well done!  :-* Many congrats!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: painterman on May 06, 2020, 09:43:44 PM
Hi
Really love the variations that you've got with the mounted figures - they look spot on and always good to have create some unique figures in units.
Very impressive armies coming along.
Cheers, Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: bluewillow on May 07, 2020, 06:47:47 AM
Loving the cavalry! Some great standards there

Cheers
Matt
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 07, 2020, 08:41:44 AM
Silly question but how'd you do the plumes for your two liveried Men-At-Arms? Lately I've just been cannibalising feathers from the Perry Swiss heads

Are the plumes from the Steel Fist plume pack and/or the Swiss Front Ranker pack/s?

The plumes on the two French men at arms are from LAF's very own painterman, who I believe had them cast up for his Burgundians several years back. I don't know if he's got any left, though you're welcome to ask him!

Note that the big feathers on the German horseman are not separate, the head being from the SF Swiss front rankers.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Atheling on May 07, 2020, 10:14:29 AM
The plumes on the two French men at arms are from LAF's very own painterman, who I believe had them cast up for his Burgundians several years back. I don't know if he's got any left, though you're welcome to ask him!

Note that the big feathers on the German horseman are not separate, the head being from the SF Swiss front rankers.

Thanks Charlie. I'll ask Simon today :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: GamesPoet on June 19, 2020, 12:35:14 AM
Enjoyed reviewing this entire thread.  The early posts are outstanding, and then with the figures transforming for the Burgundian War of Succession is excellent.  I look forward to seeing more.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Wiegraf on June 19, 2020, 02:13:40 AM
These are great. I'm looking to do some late 15th century Armies that are just "mercenary" in nature after my ww2 project, and this is great inspiration. Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Hunlion on June 21, 2020, 06:56:02 PM
Hi Charlie,

So I would like to ask have you fixed on a base size for your units.  10 or 12 figures to an Infantry unit? Mounted 8 or 10 or even 12 to a unit. Light cavalry?

Thanks in advance.

Hunlion
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Breazer on June 22, 2020, 06:59:54 AM
Awesome stuff Charlie. Really looking forward to the massive additions you will add this time!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 22, 2020, 06:01:31 PM
Hi Charlie,

So I would like to ask have you fixed on a base size for your units.  10 or 12 figures to an Infantry unit? Mounted 8 or 10 or even 12 to a unit. Light cavalry?

Thanks in advance.

Hunlion

Do you mean units or bases? The units are much bigger than you mentioned, my cavalry units are 16, 18 or 20 strong. All based individually but using my own custom-designed unit trays.
Light cavalry are based 2 on a 50x100mm base, usually 10 (5 bases) in a unit. I'll have a finished unit of light cavalry to show you in a few weeks hopefully.
I don't have any set unit sizes, my rules allow any size units, from small to very large - roughly in multiples of 5. 1 'unit strength' points for every 5 infantry, or 2 for every 5 cavalry. So 40 infantry or 20 cavalry is unit strength 8. The 16 and 18 strong cavalry I mentioned are rounded up from 15 or 17.5 (i.e. unit strength 6 and unit strength 7).
This current cavalry phase should be wrapped up this summer - I'd like to say in a few weeks, but more likely a month or so. Then I will showcase all the finished/rearranged French and Burgundian cavalry units. Then it will be giving horses a break for a while, and time to start some French infantry!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Hunlion on June 25, 2020, 08:18:49 PM
Thanks, Charlie for the information.  I will be following your further adventures with your projects with great interest. Keep us all posted, please.

HunLion
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Ray Rivers on June 26, 2020, 03:21:07 PM
It's been ages since I commented on this thread, but not from lack of interest.

It's just wonderful to see such a beautiful collection of miniatures. I love your cavalry. Painting all that infantry is... scary!  :o And the flags just pop really nice.  :-*

I think you are going to need a bigger table though...  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Winston on June 26, 2020, 04:14:18 PM
Absolutely lovely stuff - like the horses in particular - do you use washes on them at all - or is it all just a nice blend of colours?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Jeff965 on June 26, 2020, 09:19:26 PM
Jaw dropping pike blocks :o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Hunlion on June 27, 2020, 12:19:35 PM
Hi Charle,

I would like to ask where do you get your flok/grass/grit from?  Thanks :-)


HunLion
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 27, 2020, 06:46:50 PM
Thank you all for your continued interest!

Absolutely lovely stuff - like the horses in particular - do you use washes on them at all - or is it all just a nice blend of colours?

I do rely on washes for most of my horses. At the most basic, they are just some shade of brown or another with one or two coats of Army Painter dark tone wash. The black legs (and ears muzzles) just have multiple further dark washes to get a gradual blended effect. The black manes and tails are just pure black, no highlights.
There are variations on that - some I have re-highlighted with the original base coat, and others I have done a couple of rough highlight layers to start before the wash. I also sometimes use a dark brown wash (a mix of dark tone and vallejo umber).

HOWEVER... all the lighter coloured horses, the standard bearer with the red and green flag in my last post being the best example, are not done like this. They are just lots of layers of highlights, lightening each layer very gradually. They obviously take much longer. I have experimented with various 'cream' coloured horses (palominos, buckskins, etc) in the past and never been really satisfied, but lately I've nailed it - that standard bearer on the palomino is the breakthrough. Takes a long time, but well worth it. I've since done a couple more like this, and this week finishes a white horse I'm really pleased with!

So in short - brown / bay / chestnut horses, mostly quick washes. White, palomino and other light coloured horses, painstaking layered highights.

I would like to ask where do you get your flok/grass/grit from?  Thanks :-)

The grit is just sand. I don't even paint it, just seal it with watered down PVA, so it dries rock hard.
The static grass is from Army Painter, the colour is 'steppe grass' I believe. Apply that quite liberally so there is more grass than bare ground/sand.
And the tufts are from Gamers Grass, three different colours. I'm a recent convert to 'tufts', they really are amazing. The more the better really, they just look great.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: Hunlion on June 27, 2020, 09:53:08 PM
Thanks, Charlie for the information.  :)

HunLion
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Cavalry for the War of Burgundian Succession (May 5)
Post by: bluewillow on July 03, 2020, 07:11:57 AM
Excellent work

Cheers
Matt
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 17, 2020, 08:39:47 PM
So, I've nearly finished the French and Burgundian cavalry, just painting the last couple of batches or riders- I think I've painted my last horse for a good while!

Here's one particular successful conversion I shared on facebook a few weeks ago - another Perry/Steel Fist hybrid. My favourite of the bunch.

(https://i.imgur.com/iMvW9MR.jpg)


Meanwhile, I've been adding a few more light cavalry at the same time, so now I've got a second unit of 10 in open order. I made an effort to make these look particularly Germanic - several in full Gothic harness, and some big feathers (I think that's a German fashion, not just Swiss? Southern German?). With the older unit of very generic light cavalry, there are 20 in total. I will add another 5 more German ones sometime in the future.

It seems some sort of German light cavalry were involved in the War of Burgundian Succession. There is evidence of German horsemen being hired by various towns which resisted the French, and also in Maximilian's armies which were sent to campaign in Gelderland and Luxembourg. Interestingly they were paid much less than men-at-arms, which suggests they were more lightly armoured, and perhaps 'light cavalry', well suited to the raids and skirmishing between the French and 'Burgundians'.
My source is this article (https://www.cairn.info/revue-du-nord-2002-2-page-389.htm#) - it's in French, but let google chrome translate is and you get a very readable and easy to understand English translation!

Anyway here they are. Most of them are converted in some way or another, including a few hand swaps, and the head of the captain is one of my new helmet/bevor combos. Most are Perry plastics, but three are Perry metals, and two of these ride Steel Fist horses. The head with the huge feathers is from the Steel Fist swiss front-rankers.

(https://i.imgur.com/FJ8vxPC.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Mdl9N5s.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/A40dEgC.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/f1jdXFN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/sV7o7RZ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/kXdXNOn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/FS4gkfK.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/vwChx4y.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/KG6hh3v.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: DintheDin on July 17, 2020, 08:48:19 PM
Very neat painting and an admirable job on metal! You achieved nice postures also! And well painted horses! What's not to like?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on July 17, 2020, 10:32:32 PM
Excellent work, and thanks for the link to the article too! Nice attention to detail specifically using the German plate harnesses in the bunch as well!

Is the leaning chap at the back of the captain's base a Perry Metal?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: Ray Rivers on July 18, 2020, 12:56:18 AM
Wonderful!

I also really like your favorite!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: Aesthete on July 18, 2020, 02:05:06 AM
Inspiring work. Really well done!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 18, 2020, 05:29:24 AM
Is the leaning chap at the back of the captain's base a Perry Metal?

Yes, he's from 'WR19 Scurrers scouting'. He's in a dynamic pose, originally twisting in the saddle to look behind him, but with a headswap so he's looking straight ahead another interesting new pose is created!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: Atheling on July 18, 2020, 06:07:54 AM
Yes, he's from 'WR19 Scurrers scouting'. He's in a dynamic pose, originally twisting in the saddle to look behind him, but with a headswap so he's looking straight ahead another interesting new pose is created!

It could be a young Richard of Gloucester with his spine twisted like that.

Lovely work BTW  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - German light cavalry! (July 17)
Post by: AKULA on July 18, 2020, 08:08:44 AM
Yes, he's from 'WR19 Scurrers scouting'. He's in a dynamic pose, originally twisting in the saddle to look behind him, but with a headswap so he's looking straight ahead another interesting new pose is created!

Excellent idea {scribbles a note for pinching latter}

Lovely PJs as always

 :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 26, 2020, 09:40:59 PM
So last year I rebased 50 crossbows and handgunners as my first move to (mostly) multibasing this project. However.... to be honest I haven't been quite satisfied with how they look...

I've also wanted to paint up a few more crossbows and handguns to be specifically Germans, for the War of Burgundian Succession.
In 1477 when Louis XI invaded the Burgundian territories, the 'burgundians' were somewhat defenceless, after Charles the Bold's army was mostly destroyed at Nancy. Some of the first mercenaries to be hired were 'germans', apparently mostly handgunners/'couleuvriniers' - many towns recruited them in large numbers. It seems they were keen on going on raids and taking the fight to the French - these expeditions universally met with disaster! They also captured a few castles for themselves temporarily, and some of them went over to the French. All in all they don't sound like they were the best investment.....
Later large numbers of Germans and Swiss were hired - presumably mostly pikemen, though no doubt with some missile troops among them.
Read more about them in this article - it's in French, but google does a very good job of translating it, is perfectly understandable!
https://www.cairn.info/revue-du-nord-2002-2-page-389.htm#

Anyway, I was thinking my existing handgunners/crossbowmen weren't really doing it for me, and at the least would need rebasing.
I have painted up 10 new ones, using a different basing layout. I'm very pleased with them - my plan is to choose the nicest figures from my existing units, rip them off their bases and redo them like this. I won't need them all, perhaps 20 will go in the bin, 30 will be kept, which with these new ones will give me 40 - 4 units of 10 should be plenty.

These are all metal sculpts - no plastics. 8 of them are from the Perry Italian skirmisher sets (fantastic poses!), and 2 are Crusader Miniatures. The small/aborted WOTR range from Crusader has some useful potential for conversions..... It has four handgunner sculpts. My criticism of them is they are all in identical, rigid poses, and like all of that range they have tiny little hands. However I found that just by giving them headswaps, and very carefully positioning their new heads, they don't quite look so rigid/awkward - they look much more 'lifelike'. The small hands I can live with. In their favour, they are very finely detailed, and all the straps, belts, pouches etc are a very nice touch. One of them has a powder horn and a very nice longsword in scabbard.
The Perry sculpts have all had headswaps too, and I've tried to make them look less Italian in the process, and hopefully a little German, including one with a Swiss 'turban'. I've added a few swords and bucklers to those that lacked them, and a couple of Swiss basilard daggers (from Steel Fist).

(https://i.imgur.com/dbau2nr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/s0HrUqX.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/GSuWwjL.jpg)


They are based 5 to a 40x80mm base. Previously I had them 5 to a 50x100. I definitely prefer this layout - they are closer together, but still loose enough to be considered in open order. The smaller footprint I consider to be an advantage. Here's a comparison of the old and new layout. What do you think?

(https://i.imgur.com/fNYYYsJ.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on August 26, 2020, 10:27:29 PM
Nice  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on August 26, 2020, 10:31:35 PM
They look great!

And nice to see the Les étrangers article! It's got a lot of interesting information in! Definitely a lot of room to get some mileage out of when building up a late-Burgundian force!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 27, 2020, 06:18:47 PM
 
They look great!

And nice to see the Les étrangers article! It's got a lot of interesting information in! Definitely a lot of room to get some mileage out of when building up a late-Burgundian force!

Yes, it was a great find! I can't recall - did you find it for me??
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: Griefbringer on August 28, 2020, 06:52:35 AM
The small/aborted WOTR range from Crusader has some useful potential for conversions..... It has four handgunner sculpts. My criticism of them is they are all in identical, rigid poses, and like all of that range they have tiny little hands. However I found that just by giving them headswaps, and very carefully positioning their new heads, they don't quite look so rigid/awkward - they look much more 'lifelike'. The small hands I can live with. In their favour, they are very finely detailed, and all the straps, belts, pouches etc are a very nice touch. One of them has a powder horn and a very nice longsword in scabbard.

My understanding is that this range was originally sculpted for Corvus Belli, and then at some point in the past sold to Crusader - this explains why they differ from the usual Crusader sculpts in proportions and style.

I have two packs of these handgunners for some reason - could try doing a few headswaps at some point to provide them with more variety.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some German handguns/crossbows (August 26)
Post by: Winston on August 28, 2020, 09:16:42 PM
They look top drawer and I like the spacing a lot - close together to look like a group working together yet far enough apart to pass as Skirmish or open order etc.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 31, 2020, 02:16:50 PM
Ok, a big post today. I have finally finished expanding and converting my heavy cavalry collection for the War of Burgundian Succession!

So there are now a total of 5 units, 3 French and 2 Burgundian, a grand total of 94 horsemen.

The French units represent the ordonnance companies that made up the bulk of the French armies of this period. Each 'lance' consisted of a man-at-arms with two or three more lightly armoured combatants... I have found differing accounts of what exactly, it seems likely 2 archers, but there are occasional mentions of 'coustilliers' too. I've decided to have my French cavalry units consisting of mostly just men-at-arms. There will be units of dismounted archers (i.e. longbowmen) coming later, and perhaps some small 'light' cavalry units for scouting, skirmishing etc. There are a few lightly-armoured models in the back ranks, they can be considered coustilliers or perhaps lance-armed archers (at some point the ordonnance archers stopped using missile weapons and became armoured lancers themselves, 'medium cavalry' if you like, though this probably didn't happen on a large scale until a few decades later, probably in the 16th century).

The Burgundian units are not the ordonnance companies of Charles the Bold. His army was mostly destroyed at the Battle of Nancy, and many of the survivors (or those companies that weren't there) broke up or even went over to the French. His daughter Mary and her new husband Maximilian of Austria desperately tried to raise new ordonnance companies to combat the invading French. They met with varying success, and they were heavily dependent upon the towns of the Low Countries raising money to pay for them. So I'm interpreting the heavy cavalry of Mary and Maximilian as being outnumbered by the French, and probably inferior in quality, or at least not so disciplined. At the battle of Guinegate, the outmatched Burgundian cavalry were beaten and driven off by their French counterparts.
However these units don't have to represent official ordonnance companies - they can be any sort of men-at-arms fighting for Mary and Maximilian.... specific nobles and their private retinues, mercenaries, allies, etc.

I've used smart livery jackets for the French units (on about a third of the models), with the white cross of France. There isn't much info out there on specific uniforms of the French ordonnance companies, so I've chosen to give most of my army red liveries, though one of these three units is in red and green for some variety. The three ordonnance company standards I got from this website - LINK (https://web.archive.org/web/20160316080025/http://krigsspil.dk/node/65). The three flags with crosses I made myself on photosop.
In contrast, I've not used any uniform liveries on the Burgundian units, and they have more lightly-armoured figures in the back ranks, for a slightly more rag-tag appearance. I wanted to give them Burgundian flags which weren't specifically tied to Charles the Bold (most Burgundian flags you find have his motto on them), but could be seen as more generic and suitable for Mary and Maximilian's ordonnance companies. Two of these are from Pete's Flags, and the long white one is from the same website I got the French ones from. The heraldic banner is that of Jean de Chalon-Arlay, Prince of Orange, a Burgundian leader who fought for Mary and Maximilian against the French (though funnily enough he originally was one of the French leaders who invaded the Duchy and County of Burgundy, but he switched sides and led a revolt in the name of Duchess Mary soon after conquering the region for the French!). I made that flag myself too.

(https://i.imgur.com/o0t3ZUV.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/BY5e1g5.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/yPdeytL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/O0o1RG4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/NxYq2RD.jpg)


And here's a secret... the Prince of Orange's banner is removable. I have LOTS more heraldic banners I'm putting together, the idea being they will all be removable like this, so I can have any of the relevant personalities leading either the French or Burgundian cavalry units (I've got a few more extra standard bearers like this). Most of the 'big names' will have individual command stands, but this also gives me the option for any of them to be leading the cavalry in person.

(https://i.imgur.com/0OTkFE1.jpg)


These units don't just use the Perry plastic sets - there are lots of conversions featuring certain Perry metals, and the recently released Steel Fist mounted men-at-arms, both of which expand the range of armour styles available. Some of these models are years old, some are brand new. I won't go into detail individual figures, but see if you can spot the conversions!


___________________________________________

Now here are lots of close-ups and different angles, which show off the models much better I think!

(https://i.imgur.com/q1jaNyq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/nPe8yyW.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/TmckuAM.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/aRW8wuR.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/VgkNWLn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/KmI6ZGJ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/jnf5mSh.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/UgPL89h.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ojig2sh.jpg)


And an action shot. Charge!

(https://i.imgur.com/YacZYvj.jpg)


And because I'm sure someone is going to ask for a pic of all of them together.....

(https://i.imgur.com/XiLkUqD.jpg)





So that's it for cavalry. No more horses for a long time!
(Well I do still have multiple mounted commanders to paint, and mounted crossbowmen, and I've got some ideas for open order skirmishing man-at-arms units....)

Next on the list.... the French need some infantry. Ordonnance longbowmen - watch this space!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Silent Invader on August 31, 2020, 02:24:41 PM
Great update Charlie. Your commitment to this project is evident. Nice touch on the interchangeable banners.  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on August 31, 2020, 02:47:20 PM
Excellent work! That's an impressive force of horse!  :o

Nice idea with the interchangeable banners too! How do you manage that? Is it just a case of getting some hollow pipe to add the banner to, and then slot over the poles?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Atheling on August 31, 2020, 03:02:59 PM
Beautifully done Charlie and in such numbers!!!  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Ray Rivers on August 31, 2020, 04:09:32 PM
WOW!  :o

There is something about massed cavalry that I can't resist and yours are fantastic!  :-*

Great idea with the banners too. I'm sure that will come in handy.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Captain Blood on August 31, 2020, 05:36:42 PM
100 cavalry  :o
That is some achievement Charlie. Well done. They look fabulous.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: DintheDin on August 31, 2020, 06:48:59 PM
Massive cavalry! Excellent work on the metal parts, you achieved a natural movement of the riders and such a variety of postures!
Great! And the horses are well done! Congratulations!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 01, 2020, 06:05:53 PM
Thanks all!

Nice idea with the interchangeable banners too! How do you manage that? Is it just a case of getting some hollow pipe to add the banner to, and then slot over the poles?

Actually no, it's much simpler than that, though I have seen others do it like that, with the flag wrapped around a piece of brass pipe.

It's wrapped around nothing! I just moulded it around a spare metal pike when the PVA was drying, and once dry took it off and popped it on the horseman's lance (which I snipped the head off). It's a nice tight fit, and stays in place when attached. You can move it from side to side, but can also pick the whole figure up by the paper flag! I did add a pike head which is just a 10mm offcut, that is superglued into the paper 'tube'.
It's pretty robust, and even if it does get damaged one day, it's not a problem - I'll just print off a replacement! But I can't see how it could get damaged (unless I dropped the whole unit on the floor or something, but then one paper flag is the least of my worries).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on September 01, 2020, 08:42:56 PM
Oh wow! Thanks for the explanation! I'll have to give that a try  :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: painterman on September 01, 2020, 08:57:51 PM
Lovely work on those Charlie - the whole project looks great and nice idea on keeping the models fairly generic with the changeable flags!
All the best
Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: AKULA on September 01, 2020, 09:42:52 PM
Top work Charlie - 100 Cavalry is enough to give any Wargames army quite a punch

Clever idea with the banners  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: Muzfish4 on September 01, 2020, 10:31:50 PM
What a magnificent sight!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French and Burgundian cavalry ride to war! (Aug 31)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on September 02, 2020, 06:35:02 AM
Splendid  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 08, 2020, 08:57:46 PM
I've started work on some French infantry for the War of Burgundian Succession.
French armies of the late 15th century were based around the ordonnance companies, which provided men-at-arms and mounted archers. Obviously the men-at-arms usually fought mounted as heavy cavalry. The archers we can assume usually fought dismounted as missile troops, either longbowmen or crossbowmen. I also believe they were more than just missile troops, and could be found fighting on foot with polearms and serving as light/medium cavalry with lances (indeed by the 16th century they had actually become armoured lancers), but this post is about them as longbowmen.

So, French longbowmen!

These are a mix of Perry plastics and Crusader Miniatures metals, with various conversions.
The Crusader 'WOTR' range is a limited but very nice one. It looks to me like a range that was started but abandoned for some reason. The archers in particular are very nice, in really good poses. They scale well with Perrys, though are on average a few mm shorter. They are very slender and delicate with fine details - lots of fiddly belts, straps and pouches. One criticism is they have very small hands. They have a nice selection of armours and clothing, one oversight though is the archers don't have arm bracers - oh well. Some of them have really nice longswords too.

The main conversion here is I have replaced all the bow-hands from the plastic Perry WOTR figures with those from the Perry Agincourt plastics. These bows seem much more realistically proportioned to me - longer, not so thick. I daresay the Agincourt plastics are technically better sculpts than the WOTR plastics. Another cool thing about them is some and clearly in a bent / drawn back position, and some are unbent. In contrast all the WOTR bows are identical.

See here, before and after. What do you think?

(https://i.imgur.com/csEdRuE.jpg)

And I've also given the Agincourt bows to all the Crusader metals. In some cases I have also replaced the right hands too (and in retrospect I wish I'd done it to all of them). The original Crusader bows are quite short, and being metal are prone to bending of course. Most of the Crusader archers have also had headswaps. Here's the best example (though he actually isn't in this unit and hasn't been painted yet!). Before and after - a much better bow, new hands, and the slightly different position of his new head I think has completely improved his posture. What do you think?

(https://i.imgur.com/V91gbTk.jpg)

Here are all of the Crusader archer conversions. A couple of them had the bows, the arrows stuck in the ground and their left legs all joined together. In removing the bows, I had to also remove the arrows and carve away the excess metal from their legs. I covered up the damage with new plastic arrows.

(https://i.imgur.com/rzAdiDR.jpg)

Another conversion was adding riding boots out of green stuff to some of the plastics, which helps signify that they are 'mounted' archers, dismounted for battle. Some of the Crusader metals already had boots.

(https://i.imgur.com/KpB8ITO.jpg)


And here's the finished unit! I've put them in red livery jackets with the white cross of France, but varying it a bit throughout so it's not quite a uniform.

(https://i.imgur.com/aruQfOr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/5HnYqSN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/834ixez.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/SqDCQsr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Kal147d.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/dhDfAPj.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pbDT7yN.jpg)


This chap in the blue brigandine is my absolute favourite, so I made sure he went in a prominent position.

(https://i.imgur.com/V7DdjOx.jpg)


I've got a second unit of these planned, using mostly the same figures but all converted enough to avoid clones ( and there is the one Crusader sculpt I haven't used in this first unit). I think I'll make sure more of them have the high style of riding boots.


The other sort of French infantry I need are the so-called franc-archers. These were basically a sort of part-time militia called up in times of war, whereas the ordonnance troop were full-time professionals. The franc-archers  didn't have a very good reputation and were disbanded by Louis XI sometime after 1479 in favour of hiring Swiss mercenaries (though they were recruited again under Charles VIII). For them I've chosen to use the excellent metal marching archers and billmen from Perry, mixed with a few plastics and lots of headswaps of course. Here's the first unit waiting in the painting queue!

(https://i.imgur.com/nUr8VxT.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: DintheDin on December 08, 2020, 08:59:53 PM
A splendid array of archers in their livery and red Banner!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: fred on December 08, 2020, 09:20:20 PM
Great work Charlie. Impressive conversions, how did you get so many spare bows from the Agincourt set?  Changing the firing hand and the arrow bundles is true dedication!

The overall results are very impressive.


Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Ray Rivers on December 08, 2020, 09:43:10 PM
Another beautiful unit, mate!

Well done!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Stuart on December 08, 2020, 09:57:20 PM
Excellent work Charlie. Really like the livery jackets and your consistently neat brushwork.

Did some of these end up at Bosworth or have I imagined that?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 08, 2020, 10:36:34 PM
Lovely job Charlie.
I agree the longer, more slender longbows in the Agincourt English set are better than the rather short, chunky ones in the WOTR set.
(I guess, in defence of Michael, who sculpted the original WOTR set, it was one of the first plastic sets they made, a good ten years ago).
The Crusader Miniatures figures are actually really nice. Might have to get a few. They don’t look like Mark Sims’ usual work at all. Much more slender and less munchkin-like. Interesting... I wonder if someone else sculpted these, or if he just changed his usual stocky style for this range...
Nice Green Stuff work too :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Atheling on December 08, 2020, 10:39:51 PM
Fab work Charlie- some very fine crisp brushwork  :-*

I agree re: the WoR plastic longbows vs the 'HYW' plastic longbows. The latter are much more the correct size.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 09, 2020, 12:18:58 AM
Thank you all! I am very pleased with how they've turned out.

Great work Charlie. Impressive conversions, how did you get so many spare bows from the Agincourt set?  Changing the firing hand and the arrow bundles is true dedication!

I have a lot of Agincourt archers with no hands!!!
Well I bought a box of them when they first came out, used a few bits at the time but never really did much with them. So that gave me 24 pars of archers hands needing jobs.
I will need to buy a second box for the next unit though.... There are other useful things in it I make use of, the swords, bucklers, stakes and arrows. But yeah I do have lots of bodies and heads, if anyone needs them?

Did some of these end up at Bosworth or have I imagined that?

I'm not entirely sure... I believe there were French soldiers in Henry Tudor's army, but what exactly they were is up for debate. Perhaps otherwise out-of-work mercenaries, men who had served in the ordonnance companies or franc-archers and were looking for a new campaign to go on? In fact now that you bring it up, it would make sense that Tudor's frenchmen would have been fighting in Flanders or Burgundy just a few years ago.... In particular the 1477-1481.... so yes, some of these archers might well have found themselves crossing the channel a few years later!

I agree the longer, more slender longbows in the Agincourt English set are better than the rather short, chunky ones in the WOTR set.
(I guess, in defence of Michael, who sculpted the original WOTR set, it was one of the first plastic sets they made, a good ten years ago).

Yes, I reckon that is the case.

Quote
The Crusader Miniatures figures are actually really nice. Might have to get a few. They don’t look like Mark Sims’ usual work at all. Much more slender and less munchkin-like. Interesting... I wonder if someone else sculpted these, or if he just changed his usual stocky style for this range...

Yes they are good! I think they were from another company originally and ended up at Crusader, so no doubt a different sculptor. It's severely lacking as a WOTR range - it has 8 archers, 4 crossbowmen, 4 handgunners, and 12 'pikemen' which to me look like they were designed as standard bearers. It has a very few mounted men-at-arms but none on foot.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on December 09, 2020, 01:28:07 AM
Excellent work! and agreed with everyone else, the HYW bows work great proportionately!

I also believe they were more than just missile troops, and could be found fighting on foot with polearms and serving as light/medium cavalry with lances (indeed by the 16th century they had actually become armoured lancers), but this post is about them as longbowmen.

So, French longbowmen!

The "archers aren't necessarily actually archers" thing has stung me more than once! I've seen the word "vougiers" used for polearm-armed infantry, but usually only from more recent historians, rather than contemporary musters where they just use "archiers/archers" or "gens de trait" most of the time by the looks of things. At least it gives some room for versatility!   :D

Thanks for showing the Crusader range too, didn't realise how well they'd work with the Perry sculpts!

Keep up the great work!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: tomrommel1 on December 09, 2020, 06:51:24 AM
very nice additions
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 09, 2020, 07:13:19 PM
Excellent work! and agreed with everyone else, the HYW bows work great proportionately!

The "archers aren't necessarily actually archers" thing has stung me more than once! I've seen the word "vougiers" used for polearm-armed infantry, but usually only from more recent historians, rather than contemporary musters where they just use "archiers/archers" or "gens de trait" most of the time by the looks of things. At least it gives some room for versatility!   :D

Yes, I think its very reasonable to argue that 'archer' and 'man-at-arms' are used in administrative records as a rank determining rate of pay. The actual 'archer' may or may not be armed with a longbow or crossbow, he is just a lower ranking, less well armoured soldier than the man-at-arms. It's pretty much the same argument you sometimes find with English armies during the WOTR.
Though the Burgundian ordonnance obviously do list separate archers, pikemen, handgunners etc... I wonder if the reason the French ones just listed men-at-arms and 'archers' is because the latter were more all-round soldiers, capable of fighting as missile  troops, heavy infantry with polearms, and medium/light cavalry? Charles the Bold just decided to go into more detail with what he wanted.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Atheling on December 09, 2020, 07:21:25 PM
Charles the Bold just decided to go into more detail with what he wanted.

I think you have hit the nail on the head with that one. He certainly had an eye for detail.


Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: bluewillow on December 11, 2020, 08:50:34 AM
Lovely brushwork on those, the army is looking spendid. I must agree with you about the crusader range they are a perfect match for the Perry miniatures, good idea to replace the bows too.

Yes hard to find information about the French Archers of the period, even the Bretons have better information. The flags in art, particularly tapestry and a few hints in letters is all we have.  I like using the red on my French also, blue, green and grey work too.

Cheers
Matt
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Silent Invader on December 11, 2020, 12:01:03 PM
That’s a lovely unit Charlie  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Atheling on December 11, 2020, 01:43:06 PM
Lovely brushwork on those, the army is looking spendid. I must agree with you about the crusader range

I have quite a few that I have plans for (for ahem.... a 'few' years!) but are yet to see a lick of paint. The Crusader Wars of the Roses mini's are oft overlooked and as you say mate, they are an excellent match with the Perry EU and Wars of the Roses ranges  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Breazer on December 14, 2020, 09:07:50 AM
I've been away for 2 minutes and Charlie stomped out an entirely new section of his army. The cavalry look amazing and the archers do too. Really well done sir. Your army must look really impressive on the table. And you make me feel like I should be posting my new project here too!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: bluechi on December 14, 2020, 01:29:20 PM
https://altevolkstrachten.de/ordonnanzkompanien/

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 14, 2020, 07:14:17 PM
And you make me feel like I should be posting my new project here too!

I think you should  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French Ordonnance archers (December 8)
Post by: GulKelan on January 11, 2021, 09:31:46 PM
Hi Charlie

Just wanted to thank you for this great tip with the flags.
I will give it defenatly a try!
you saved me alot of work for all these personalities... :)
Cheers
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 31, 2021, 08:59:04 PM
The second unit of French infantry is done!

These are a different sort of archer to the ordonnance longbowmen.... These are the francs-archers, which were essentially a sort of part-time militia as opposed to full time professional troops. They were first raised by Charles VII during the latter stages of the hundred years war, who I believe hoped to have a force of longbowmen to rival the English, but the idea never really took off. The French did start to use the longbow, but I think the 'golden age' of English superiority on the battlefield had passed and perhaps longbows weren't battle-winners anymore, especially if both sides used them.

Fast forward to my era (the War of Burgundian Succession 1477-1493) and the francs-archers saw service both in the Low Countries and Burgundy itself. They seem to have earned themselves a bit of a poor reputation, perhaps due to their interest in looting rather than fighting. They let the side down at Guinegate in 1479 - though to be fair to them the French infantry had been left to face Maximilian's pikemen by themselves after the French cavalry had chased their Burgundian counterparts off the field, and it wasn't just francs-archers who were there. I have found a suggestion that they were responsible for disorder in Burgundy too - the duchy was occupied by the French led by Georges de la Tremoille, until he was dismissed and replaced by Charles d'Amboise. The latter to placate the inhabitants of the duchy promised to put a stop to the looting, and sent the francs-archers home, so perhaps they were to blame?  In gaming terms they can be made notably inferior to the ordonnance archers, or at least less reliable.

Louis XI disbanded them in 1479 after Guinegate, but they were raised again under his son Charles VIII.

For this unit I've used the metal Perry marching archers and billmen from the WOTR range, with headswaps to avoid clones and some of the plastics mixed in. I generally prefer my units in combat poses (archers shooting), but these models are too good to pass up and I really wanted an excuse to use them. So my rule will be ordonnance archers shooting, and francs-archers marching. This could work out quite well for gaming, as in some scenarios I could have the ordonnance archers deployed and ready for action, whilst the francs-archers can be late to arrive and unenthusiastic about engaging!

(https://i.imgur.com/b5QqhrY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/sPn4FtW.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/1RHOTmn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/B2BkKHA.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/tpe1Bbh.jpg)

I really enjoyed painting these, now that I've finally got used to painting all those damned white crosses, and have found a way of painting padded jacks that works.

Here's the two units of French infantry together. It's a start, but not a big enough force for battle yet! I plan to do another unit of each, and there will also need to be some sort of heavy infantry which I've got some cunning conversions planned for.

(https://i.imgur.com/dNK4w8q.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: James Morris on January 31, 2021, 09:42:20 PM
They are spanking.  I like the use of the walking poses across the unit...very realistic.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Captain Blood on January 31, 2021, 11:50:20 PM
Very nicely done Charlie.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: The_Wanderer on February 01, 2021, 08:03:39 AM
These look great  :)

I feel your pain on painting the crosses - I have to do the same (but in reverse colours) on my late Hundred Years War English models, it's quite time consuming!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 01, 2021, 09:24:25 AM
They look great! I like the reasoning around fielding them on the tabletop as disorganised latecomers too!

The method you're using for painting the jacks has turned out really well as well! Keep up the great work
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Hu Rhu on February 01, 2021, 02:03:22 PM
Very nice indeed.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Atheling on February 01, 2021, 03:27:14 PM
Fabulous stuff Charlie  :-*

They have come out brilliantly.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 01, 2021, 11:55:09 PM
Thanks all.

I feel your pain on painting the crosses - I have to do the same (but in reverse colours) on my late Hundred Years War English models, it's quite time consuming!

I really dislike painting freehand on 28mm models, I have manged to avoid painting any heraldry so far (usefully in this period nobles often didn't wear heraldry on their person anymore, which suits me fine), but had to bite the bullet and learn to paint lots of neat white crosses when i started on the French!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 02, 2021, 01:14:40 AM
(usefully in this period nobles often didn't wear heraldry on their person anymore, which suits me fine)

Huh! Didn't know that! I thought it was slightly later into the 1490s before heraldry was swapped out en-masse. Do you know when and/or why the trend started? (Though I feel like the English were slower on the trend and kept the battlefield heraldry a bit longer from what I've seen)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 02, 2021, 07:11:55 PM
Huh! Didn't know that! I thought it was slightly later into the 1490s before heraldry was swapped out en-masse. Do you know when and/or why the trend started? (Though I feel like the English were slower on the trend and kept the battlefield heraldry a bit longer from what I've seen)

Well I really mean just how in general over the 15th century it became more common for the nobility to wear uncovered 'white harness' rather than wearing heraldic garments over the top. Compared to earlier centuries anyway.
You can happily paint some high-ranking noble in uncovered armour and not have to freehand paint his heraldry. Whereas in the 13th and 14th century i think painting heraldry must be unavoidable!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Breazer on March 02, 2021, 10:28:31 AM
These archers look fantastic! also if i can give a tip on how i paint white is always t feint it (hope i wrote it right) go with a slightly greyer colour or something a bit more muted than pure white so you can use the pure white or even a mix of the two colours to highlight with. it will still look like white in everyones eyes.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Atheling on March 02, 2021, 02:12:37 PM
These archers look fantastic! also if i can give a tip on how i paint white is always t feint it (hope i wrote it right) go with a slightly greyer colour or something a bit more muted than pure white so you can use the pure white or even a mix of the two colours to highlight with. it will still look like white in everyones eyes.

That's pretty much my method too though I tend to start darker with the grey in miniatures with a lot of contours. The Byzantine mini below was painted up from Vallejo Medium Grey with Vallejo Off white added with a final highlight of Vallejo White:
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new unit of francs-archers (Jan 31)
Post by: Codsticker on March 03, 2021, 06:17:44 AM
That's pretty much my method too ...
I just discovered that this year... after 20+ years.😖
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 19, 2021, 09:19:44 PM
Ok, today's post is just a sort of update of what I'm working on - no new units, but some things you might find interesting.

Painting is progressing but at a glacial pace now. A busy time at work, and an imminent house move, means the units aren't getting finished very quickly. I'm currently working on a second unit of French ordonnance archers, and I have lots of other things planned, which will take up all this year and probably much of 2022 as well! This is the list of my to-do list, some constructed, others still in the planning stage....

1 - A second unit of 20 French ordonnance archers.
2 - A second unit of 20 French francs-archers.
3 - A unit of 40 French infantry with polearms.
4 - A unit of French dismounted men-at-arms.
5 - A unit of Burgundian archers.
6 - Another unit of 50 German / Swiss pikemen.
7 - Various units of mounted crossbowmen.
8 - Various commander stands.
9 - An assortment of other cavalry.

Yes, that does look like a lot now that I've written it out....

So I'm currently painting the second French ordonnance archer unit - here is a picture of it assembled before I started painting it. I'm past the halfway point, but it won't be done for another few weeks yet.

(https://i.imgur.com/CGcMQfe.jpg)

It's more heavily converted than the first thing, let me show you a few details....

I've got a chap who does green stuff sculpting conversions for me - I've used him before to sculpt padded jacks onto some metal pikemen, and some riding boots for a few figures in the earlier archer unit. I got more of the boots sculpted for this unit, as they are supposed to be dismounted 'mounted' infantry. I also had the bright idea that some of them could have some mail added, so that they are wearing sleeveless livery jackets over mail shirts, making sure to pair them with arms wearing mail. I'm very pleased with how these came out.

(https://i.imgur.com/SxNDqiQ.jpg)

Three of the models in this unit are also Wargames Foundry conversions  - the Foundry WOTR range was sculpted by the Perry twins way back in the 80s. It is a very mixed bag, some goofy looking sculpts, and others are fantastic. I wish they could be mixed in with their modern WOTR range, but they are unfortunately much smaller. I wanted to have a try at giving them new legs to make them taller - I've done this before with some Old Glory pikemen quite successfully. Fortunately I found a seller on ebay who sells them individually - I bookmarked various ones that I thought  looked good and the conversion would work on. Here are three of them. You need to make a clean cut somewhere below the waist, so it's much easier on those wearing coats or livery jackets. It won't work (or is beyond my skill) on most of the ones with full uncovered plate armour. I'm going to resculpt the hems of their coats to cover the joins and bring them a bit lower. The proportions might look a little odd from some angles - small arms perhaps? - but I will position them carefully in the unit so it's not glaringly obvious. On the two with polearms, I removed and drilled out their original weapons and gave them some better ones.

(https://i.imgur.com/viUsWud.jpg)

I also converted one of the Foundry light cavalrymen in a similar way - remove his legs, and give him new plastic Perry legs. I sat him on a metal horse, and also gave him a new plastic hand to make him into a mounted crossbowman. It worked very well I think! The Foundry riders fit on Perry horses pretty well, but do have funny stubby little legs.

(https://i.imgur.com/OVxNIhw.jpg)

I wanted to have a go with the heavy cavalry too, to bring some much needed variety to my large men-at-arms units. It seems the Foundry range has just four basic heavy cavalry bodies, with lots of different head variations - one with a livery jacket, one with some sort of fancy coat, and two in uncovered armour. Again, it would be too tricky to do it on the uncovered armours, but the other two work PERFECTLY. This conversion has one of the bodies wearing a coat and a cool kettle hat / bevor combo. I gave him new plastic legs and put him on a plastic horse. I also gave him a new right arm, cut off just below the shoulder, and to make the left arm match better i was actually able to remove his elbow-plate and replace it with a plastic one, which required some extensive carving.

(https://i.imgur.com/Tissbmi.png)

I've got a few more of these i'll do one day - the body with the livery jacket is going to work very well I think.

While on the subject of cavalry, here are the first three mounted crossbowmen I've painted up. They are metals on metal horses - these sculpts are actually supposed to go on the larger plastic horses, but I fought they'd work better on the noticeably smaller metal horses. One of them has had a head swap. I've got a total of 20 mounted crossbowmen on the work bench, many of which are converted more extensively. I'm painting them one at a time when I need a break from infantry, and once I've got 5 done I will base them up.

(https://i.imgur.com/Cpmzag0.jpg)

Next, I just this week got another greenstuff commission delivered. I got a few more of the riding boots and mail combos, which I've used to make these chaps with swords and bucklers. The arms are converted too, made from several pieces to give them short mail sleeves over plated arms. The idea is to represent either less-well-armoured men-at-arms or well-armoured archers fighting in close quarters. Inspired by various Graham Turner paintings. I don't have a job for these guys yet, so it might be a long time before you ever see them in a unit.

(https://i.imgur.com/7maeuoR.jpg)

And also a preview of whats to come with the French polearm unit.... I needed infantry in advancing polearm/pike poses wearing livery jackets over gambesons and mail shirts. These are variations of earlier pikeman conversions he's done for me. I'm really looking forward to getting this unit together!

(https://i.imgur.com/BUmdoUk.jpg)

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 19, 2021, 09:26:17 PM
Oh, and finally... I've started work on a blog / website. This will host all my research on the War of the Burgundian Succession for you to read, the same project log you'll get here, a full gallery of the collection, plus eventually other articles on conversion guides, terrain, battle reports, etc.

I've made a banner, what do you think?

(https://i.imgur.com/dLrVFu6.png)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Atheling on April 19, 2021, 09:35:47 PM
Quality work Charlie  :-* :-* :-*

Oh, and finally... I've started work on a blog / website. This will host all my research on the War of the Burgundian Succession for you to read, the same project log you'll get here, a full gallery of the collection, plus eventually other articles on conversion guides, terrain, battle reports, etc.

I've made a banner, what do you think?

(https://i.imgur.com/dLrVFu6.png)

I'd make it a little bit smaller. That was the advice given to me by the mods on here.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Captain Blood on April 19, 2021, 09:39:42 PM
Nice work Charlie, as ever :)
I particularly like those sword and buckler men.


I'd make it a little bit smaller. That was the advice given to me by the mods on here.


Only if you’re going to attach it to the bottom of your LAF posts  :)

I like the design.

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Atheling on April 19, 2021, 09:44:39 PM
Nice work Charlie, as ever :)
I particularly like those sword and buckler men.

Only if you’re going to attach it to the bottom of your LAF posts  :)

I like the design.

Ah, right, my mistake. If it's for your blog then it's the perfect size and a damn good design  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Blackwolf on April 19, 2021, 09:50:44 PM
Lovely work :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: commissarmoody on April 19, 2021, 11:09:02 PM
Cool design, and great sword and buckler men.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Silent Invader on April 19, 2021, 11:16:56 PM
That’s an impressively hefty update  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Muzfish4 on April 19, 2021, 11:24:57 PM
Terrific stuff.

Your banner design looks great.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Sirolf on April 20, 2021, 12:56:49 AM
Great design on your banner and amazing work on the models. Two quick questions:

What's your scheme color for flesh?

Also, where are those heads on the french pikemen/polearm conversions from?

Keep it up!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on April 20, 2021, 10:04:08 AM
The conversions are really top notch stuff! Big fan of the green-stuff additions to the Perry kits as well, the riding boots especially give them a very 'continental' sort of feel with the Ordonnance companies!

Nice work as well integrating the Foundry sculpts too! Looking forward to seeing them painted up!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 20, 2021, 06:19:29 PM
What's your scheme color for flesh?

For flesh, I start with a basecoat of dark brown, then GW Bugman's Glow covering everything but the eyes, mouth, between the fingers and any other deep recesses.
Then a few highlight stages mixing in Vallejo game colour Elf Flesh. Usually three highlight stages. The last highlight is almost pure elf flesh. Then a wash of Vallejo Flesh Wash, which is a nice warm reddish brown - it blends the highlight stages together nicely. I make sure the last flesh highlight is quite severe - before the wash it makes them look pale and skeletal, the wash smooths and balances it all out - if the last highlight stage wasn't light enough, the wash can make it all too dark and smooth.

Quote
Also, where are those heads on the french pikemen/polearm conversions from?

Well spotted! The two headswaps come from Foundry figures.... The one on the left is from the WOTR range, the one on the right from the Swiss range. The middle one has kept hit original head.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: Hu Rhu on April 20, 2021, 06:21:23 PM
Fantastic conversions on all those figures.   :-* :-* :-*  Looking forward to seeing them painted in the fullness of time, but in the emantime good luck with teh house move.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: nervisfr on April 23, 2021, 03:56:53 PM
Wonderful work and amazing collection.
That's what i like in our hobby !
 :-*

Re-Animator Approved  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - bits and bobs on the workbench (April 19)
Post by: GulKelan on April 24, 2021, 03:48:06 PM
your conversions are simply stunning Charlie!!

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 17, 2021, 09:14:41 PM
Finally got this unit finished at last.

It's another unit of French ordonnance archers, the first of which can be seen back on page 25 (link (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=101280.360)).

Like the first unit, this is a mix of Perry WOTR plastics and Crusader Miniatures metals, both with their bows replaced by those from the Perry HYW range, which look much better. I think this units looks much better than the first - I have given more of them new riding boots (sculpted by Graham Green, as detailed in my previous post) and two of them have new mail shirts added under their livery jackets. I've also given them a few heavily armoured men with polearms - in games terms they will just be treated like any other archer unit, but the extra armour and weapons make them look like a more well-rounded unit capable of handling themselves at close quarters.

And three of them, including the captain, are converted Wargames Foundry sculpts, also done by the Perrys way back in the late 80s I think. I gave them new plastic legs to make them taller so they mix in with the rest of the unit - I think its been successful!

Also, the standard bearer is from the new Athena Miniatures WOTR range.

(https://i.imgur.com/MHBVias.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/2YfJcj4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Liw8l1M.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/xcH4A9N.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/oDzM6Ip.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/2saGodc.jpg)


And here are some shots of the Foundry conversions. I extended the hems of their coats to cover the join. I generally hate sculpting but did quite enjoy doing these and think they came off well - perhaps I'll dare to do more in the future.

(https://i.imgur.com/s8065eb.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: majorsmith on May 17, 2021, 10:00:12 PM
Very nice
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Captain Blood on May 17, 2021, 10:07:53 PM
Top work Charlie. Well done  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Hu Rhu on May 18, 2021, 06:01:28 AM
Excellent conversions and some great painting as well.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: AdamPHayes on May 18, 2021, 06:10:58 AM


And three of them, including the captain, are converted Wargames Foundry sculpts, also done by the Perrys way back in the late 80s I think. I gave them new plastic legs to make them taller so they mix in with the rest of the unit - I think its been successful!


(https://i.imgur.com/s8065eb.jpg)

Really effective conversions. I have been tinkering with something similar for some dumpy Romans but they are plastic figures, much braver to chop up metals!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 18, 2021, 07:57:40 AM
Great work! The Foundry conversions turned out really well, they blend in seamlessly!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 18, 2021, 06:27:48 PM
Thanks all!

Great work! The Foundry conversions turned out really well, they blend in seamlessly!

Yes I'm really chuffed with how they've turned out. I'll probably do some more of them in the future, it's just a question of finding suitable Foundry sculpts that will take the leg transplants!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Stuart on May 18, 2021, 10:02:02 PM
Excellent work Charlie, I like the addition of the arrows on the archers nocking.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - more French infantry (May 17)
Post by: Ronin1978 on May 21, 2021, 11:51:11 AM
Ciao !
Lavoro grandioso.
Quello che più mi colpisce è il tuo schema di colorazione , semplice all'apparenza ma molto realistico e opaco sembra che tu dia un unico colore ma si avvertono tutte le profondità dei volumi delle miniature .
Mi piacerebbe molto dipingere così senza troppi stacchi tre i punti di luce e d'ombra cioè naturale .
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - some mounted crossbowmen (June 2)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 02, 2021, 09:49:55 PM
Something small today, the finished unit of mounted crossbowmen I started a while ago.

These are supposed to be generic-looking, and will probably be used as Germans, or some other troops on the 'Burgundian' side (could be Swiss, Flemish, other Low Countries, etc).

Three of them are the metal Perry Italian crossbowmen (one with a headswap), and one is a Perry plastic - these are all designed to go on the plastic Perry horses, but i put them on the smaller metal horses that come with the WOTR metal light cavalry. I needed to sculpt the rear part of the saddles from scratch to do this. The last one, on the palomino horse, is a conversion I previewed earlier - he is a Wargames Foundry figure with new Perry plastic legs, and a new right hand holding a crossbow.

I also tried out a new light cavalry basing arrangement for them - they use the Renedra plastic 'artillery bases', which measure 65x90mm. One with two figures, one with three, for a unit of five. I kind of wish i'd done my earlier light cavalry like this....

(https://i.imgur.com/SkSQVSq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/GaS3lUW.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pUvR5Gz.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/GzaDdMS.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - some mounted crossbowmen (June 2)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 02, 2021, 11:00:21 PM
Great work!

The basing idea is good, gets across the 'skirmishing' feel without needing individual bases for it

The conversion and the headswaps are effective too, to give them a more solid 'continental' look (as opposed to specifically WotR). Though do you ever run into the problem of having a drought of sallets and kettle-helms as well?   lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - some mounted crossbowmen (June 2)
Post by: Hu Rhu on June 03, 2021, 11:28:58 AM
They are wonderful, especially the converted Foundry figure.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - some mounted crossbowmen (June 2)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 03, 2021, 07:47:39 PM
Thanks!

The basing idea is good, gets across the 'skirmishing' feel without needing individual bases for it

The conversion and the headswaps are effective too, to give them a more solid 'continental' look (as opposed to specifically WotR). Though do you ever run into the problem of having a drought of sallets and kettle-helms as well?   lol

Yes I'm very pleased with the base layout. I used to have my cavalry all based individually but realised I hated the look of light cavalry in open order like this, and they look so much better based in twos on 50x100mm bases or something similar. This was an experiment as I wanted a small unit of 5, so 2 one base 3 on the other. I'm having troubling thoughts now about rebasing all my existing cavalry sometime..... but don't know if I'd ever dare, there are over 100 of them, and most of them are plastic horses fixed to plastic bases with poly cement, so it won't be simple to remove them without risk.....

I haven't ever run out of sallets, but I do have to be careful not to misplace any of those deep-rimmed kettle helmets which I really like.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 22, 2021, 08:29:27 PM
Today I have the first of many commanders I have planned, to represent various interesting characters from the War of the Burgundian Succession.

This is Claude de Toulongeon, lord of La Bastie. Previously chamberlain to Philip the Good, he was one of the many Burgundian nobles who resisted the French invasion of 1477. The Burgundian heartland was divided into the French Duchy of Burgundy and the Franche-Comté (the County of Burgundy) which was part  of the Holy Roman Empire. The Duchy was quickly brought under French rule, but the County soon fought back. Toulongeon was one of the Burgundian leaders who took the fight to the French- he led a force of Swiss mercenaries west into the Duchy and raided the county of Charolais. When things started to go against the rebels in 1479, he was among the last to surrender, defying the French and retreating to the mountains. He finally submitted in the spring of 1480, and avoided the fate of many of his fellow rebels who had been executed.

I'm not entirely sure of where his allegiances lay shortly after this - he was made a Knight of the Golden Fleece by Maximilian in 1481, but apparently the French also made him lieutenant-general of the newly conquered Franche-Comté.

I've tried to trace his lineage and it is a little bit confusing. His father Antoine de Toulongeon had also been a Knight of the Golden Fleece, but he is sometimes referred to as his grandfather. It seems there was another Claude - my main source has the sons of Antoine being Jean and Claude, and Jean also having a son called Claude. By 1477 both Antoine and Jean are dead, and both Claudes are alive - the younger Claude presumably being the head of the family, with our Claude being his uncle.

My first source for his heraldry was the fantastic wappenwiki site - http://wappenwiki.org/index.php?title=Order_of_the_Golden_Fleece_-_Habsburg, but I've since found the following image, from his own Book of Hours..... It seems to show the quarters 'reversed' - this might make sense, as if my family tree is correct he wouldn't be the head of the family but a younger son, and would presumably need a way of differencing his arms from his father and elder brother? I will continue looking into it......

(https://sites.google.com/site/heuresbookofhours/_/rsrc/1346597199212/t/Toulongeon.jpg?height=400&width=263)


Anyway, here he is. Both Claude and his standard bearer are originally from the Perry WOTR scurrers command set, with new plastic headswaps, and put on stationary horses from other Perry WOTR metal sets.

(https://i.imgur.com/wYYwVZL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/uWgS1QU.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/SaIGRcF.jpg)

And here's a secret... the flag is removable. I don't plan to paint up a command stand for every character, so on most of them the flags can be swapped out. So maybe some day in the future you'll see this same guy with a different flag!

If you want to read more about the War of the Burgundian Succession, here's my thread about it with a link to what I've been writing (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=131098.msg1662863#msg1662863).

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: DintheDin on June 22, 2021, 08:50:28 PM
Impressive job and great flexible idea with the removable flag! Cheers!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: Atheling on June 23, 2021, 07:14:59 AM
Excellent brushwork Charlie  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on June 23, 2021, 07:24:10 AM
Lovely  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: Hu Rhu on June 23, 2021, 08:06:53 AM
Excellent painting and nice conversions.   :-* :-* :-* :-* 

I've stolen borrowed your idea for making the flags removable for my minor nobles in the WotR.  It works a treat.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 23, 2021, 05:20:33 PM
Thanks all.

I've stolen borrowed your idea for making the flags removable for my minor nobles in the WotR.  It works a treat.

I cannot claim it's my idea, I think I first saw it on the olicanalad blog (link (http://olicanalad.blogspot.com/)). Though he uses some sort of brass tubing to wrap the paper flags around, I don't - mine are technically more fragile but i don't intend to be throwing them around a lot, and if a flag ever did get damaged I can just print off a new copy!

I've just updated the original post to add a link to my thread on the Burgundian Succession - follow if you are interested in reading more (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=131098.msg1662863#msg1662863)!

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 25, 2021, 12:44:25 AM
Nice work, the conversion is subtle, but really effective to make the figures stand out as Burgundian!

Interesting point about the heraldry too, it's a shame the Habsburgs weren't quite as thorough keeping armorials of their Golden Fleece inductees as the Burgundians were! It'd be interesting to cross-reference against the Book of Hours to compare with the other Toulongeons



 
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Claude de Toulongeon (June 22)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 25, 2021, 06:00:40 PM
Interesting point about the heraldry too, it's a shame the Habsburgs weren't quite as thorough keeping armorials of their Golden Fleece inductees as the Burgundians were! It'd be interesting to cross-reference against the Book of Hours to compare with the other Toulongeons

Having searched around some more, I can say that the Toulongeon family arms have been depicted both ways, as in A-B-A-B and B-A-B-A... There were three members of the family in the Order of the Golden Fleece, and I have found no answer yet as to which way round is 'correct', nor whether perhaps having them 'reversed' was significant, for a younger son perhaps. And I've found references to both older members of the family having their arms differenced, one with a label and one with a blue border, but also I've seen both of them just using the basic family arms.
So who knows! I guess i'll stick with the 'basic' version for my Claude for now.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 20, 2021, 08:31:46 PM
I've got two more commanders for you today, both characters from the War of Burgundian Succession.

First off is Georges de la Trémoille, Lord of Craon. He was a younger son from a quite significant French family - his nephew was the famous Louis de la Trémoille. In 1477 after the death of Charles the Bold, Louis XI invaded both the Burgundian Low Countries and the Duchy and County (Franche-Comte) of Burgundy in the south. La Trémoille led the French invasion force that entered the Burgundian heartland, alongside the Prince of Orange (more on him in the future!). The duchy was quickly conquered, though the county to the east (which was part of the Holy Roman Empire rather than a French fief) proved more troublesome.
La Trémoille royally messed up. He offended the Prince of Orange, who switched sides and led all the Comtois nobility who were still loyal to Burgundy in a rebellion. La Trémoille wasn't very popular due to his excessive pride and ill-treatment of the locals. He was twice surprised by nighttime sorties whilst besieging towns - first at Vesoul and then at Dole, on both occasions his camp was attacked, his army routed and his artillery captured! He did win one costly victory against the rebels at the bridge of Emagny, but by the end of the year all the French had been driven out of the county. Louis Xi was not pleased, and La Trémoille was dismissed from his duties - he did return home wealthy from all his plundering though. He died in 1481, with no heirs.
Philip de Commynes described him as 'a very fat man'.

Here's my representation of him - it's a mix of Perry and Steel Fist.  La Trémoille is a Perry metal WOTR commander with a plastic headswap, on a Steel Fist horse. His standard bearer is a Steel Fist late medieval rider on a Steel Fist horse, with a plastic Perry head.

(https://i.imgur.com/v1I6gPY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/RH3RXxA.jpg)



And next up is Simon de Quingey, a Burgundian who had served Charles the Bold and fought at Grandson, Morat and Nancy. In 1477 he remained loyal to Duchess Mary. He was one of the many nobles who was part of the Prince of Orange's rebellion in the south. He was actually in command of the Dole garrison when it was besieged by La Trémoille, so presumably was responsible for the successful sortie against him!
However in 1478, after the rebels had captured some places in the duchy of Burgundy, he led a force of 600 German mercenaries to reinforce the town of Beaune. He stopped at Verdun along the way, where he was attacked by the new Governor of Burgundy, Charles d'Amboise (he had replaced La Trémoille and was much more effective as a leader). De Quingey was captured, and was imprisoned in an iron cage (a fate that befell many captured Burgundians). He refused to swear allegiance to Louis XI, and was apparently kept in captivity for many years until he fell ill and was finally freed. He died in 1523.

I've used the Perry metals for Simon and his standard bearer. Simon has had a simple headswap which I feel, along with choosing a specific horse, has completely transformed the original sculpt, he's one of my favourite conversions! I'm very pleased with the white horse too...

(https://i.imgur.com/ye7SYMB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DbyLaEq.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Atheling on July 20, 2021, 08:47:40 PM
Lovely work Charlie  :-*

Fab stuff all 'round but there's nothing quite like a well painted white horse to set off a base.  8)

Always great to see someone really digging into their own research too.

I was wondering, for future reference for me too, what other sources other then Philip de Commynes have you used?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Hu Rhu on July 21, 2021, 09:46:51 AM
Fabulous figures, great conversions and painting.  Also the back story makes the characters come alive.  Wonderful stuff.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on July 21, 2021, 10:32:36 AM
Excellent work! The headswaps really make the most of the WotR command figures, and great paintwork on the horses too

I wonder why Louis XI was so keen on iron cages though! It was definitely part of his 'brand' when it came to Burgundian prisoners
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 21, 2021, 06:21:42 PM
Lovely work Charlie  :-*

Fab stuff all 'round but there's nothing quite like a well painted white horse to set off a base.  8)

Always great to see someone really digging into their own research too.

I was wondering, for future reference for me too, what other sources other then Philip de Commynes have you used?

Thanks Darrell, yes a white horse does do wonders - takes longer to paint, I've found it can only be done with lots of careful layered highlights, no shortcuts, but it's worth the effort. For some reason I'd put off painting white horses for ages until recently, I'm mixing more lighter coloured horses into the collection these days.

For my research, might I suggest you look at my other thread here, where all will be explained - there's a further link to all my sources there.
https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=131098.msg1662863#msg1662863
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Atheling on July 22, 2021, 07:15:21 AM
Thanks Darrell, yes a white horse does do wonders - takes longer to paint, I've found it can only be done with lots of careful layered highlights, no shortcuts, but it's worth the effort. For some reason I'd put off painting white horses for ages until recently, I'm mixing more lighter coloured horses into the collection these days.

They are well worth the time and effort. Next to grey dappled they are my favourite. They just "sing" out loud in a unit and are the perfect way t illuminate a leader/noble of worth.

For my research, might I suggest you look at my other thread here, where all will be explained - there's a further link to all my sources there.
https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=131098.msg1662863#msg1662863

Thanks Charlie. I've bookmarked the page and will give it a read through later on  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on July 22, 2021, 07:43:29 AM
Nicely done  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - two more commanders (July 20)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 23, 2021, 01:14:10 PM
They are well worth the time and effort. Next to grey dappled they are my favourite. They just "sing" out loud in a unit and are the perfect way t illuminate a leader/noble of worth.

Indeed - were white horses historically more likely to be used by people of note, were/are they rarer or more expensive for example? I suppose the same question goes to other interesting colours, say palomino, of which I've been painting a few lately...

Nicely done  :)

Thanks!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 08, 2021, 09:39:10 PM
Been a while since i've updated this, so here's an update to show what I'm working on.

I'm in the cavalry zone right now - I've got some wild ideas about rebasing all my cavalry, but I think i'll stay quiet about it until (if) it gets done.  I'm building up the cavalry numbers first, and once that's done I will think long and hard about how to re-organise and re-base what will be over 100 horses!

Usually when I paint cavalry I do them in batches of four, the horses first and then the riders. I thought I'd go about it differently this time - paint up loads of horses first with no plans as to which riders they will be given, and once i'm all horsed-out do all the riders, choosing which horses to put them on as I do them.

I know most people loathe painting horses, but I've come to really enjoy it!

Here's a bunch of horses awaiting riders....

(https://i.imgur.com/gUa9Y9U.jpg)


But that's all plastic horses for plastic riders.

When it comes to metal riders I attach them to the horses first and paint them all as one. So I've got a few of these finished already, most of which are converted in some way or another - let me take you through them!

These first two are Perry metals on plastic Perry horses. The one on the left is going to be given a flag. The one on the right has also had a plastic headswap.

(https://i.imgur.com/yPD1ekE.jpg)

The next three are also metal riders on plastic horses. All three have been given headswaps (the rider on the white horse's new head is actually from the Foundry WOTR range). The standard bearer might look odd with his cut-down flagpole currently, but that's because he will be used for different swap-able flags. Funnily enough this is the first time i've used the Italian horse bard from the Perry kit - I've saved it up for an impressive looking unit leader! Also the two chestnut horses are me trying out a new colour, using the Foundry paint triads for the first time (Chestnut).

(https://i.imgur.com/68Mx5l5.jpg)

The next two are coverted from the old Wargames Foundry WOTR range. They are noticeably smaller than the modern Perry range, but that is mostly due to their little stunted legs - the riders can be made to sit on the larger Perry horses by giving them new plastic leg transplants. This is very easily done on the riders with convenient cloth coverings on their armour, probably not so easy on the ones in uncovered armour (I haven't tried). These two in livery jackets are basically wearing the same outfit as one of the bodies from the Perry cavalry plastics, but a little variety in posture and cut of the jackets goes a lone way! They also have great heads, including some nice kettle hat and bevor combos. The one on the left has had his lance-arm replaced with a Perry plastic part. The one on the right is riding a metal horse, and will get a flag in the future.

(https://i.imgur.com/Ry7bUHy.jpg)

And here's another two Foundry-Perry conversions. The one on the left has had the plastic leg swap, and also a new  right arm. The one on the right I kept the original legs of - see how little they are? I put him on one of the slightly smaller metal Perry horses so it's not so noticeable. He is also awaiting a flag.

(https://i.imgur.com/p7wCpna.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/zy4SMUR.jpg)


And finally, a slightly converted Steel Fist 16th century Gendarme, put on a Perry horse. I realised this body could be slightly altered to make it look more 15th century - in fact Oliver from Steel Fist seems to have done the same thing himself, as one of his late medieval man-at-arms sculpt seems to be based on this one with a few alterations! It has a raised lance though, and I wanted the lowered couched lance.... What I did was reshape the feet so the sabatons are pointed not square-toed (mostly just done with a file), and scraped off the 'stop-rib' on the breastplate. I left the breastplate plain, though someone more ambitious could have sculpted a plackart. And of course I gave him a suitably 15th century headswap. Though one 16th century feature that remains is the 'gorget' or whatever this sort of neck armour is called, though it is mostly covered by the sallet and bevor.

(https://i.imgur.com/sOYmteC.jpg)

You won't see these based up in their units until sometime in the new year....

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on December 08, 2021, 09:43:24 PM
Very smooth  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on December 09, 2021, 01:35:19 AM
Great work on the conversions!

And glad to hear you've gotten into a rhythm with the horse painting! It's definitely paid off! The new chestnut colour scheme has turned out nicely as well
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: Atheling on December 09, 2021, 06:16:35 AM
Lovely work Charlie.

The blending on the horse flesh is very impressive  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: tomrommel1 on December 09, 2021, 06:39:51 AM
very nice indeed
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: Norm on December 09, 2021, 06:51:51 AM
lovely, I will come back to these when doing my next cavalry batch.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: levied troop on December 09, 2021, 08:08:22 AM
Very nice work.
I’ve started batch painting horses myself, mainly to try and overcome my nervousness  terror of painting horses.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: **GS** on December 09, 2021, 08:35:29 AM
Very nice indeed!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: Atheling on December 09, 2021, 08:36:42 AM
Very nice work.
I’ve started batch painting horses myself, mainly to try and overcome my nervousness  terror of painting horses.

I really enjoy painting horses, usually with a high degree of artistic license as ca be seen on the Steppe Nomads on this page of my Early Byzantine thread:
https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=126483.390
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - restocking the stables (Dec 8)
Post by: LCpl McDoom on December 10, 2021, 12:30:14 AM
Lovely to see this work, many thanks for sharing & also taking the time to put up the explanatory notes.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 14, 2022, 09:02:12 PM
I have finally got round to creating a blog to act as a permanent home for this project (and any other future projects that may one day happen).

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-snyi-97tCuQ/YeMoqbKi4eI/AAAAAAAAAgE/y_ogUoZNGG8YGWcg-eerWehBTbMIoMUuACNcBGAsYHQ/s752/blogbanner1.png)

I invite you all to take a look, and please follow or subscribe in whichever way you would normally do so.

https://fullharness.blogspot.com/ (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/)

I've spent quite some time making it look nice.... I have actually had this ready to go for ages, but I wanted lots of posts stored up before it went public.

You will also be able to find here my research into the War of the Burgundian Succession, which I hope makes for a good read! You can find it all in the dropdown menus. I won't go on about it too much - suffice to say, if the snippets of history given in the posts interest you and you want to find more, then read the full articles there. I have provided a page with all my sources too.

I definitely don't plan for the blog to replace this thread - when I post something new on the blog, I will repeat it in full here (and post a small summary with links to the blog on facebook and TMP).

I also want the blog to act as a permanent gallery for this project, so to start with I will be posting lots of finished units which I have already shared here. I WON'T repeat them in this thread, but as soon as I move on to new fresh things they will be repeated here. The first units posted today are my three pike units, and I have six or seven more such posts which I'll put out over the next few weeks. Hopefully by the time they are all done I will have lots of finished new stuff ready to go (and perhaps some new followers and subscribers by then?).

When it comes to posting up various new commander figures I have waiting to be photographed, there will be lots of history included in the posts, which I am keen to share with you all!

In the future there will be actual gaming content too, but for now I am focusing entirely on painting and army building.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: Atheling on March 14, 2022, 10:58:07 PM
Excellent stuff Charlie. I haven't had time to give it a read through- just a skim but it seems to tick all the right boxes  8)

I've added it to my "Blogroll" on my blog.

Looking forward to seeing more stuff- and rereading the first post tomorrow! :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: commissarmoody on March 15, 2022, 06:22:20 AM
Cool, I'll start fallowing your blog as well.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: painterman on March 15, 2022, 10:56:45 PM
Great looking blog Charlie - will be following, with interest!
All the best
Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 17, 2022, 12:05:09 PM
Thanks, I'm glad the blog is proving a popular idea!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: magyar on March 20, 2022, 08:05:07 AM
Excellent blog, Charlie! I really liked the history part, - great to have the wealth of information gathered in one place.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: glenning on March 20, 2022, 12:11:38 PM
Great stuff as usual! The commander's head seen here - where is it from?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: Golgotha on March 20, 2022, 05:45:03 PM
Exciting indeed! I love your painting style - realistic shading and not overdone as you see on too many miniatures.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on March 21, 2022, 05:39:04 PM
Slightly late to the party but excellent blog! Thanks for sharing here!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - my exciting new blog!!! (March 14)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 21, 2022, 07:26:18 PM
Great stuff as usual! The commander's head seen here - where is it from?

That's a plastic Perry head from the Mounted Men-At-Arms set, with a plume from Steel Fist.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Prince of Orange and his uncle (April 3rd)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 03, 2022, 03:40:11 PM
Since launching the blog i've reposted four of the units I've already shown here over the last couple of years. Today is the first entirely new post, which I'll repeat most of here - there's a bit more about the heraldry on the blog.

Click here to see it on the Full Harness blog. (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/)



The Prince of Orange and his uncle

This is the Prince of Orange, Jean de Châlon-Arlay IV, who in 1477 led a rebellion in the Franche-Comté (the County of Burgundy) against the occupying French forces. The story is a bit more complex than that though, as at first he was a leader of the French invaders himself. The house of Châlon held territory in both the duchy and the county of Burgundy as well as France, but an inheritance dispute had led to a divide in the family. Jean's grandfather had split his inheritance between children from two separate marriages - the eldest son Guillaume succeeded him as Prince of Orange, but some of his estates went to his two younger sons Louis and Hugues. There was clearly a dispute between the half-brothers, and the Duke of Burgundy intervened in support of the younger line. Guillaume retreated to his French territories, and thus allied himself with Louis XI of France. He died in 1475 and was succeeded by his son Jean. Louis de Châlon died fighting at the Battle of Grandson the following year, so at the start of the War of the Burgundian Succession we have Jean, Prince of Orange in France and his remaining half-uncle Hugues, now Lord of Château-Guyon (or Châtel-Guyon), in Burgundy.

(https://i.imgur.com/rAppz4w.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/2rOZsgH.jpg)

Louis XI had promised to restore the family's Burgundian territories to Jean, so the Prince of Orange found himself leading the French invasion of Burgundy alongside Georges de La Trémoille. Through his diplomatic efforts the duchy promptly swore allegiance to France, and the Franche-Comté was in the process of doing so when the cracks began to appear - La Trémoille refused to hand over the Châlon family estates, and clearly the two noblemen were not working well together. The Prince of Orange was then persuaded to switch sides by none other than his uncle Hugues, Lord of Château-Guyon. The recently occupied towns in the Franche-Comté promptly evicted their French garrisons, and the Comtois nobles united behind the Prince of Orange to fight against the French and drive them out of the county. For a detailed account of what happened, read my article on the war here (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/p/the-war-in-burgundy-1477-1480.html).

The family tree I've put together below should make the familial relationships clear - the names in boxes are those who were alive in 1477. Note the two cousins Charles and Leonard de Châlon, whom I have also found among the listed Burgundian nobles who resisted the French. Charles de Châlon had his lordships confiscated by Louis XI in 1477, though they were restored after the Treaty of Arras (1482). He also fought at the battle of Guinegate (1479), where he was wounded.

(https://i.imgur.com/Qa4dF5F.png)

When I first found out about these events, the dispute was described as being between the Prince of Orange and 'his uncles'. Looking at the dates of deaths, I wonder if perhaps the only troublesome uncle was Louis - after his death his younger brother Hugues clearly came to some agreement with the Prince, so perhaps he was the more pragmatic of the two?

The Prince of Orange was the main figurehead of the Comtois rebellion in 1477, and his betrayal was taken as a great insult by Louis XI, who ordered him to be captured and executed, and had an effigy of him publicly hanged. Interestingly though I haven't found any accounts of actual fighting he did, and in the following years he is noticeably absent from the sources whilst the war continued. Hugues de Châlon on the other hand led several thousand Swiss mercenaries against Georges de La Trémoille at the bridge of Émagny in 1477 - after a hard-fought battle he was captured and his army forced to retreat. He was at some point ransomed, but in 1479 was persuaded to serve Louis XI through the arrangement of a long-desired marriage to Louise of Savoy (who was the king's niece) - he subsequently played no further part in the wars, and died in 1490.

At some point following (or perhaps during) the failed war in the Franche-Comté, the Prince of Orange moved to the Low Countries, where he served Maximilian as both a military leader and diplomat, campaigning against rebels in Luxembourg and Liège, being made stadtholder and captain-general of Namur for a while, and going on a diplomatic trip to England. Following the Treaty of Arras (1482) he made peace with Louis XI and regained his Burgundian possessions (both the duchy and the county were by then held by the French), and after the latter's death the following year he appears to have maintained good relations with both sides. He settled in Brittany, where he exercised great influence (his mother being a sister of Duke Francis II). He sided with the Orleanist party during the so-called 'Mad War', and was captured at the Battle of Saint-Aubin-du-Cormier (1488). Following his release both Maximilian and the French regency government attempted to use his influence on the issue of Anne of Brittany's marriage - ultimately she was married to Charles VIII of France, who rewarded the Prince of Orange for his part in this. Following Maximilian's reconquest of the Franche-Comté in 1492 he was made stadtholder of the county, yet at the same time had a seat on the French royal council.

(https://i.imgur.com/uO0a3Ts.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/B0p9ekv.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Prince of Orange and his uncle (April 3rd)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on April 04, 2022, 02:02:45 AM
Nice work! And great writeup!

It's interesting to see how the Chalons-Arlay family spent basically the entire 15th century making (sometimes bizarre) power plays! 
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - The Prince of Orange and his uncle (April 3rd)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 05, 2022, 01:27:19 PM
Yes, our Prince d'Orange at least seems to have been adept at always trying to be on the winning side, whoever that appears to be at the time!

It's interesting, we obviously have no real idea of the actual character and personality of these historical figures, but you can't help but have certain images in your head when you read about them. I'm picturing him being a proud, big-talking character full of great promises, who will ultimately let you down and run for cover when things aren't going the way he wanted!!!
And I can't help but imagine him as a character who'd fit well in to A Song Of Ice And Fire....
Would be fun to think about how you'd want him to be portrayed in a film...
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 06, 2022, 09:47:28 PM
I've rebased all my cavalry....

I know they've been posted here before, but I'd like to present them to you again, rebased, re-organised, expanded, smartened up, and generally looking better than before! I even went back and put in all the little studs on the horse harness that I'd omitted the first time round....!

First off is the Burgundian heavy cavalry, two units of 20 each.

I'll just put the whole blog post here - the full blog is at https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

BURGUNDIAN HEAVY CAVALARY

Here's my two Burgundian heavy cavalry units, recently rebased. The French cavalry are getting the same treatment right now. As usual they are mostly Perry miniatures, not just plastics but quite a few metal sculpts as well, with a scattering of Steel Fist parts too. There are lots of conversions which I won't go into detail about in this post.

(https://i.imgur.com/kJ8EuyS.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/G31BCsT.jpg)

These are of course supposed to represent Burgundians after the death of Charles the Bold, to be useable for any conflict between 1477 and 1493. We could call them 'Habsburg-Burgundian' if we want. After the disaster of the battle of Nancy, the ordonnance companies who were present would have been destroyed or dispersed, though several thousand survivors made it back, and of course others would not have been there in the first place. Nevertheless the companies ceased to function as a military force capable of combatting the French in 1477. Many of their leaders also went over to the French side, and no doubt took large numbers of men with them. Later in the year Mary and Maximilian managed to raise new ordonnance companies, and by the end of the year they had 800 'lances'. These companies seemingly remained an important part of Maximilian's army into the 16th century.

(https://i.imgur.com/sCCaQhX.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/E8RKPOQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/aVFFZvB.jpg)

When it comes to the question of flags and livery.... we really don't know. I didn't want them to have a uniform livery, certainly not the familiar blue and white of Charles the Bold's army. A few of the models I gave a Burgundian saltire on their jackets, but not in any uniform colour scheme. As well as the actual ordonnance companies, they could represent the personal retinues of certain nobles or any sort of cavalry unit hastily thrown-together for combating the French invasion, so the less cohesive look suits this just fine.

(https://i.imgur.com/FtzBlqR.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/kad12RI.jpg)

I purposefully sought out Burgundian flags that didn't feature Charles the Bold's motto. One is from Pete's Flags, one from the krigsspil website, and one from a chap calling himself Alea Jacta Est Miniautes - he's been posting them free to use on facebook, and he also has a blog where you can find them all. The heraldic banner I made myself - it bears the arms of Jacques de Luxembourg, Lord of Fiennes, who was one of the many nobles who remained loyal to the house of Burgundy after the death of the duke. He was made a Knight of the Golden Fleece in 1478 and the following year was appointed marshal of Maximilian's army in the Low Countries.

(https://i.imgur.com/G7AiK7A.jpg)

And here's a little trick.... the banner is removable, so whilst its Jacques de Luxembourg for this particular photo-shoot, command of the unit can be re-assigned to any other noble I've made banners for! In the picture below are the banners of the Count of Nassau, the Prince of Orange and Louis de Vienne.

(https://i.imgur.com/5zRaD6z.png)

There is lots more cavalry to come in the next few weeks, old units have been rebased and expanded and many new figures have been painted. I have painted lots of horses over the past 6 months, I've even come to enjoy it, and I can happily say I took on and conquered the dreaded rebasing task! The end result I think has been very much worth it.

(https://i.imgur.com/35nLFoD.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Ray Rivers on May 07, 2022, 12:26:14 PM
They look fantastic!

What a collection!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Elk101 on May 07, 2022, 12:28:59 PM
Absolutely, that really is an amazing collection.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on May 07, 2022, 12:35:13 PM
Very impressive  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: magyar on May 07, 2022, 02:36:53 PM
Great looking units and a most impressive force - obviously, it is ready to steamroll any enemy  ;) !
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 07, 2022, 04:04:13 PM
They look great! The rebasing has turned out really nicely
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Atheling on May 07, 2022, 04:31:33 PM
Fabulous looking units Charlie  :-*

Great that you went back and painted in the studs- that one would really have nagged at me.

Have you a set of rules you've settled on yet?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on May 07, 2022, 07:47:26 PM
Absolutely magnificent! Inspiring!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: bigredbat on May 07, 2022, 08:39:49 PM
Yes they look terrific- very well done!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on May 07, 2022, 11:51:30 PM
Brilliant work!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 09, 2022, 05:19:31 PM
Thanks all.

Great looking units and a most impressive force - obviously, it is ready to steamroll any enemy  ;) !

Well they might be in trouble - I've just finished rebasing their French opponents, who outnumber them by 50%!

Have you a set of rules you've settled on yet?

It's my own homebrew rules.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian heavy cavalry, rebased (May 6th)
Post by: Atheling on May 09, 2022, 07:19:34 PM

It's my own homebrew rules.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 14, 2022, 11:26:12 AM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

BURGUNDIAN LIGHT CAVALRY

Next up from the big cavalry rebasing project..... Two units of Burgundian 'light' cavalry. Some of these have been rebased, whereas many of them are new additions.

(https://i.imgur.com/TjttB1i.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/caEIcEh.jpg)

In this period there weren't really dedicated 'light cavalry' companies in Burgundy or France as far as I can tell. The 'lance' organisation featured coustilliers and mounted archers alongside men-at-arms, but it seems that the Burgundian ordonnance companies raised by Maximilian from 1477 onwards just had two archers for every man-at-arms - no coustilliers. There of course is the theory that the term 'archer' doesn't always have to refer to a soldier armed with a bow, and perhaps it's an umbrella term referring to any professional soldier on a lower pay grade than the men-at-arms. Or perhaps some 'archers' could perform multiple roles, including that of light lance-armed cavalry?

The first of these two units is supposed to represent either members of the Burgundian ordonnance companies, or instead just a more informal grouping of horsemen thrown together for a certain task. Half of the figures are actually in full armour so could be classed as men-at-arms. Again I've gone for no uniform livery as with my heavy cavalry, though a few of them do sport Burgundian crosses.


(https://i.imgur.com/OPaadeY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3piqCSC.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/D9Lkkng.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Sr5yXKi.jpg)

For the second unit I tried to make them look a bit more Germanic. It seems that among the many Germans that came to seek employment in the Low Countries and Burgundy from 1477 onwards were companies of horsemen who were paid less than men-at-arms, so perhaps these were some form of true 'light' cavalry. You can read about them on this French article here - google will do a perfectly readable translation for you.

(https://i.imgur.com/WQMVLRa.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/r2aFcVl.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/EHL6cY4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3cmEguq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/YMC0TBg.jpg)

Both units are a mix of Perry plastics and metals, with various conversions, plus a few Steel Fist parts and two converted Wargames Foundry sculpts. One of the flags is from Pete's Flags, the other is from the krigsspil website.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on May 14, 2022, 03:44:21 PM
Beautifully done! Absolutely fantastic!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: Norm on May 14, 2022, 08:29:14 PM
Yes, lovely.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: Ray Rivers on May 14, 2022, 10:32:05 PM
You need more cavalry, Charlie!  :D

 :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 15, 2022, 01:51:24 PM
You need more cavalry, Charlie!  :D

 :-*

Don't worry, there's more coming! The French cavalry outnumbers the Burgundians....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - new Burgundian 'light' cavalry (May 14th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 18, 2022, 01:50:47 PM
Lovely work, really dynamic looking unit!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - rebasing cavalry, horror and success (May 20th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 20, 2022, 06:06:54 PM
I've done a detailed post on the blog about re-basing the cavalry, and finding new layouts for the heavy and light units, if anyone is interested!

https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

(https://i.imgur.com/IVofDPz.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - handgunners (24th May)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 24, 2022, 07:28:15 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Handgunners

Here's another small unit of skirmishers to join my previous crossbowmen and handgunners - this time all handgunners, as this seems more suitable to represent German mercenaries. Have a read of this French article (https://www.cairn.info/revue-du-nord-2002-2-page-389.htm#) to learn about the German handgunners (les couleuvriniers Allemands) who were hired in quite large numbers by towns on the Franco-Burgundian border in 1477.

These can also easily be used as Swiss, Flemish, Brabantine and other nationalities as required.

These figures are mostly metals - only one is from the familiar Perry plastic sets. Three are converted Perry metals, two are converted from Crusader Miniatures, and the remaining four are from the relatively new Athena Miniatures WOTR range. Two of these have also had headswaps, just because. The one looking down as he loads his gun is my favourite, it's a great pose.


(https://i.imgur.com/iQ8OKft.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/xiAvLWq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DwPhLpc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7xJrujz.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - handgunners (May 24th)
Post by: painterman on May 24, 2022, 09:54:04 PM
Hi
Another excellent looking unit Charlie!
picking up on our chat in Sunday, i do like the handgunner loading some powder from the flask...lovely pose.
Cheers again, Simon
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - handgunners (May 24th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 25, 2022, 09:09:21 AM
Excellent work! Thanks for showing the different ranges in the unit too, it's great to see how compatible they are together!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - handgunners (May 24th)
Post by: Atheling on May 25, 2022, 02:47:30 PM
Exceptional work Charlie.  :-* :-* :-*

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - handgunners (May 24th)
Post by: GulKelan on May 26, 2022, 08:58:24 AM
awesome stuff Charlie, as always!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 31, 2022, 06:17:02 PM
http://fullharness.blogspot.com

The House of Vaudrey

Here are two Burgundian nobles from the Franche-Comté region - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey. They were prominent leaders of the Comtois rebellion that fought the French from 1477 to 1479 under the figurehead of the Prince of Orange, and seem to have been effective leaders with many dramatic victories to their names. Their exact familial connection has been tricky to pin down, but I am fairly confident they were uncle and nephew.

(https://i.imgur.com/qZhcgzB.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lzOnk3l.jpg)

The War in the Franche-Comté

To briefly summarise the situation in the Franche-Comté after the death of Charles the Bold, a French army under Georges de la Trémoille had occupied the region, but it wasn't long before an uprising had begun. The city of Dole evicted its French garrison, and many others followed its example. La Trémoille besieged the town of Vesoul, where Guillaume de Vaudrey commanded. On the night of 17 March Vaudrey led a night-time sortie, supposedly having trumpets sounded from multiple directions which panicked the French camp, making them think they were being attacked by a much larger force. As they retreated Vaudrey attacked and routed them. Claude de Vaudrey meanwhile had defended Auxonne against the French.

By the end of March the French had been mostly driven out of most of the county by the Vaudreys and the Prince of Orange, who now had under their command several thousand Swiss mercenaries. La Trémoille re-gathered his strength and counter-attacked - either one or both Vaudreys were at the Battle of Émagny, which was a costly French victory. Whilst La Trémoille besieged Dole they rode the countryside at will, harassing the French wherever they found them. They then re-captured the town of Gray in remarkable style - again moving at night, they scaled the walls and were able to open the gates to allow their forces in. The French defenders were driven back to the castle as parts of the town were set alight, and Claude de Vaudrey led the assault over the ramparts. The French garrison were mostly all killed, their captain Jean de Salazar only just able to escape, wounded and badly burned.

When La Trémoille was again defeated outside the walls of Dole, the Vaudreys attacked his rearguard as he retreated. The French were driven out of the Franche-Comté and into the duchy of Burgundy. Claude de Vaudrey and the Prince of Orange led an incursion into the duchy which reached the walls of Dijon, before they were turned back by a force led by the recently-wounded Jean de Salazar.

After the successes of 1477 things turned against the Comtois rebels, as they lost the support of the Swiss and the French moved again under the new leadership of Charles d'Amboise. Guillaume de Vaudrey may have been among the Burgundian leaders who were captured leading an expedition in the French-held duchy - if he was he was clearly released at some point. In 1479 d'Amboise led a second invasion of the Franche-Comté, focusing on the capital of Dole. Claude de Vaudrey defended the castle of Rochefort which was forced to surrender, and he was presumably captured. After the fall and sack of Dole most of the region submitted to the French, though a small group of the Comtois nobility continued their fight, retreating to the mountains - among these was Guillaume de Vaudrey. He was eventually captured in the winter of 1479/80 and was among the few nobles to be summarily executed as a lesson to other would-be rebels.

Claude de Vaudrey survived and was presumably released at some point - in 1481 he was serving Maximilian, campaigning against rebels in Holland. He lived for several more decades, becoming well-known as a tournament fighter, and died in 1518.

The extended House of Vaudrey

Trying to work out some sort of family tree for the Vaudreys has been very difficult, with contradictions cropping up at every turn. As I said I am confident that Guillaume and Claude were uncle and nephew, but various sources have also referred to them as brothers and even father and son. The source that seems to have the answer is Le Grand Dictionnaire Historique by Louis Moreri. Published in the 18th century, this has an extensive list of Vaudrey family members. However it lists Guillaume as the youngest of three sons with apparently no lordship of his own and no children, whereas all other references to him I can find refer to him as the Lord of Courlaou. If we assume that the Grand Dictionnaire Historique has a mistake... then he could be the elder of two brothers, Lord of Courlaou, and father of Lancelot de Vaudrey. I've put together the following family tree to show all the members of the Vaudrey family around during the late 15th century and how they are connected. This is all using the information from the Grand Dictionnaire Historique, the one change being moving Guillaume's position.

[It seems the French author Jean-Marie Thiebaud, who has apparently published many books on the nobility of the region, also lists Guillaume as lord of Courlaou and father of Lancelot, as you can see on his website here (https://www.jeanmariethiebaud.com/web/index.php?op=readart&id=654). I'd love to have a look at some of his books, but haven't managed to find any of them at an affordable price, and not speaking French translating them will be trickier when on the page rather than the laptop. There are also some recently updated French wikipedia pages on both Guillaume and Claude which seem to mostly agree with my interpretations, with the exception of a few minor details.]

(https://i.imgur.com/Xzypm7z.png)

As we can see there were multiple branches of the family, and I've found several references to other Vaudreys who we can locate on the family tree.


Heraldry

The Vaudrey arms were easy enough to find, but as for all the myriad of different family members, there is no hope of finding their personal heraldry. Unfortunately none of them were made Knights of the Golden Fleece, which would have made things easier! I was able however to find what I believe to be the coat of arms of Claude de Vaudrey - the Vaudrey arms differenced with a label. For Guillaume I've decided to use the undifferenced arms - if he was indeed Lord of Courlaou then he was of the senior line, and presumably the head of the family.

(https://i.imgur.com/n1RZxVh.png)

As Guillaume's heraldry is quite simple, I took the opportunity to use a figure with a heraldic surcoat for him and have a go at painting it freehand. No way was I going to attempt this with any of the much more complex heraldry I've come across, not both on the front and the back but in miniature on both sleeves..... all respect to those who manage to do this effectively! I'm very pleased with the results, but don't expects to see much more freehand heraldry from me any time soon.

The miniatures themselves are a mix of Perry and Steel Fist parts.

(https://i.imgur.com/lOUcfIy.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/8uM2Ahb.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Griefbringer on May 31, 2022, 08:46:48 PM
That's some simple but impressive looking heraldry on the figures. I particularly like the dark, muted red (is that actually murray?).

Also lovely conversion work on the figures. After a bit of searching, I think I can recognise where all of the bodies come, but it took me a while to spot that all of the metal figures seem to have head swaps on them, while the plastic rider seems to have an interesting feather somehow stuck to the top of helmet (and his horse has bits from the Perry HYW cavalry set).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Ray Rivers on May 31, 2022, 11:35:38 PM
Those are wonderfulopulace!  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: commissarmoody on June 01, 2022, 05:23:41 AM
Very well done, and lots of useful information.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: glenning on June 01, 2022, 11:30:06 AM
Looking great as usual!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Captain Blood on June 01, 2022, 12:13:56 PM
Very nice Charlie  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Atheling on June 01, 2022, 04:53:41 PM
Fab work Charlie  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 01, 2022, 06:16:34 PM
And thanks also for the information about the military conflict taking place in Franche-Comte, I did not really know any details about that. Burgundians supported by Swiss mercenaries versus French ordonnance invaders - sounds like this could make for some interesting games. Any idea how many participants there were in the field battles that took place - a few thousand per side?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 01, 2022, 08:14:48 PM
Thanks all.

That's some simple but impressive looking heraldry on the figures. I particularly like the dark, muted red (is that actually murray?).

Also lovely conversion work on the figures. After a bit of searching, I think I can recognise where all of the bodies come, but it took me a while to spot that all of the metal figures seem to have head swaps on them, while the plastic rider seems to have an interesting feather somehow stuck to the top of helmet (and his horse has bits from the Perry HYW cavalry set).

It's just supposed to be red, and that's how it turned out! I did do the flags first so I could try to match the figure's tabard to it, rather than the other way round, and was surprised at the amount of white I had to add for the highlights, which were much lighter than I usually do - full on pink actually.

You are right about the conversions. I ALWAYS do headswaps on the metal figures pretty much, it's so easy and completely transforms the figure.

And thanks also for the information about the military conflict taking place in Franche-Comte, I did not really know any details about that. Burgundians supported by Swiss mercenaries versus French ordonnance invaders - sounds like this could make for some interesting games. Any idea how many participants there were in the field battles that took place - a few thousand per side?

Yes it is quite jarring at first to read about the Swiss fighting for the Burgundians - and really soon after the battle of Nancy in January 1477. Apparently they were actually the very same soldiers from that campaign! And in '78 and '79 they switches sides and fought for the French.
To be honest the big mystery is who the 'Burgundians' were in terms of military organisation..... I mean we know the names of their leaders, and the fact that they hired German and Swiss mercenaries.... but what proportion of their forces in this conflict would be made up of 'true' Burgundian soldiers?
Would these be soldiers from Charles the Bold's army organised in a similar way, or a much more informal gathering of whatever local troops were available - a mix of ex-Ordonnance troops/survivors, the personal retinues of the nobles, hastily raised militias and random mercenaries? I've gone for the latter option.
It's also not entirely clear if the Germans/Swiss were the main strength of their forces or just a significant part of it working alongside the 'locals'.

As for numbers.... I take all references to numbers in medieval battles with a HUGE pinch of salt, so much so that I find it kind of irrelevant. I recently read some of the recent series on the Italian Wars published by Helion, and so much time is given over to the numbers apparently involved, with so many wildly different sources, it all seems a bit pointless.

There weren't many field battles in the War of Burgundian Succession (covering both t Burgundy/Franche Comtois and the Low Countries) -the only well known was in Guinegate in 1479. This certainly seemed to feature numbers in the tens of thousands - Wikipedia right now has between 16,000 and 23,000 per side.

There are three other events we could interpret as large battles I've come across.
- Emagny, 1477 - The French forced a river crossing against the Burgundians with their German/Swiss mercenaries, in the Franche-Comtois. This was probably in the thousands, off the top of my head I think the numbers of the Swiss employed were 3-4000. Glancing at the French wikipedia page it lists 10,000-12,000 for the French, but if that was the actually size of the French army on campaign the number actively involved crossing the bridge must be significantly smaller!
- Bethune, 1487 - The French defeated a Burgundian army in the Low Countries and captured some important nobles. There seems to be absolutely NO concrete information about what happened and the numbers involved, but I think I've read a few mentions of it that suggest it was a French ambush of some sort.
- Dournon, 1493 - A French army was soundly defeated by a Burgundian/German force during the reconquest of the Franche-Comte. The French wikipedia page puts the numbers at 7,100 French and 3,000 Burgundians/Germans.

So yeah all numbers taken with huge pinches of salt, but I think its safe to say these battles featured thousands and possibly up to and beyond ten thousand troops a side in some cases. Not massive, but big enough to call real battles.

The numbers of troops actually on campaign at certain times (in the Low Countries especially) were certainly in the tens of thousands. At certain points between '77 and '79 both Louis XI of France and Maximilian themselves were in the field at the heads of their armies. It's just they only actually came to face each other once, at Guinegate (Louis XI wasn't there though by that point).
One thing that I've learned from this is that raising a BIG army for a campaign cost a LOT of money and was absolutely CRIPPLING financially for Maximilian. If you're going to raise a force of 10,000+ troops you sure better do something worthwhile with it, or it is a complete waste of money you may never recover from.

Most of the fighting you find accounts of of course are sieges - lots of interesting accounts of castles and towns being bombarded, assaulted, captured by stealth, and besieging forces being attacked and routed. But there's always constant references to raids and skirmishes between both sides,  various accounts of quite large forces going on raids / incursions into enemy territory and being turned back / repulsed. So a perfect setting for small-scale mobile warfare.
But then again, how many troops fight in these small 'skirmishes'? Is it dozens, hundred, or thousands?

A few more interesting encounters come to mind - not pitched battles, but probably quite large affairs which would make great gaming scenarios.

- During the siege of Arras in 1477 a force of Burgundians lead by Guillaume de Vergy was gathered together by nearby towns and marched to reinforce Arras. However they left during daylight and the French knew they were coming - they set up an ambush, soundly defeated them and captured their leaders.

- A large army of Flemish (20,000) led by the Duke of Guelders marched to attack the French-held town of Tournai in 1477 - an apparently small force of French sallied out to fight them, the Duke was killed in a skirmish and the Flemish army fell apart and was routed.

- Battle of Brouwershaven in 1490 - rebels from the anti-Burgundian 'hook' faction were raiding along the coast of Zeeland when they were attacked by a fleet led by John of Egmont. Several ships ran aground and their occupants continued the fight on the shore, where they were defeated and killed. Their leader, Franz van Brederode, was captured but died of his wounds.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Wiegraf on June 01, 2022, 09:04:37 PM
Excellent topic, reading, and painting. I'm really enjoying all the mounted figures and recent gunmen. cannot wait to eventually get to this era and work on my Savoyard forces. :) Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 02, 2022, 02:14:34 PM
Excellent topic, reading, and painting. I'm really enjoying all the mounted figures and recent gunmen. cannot wait to eventually get to this era and work on my Savoyard forces. :) Thank you for sharing.

Glad it's of interest to you! I'd be interested to see a Savoyard force for this era....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 02, 2022, 05:47:54 PM
To be honest the big mystery is who the 'Burgundians' were in terms of military organisation..... I mean we know the names of their leaders, and the fact that they hired German and Swiss mercenaries.... but what proportion of their forces in this conflict would be made up of 'true' Burgundian soldiers?
Would these be soldiers from Charles the Bold's army organised in a similar way, or a much more informal gathering of whatever local troops were available - a mix of ex-Ordonnance troops/survivors, the personal retinues of the nobles, hastily raised militias and random mercenaries? I've gone for the latter option.
It's also not entirely clear if the Germans/Swiss were the main strength of their forces or just a significant part of it working alongside the 'locals'.

I think yours is a sensible approach. Even in their prime, the ordonnance companies did not completely replace other types of military organisation in the Burgundian lands, but provided a field army that could be quickly mobilised for campaigns whenever needed - complemented by mercenaries that could be formed into ordonnance companies of their own. For local defense, probably a major role was still played by the traditional militias, levies and retinues, especially when opposing raids and smaller incursions.

However, it is also my understanding that in Franche-Comte a remnant of the Burgundian ordonnance company organisation was retained for a long time - actually for long enough to fight against the Dutch in the early part of the Eighty Years War, almost a century later! However, there had been reorganisations over the years and by that time the companies were cavalry organisations, and much smaller than the original 900 man companies of Charles' era.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 03, 2022, 04:37:48 PM
Speaking of ordonnance companies in the post-Charles era, on another forum I encountered an old link to a French article "L’armée, le Prince et ses sujets: le financement de la guerre aux Pays-Bas bourguignons après la mort de Charles Le Téméraire, 1477-1482" written by Amable Sablon du Corail:

http://www.institut-strategie.fr/RIHM_83_20.htm

My french being rather limited, I did not try going through it yet - I guess I will need to try Google translator (which might have issues with medieval French terms?).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 03, 2022, 05:16:35 PM
Speaking of ordonnance companies in the post-Charles era, on another forum I encountered an old link to a French article "L’armée, le Prince et ses sujets: le financement de la guerre aux Pays-Bas bourguignons après la mort de Charles Le Téméraire, 1477-1482" written by Amable Sablon du Corail:

http://www.institut-strategie.fr/RIHM_83_20.htm

My french being rather limited, I did not try going through it yet - I guess I will need to try Google translator (which might have issues with medieval French terms?).

Yep that was one of my sources!

Google does do a very readable translation of it. When the odd word or phrase doesn't translate well you can normally work out was it being talked about pretty easy. There's another article by him which was a good source, about foreign soldiers in the Burgundian army after 1477. And I have actually recently located another longer academic article by him, about 28 pages, on the same subject which I haven't yet translated. It might be repeating al the same information, but I'm hoping there will be some new nuggets of info!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 05, 2022, 06:28:55 PM
Time to give Google translate a try one evening then, I guess.

Speaking of foreign soldiers in Burgundian service, there supposedly were a bunch of Swiss in Charles the Bold's service until he ended up in a conflict with the Confederation.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: bluewillow on June 07, 2022, 05:38:39 AM
Great work on de Vaudreys'

The project is well researched and delivered bravo

Cheers
Matt
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (May 31st)
Post by: magyar on June 08, 2022, 04:43:43 PM
Brilliant research, flawless execution, and exciting read!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 09, 2022, 05:30:58 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

French heavy cavalry

You've seen the Burgundian cavalry, now here are their French opponents.

There's three units of twenty mounted men-at-arms each. Like the Burgundians, they are primarily a mix of Perry plastics and metals, with a few Steel Fist riders and horses in there too. I wanted them to look potentially better equipped and organised than the Burgundians, as they are more likely to be representing the standing forces of the compagnies d'ordonnance at full strength. (the Burgundians in contrast might be representing the remnants of Charles the Bold's defeated army or new units hastily raised from scant resources). They are are almost all in full harness, with a only a few lightly-armed coustilliers in the back ranks. I also gave them uniform livery jackets, like all my French units.

(https://i.imgur.com/mNEqrax.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ploq7Vm.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/gzhm1vt.jpg)

Two of the three units have heraldic banners to represent prominent nobles leading them - these are both removable for maximum flexibility, so I'm not tied down to the same two nobles. For this photoshoot however, they are led by Philippe de Crèvecœur and Antoine de Chabannes.

Philippe de Crèvecœur, Lord of Esquerdes had previously served Charles the Bold  - he was governor of Artois and Picardy and had been made a Knight of the Golden Fleece in 1468. When the French invaded in 1477 he was one of the most prominent Burgundians to switch sides, handing over the citadel of Arras (from which the city itself was besieged and ultimately captured). He led the French at the Battle of Guinegate in 1479, was appointed governor and lieutenant-general of Picardy in 1482, and under Charles VIII was made Marshal of France. He was in charge of the French military efforts in the Low Countries for all of the 1480s, and died in 1494.

(https://i.imgur.com/qBXmJi2.jpg)

Antoine de Chabannes was by 1477 an elderly veteran of the French military, having fought in the Hundred Years War alongside Joan of Arc. Originally a younger son with no lordship of his own, he became Count of Dammartin through marriage in 1439. His long career had actually seen him at one point an enemy of Louis XI, but by 1467 they had reconciled and he was appointed Grand Master of France. He was also made one of the first knights of the Order of St Michael. In 1477 he was involved in the French occupation of the Low Countries, and he died in 1488 aged eighty.

(https://i.imgur.com/Srvj0Pn.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lDnqMTG.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/LcQ8KFt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/5McsF21.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/hUAWRkU.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/0daA9P4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7MR0MVD.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 09, 2022, 07:46:31 PM
That's quite an impressive cavalry force - any chance of a group shot of all three units side by side?

Did not spot much horse armour on them - two sets of full barding (for unit leaders) and around fifteen front rank horses with crinets on their head (some of which I presume are from the Perry HYW cavalry sprue).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on June 09, 2022, 07:57:11 PM
Great stuff  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on June 09, 2022, 09:01:23 PM
Great looking figures! I love how the metal looks! The horses are Fantastic!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 10, 2022, 08:35:29 AM
That's quite an impressive cavalry force - any chance of a group shot of all three units side by side?

Did not spot much horse armour on them - two sets of full barding (for unit leaders) and around fifteen front rank horses with crinets on their head (some of which I presume are from the Perry HYW cavalry sprue).

I might attempt a group shot sometime, but for some reason I find it very difficult to photograph multiple units or whole armies...

You're right there is not much barding. I believe in the 15th century horse armour wasn't as common as some people assume. I happily would have used a bit more, but I think just using the same two sets of barding from the WOTR cavalry set looks a bit odd - if there were lots of different alternatives I would certainly have scattered a few more around in the front ranks! So I've reserved the full barding just for a few commanders - two of the unit leaders here, and a couple of my command stands.

There are a few horse armour bits in the Agincourt cavalry set, but I only ever bought the one frame of them, and have used some of the pieces already. There is one armoured horse head I've yet to use, and the mail horse armour, but I'm not sure about that one, I don't know if it's appropriate for this period?

None of the horses in these units use Agincourt parts - all the armoured heads are from the WOTR cavalry set, plus one of the semi-armoured horses is a metal from one of the command packs (he's a bit smaller and skinnier than the plastic horses, but I raised his base up a couple of mm and he now is the same height as the others).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 10, 2022, 10:02:55 PM
You could perhaps get a bit more variety from the Perry plastic bardings by putting together a couple of horses that have just partial barding. The gothic (germanic) barding comes with the front and rear parts separate, so it would be easy to just glue on the front parts for a half-barding. This would perhaps look best on a figure located at the edge of the formation - for a one in the middle it would not be so obvious that it is just a partial set.

As for the HYW mail armour, that might look a bit dated by 1480. However, perhaps you could stick it to some unit of noble levies that have slightly less state-of-the-art equipment than the more professional men of the ordonnance forces.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Ray Rivers on June 12, 2022, 01:31:45 AM
You're doing a great job, Charlie!  :-*

You're armies will look amazing on the table top!  ;D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Bloggard on June 12, 2022, 08:50:51 AM
great array of figures.

love the photography: close-up / cropping.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 12, 2022, 04:50:58 PM
Really impressive force of cavalry!

Also, it's interesting to see just how many defectors there were from the Burgundians to the French during the war of succession (and also interesting to see who didn't defect!)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy cavalry! (June 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 12, 2022, 06:43:28 PM
love the photography: close-up / cropping.

Thanks, I got some good advice on this forum a few years ago about photography! A good but inexpensive camera, and careful cropping of photos.
I actually find getting a good all-in-one shot of large units like this always unsatisfactory, the best photos are always the close-ups from different angles.

Also, it's interesting to see just how many defectors there were from the Burgundians to the French during the war of succession (and also interesting to see who didn't defect!)

Yes, there were LOTS of them. And after the Treaty of Arras in 1482, even loads of those who had been fighting up til that point entered French service.

I guess a lot has to do with where their properties were. There's lots of accounts of nobles having their estates seized by the French straight away - those in the occupied territories like Picardy and the Duchy of Burgundy. So a lot of those fighting for Maximilian over the next few years effectively had no property. Then after the treaty of '82 they were offered their French-held estates back, and perhaps ended up living within what was now the French border.

I think the ones that stuck with Maximilian from the start were those whose territory was never threatened.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 18, 2022, 08:36:15 PM
Two of these commanders I posted a while back, last summer I think, but one of them is new. I'll put the whole blog post here for the full info on them!

https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Three Burgundian commanders

Here are three commander bases for the Burgundian side. All three of them have removable flags so can be used to represent anyone I have made flags for (only one of them actually has a Burgundian cross, so the other two could also be used as French or anything else). For this photoshoot I am using them to represent the various nobles who fought the French in the Franche-Comté and the duchy of Burgundy. This theatre of the war saw the nobility loyal to Duchess Mary fight back against the French occupation, led by the Prince of Orange (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/04/the-prince-of-orange-and-his-uncle.html) and Guillaume and Claude de Vaudrey (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/05/the-house-of-vaudrey.html), who I have already done posts on. Click here (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/p/the-war-in-burgundy-1477-1480.html) to read my full account of the war in Burgundy, it's quite interesting. In these photos we have three of the Comtois rebels - Claude de Toulongeon, Simon de Quingey and Marc de Ray.

All the mounted models are Perry metals, all of one of which have had the all-important headswaps. The standard bearer on foot is from Steel Fist.

(https://i.imgur.com/KeY2wHn.jpg)

Claude de Toulongeon, Lord of La Bastie (?-1504) was one of the nobles who refused to surrender after the Franche-Comté was conquered in 1479, and continued to fight into the winter. He eventually fled to the Low Countries, and Louis XI had his Burgundian possessions confiscated. He was made a Knight of the Golden Fleece in 1481. Following the Treaty of Arras in 1482 he was supposed to have his territories returned to him but he struggled for the rest of his life to reclaim them, leading to a feud with his brother-in-law Guillaume de Vergy. Confusingly there was another Claude de Toulongeon around at the same time, his nephew, the Lord of Traves.

(https://i.imgur.com/uTWPFl7.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/WLwsYnv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/0lEZJsO.jpg)

Simon de Quingey (1448-1523) as a young man had served Charles the Bold and fought in all his famous battles, actually having saved his life at Montlhéry in 1465. After the death of the duke in 1477 he remained loyal to Duchess Mary and defended Dole from the French. In 1478 he was captured leading troops into the French-held duchy of Burgundy, and was subsequently imprisoned in an iron cage. Eventually he was freed and afterwards served Louis XI.

(https://i.imgur.com/PekRbNM.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lc2U4Bx.jpg)

Marc de Ray
(?-1510) defended the castle of Rollans from the French and didn't surrender until the winter of 1479/80. That's all I've got on him, sorry!

(https://i.imgur.com/62n33JT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/KUyaUyt.jpg)

And here's some biographical detail for a few others who fought in the conflict: I've located heraldry for some, but not all.

Guillaume de la Baume, Lord of Irlain (1430-1498) had been since 1472 a chamberlain in the household of Margaret of York (third wife of Charles the Bold), and later served both Mary and Maximilian, fighting the French in the duchy of Burgundy. Was made a Knight of the Golden Fleece in 1481. After the Treaty of Arras in 1482 he regained his Burgundian possessions, and by the reign of Charles VIII appears to have been serving the French.

Chrétien de Digoine, Lord of Thianges (?-1479/80) fought into 1479/80 and was one of the few who was actually executed when finally captured.

Jean de Neufchâtel, Lord of Montaigu (1419-1489) had previously been a councillor and chamberlain to both Philip the Good and Charles the Bold, a Knight of the Golden Fleece (1451) and Lieutenant-General of both Burgundies. He was given a place in Maximilian’s household in 1477, and helped defend the Franche-Comté. However he surrendered and swore allegiance to Louis XI in 1479.

Jean de Oiselay (?-1503) was captured in 1479. His wife (or possibly sister-in-law) helped defend the ramparts, halberd in hand, when the castle of Oiselay was taken.

Other names I've found reference to include Louis de Vienne, Leonard de Châlon and Charles de Châlon, plus the lords of Arban and Cottebrune, who I haven't been able to identify.

And here's a pic showing how the removable flags work. I might do some sort of how-to guide in the future if anyone's interested? The other two flags in this pic are for Guillaume de la Baume and Louis de Vienne.

(https://i.imgur.com/tw5iAra.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: Atheling on June 19, 2022, 05:07:20 AM
Beauties Charlies  :-* :-* :-*

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 19, 2022, 07:01:24 AM
Great work! The swappable flags are a nice touch too!

I wonder if Marc de Ray has any connection to the Duchy of Cleves, given how similar his coat of arms is to the dukes' there
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: magyar on June 19, 2022, 03:32:36 PM
Very interesting, and great paint work!
Some how-to on the flags would be definitely appreciated.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on June 19, 2022, 04:21:31 PM
Excellent idea! I love the switchable flags! I'd like to hear how they hold up to repeated switching.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 19, 2022, 06:58:33 PM
I wonder if Marc de Ray has any connection to the Duchy of Cleves, given how similar his coat of arms is to the dukes' there

I don't think so, I wouldn't read too much into the similar heraldry - in researching this I've learned that a LOT of families had identical coats of arms! (at least in the basic non-differenced versions)

Some how-to on the flags would be definitely appreciated.

Is it a guide for making them switchable, or a more complete guide to making flags digitally you are interested in? I'm planning to do a guide for the latter someday IF enough people are genuinely interested.

Excellent idea! I love the switchable flags! I'd like to hear how they hold up to repeated switching.

Surprisingly well actually! I can't imagine them ever getting damaged unless I did something stupid like dropped them in a cup of tea.... And if they did, I can just print out another copy.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: magyar on June 20, 2022, 05:58:07 AM
Charlie_,
I'd vote for the guide to making flags digitally. The "switchability" part appears less challenging. However, some hints may be useful here, too  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 20, 2022, 07:10:05 PM
Charlie_,
I'd vote for the guide to making flags digitally. The "switchability" part appears less challenging. However, some hints may be useful here, too  ;)

It's on my to-do list. It will be quite a detailed guide with lots of screenshots, might take quite a bit of time to put together.

If I do a little post about making the switchable flags, it will be more a case of some useful hints and tips!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: Atheling on June 20, 2022, 07:54:49 PM
It's on my to-do list. It will be quite a detailed guide with lots of screenshots, might take quite a bit of time to put together.

If I do a little post about making the switchable flags, it will be more a case of some useful hints and tips!

That would be brilliant Charlie and appreciated by many I would think. Tech sets my head spinning!  o_o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three Burgundian commanders (June 18th)
Post by: LCpl McDoom on June 20, 2022, 10:34:39 PM
Lovely work, very impressed. I've been doing something similar for flag-switching as well. So I'm another voter for the possible future article on digital flag-making please  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 24, 2022, 07:25:51 PM
French light cavalry

Here are two units of French 'light' cavalry, twenty figures in total. As far as I'm aware in the late 15th century there weren't actually dedicated light cavalry formations in the French or Burgundian military, so these should really be seen as informal groupings of (mostly) lightly armoured horsemen pulled together for specific tasks. As such they will probably just see action in smaller skirmish-style games rather than large battles.

(https://i.imgur.com/fWTRo6T.jpg)

The French 'lance' featured two mounted archers to each man-at-arms. Would these archers always be fielded on foot as missile troops, or could they also double up as lightly-equipped lancers, either to support the mounted men-at-arms or used as scouts, etc? Certainly by some point in the 16th century the term 'archer' actually came to refer to an armoured lancer, so could the start of this be traced back as early as 1477? I don't know, but it makes sense to me that at times some of the 'archers' might be seen fighting on horseback with a light lance. It's not actually clear to me if the French 'lance' also featured a coustillier - I've found conflicting accounts.

(https://i.imgur.com/jP1gy8H.jpg)

One of the units features mostly fully armoured men, so in fact represents men-at-arms in a 'light cavalry' role, or perhaps just suitably based for small skirmish games.

(https://i.imgur.com/CKTjcSn.jpg)

The heraldic banner is swappable, but the one you see here is for Gaston du Lion. He was a nobleman who fought in Burgundy under Georges de la Trémoille, so at least in 1477 and probably for longer after la Trémoille's dismissal. I came across his name from an account of a letter he wrote to la Trémoille, bragging about having routed a force of Swiss outside the walls of Dole. The idea seems to be that his boasting suggested to la Trémoille that he would have an easy victory when he came to besiege the town, but in that he would be disappointed! I haven't been able to find out much more about him other than he was Lord of Besaudun and Seneschal of Toulouse, and his brother was Archbishop of Toulouse. The flag is his family arms, but I can't say if those were the ones he would have used in 1477.

(https://i.imgur.com/2G7SIOi.jpg)

The figures are mostly a mix of Perry plastics and metals, plus a couple of old Wargames Foundry sculpts converted to fit in with the modern Perry range. I've got a few of the metal Perry horses in there as well - they are noticeably smaller than the plastic ones, but I raised their height with an extra 1.5mm Renedra base and now they blend in much better. I wish I'd used more of them for my earlier cavalry units now.... There's also two plastic horses from the Perry AWI range - once the 19th century saddlery is carefully carved off they fit into the 15th century quite fine.

(https://i.imgur.com/Ccg24kw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/rEsvTg2.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Qmd8fL6.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: bigredbat on June 25, 2022, 10:17:11 AM
Absolutely terrific minis!   In the mid c.16th the archers that weren't supporting the gendarmes fought under a guidon flag on the wing.  I wonder if this might have been the case, earlier?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Atheling on June 25, 2022, 11:38:24 AM
Absolutely terrific minis!   

They are  :-*

Have you got a source/reference for
In the mid c.16th the archers that weren't supporting the gendarmes fought under a guidon flag on the wing.

Simon please?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: bigredbat on June 25, 2022, 01:32:12 PM
Hi Darrell,

I can't give a source, but have been discussing how the French Ordonnance companies fought with a learned French friend. He writes "The archers who skirmished with their guidon (the officer commanding the surplus archers) in front of the gendarmes, fall back on the wings of the formation. Once positioned on the flanks, they will fight " à leur manière" (in their own way), or wait to rush on the opponent if he is broken by the shock and seeks to fall back, they then rush in pursuit and prevent his rallying."  I'm encouraging my friend to publish his material.

You see it at Ceresole in 1544 where the Gendarmes are in the centre, and the archers (well at least some of them, as many likely stayed with the gendarmes, forming a second rank) are several hundred yards away on the left wing. I don't think there's any evidence for them skirmishing at Ceresole, they were lancer cavalry by then, just a bit lighter than the gendarmes.

Cheers, Simon

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Atheling on June 25, 2022, 01:51:52 PM
Thanks Simon  8)

I can't give a source, but have been discussing how the French Ordonnance companies fought with a learned French friend. He writes "The archers who skirmished with their guidon (the officer commanding the surplus archers) in front of the gendarmes, fall back on the wings of the formation. Once positioned on the flanks, they will fight " à leur manière" (in their own way), or wait to rush on the opponent if he is broken by the shock and seeks to fall back, they then rush in pursuit and prevent his rallying."  I'm encouraging my friend to publish his material.

I do hope he decides to go for it. There is so little actually written on the subject of how the "Archers" actually fought.

You see it at Ceresole in 1544 where the Gendarmes are in the centre, and the archers (well at least some of them, as many likely stayed with the gendarmes, forming a second rank) are several hundred yards away on the left wing. I don't think there's any evidence for them skirmishing at Ceresole, they were lancer cavalry by then, just a bit lighter than the gendarmes.

Do you know if they were "Archers" or early "Argoulets" at Ceresole? Or were the formations of both mixed? It's a question that I tried to look into a while ago but came up with very little. Mind, it was mainly internet research as I found nothing satisfying in my own book collection.

Maybe this is a conversation we should have on the TtS forum or elsewhere as I think we might be going a little OT?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: bigredbat on June 25, 2022, 02:14:14 PM
Hi Darrell, no mention of the term argoulet at Ceresole, that's more Wars of Religion, but plenty of chevaux léger "archers". Yes feel free to drop me a line offline. 
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Atheling on June 25, 2022, 02:48:59 PM
Hi Darrell, no mention of the term argoulet at Ceresole, that's more Wars of Religion, but plenty of chevaux léger "archers". Yes feel free to drop me a line offline.

Will do Simon. The Test Match is on now so it will be Monday evening  lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Griefbringer on June 25, 2022, 07:39:32 PM
It's not actually clear to me if the French 'lance' also featured a coustillier - I've found conflicting accounts.

Every source I have encountered (not too many) specifies the French ordonnance lance as consisting of a gendarme, a coustilier, archers and pages/vallets, six men in total.

Where things get confusing is with the number of archers and pages/vallets. Sometimes this is specified as three archers and one page (as in the later Burgundian lance), at other times as two archers and two pages/vallets. One interpretation is that both versions existed, either at different times or places.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Tonhel on June 26, 2022, 10:52:58 AM
Lovely! This is such a fantastic plog!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on June 28, 2022, 11:02:34 PM
Every source I have encountered (not too many) specifies the French ordonnance lance as consisting of a gendarme, a coustilier, archers and pages/vallets, six men in total.

Where things get confusing is with the number of archers and pages/vallets. Sometimes this is specified as three archers and one page (as in the later Burgundian lance), at other times as two archers and two pages/vallets. One interpretation is that both versions existed, either at different times or places.

Yes it does get confusing.

Of course you've got to remember that when talking about the ordonnance companies we are covering a period from the 1440s to well into the 1500s, and the exact components of a 'lance' clearly changed over that period.

Off the top of my head, I think in 'my period' it's two mounted archers per man-at-arms, and possibly a coustillier as well. I don't worry too much about the non-combatants.

But of course, how often were the companies and their lances at full strength? All it takes is for there to be some casualties after one combat situation (or something more boring like sickness etc) and it all goes out the window!

So I'm happy with keeping it vague - archers and perhaps other 'light' troops supporting the men-at-arms, which would normally be bow-armed mounted infantry, but could also perhaps be seen in other roles (light cavalry, infantry with polearms, mounted crossbowmen?).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on June 30, 2022, 11:05:55 AM
Great work on the light cavalry!

And ah yes, the struggle of identifying what exactly the sources are referring to by "Archers" in any given instance in the 15th century! Where there isn't even agreement between the French and Burgundian sources!

My understanding (at least earlier in the 15th century in Burgundy) is that "Archer" is just a generic catch-all for any non-noble professional soldier, and tended to have a specific salary-grade associated with the term, so your call on keeping it open would definitely be justified there! Although, I think crossbowmen were classified separately, presumably to cover the relatively more expensive training and equipment costs
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French light cavalry (June 24th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on June 30, 2022, 04:48:37 PM
Masterful brushwork! Fantastic looking figures!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 01, 2022, 07:58:22 PM
Latest post on the blog - what is next for this project?

What's next?

So this blog has been going for over three months now, and I've more or less caught up with posting all my existing and recently completed units for both the French and Burgundians.

So what's next?

In short - lots more!

All the units I've posted so far were either finished over the past few years, or in the case of the cavalry have been rebased, reorganised and expanded in recent months. Most of the commanders and a lot of the cavalry additions (including most of the French light cavalry) are the most recent additions.

However from this point onwards the pace of finished units being posted will slow down, as I actually have to paint them from scratch! But I will be posting more work-in-progress stuff and plans for future units, and more history posts without minis.

Right now I'm half-way through a second unit of francs-archers, and I've got some more commanders and some French mounted crossbowmen waiting in the painting queue.

(https://i.imgur.com/NCgJCPA.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Y6twn0J.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/kBPftLw.jpg)

After that there is a big gap in the French army that will need to be filled - heavy infantry. I've got some interesting thoughts on how I'm going to do this, which I'll go into when the time comes!

Other units planned for the future in a rough order of priority are:

- Another German/Swiss pike unit.
- Burgundian longbowmen.
- Wagon forts, baggage trains, etc.
- More cavalry! Both light and heavy.
- More artillery.... More skirmishers.....More of everything pretty much....

I'm also thinking of doing some sort of step-by-step tutorial for designing flags digitally. If you would be interested in this please let me know - a few people have said they'd find it useful so far, but the more interest there is the more likely it will happen and the more comprehensive it will be.

I might do some other tutorials as well, perhaps painting horses? At least 'my way' of painting horses.

Thank you to everyone who has been following this blog, knowing people enjoy seeing what I'm doing is always encouraging.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Griefbringer on July 05, 2022, 06:02:10 PM
Looking forward to seeing the updates, especially the baggage train and French heavy infantry (any chance that a few Perry Italian heavy infantry figures might be doing a cameo appearance)?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 05, 2022, 06:11:48 PM
Looking forward to seeing the updates, especially the baggage train and French heavy infantry (any chance that a few Perry Italian heavy infantry figures might be doing a cameo appearance)?

Yes, a couple of the Italians will probably make it in, with headswaps of course, and I'm going to try and sculpt some livery jackets over the top.

By 'heavy infantry' I really just mean non-missile troops. Polearms etc. I am undecided whether I will have two different units, one being mostly dismounted men-at-arms and the other more lightly armoured (francs-archers with polearms perhaps), or whether i will mix them all together, and have both units with some men-at-arms in the front ranks. I think I'll just start assembling and painting miniatures and then see how they go together, which is the opposite to how I normally construct units!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Griefbringer on July 06, 2022, 04:51:38 PM
If you are going to make two units worth of French melee infantry, then it might be worth modelling them as two stylistically distinctive units. For example, previously when doing the French bowmen, you had the interesting decision to do the Francs Archers in marching poses, while the Ordonnance Archers were in more active shooting poses. Perhaps you could do matching units of melee infantry, especially if you have suitable figures at hand?

The marching unit of Francs Archers with melee weapons (bills/guisarmes, spears etc.) would thus tie well visually with their bow-armed companions, especially when similarly provided with livery coats, jacks and helmets. For the front rank you could perhaps try a few figures with a bit more armour (say brigandine or mail shirt), as well as a better armoured captain and standard bearer. There are plenty of model options from the Perrys, most obviously the plastic mercenaries and metal WotR liveried billmen marching, but also the metal Swiss halberdiers marching could be used for the rear rankers (especially with head swaps).

Then the other unit, of ordonnance infantry, could be posed with weapons levelled, as if just about to enter a fierce melee. They could be represented with a front rank of fully harnessed men-at-arms, backed by a second line of partially armoured (breastplates, brigandines etc.) coustiliers, all armed with a variety of polearms etc. Actually, considering the variety of figures available for dismounted men-at-arms, you could probably easily put together two such units without needing to resort to fielding duplicate figures.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 06, 2022, 06:44:45 PM
If you are going to make two units worth of French melee infantry, then it might be worth modelling them as two stylistically distinctive units. For example, previously when doing the French bowmen, you had the interesting decision to do the Francs Archers in marching poses, while the Ordonnance Archers were in more active shooting poses. Perhaps you could do matching units of melee infantry, especially if you have suitable figures at hand?

The marching unit of Francs Archers with melee weapons (bills/guisarmes, spears etc.) would thus tie well visually with their bow-armed companions, especially when similarly provided with livery coats, jacks and helmets. For the front rank you could perhaps try a few figures with a bit more armour (say brigandine or mail shirt), as well as a better armoured captain and standard bearer. There are plenty of model options from the Perrys, most obviously the plastic mercenaries and metal WotR liveried billmen marching, but also the metal Swiss halberdiers marching could be used for the rear rankers (especially with head swaps).

Then the other unit, of ordonnance infantry, could be posed with weapons levelled, as if just about to enter a fierce melee. They could be represented with a front rank of fully harnessed men-at-arms, backed by a second line of partially armoured (breastplates, brigandines etc.) coustiliers, all armed with a variety of polearms etc. Actually, considering the variety of figures available for dismounted men-at-arms, you could probably easily put together two such units without needing to resort to fielding duplicate figures.

Yeah I've considered all those ideas. A unit of francs-archers all with shouldered polearms will look nice, but I'm kind of against the idea of melee units in marching poses without lowered weapons, they'll look daft when they get into combat!

I'd quite like both units to look similar actually, rather than different. I dunno I guess I like symmetry.... The two units will often be working side by side. The question is whether one should be 'heavier' than the other or if they should both have the same mix of troop types.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - What's next? (July 1st)
Post by: Griefbringer on July 13, 2022, 04:26:56 PM
I'm kind of against the idea of melee units in marching poses without lowered weapons, they'll look daft when they get into combat!

Well, there is that... though with a unit of Francs Archers quality (even with polearms), I would not count on them staying too long in melee, in case they actually will make it that close to the enemy in the first place.

In case you want both of your melee units to look similar, then perhaps it would be best to make them both as dismounted ordonnance troops (men-at-arms and coustilliers), matching your two units of ordonnance archers. This would enable you to make great use of the multitude of dismounted men-at-arms figures available for the late 15th century (unfortunately dismounted coustiliers are not available in quite the same numbers).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 16, 2022, 10:06:53 AM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/ (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/)

Trying out some obscure miniatures

I recently became aware of the 'Giants In Miniature' range from Wargames Illustrated, which seems to produce a limited run of just 500 casts of each individual figure. Browsing through it I found three that are suitable for the late 15th century, so had to give them a go!

(https://i.imgur.com/iSz04SF.jpg)

The first is 'Lord Callan' which I believe was made for the recent release of the  Never Mind The Billhooks Wars of the Roses rules. It's a dismounted man-at-arms in English-style armour and a livery jacket, wielding a pollaxe in an action pose - a really excellent and dynamic sculpt. Obviously he will make for a great French or Burgundian man-at-arms, and will be used as such some day in the future!

The second is supposed to be the Englishman John Hawkwood, though it notably wears Italian armour of a style about 100 years later than Hawkwood was actually around. I believe this is because the sculpt was based on a 15th century painting of the man, which depicted him wearing the armour of the artist's day rather than what he would have actually been wearing in the 14th century. So perhaps not suitable for John Hawkwood himself, but perfect for a late 15th century man-at-arms in Italian fashion! A very nice sculpt indeed, and just crying out for a headswap. His baton could also be snipped off and drilled out, to be replaced by a flagpole, or alternatively his right hand could be removed and replaced by one from the plastic Perry heavy cavalry set, to have him waving an axe or mace.

The last of the three is supposed to be Joan of Arc, and for some reason is again wearing armour from a later period than the historical figure was actually around. Conveniently for me the armour seems to be suitable for my period, and again she looks set for an easy headswap. Again I could either use her as a standard bearer or give her a new plastic hand. I'm not so keen on her horse, but she can be made to fit well onto a Perry horse. She doesn't seem like such a good sculpt as the other two, but I'm sure I'll make use of her some day in the future.

I don't know who sculpted these figures - I get the feeling that the first two are from the same sculptor and really are excellent, whereas Joan of Arc might be from someone else and isn't quite as good (but still perfectly useable).

I went ahead and converted John Hawkwood into a standard bearer.

(https://i.imgur.com/gWgT1gm.jpg)

Now I had also for a while been looking for pictures of the 'Condottiere' range of late 15th century Italians by the now-defunct Venexia Miniatures. This range seems to suffer from the curse of having barely any pictures in existence, which surely isn't great marketing if you want to sell them. I'd seen an example of a painted cavalryman and thought he looked really good, the barded horse in particular. searching around I was also able to find some 'green' pics of the cavalry, which certainly look excellent in this form at least.

(https://i.imgur.com/ePv7hBf.jpg)

I eventually found they were still available from Lancashire Games (https://www.lancashiregames.com/lg/28mm-italian-wars.html). I decided to take the risk and buy several of the packs even without seeing full pics. If they're not usable then it's money down the drain....

They arrived very promptly. I would rate them as.... variable. Let's take a look at what I got straight out the bag.

First of all, the cavalry. I ordered two packs of three, but got an extra fourth rider in each for some reason. The riders, fully armoured men-at-arms in Italian armour, are all the same sculpt as far as I can see. They come with separate heads and right arms, which is nice. The heads themselves are alright, the armets look very useable, but don't really offer anything you don't get with Perry. I'll probably give them plastic Perry heads to make them mix in with the rest of the collection better. They can also use the plastic right arms from the Perry heavy cavalry set, as the armour is identical. There are two types of arm provided - one for carrying an upright lance and one for a raised hand weapon. The weapons themselves are separate and I won't be using them - I'm generally not a fan of separate metal weapons, they are generally oversized and no one likes bendy lances. Some are broken/miscast too.

(https://i.imgur.com/vNv5FNW.jpg)

Some of the riders are a bit miscast, but I won't ever be using all eight, if I do use them I'll choose the cleanest casts in the lot.

In terms of size they are the right sort of bulk to mix with Perrys, but a bit shorter. If put on a Perry horse the feet won't come down to quite the right place. In this way they are perhaps the same dimensions as the Wargames Foundry WOTR cavalrymen.

Now the horses. There seem to be two barded horse variants, and two unbarded. First of all, the unbarded horses are nothing special, certainly inferior to the Perry metal horses, so I won't be using them. The barded horses however are VERY nice - both in variants of Italian=style steel bard, one of which has a cloth covering. They are smaller than the Perry plastic horses though, not just in height but also general build, which is a bit of a shame. I think they'd look small and skinny if mixed into a Perry cavalry unit, which isn't what you want for the most heavily armoured horses in the front rank. They are however roughly the same height as the Perry metal horses (which are slightly smaller than their plastic ones), so I could use them on a separate commander base rather than in a big unit quite happily I think. More variations of horse bard are always welcome for high-ranking commanders.

(https://i.imgur.com/vaBRc6c.jpg)

Next, the infantry. There aren't many different sculpts - I got the crossbowmen (two poses) and the polearm infantry (four poses). They are alright, perfectly useable. Slightly shorter than Perry. One of the polearm men in heavy armour I'll definitely be making use of. I think they will all find a place in my collection somewhere or another in the future. Again the heads are separate, which is good - they'll look better with plastic Perry heads I think. The supplied polearms are oversized and I won't be using them.

(https://i.imgur.com/Q7YQkLR.jpg)

I also got the artillery piece and crew. I like collecting artillery I guess - I have four painted up and something like three other variants now waiting to be assembled and painted one day. It's a good quality gun - the crew are based on the polearm infantry sculpts. I'll be using it someday for sure.

(https://i.imgur.com/Avtf7sk.jpg)

There are a few other sets I didn't get - handgunners, command, light cavalry, sword & shield infantry and stradiots.

So the Venexia range has some uses for conversions and mixing things into the larger collection, though admittedly I think most of them are going to remain in the components drawer for a while before I make use of them.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on July 16, 2022, 02:31:53 PM
Great review of the figures! Those polearms would fit in better with 54mm figures. I absolutely love what you did with the Hawkwood figure!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: magyar on July 18, 2022, 06:11:57 AM
Very interesting!
I too liked the Hawkwood figure with the headswap, and the gun crew looks very nice indeed. Some really cool horse barding, wish the horses were bigger  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: Captain Blood on July 18, 2022, 10:28:04 PM
Some interesting and obscure finds there Charlie. Agree the gun crew looks quite good  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on July 19, 2022, 01:08:09 PM
Interesting set of figures! The Hawkwood conversion is really effective!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Trying out some obscure miniatures... (July 16th)
Post by: Griefbringer on July 19, 2022, 01:17:04 PM
That figure for late 15th century John Hawkwood looks like a nice sculpt, though the posing somehow makes me think that he is checking his wristwatch (and even your converted stantard bearer seems to have head posed in similar angle).

Interesting to see pictures of the Venexia figures. I once purchased the Italian command pack from some source, and did not get too inspired to try purchasing any further items - I found the sculpting a bit mediocre, and they were a bit bulkier than Perrys. The separate heads are an interesting idea, though the ones that came in the command pack did not feature much variety. That artillery piece in your pictures does nto look too bad, though.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 24, 2022, 02:12:19 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/07/more-francs-archers.html

More francs-archers

Here's the second unit of francs-archers. Like the first one it's a unit of 20, made up of mostly Perry metals with some plastics mixed in, and headswaps to avoid duplicates.

(https://i.imgur.com/akIP2aZ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7v3btcw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/I142UsD.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/eTYCVFC.jpg)

And here are the two units side by side, plus combining them for a unit of 30 men.

(https://i.imgur.com/Cxn9lcF.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/0hwuAhr.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: Dolnikan on July 25, 2022, 05:46:46 AM
They look great. With them all advancing but not in exactly the same pace and with different weapons really gives off a vibe that fits the era.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 25, 2022, 03:45:55 PM
They look great. With them all advancing but not in exactly the same pace and with different weapons really gives off a vibe that fits the era.

Thanks, yes that's exactly the effect I wanted - not too uniform!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: Griefbringer on July 25, 2022, 06:47:59 PM
That's a pretty decent looking lot, and stylistically fits well with the previous one.

My personal approach would have probably been to use a bit flashier figure for unit leader (say, with more armour, fancier helmet or more dynamic pose), though your more minimalistic approach is also interesting. It might take a few seconds more to spot the leader, but with his pose, tilted head and mouth open to yell orders, it is still clear who is in charge here.

As for establishing a bit ragged and dis-uniform look, it certainly helps to put a few of the archers without livery coats in the first rank, rather than hiding them all in the rear rank.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on July 25, 2022, 08:58:17 PM
Great work on the unit! I've definitely got a soft-spot for the metal marching infantry sculpts, always glad to see them in use!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 28, 2022, 08:00:16 PM
My personal approach would have probably been to use a bit flashier figure for unit leader (say, with more armour, fancier helmet or more dynamic pose), though your more minimalistic approach is also interesting. It might take a few seconds more to spot the leader, but with his pose, tilted head and mouth open to yell orders, it is still clear who is in charge here.

Yes I gave the first unit a more obvious leader figure, I thought I'd do it differently with this one!

Great work on the unit! I've definitely got a soft-spot for the metal marching infantry sculpts, always glad to see them in use!

Yes they're great sculpts - I wish there were some metal sculpts in the same style in other poses too. Like with most Perry metals they aren't the best castings, when cleaning them up and laying down the base coats I always notice dodgy spots on them and which they were cleaner, but once painted up and based in a unit they are really not noticeable.

I've had enough of painting archers now though!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More francs-archers (July 24th)
Post by: brunei35 on July 29, 2022, 07:33:44 AM
Look excellent and like the way mixed in the marching poses with the plastics as other said. Will have to give it a go sometime. Thanks for posting again on this interesting thread.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Theatres of war (August 7th)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 07, 2022, 06:14:34 PM
No new miniatures today, just a history post on the blog - https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/08/theatres-of-war.html

I've summarised all the different theatres of war for the whole 1477-1493 period, to see which ones make for good gaming opportunities. I've also got a chart of all the named nobles and commanders I've been able to find, and which theatres they were involved in.

I won't post the whole thing here - follow the link if interested.

I will however post the list of specific battles, skirmishes and sieges that would make for good scenarios!



The attempted relief of Arras (1477) - A Burgundian relief force was ambushed and routed.
The failed attack on Tournai (1477) - A disorganised Flemish army was defeated by a smaller French sortie, and the Duke of Guelders was killed.
The siege of Vesoul (1477) - Guillaume de Vaudrey sortied out at night and surprised the French siege camp.
The Battle of Émagny (1477) - The French fought to cross the River Ognon, which they eventually managed after taking heavy losses.
The first siege of Dole (1477) - The French bombarded the walls but their subsequent assaults on the breach failed. They settled in for a long siege, but were again surprised and routed by a night-time sortie.
The capture of Gray (1477) - Claude and Guillaume de Vaudrey scaled the walls at night and captured the town after hard fighting, though it was looted and set ablaze in the process.
The second siege of Dole (1479) - After methodically capturing the surrounding fortresses, the French under Charles d'Amboise managed to enter the town through trickery, as German reinforcements secretly in their pay opened the gates to them. Dole was subsequently sacked.
The Battle of Guinegate (1479) - A major pitched battle. Though the French cavalry routed their Burgundian counterparts they pursued them far from the field of battle, after which Maximilian's infantry defeated the French.
The failed attack on Hesdin (1481) - John de Berghes was tricked into leading a 'secret' assault over the walls at night. It was a trap, and the French were waiting for him.
The capture of Dordrecht (1481) - The Burgundians entered the town hidden in boats.
The Battle of Westbroek (1481) - The Burgundians lured the 'hook' rebels of Utrecht out of the town, where they were outnumbered and crushed.
The Siege of Utrecht (1483) - Maximilian besieged Utrecht - after bombardment and hard fighting the rebels in the city eventually accepted peace terms.
The Battle of Hollogne (1483) - Guillaume de la Marck was defeated by Philip of Cleves.
The Battle of Béthune (1487) - Maximilian's army was defeated by the French, who captured Engelbert of Nassau and Charles of Egmont. This battle seems to have been quite significant, but I've found no information on how it actually played out.
The Battle of Dixmude (1489) - Flemish rebels besieged the town of Dixmude, but were attacked and defeated by a force of landsknechts and English allies from nearby Calais.
The Battle of Brouwershaven (1490) - The 'hook' faction leader Franz van Brederode was attacked whilst raiding along the coast by John of Egmont. The battle began at sea and continued on the shore, were the hooks were defeated and van Brederode captured, later dying of his wounds.
The 'bread and cheese revolt' (1491-1492) - A peasant uprising in which several towns were captured, before it was put down by Albert of Saxony.
The recapture of Arras (1492) - Burgundians recaptured Arras, one of the most important towns in the French-held county of Artois.
The Battle of Dournon (1493) - As Maximilian moved to retake the Franche-Comté, a force of Burgundians and Germans (landsknechts) faced the French under Jean de Baudricourt and soundly defeated them.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Theatres of war (August 7th)
Post by: Atheling on August 07, 2022, 07:22:30 PM

The attempted relief of Arras (1477) - A Burgundian relief force was ambushed and routed.
The failed attack on Tournai (1477) - A disorganised Flemish army was defeated by a smaller French sortie, and the Duke of Guelders was killed.
The siege of Vesoul (1477) - Guillaume de Vaudrey sortied out at night and surprised the French siege camp.
The Battle of Émagny (1477) - The French fought to cross the River Ognon, which they eventually managed after taking heavy losses.
The first siege of Dole (1477) - The French bombarded the walls but their subsequent assaults on the breach failed. They settled in for a long siege, but were again surprised and routed by a night-time sortie.
The capture of Gray (1477) - Claude and Guillaume de Vaudrey scaled the walls at night and captured the town after hard fighting, though it was looted and set ablaze in the process.
The second siege of Dole (1479) - After methodically capturing the surrounding fortresses, the French under Charles d'Amboise managed to enter the town through trickery, as German reinforcements secretly in their pay opened the gates to them. Dole was subsequently sacked.
The Battle of Guinegate (1479) - A major pitched battle. Though the French cavalry routed their Burgundian counterparts they pursued them far from the field of battle, after which Maximilian's infantry defeated the French.
The failed attack on Hesdin (1481) - John de Berghes was tricked into leading a 'secret' assault over the walls at night. It was a trap, and the French were waiting for him.
The capture of Dordrecht (1481) - The Burgundians entered the town hidden in boats.
The Battle of Westbroek (1481) - The Burgundians lured the 'hook' rebels of Utrecht out of the town, where they were outnumbered and crushed.
The Siege of Utrecht (1483) - Maximilian besieged Utrecht - after bombardment and hard fighting the rebels in the city eventually accepted peace terms.
The Battle of Hollogne (1483) - Guillaume de la Marck was defeated by Philip of Cleves.
The Battle of Béthune (1487) - Maximilian's army was defeated by the French, who captured Engelbert of Nassau and Charles of Egmont. This battle seems to have been quite significant, but I've found no information on how it actually played out.
The Battle of Dixmude (1489) - Flemish rebels besieged the town of Dixmude, but were attacked and defeated by a force of landsknechts and English allies from nearby Calais.
The Battle of Brouwershaven (1490) - The 'hook' faction leader Franz van Brederode was attacked whilst raiding along the coast by John of Egmont. The battle began at sea and continued on the shore, were the hooks were defeated and van Brederode captured, later dying of his wounds.
The 'bread and cheese revolt' (1491-1492) - A peasant uprising in which several towns were captured, before it was put down by Albert of Saxony.
The recapture of Arras (1492) - Burgundians recaptured Arras, one of the most important towns in the French-held county of Artois.
The Battle of Dournon (1493) - As Maximilian moved to retake the Franche-Comté, a force of Burgundians and Germans (landsknechts) faced the French under Jean de Baudricourt and soundly defeated them.

Well, that's 19 Late Med. battles and sieges I know little or (mostly) nothing about!

Looking forward to reading more  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Theatres of war (August 7th)
Post by: Wiegraf on August 07, 2022, 08:15:50 PM
The Francs-archers look great. I was thinking of using some of the war of the roses Perry lads in a similar fashion for my Savoyards I plan on doing whenever I get around to doing the later 15th century stuff.

Great to see all the different Wargames illustrated minis you have received. I'll have to get Lord Callan as well as I think he'll do nicely for the later 15th century. I plan to grab their Otto von Bismarck model when they release it, so that'll be a good time to jump on that.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Theatres of war (August 7th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on August 08, 2022, 04:52:07 PM
Thanks for the write-up! It's definitely interesting to see the various battles and campaigns itemised like this, a lot of writing seems to de-emphasise the 'Burgundian-ness' of the period, in favour of Maximilian, so it's nice to see the acknowledgement of the Burgundians through the period!


The table of commanders at the end is also a huge help, trying to place where everyone is in this period can get a bit hectic at times!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the workbench (August 16th)
Post by: Charlie_ on August 16, 2022, 08:35:40 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/08/on-workbench.html

On the workbench...

I've been gathering together various infantry figures for the next units, which will be French 'heavy infantry'. I'm not entirely sure how I'm going to group them together in units yet, so am going to go about this a bit differently, and just paint loads up and decide how the units should be put together afterwards.

I don't just want to use the Perry plastics exclusively, so have been looking at other manufacturers to see which ones will mix in well, with or without conversion work. Even if a range is proportioned a bit differently to Perry, quick headswaps go a long way to help them blend in, as long as they are not far too short in stature (i.e. Old Glory and Foundry).

One reason for doing this is I have a certain vision in my head of how the unit will look, and I want certain poses yet not have many noticeable duplicates. The Perry foot knight plastics are of course great but can look a bit too 'random' in large units, and I've never really liked the bill and halberd arm poses from the WOTR infantry plastic set (at least not in ranked up units).

So here's a brief summary of what I've found useable from other manufacturers. These are NOT reviews of the ranges or quality of the sculpts, but rather a look at how they can be integrated with Perry Miniatures if you are really fussy about this sort thing, like I am.

Front Rank - Generally chunkier and a bit shorter than Perry, and some of the poses are a bit stiff, but some of them could be made to blend in well. The weapons are a bit too chunky.

Venexia - A limited range, but some are very nice, though a little bit shorter than Perry. Come with separate heads and open hands, which is useful. Sold by Lancashire Games.

Grenadier - Kind of chunky, a bit inconsistent, but some are nice. The weapons are far too chunky though. This old range is now available from Forlorn Hope Games.

Athena
- Vary in size, some are taller than Perry, and overall somewhat slimmer, but should mix in fine.

Crusader
- A tiny bit shorter than Perry, probably not noticeable, somewhat slimmer and with tiny hands. Finely detailed.

I've cherry-picked some sculpts from these ranges to be used in the upcoming heavy infantry units, plus some for a Burgundian archer unit sometime in the future. Some I've given headswaps, and have manged to drill out and replace certain oversized weapons.

First thing to point out is I think Grenadier match really well with Front Rank - If anyone was to start a Front Rank WOTR project, they could mix in the Grenadier sculpts for more variety.

(https://i.imgur.com/285Ahsp.jpg)

Next up, here are a selection of armoured men-at-arms from Perry, Athena and Steel Fist, to be used in my French infantry units. With the open-handed ones I mixed it up and gave them poleaxes from a variety of different manufacturers, to help them blend together (and just to be different!).

(https://i.imgur.com/uLyIuZ6.jpg)

Here's two of the polearm infantry form Venexia - good sculpts which take Perry heads and new polearms perfectly. I really like the armoured one, he's going to be really useful for various units (I've got four of him in total).

(https://i.imgur.com/3P1GtVt.jpg)

Next up, two polearm infantry from Grenadier. I replaced their chunky weapons with better scaled alternatives (which required a bit of hacking and drilling). Some of the Grenadier sculpts have short little legs, but these ones scale perfectly with Perry.

(https://i.imgur.com/QHQqBej.jpg)

And here's a scale comparison of various ranges for my polearm troops. I plan to mix these all in together. The two Venexia ones are slightly shorter, but I could happily raise them up a mm or two, no problem.

(https://i.imgur.com/KguryIx.jpg)

I've also got some archer conversions - I want to use as few of the Perry plastics as I can for my next archer unit, so wanted to find as many metal longbowmen from other ranges that could be made to mix in. I've done this before with Crusader Miniatures -give them new plastic Perry bow hands (from the Agincourt range preferably), and perhaps right hands and new heads too. A couple of the archers form Grenadier are  nice - the one here in particular, I just gave him a new bowhand for consistency. A few of the others Grenadier archers will probably need leg swaps if I was to use them....

(https://i.imgur.com/VLQEfrS.jpg)

I tried giving the same treatment to some Front Rank archers. The poses of the shooting ones are a bit stiff, and they do look chunky alongside the rest, but I think I'll use a few of them for sure, they can always be hidden inside the unit a bit.

(https://i.imgur.com/cTxeXL2.jpg)

And here's some archers from Athena. Some of these have really great poses, but they are somewhat inconsistent in size. The one on the left is a perfect mix for Perry, whereas a certain few others are comparatively massive. Many of their bows were bent and damaged, but that's just the problem of thin metal weapons - easily improved by replacing with plastic bow hands. The one on the right has a bow in pretty good shape though, so he'll keep his unless I manage to snap it by mistake!

(https://i.imgur.com/swTZPob.jpg)

Don't expect to see these conversions painted up in finished units for a long time, but I might keep you updated with future 'workbench' posts as I paint them up.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French mounted crossbowmen (September 1st)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 01, 2022, 08:34:19 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com

French mounted crossbowmen

A new small unit - French mounted crossbowmen!

(https://i.imgur.com/7PspqAj.jpg)

These could represent mounted 'archers' of the Ordonnance companies among other things. I don't think they'd ever be seen in actual pitched battles, but could see plenty of action in smaller scale warfare. Skirmishes involving scouting missions, ambushes, baggage convoys... plenty of fuel for gaming scenarios. I've shared these thoughts before on my previous posts on French light cavalry and mounted crossbowmen.

All five models are converted in some way or another. All Perry Miniatures, two are plastics and three are metal. All have had metal headswaps - two are hacked from some Wargames Foundry sculpts, and another two are from Crusader Miniatures. All of them have been put on the Perry metal horses (which are smaller than the plastic ones), and most have required at least part of their saddles to be sculpted from scratch. One of the horses is actually from the Agincourt range.

(https://i.imgur.com/CbfYEz8.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ciQTiDs.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/7XG6EuF.jpg)

And here they are joining forces with my earlier 'generic' mounted crossbowmen, to make a larger unit of 10.

(https://i.imgur.com/WIRzA8X.jpg)

I really like the look of these and how they're positioned on the bases - I plant do more light cavalry sometime in the future!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French mounted crossbowmen (September 1st)
Post by: magyar on September 02, 2022, 12:14:11 PM
A lovely unit indeed!
I like the line-up, - seems like the guys are scanning the horizon on a look-up to kick some butt  lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French mounted crossbowmen (September 1st)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on September 02, 2022, 12:28:39 PM
Excellent work! They absolutely look the part for all the raids and skirmishes across the two Burgundies!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French mounted crossbowmen (September 1st)
Post by: Wiegraf on September 02, 2022, 11:03:44 PM
They look great. Well done. Could easily represent the Savoyards as well. Chances are when I'm in this period I'll probably come back to your blog or the forum and check out how you went about doing all the units. :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French mounted crossbowmen (September 1st)
Post by: LouieN on September 03, 2022, 10:05:34 PM
An excellent unit. 
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 10, 2022, 08:51:04 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Three French commanders

Some more commanders now, this time for the French side. Here we have Philippe de Hochberg, Jean de Damas and Jean de Salazar. These three were all involved in the southern theatre of the war (see The War in Burgundy (https://fullharness.blogspot.com/p/the-war-in-burgundy-1477-1480.html) for full details), and so should make good opponents for my many Burgundian nobles. As usual all the flags are swappable, so these particular figures can be used as any other nobles.

(https://i.imgur.com/uLvZrgm.jpg)


Jean de Damas, Lord of Digoine, Clessy and Saint-Amour (1423-1481) had previously served the Dukes of Burgundy. He was governor of the Mâconnais region (which had belonged to the dukes since 1435) and had been made a Knight of the Golden Fleece in 1468. Following the death of Charles the Bold in 1477 it wasn't long before he switched his allegiance to Louis XI, and handed Mâconnais over to the French. He was removed from the Order of the Golden Fleece in 1481, and died later the same year.

My Jean de Damas is a Perry metal commander with a headswap, the new one being from the Wargames Foundry WOTR range. His standard bearer is also from Wargames Foundry, but he is on a Perry metal horse.

(https://i.imgur.com/5uCfK7z.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/r0qq25x.jpg)


Philip de Hochberg, Lord of Badenweiler (1454-1503) was a nobleman who had also previously served Charles the Bold and had been taken prisoner at the Battle of Nancy in 1477. Following his release he sided with France, and was made Marshal of Burgundy when the French occupied the duchy. He was also gifted with the confiscated territories of the Prince of Orange, though he had to return them following the Treaty of Arras in 1482. In 1487 he succeeded his father as Margrave of Hochberg-Sausenberg and Count of Neuchâtel, and was later made Grand Chamberlain of France (1491) and Grand Seneschal of Provence (1493).

My Philip de Hochberg is actually from the Athena Miniatures WOTR range, though I have replaced his hands with plastic Perry parts and put him on a metal Perry horse. The standard bearer and his horse are both Perry metals.

The heraldry I have used is conjectural - I have found his heraldry for when he succeeded his father, but at this point he was just the heir, so what I've used is his family arms quartered with the arms of Badenweiler. Interestingly these are the same as the Counts of Neuchâtel but in different colours.

(https://i.imgur.com/hAUncMo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/pGSLWWl.jpg)


Jean de Salazar
(1410-1479) was a veteran Spanish mercenary who had served France for many decades, even having fought alongside Joan of Arc in the Hundred Years War. In 1477 he fought in Burgundy, and was in command of the occupied town of Gray in the Franche-Comté when it was attacked during the night by Claude and Guillaume de Vaudrey. Taken by surprise, Salazar led the defence of the castle but was eventually forced to flee, wounded and badly burned. He escaped to the duchy, and despite his injuries he later managed to lead a sortie to turn back a Burgundian raid led by the Prince of Orange that had reached the gates of Dijon.

Interestingly there was another Jean de Salazar around this time who fought for the Burgundians, known as le petite Salazar. It's not known if the two were related.

My figure for Salazar is a plastic Perry man-at-arms with a Steel Fist plume, and his standard bearer is a metal Perry sculpt with a headswap, both on metal Perry horses.

(https://i.imgur.com/YI5npTt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/w11W9Wm.jpg)


In comparison to the Burgundians, the list of identifiable French commanders in this conflict is actually quite small, or at least I've not been able to identify that many of them. And of the three here, I've only found references to Jean de Salazar doing any actual fighting. The other two were involved in the campaign though - they both led armies into the Duchy of Burgundy in 1477 when it was in danger of rebellion, and Philippe de Hochberg was with Charles d'Amboise when he victoriously entered Besançon in 1479. I've already covered Georges de la Trémoille, and also talked about Gaston du Lion on my French light cavalry post. That leaves the one notable French leader for the southern campaign of 1477-1482 as Charles d'Amboise. He will get covered sometime in the future!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on September 11, 2022, 06:14:03 AM
Lovely work on the commanders! de Damas' Golden Fleece chain is a really nice touch

Also I didn't realise how old de Salazar was! It's quite a career he had
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 12, 2022, 05:40:14 PM
Lovely work on the commanders! de Damas' Golden Fleece chain is a really nice touch

Funnily enough that wasn't intentional, it was already on the figure (originally it was Henry VII). I was thinking it would be a good 'chain of office', and as he was governor or Maconnias it could be for that role. But yes, it could also perhaps be a Golden Fleece chain!

Several of the other Perry WOTR commanders I've used have them, and I have tried to reserve those models for commanders with some sort of high-ranking position.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Ray Rivers on September 22, 2022, 02:19:40 PM
Stonking new additions, Charlie!  :-*

Does it really matter that some of the minis are not of the same height or body type as the Perry ones? Seems like in a large army you would have all kinds of differently sized soldiers.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Atheling on September 22, 2022, 02:40:43 PM
Very deft brushwork Charlie  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 22, 2022, 07:29:28 PM
Does it really matter that some of the minis are not of the same height or body type as the Perry ones? Seems like in a large army you would have all kinds of differently sized soldiers.

Ah well I'm just fussy!
Indeed some can mix in nicely with different 'body shapes', some of the Front Rank sculpts in particular, and simple head and hand swaps go a huge way in tying different ranges together.
What I try to avoid is things such as a whole unit being vastly different in size to others, or a unit of cavalry on big destriers led by a high-ranking noble on a fully armoured pony!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: whill4 on September 23, 2022, 02:37:24 PM
Nice work. I have been following this thread with interest. If you get a chance would you please offer some tips on how you make your banners and standards interchangeable. Thank you.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on September 24, 2022, 09:25:13 PM
If you get a chance would you please offer some tips on how you make your banners and standards interchangeable. Thank you.

I do plan to do a post about that in the future, I'll take some pics when I next make some new flags!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: whill4 on September 25, 2022, 02:03:19 PM
Thank you! Looking forward to the post.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Cacique Caribe on September 27, 2022, 04:44:30 AM
Wow, what a thoroughly inspiring thread!  Thanks so much for that treat.

Dan
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Three French commanders (September 10th)
Post by: Metternich on September 27, 2022, 07:25:07 PM
Some very nice painting there Charlie.  And thanks for including the very helpful size comparison shots.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: Charlie_ on October 22, 2022, 10:32:27 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Slow work in progress...

Been a while since my last post - October is a very busy time of year for me, so painting slows to a glacial pace. I still manage to get at least a little bit of paint on most evenings, but it takes much longer than normal to complete a batch of figures this time of year.

The current focus is on French 'heavy' infantry, and as I said in a previous post it will be some time before this results in finished units. I'm approaching it in a slightly different way to normal, as I haven't yet decided how I'm going to group and base them. So I'm just converting and painting up a random batch of figures which I plan to use in the unit(s), and will decide how to group and base them when they are all done!

Therefore I thought it would be worth sharing some 'work in progress' posts along the way.

Here's the current rather small number of finished figures. Almost all of them are converted in some way or another, and not all of them are Perry Miniatures.

(https://i.imgur.com/lsQX1kN.jpg)

Let's take a closer look at some of them.

These are both Perry metals, the captain on the right has had a headswap.

(https://i.imgur.com/1r0r1eU.jpg)

This is a Perry plastic with a Steel Fist head, from their Italian Wars light cavalry packs.

(https://i.imgur.com/KZfX9Vu.jpg)

This conversion (using the same Perry plastic body as the last one) has had nice riding boots and mail under his brigandine sculpted with green stuff. His arms are also made from various different plastic parts.

(https://i.imgur.com/bSuimpZ.jpg)

These three are Perry metals and have had new clothing layers sculpted on. All three have been given livery jackets, and the mail shirt and padded jack of the two on the left are also new additions (previously they were wearing just plain doublets, ideal for sculpting new layers on to). The two on the right have new heads from Wargames Foundry.

(https://i.imgur.com/FW4nWLL.jpg)

And here's an example of mixing different manufacturers together. On the left is a Perry metal (with a Wargames Foundry headswap), in the middle is Front Rank (with the oversized halberd head replaced by a better scaled plastic Perry glaive) and on the right is Grenadier (again with his oversized weapon removed and replaced, this time by a Front Rank pollaxe). I'm not a fan of the whole Front Rank and Genadier ranges, but have found certain individual sculpts I like from both.

(https://i.imgur.com/WaplAWO.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on October 23, 2022, 04:23:59 AM
Great work on the conversions! The subtle swaps go a long way, they're really effective!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: commissarmoody on October 23, 2022, 05:08:20 AM
Nice conversion work.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: MaleGriffin on October 23, 2022, 02:12:42 PM
I love the conversion work, especially the boots!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: bluechi on October 23, 2022, 09:26:10 PM
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2b/Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg/544px-Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg

this is the heraldry of Philip....1476

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ee/Burg_R%C3%B6tteln_-_Unteres_Tor.jpg

difficult to say whats right.

it must be the Baden/Neuenburger/Savoyen so it is on the gate of the Palas of Castle Rötteln he build . Next visit make a Picture :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: Charlie_ on October 23, 2022, 09:56:17 PM
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2b/Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg/544px-Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg

this is the heraldry of Philip....

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2b/Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg/544px-Wappen_Philippe_de_Hochberg.jpg)

Ahh yes, well found, I had found that one myself but decided it was not actually his heraldry, but rather his family arms and his wife's together. My reasoning being....
1 - The shield is captioned below as "Phillippe de Hochberg 1487-1503 / Marie de Savoie" (the date being when he succeeded his father as Count of Neuchatel). The right hand arms would indeed be those of Mary of Savoy, a daughter of Amadeus IX Duke of Savoy and Yolande of France (sister of Louis XI of France, thus the Savoy/France quartering).
2 - Apparently this is found at Neuchatel castle. I have also found the image below (1) which, with identical surrounds, is surely from the same location, perhaps alongside it. It is for his father, Rudolf de Hochberg, and again shows the family arms alongside his wife's family (Margaret de Vienne, and that is indeed the Vienne family arms).
3 - All other sources I can find show the seals of both father (Rudolf) and son (Philippe) once he had inherited as being the images below (2), including his/their seal.

Thus I've taken this to mean that the shields on the wall at Neuchatel castle (presumably there are others) show the family arms of the ruling Hochberg-Sausenberg family halved with those of their wives, with dates for when the count ruled. These are NOT actually their coats of arms.

(1)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/82/Allianzwappen_Rudolf_IV_Neuchatel.jpg)

(2)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/75/Siegel_Rudolf_IV_Hochberg.jpg/232px-Siegel_Rudolf_IV_Hochberg.jpg)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/Wappen_Hachberg-Neuenburg.jpg)


EDIT responding to your edit
I hadn't seen that second image before, again it looks to be the same as all my other finds for both Rudolf and Philippe. Good find!

My heraldry for Philippe is supposed to be his during his father's lifetime, before he inherited, so he presumably would be using something different. It just happens that the arms for Badenweiler, which he was lord of before inheriting, are the same in different colours, so seems like a fair bet to me!

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: bluechi on October 23, 2022, 10:27:07 PM
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ca/Siegel_Philipp_v_H-S.jpg/658px-Siegel_Philipp_v_H-S.jpg

 i think that is the Neuchatel colours red/silver(white). While Rötteln/Badenweiler/Sausenburg going 1447 together and build since than the "Markgräflerland". who comes 1503 to Christoph1 of Hachberg(Hochburg).

but this is "Dipfeleschisserei" in "Markgräfler slang" ;-D

next time visiting Rötteln gonna make a Picture of the Palas gate....thats interrest me....thanks for new adventure in history of my area. At the moment reading the history of Peter von Hagenbach/Bilgeri von Heudorf/Wilhelm Herter von Herteck....

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Slow work in progress... (October 22nd)
Post by: bluechi on October 24, 2022, 06:01:46 AM
Here it is...
https://wappenwiki.org/index.php?title=House_of_Baden-Hachberg
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (10th Nov)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 10, 2022, 08:14:31 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Burgundian halberdiers

Question - How many times can a unit be rebased?

Apparently the answer is currently three! Most of the models in this unit have been rebased three times. Originally they were based singly, and then were among my first units to be redone in the multi-base format. There were lots of them back then - some of the models here are actually among the first ever Perry Miniatures I painted about seven years ago. Over time the number of polearm troops grew until I could group them into I think five units of thirty. When I made the switch to a true historical project, they were re-organised into two large units. And I've now decided to reduce them further into one single unit of thirty. Why?

- Most of my German infantry should really be pikemen. Two over-large units of halberdiers didn't quite feel right. One small unit to accompany the larger pike blocks seems better.

- They look best in three ranks of ten, all in advancing/attacking poses, weapons at 45 degrees or lowered. I like the close-packed 'forest of polearms' look.

- A lot of the ones I'd painted years back haven't held up alongside my more recent units, both in terms of painting and posing. I've chosen the best of the bunch for this one unit.

- I want this unit to definitely look German in its weaponry and armour, so have made sure they are mostly armed with halberds of various styles. A scattering of glaives, and no bills.

- I also carefully chose some of the less German-looking ones to use for the future French units.

So here they are - German halberdiers in the service of Burgundy. German infantry were hired in large numbers from 1477 onwards to help defend against the French invasion, and over the years Maximilian relied on them more and more.

They are of course mostly Perry Miniatures (all metals, no plastic), with a scattering of Wargames Foundry and Steel Fist. Many headswaps and other minor conversions.

(https://i.imgur.com/YBuCoKH.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/IuI5RJY.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ujkUxr1.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on November 10, 2022, 08:48:49 PM
Magnificent polearms-men! Absolutely gorgeous! Pray tell what caused your dislike of plastics?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 11, 2022, 06:10:30 PM
Pray tell what caused your dislike of plastics?

Oh you misunderstand me, I do not dislike plastics at all! This whole collection is a mix of plastic and metal, it just happens that this unit is all metal.

I have found though that the plastic Perry kits don't quite work to my eye for this sort of pose, with the  polearms at 45 degrees or lowered. So I make a lot of use of the comparatively very small range of Perry metals for my pike and polearm units.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on November 12, 2022, 01:03:35 AM
The rebased unit looks great! Agreed that the 'forest of polearms' look is really striking, especially for the formations of proto-landsknecht of the era!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: magyar on November 12, 2022, 10:08:15 AM
Lovely lineup! A most impressive cold steel forest  :).
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: bigredbat on November 13, 2022, 01:07:25 PM
Those are superb!  Love your units.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 15, 2022, 05:46:19 PM
The rebased unit looks great! Agreed that the 'forest of polearms' look is really striking, especially for the formations of proto-landsknecht of the era!

Those are superb!  Love your units.

Lovely lineup! A most impressive cold steel forest  :).

Thanks all!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Halberdiers, rebased for the third time (Nov 10th)
Post by: DalyDR on November 16, 2022, 12:30:06 AM
That's a wonderful looking group of halberdiers.  They really present the appearance of being just about to make contact with their foe.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 23, 2022, 08:51:53 PM
I've written a brief guide for interchangeable flags on my blog, as several people have asked me how it's done in the past.

I'm certainly not the only person doing flags like this and can't claim credit for the idea. I can't actually remember where I first saw it done...

This is just showing how I do it, and should have a few useful tips in there even if you don't use my method in its entirety.

https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/11/guide-for-interchangeable-flags.html

(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEguQZx_f2DTioy1NDQHxi4jPr9C1nlyDWVAsiwfeg2otPPbJy-lWrDUb6tNDGkWY3nqWo79Sgwq_dnKr5CZTYrw3gVJh7NmuS4uvm7ovexRTsO7o72toMyGeDjtusDGNUBQvtfv9EamX6VtzR0cDi2VEomK1RBCk8WaMRBrkkgTfGyODQBbT4Itn4SF/s2038/swappingflags2.jpg)

(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjWA3Ykp6lHAdFBPxeWavinJ-4jkuTsRBmmkkRF8mzUhwud-KAhBuGo356AJc5o-xZ36ekdS_tbNLCgvxh53A4s24_GePojzncXXwwYnfbrunUdnAZVkMygZxm7bZN111l0PFd7Hvaz6p4XmT1sAFr1uAJ4dclMqdkWMOhuiNpgvMxbcGBPRLE_riwK/s883/swappingflags3.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on November 24, 2022, 11:21:33 AM
Thanks for posting this guide! That's really useful information!

I've mostly been in the brass-tube camp for a while, and definitely agree that your method is much more seamless, thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: whill4 on November 24, 2022, 02:52:29 PM
Thank you for the tutorial.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: Ray Rivers on November 24, 2022, 02:57:32 PM
Great tutorial, Charlie!  :-*

I could see using a similar technique for gluing flags on staffs which are too short.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: magyar on December 01, 2022, 04:17:19 PM
Charlie, thanks for sharing, quite useful!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: valleyboy on December 02, 2022, 07:01:19 PM
Excellent, well done, I might modify my technique then which is to use hollow plastic tube as this seems better
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Guide for interchangeable flags (Nov 23rd)
Post by: Pattus Magnus on December 02, 2022, 08:00:19 PM
That approach is new to me, so thanks for sharing it! I’ll have to give it a try soon.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 04, 2022, 08:06:07 PM
I'm glad you've all found it useful!

Now I've put together three A4 sheets of flags which you are free to download and use.

Full-size images on the blog, plus biographical details of each historical personality featured - https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

(https://i.imgur.com/xyHbLMBl.png)

(https://i.imgur.com/oqrpzzpl.png)

(https://i.imgur.com/SUUK0Lrl.png)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on December 04, 2022, 09:21:42 PM
Lovely! Thank you so much for sharing these fantastic flags!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 04, 2022, 10:21:58 PM
Those are splendid. Well done Charlie  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: Atheling on December 05, 2022, 10:36:22 AM
Excellent stuff Charlie and very generous for you to share. I've saved the images as Jpg's and saved the heraldic information to Word.

As I say, very generous of you to share  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on December 05, 2022, 03:45:42 PM
Thanks for sharing! That's a huge help, especially the Cleves ones, on account of how extremely fiddly they are!

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: GulKelan on December 05, 2022, 03:56:51 PM
WoW these are so amazing. Thank you so much Charlie!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Burgundian flag sheets! (Dec 4th)
Post by: Wiegraf on December 06, 2022, 01:12:46 AM
Great work on the flags. I've still yet to do any research for my own Burgundian stuff since I'm still floundering around in my 1400-1429 hundred year wars project but I'll certainly be returning to this thread for more references.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 18, 2022, 05:26:59 PM
And here's another flag sheet, this time for commanders on the French side.

Full-size image and biographical details on the blog - https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/12/french-flag-sheet.html

(https://i.imgur.com/aUZwGrEl.png)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on December 18, 2022, 06:07:01 PM
These are looking great! I really love those pieces on heraldry of the period in your blog. Makes it so much easier to choose what historical retinue to make.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: has.been on December 19, 2022, 12:41:25 PM
Many thanks for your generosity.
Just received my copy of 'Never Mind
the Billhooks Deluxe'  so I am on the
look-out for medievals. French would
be nice.
 :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: Atheling on December 19, 2022, 12:54:15 PM
Fabulous stuff Charlie and very kind of you to make them available to people again  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: GulKelan on December 19, 2022, 03:12:01 PM
Thanks alot Charlie. Your deisgns are awesome!
Now i defenatly have to build a late medieval french army aswell :D


i was wondering if you know this little book:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/BURGUNDIAN-ARMY-CHARLES-BOLD-COMPANINES/dp/B003DVZIGY
you probably know it already...

alot of great banners and flags!
But your quality of your flags are much higher anyway.
could you imagine to create these flags from the book in your high quality standart?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French flag sheet (Dec 18th)
Post by: Atheling on December 19, 2022, 03:56:09 PM
i was wondering if you know this little book:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/BURGUNDIAN-ARMY-CHARLES-BOLD-COMPANINES/dp/B003DVZIGY
you probably know it already...

alot of great banners and flags!
But your quality of your flags are much higher anyway.
could you imagine to create these flags from the book in your high quality standart?

The Burgundian Army of Charles the Bold booklet is a Freezywater Publication from the Lance and Longbow Society available (for cheaper) here:
https://lanceandlongbow.com/shopPublications.php (https://lanceandlongbow.com/shopPublications.php)

It described the army of Charles the Bold and is from an slightly earlier period than Charlie's fab work.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 22, 2022, 09:03:32 PM
More works in progress

https://fullharness.blogspot.com/2022/12/more-works-in-progress.html

Just an update before Christmas - the French heavy infantry are nearing completion. The plan is probably to have them in two units of thirty, and I've started the last little batch to bring it up to that number. As I said before, I haven't yet decided how they will be grouped - it might be one 'lighter' and one 'heavier' unit, or they both might be the same mix of lightly and heavily armoured figures.

Here's a few with shouldered weapons I'm rather pleased with, both plastics and metals.

(https://i.imgur.com/hxfGfZxl.jpg)

The next three are all converted, to try and get more of the metal figures with weapons angled lower wearing livery jackets. The one on the left has had a new mail shirt and jacket sculpted over his original doublet. The two on the right were originally in poses with weapons shouldered - the new poses are achieved through some replacing their hands and turning their heads to the side.

(https://i.imgur.com/nzaj7nv.jpg)

The next two are from the small Venexia Miniatures range, which to be honest is a bit of a mixed bag. There is one body though that is very useful as a well-armoured infantryman, here are two variants of it with plastic Perry heads. There are a few flaws in the casting, but they can be hidden by careful placement in the unit.

(https://i.imgur.com/67bxF9am.jpg)

The next three men-at-arms are all from Athena Miniatures, though their polearms are from a variety of different sources.

(https://i.imgur.com/WCpOjysl.jpg)

And finally three plastic Perry men-at-arms, though each of them has a small conversion of some sort. The one on the left had a torso-swap, to get a jacketed body paired with some different legs.

(https://i.imgur.com/7CgHUSY.jpg)

The unit(s) will hopefully be finished sometime around early January!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on December 22, 2022, 09:35:04 PM
Lovely  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Captain Blood on December 22, 2022, 10:16:23 PM
Great work Charlie. Especially those three men at arms. Lovely little creations.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Atheling on December 23, 2022, 12:21:11 PM
I don't think I've said this before but the blending of the paint on the armours is excellent Charlie  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 23, 2022, 01:36:02 PM
Thanks all!

I don't think I've said this before but the blending of the paint on the armours is excellent Charlie  :-*

Nothing to it except a dark wash (GW Nuln Oil) and the briefest, lightest highlight/drybrush of silver (only on the fully armoured men-at-arms). So simple I feel like I'm cheating!

Though also I think somehow my camera works some sort of magic on it too, the armour always seems to look better in the photos than 'in the flesh'.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Atheling on December 23, 2022, 03:17:16 PM
Thanks all!

Nothing to it except a dark wash (GW Nuln Oil) and the briefest, lightest highlight/drybrush of silver (only on the fully armoured men-at-arms). So simple I feel like I'm cheating!

Well, the results are excellent! I might give your drybrush then dark wash of Nuln Oil a try. How thick is the Nuln Oil wash going on Charlie?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 23, 2022, 04:07:56 PM
1 - Basecoat silver.
2 - One coat of Nun Oil, straight from the bottle.

Done! At least for lower-ranking figures.

Then for figures in full plate armour, I use the Nuln Oil again to carefully get in the main gaps between armour plates, where it needs a little extra definiiion. A second coat on the bits of mail between plates.
And then a VERY light drybrush of silver, just to catch the edges and nothing more.
And finally perhaps another smooth layer of silver on some of the large, smooth plates, such as big Italian-style pauldrons, but only if they are looking a bit dark/grubby and want a little extra polish.

And matt varnish to finish.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More works in progress (Dec 22nd)
Post by: Atheling on December 23, 2022, 07:08:06 PM
1 - Basecoat silver.
2 - One coat of Nun Oil, straight from the bottle.

Done! At least for lower-ranking figures.

Then for figures in full plate armour, I use the Nuln Oil again to carefully get in the main gaps between armour plates, where it needs a little extra definiiion. A second coat on the bits of mail between plates.
And then a VERY light drybrush of silver, just to catch the edges and nothing more.
And finally perhaps another smooth layer of silver on some of the large, smooth plates, such as big Italian-style pauldrons, but only if they are looking a bit dark/grubby and want a little extra polish.

And matt varnish to finish.

Thanks Charlie. I'll give it a go soon as I've got some armours to paint- 11th CE but it should work on splint greaves and helmets too.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 14, 2023, 10:08:24 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

French heavy infantry

I've finally finished the French infantry I've been working on for a while.

The original plan was to have two units of thirty. I ended up painting up enough models for one of thirty and one of twenty.... But I just couldn't find a way to group them together that was satisfactory. The first question was how I would mix the fully armoured and lightly armoured models - one unit of foot knight and one of lesser infantry, or both units a mix of the two? Or one slightly better armoured than the other?

The other problem was with figure poses - I wanted them to have a closely-packed look, with polearms lowered or at a 45 degree angle, like my existing pike and halberd units. Just using the Perry plastic sets as they are doesn't quite achieve this. At the same time I wanted a lot of them to have livery jackets - I've shown some conversions I did in previous posts, which I'm very pleased with, but getting enough figures in the right poses with the right equipment for two units was proving tricky.

In the end I chose to scrap my plan for two units, at least for now. I chose thirty of my favourite to make one unit that fits my vision, where every figure has its place. That does mean there's lots I haven't used, but a lot of them will find a home somewhere else in the future. I also did use some with shouldered weapons, but the overall effect is still of advancing/attacking troops.

I won't list all the conversions in here, but the most notable ones are new layers of clothing (padded jacks and livery jackets) sculpted over existing clothing.

(https://i.imgur.com/2iLZXNv.jpg)

The finished mix of troops features both fully-armoured men-at-arms and lesser polearm troops both heavily and lightly armoured. This could represent some knights who have dismounted to lead the infantry in an attack.

(https://i.imgur.com/Q2p84si.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/ligHpb4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/fOQLIfH.jpg)

The banner is swappable. In these first pictures it is the banner of Jean de Daillon, Lord of Lude. It can be exchanged for any other French commander I have made flags for. I've also got a generic French flag available to them.

(https://i.imgur.com/E1BUmq4.jpg)

The French are still severely outmatched against the Burgundians when it comes to heavy infantry - they have just one unit available to them in my collection, whereas their opponents have five, most of which are much bigger! They will at times have the opportunity of having the Swiss on their side though. The French do have the lead in heavy cavalry and archers.

(https://i.imgur.com/vqVxu4Z.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/sd4wyRT.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Tonhel on January 15, 2023, 08:08:06 AM
Very impressive work! Some serious dedication and focus!

I am going to read your Full Harness blog, as I think it will be very inspirational.

In your blog you mention the 3D sculpts of the Swiss for Steel Fist miniatures and that the sculptor has also released other work? Do you have a link or the name of the sculptor? I would love to see his other stuff as those Swiss renders look great!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: David H on January 15, 2023, 01:58:10 PM
Impressive!
It makes me want to get my 15th century stuff out, but I must stick to my queue!  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on January 15, 2023, 05:28:29 PM
Looking really good and I like the break away from the usual war of the roses conflict
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on January 15, 2023, 05:53:32 PM
Great work! The St. Denis livery coats really make them stand out against the Burgundians!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 16, 2023, 06:18:09 PM
Thanks all!

In your blog you mention the 3D sculpts of the Swiss for Steel Fist miniatures and that the sculptor has also released other work? Do you have a link or the name of the sculptor? I would love to see his other stuff as those Swiss renders look great!

I believe if you google 'Piano Wargames' you will find the answer... Though I cannot claim to be 100% certain of that, I do not speak for Steel Fist.

Looking really good and I like the break away from the usual war of the roses conflict

Of course, the continent provides much more interesting wargames ; )
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Tonhel on January 16, 2023, 06:58:56 PM
Aha, yes, I know Piano wargames. I backed his two latest kickstarters. His Napoleonics are fantastic. I didn't know those Swiss were his work. I wouldn't mind a range done by him for the Holy Roman Empire. The timeframe of Frederick III or Maximilian I. :-D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French heavy infantry (Jan 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 17, 2023, 06:28:46 PM
I wouldn't mind a range done by him for the Holy Roman Empire. The timeframe of Frederick III or Maximilian I. :-D

I also wouldn't mind that!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 12, 2023, 12:51:09 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Some more skirmishers

I've finished another small unit of skirmishing missile troops. As before, these are designed to be used as Germans or Swiss. Most of them feature 'kettle hats' in various Germanic forms.

(https://i.imgur.com/kYkZvOF.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/TU9b4ML.jpg)

They are a mix of some old miniatures painted years ago, a blend of Perry metals and plastics, with a few new ones added. Three of them are also 3D prints from the soon-to-be-released Warsteel Miniatures range, which at the time of writing is currently running as a kickstarter campaign (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/881082498/late-15th-century-medieval-gewalthaufen-0?ref=discovery_category_newest). I was kindly sent a few samples to try out.

(https://i.imgur.com/KFfnqmh.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/myuWHqr.jpg)

They scale well with Perry, as the picture below should demonstrate. Note that they don't come with integral bases, so I've glued them to 2mm Renedra bases first to compensate, and then these themselves are stuck to the unit bases.

(https://i.imgur.com/bjiPy9d.jpg)

Overall they are quite thin and delicate, especially the handguns, crossbows and feathers. They come with separate heads, which are very nice - one of the Perry figures here has also been given a new Warsteel head (the crossbowman with green sleeves). It's interesting to compare that particular head (a kettle hat with a scarf and feather) to a similar Perry one worn by the crossbowmen in the middle - the 3D prints allow for much finer details. The rim of the helmet is much sharper, the scarf is narrower, and the feathers are more delicate. This isn't better or worse in my view, just different! But they mix in just fine, and I will definitely be using a lot of these very useful heads extensively for upcoming units.

I now have three units of ten skirmishers each for the Burgundian/Hapsburg side, which is more than enough.

(https://i.imgur.com/8pjMgkJ.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: Captain Blood on February 12, 2023, 05:48:53 PM
Another great looking unit Charlie  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on February 12, 2023, 05:52:05 PM
Brill  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: Atheling on February 12, 2023, 06:09:08 PM
I think that they have more animation in the "dollies" than do the Perry sculpts- which, let's face it, is really saying something!  :o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: magyar on February 12, 2023, 06:30:25 PM
Ah, very nice! Indeed, the heads add a lot of variety, and make a lot of difference.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 12, 2023, 08:02:31 PM
Excellent work! The extra pose variety from the Warsteel bodies definitely goes a long way!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on February 13, 2023, 02:07:38 PM
Fantastic work, creat composition with the crossbowmen! I really like the way you do your bases! Which brand is the short static grass and the tufts you use ? Do you use a static grass applicator?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 13, 2023, 06:33:03 PM
Fantastic work, creat composition with the crossbowmen! I really like the way you do your bases! Which brand is the short static grass and the tufts you use ? Do you use a static grass applicator?

Thanks!

The static grass is from Army Painter, 'Steppe Grass', and no special gadget was used to apply it - just mashed into patches of PVA glue.
The tufts are Gamers Grass, I use a mix of three types - Dry, Dry Green and Autumn. I was a late convert to tufts, but I now believe they are the best thing ever!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more skirmishers (Feb 12th)
Post by: Tonhel on February 13, 2023, 09:17:01 PM
Very cool and inspirational!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 18, 2023, 10:53:34 AM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

A humble wagon

A change of pace now - here's a wagon.

(https://i.imgur.com/CIBgFMP.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/vcKAXxF.jpg)

I really enjoyed painting this. I've painted several of the Perry wagons in the past to make some 'wagon fort' bases, and found it a real hassle to be handling them as I paint them before they're glued down to the base. This is the first time I've done one complete with horse and handler, and decided I would just glue it all together on the base first and paint it as one piece. Definitely the way to go - any awkward-to-reach areas like the underside of the wagon aren't going to be seen anyway! Only the baggage I did separately and then glued on afterwards.

I've put off painting wagons for years, as it seems time spent on them is time that could be spent building up new units, which are of course always a priority. But now I've got enough completed units under my belt I'm going to spend some time on wagons of various sorts, which I see as terrain pieces for specific scenarios. Though this one is just more more or less put together straight from the box, I've got some plans for others to include limbered artillery, enough to form a whole baggage and artillery train, for various ambush and 'capture the guns' type scenarios. More on that in future posts!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on February 18, 2023, 11:11:26 AM
A brilliant thread, so much to love! Excellent work. 👍
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on February 18, 2023, 11:20:38 AM
That works well  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on February 18, 2023, 06:26:11 PM
Looks Great Charlie looking forward to seeing more wagons and more of the new 3d printed figures!. What manufacturer are your sacks?

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: Atheling on February 18, 2023, 06:31:21 PM
Looks Great Charlie looking forward to seeing more wagons and more of the new 3d printed figures!. What manufacturer are your sacks?

Just a guess, but they look like the Front Rank bags of arrows.
(https://www.grippingbeast.co.uk/userfiles/images/sys/products/EQ78.jpg)
Available from GB here:
https://www.grippingbeast.co.uk/EQ78_Sacks_Of_Arrows_4_Per_Pack--product--10002.html (https://www.grippingbeast.co.uk/EQ78_Sacks_Of_Arrows_4_Per_Pack--product--10002.html)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: Tonhel on February 20, 2023, 06:13:26 AM
Beautiful! :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A humble wagon (Feb 18th)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on February 20, 2023, 06:28:10 AM
Brilliant thank you Athelling
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 25, 2023, 10:59:02 AM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Assembling the baggage train

Work has commenced on putting together a full baggage train of carts, wagons and limbered artillery!

Something I've been considering whilst planning this is what 'story' do I want these figures to tell? Of course you can't go wrong with scattering some carts on the battlefield just for fun, but rather than having them being calmly unloaded, the wagoneers having a chat together.... I want them to appear as they would if they were actually on the battlefield, close to the action. The most obvious reason for them being there is if a marching column is being attacked, in some sort of ambush. So I want to try and model them as if they are under attack, with the wagoneers perhaps looking a bit panicky, some soldiers rushing about on the same bases maybe...

With that in mind I would probably prefer the horses in stationary poses rather than walking, but as there is a limited number of suitable draft horses in the Perry range, it's going to be a mix of both.

Here's three I've got assembled and in the painting queue. Two are from the Perry Wars of the Roses range of course, but the third is actually from their American War of Independence range (link (https://www.perry-miniatures.com/product/aw127-two-wheeled-tumbrel/)). As far as I can make out  cart and draft horse harness design didn't change much over the centuries, which means various 17th and 18th century carts, horses and wagons can be used for earlier periods. If anyone can point out any anachronisms here, I'd be interested to learn about it, but I won't be changing anything - I definitely think it's a case of 'close enough'! I swapped the WOTR and AWI horses around, just to blend things in better.

(https://i.imgur.com/thZ1Db9.jpg)

I'm going to need to convert multiple extra wagoneers. I glue them to the base in advance where they won't get in the way of painting, but some I'm keeping separate for now. I'm thinking I might use more than one per base.

(https://i.imgur.com/FMuJD6v.jpg)

I've also wanted some limbered artillery - the guns had to be transported somehow! This will also make the scenarios more interesting, the attackers trying to capture the artillery for their own use, or prevent it reaching a nearby siege. Simon Chick put together a great limbered gun which can be seen on his blog (link (https://je-lay-emprins.blogspot.com/2012/01/artillery-limber.html)). I'm daunted by the idea of modelling traces and such (the ropes that connect the horses to the limber or wagon), but equally wouldn't want to leave them out, so was curious if there was any evidence of simpler one-horse arrangements for transporting artillery.

I then found that the wonderful artist Graham Turner had depicted just such a thing in one of his more recent Wars of the Roses paintings. I don't know what his source for this is, but he clearly puts a lot of research behind his paintings, so if it's good enough for him it's certainly good enough for me!

(https://i.imgur.com/CtglW0f.jpg)

Simon has since pointed out to me that there are also similar one-horse arrangements depicted in the Swiss chronicles.

(https://i.imgur.com/Kg2aWhM.png)

To model this proved ever so simple - turning to the Perry AWI range again, it seems they have a limbered 'butterfly' gun that has a more or less identical arrangement (link (https://www.perry-miniatures.com/product/aw117-limbered-3-pdr-butterfly-with-horse-driver-and-2-continental-gunner-variants/)). It was just a case of replacing the gun with a suitable 15th century one - the one I chose comes from Old Glory. Handily this can be put together in the 'folded up' transport position, and also has a iron hoop which I was able to put a bit of plastic offcut through to represent a wooden pin. Clearly there would have to be some other form of attachment underneath though, as this pin alone wouldn't work by itself! Looks good though.

(https://i.imgur.com/q7WgAVc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/NMlKEY6.jpg)

I'm planning to do probably two more limbered guns and a big wagon, and will return to the AWI range for more parts. I'm still going to avoid the full four-horse setup to preserve my sanity, but the AWI range has some two-horse arrangements that I could make use of, and I'll try my hand at making some traces out of twisted wire. The reason the four-horse setup scares me is I'd want to glue it all together before painting, to avoid getting superglue all over the painted components when it comes to putting it together - I'd rather get the glue everywhere first, and then paint over it! With four horses that would be too tricky, but a two-horse limber or wagon could be done this way.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on February 25, 2023, 07:13:29 PM
Wow Charlie these look Great. This aspect of medeival miniatures interests me the most and i love that you will be telling a story with how you create your wagons.

There is an interesting picture from a re-enactment group which i will try and find and post, they are using a small wagon as the limber, i do not know if its accuarate but would be a cool and quick conversion. The Perry tilt wagon would be perfect for that! just needs a little hook and chain and then fill it with all the artillery equiptment.

Would you be able to use some thin wire for the ropes?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: MaleGriffin on February 25, 2023, 08:29:08 PM
Charlie, its only fair to tell you I'm stealing your ideas right, left and center! Fantastic work!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on February 25, 2023, 09:36:32 PM
Brilliant creativity, craftmenship and use of bits from various ranges to make your ideas come to life! A pleasure to read and watch :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: magyar on February 26, 2023, 06:39:00 AM
Charlie, what a great little project! Thanks for the write-up, most interesting.
This very welcome addition does add numerous opportunities scenario-wise.  In fact, I start thinking of a cart train myself  :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: Atheling on February 26, 2023, 07:12:12 AM
Some cracking imaginative work Charlie. The gun limber taken from the AWI carriage is inspired. A lovely, simple conversion; of course the art in such things is in the imagination that brings the creation into being.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: Captain Blood on February 27, 2023, 09:02:14 AM
Great stuff  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: Silent Invader on February 27, 2023, 09:36:13 AM
Great work on the wagon train Charlie. Your perseverance with this project and the results you are achieving are both most impressive.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Assembling the baggage train (Feb 25th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on February 27, 2023, 08:16:46 PM
These are brilliant!  :-* :-*
I especially like the gun limber one. I like these little vignette elements that bring everything to life. I wish I could spare a room to have a huge gaming table permanently set up.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 09, 2023, 09:10:33 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Baggage train part 2

Progress with the baggage train - a cart and the limbered artillery piece painted and based.

(https://i.imgur.com/vvnJYtA.jpg)

These two are designed to go together, the cart holding artillery equipment. I decided to put two wagoneers on the base, which I really like the look of.

The horses, cart and limber are a mix of Perry parts from both their Wars of the Roses and American War of Independence ranges. See the previous post for full details and my thoughts on how 15th century artillery could have been transported. The two cart crew are both Perry (one metal and one plastic), and the one on the artillery base is from Eureka Miniatures, with a slight arm conversion.

(https://i.imgur.com/UcQQ2ZV.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Zh1qzgJ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Yea2tdb.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/Wud4zO8.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on March 09, 2023, 09:51:48 PM
Very good  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on March 10, 2023, 07:17:28 AM
I like the artillery piece - well done. :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on March 10, 2023, 08:47:58 AM
Beautifully painted, the composition with the cart drivers on foot is brilliant!  :-* I love the muted natural colours and the smooth blending in your painting.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: bigredbat on March 10, 2023, 09:08:28 AM
Absolutely cracking!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on March 10, 2023, 02:31:32 PM
I love these pieces they add so much life
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: Captain Blood on March 10, 2023, 05:47:40 PM
Top job  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: Atheling on March 10, 2023, 06:06:11 PM
Smart work Charlie  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Baggage train part 2 (March 9th)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on March 12, 2023, 06:41:25 AM
Hi Charlie these look fantastic, I love the guy holding his helmet such a realistic pose, looking forward to more!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More carts.... (March 17th)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 17, 2023, 08:32:27 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Baggage train part 3

The baggage train grows... Two more carts.

(https://i.imgur.com/5FP1w6Y.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/GCKBcjm.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/897iQqI.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/iFOrWPj.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/78jdwqF.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More carts.... (March 17th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on March 18, 2023, 01:35:21 AM
They look great
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More carts.... (March 17th)
Post by: commissarmoody on March 18, 2023, 06:27:36 AM
Nice looking wagons you got there.. shame is some one tried to rob them.  :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - More carts.... (March 17th)
Post by: Metternich on March 18, 2023, 02:55:58 PM
Very nice indeed.  Glad to see you put the horse before the cart. lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A small update (April 5th)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 05, 2023, 08:16:09 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

A small update

I'm not working on any large units right now, for the first time in a while, so am taking the chance to paint up some little odds and ends that have been in the queue for some time.

Here's a few light cavalrymen which I've decided to base up individually. I originally planned to have two more units of mounted crossbowmen in standing poses, based like my other light cavalry, but changed my mind. Instead I'm going to be using them them as guards for the baggage train, or similar roles where they might just be set dressing rather than actually 'units'. I have several more like this in the queue. They are a good way to make use of the various horses in standing/walking poses from the metal Perry ranges.

The first two are both metal Perry 'scurrers', with headswaps and put on different horses. One has had his right hand replaced with a plastic crossbow hand. The other is empty-handed - I originally gave him a a crossbow slung from his belt, but I decided he worked better as just some sort of messenger or officer so I didn't reattach it after it broke off...

(https://i.imgur.com/gC83YAq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/MxofuDA.jpg)

The third one is a metal Italian crossbowman, but with a headswap making him Swiss or German. His horse is actually from the Perry Agincourt range.

(https://i.imgur.com/PL25Tx4.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/XY3dw2d.jpg)

I'd also like to mention a new product I've started using - AK Interactive Ultra Matt Varnish. I know I'm not the only one who has trouble getting matt varnishes to do what they say on the tin.... I've always used Winsor & Newton Professional Matt Varnish in a spray can, and it's USUALLY successful. But sometimes it just doesn't get things truly matt, especially on horseflesh for some reason - perhaps it's just more noticeable when it's a large expanse of one smooth colour? I've tried all sorts of different things, varying the number and thickness of coats, different spraying techniques, etc... Also tried the W&N brush-on equivalent but had zero success with that for some reason.

On a whim I ordered the AK Interactive Ultra Matt after seeing it recommended somewhere, and... it works! What I actually do now is my usual two coats of W&N spray, and then brush on the AK Interactive on spots where things still look a little too satin. It works, and also dries very quickly. I've even gone back to some older units and quickly slapped the AK onto some troublesome bits of satin-like horseflesh - instant success!

Nothing enhances the look of a carefully painted figure better than having it truly matted down, in my opinion. Once I've finished painting, the different colours all have varying degrees of glossiness. That final matt varnish layer is what finishes it off and pulls it all together, and suddenly makes it look good after too many hours of working on it. I can't get my head around it when people claim they don't varnish, or prefer a glossy look!!!

So yeah, I recommend this product.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A small update (April 5th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on April 06, 2023, 12:11:22 AM
Oh nice! Thanks for the recommendation! Finding a varnish that doesn't make everything really glossy is always a nightmare!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A small update (April 5th)
Post by: tomrommel1 on April 06, 2023, 06:01:57 AM
Very nice additions
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A small update (April 5th)
Post by: Captain Blood on April 06, 2023, 08:40:46 AM
Lovely little creations  :)

Will give the AKI varnish a go. I like their weathering effects. Their paints I find a bit thick. Haven’t tried the varnish, but will give it a go.
I find W&N Galeria brush-on matt varnish generally pretty reliable, but always up for a new recommendation :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A small update (April 5th)
Post by: SirGromit1879 on April 07, 2023, 05:03:25 PM
Lovely painted and selected figure Charlie, thank you for the tip on varnish will pick both the W&N and the AK up
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Comparing washes (April 10th)
Post by: Charlie_ on April 10, 2023, 10:20:07 AM
Comparing washes

I've written a post about comparing different manufacturer's brands of dark wash after Citadel seemingly changed the formula of their popular 'Nuln Oil'.

Read all about it on the blog - https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

(https://i.imgur.com/QmPCD0m.png)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Comparing washes (April 10th)
Post by: Atheling on April 10, 2023, 11:02:00 AM
Nice one Charlie, I'll give it a read later today.

For those who may not know, you can make any wash out of any good quality acrylic paint simply by mixing the paint with Matt Medium, Acrylic Retarder and water. That is essentially what you're buying when you buy a "wash" but with the added bonus of it drying at a slower pace (Retarder.) being able to choose what colour (or mix of colours) you wish the wash to be and controlling how "matt" a "finish" you want by adding different amounts of Matt Medium. Simples :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Comparing washes (April 10th)
Post by: Harry Faversham on April 10, 2023, 01:45:08 PM
 Simples, bleedin' simples!!!???
That little lot sounds complicated as fook!

 :o
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 14, 2023, 07:51:30 PM
I got some of the new dollies released by Steel Fist, and sculpted by this forum's very own Captain Harlock.

https://www.steelfistminiatures.com/product-category/later-medieval-1460-1490/

Here are the first creations!

(https://i.imgur.com/iImfLXS.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/R8sYlnl.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/UCHqZY0.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: commissarmoody on May 14, 2023, 09:43:20 PM
Well done.   :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 14, 2023, 09:57:14 PM
Ah amazing! Definitely looking forward to getting my hands on some of these!

Looking forward to seeing these painted up!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: Muzfish4 on May 15, 2023, 11:38:48 AM
Steel Fist are brilliant! Lovely work on the latest additions to your collection.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: vodkafan on May 15, 2023, 10:29:05 PM
Do Steel Fist fit with Front Rank? Not really interested in Perry Medievals, sorry and all that.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: Atheling on May 16, 2023, 04:21:44 AM
Do Steel Fist fit with Front Rank? Not really interested in Perry Medievals, sorry and all that.

Personally i would say no, Front Rank are bulkier though i realaise at the end of the day it's all about taste.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - New Steel Fist dollies (May 14th)
Post by: Captain Harlock on May 16, 2023, 01:54:42 PM
I cant wait to see them painted!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more light horsemen... (May 21st)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 21, 2023, 12:15:31 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Some more light horsemen

Here's a few more singly-based light horsemen, which like the previous three could be used as baggage train guards, scouts, or just general set dressing on the table. One wears a French livery jacket, the others are all generic and can be used for either side.

Again they are all a mix of metal and plastic Perry parts - the horses are all metal, and two of them are actually from the Agincourt range. All have had headswaps, and two of the heads actually 3D prints from Warsteel Miniatures.

I've got two with drawn swords which I think will look good defending the baggage train, for scenarios where attacking or capturing it can be an objective. I'll do a few more such figures over time, including a few on foot.

And the other two are mounted crossbowmen. I'm particularly pleased with the pose of the one on the stationary horse!

(https://i.imgur.com/QuhJC9I.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/fPRP9IC.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/f31VnCt.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/XJblUJN.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/c6SK71C.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more light horsemen... (May 21st)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on May 22, 2023, 09:40:29 AM
Great work! These are really effective poses, and the Warsteel heads fit in perfectly!

It's a shame the Perrys don't sell separate packs of the Agincourt mounted sergeant horses, they're some of the best horses in their range!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more light horsemen... (May 21st)
Post by: Charlie_ on May 22, 2023, 06:03:34 PM
Great work! These are really effective poses, and the Warsteel heads fit in perfectly!

Yes I have warmed to them, the face in the open sallet helm really came out well I think.

Quote
It's a shame the Perrys don't sell separate packs of the Agincourt mounted sergeant horses, they're some of the best horses in their range!

Yes they are good - some of them are clearly the same basic horse as some of the WOTR metal light cavalry ones but with different harness (and incidentally they are a bit skinnier), but the walking/standing poses aren't featured in the WOTR range.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some more light horsemen... (May 21st)
Post by: Tonhel on May 23, 2023, 07:38:16 AM
Lovely work!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space... (July 24th)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 24, 2023, 08:08:25 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

A new hobby space

It's been a couple of months since the last update, and I haven't done much painting in that time. The reason being that I've moved house.

And of course the most exciting thing about that is I now have a dedicated 'hobby room'. I'm very pleased with how it's laid out - I was worried that perhaps everything wouldn't fit as I'd envisioned, but turns out the opposite is true - I've got lots of room still to fill up. So we've got some display cabinets and other shelving, a spacious painting area with all paints and tools close to hand, a separate table for a laptop and a photography area, and lots of room for future storage. Not bad, huh?

All it needs to complete it is some Graham Turner prints on the walls!

(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEiiv_0P2NTh-vPeu4BgdtUC8eUTMq2AbSHGKhWftvH68MD1Zg_PiBS6ARYw4xS19mWmzOgPs6uYzU7nIAUxP7xw1_SaPOYWIS4M2x3bLLOI3bWExn3M5BImHsWcuACDB8wATEPgrwbavXD7OwBIKV4ESvdK6YDBEoIPEdZk3fZmwOME81WBOLbbkW0fedY/s2000/room1.JPG)

(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEi8vdgUjMUZXtG46wtf3uZDtspV_IWJp7juXe_cxmvNCsP2F2JN_S3f_OilrXie2u01pYUM0nP7ODLOvnNXq3PWRf6c7ZZLl1rCcmnf4SQZL2nJYo0k2lv2KxgAvCtJ1dDWWbYGza5SY3wGycdQIRvE4fUdqdb7N8XNpAVD00cKPg1Yl79Iljk-_fMQ9hE/s2000/room2.JPG)

(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEghmYRTb2x63GrhUF69zXYMF4WlG4PUL4vXGRY9cQxG3gOAAQ3TsPx-GCrlo9_XWFnnc78mb3ojVhBSSZ3oF_YBzpeTFNY6dpaEnjo_VsG4LNYpB7hM3vAzZrxNQoquL0RqsQxN8M2wkaiogabFQxE-oIwJiaplENSd-j2Xbp23HYZ3sV58F0GucPA2TWI/s2000/room3.JPG)

Of course there's not room for gaming in here. That is what the garage / workshop is for.... More on that in the future!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Codsticker on July 24, 2023, 09:56:19 PM
That looks terribly civilised... and suspiciously tidy. ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Atheling on July 24, 2023, 10:12:07 PM
That looks terribly civilised... and suspiciously tidy. ;)

Creation is the art of destruction!  lol

You have a very lovely space there and one to be proud of.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: commissarmoody on July 25, 2023, 01:53:32 AM
Great looking hobby space. I am trying to set mine up as well.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Muzfish4 on July 25, 2023, 07:19:28 AM
That is indeed a nice looking space. My experience is that no matter how much space you think you have it's surprisingly easy to fill up, though you look way more organised than I will ever be.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on July 25, 2023, 07:58:41 AM
That's a great looking space! Definitely jealous of how well organised it is!  :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Captain Blood on July 25, 2023, 10:17:46 AM
Jolly nice Charlie  8)
And very tidy - like your modelling and painting!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Captain Harlock on July 25, 2023, 06:54:07 PM
Thats a really nice attic space there, maybe in need of a touch of Chaos  lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - A new hobby space (July 24)
Post by: Charlie_ on July 26, 2023, 05:30:15 AM
Don't worry everybody, once I've had a chance to start using it, it'll soon end up nicely cluttered and chaotic!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: Charlie_ on October 23, 2023, 10:20:40 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

On the (new) workbench...

It's been a few months again, but here's a small update to show you what I've been working on.

First of all, it's really a game-changer to have a new dedicated hobby room, and a desk with all my tools, brushes, paints and everything else I need right in front of me!

(https://i.imgur.com/Jp5rJK9.jpg)

So what's on the new workbench? I've been getting back into painting infantry figures for upcoming units - the plan is to have several new units of both French and Burgundians, in both advancing/attacking and standing/defending poses. Most of what follows are for the first French unit. I'll show you some of the current highlights, most of which are conversions of some form or other. I'm also really pleased with how my painting has been progressing in terms of neatness and consistency, and the colours I'm using. Having said that, one batch of these did have a bit of a strange experience with my spray primer - it gave them quite a rough texture for some reason, which is most notable on the helmets and other metallic parts on a few of them.

First off, this is a pair of conversions I'm really pleased with. Perry plastics, with new riding boots sculpted on, along with new mail shirts beneath their livery jackets. I didn't do the sculpting myself, they were a commission job, and It's not the first time I've had these same conversions done. These two though look just right I think - the idea is for them to be well-equipped dismounted 'archers' or coustilliers of the compagnies d'ordonnance. The arms of the sword-and-buckler one were created from cutting and re-combining different plastic pieces.

(https://i.imgur.com/cqa3TjC.jpg)

Next, some Perry plastics with 3D-printed heads from the Warsteel Miniatures Swiss kickstarter that ran last year. They are a good match as you can see.

(https://i.imgur.com/jbNy1Rs.jpg)

Two more sword-and-buckler men. The one on the right uses arms from the Agincourt set (plus another 3D-printed head), the one on the left is simply a metal standard bearer with a buckler instead of a flag in his left hand.

(https://i.imgur.com/CzfIWfE.jpg)

Next up are some examples of the bodies which were sculpted by Talos Miniatures, which since earlier this year have been available in metal from Steel Fist Miniatures. They were designed to be combined with Perry plastic heads and arms, as I've done here (though one of the heads is actually from Steel Fist). Another sword-and-buckler man using the same arm conversions from the first pic. These are very nice sculpts, and it's been great to finally get some paint on them. They are full of excellent detail, just look at those buckles!

(https://i.imgur.com/QePKYCR.jpg)

A couple of metal standard bearers next.... The one on the left has one of my swappable heraldic banners, the one on the right is yet to receive his flag.

(https://i.imgur.com/IADdVpj.jpg)

And a couple of metal polearm men, both with headswaps (of course). The one on the left is a conversion I've done once before - he originally had a shouldered weapon, but new hands and turning his head to the left gives him a new pose and role.

(https://i.imgur.com/kAumS4m.jpg)

These are two plastics conversions I did years back, and they're being rebased to fit into the new units. Leg swaps - quite easy to do with plastics, giving them both new poses.

(https://i.imgur.com/94xSXql.jpg)

And finally another leg-swap conversion, this time a metal figure from Eureka given new plastic legs, to change him from an advancing to stationary pose. This one must be where the primer mishap is most evident.... let's just say his armour is unpolished, rough from the hammer!

(https://i.imgur.com/l1w7Jo5.jpg)

There should be some more updates between now and Christmas, with some quite exciting news I'm keen to share soon, and these figures will be getting based into their units before too long!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on October 23, 2023, 10:31:57 PM
Nicely done  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: Captain Harlock on October 23, 2023, 11:49:48 PM
Great painting and kitbashing, I’m super happy to see my sculpts being put to good use!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: commissarmoody on October 24, 2023, 02:41:51 PM
They all look great. Where did you pick up that spear on the last figure?
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: Atheling on October 24, 2023, 05:47:51 PM
Nice work charlie  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: bigredbat on October 24, 2023, 09:34:50 PM
All rather splendid!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: magyar on October 25, 2023, 04:46:52 PM
Charlie,
Lovely conversions, great poses! I especially liked the sword-and-buckler guy sporting riding boots.
And - green with envy re. your workbench  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: Ethelred the Almost Ready on October 25, 2023, 05:59:39 PM
Thanks for posting these, Charlie.  The conversions work well and the painting is beautiful.  These will help inspire me for my own project.  But I don't think your tidy room will inspire me to tidy my own room just yet!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - On the (new) workbench (Oct 23)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on October 26, 2023, 08:22:52 AM
Great work! The conversions work great, especially for the sword-and-buckler men!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 19, 2023, 09:56:41 AM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

I commissioned some miniatures!

Exciting news - I have commissioned a set of miniatures, and just a few days ago they arrived.

These were sculpted by the very talented Yannis from Talos Miniatures in Greece - you can follow his work on his Instagram page here (https://www.instagram.com/talos.miniatures/). I'm not the only one who has commissioned sculpts from him - there are various other interesting late 15th century and early 16th century things he's working on. He also made the bodies released earlier this year by Steel Fist Miniatures, designed to be compatible with Perry plastic heads and arms. These were of course what gave me and others the idea of commissioning similar things. He was extremely easy to work with, and I'm pleased to say what we have here isn't the end of our collaboration!

They are cast in resin, which is actually something I haven't worked with before. It holds the detail very well, better than metal - I think I'm going to be enjoy working with and painting it.

What I wanted was more infantry equipped with polearms. I decided the best way to go was for full bodies with arms, empty-handed to accept various different weapons. We didn't do any heads, as of course I have a ton of spare plastic Perry heads to use with them. Separate heads would have been wonderful, but I decided for my budget to go for more bodies instead.

Yannis made several polearms - I wanted them mostly to be glaives of various shapes, which is what I got, plus a couple of more unusual weapons! You will notice something interesting about the polearms - they are cast in resin but with a thin metal rod inside to strengthen them. As you know, metal spears bend, and I didn't want resin weapons to bend or snap or anything like that. This way of doing it seems to make them really robust and strong.

We also got separate sidearms - swords (including a couple of falchions/messers) and a few bucklers.

So here are the nine finished miniatures, combined with plastic Perry heads.

(https://i.imgur.com/f4Sigyf.jpg)

Three are in front rank poses, and six are 'second-rankers'. Of course the idea is to mix these in with Perry miniatures (and other things) in large units, and I will be mixing the parts between the different ranges more than we see here - these polearms will also end up in Perry hands for example.

There's lots more I could say about them, but I think I'll just let the pictures speak for themselves!!!

(https://i.imgur.com/yhyTVvs.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/S81NWyL.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/B0kDoTP.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/dqb0FEo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/zHymmE2.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/UCtae7X.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/IvJIzcf.jpg)

I'll have a more detailed post about them in a week perhaps, and with a bit of luck I'll get some paint on them before Christmas!

(https://i.imgur.com/NQz8bnv.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Jack Jones on November 19, 2023, 03:57:42 PM
Fabulous!

We all want them, of course! 😋

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: commissarmoody on November 19, 2023, 06:53:58 PM
They look awesome. I also just got my commissioned bellows faced sallets from Talos on Thursday. And I'll eco that they looks nice and crisp.

Can't wait to get started on them.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Atheling on November 19, 2023, 07:00:01 PM
Brilliant stuff Charlie- I thought you had been quiet  ;) 8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on November 19, 2023, 09:04:05 PM
These look amazing! Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Captain Harlock on November 20, 2023, 01:00:12 AM
I’m really glad that you were satisfied with the result! I really enjoyed sculpting these guys and I really can’t wait to see them in a battle line.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: magyar on November 20, 2023, 04:45:08 AM
Absolutely gorgeous! Definitely a welcome addition. Love the polearms solution, and do wish these were available commercially (as well as the figurines themselves, of course)  ;)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Charlie_ on November 20, 2023, 10:31:31 PM
Glad you all like them! It's been great fun designing them with Yannis (Captain Harlock) and seeing them come to life. There might just be some more on the way too....
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Ethelred the Almost Ready on November 25, 2023, 05:37:52 PM
Great looking miniatures.  You and Captain Harlock must be very proud.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: GulKelan on November 25, 2023, 06:30:58 PM
absolutly beautiful sculpts! also the white casting material looks awesome - reminds me of sculptures of the renisance.

Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - I commissioned some miniatures! (Nov 19)
Post by: Captain Harlock on November 27, 2023, 10:29:37 PM
absolutly beautiful sculpts! also the white casting material looks awesome - reminds me of sculptures of the renisance.

Its resin and its a very light grey, although you can add any color you want really.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Painted samples of commissioned sculpts (Dec 28)
Post by: Charlie_ on December 28, 2023, 07:06:45 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

First painted samples

Just a quick post before the new year - here's some samples from the first batch of commissioned sculpts I've got some paint on. These will be being based up into a unit of 20 over the next few days.

Two of them have plastic Perry heads, one has a 3D printed Warsteel head. The polearms are all from the commission, as are two of the sidearms, the third being Perry with a Front Rank buckler.

(https://i.imgur.com/rRyFPSX.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 01, 2024, 07:04:04 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

French infantry reinforcements

At last, here's another 'proper' unit. More French heavy infantry.

(https://i.imgur.com/lYppjoi.jpg)

This unit is 20-strong and in stationary/defensive poses, whereas the last one was 30-strong in advancing/attacking poses. These two methods of basing seems to work well, and is what I'll stick to from now on for close order infantry - advancing units in three or more ranks, and defending units like this one  and all my archer units in just two ranks. I'm part way through another unit like this for the Burgundian side, and there will be more bases to expand them both in different ways in the future.

This unit features the three painted examples of my commissioned sculpts I showed the other day - more of them will be appearing in future infantry units! As you can see they fit in very well alongside Perry sculpts (helped by the fact that they mostly are using Perry plastic heads). One of the other bodies is also from the same sculptor, one of the 'dollies' which is now sold by Steel Fist Miniatures. There's also three of the original Steel Fist foot knights in the unit. There's various other conversions in here, but I think I've shown the most interesting ones previously. My favourites are the two plastic Perrys with new riding boots. I put special care in to how all the figures are positioned in the units, so the most interesting ones are in prime positions for photography - I don't want them to get lost in the middle of all their less interesting friends!

This unit is supposed to represent a somewhat informal grouping of French soldiers - dismounted men-at-arms and others from the ordonnance companies, grouped together with francs-archers and other lower-ranking types. I think I prefer this approach to having them all in separate units. After basing them I felt there was a bit too much empty space at a certain place in the unit, so filled it with a solitary pavise, which I think has worked quite nicely!

I've given them two flags - one is an ordonnance company standard, the other a heraldic banner which can be swapped out to represent different nobles - currently the unit is under the command of Jean du Bellay, who was captain of an ordonnance company in 1475 (and I'm presuming was still there from 1477 onwards).

(https://i.imgur.com/La6ZNjm.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/70pDCBr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/dVbibrv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/DcZZXoQ.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/S6IbT4y.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: RedRowan on January 02, 2024, 08:41:00 PM
The early painted samples already looked great but the whole unit together is something else. Fantastic work on these.

Steve
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: magyar on January 03, 2024, 05:47:58 AM
Charlie,
That's one mean looking unit :-)
Very nice work indeed, quite menacing and convinving lads with sharp iron, Love the unioirmed look of the ranks. And the new addittions fit in perfectly.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Griefbringer on January 03, 2024, 12:45:49 PM
I particularly like the sword and buckler man placed on the key spot on right flank!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Atheling on January 03, 2024, 02:48:58 PM
Fab stuff Charlie- very impressive  :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Captain Blood on January 03, 2024, 05:47:50 PM
Another super looking unit Charlie. Great job.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Silent Invader on January 03, 2024, 06:29:15 PM
Great stuff Charlie  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 03, 2024, 06:30:46 PM
Lovely  :)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - French infantry reinforcements! (Jan 1)
Post by: Charlie_ on January 03, 2024, 09:30:32 PM
Thank you all.

I particularly like the sword and buckler man placed on the key spot on right flank!

Yes he is one of my favourite conversions, so he had to have the 'place of honour'!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Updates! (Feb 21)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 21, 2024, 09:08:52 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Updates

ime for some updates.

First of all, I'd like to point you in the direction of a kickstarter currently being run by Warsteel Miniatures for late 15th century infantry STL files, for 3d prinitng. This is part 2 of a series, part 1 last year was unarmoured infantry (pikemen, crossbowmen and handgunners). Part 2 has armoured versions, with a mix of plate and cloth armour. Simon from Warsteel kindly sent me some samples, which I have enjoyed experimenting with. They come with separate heads - I've put a few together with a mix of different heads and polearms from various sources. They will definitely find their way into future units of French and Burgundians.

The kickstarter also has the same bodies without arms, for combining with plastic Perry arms of course. There are other things listed as stretch goals, so the more people who pledge the more interesting things will be unlocked.

Support the kickstarter here - https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/warsteelkickstarter2/late-15th-century-medieval-gewalthaufen-part-2?ref=user_menu

I confess I'm not very up to date with 3D miniature printing technology, but as I understand it you get the files which you can either print yourself or get a 3rd party service to print for you. You can also get all the files from the 1st kickstarter, which together will give you a huge number of bodies (with and without arms), a multitude of separate heads and other things like polearms and casualties. Once the dust has settled I'll probably do some some of 'pick & mix' of the files I'll want printed for my project.

Here are the samples I've put together so far.

(https://i.imgur.com/oDYXSfq.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/vtQfUzQ.jpg)

I should also point out in case anyone reading this didn't catch the announcement, that Steel Fist Miniatures have released a small range of 15th century Swiss - two packs of 6 advancing halberdiers/pikemen, and they really are fantastic. Though at the time of writing this the first batch are nearly out of stock!

(https://www.steelfistminiatures.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/77819B3D-55C5-47F6-8DD7-D6D3BFD1FE80_1_201_a-scaled.jpeg)

As for what's on my workbench, I am slowly working my way through a mass of infantry, and imagine I will be doing nothing else for the rest of 2024. I've roughly mapped out what units are going to be built up from them, and it does seem a bit daunting... I've got a few more commissioned sculpts to be delivered sometime in the year, and some of these units will have to wait until I have these in my hands before they can be assembled and based. Until then I will just keep on painting what I have.

This is my rough plan....

- Two units of 20 French heavy infantry, defending (first one completed in January, see last post)
- Two units of 20 Burgundian heavy infantry, defending (first one nearly finished)
- One unit of 30 French heavy infantry, attacking
- One unit of 30 Burgundian heavy infantry, attacking
- One unit of 20 French archers
- One unit of 20 or 30 Burgundian archers.
- Various extra bases that can be used to expand the above units or form small units themselves.
- Some 'wagon fort' bases with built in defenders, for both sides.
- One unit of 50 German pikemen.

There's no way I'll get it all done this year, but we'll see how far I get!

Here's a few nice figures that are sitting around waiting for some friends to form units with. The one one the left is one of my commissioned sculpts, with a Perry head. The second is a conversion put together form various parts. The last two are from the small but excellent Eureka Miniatures late medieval range - very nice sculpts.

(https://i.imgur.com/EsLZtQJ.jpg)

And before I forget, here's another French unit!

This is just a small unit. I like my units to be consistent poses, usually either advancing/attacking or defending, with weapons lowered. I don't like to see ranks of models with shouldered weapons making contact with the enemy on the tabletop, it just looks odd to me. However there are lots of very nice figures in more relaxed 'at ease' poses, and I've been wanting to find a way to make use of them for a while. I've bunched some of them together with a few other carefully chosen poses that suit the theme.

When seen on the tabletop, this little unit will probably be seen standing behind a hedge, wall or barricade, where lowered weapons would get in the way. They could also work as artillery or wagon guards maybe.... They won't be front line troops, but there'll be a use for them on the table somewhere, even if it's just to stand around looking smart!

(https://i.imgur.com/FAlkrhb.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/yPE9QBw.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/YgeSZOT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/lBIXpnd.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/VH2yN2Z.jpg)


Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Updates! (Feb 21)
Post by: Dr. Zombie on February 22, 2024, 08:01:06 AM
Well 90% of all battles is standing around waiting. Hurry up and wait has been true for all soldiers from antiquity until today. I think the unit looks great.

The warsteel 3d miniatures are great! I backed the first kickstarter and I am also on board for the second. I am using them to create a peasant army.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Updates! (Feb 21)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 23, 2024, 12:25:06 AM
The new unit looks great! Having some scruffier reserves on the table really adds to the immersion!

The planned infantry definitely sounds like a huge task! Looking forward to seeing the results!

3D Printing is still a bit of a mystery to me, so I'm curious how the new Warsteel figures will look in the other units
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Charlie_ on February 28, 2024, 06:17:44 PM
https://fullharness.blogspot.com/

Some long-awaited Burgundians!

It seems all the units being finished lately have been French, and looking back at the infantry available to my Burgundian army, technically they are all German mercenaries or reluctant urban militias.... Now at last we have some true Burgundians on foot!

(https://i.imgur.com/1pRW4nh.jpg)

These could represent the personal retinue of some Burgundian noble.... or rather, some noble who at the time these photos was allying himself to Mary and Maximilian - many of them were quick to make friends with King Louis after being captured and offered lots of generous gifts! The exact makeup of the 'Burgundian' troops for the 1477-1493 period is hard to pin down, especially when you consider many towns were found on the ever-shifting border between the Burgundian lands and France, and many nobles held property on both sides of this border. Maximilian did raise new ordonnance companies from 1477 onwards, and this unit could represent some of these newly re-organised troops (perhaps veterans of Charles the Bold's wars) dismounted for combat.

I've given them a blue and red livery with a white St Andrew's cross, making them the most uniform unit so far on Maximilian's side. The standard is from Alea Jacta Est, who makes lots of interesting late medieval flags available for free on his website (LINK (https://flagspennonsandbanners.blogspot.com/)) - I'm not sure of the source of this flag, I think it's another 'unknown owner' situation, but that suits me fine as I don't want this unit to be tied to any one known character.

Again its mostly converted Perry miniatures, but with several of my own commissioned figures and a few other things - there's even a Front Rank and an Old Glory sculpt in there, suitable converted to 'Perry-fy' them.

(https://i.imgur.com/uVDosPf.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/nXHweDM.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/HC9LY74.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/siOyaDd.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/NkG0are.jpg)


And here they are facing off against their French opponents!

(https://i.imgur.com/VKnzRHk.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/VdZnEkI.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/dPbU7ED.jpg)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Old Hob on February 28, 2024, 10:47:30 PM
I really like them (both Burgundians and French). There's a nice balance between a crisp paint job while having the armour looked lived-in. Really nice.
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: HappyChappy439 on February 29, 2024, 01:00:05 PM
These look great! Once again the mix of ranges and Perry-fied figures looks amazing, the effort with converting them really pays off!

Thanks for the link to the blog with the banners as well, that's extremely helpful! Painting the banners by hand can be pretty excruciating towards the end of the 15th century!  lol
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 01, 2024, 06:26:25 PM
Thank you both!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Wellington Bonaparte on March 01, 2024, 08:59:31 PM
Fabulous painting! The Burgundians are gorgeous, do you paint the saltire by hand or they a transfer? Look so uniform, brilliant stuff   :-*
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: RedRowan on March 02, 2024, 08:45:25 AM
Another great looking unit. Really like those shots of them facing their opponents.

Steve
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: MaleGriffin on March 02, 2024, 04:59:02 PM
Beautifully painted troops! Well done siir!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Captain Blood on March 03, 2024, 10:54:20 PM
All very splendid Charlie  :-*

Right then, down to brass tacks. How many have you done in total now? You must be into the thousands  8)
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Captain Harlock on March 04, 2024, 07:40:32 PM
They all look so great together. I have to admit that I feel very proud of our boys. They used to be a small ball of clay and now they threat people with glaives  :'(
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Basementboy on March 04, 2024, 10:47:34 PM
Fantastic work! Absolutely gorgeous paint job :D
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Charlie_ on March 06, 2024, 10:33:04 AM
All very splendid Charlie  :-*

Right then, down to brass tacks. How many have you done in total now? You must be into the thousands  8)

Hmm not quite, let's total it up in my head now...
100 heavy cav
50 light cav
90 pike
80 archers
100 heavy infantry
30 skirmishers
5 artillery

So that's 150 cavalry, 300 infantry. Plus multiple command bases.

So only a few hundred. I know others who are into the thousands in this period, in 28mm!


They all look so great together. I have to admit that I feel very proud of our boys. They used to be a small ball of clay and now they threat people with glaives  :'(

They fit in perfectly with all their Perry cousins!
Title: Re: Charlie's 15th century - Some long-overdue Burgundians! (Feb 28)
Post by: Silent Invader on March 06, 2024, 10:40:25 AM
That’s a great collection Charlie. Up there with the very best.