Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Future Wars => Topic started by: OSHIROmodels on November 18, 2019, 08:39:00 AM
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For those that have seen it or that can’t wait, here’s the place for the Mandalorian discussion.
Spoil away :D
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I think there is a joy to it that’s nice to see.
They aren’t trying to prove anything. Just having some fun.
The IG droid is there for no purpose other than to be cool, and the whole bit with the sandcrawler is there largely just to play with a sand crawler.
It’s good stuff.
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Think IG-11 was the best thing of the series so far, after seeing him in action, I would love to see more, or even better see something focused on IG-88
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The way IG-11 wobbles a bit at the end of each move like cheap animatronics is genius.
The kind of sight gag you can’t just put in a script.
It shows there is creative vision is what I am saying. Someone wanted the droid to look and move like that. It’s why he’s there.
If they can keep on doing the live action samurai jack thing I am very much down for it.
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So far so good. Like a Spaghetti western.
I think some of the hype is a bit unwarranted. It is good, but it's not amazingly so, not that it needs to be.
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The way IG-11 wobbles a bit at the end of each move like cheap animatronics is genius.
The kind of sight gag you can’t just put in a script.
It shows there is creative vision is what I am saying. Someone wanted the droid to look and move like that. It’s why he’s there.
If they can keep on doing the live action samurai jack thing I am very much down for it.
I got a real Samurai Jack Vibe as well.
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My favourite genre is ‘Sci Fi Western but Not Naff’ which is really difficult to define. I don’t want robots in cowboy hats, but I do want robots that feel like cowboys. These two episodes have been some of my favourite star wars things ever. It’s daft and I love it.
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I was really sad that IG gone down. I liked that panicky and conciliatory droid a lot.
And I agree mood is great.
I am a little let down by mid episode (act 2?). in both there was slow down and monster of the week fight.
While I am ok with slowdowns I dont like monster of the wek approach. Would prefer mercenary enemy of the week or something non combat at all
But overall i really like the vive
And I like characters silence
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Anyone else get a Indiana Jones vibe when he was trying to get on the sandcrawler? Loved the Jawas in episode 2.
"I have spoken" lol
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Really enjoying it so far
Am I the only one who liked to see the Jawas getting their just deserts
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Anyone else get a Indiana Jones vibe when he was trying to get on the sandcrawler? Loved the Jawas in episode 2.
"I have spoken" lol
I got several vibes from it.
The Big Country when James McKay tames a cranky old horse is an example. There are others too.
The Jawas in episode 2 were good, but it was a horrible plot for that one. Not good. I didn't like how easily they became favourable after having so many of their number slaughtered.
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Watched episodes 1 & 2 last night with the wife. We both enjoyed it, though I was
studying the scenery. Will definitely watch more. 'That is acceptable'
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Really enjoying it so far
Am I the only one who liked to see the Jawas getting their just deserts
Nope, little devils deserved what they got ;)
I have to say that I really like this show so far.
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If you do not mind spoilers Angry Joe does good reviews of the episodes.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9dnWCYKSZhc
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Mando shot the guy right in the beskar steel.
Good flex.
And the guy flying on the jet pack next to the ship at the end.
I really do get the impression they are having a lot of fun with this.
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.....and no one has mentioned Baby Yoda yet! ;) Loved the genius part where Mando finds the knob missing from the control lever, then at the end when Baby Yoda is reaching for it, pulls it off for him to play with. Great scene!
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This is the way. :D
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It's daft and full of plot holes. It's great.
Only thing I'm not 100% with is the dodgy Glen A Larson soundtrack
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Only thing I'm not 100% with is the dodgy Glen A Larson soundtrack
I find it humable.
https://youtu.be/SiGd8k55mWk
Don’t you get the urge to... *walk* somewhere with that playing in the background?
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I've been thinking a lot about the music. I wasn't initially sold on it but I think I've come around. I like that it's not relying on the Star Wars films.
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The soundtrack has a lot of character in itself, I think. Very "Mandalorian".
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I saw the first 3 episodes... it's pretty good so far.
I really liked Pascal in Narcos. Even with his mask on all the time, he seems to have a certain "presence" on the screen...
I also like Brian Posehn (Bert in The Big Bang Theory)... but the poor guy is killed almost right away in the 1st episode... lol
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Really enjoying this but does every town need to look like Moss eisley?
And every planet Tatooine?
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Really enjoying this but does every town need to look like Moss eisley?
And every planet Tatooine?
Did you watch the latest episode? Because it sounds like you haven't.
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Did you watch the latest episode? Because it sounds like you haven't.
I have missed some Ewoks, in fact...
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I have missed some Ewoks, in fact...
You need to aim better.
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I enjoyed Episode 4. Good to see a nod to galactic events and even better to see the Scout Walker.
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Did you watch the latest episode? Because it sounds like you haven't.
I am only on episode 3?Does anybody know how long a series it is?
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I believe it's 8 episodes for the first season
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I'm really hoping ep 4 was a low point rather than the direction it is heading. Nothing wrong per se but hardly original.....
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I'm really hoping ep 4 was a low point rather than the direction it is heading. Nothing wrong per se but hardly original.....
Absolutely loved this episode for that very reason:)
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The big problem with Episode 4 is that traditionally there are 7 defenders of the the town against the Japanese or Mexican or whatever they were bandits.
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I'm really hoping ep 4 was a low point rather than the direction it is heading. Nothing wrong per se but hardly original.....
Which parts that you have seen so far have been particularly original?
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Finally watched Episode 5. The series visits Tattooine at last and this feels like a homage to the original film.
Cantina - Yep
Tuskan Raiders - Yep
Dewback - Yep
Familiar looking droids - Yep
I did enjoy this episode :)
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Much preferred this one. Could have easily gone the other way
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Didn't mind ep.4.
I mean, the entire character appears to be based around Clint Eastwood in a western. Mando with no name?
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Really liked No 5
Does anybody know where the art work on the credits comes from ?
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Is that not the Doug Chang/Ralph Mcquarrie Stuff? I imagine they’ll make a book you can buy of the concept art from the series. They did that with all of the films.
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I liked 6th a lot.. Second best after the first IMHO.
He could be made better by killing the bastards but I guess he has to be a good guy and not that ruthless (he is only to droids pg13 thing :) and they spared him anyway.
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I liked 6th a lot.. Second best after the first IMHO.
Agreed, but overall I got more and more disappointed.
True Star Wars in the look and feel, but where is the overall storyarc?
For 6 Episodes surprisingly little happened!!!
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Agreed, but overall I got more and more disappointed.
True Star Wars in the look and feel, but where is the overall storyarc?
For 6 Episodes surprisingly little happened!!!
It was supposed to be a limited 8 episodes show, but, with all the fuss created by "baby Yoda" on the net, maybe they decided to do further seasons... Let's hope not as this always results in diluted storyline and increasingly bad episodes... >:(
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It was really supposed to be 8 episodes only ?
If so the plot is seriously thin (Non existant really) o_o
I hoped for 8+8 season like they do some shows
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I suspect they may not have planned it to be anything at this point.
I say that because the original plan was for a Bobba Fett movie which got panned. This then came about and it is clear they had fun doing it. It reminds me of a lot of old 50's/60's shows in that the plots aren't amazing but it gives you all of the entertainment and fun you'd want in 30min episodes.
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Watching Episode 6 made wonder if the creators/writers had played Imperial Assault. Very much had that vibe about it.
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This series has been perfect for me - "hey, watch this cool star wars stuff", it's basically all I need. I loved 4, scenarios like that are the reason I love star wars. I like seeing the universe post-Empire, I like seeing that things don't seem to have improved much, it's interesting.
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And the reference about the Stormtroopers´aim capabilities is priceless... :D :D :D
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And the reference about the Stormtroopers´aim capabilities is priceless... :D :D :D
That was a good one :)
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It was really supposed to be 8 episodes only ?
If so the plot is seriously thin (Non existant really) o_o
I hoped for 8+8 season like they do some shows
10 episodes gazetted for S2. They finish primary shooting shortly.
Doug Chiang is one of the art guys on the show.
The mando's original armour design is based off a character concept for the dead-in-the-water "1313" series that had been mooted pre-Disney.
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Just watched episode 7 :o 8)
Loved it, reminded me of the Rebels TV show.
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Finally we get to see an Imperial Troop Transport in live action - they've appeared in Rebels.
Something else happens in the episode, which the writers must have known occurs in the Rise of the Skywalker too (leaving it vague for those that haven't seen the film yet!).
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DAMN cliffhangers.
That is all.
Oh wait, Kuiil, wont know till ep 8 or never. But i am curious did the danger come from the front or back that put him on the ground.
Grimm
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Finally we get to see an Imperial Troop Transport in live action - they've appeared in Rebels.
I had a weird emotional reaction when that showed up. I was truly shocked and felt like a kid again- I even started babbling about how damn cool and surprised I was to see it. I had the toy when I was a kid (still do, it's totally beat to shit) and at the time wondered why they made a toy but never showed it.
(http://theswca.com/images-toys/figuretoys/itt-variation.jpg)
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Hmm. If they are going to add in the old toys... I may have to look into watching this sooner than anticipated. lol
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Ep 7 was IMO the absolut highlight of the 1st season so far!
I am really curious now how it will end.
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Yes, this episode has been "a new hope" for me...
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Ep 7 was IMO the absolut highlight of the 1st season so far!
I am really curious now how it will end.
my thoughts exactly
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I bet you the sale of SW Legion Deathtroopers has gone up! I hope Kuill isn't actually dead, he has been one of the best characters!
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Episode 8 is out and yeah, it can't end like that, I mean, Mof Gideon pops out of his crashed Tie Fighter with Mandalore's Dark Saber! That"s a whole story right there! Did he stole it during the purge?
We need another season )
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I had a weird emotional reaction when that showed up. I was truly shocked and felt like a kid again- I even started babbling about how damn cool and surprised I was to see it. I had the toy when I was a kid (still do, it's totally beat to shit) and at the time wondered why they made a toy but never showed it.
(http://theswca.com/images-toys/figuretoys/itt-variation.jpg)
Me too!
Just seen Episode 8. Cracking series.
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I really liked the ending.
Season 2 is confirmed and will come out next Fall.
Episode 2-6 were a bit too slow for my taste but the last 2 episodes gor it ALL right!
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episode 8 WOW Loved it :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
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Kinda a shame they keep killing my favourite character! IG-11 has been refreshing in the SW universe!
I was in stiches with the 2 scout troopers not being able to shoot for shit! lol
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My wife & I both enjoyed the series. Can't wait for the next one.
I too liked the 2 speeder troops & their chat.
Yeah, shame about killing off the nice characters. I was thinking
he was getting a good little (Galactic Heroes?) team about him.
Could say more, but... 'I have spoken'
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Yeah, I liked the two scout troopers banter and shooting in that last episode.
Overall I felt it had a bit of a feel to the Kevin Sorbo Hercules series to it. Kind of looked like they had a loose plot with lots of little adventures in it. Minimal cast etc. Still enjoyed the series, it got better as they got more into it.
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Those two troopers were great.
They should do a show called Patrol or something with those two.
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Those two troopers were great.
They should do a show called Patrol or something with those two.
Will the show take place prior to Ep. 8, or after they get out of an exceedingly long rehab? ;)
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Those two troopers were great.
They should do a show called Patrol or something with those two.
Did you see the "Cops" parody back in the 1990's... IIRC it was called Troopers and show how Luke's aunt and uncle "really" died lol
*EDIT* find it.... it's called Troopers.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcoZBDIPDP8
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Thanks for posting the vid. great fun.
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Will the show take place prior to Ep. 8, or after they get out of an exceedingly long rehab? ;)
Prior of course :)
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If you liked Troopers... you may well like IMPS.
https://www.youtube.com/user/IMPStheRelentless
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The pistol he uses,suitably modded,is a Bergmann 1894 No. 1,which is pretty cool considering the past use of weapons such as the C96 Mauser :)
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I've got to say this series has rekindled my love for Star Wars gaming.
Now thinking of running a campaign at the fall of the Empire. You've got the Rebel Alliance trying to establish itself as the New Republic. They'll be Imperials assets trying to reassert their authority. Force users could come out of the woodwork. Mention was made of war crimes trials, so bounty hunters could be hunting down Imperials. So much potential and the only 'canon' is in my head! ;)
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I've got to say this series has rekindled my love for Star Wars gaming.
Now thinking of running a campaign at the fall of the Empire. You've got the Rebel Alliance trying to establish itself as the New Republic. They'll be Imperials assets trying to reassert their authority. Force users could come out of the woodwork. Mention was made of war crimes trials, so bounty hunters could be hunting down Imperials. So much potential and the only 'canon' is in my head! ;)
That is a great idea. loads of potential. ;D
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Just watched Episode 8 & bloody loved it, the two scout troopers cracked me up, again shame about IG11, & The Mandolorian taking off his helmet, spoiled it a bit for me (it was akin to Joe Dredd taking his helmet off)
Can’t wait for the next series
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Just finished the series and really enjoyed all of it. It was just all good fun.
It was a huge hit with the Little Fish as well, Very glad another series is on the way.
Plenty of gaming ideas from the first 8 episodes.
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I really enjoyed the series, and like many, I've felt an actual SW spark again. Something I've not felt for a very long time.
I think this format is the way forward, and I hope they will continue in this way. But the creation of the Disney+ channel bodes well in that regard.
The Razor Crest looks very familiar for some reason. Maybe the ship's layout is somewhat tropeish, I can't put my finger on it. But I like it nonetheless.
And I have to agree with the general consensus in regards to the final two episodes; they were the best of the season. The Scout Troopers were hilarious, the shootout around/in the bar was thrilling and the (2nd) demise of IG-11 felt like a true loss. Especially since we got to see an IG series truly in action for the first time in this series.
Also, the X-Wing game throwback in ep. 6, when they destroyed the station was a real 'Yeah!!' moment for me! :D
The dark saber and all it entails bodes well for the next season, and I certainly hope Kara Dune will return... ;)
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The Razor Crest looks very familiar for some reason. Maybe the ship's layout is somewhat tropeish, I can't put my finger on it. But I like it nonetheless.
I thought the Razor Crest had a similar feel to the Republic LAAT. Clearly I wasn't alone since this image popped up:
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/1DKs01B1jUc/hqdefault.jpg)
I think that helped it feel both familiar and new at the same time. I'm glad Mando didn't fly around in something equivalent to the "Slave 2" as I would have required a lot of help understanding why that style ship happened to be associated with the Mandalorians as a whole. Since Mando was part of a pieced together group of Mandalorian refugees, it feels in keeping with the tone that his ship might also pieced together from an old LAAT vice being a true ship of Mandalorian heritage.
My only complaint with the series was that it didn't last long enough. I loved every minute of it, but I seem to be blessed with a very low threshold for enjoying what is in front of me without having to analyze it to the N-th degree.
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his ship is not a modified LAAT.
it is a Razor Crest class Police gunship. dialog puts the class of ship as Razor Crest (it is not the ship's proper name, despite what so many places keep using it as). the design pre-dates the Empire, but we aren't told by how much. it is presumably heavily modified in armaments and internal systems.
visually it is similar in appearance to the SS-54 Assault ship (https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/SS-54_assault_ship) from the pre-imperial period, suggesting a possible trend in design during that time.
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his ship is not a modified LAAT.
it is a Razor Crest class Police gunship. dialog puts the class of ship as Razor Crest (it is not the ship's proper name, despite what so many places keep using it as). the design pre-dates the Empire, but we aren't told by how much. it is presumably heavily modified in armaments and internal systems.
Wookipedia seems to think around 19BBY.
Grimm
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So it’s *a* Razor Crest, not *the* Razor Crest?
Interesting and perfectly in character.
It was a great show. Enjoyed it immensely.
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The Razor Crest looks very familiar for some reason. Maybe the ship's layout is somewhat tropeish, I can't put my finger on it.
I finally figured out what the ship reminds me of: the VTOL from Deus Ex: Human Revolution...
(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/deusex/images/e/ee/VTOL2.png/revision/latest?cb=20110912083729&path-prefix=en)
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As one of the folks in Europe who only just got access to Disney+ and therefore The Mandalorian, I am as usual late to the party.
My wife and I watched the first episode last night. My wife thought it was ok.... whereas I loved it! It was pretty much what I hoped it would be... pulpy spagetti samurai western space opera. It was too short and the voice of the IG robot did not make the most of its brilliant self destruct dialogue but I was surprised how much the show managed to suspend my disbelief.
For me this experience was essential, because it illustrates to me that what I expect from Star Wars is achievable. My nostalgia has not ruined all future Star Wars.
Fire Kathleen Kennedy I say! I have spoken.
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It's fucking aces!!!
(just watched Episode three on Friday :D)
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As one of the folks in Europe who only just got access to Disney+ and therefore The Mandalorian, I am as usual late to the party.
My wife and I watched the first episode last night. My wife thought it was ok.... whereas I loved it! It was pretty much what I hoped it would be... pulpy spagetti samurai western space opera. It was too short and the voice of the IG robot did not make the most of its brilliant self destruct dialogue but I was surprised how much the show managed to suspend my disbelief.
For me this experience was essential, because it illustrates to me that what I expect from Star Wars is achievable. My nostalgia has not ruined all future Star Wars.
Fire Kathleen Kennedy I say! I have spoken.
The voices in the English version are really better than in the Spanish one, all of them.
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The Hasbro 'Mandalorian Child' plush speaking toy is up for pre-order already. MrsCub has dropped several lead-weighted hints regarding her birthday.
I want the episodes to be a good 15mins longer, but what a great TV programme and what superb timing for us in Europe to have something to look forward to each week! No doubt I'm not the only '1st generation' Star Wars kid to be loving the indulgent storyline on Mandalorian warrior culture, remembering playing with my Boba Fett action figure and insisting that he was rock-hard despite that fact that he doesn't do that much in the films.
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I can not get over how much I am enjoying these episodes. They are not perfect. Too short and some plot holes but overall head and shoulders better than anything since before the prequels.
Interestingly, I just came across this article and I have to say I agree with the author. I have always preferred A New Hope to Empire Strikes Back but I never considered that the hype for Empire may have what got use Rise of Skywalker.
http://www.bbc.com/culture/story/20200430-star-wars-why-the-empire-strikes-back-is-overrated
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I'm in the same boat as you Rick, I watched and enjoyed while my wife looked at her phone! Watched them all now and quite glad in a way that they weren't put on in one lump, as they've stretched out and kept me wanting more.
I really enjoyed seeing Tuskans and Dewbacks back and have ended up buying a dewback rider to paint, it's a really nice model. I found the jailbreak episode a bit dull, thought the characters were a bit tropey, particularly the hissing Twi'lek, but maybe that's the point and I just missed it.
And altogether I enjoyed having short episodes. Personally I'm getting tired of epic series with hour long episodes every week and find they can get to be a chore to watch. Half hour episodes with a good few action scenes kept me wanting to watch the next one, and I'll probably go back and watch them again.
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I think the show is something of a homage to tropes. What is surprising is that it can take cliche tropes and execute them well. Just how many times can the story of some warriors hired to protect villagers from bandits be told? I was surprised how well that worked.
I even liked the tropes in the jailbreak episode, including the Harley Chianna Catwoman Twi’lek. What really made the episode for me though was how it went from heist movie to horror movie with Mando hunting the others in the manner he did.
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I am easier to please than most, I find. I loved every second of it. The show got better and better as the season went on, and the cliffhanger at the end has me on the edge of my seat still, even after finishing it back before the coronapocalypse.
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As something of an amateur cinematography enthusiast I am rather critical. I can enjoy a technically terrible film at times but yeah, I am something of a critic. Costuming, editing, plot writing... I always pick up on these things. I can make some allowances for budget or when watching dated productions. I am not skilled with lighting or special effects so I often give a break in these categories as well.
We just finished it tonight, my wife and I loved the final episode. We loved the whole season but I am critical enough to spot a couple things that could have been a bit better.
I absolutely hate the whole stormtroopers always miss trope, which is demonstrably false, as it undermines the death of characters who do get shot. I liked the chatter between the Biker Scouts but I think it would have been better if the first one was a terrible shot but the second one was a good shot. I let the Bill Burr stormtrooper remark slide in the jail break episode but considering the character death in the episode before this one the trope just went too far. It undermines the threat from all the other stormtroopers throughout the show. That said, I liked that the black clad Death Troopers appeared to be at least competent in hand to hand. And I loved the Moff Gideon was clever enough to take that explosively epic pistol shot. That kind of thing lends gravitas to a villain. Like the Vader scene iinRogue One where he is cutting down rebels alone in his pursuit of the plans. Counter that to the joke that was Hux and all the First Order villains. Their comedic value undermines the sense of genuine threat to the heroes.
My wife and I want more Mandalorian... but looks like we all have quite a wait on our hands with the current international health situation. I really hope producers learn from this and get Star Wars back on target!
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Yeah the Deathtroopers have a real gravitas to them. And I agree with your assessment of the top villains too, Moff Gideon and Werner Herzog's character, whose name slips my mind, had a real menace to them that was completely lacking in the newer films.
I watched Rise of the Skywalker last night now it's on Disney+ and enjoyed it, but it's not a patch on the Mandalorian or Rogue One.
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Whilst I enjoyed elements of Rise of Skywalker whilst I watched it, the good bits carrying me through the rest of it, after I came out of the theater and thought about it the film left me increasingly hollow. Like junk food that only temporarily satisfied my hunger. Whereas I have seen A New Hope more times than I can remember I have no desire to rewatch Rise of Skywalker. Quite the opposite, the more I think about it the more the movie disappoints.
t may be a bit selfish but the tv show feels to me like the kind of thing me and my friends would come up with when we were kids back when the original trilogy had come out. Same with Rogue One. Solo, not so much. But the last trilogy only briefly catches onto some nostalgic moments, for example “Chewie, we’re home”. It feels like the movies were made by someone who was told what Star Wars was about rather than someone who had experienced it. Or at least experienced it like I did. For me as a kid the Force was like an introduction to extreme Zen Buddhism rather than the later Midichlorian concept which turned into basically mutant superpowers by the last film.
What I can not really figure out is how a gritty hardboiled sci-fi Wild West Samurai Action Adventure can feel more hopeful, more charmingly optimistic than the latest trilogy as well as Star Trek Discovery and Picard. I remember thinking the JJ Abrams Films felt more like Star Wars films than Trek films. But his Star Wars films have been exceedingly disappointing if not as outrageously bad as the Rian Johnson disaster.
It is probably my own cultural baggage as a child of the 70’s and 80’s but I commonly find movies and tv shows lately to be filled with bitter, mean spirited and ultimately unlikeable characters. This is why some shows, like the recent Marvel movies and the Mandalorian really please me.
And it is not just down to the Directors or IP’s and their age. The last Indiana Jones movie and the latest additions to the Aliens/Predator franchises for example. Ridley Scott created a masterpiece with Alien. A film every single cinematography student should consider essential study. But at this point it feels like Scott has lost his way. Maybe success has a way of spoiling a Director? I feel George Lucas and Peter Jackson lost their way for example.
One thing I loved about the Mandalorian was how it touched on a subject that I found depressingly dealt with in Solo....droids as people. I have hated how Star Wars seems to be quite content to treat droids as slaves. They are seen tortured, seen to display fear, seen to have self awareness. I can not help but wonder how that lays a foundation for some to believe how future AI should be treated. I absolutely hate how the Trade Federation droids are shown as some sort of beings to bully for comedic value.
I think when kids watch movies or tv shows like Star Wars and Star Trek it can create a foundation of moral values that affects them later in life. These are our contemporary mythologies. They are more than just mindless entertainment and they should be treated as such.
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Mandalorian is some of the best SW stuff ever made, IMHO. Terrific gaming potential, too. Anyone see the last series of the Clone Wars? It lagged a little in the middle, but overall I thought it was a terrific way to wrap it up. Ashoka Tano is one of he best SW creations outside the main movies.
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Yeah, I loved the first season and am greedily awaiting season 2 airing in the UK. I understand the Tattoine episode was one of the less popular ones from the series, but I literally squealed with excitement when I saw the cantina. I can't separate the TV programme from my nostalgia and I'm just soaking it all in. But I am one of life's optimists. I accept imperfection and prefer to suck the joy from things. But then I'm on the outside of a bottle of merlot right now, so perhaps I'm just in a really good mood.
Jon Favreau seems to be new wunderkind who can do no wrong. Considering The Mandalorian partially replaced the cancelled Boba Fett movie, I expect (and hope) to see a lot more of Jon Favreau's work in the Star Wars universe, on both big and little screens. Taika Waititi (the director and voice of the IG droid) has been linked to further Star Wars films. The Skywalker Saga may be wrapped up, but there's no way any studio is going to turn its back on such a popular and lucrative franchise. The Empire Strikes Back was always my favourite (I saw it before I saw Star Wars because I was so young) and none of the other films came close to capturing the magic of the original trilogy … but that's okay. They are still there. I like all the films (even Attack of the Clones) and maybe, just maybe, someone can now grab the Star Wars universe, write their own saga and be able to skilfully craft the story arc without having to cram it around the framework of someone else's work (or clumsily shove in prequels that eventually join up their threads to existing movies).
I don't understand what it is about Star Wars, I'm not a sci-fi fan as such, but I just adore Star Wars. I can't get enough of it.
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Long time ago someone said Star wars isn't Sci-Fi
it's Space Opera.
Sci-Fi will go into details about how you jump to light speed.
Space Opera has, 'It ain't like dusting crops, boy!'
Maybe that is why I (& you Cubs) like Star Wars.
I saw the first film. A large space ship seemed to come onto the screen over our heads.
It was firing backwards, then... an even bigger space ship came over our heads, chasing it.
From that moment I was hooked.
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I saw the first film. A large space ship seemed to come onto the screen over our heads.
It was firing backwards, then... an even bigger space ship came over our heads, chasing it.
From that moment I was hooked.
They use a hybrid technique in The Mandalorian don't they? Where they film models of the various space-ships, augmented with CGI, as opposed to the 3 prequels where it was pretty much pure CGI. Maybe that helps explain why it just seems so visually authentic and closer to the original films?
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I didn't mind later Star Wars films. I like action, I don't need to know details of interstellar politics, and I find the "Stormtroopers can't shoot" trope to be quite charming. Plot armor is a heck of a thing, and it doesn't just exist in the Star Wars universe. What I loved about Rise of Skywalker was that the force suddenly became BIG. As a kid, that's what I wanted to see. Not the force as a way to just choke someone who is mouthy, or pick up a stick, but yank a ship out of the sky or project your being across the galaxy. That's pretty cool and better matches what my kid brain wanted out of a Jedi. For my money, the Force is at its peak in something like the video game Force Unleashed. Suddenly Darth Vader is straight up terrifying in his power. I'm also a fan of the Dooku and Yoda fight scene because I finally got my answer about what makes Yoda a Jedi Master.
But like I said, I'm easy to please. I like my lasers, explosions, and fast action. If I want a good plot I'll read books. Movies and TV are more about the visuals for me. Mandalorian was visually stunning, even in the more monochromatic sets.
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Long time ago someone said Star wars isn't Sci-Fi
it's Space Opera.
Sci-Fi will go into details about how you jump to light speed.
Space Opera has, 'It ain't like dusting crops, boy!'
Maybe that is why I (& you Cubs) like Star Wars.
I saw the first film. A large space ship seemed to come onto the screen over our heads.
It was firing backwards, then... an even bigger space ship came over our heads, chasing it.
From that moment I was hooked.
that hooked me well, still sends a shiver down my spine when ever I watch it
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One thing I loved about the Mandalorian was how it touched on a subject that I found depressingly dealt with in Solo....droids as people. I have hated how Star Wars seems to be quite content to treat droids as slaves. They are seen tortured, seen to display fear, seen to have self awareness. I can not help but wonder how that lays a foundation for some to believe how future AI should be treated. I absolutely hate how the Trade Federation droids are shown as some sort of beings to bully for comedic value.
I think when kids watch movies or tv shows like Star Wars and Star Trek it can create a foundation of moral values that affects them later in life. These are our contemporary mythologies. They are more than just mindless entertainment and they should be treated as such.
I see a bit of a double bind here. But I'll get to that.
Having come to the party late with Clone Wars having treated myself to Disney+ I will say that I believe the Mandalorian to be very much Clone Wars in feel. If you haven't seen Clone Wars - do. The droids as slaves theme is pretty much reoccurring - it isn't always spoken, but like all good stories it is with the unspoken too. It also deals with issues around clones that are created purely to fight on their masters demand. In many ways, I like it as it suggests the Jedi have their flaws too.
Now back to the other bit. They are more than just mindless entertainment and should be treated as such.
I find that really quite interesting. The originally trilogy, to me, were actually incredibly simple. It has been said by some critics that A New Hope and Empire were near identical plot wise. With a couple of tweaks or additions. The main difference was the atmosphere and the battle for Hoth. Essentially though it wasn't exactly a new concept.
There is a young hero who is finding his destiny. Up until his meeting with Obi Wan in a New Hope, could be a sci fi dressing of the sword in the stone part of the King Arthur myths. He finds Merlin, and his sword, then his adventures begin. Off they go to rescue a princess. Again, nothing new there. It's a Grimm fairy tale in space. Having read a few of the original Grimm tales recently, I can tell you, they don't all carry morals or lessons and some are rather nightmarish!
So what am I saying? I don't ever watch the original trilogy and question what is going on because it is very much mindless entertainment. When I say that, I mean to say that if you were to watch it and start to question it you would find plenty wonky about it. Alec Guinness wrote in his autobiography autobiography that he felt much of the script was filled with jargon to make it sound technical and therefore sci fi, but by and large didn't actually mean very much.
My views on the latest trilogy are summed up by Mark Kermode's reflection on the Rise of Skywalker - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBqZHsEieyM
The most disappointing thing for me has been the response of some fans. I found all of the movies enjoyable. Are they massively intellectually stimulating to adults? No. Were the original trilogy? No. Did they inspire youngsters in the same way that the old ones did when they were brand new? You bet. I've enjoyed them all. Though I will admit to getting a bit trilogy fatigued. You would have thought, that with the success of the MCU that they would perhaps try to do something similar, bearing in mind Star Wars has had it's own cinematic universe ever since they explored different parts of it in cartoons etc in the 80's and 90's. I enjoyed Rogue One and Solo because there didn't have to be more - not just that they were enjoyable.
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I have only seen the First few of episodes of Clone Wars, season 1. I have not seen Rebels nor the other new Star Wars animated shows on Disney+. The prequels put my off Clone Wars but it was repeatedly recommended to me and I have been trying to give it a chance. I dislike the characterization of Anakin so much that it is difficult but I do enjoy a lot of the rest of it, particularly Obi-Wan and the Clone Troopers. Maybe Ashoka will grow on me but so far I find her irritating in her know it all rebellious way.
As for the Tattoine episode... I loved the nostalgia of it. I felt a strange emotion seeing someone sitting in Han’s seat. I can not quite articulate it. The young bounty hunter, sadly I forget his name, did not annoy me as much as he has annoyed others. I do get a little confused about what planet folks are on at times because I thought Jawas only lived on Tattoine but they keep popping up in different episodes.
I can criticize something, acknowledge its flaws and still enjoy it without sucking out the joy. I just prefer not to give a free pass on something just because I like part of it. Things rarely get better without honest critique.
It does make me wonder how much is Faverau and how much is Filoni. Or how much it is them bringing in folks like Waititi. The banter of the Biker Scouts and jokes from Greef Carga struck me as MCU style humor. It makes sense that looks would want to continue the successes of the MCU.
Fair point on Star Wars being Space Opera instead of Sci-Fi. I think it still requires a consistent universe to avoid breaking immersion but it does not need the same foundation that say Star Trek requires. I think that may be way there used to be a bigger divide between Star Wars and Star Trek fans.
The opening scene for A New Hope is cinematic genius in my opinion. That is exactly the kind of magic that things like camera angle and music bring to cinematography and make it more than just simply point and click camera work. It is visual story telling without dialogue, storytelling that sets a framework into the mind of the viewer. The political situation of the Rebellion and the Empire is almost instantly established without the need for long exposition dialogue. This is what I mean about something looking simple but actually being quite complex.
I am a big fan of practical effects and attention to detail in set design. Mandalorian seems to take an approach like Bladerunner when it comes to depth of detail on set design.
Plot armor is a thing most shows can not avoid. However everything I hear someone go on about how stormtroopers could not shoot themselves in the head because they would miss it runs contrary to the plot point of Obi-Wan knowing Tusken raiders did not kill the Jawas that had R2 and 3P0. It makes what are supposed to be sinister villains comedic mooks.
But why it really bothers me is that people start to believe it because it is said so often and because people want to believe it, even when it is demonstrably false. This is sadly true of more than just cinema tropes. This just happens to be a relatively harmless example of what in other cases can prove to be terribly destructive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFQ9uO4GxkQ
We are all entitled to like what we like. It you like BIG Force application, fair enough. I do not. It reminds me of power creep in a D&D campaign. To me the ability to choke someone without touching them is already quite big enough. But then I prefer level 1-3 adventures to 9-12.
I enjoy good, thought provoking plot in all my mediums... be it books, movies or tabletop gaming. I prefer narrative gaming to competitive number crunching for example. If that plot has explosions and laser swords, all the better.
As for trilogy fatigue, yeah I am feeling that as well. Single stand alone films in the Star Wars universe are fine by me.
But I do not find the original trilogy mindless. Are they space fairy tales? Sure. King Arthur in Space? Of course. That does not in my opinion make them by necessity mindless. Different versions of King Arthur have different things to teach. Nothing is truly mindless unless you are watching early morning static. How many of you remember that? What I find disappointing in some fans is being willing to accept just about anything as being good enough and telling others to be thankful we get anything.
EDIT: But let me add... I love that people are willing to engage in discussing this. I value all the opinions expressed, including those I disagree with. I realize I come across harsh at times... this is how I have come to be called a grumpy gnome. I have spoken.
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I get that, I'm not trying to force people to like anything, it's just that not liking something is fine in it's own right. You don't have to have a deep reason for it for it to be justified. I struggled to like a number of films other people have seen. But they just don't hit a chord with me. Doesn't mean they don't with someone else.
I wasn't really trying to say that the originals were mindless, just no less mindless than the others. The problem always with original movies like that is authenticity and repetition. Repeat to many aspects and people will just feel it's a copied trope that offers nothing new. Try too much different and you end up with people feeling disconnected from the originals. You can see that with the prequels which were visually just far too different - though folks favourite bits tend to be the ones with the most familiarity like the pod racing.
A few folks on here know I work in a kids home with young folks. I actually connected with Rise of Skywalker a lot. But I felt it crammed in too much because of trying to undo the Last Jedi. Sorry if this spoils anything massively for anyone but I'll try not to.
The entire plot for Rey was complex and incredibly meaningful and mindful. I couldn't help but be reminded of the many, many young people I have worked with in the 13 years I have worked this job. Parents or grandparents who have done unspeakable things, and how it can be a weight upon you. Not knowing who your parents are/were and finding out.
When I compare it to Luke's plot in the original trilogy, I think whilst it has similarities there was actually much more emotional depth and exploration. Luke seemed inquisitive but naive. Apart from the fight in Empire, he never really accepted the evil of his father. There was no real acceptance that his father had done unspeakable things that perhaps could never be forgotten. He was convinced his father had good in him yet and he could turn him back to the light side. Yes he ultimately succeeded but there was always a bit of a disconnect there for me, and Luke was never my favourite character for that reason. He was too dismissive, he didn't carry that sense of guilt, almost arrogance at times.
Rey you can see utterly bears it. She is more fearful of her responsibility, distrusting. I really do prefer her overall character if I am honest. I think Rise of actually represents disappointment in other ways. I think it's the first time we start to see the relationship between Poe, Finn and Chewie show the glimpses of the sort of silliness we saw with Han, Luke and Chewie. The swashbuckling running about with blasters, wise cracks and the back and forth.
As for the force bit at the end. He had just absorbed a lot of power. At that point it made me think of a necromancer, or a vampire and how they have been depicted of drawing power from the living to keep them alive and even give them more power or energy to do even greater things. And it didn't kill. It was more like an EMP.
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It's fucking aces!!!
(just watched Episode three on Friday :D)
No it isn't. It's arse warts.
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No it isn't. It's arse warts.
So are you ;D
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I get liking something and not really understanding, intentionally or otherwise, why. I like plenty of things that are technically or even artistically poor. Buckaroo Bonzai immediately comes to mind.
For me A New Hope is somewhat simplistic compared to the rest of the franchise. I do not think that makes it mindless and more than that I think complexity does not necessarily equate with deep thinking. It is rather black and white, naively good and evil compared to the rest of the franchise. My love for the franchise has slowly declined since Empire Strikes Back, which echoes the author of the article I shared above.
When I was young much of what I consumed was black and white morality tales, so antiheroes appealed to me. The Man with No Name. Punisher. Mack Bolan. But as I have grown older and found media inundated with antiheroes, cynicism, and dystopia I find myself craving more Captain America, Luke Skywalker, John Wayne naive optimism. Perhaps it is a reflection of our contemporary society but I am tired of bitterness, snarkiness and disappointment.
I can not explain why I feel like the Mandalorian feels hopeful. Maybe it is in scenes like an IG unit telling our protagonist that he can tell that he is sad. The sacrifice that then comes feels hopeful as we watch our protagonist has gone from blind, bigoted hatred to empathy for another being. And yet Mandalorian is not perfect in this because it is countered with the senseless disintegration of Jawas. The same Jawas who then respond to deadly violence with stunning instead of killing our protagonist. Of course you could argue that them sparing him is exactly what makes it feel hopeful. Either way it feels so very different from Star Trek Discovery or Picard which seem to revel in glamorizing moral shades of grey and the end justifying the means.
But maybe I am full of pretentious crap, because I can not really articulate why I love the Mandalorian but loathe Last Jedi when I try to dissect it. I seem able to forgive some things but not others. The jokes of Greef Karga work for me but the ones of Poe Dameron to Hux do not.
Rey is a more likable character than Young Luke in general. She whines less for sure. Much as I hated Last Jedi I certainly identified with grumpy old Luke. As a former Idealist who has become bitter about my inability to change the world it was like watching myself on screen. Maybe that was why the milking scene disturbed me so much.
Whilst I see some plot holes in Mandalorian there just was not any scene that made me groan like the films of the last trilogy. Solo and Rogue One felt like they missed some opportunities to be better but the last trilogy movies killed the franchise for me... until Mandalorian brought it back like a necromancer. *wink*
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To be fair to the Storm Troopers, you can both miss a lot and be a formidable foe all the same. I doubt any soldier in the Civil war felt their adversary to be laughable just because there were a lot of missed shots on the whole. Likewise, in both World Wars, nobody approached something like a 1-shot/1-kill ratio. That never made a single death less tragic, nor did it make a pretty bad KDR (to co opt a video game idea) laughable. Yes, of course the Storm Troopers kill some folks. I think the humor, again not relegated to Star Wars alone, is how reliably they miss the heroes in fairly straight forward situations. You might forgive, and believe, missing one particular person on a field of battle such as Hoth. But for a squad of troopers chasing people down a hallway, you would hope someone (Stormtrooper or otherwise) could be expected to halt and aim their weapon with some bit of accuracy.
Maybe the better criticism is to accuse Stormtroopers of having little discipline in battle; breaking cover, firing from the hip while at a run, etc. Again, I'll go back to video games as a better representation of my vision of Star Wars where you have a game like Republic Commando, which shows a SPECOPS level of discipline and execution in combat. Though, I suppose clone troopers were always given more of a nod in terms of being formidable.
I would be all in on a BIG force battle against specops level storm troopers. Then I think you get something more like the Matrix (first), where you can have someone "chosen" who is also threatened by an adequate opponent. I'd be all for that, or I can also love it the way it is even if the New Hope Darth Vader/Obi Wan lightsaber duel is less action packed than two pensioners poking a biscuit around the table with their canes lol
I, like Grumpy, appreciate the discussion.
Also, Buckaroo Banzai is good stuff. :D
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“.... they let us go....it’s the only explanation for the ease of our escape.“
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nammMXTkrX4
That is how I justify the poor marksmanship displayed in the hallway scene. The plot armor can be attributed to Vader’s plan. At least at this stage of the franchise.
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Very surprised to see Season 2 coming so quickly given the state of the world these days.... but it does look good!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eW7Twd85m2g
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Looking forward to it 8)
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The trailer made me finally prime all the Imperial Assault miniatures I have lying around :)
These PVC style minis from my wargamer perspective are just okay and I plan to use them as a massive testing ground for painting techniques.
Not to ruin them but not being angry if some of them turn out to look funny...
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Apparently season two filming finished before covid lockdowns and impacts started.
And they have been working on scripting and other stuff within limitations already for season 3 but apparently not started filming yet
So might be a long delay on that, but thats ok, looking forward to binging the second at least
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Enjoyed series one, looking forward to series two.
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I got a chance to catch season 2's trailer last night. I have to say I'm very excited. I've enjoyed the bits of the Star Wars universe that haven't been so Jedi/Sith focused.
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That dock scene really caught my attention.
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That dock scene really caught my attention.
I am hoping that is the last episode, if I'm honest. I would rather the Jedi be a cliffhanger, and not appear early, and thus constantly be in the picture. Plus I fear that the addition of a Jedi invites the introduction of a Sith, and then we get back to a world of Jedi/Sith and stop focusing on the other 99.999999999999% of the Galaxy's inhabitants... which is the draw for me. I could probably live with a Jedi showing up, being found, and taking possession of the child. Not totally sure what Mando would get up to then, but certainly there are plenty of other situations needing a bounty hunter and we could tie into a story line with the Hutts or something equally interesting and not Force involved.
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It is Star Wars mate, you can not escape the Force. It is an energy field created by all living things, it surrounds us, it penetrates us, ties the galaxy together. The Force has been a central plot element of the Mandalorian both with the baby and the history of the Mandalorians themselves.
Given what has been in the tv series Rebels (admittedly I have only seen a couple episodes), the crazy old wizard Ben was hardly the last of the Jedi despite what Vader thought.
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Yes, yes, I am aware that there are Force sensitive individuals sprinkled throughout the Galaxy, but this assumes they have to be involved in everything, all the time. The universe can be interesting without it. Rogue 1 didn't need Jedi, Solo didn't need Jedi, and both were set in a universe where the Force existed. Whether you liked either story is not a relevant point, I'm saying that they told the story without centering around the Sith/Jedi directly.
In season 1 I would say that we understood the Child to be special, but that the Force wasn't a central point to the story. Take out the Force and I think you can probably have another mcguffin that would work in the story. Any secret weapon that the Empire would want and that maybe the Mandalorian wouldn't want to give them would work. That other secret weapon could be used on the rhino monster, and could pull Mando out of a jam or two. In the end Mando could simply work to destroy the weapon LOTR style and move on. I don't know that it HAD to involve the force, but I suspect there was no way Disney wasn't going to cash in on something cute and marketable in plush toy form. Plus there is a clearer moral dilemma involved if the bounty involved a kid. We, as the audience, wouldn't have cared nearly as much if this was centered around a middle aged and fully functioning Force user (Jedi or not).
I'm just saying that I don't want there to be a Jedi to swoop in and wave a hand to make someone forget, or to lightsaber their way through a few fight scenes. Mando is capable, and the Jedi addition makes him an easy second best (perhaps) or steals some of the thunder at least. The fun of Mandalorian, for me, was getting to see a Mandalorian in action. Boba never really had his day in the sun, and Jango had a fairly short run of success before he was bested. Plus, I liked seeing the IG unit display how/why it is lethal. Again, we were told about it in the first Star Wars movies, but lining people up and saying "You all are great bounty hunters" (paraphrasing a bit) isn't as fun as seeing it in action. I think a Jedi in the mix ruins that in the same way that asking Magic Johnson to play on your rec league basketball team ruins the season. Yeah, you win but it was never really a fair fight to begin with. This is why the Jedi/Sith thing is always there. The franchise has set out that you pretty much need a Larry Bird on the other team if someone is going to bring a Magic Johnson.
I don't know modern basketball players. lol
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Whilst I never played Star Wars Galaxies I have numerous accounts of how the later prolific Jedi population “ruined” the game. Jedi, like any other kind of superheroes, can become a crutch and if so abused can undermine the appearance of relevance of other characters.
Make no mistake, given the incredibly poor handling of Jedi stories in the movies from the prequels onwards I feel like I could do without Jedi/Sith as well.
I am not up to speed with Clone Wars and Rebels mind you. Several folks have told me they really expand the Star Wars universe and are quite good but I just have not gotten around to them.
As for Jango and Boba.... to be fair, from what I understand, they are not Mandalorian, merely having Mandalorian armor. Whereas in the lore real Mandalorians fought Jedi with some parity. Hence the Darksaber with Moff Gideon.
I do not think the problem is having Jedi, Sith and the Force but rather how they are handled. So far the Mandalorian tv series has handled the Force well and I remain optimistic that it will continue to do so. Using the term “sorcerers” for the Jedi is a bit of hint on how they may be written into what currently feels like a Western.... going back to the crazy old wizard trope of the space opera vibe of A New Hope.
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Can’t wait for S2
The Jedi involvement looks v.minimal tbh - it’s the end goal of the season so has to be teased a little.
8)
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As for Jango and Boba.... to be fair, from what I understand, they are not Mandalorian, merely having Mandalorian armor. Whereas in the lore real Mandalorians fought Jedi with some parity. Hence the Darksaber with Moff Gideon.
It would seem that Star Wars has been a bit unclear about whether Boba is a Mandalorian. It seems that because Boba was popular, a backstory was created to explain him, and thus the Mandalorians were created. To me, he is THE Mandalorian Godfather. Not in timeline, but in terms of my introduction to the culture and iconic armor. Jango is dad, or... genetic donor? There certainly seems to be a lot of Star Wars backstory that plugs Jango into the Mandalorian history directly. Whether Jango or Boba had Beskar armor isn't ever really detailed. As we see from Mando, the armor style and Beskar aren't one and the same, so it is likely that if the Empire hoarded Beskar then Boba probably didn't have it? But it wouldn't appear that the greater Star Wars universe thinks of them as simply not Mandalorian. I suppose it depends on the books you read, or how you interpret some vague lines from the movies.
I don't want the Star Wars universe to cease having Jedi/Sith/Force, but I want to see parts of it that aren't FOCUSED on that black and white version of good and evil. Sadly, I'm not sure that you can introduce Jedi or Sith without the accompanying extremes. A force sensitive child is fine, though I would be lying if I didn't want that story line to end so we can move onto some other plot.
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Whilst I never played Star Wars Galaxies I have numerous accounts of how the later prolific Jedi population “ruined” the game. Jedi, like any other kind of superheroes, can become a crutch and if so abused can undermine the appearance of relevance of other characters.
Absolutely. I was a HUGE player in SWG from the start; things started to get a little messy/unbalanced when they added more vehicles and pets into the mix, but when they opened the doors to Jedi the game almost overnight turned into Overpowered Jedi vs Overpowered Bounty Hunters. Suddenly every other class became insignificant except as alts to use for mining and crafting. One of the most enjoyable MMOs ever rapidly became unplayable dreck.
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George Lucas created one of my all time, most beloved movies with the original... later called A New Hope. I love almost everything about it. To me it is timeless, a sci-fi fantasy fable in part because of the stark good versus evil. But Lucas went further and further away from what I loved as time went by.
I liked the idea the Boba and Jango were Mandalorians as explained in Legends but that has become a sort of literary alternate reality because in Canon, they are not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nua2NUgvCkw
As for Star Wars Galaxies, when I hear people talk of a game they loved ruined and then taken offline it makes me sad, even though I never played it. It reminds me of Pirates of the Burning Sea which I did play (and loved) that also got run into the ground... pardon the pun.
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Anybody else heard the wild rumours about Pedro Pascal becoming difficult on set, storming off in a huff, and that the role may be recast as he has already left?
May well just be a load of bollocks, but word is that he was tired of being a glorified voice actor, and wanted more scenes without the helmet, like Stallone in his Dredd movie.
Who knows, but I do love a bit of industry gossip.
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It's a load of old bollocks :)
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I do not know your source but I found these with a quick google search, which indicate to me that the rumors you mention are false.
https://www.geekositymag.com/post/is-pedro-pascal-leaving-the-mandalorian
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/pedro-pascal-quit-mandalorian-actor-rumors-fake
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I don't want the Star Wars universe to cease having Jedi/Sith/Force, but I want to see parts of it that aren't FOCUSED on that black and white version of good and evil. Sadly, I'm not sure that you can introduce Jedi or Sith without the accompanying extremes. A force sensitive child is fine, though I would be lying if I didn't want that story line to end so we can move onto some other plot.
To be fair, the direction of the majority of the modern material has been about the grey areas rather than black and white.
Clone Wars for example, is full of examples of the Jedi being quite pompous, outspoken and refusing to help those in need on a number of occasions. It portrays them as being far more political than simply the clean 'good guys' in the original trilogy.
As for the "Jedi", it may not be a "Jedi" as such. After all, this is set after Return of the Jedi but before the new movies. So far as we know, Leia and Luke are the last Jedi at this point. Ahsoka Tano, for example, is not a Jedi. She is Jedi trained, yes, but not signed up member of the Jedi, which means she is not necessarily bound by their beliefs and rules. You also have force sensitives that have had no training at all bar what they have taught themselves.
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You also have force sensitives that have had no training at all bar what they have taught themselves.
That may be ok. It just depends on how it is handled, but that isn't really my main grumble. More of a result of having to include Jedi/Sith in everything.
Including the Force at all is a little like making sure that every movie about sports includes a hall of fame athlete. Yes, some people are world class athletes, but the vast majority of us aren't. So you could tell a good sports story without including an athlete of far above average prowess. Something along those lines. Bad News Bears. That story isn't better by including Cal Ripken on the team (insert your own baseball hero if it helps you draw the connection). I think that is maybe my point. We can have the Bad News Bears with a kid who dreams about playing in Major League Baseball (acknowledge that it exists) but we don't need any of the players to make a cameo or hit the game winning home run.
In this case, the Star Wars universe has so much more to offer than the Force. I prefer to see those other bits, **OR** I would like to see them go big with the force. I don't want my Force powers to include struggling to pick up a lightsaber or lifting a rock. I want that Force Unleashed experience, or even the KOTOR level of force powers. Sort of like I don't want my Gandalf to make a sparkle and a flash of light. I want him to man up to the Balrog and be a force to be reckoned with. I just don't like piddling around in the middle.
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At which point I guess I would ask whether you are into the wrong franchise then. I don't mean that horribly but one of the main things that makes Star Wars different to any other sci fi trope is that it has "the force". Now, I do understand that it also has a nicely rich universe too, but even in things like the Mandalorian, although not directly featuring the two sides of the force directly, it is eluded to and does shape the story.
It is more or less impossible to separate the Empire from the Emperor and the Sith as they shaped it. In the same way it is difficult to separate the senate and therefore the rebels from the Jedi. The theme is central to the universe and the telling of it's stories.
The all or nothing approach is what has met it's biggest critics too. The Emperor being seen as far too powerful. Rey gaining use of the force competently too quickly. Luke not being seen as powerful enough...
I like that they are exploring side stories. Depicting the view of the decades of conflict from the perspective of those that perhaps are on the fringes of it, or are trying to escape it. One has to remember though, that Mandalorian falls in the period between RotJ and Force Awakens. That means this is relatively new territory and there are bits of storyline they may want to touch on, such as the rumoured Boba Fett. I expect that it'll be more of a commentary though, so storylines that touch on but don't necessarily see directly what happened or what has happened to other characters and storylines.
As for Gandelf, that's another story. But he's not meant to be a giant slaying warrior as such, at least not by the time you get to the LotR where he is older. Much like Obi Wan when it comes to A New Hope. He's not as able a warrior as he once was, his age impacts upon his ability to use the force, much like Yoda in ESB, and arguably to some degree as Vader in RotJ.
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This looks interesting, a floaty boat as opposed to a hovery boat :D
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/48/2619-051020155001-48535532.jpeg)
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I was with you McFonz up until that last paragraph. I agree with your comments on the Star Wars universe and the Force being part of what defines it.
But as for Gandalf, Obi-wan, Darth Vader and Yoda.... I disagree, I do not think their chronological age had any impact on their abilities. If anything, their youth was shown at a time people wanted, expected even, power creep. This conversation illustrates that I believe.
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This looks interesting, a floaty boat as opposed to a hovery boat :D
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/48/2619-051020155001-48535532.jpeg)
Yeah, you don't see a lot of 'traditional' watercraft in Star Wars. The Wookie boats in RotS are some of the only ones I recall?
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Yeah, you don't see a lot of 'traditional' watercraft in Star Wars. The Wookie boats in RotS are some of the only ones I recall?
Wookie boats?
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Wookie boats?
Boats for Wookies...
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Again, I'm not against the Jedi/Sith thing but I don't think it has to be the center of every Star Wars story. Least of all at a time when they were supposed to be scarce, if not wiped out. There is just more out there, why not explore it without the constraints that the Jedi/Sith create once they are introduced? Part of the draw of the old westerns, if I'm not mistaken, is that the guy you are rooting for is rarely "good" in the traditional sense. Josey Wales is an outlaw. He isn't meant to take sides with someone like the Lone Ranger (or other intolerably one dimensional do-gooder) regardless of whether his actions have some heart and humanity in the end. Again, I'm just hoping that Mando isn't dragged into taking sides with the Jedi just because he is saving the kid. He could bump into a Jedi, do a handoff, and mosey into the sunset. That is fine. That would be a level of involvement that I could be ok with, and that doesn't turn the whole show into the "Mando & Secret Jedi save the galaxy" thing I fear will happen.
Also, I'm not sure the Wookies had boats, but the Droids didn't seem to be against riding the waves:
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/b5f230d73ce9c9600635ada18962fdd1/tenor.gif?itemid=15588650)
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Some of us intolerably one dimensional do-gooders like to see similar representations on the screen.
That is a cool looking boat scene you put there. So much more could have been done with the droid army to make them interesting antagonists rather than comic relief. I must have glossed over several cool scenes like that because of how the droids were portrayed personality wise.
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Weren't the wookiee catamaran craft usable in the water and air?
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I don't recall if the Wookie Catamaran was ever shown in the water, though the hull shape certainly leads one to believe that water landings were part of the plan. I think this image is more fan art than canon but you wouldn't be the first to see the water relationship.
(https://starwarsblog.starwars.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/EP3_ART_244-1.jpg)
I'm not totally sure if they are ever shown in the water in movies or games? They seem to always be flying about.
I always thought the Droidekka felt appropriately scary. It seemed to be the one enemy that the Jedi tended to run from rather than face.
Mandalorian gives droids a more threatening feel. Maybe that results from the "normal" vs. droid match up. That might not be so scary for a Jedi, but for the other 99.999% of the galaxy they would be pretty worthy adversaries. Even Mando has his struggles with the Security droids in the prison break episode. He clearly has a means to handle them, but they aren't pushovers and don't get treated as non-threatening. And of course, the Droid army killing Mando's parents are given an ominous feel too. That scene has more of a massacre feel to it than simply overrunning some defenses or besting a local militia.
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I agree on the Mandalorian making droids in general more threatening opponents. Very different from the comedy relief “uh oh” and “roger, roger” vibe of the fairly useless B1 Battle Droids which I think undermines the whole tone of the Star Wars universe. Such farcical antics are better suited to Mel Brooks satire.
Both in the movies....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hm0HcCDJ8c
And tv shows....
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Season 2, Episode 1. Epic! Epic! Epic! I loved it and can not wait to see where it goes now. Please, please, please Disney, take Star Wars from Kathleen Kennedy and give it to Jon Favreau. Please!
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I was mildly disappointed...
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/49/2619-011120212454-49091480.jpeg)
lol
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Haha! Nice one.
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Off to a very good start. Interesting choice to cast Olyphant as the small-town lawman. I also learned that Cobb Vanth was previously established to have Boba's armor in the Star Wars novel Aftermath. That makes me interested to go read the book.
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Off to a very good start. Interesting choice to cast Olyphant as the small-town lawman.
For me only logical after Deadwood and Justified, i loved how he played more or less the same role in 3 enviroments. ;)
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Really liked the first episode of the new series.
Great watching the Childs ears flapping about and it's expressions.
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I really liked it as well.
I wonder if Boba will be a help or an adversary.
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My guess is adversary.
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My hope is it isn’t Boba.
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For me only logical after Deadwood and Justified, i loved how he played more or less the same role in 3 enviroments. ;)
Make it four, he's also quite good in season 4 of Fargo... lol
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My hope is it isn’t Boba.
Wasn’t Boba eaten by a sand worm? I thought only his armor survived… :?
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Wasn’t Boba eaten by a sand worm? I thought only his armor survived… :?
Sand worms are on Dune. Boba fell into a Sarlac pit.
If it is not Boba it is a very old Clone Trooper. That would be cool as well.
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Rex!
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It could have been Rex, although all through Rebels he sported a white beard, having Rex present would also tie into the rumours that Asoka shows up later.
IMDB claims that Temuera Morrison played Boba Fett in Mandalorian S2E1: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0607325/?ref_=tt_cl_t15 (https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0607325/?ref_=tt_cl_t15)
I was a little dissapointed, but even a so-so episode of the Mandalorian is better than most other things out there presently :)
And yeah, it seems like Timothy Olyphant has been typecast as a "grumpy/angry Sherif", which suits him.
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Rex!
That would actually be way cooler than Boba. He was in the Siege of Mandalore. So that could make for some great stories.
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Rex had a white beard in Return of the Jedi as well. I am pretty sure it was Boba. As for the Sarlaac... he survived in the old expanded universe, although I forget how and Disney has invalidated the old expanded universe.
And to be fair, it was foreshadowed with the Mandalorian surviving the “dragon” swallowing him.
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I'm neither excited nor bummed about the Boba Fett connection. Since the armor showed up, I guess it stands to reason that he would also pop up to claim it. I'll assume that, beyond the cameo, he will point Mando towards other survivors and go back to being a Dune Sea hermit. I don't think he will likely play a big role. I really can't see how that would fit. Maybe Boba would have some info about the race that Yoda (and Yaddle) belonged to? Maybe Boba will just try to kill the Child? That would put Mando in an interesting quandary. Kill a (maybe) Mandalorian to save the Child?
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But Boba is not a Mandalorian. Even if he were he is disgraced as he has lost his armor.
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Rex had a white beard in Return of the Jedi as well.
Sand and beards don't mix ;D
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I watched the new episode with my wife and kids and we really enjoyed it. It was a great homage to old westerns. I'm not sure why the Mandalorian gets Star Wars and the new trilogy did not (Solo and Rogue One got the idea right), however it did not disappoint.
Loved the sheriff, needing to form an alliance between enemies, and Fett showing up in the end (would hate for it to not be Fett, stay with the telegraphed nature of the old Westerns).
Made me think of Audie Murphy and John Wayne, and that is rarely a bad thing.
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I loved it. :-* So many nods to different things. Did you see the Sheriff riding one of the engines from Anakins Pod Racer?
It is amazing how quick the 3D print miniature companies came up with models for this episode! Even the Dragon!! :o :o :o
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I watched the first and second episodes with mixed feelings.
The first one was great with a strong western vibe and lots of interesting ideas. Some surprise on Boba Fet but lets see what John Favreau reserves to the character.
The second wasnt so great but still with some interesting parts. i wont spoil the surprise of seing it but looking forward to your comments. ;)
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I felt a bit disappointed with the second episode.
At the end of this blog post I talk in more detail about my thoughts on the episode for those curious...
https://thegrumpygnome.home.blog/2020/11/09/ever-onward/
... but I really did not get what the writer/director were intending to convey with The Child’s eating habit. They seemed to miss the irony of the episode given the final scene.
And I think it suffered from being to short, it felt rushed overall although the individual scenes were often ok, the plot suffered a bit for lack of consistency with the bigger story and universe.
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I liked it :)
A nice nod to some original canon and it was good to see Feloni again but even better that the actor got the screen time rather than him.
I do agree about the length but that goes for pretty much all the episodes. An hour each would be better as long as they weren't padded out just for the sake of it.
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Really enjoyed episode two, although it left me with a question regarding the Child's eating habits...
What if he's not just a cheeky little bollocks, but a baby Sith? I mean, that last scene in the cockpit was pretty cold.... :?
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I think that, as in the first season, some episodes are mostly pillars for the story and not stories by themselves. The second one is one of them,IMHO.
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Really enjoyed episode two, although it left me with a question regarding the Child's eating habits...
What if he's not just a cheeky little bollocks, but a baby Sith? I mean, that last scene in the cockpit was pretty cold.... :?
lol Nah, Mando just doesn't feed him enough :D
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I agree Jolly Bob. Eating the eggs of a sentient being is not just a little bit naughty and eating it covertly conveys a sense of understanding. The question is, did the writer intend it to be a cheeky joke, am expression of something darker? It did not come across as the writer was aware of or expressing the real horror of it.
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But they're not fertilised. Fine by me :D
Sith baby Yoda works for me as well lol
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Having looked about the internet it interesting what some theories throw up.
Some folks seem to think that baby yoda wasn't eating the eggs as they appeared to be swallowed whole. Also, they are just eggs. As for being of sentience? Every living creature is sentient so unless you are vegan, you would also have to take issue with eating any egg...
Personally I found it amusing and reminded me of when Luke first landed on Dagobah and Yoda was just helping himself to his food etc.
As for Sith? Well it's clear you are not born to either light or dark, so it is entirely possible that without guidance of one or the other that at times, both can be seen. Hence the force choke we have already seen too in the last series, which in terms of story telling, tends to be something we see far more commonly from the Sith.
A friend an I were also theorising what baby Yoda could represent. Being that this is set between the Return of the Jedi and the latest trilogy. We know that the Sith have used clones before and have an interest in cloning tech. We also know that Yoda was one of the most powerful Jedi - and possibly more importantly, longest living. We also know that in the last movie Palpatine was able to gain rejuvenation from Ren and Rey. So there is some sort of potential plot line around trying to create a clone force of Jedi, or possibly a source of rejuvenation for Palpatine? Though the original bounty was dead or alive which might suggest that there was some sort of 'issue' with him, perhaps too inherently good/light?
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My wife said the same thing about them being unfertilized.
I was lazy in writing just sentient, I meant higher level sentience. (EDIT: Perhaps I should have used “sapient”? I seem to confuse the two words). A chicken may be sentient but I would not balk about eating chicken eggs compared to human, ape or dolphin eggs. But that may be my own arrogance and ignorance at play. For some reason The Child eating what appeared to be a lower sentience amphibian in a previous episode is not the same as eating the eggs of a distressed being that can be communicated with. As I reflect on that, it does appear somewhat arrogant and ignorant, as well as hypocritical of me to make assumptions about levels of sentience/sapience and the ethics of eating such creatures/beings as well as their young.
Given my wrestling with the ethics of animal and AI rights I really have not come to a firm resolution. I can not explain why I feel dolphins, horses, dogs, apes, whales and so forth should have more rights than say a chicken or cow. So I have to wonder at the logic of it since I can not explain it. For whatever reason I had a sudden and overwhelming disgust at the eating of the Passenger’s eggs unlike anything else the Child has eaten. A sense of wrongness, not just distaste along the lines of my opinion on say, caviar.
From a certain perspective our protagonists were the monsters that trespassed and ate one of the young ice spiders before they in turn acted in what could be described as self defense. It does make me wonder what they normally feed on in that environment. And how related they are to Krykna. At times the show has me confused as to where they are because I thought Jawas for example were only on Tatooine.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Krykna
As for Sith... I agree, it seems unlikely that something is born Jedi or Sith. Those seem to me to be philosophical path choices.
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As anyone with kids can attest to. Children will try to eat everything.
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Fair point Dr. Zombie, I am constantly trying to teach my son empathy towards our tortoises, various insects and plants. Said empathy is admittedly in direct conflict with my arachnophobia.
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Perhaps "Sith" was too prescriptive of me... I meant that maybe the Child isn't quite as innocent as he appears. Remember he is over fifty years old, as well - who's to say that species doesn't mature faster mentally than they do physically? Maybe that's why they are so strong with the Force, they have longer to practice at a higher operational level.
It would make sense in a way that a species that was physically vulnerable for so long would have other ways to defend themselves. And as mentioned earlier, the philosophy of the whole Jedi/Sith thing depends a lot on temperament and experience...
On the other hand, it's STAR WARS. Just relax and enjoy the ride FFS... lol
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This is a kid eating candies.
On the other hand, the New Republic "Air Forces" appear to have a real problem with the age of the X-Wing pilots... :D :D :D
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As anyone with kids can attest to. Children will try to eat everything.
I don’t know the name of Yoda and the child species but, maybe it’s their only flaws… they just can’t stop eating all the can put their little paws on… ::)
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On the other hand, the New Republic "Air Forces" appear to have a real problem with the age of the X-Wing pilots... :D :D :D
lol
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Problem? Beware older folks who have survived in a job that often gets folks killed in their youth.
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But Boba is not a Mandalorian. Even if he were he is disgraced as he has lost his armor.
Not necessarily, Din Djarin's crew are Deathwatch, extremists.
Other Mandalorian in canon (in Rebels) have had no issues removing their helmets, for example.
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So, I guess there might be some people firing up their 3D printers or converting some particular SW Legion minis after this episode...
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Episode 3 was great :D
Nice to see the galaxy expand with different environs etc.
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Episode 3 was great :D
Super great. :D
Lots of ideas too. :D
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I thought it was a decent but not overall amazing episode.
It had some good scenes, as always it looks amazing. But I felt it suffered yet again from the short running time. I thought it felt rushed. And it felt like some plot holes were not addressed because the writer/director was more interested in the really cool scenes rather than needed but not as exciting scenes linking them together.
Yet again I felt like I should try harder to catch up on Clone Wars and Rebels as the little bits I do know from those helped me explain some things to my wife. She enjoyed this episode more than the last one, even though she did not understand a lot of what was going on.
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I think this episode was more interesting than the second one, new places, new ships, new characters and new bits of information about the "Great Game". As Oshiro has said, it has expanded the Galaxy.
And Rick W., about the age of the X-Wing pilots I commented, it was because I am a member of the Spanish Air Forces and here, senior pilots (COs all of them) are posted in higher level of responsibility, nor patrolling the air space. That was the reason of my joke. But I like to see directors and other SW people in these small participations, this is one of the reasons I like a lot "The Mandalorian".
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I am an old warhorse and I completely understand.
Let‘s just say I am overly familiar with folks underestimating someone because of their age.
And yeah, it is nice to see directors care enough about the project to want to be in cameo roles.
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Where do I find series 2 ???
My wife & I watched, & enjoyed, series one on her Firestick, but
we can't find Series 2.
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Only place I know is Disney+.
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Only place I know is Disney+
Unfortunately we would have to pay extra for that.
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I find Disney+ to be worth the cost.
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Well, I'm a little behind but appreciate many of the sentiments already expressed. I thought episode 1 was great, and 2 just left me scratching my head. Wife liked the frog/gecko alien though. I just didn't understand what the point of the episode was, nor why the x-wing pilots would kill the ice spider thing but when Mando asked for help getting the ship flying again they were like "whatever, sucka, you are on your own." So... they came back to tell him that they didn't give two hoots about him (or his companions) freezing to death? I feel like maybe they just wouldn't have returned at all, or called off trying to destroy the Razorcrest once they figured that some crimes plus some "good acts" balance the cosmic legal system so long as he turns on his beacon? Truly, truly, confusing.
Episode 3 was better but will agree with it feeling rushed along. It jumped from action to action with seemingly little indication as to how or why things were happening. Suddenly Mandalorians? Suddenly revenge for killing my brother? Suddenly we are free from the room you trapped us in and we managed to enter the cockpit with little resistance? It all lept about too much for my tastes.
I was hoping the frog people would have absconded with baby Yoda after learning that he had been eating their babies. Take the little monster (their perspective, certainly) to the local authorities for threatening the very survival of their lineage? That didn't happen. Felt like a missed opportunity. Also, how do you miss the chance to make a connection like the Mandalorians looking for the dark saber talking to the guy who "shot down" the gent who happened to be flying around with the dark saber? Just mentioning Moff Gideon should have been enough to trigger an interesting conversation, but that was also missed.
I don't know, so far this season has not felt as coherent and interesting as the first. It is like this season was written by someone that writes those grinding side quests for Bethesda games. Go here, talk to this guy who will tell you to go there and talk to that lady who will tell you to travel over yonder and find an herb which needs to be brought to her brother... Groan.
I hate to say it, but if adding a Jedi will stop the madness, let's do it already! lol
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Yup, I agree. Great point about missed opportunities and the Bethesda side quests vibe is spot on.
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Howdie fellows!
I tremendously enjoyed the first episode and really had a good time for the next two parts.
There are many issues with Mando, but as in series 01 I don’t really care. It looks good, give gazillillions of ideas for the tabletop and is just plain good fun.
Next episode will be the return of Ahsoka!
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I think folks are over thinking the child eating the eggs. They are, at that point, just eggs. They are not sentient. Remember, according to the main series, all living things are part of the force. Plants, animals, microbes, bugs, etc. Essentially eating anything at all, according to the logic, is killing something with a 'soul'. The eggs at least have no presence of mind to affect. They are just protein jelly.
The Child's eating of the eggs, or really anything it can fit in it's mouth, is a riff on Yoda himself. When we first met Yoda he complains to Luke "How you get so big eating food of this kind?" Then he drags Luke off for food he was making. I think the Child is poking a little bit of fun at how big a deal Yoda seemed to make of food when you look back on it.
Certainly eating the eggs is less 'carnivorous' then eating the living lizards or bugs he's eaten in the past. They aren't children or babies at that point. Just protein until fertilized. Note that he did not try to eat the tadpole....
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I think the eating of the eggs is part of the thankfully rare thoughtless/lazy writing that can creep into something like Star Wars. The Star Wars universe is interesting to me in part for its rich diversity and layered world building. So many cultures, species. So much lore.
This subplot misses the magic of the best of Star Wars by having things like the character only being called “Frog Lady” in the credits. Her name is not given. Her species is not given. Her character is more than just a background extra. Her mate you might argue the pont on but not her. The Star Wars IP has addressed things like this in the past going from Squidhead to Quarren, much to its improvement.
There is also the dialogue where she says the eggs are the last of her bloodline if I remember correctly. Whether that means her family or species is unclear. It does not come across like she can just wait a bit and produce some more. So each egg is potentially one less opportunity for a surviving child. It is interesting to note that there is only one child, making me wonder if it was just the first, the only one that survived the process or that they only fertilized one egg.
So many things that could have been explained better if they had longer running times.
Another thing I did not understand was why Din was so dismissive of her language. “Whatever language it is that you speak” if I remember correctly.
Cinematography 101, everything in a film or tv show is there for a reason. If it was added by accident it should be edited out. Maybe there was an intentional decision not to create a name for her or her species and that line was on purpose. Or maybe it was an accident and the line is ad lib to reflect that they did not have a name for the language at filming. Either way I find it annoying and slightly diminishes what in many ways is a brilliant piece of work.
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The Child is just being a child, when hungry it tries to eat just about anything. I had to stop my 1 year old from eating a live spider the other day. I think people a reading to much into it.
Maybe the Frog Lady species will be fleshed out later, either in a movie, a series or a novel?
It wouldnt be the first time they did something like that.
Take Yoda as an example, we dont even know the name of his species and he has played a far bigger role in Star Wars than I think Frog Lady or her spawn ever will.
I think Frog Ladys situation regarding the eggs is left unclear, because she's just a story device to get Mando to the next planet without using hyperspace. Any more detail on her and it would distract from the main story.
Mando isnt dismissive of her language, he's frustrated with the situation and not being able to communicate with her.
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Also I think that one thing that people are missing is that in all good Sci-fi og fantasy there are a lot of blank spaces for you to fill out yourself or just wonder about.
That is the main attraction for those genres. Everything does not need to be explained in detail. Only hints is really enough and you can fill in the rest with your own immagination. It has nothing to do with lazy writing. It's how it is supposed to be.
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Whilst it is true that not everything needs to be explained out in minute detail just using a speaking character to get a protagonist from one place to another without considering how they fit into the setting is in my opinion the very definition of lazy writing. Saying Frog Lady is not important enough to distract us with her name or her species name suggests she did not need dialogue at all.
Folks do not need to analyze things as much as I do. If you enjoy it without looking at the small details, cool. I am constantly trying to improve my own story telling skills in various mediums so I remark on things I see, or do not see, and those that care to discuss are welcome to do so. This thread has already given me pause to rethink some of my own views and values. And that is cool. That is what discussion about art should do.
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The "it's just an egg" argument is hard for me to accept. While the Child does eat a variety of frog things across the galaxy, none of those frogs (Krill pond, for instance) had the wherewithal to book transport to another planet where their spouse was working to build a better life. I don't know what it says about the Child, but someone mentioned that "sneaking" eggs does show an understanding of right/wrong. One doesn't sneak when there is the belief that the behavior is acceptable. The Child doesn't "sneak" eating frog things on other planets and performs happily for a group of small children. But in this episode, the writing clearly indicates that both Mando and the Child understand that it isn't OK to eat the eggs. So why then is the character both a focus AND unimportant? Did we need to be introduced to the character just so Mando has a babysitter in the third episode? You know... a babysitter whose children the Child eats uncontrollably?
It's odd. I don't think you have to look very deep for this to be odd, and I think that is what gets to me. I don't know that you can add more minutes to the show and explain away this entirely awkward plot thread. I'm hoping that there is actually some link that comes back which gives me a sense of all the pieces falling into place. Perhaps nobody knows where Yoda is from, but that his people routinely eat the frog people's offspring? The frog people don't speak "whatever Mandalorians speak" and thus they can't say "Sweet mother of god, why do you have one of those awful baby munchers on your ship?" Or maybe they just accept the loss? I mean, laying a lot of eggs is typically a survival strategy to make sure that some offspring survive the predator/food chain gauntlet. But, maybe they (once you get a translator) can point the way to a whole colony of Yodas because they are from the same swamp planet?
That would make the story, as it has been told to date, make sense. Make more sense. There are still some weird holes in the idea, but it would be one that I could follow along with. Right now it does just feel sloppy.
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The Child is just being a child, when hungry it tries to eat just about anything. I had to stop my 1 year old from eating a live spider the other day. I think people a reading to much into it.
That was precisely my take on it. We all thought it was a great touch - and much more in line with the amoral characters and universe that the series has created. Like his samurai-movie and spaghetti-western antecedents, Mando isn't a "good guy" - witness his casual murder of Jawas, his shady past with the space pirates, and his leaving the cyclops chap hanging (to be eaten alive, presumably).The egg-eating fits in with all that.
That grittiness makes for a much better experience, I think. In our house, we much prefer Star Wars when it leans towards Yojimbo and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly than when it goes the other way.
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Shit, I had an omelette the other day.
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I have really enjoyed episodes 1 and 3, though episode 2 wasn't great in my opinion... why did the new republic pilots come back to just leave them..?
Loved 1 and 3 though - great star wars action and the grittiness referred to by others.
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Again I agree with you Andrew.
I like grittiness but I also like a bit more clarity and completeness in the writing of plot. A protagonist does not have to mirror my moral values to be worth watching in a compelling story.
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Cracking series so far, really rekindled my love for Star Wars, It’s got a great mix of action , storyline and some comical elements too, some fantastic settings too, as for the child eating eggs, I think some of you are getting far to serious about it, kids will try to eat anything if you let them! And I don’t think mando feeds him enough!
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The Child is depicted doing something the audience will find transgressive to demonstrate that the Mandalorian MUST starting taking a more active parental role. But of course he is hardly equipped to do so!
In Season 1, we saw a lot of “This Is The Way” without much looking into WHY it’s the Way. Pretty much every character, even quite minor ones, are presented from a moral perspective. They all have their codes, sometimes more and sometimes less flexible.
The major exception to this is obviously the Child ... because it’s a child. Blankly repeating “This is the Way” or “I have spoken” may be fine for adults summing up their ethics but that kind of laconic attitude is useless when you need to TEACH the difference between right and wrong to a child.
Notice that S2 has already introduced some major themes along these lines. Cobb Vanth in S2E1 had to reconsider his worldview to work with the Tusken Raiders. In S2E2, the frog lady asks whether the vaunted Mandalorian code is “just stories for children.” And then in the latest episode, Bo Katan demonstrates that not all Mandalorians share the same values.
As the Mandalorian grows and develops, he will have to take a harder look at his own sense of what’s right and wrong. We’ve already seen him change (rethinking his hatred of droids and his preference for being a loner) but he needs to get to the point where he can teach the child why it is not okay to eat the eggs of a sentient being.
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Fair points Manchu, and well said.
As far as I am concerned tv shows like the Mandalorian are our contemporary mythology, our fables. They have the power to influence our values whether we realize it or not. This applies to comic books, movies, and computer games as well.
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As far as I am concerned tv shows like the Mandalorian are our contemporary mythology, our fables. They have the power to influence our values whether we realize it or not. This applies to comic books, movies, and computer games as well.
But take real mythology: the Norse myths and the Greek myths, for example. They're full of dodgy characters doing dodgy stuff - and that's a huge part of their timelessness. No one would look to Thor, Odin and Loki for moral example - but they're terrifically entertaining!
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I am fairly sure depending on how the tale is told some folks have taken their cues from Odin, Thor and Loki. And those characters have been reinvented time and time again to suit different agendas, ie Marvel.
Look I am not trying to say they should not have morally ambiguous characters, that the show should not be gritty or anything like that. I am saying have a purpose behind doing that. That is what makes a show a great classic rather than mediocre “junk food” entertainment. Tolkien or Howard versus say Norman (Gor).
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I actually did like this weeks episode, because even though it was mostly action scenes, the scenes were well done.
Still I wonder whether they have revealed the MacGuffin "purpose" of the child too early. Also, did this suspected purpose really have to be tied to the ill-planned and story-less stinker that was the third trilogy?
Well, we´ll see where the story goes. At least they are definitely ramping up the "let's sell some more toys" (which old nerds might even recognize) aspect of StarWars again.
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I am fairly sure depending on how the tale is told some folks have taken their cues from Odin, Thor and Loki. And those characters have been reinvented time and time again to suit different agendas, ie Marvel.
I wonder if it's not the other way round: that Odin, Thor and Loki (and Zeus, Hera, Apollo, etc.) have lasted because they reflect human emotions and failings. They have been reinvented, sure - but few would argue that the Marvel versions improve on the Eddas, for example. And, with an 800-year headstart, it's a fairly safe bet that the Eddic versions will prove more durable!
Also, the most lasting works of literature tend to revolve around flawed - sometimes heavily flawed - characters. One could argue that tragedy is often considered the highest form of drama precisely because it centres on heavily flawed characters. And epic tends to revolve around flawed characters, too: think of Achilles, Gilgamesh, Rostam and Sigurd.
Look I am not trying to say they should not have morally ambiguous characters, that the show should not be gritty or anything like that. I am saying have a purpose behind doing that. That is what makes a show a great classic rather than mediocre “junk food” entertainment. Tolkien or Howard versus say Norman (Gor).
Does the purpose need to go beyond showing that the Child is just, well, a child, though? I mean, we all thought it hilarious because my wife and I could remember our kids being exactly like that (greedy, somewhat devious and entirely amoral, at around the time they were beginning to talk), and one child could remember the other being like that. We all thought it was a great little detail precisely because it rang true.
But it achieved more than mimesis; it was poignant too, because we knew that while the eggs were just a tasty snack for the Child, they were the future for the frog-people. So it was both comic and tragic.
And it set up some nice tension in the scene with the tadpole - because we could infer that the Child saw the infant as a treat rather than a playmate.
On Tolkien: much as I love his works, I tend to agree with critics who say that the weakness of The Lord of the Rings is its black and white morality. The book's a mix of epic and novel, and I think the novelistic sections (those featuring Gollum, the hobbits or the orcs) are stronger because there's more moral ambiguity - especially with Gollum. I love the epic bits, but I think they can pale slightly against real epic because the morality's a bit simplistic. I don't quite agree with Moorcock here (https://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/jan/25/featuresreviews.guardianreview18) as I think LotR is, ultimately, a stronger and richer work than The Broken Sword (great though the latter is), but I do think that he makes some strong points.
On the whole, isn't it fair to say the more moral complexity a book, film or series has, the better it's likely to be? I think that's one reason that The Mandalorian, with its grittier universe and moral shades of grey, is so much better than the recent series of Star Wars films. I reckon you could also make a case that Star Wars films generally declined in quality the further they got from their roots in jidaigeki and revisionist westerns, grit, cynicism and all.
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Chapter 12 was fucking awesome!
Time to get the toys out :D
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Tonight’s episode was fun. Filled with lots of nostalgia and Easter eggs. Too short again but I did not pick up plot holes like the previous episode.
My point about Tolkien was not about morality, hence adding Howard, but rather detailed world building.
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I must be missing something, because this show just reminds me of a slightly more violent Saturday Morning Cartoon, rather than anything "gritty" or tense, or gripping.
It's kinda fun, but Pedro Fett just strikes me as a less charismatic imitation of old Clint Eastwood characters, and the plots extremely simplistic. Which is fine. Not like I expected much from a Disney+ original. It's a streaming service aimed at kids. Pedro and Baby Yoda meet a new scary monster every week, and kill it. Or they run into stormtroopers and easily defeat them. It's Star Wars Lite.
I guess it's better than the Sequel Trilogy, but that's so low of a bar you can skip over it.
I think the most entertaining part of this season so far is, knowing the behind the scenes drama with Pedro Pascal, watching literally every other Mandalorian character and stunt-casted actor taking their helmet off at every opportunity.
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I think the most entertaining part of this season so far is, knowing the behind the scenes drama with Pedro Pascal, watching literally every other Mandalorian character and stunt-casted actor taking their helmet off at every opportunity.
That’s bollocks as has been discussed further back in this thread
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Chapter 12 was fucking awesome!
Time to get the toys out :D
Mine are out already.
Painting more stuff... :D ;D
Just loved this episode.
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I agree that the Stormtroopers are being portrayed as rather inept. Which is disappointing. They are however better portrayed than the New Order.
Whilst the show is full of tropes I think they are generally done well and I find Pedro Pascal to be doing a fine, charismatic job in the role. He has excellent scenes where he can portray emotions well without having to task his mask off. And not taking his helmet off is I believe in him having been taken in by Death Watch.
Folks might wonder why I am so passionate about Star Wars. As a child the first film was incredibly important to me. I listed to an audio version of it on cassette tape over and over and over. Hundreds if not thousands of times. Even to this day over four decades later I can quite lines from the first film verbatim.
As the years went by and Lucas brought out more films I grew increasingly distant from his evolving vision. That made me sad. I got my hopes up for the recent films but they all disappointed. Some more than others. For whatever reason this show finally speaks to me the way the original film did.
I am engaging in this thread in part to think out loud and try to figure out why I get the same goosebumps I did as a kid when all the recent movies failed to evoke that response.
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I must be missing something, because this show just reminds me of a slightly more violent Saturday Morning Cartoon, rather than anything "gritty" or tense, or gripping.
Not sure what you have in mind for “gritty or tense, or gripping” but S2 opens with Mando stringing a dude up and leaving him to be consumed alive by vermin. In a cartoon (for kids), this situation might be set up but (a) it would be the work of a villain rather than the protagonist and (b) it would have been resolved with the victim’s rescue.
I mean, it’s not flat-out horror, nor is it aiming for that. I think by “gritty,” most people mean something a little bit moral and a little bit physical. The main thrust of the setting is the fringe and frontier of civilization: locations and props are dirty and well-used and characters are wary of others and not completely trustworthy themselves.
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I have liked a lot this episode, classic Star Wars, but I am also begining to feel they are too short. A lot of plot is lost with such a hurry!
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I must be missing something, because this show just reminds me of a slightly more violent Saturday Morning Cartoon, rather than anything "gritty" or tense, or gripping.
A) It's Star Wars, B) It's designed to be family friendly, C) It's star wars.
What was the highest age certification for a Star Wars movie?
It's kinda fun, but Pedro Fett just strikes me as a less charismatic imitation of old Clint Eastwood characters, and the plots extremely simplistic.
Erm, what? Firstly, it's pretty clear it is designed to be a homage to "the man with no name" and other westerns. You even have episodes that hark to the likes of the seven samurai / magnificent 7 etc. As for plot. You really can't mention the Spaghetti Westerns and then suggest that the plots are extremely simplistic. I mean none of those movies had complicated plots at all, they were incredibly simplistic really.
I think the most entertaining part of this season so far is, knowing the behind the scenes drama with Pedro Pascal, watching literally every other Mandalorian character and stunt-casted actor taking their helmet off at every opportunity.
As has already been said, this was a fake rumour. But even then, if you have watched any of the other series you would know that the way of the Mandolar is a reference to Mandolar, an actual person who is a hero to many Mandalorian natives. However, as described in the last episode, some follow a strict code they believe he set. So far, we haven't seen a Mandalorian of the same group as our main character, remove their helmet.
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The Child is just being a child, when hungry it tries to eat just about anything. I had to stop my 1 year old from eating a live spider the other day. I think people a reading to much into it.
That! When my daughter started to crawl, no bug living or dead was safe from her. That’s just what little children do.
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Just finished today’s episode. Yes, it’s simple (not simplistic!), yes, it’s rushed, but it was (again!) great fun, and I can even get my wife to watch it on a regular basis.
Loved the style, the school and Moff G.‘s ship at the end. So many tabletop opportunities.
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A) It's Star Wars,
Rogue One was Star Wars, and it wasn't structured like a children's cartoon. Neither was The Empire Strikes Back, for that matter. Turns out that being Star Wars doesn't mean something can't have an interesting story with mature themes.
The Mandalorian just is what is is. A live action cartoon Star Wars Lite for preteens. You can still like it, but let's not pretend it isn't the same show where Pedro Fett crawls up the side of a sand crawler while Jawas throw trash at him, only remembering they have Space Tasers when he reaches the top so they can zap him off and he can fall off the side like Wliey Coyote.
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Rogue One was Star Wars, and it wasn't structured like a children's cartoon. Neither was The Empire Strikes Back, for that matter. Turns out that being Star Wars doesn't mean something can't have an interesting story with mature themes.
The Mandalorian just is what is is. A live action cartoon Star Wars Lite for preteens. You can still like it, but let's not pretend it isn't the same show where Pedro Fett crawls up the side of a sand crawler while Jawas throw trash at him, only remembering they have Space Tasers when he reaches the top so they can zap him off and he can fall off the side like Wliey Coyote.
Rogue One, was far grittier but still not a 15. It was still aimed at being digestible by a family audience. Even more so with the Empire Strikes Back. Yes, there are 'some' mature themes. And again that very much depends upon what you class as a mature theme. Revealing a father you didn't know isn't particularly mature. The concept of a less than straightforward love as seen between Leia and Han isn't particularly mature either. The plots on neither are complicated. In fact, the plot of Empire is relatively straight forward as is Rogue One. Doesn't stop either being great movies to watch though.
As for adult themes, he obliterated several Jawas in an angry rage in season one... Then you have sort of likenesses to Shane (western) at some moments too. The times when he is tempted, albeit briefly, to stop and settle down, but then his guns are needed. And the conflict between only taking the 'good' jobs, and then the balance of taking the 'bad' jobs because they are the means in which to reach the 'good' outcome. Then there is the genocide that saw the death of both his parents. He has been not trusting, too trusting, critical of others for not trusting or seeking a peaceful route etc. There is a fair bit going on for 30-40minute episodes of which there have only been 12 so far.
It's clear you don't like it, but you don't have to belittle it and diminish the reasons others enjoy it. I personally think it hits the spot in terms of again, being for all of he family. There are references, homages and lore that you wouldn't necessarily pick up as a kid. All are nods to the adults that will be watching it with their families.
Also, the characters name is Din Djarin. Pedro is the actors name, I kinda get that, and Fett belongs to two characters, Jango and Boba, neither of which are/were Mandalorians. They wear the armour but that's it. Surely Pedrolorian would be better? ;D
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Dudes it’s totally useless to discuss whether the show is “gritty” without first agreeing on what that even means. As I said before, it seems like most people use that term to refer to the frontier worn’n’rusted aesthetic plus the moral tone of trust having to be earned rather than assumed.
Also, calling the show a live action cartoon for pre-teens is weird. Who are you trying to impress with this edginess? OF COURSE people who enjoy this show understand it is a pulp adventure. So how is that a critique? Do you want it to be more gory or sexually explicit? Why? What would be the point?
Citing Rogue One as an example of “mature themes” is pretty absurd. It could have gone that way (Cassian Andor murdering the Rebel informant at the beginning of the film, Saw Gerrara being “Apocalypse Now”-style insane) but those ideas are abandoned before our eyes during the film’s runtime. What a terrible mess that film was. If you want to use “cartoon” as a pejorative term, especially meaning juvenile and superficial, then that term definitely applies to Rogue One. But Darth Vader murdered a hallway full of terrified Rebels like Jason Vorhees so I guess it’s “mature.”
The Empire Strikes Back has at least one fairly sophisticated subplot: Lando, a conman turned legitimate businessman and civic administrator, morally compromises himself — to nobly protect his people or selfishly protect his investment and status? In that sense of “maturity,” The Mandalorian definitely engages in “mature” themes.
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I agree with several of your points Manchu and McFonz.
Manchu, thank you for giving me a different perspective on that Vader scene. I really liked that scene for the cinematography but you articulated something that I had picked up on but could not really explain. I thought the scene illustrated why Vader was so feared but I had not considered the actual helpless horror aspect.
It would be nice if folks could avoid snarkiness in their critiques. I saw a comment in another thread referencing this conversation that soured my mood because of the implied snarkiness in it as well as what has crept into this conversation. If my critiques of the show have come across as snarky, rude or disrespectful I apologize.
To be honest I am beginning to regret ever voicing my opinion in this thread, which I accept is my own fault. Seems I keep forgetting the advice, “never get off the boat”.
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The Vader scene is fine — it’s cool to see the Dark Lord be scary. It’s just not all that “mature” in any meaningful way, hence my comparison to slasher horror. It’s fun but just as cartoonish as any other cartoonish aspect of Star Wars.
The main problem with Rogue One isn’t it’s lack of “maturity,” however; rather, the issue is, its characters are paper thin. By contrast, The Mandalorian has great characters. Even minor characters have lots of personality. And as I mentioned above, it is pretty interesting that both main and minor characters in the show are presented as having a moral perspective, one way or the other.
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I think you might all be over thinking it lol
I'm enjoying it loads, can't wait till next weeks installment
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I agree with you Manchu.
I apologise if I came in a bit heavy handed.
I'll be honest here, I am a bit tired of the toxicity that the counter star wars culture is generating. People who look to do nothing but criticise the modern movies/series as being aimed at children etc. That, despite the fact that Lucas always wanted his movies to be aimed at the family audience - and quite rightly, he had investments in the toy sales resulting from the franchises. Toys sell, primarily to kids, bought by their parents.
To consider Star Wars was anything but that is disingenuous. The complexity of star wars has always been that it can deliver to every generation it is aimed at. That there are themes for all, love, romance, family, good vs evil and everything in between. At the heart the plot and story isn't that unique, it's the telling of the story and the richness of the setting that make it brilliant.
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Sorry I'm a bit behind - just saw Ep1 S2 tonight and loved it. The thrill of seeing red R5 (complete with scorched marks where the motivator blew!) in the ship bay on Tatooine was too much. The fun with Timothy Olyphant as Marshall, the glimpse of Boba Fett at the end ... just too much for my poor inferior pre-teen immature self.
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I agree with you Manchu.
I apologise if I came in a bit heavy handed.
Not at all, I think you and I seem to be on the same page. My comments are more aimed at faulting the show for having a broad appeal. It’s just an odd perspective when clearly what is needed for/from this franchise is exactly that. ... just too much for my poor inferior pre-teen immature self.
Haha yes exactly! Same here! And just wait til you see the next two episodes, which are even better.
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Episode five was great :D
I would suggest to watch it with the lights down low as it is a visually dark episode.
Oh, Thrawn got a mention 8)
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Eagerly awaiting my wife to get home so we can watch it. Thrawn is one of the only things I liked about the “Rebels” episodes that I dip sampled. Interesting take on a villain. I tried to explain my interest in his character to my wife but she just did not get it. A failure on my part to adequately articulate my thoughts it would seem. I am very curious where he fits in the scheme of things now.
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The episode is called "Jedi" and everything is better with Jedi
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everything is better with Jedi
Oooo, that's debatable lol
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I was very skeptical of this season's success after Episode 2 and 3 but this one is pretty close to perfect.
The cinematography is stellar. I would even go as far as saying that it might contain my favourite Star Wars combat choreography yet. Don't want to go into too much detail, even though this is a spoilers-thread, but I liked how very fluid yet not frantic everything was.
The episode contained tons of references to other movies, tropes and Star Wars canon and set up some nice plot strands as well.
Before watching it, I was not sure whether I would have a real interest in the series anymore (as much as I appreciated the great Bo-Katan) but now you can count me in on the journey.
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Brilliant episode.
I would have preferred a slightly different outcome with “the gunslinger”, it was a little too obvious and the HK assassin droids were underwhelming considering their reputation in the lore and what the Series has already shown of IG units but yeah beautiful cinematography, good pacing, good dialogue, good costuming, good set dressing, good combat choreography (melee and ranged).
A truly brilliant episode.
Thrawn...Boba Fett... some serious loose ends to tie up. And potentially another Jedi?!
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We just watched it and had a splendid time! I really think this was the best episode yet (and that is saying something, because I liked all episodes and loved quite a few).
One question to those LAFers with more Samurai experience: I had the impression that several parts of the episode were a reference to an older Eastern or Samurai movie, e.g. the castle, the alarm bill, the cages (reminding me of crucified prisoners). Is this so or was it just a general homage to this genre?
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and everything is better with Jedi
Are you sure?
(https://blueprint-api-production.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/story/thumbnail/37133/85752a8c-ded4-45c7-9fbf-7bea0b15adca.jpg)
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Brilliant episode. This whole series has been great (bar episode 2) but this one was awesome. You don't realise how much you miss lightsabres until they appear again!
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Are you sure?
(https://blueprint-api-production.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/story/thumbnail/37133/85752a8c-ded4-45c7-9fbf-7bea0b15adca.jpg)
I had erased that from my memory, thanks ;D ;D ;D
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You don't realise how much you miss lightsabres until they appear again!
This is the way. :)
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I had an awkward moment watching the show with my wife when she said something about “laser swords”.
In typical Star Wars fanboy geek mode I immediately said, “Not laser... plasma. And light saber not laser sword.”
Side note: Yes, I know Luke makes a laser sword comment in one of the recent movies which apparently is sarcastically referencing something from the original production and sabers are usually curved... but hey I did not come up with the name.
Only to then have Din make a comment about Ahsoka’s “laser swords”.......
Needless to say the look I got from my wife spoke volumes.
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In Spain we have not that "dilemma", they are "Espadas Láser", laser swords. :) :)
I agree with all of you, great episode, very good in all senses but the end of the Gunslinger. But this is a Samurai/Western show...
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I had erased that from my memory, thanks ;D ;D ;D
What Jam-Jar...*
* - search for goldfish Carrott castle.
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Bloody loved it.
I am also beginning to wonder if this series is going to be the launch pad of various other series.
Cara Dune is rumoured to be getting her own series, unless she is found to be too controversial with her political views (lets not go down that rabbit hole here 8)). Now, the last we saw of her, she was given a token as a form of an invite to return to the "rebels" or perhaps the New Republic? It sets itself as a great moment for her to branch off on her own adventures.
Then there is Asoka Tano. She may well get her own series too. She is a firm favourite from Clone Wars and a creation of Filoni. So we know that the love is there, and she certainly has a story to be told, though we know she is no longer alive by the time of RoS as her voice is heard speaking to Rey and it has been confirmed all those we hear in that segment are no longer around at that time, having passed on to where ever it is Jedi spirits go to.
I sort of wonder if the Bo-Katan and Mandalor storyline might be the plot that sort of acts a bit like the catalyst for some team ups? Some shared plots across stories etc?
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One question to those LAFers with more Samurai experience: I had the impression that several parts of the episode were a reference to an older Eastern or Samurai movie, e.g. the castle, the alarm bill, the cages (reminding me of crucified prisoners). Is this so or was it just a general homage to this genre?
The Mandalorian himself seems heavily influenced by the main character in Yojimbo. In addition I thought the early sequences in the forest were very reminiscent of Throne of Blood, Kurusawa's take on MacBeth.
This was my favorite episode episode to date.
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Ok... I'm not retracting my take on adding Jedi to this series but... as a cameo, I thought it played well. I was glad to see that Tano wouldn't be tagging along for the rest of the season, even if I rather enjoyed her in the episode. I think it maybe helps that she isn't a Jedi in the common goody-two-shoes manner, and by the time of this episode I believe she isn't a Jedi at all? I'm not well versed in the back and forth of her story arc.
That said, having refused to take/train the child I'm a bit bummed that we have to go on another Jedi hunt.
It does seem that this season is working towards introducing some characters that might work well in their own spin-off series. Bo-Katan's quest to regain the darksaber would be a good story to follow.
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by the time of this episode I believe she isn't a Jedi at all? I'm not well versed in the back and forth of her story arc.
Quoting Wookiepedia "Tano was framed for the bombing of the Jedi Temple hangar and other homicides, and she escaped into the Coruscant underworld to clear her name. Though she formed an unlikely alliance with Asajj Ventress, she was detained by Republic forces and was consequently barred from the Jedi Order. Ultimately, Anakin Skywalker uncovered the true culprit, Tano's friend, and fellow Padawan Barriss Offee, and prevented his former apprentice from being convicted of sedition. Nevertheless, the ordeal dislodged Tano's faith in the Jedi. She refused the Jedi High Council's offer to rejoin the Order, instead of departing in search of a new path and becoming a Force-Sensitive Outcast."
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Yeah, I just watched that episode on Clone Wars! She was kicked out by the council after being falsely accused, but when the real culprit was found and she was invited to be re-admitted to the order, she was so disgusted that the council had not trusted her, she literally walked off into the sunset. Presumably this is how she survived the purge of Order 66. Kids' show though it is, there are some interesting and mature nuances to the Clone Wars stories underneath the cartoon fun. This is one of the stories that show the Jedi Order to be less than the perfect models of wisdom they aim to be, perhaps part of Palpatine's grand scheme to draw them into a galaxy wide war, eroding their peaceful and non-political values to fatally weaken them from within. The actual bomber was a Jedi herself, torn by how far the Order had strayed from their traditional values, no longer seeing them not as reluctant protectors, but aggressors in the war.
But I digress. Yup, Ahsoka Tano is cool.
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She's a trained Jedi, but not part of the Jedi order. It isn't only the being exiled from the Jedi Order that leads to her choice, but everything leading up to it.
I felt it to be a bit like the times in Star Trek when one of the captains rails against the non-interference principles of the federation. At times the rules are pompous, arrogant even.
It's a turning point for the Jedi, the beginning of the end so to speak. I think it feeds into the reluctance Yoda initially has to train Luke in Empire too. As such it also bridges to the new movies (love them or hate them) in the sense that Yoda's force ghost suggests that being a Jedi isn't the only way to be a force of good and the order's time had passed. By that point they have Tano to prove that.
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I felt it to be a bit like the times in Star Trek when one of the captains rails against the non-interference principles of the federation. At times the rules are pompous, arrogant even.
In one episode of Next Generation, Jean Luc, in reply to the Doctors
railing against 'The Prime Directive' stops the turbo lift & agrees that
in that particular situation the P.D. seems wrong. He then postulates
a slightly different series of scenarios. It is not so obvious as to where
to draw the line. That, he says, is why we have the P.D. In the early
days of the Federation so many mistakes were made, with the best of
intentions.
When they brought out the Pre-quel to Kirk's Star Trek I thought that
it was a golden opportunity to show those mistakes. To have a 'Kirk'
unhampered by the P.D. Boy was I disappointed with what they did do.
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I'm wondering if Moff Gideon and Thrawn (whatever rank he may have at this time) will come to logger heads and slug it out with the New Republic watching on (or taking part hopefully).
I also wonder if there will be another series set a few years after this one showing the progress, or lack of it, by the New Republic ???
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I'm wondering if Moff Gideon and Thrawn (whatever rank he may have at this time) will come to logger heads and slug it out with the New Republic watching on (or taking part hopefully).
I also wonder if there will be another series set a few years after this one showing the progress, or lack of it, by the New Republic ???
I've seen rumours about a Poe Dameron series... potentially that could be set prior to the new trilogy. Perhaps that could give more of that side of things? There's quite a bit of time between the Mandalorian and the latest trilogy so I suspect we may get to see all sorts of things explored by different characters. I think that's what I like about it. We're seeing a bounty hunters take on it, all be it one with on the whole good tendencies thankfully.
We are also seeing a different side of the force as well. The universe observing it from a distance, still people out there who believe it to be a bit of a myth. Still some old scores to settle like Mandalor still not having been freed. Perhaps reminding us that the Empire still has a grip in places. Though so far in this series it's definitely somewhat weaker.
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There's quite a bit of time between the Mandalorian and the latest trilogy so I suspect we may get to see all sorts of things explored by different characters.
I was wondering if the title sequence for The Mandalorian - with all the different heads and helmets (pfff) flashing alongside the Stranger Things-style intro music was a hint that there's a variety of different stories being written, ready to be drip-fed into the TV episode format. If so, they're probably boxing a bit clever after dumping too many Star Wars movies in quick succession and maybe want to take things slower, making sure they have good stories, good characters and good casting, not to mention hunger from the public, before leaping into it.
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I would be very surprised if the Marvel universe marketing strategy is not now going to be applied to the Star Wars universe. I expect several threads to begin being woven together with another 10 year, 3 phase plan.
Gideon versus Thrawn... I had not considered that possibility. Interesting.
Long shot idea... Grogu becomes a Knight of Ren? Or a victim of Ben Solo at Luke’s Academy?
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I know Pedro Pascal is the 'Mandolorian' but am I the only one who thinks he talks and walks just like Timothy Olyphant (Cobb Vanth in the series, Deadwood, Justified)? The only time I've seen PP as other characters he speaks with a Spanish(?) accent.
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The only time I've seen PP as other characters he speaks with a Spanish(?) accent.
I think he's Chilean/American and is a fluent Spanish speaker, which, combined with his Latino looks, probably dictated he'd get a lot of those style parts. He does have a good swagger and presumably they want slim actors for things like that, if only because he needs to fit in the suit without looking oddly bulky.
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Marvel has certainly done a good job of weaving a larger tale over the years. With Disney at the helm of each project, and with a strong drive to turn everything into a franchise/remake/reboot built into the Disney machine, I'd be absolutely stunned if we didn't have more projects like Rogue One in the works. I'm guessing we will see movies and TV series to support the expanding universe of lore. The good news is that there is already a metric ton of source material. Even if you did a live-action/CGI remake of the Clone Wars cartoons, you would have enough material for several years of TV. Video games, books... I think they landed on a gold mine. I doubt I'll live to see the Star Wars (or Trek) well dry up.
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I know Pedro Pascal is the 'Mandolorian' but am I the only one who thinks he talks and walks just like Timothy Olyphant (Cobb Vanth in the series, Deadwood, Justified)? The only time I've seen PP as other characters he speaks with a Spanish(?) accent.
I can recommend watching Pedro Pascal in "Prospect", really nice sci-fi flick of the kind that I wished we would see more of
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I quite enjoyed Prospect.
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I was wondering if the title sequence for The Mandalorian - with all the different heads and helmets (pfff) flashing alongside the Stranger Things-style intro music was a hint that there's a variety of different stories being written, ready to be drip-fed into the TV episode format. If so, they're probably boxing a bit clever after dumping too many Star Wars movies in quick succession and maybe want to take things slower, making sure they have good stories, good characters and good casting, not to mention hunger from the public, before leaping into it.
Ironically, I think they learned a lesson of pitting their movies against other established big hitters. Throwing Solo in against Infinity War, for example.
So yes, I think they have responded a bit, especially with the toxic backlash to daring to have various other races and sexes play major roles in a Star Wars film... They did have plans for other movies which have been shelved. Which actually is another intelligent thing about the Mandalorian series. To me, they are clearly testing out and training up other directors to take on projects of their own under the stewardship of Filoni and Favreau.
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especially with the toxic backlash to daring to have various other races and sexes play major roles in a Star Wars film
Yikes, please don’t re-broadcast this corporate apologist nonsense. Notice how no one has trouble with race or gender when it comes to The Mandalorian. Marvel has certainly done a good job of weaving a larger tale over the years. With Disney at the helm of each project, and with a strong drive to turn everything into a franchise/remake/reboot built into the Disney machine, I'd be absolutely stunned if we didn't have more projects like Rogue One in the works. I'm guessing we will see movies and TV series to support the expanding universe of lore. The good news is that there is already a metric ton of source material. Even if you did a live-action/CGI remake of the Clone Wars cartoons, you would have enough material for several years of TV. Video games, books... I think they landed on a gold mine. I doubt I'll live to see the Star Wars (or Trek) well dry up.
Reading this, I am transported back to 2015. In the interceding five years, I really learned not to take quality Star Wars content for granted. I should have learned it in 1999. But whenever something good (or even just OK) comes out, it’s easy to forget such lessons. Before The Mandalorian came out last year, things did not look great for SW. Kids' show though it is, there are some interesting and mature nuances to the Clone Wars stories underneath the cartoon fun.
Yep and I think this is why Ahsoka is generally well-liked by SW fans despite a rocky start. At first, she seemed a little forced with her “too cool for school” attitude but her long-term arc was set up really well. She wasn’t just edgy for superficial reasons, but rather to rehabilitate the character of Anakin by showing how even despite the Jedi largely failing him, he could still be a good role model. And ultimately, the way she walked away demonstrates that Anakin certainly did not have to become a child-murdering psychopath.
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TBH while I liked Ashoka in the Mandalorian she's still my least favourite star wars character, she was so fucking annoying the clone wars movie and the first few series of the clone wars cartoon that I absolutely hate her. Honestly if I was Anakin I would have turned to the Dark side a lot sooner with a padawan like her. To be fair she was alright in the season 7 of clone wars, but I still had trouble not hating her because it was the same character I couldn't stand, it helps that with the Mandalorian it takes place so much later and it's live action, so I can pretend it's a different character altogether.
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To me, they are clearly testing out and training up other directors to take on projects of their own under the stewardship of Filoni and Favreau.
I was watching the other day and randomly spotted on the credits that it was directed by Bryce Dallas Howard. I just went, "Wait, what?" and had to rewind to check I'd read it right. Then I wondered why I was surprised that someone I knew from one thing was doing something else!
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Ron Howard's daughter directing something? Who could have seen that coming? ::)
I can honestly say there is very little in the Star Wars catalog that I don't enjoy. Episode I is the hardest to watch, for me, but even that has a lot of redeeming moments. I can't say I've ever felt like the franchise was in trouble, or in dire straights. The box-office receipts certainly don't show a franchise that has struggled.
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Ron Howard's daughter directing something? Who could have seen that coming? ::)
I can honestly say there is very little in the Star Wars catalog that I don't enjoy. Episode I is the hardest to watch, for me, but even that has a lot of redeeming moments. I can't say I've ever felt like the franchise was in trouble, or in dire straights. The box-office receipts certainly don't show a franchise that has struggled.
This.^^
I felt the prequel series was patchy, I loved the pod racing though in all fairness, you could have taken it out and I'm not sure you would have lost anything huge from the plot from it. I think they made the Gungans too comical which along with the droids took an edge off the conflict between them. The feel was different because of the reliance upon CGI rather than the mix of the originals which was so brilliantly brought back by force awakens, Rogue One and Solo.
Ep II and III probably could have done with being less padded out. The romance dialogue between Anakin and Amidala and that segment was pretty poor, it was awkward and clunky and again, I think it wouldn't have suffered if it had been chopped. In fact I think this is handled better by Clone Wars which had their differences of approach to finding solutions slowly move them apart. I felt it was a bit like Spidey 3 where rather than see a darker side emerge we just got angsty teenager having strops almost (based on my own experience of being a teenager of course!).
Yikes, please don’t re-broadcast this corporate apologist nonsense. Notice how no one has trouble with race or gender when it comes to The Mandalorian.
There are two reoccurring main characters. I'll leave it there but I suspect that is the reason why there isn't such a backlash to Mandalorian in that sense.
As for Mandalorian not getting the negative attention... it somewhat has, just not as in such huge numbers. Same as Clone Wars or Rebels really. I think the flashpoint was the movies and those people are either abstaining from anything Disney does or they just call everything they don't like childish. And there is a fair bit of that still...
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It’s the internet, you can find someone posting anything (or just write it yourself under a pseudonym, then point at that). In reality, there is no appreciable backlash about race and gender. The supposed “backlash” is a figment of marketing, a distracting and divisive narrative meant to deflect legitimate criticism about the fundamental elements of narrative: character, plot, story, and theme.
The Mandalorian has been consistently strong in those terms so far. And people are responding enthusiastically to that quality. Some internet weirdos have from week to week glommed onto supposed “issues” such as “insensitivity toward indigenous peoples” (Tusken Raiders), “genocide” (Grogu eats eggs), and “sexism” (woman depicted with breasts). But who really cares about these hand-wringers when the show is actually so damn entertaining?
Just to be clear, I think Force Awakens is fine, Rogue One and The Last Jedi are awful, Solo is pretty good, Rise of Skywalker is utter garbage, and The Mandalorian is great. Most of the people I know have a similar range of opinions about the various Disney SW movies, albeit perhaps in slightly different configurations — but there is one common thread: The Mandalorian is great. People who were really put off by one thing or another Disney has done are coming back to SW for this show.
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Hey moderators, did someone delete my post about Gina and Cara both being heroes, on and off screen, and therefore an even more captivating character and actress fort her own series?
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Hey moderators, did someone delete my post about Gina and Cara both being heroes, on and off screen, and therefore an even more captivating character and actress fort her own series?
Yes, since it was a rather inappropriate and, frankly, unnecessary foray into politics and thus in direct violation of our forum rules. Please refrain from doing so again.
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I'm sorry you feel that way
Since we were discussing her as a spin off series, a character and actress who stand up for justice, I thought it was quite appropriate.
We can stick to space aliens, though.
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Grogu...
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Ron Howard's daughter directing something? Who could have seen that coming? ::)
Ah, didn't know she was his daughter. That makes sense.
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Grogu...
This is the way...
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I know Bryce Dallas Howard as an actor but I hadn't made the connection that she is Ron Howard's daughter. Doy!
I've enjoyed her episodes. The making of documentary on Disney+ is really good, and sort of shows the approach of John Favreau and Dave Filoni in using other directors to get different takes on the various stories.
What I enjoy about this show is how it almost harks back to an older form of tv series with self contained stories in each episodes. Im so used to shows with big season spanning story arcs (and nothing else) it feels like a refreshing change.
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I’m also a big, big fan of the episodic format. I really miss that structure of TV shows.
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What. An. Episode!
Epic. Epic. Epic!
Some Lucas lore overturned but for the better I think. This show just keeps on delivering.
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Holy shitballs :o
Loved it :D
New bloody vehicle to make though lol
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I liked it but did not find it to be special as was the case with the last episode (in finding it special on a narrative and aesthetic level).
The series, in my opinion, would be greatly enhanced if the episodes were longer. I don't mean that in the "gimme more! kinda way, otherwise I would have been a fan of Peter Jackson's Hobbit Trilogy which I am most definitely not, but in a "let the characters breathe" way.
The current style in my opinion leads to all characters except the two protagonists (and Ahsoka) seeming like NPC characters, ready to suit a specific purpose and ready to be discarded at any time. These NPC characters rarely need any dialogue / evolution to become allies / enemies just like in a (shallow) RPG.
"Ah, there is a debt now, now we have to follow you on your mission - nod nod, yes yes". I was really looking forward to see more Fennec Shand but so far it did not pay off for me.
Still very much looking forward to how this season finishes with the last two episodes.
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The episode had flaws.
My wife kept saying, “go get your jet pack!”
There were a lot of Stormtroopers in that first ship.
Don‘t run on the crest of a hill when being shot at.
Why didn’t the Imperial ship shoot Slave 1?
Why did that ship mean “the Empire is back” when scores of Stormtroopers did not?
Why didn’t Din learn his lesson the first time he tried to get through that Force barrier?
I agree that yet again the show suffers from the short running time. It is edited entirely too tightly. Makes wonder if there is a director’s cut or special edition in the future which restores some of the edited footage.
Perhaps I was a bit blown away by some of the epic bits... like the change in Jango’s and therefore Boba’s backstory. Boba being a brilliant combatant. His Gaffi Stick visually shattering Stormtrooper armor (such a nice little detail) sitting on the edge of my seat to see who was in the ship that arrived after Slave 1. Some nice humor from Din. Moff Gideon twirling his moustache. Temuera freaking Morrison... man he is epic!
Because of these moments it was too easy for me to overlook what you quite rightly point out Historiker, there is still a certain NPC vibe to many of the characters and their decisions. And it feels like yet again Din is putting together a team to go on an adventure. I can not for example understand why he really needs Mayfeld (Bill Burr) to track Moff Gideon.
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We will probably get one more episode which is half "getting to Mayfeld" and half "epic season ending" and then one more completely "epic season ending" episode with a massive cliffhanger :D
For me it is a weird mixture: I like that they actually expand the Star Wars canon and have a try at world building in this established world, yet a lot of their attempts seem a little unrefined. The Dark Troopers are a neat concept but also a good example of this: They get introduced, just like the other characters, and that's it. "There, you have another toy, now to our next set piece".
Would like to see a more gradual approach, taking more time. In the end it also probably comes down to money - if you have crazy money like GoT you can take your time (or not, as Season 8 shows, and I still shudder...). When they took their time however, like in the last episode which had lots of stillness next to the action the results were extremely good.
So, fellow enthusiasts, which Jedi will answer Baby...Grogu´s Call?
Revan :D The Outcast :D Kyle Katarn :D A different incarnation of Mara Jade :D ???
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The series, in my opinion, would be greatly enhanced if the episodes were longer.
Yup, each time the credits roll up the wife and I yell "Noooo!" because it seems it's just started. Who knows what pressures there are on programme makers that dictates the lengths of their episodes, but it seems to me that another ten or fifteen minutes would flesh out each vignette nicely but still keep it lean enough without any padding, to keep the viewer wanting more.
By the way, does anyone else deliberately stay and watch the credits at the end, to see the lovely paintings? I wonder if the pics will be available to buy anywhere?
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By the way, does anyone else deliberately stay and watch the credits at the end, to see the lovely paintings? I wonder if the pics will be available to buy anywhere?
Yes and I wonder if they're done just for the credits or are pre-productions that have been altered (the slight movement)
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Those paintings are beautiful. As much as I am enjoying the TV show I think the music and end credit paintings are my favourite things!
A big lavish book of them would be a must buy.
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I’ve refrained from reading this thread again, until today, as I’ve just binge-watched all of Season 2 so far....
...firstly, some of you really seem to be overthinking this series :)
...I prefer the more “simplistic” approach of James, as summed up by:
Holy shitballs :o
Loved it :D
New bloody vehicle to make though lol
So far the highlights for me have been the egg-eating, Katie Sakehoff, crane-Walker, Katie Sakehoff and Big Bad Bobba and his gaffi stick.
Shit, I had an omelette the other day.
Frogs are people too Steve ;)
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I love the artwork and music, so yeah I watch the credits.
For as long as I can remember people have told me that I try too hard, think too much and wear my heart on my sleeve.... as if these are bad things. I do not think they are bad things. But then I suppose that does get me running the risk of having my posts deleted.
And your joke AKULA gets to the crux of the egg eating, whether you see the characters as people or not.
As for the Dark Troopers... Droids or Cyborgs?
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Those paintings are beautiful. As much as I am enjoying the TV show I think the music and end credit paintings are my favourite things!
A big lavish book of them would be a must buy.
No kidding! Seeing that gorgeous art at the end is like having extra dessert after a great meal!
"But wait, there's more...!"
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Did anyone get this book?
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51pxn4Efx2L._SY463_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Star-Wars-Mandalorian-Season/dp/141974870X/ref=sr_1_2?crid=830Z1CC6QT25&dchild=1&keywords=the+mandalorian+art+book&qid=1607100473&sprefix=the+mandalorian+art%2Caps%2C185&sr=8-2
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:o :-*
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Not due till the 22nd but I’ve got it on preorder from Waterstones.
Nice little Christmas present to myself although there’ll be so much inspiration in there I won’t know where to start lol
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Not due till the 22nd but I’ve got it on preorder from Waterstones.
Nice little Christmas present to myself although there’ll be so much inspiration in there I won’t know where to start lol
Ahh, that's strange Amazon says it was released on the 1st of December and it's already unavailable. Went ahead and ordered mine at Bookdepository. Says it will be released on the 15th. Fingers crossed for that to be true.
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I don’t mind waiting as I’ve got plenty to be getting on with lol
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Did anyone get this book?
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51pxn4Efx2L._SY463_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)
Yes, got my copy this past Tuesday. Paid 27USD, it is well worth it for fans of the production and minis gamers will find it particularly worthwhile.
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I love the artwork and music, so yeah I watch the credits.
As for the Dark Troopers... Droids or Cyborgs?
I watch the credits too. Always interesting to see how the concept art varies from the production work. The art is nice, but I always view it as more of a game to see how it differs.
I always thought Dark Troopers were droids, though I think I primarily got that idea from video games.
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Loved it, though not as much as the last episode and the first episode of season 2. great potential for an epic final.
Boba + Fennec + Mando + unknown Jeid (Kyle Katarn?) vs. Dark Troopers!
Had nearly forgotten them since playing Dark Forces a long time ago in a part of my life now far far away...
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Another great episode, though I feel I have been short changed 20 minutes of star wars tonight! Don't usually have an issue with the run time, but 30 minutes was not enough for my weekly fix!
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Another great episode, though I feel I have been short changed 20 minutes of star wars tonight! Don't usually have an issue with the run time, but 30 minutes was not enough for my weekly fix!
Yes! I feel the same, but I’ve been binge watching the Clone Wars (great!) and am now giving myself in to an episode of Rebels per day (also very good after the first couple of episodes).
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Weirdly, this was the weakest episode so far IMO. Too many “gee whiz” elements stuffed in, just thing after thing after thing and yet no time for emotional impact. What a contrast to S2E2!
Most of the show’s strength stems from its low stakes. Things are ramping up to “epic” with the paradoxical result of losing a sense of gravity. I hope this is mostly down to the directing, which was not strong at all, and the show can get back on track tonally in its final two episodes this season.
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Finally watched it last night. Why only 27 minutes? The previous episode was 52 minutes. Why can't Disney settle on a set episode duration? Say what you like about Discovery, at least the episodes are the same length every week.
Nice to have a 3rd episode in a row where a character from a previous film/TV show appears.
My gripe is why do they continue to show Stormtroopers as cannon fodder (and I know this goes backs to movies)? Stormtrooper armour seems to be as ineffective as ever - makes you wonder why they wear it? I know it's to make the main characters seem badass, but I think the Empire would struggle to take over a picnic, let alone a galaxy!
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A fair point about this episode increasing the epic factor but losing some of the sense of gravity to it.
And the constant waves of Stormtrooper cannon fodder is part of that. There was a video game feel to it. I got my hopes up a bit when the Stormtrooper Officer/NCO at least thought of flanking but then it was never properly executed and instead he was flanked in turn.
Even the heavy weapons proved more for show than a real threat. As an old mortar maggot myself I was pleased at first to see a mortar but proved as ineffective as the rest.
I feel like directors miss that the more mooks you throw at heroes, the less scary they become. A few scenes showing Stormtroopers saved by their armor would add to the immersion of the Star Wars universe. Does the armor of the Clone Troopers ever save them in the Clone Wars shows? I have only seen a couple of episodes.
Of course the masked helmets dehumanize the Stormtroopers and make it easy to forget that the newer films established them as “kidnapped and conditioned as children slave soldiers” like Finn. And their repeated incompetence erodes their supposed elite, fear inducing status.... although I think their reputation for poor marksmanship is falsely earned their tactical competence is repeatedly demonstrated.
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Never mind all that, when are they going to save Grogu? :o
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lol
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Episode 14, Guns of Navarone reference, anyone else see it?
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Never mind all that, when are they going to save Grogu? :o
Should that not read when are they going to save the empire from Grogu
Loved the scene of them coming into the room with the two storm troopers getting thrown about the room lol lol lol
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Should that not read when are they going to save the empire from Grogu
lol
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I half wonder if Luke or Ben won't show up in the end. It would tie the show back into the universe at large, as Luke is running around starting a new academy right now in the timeline.
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Episode 14, Guns of Navarone reference, anyone else see it?
no? Where? What?
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Honestly, I prefer The Mandalorian more than any of the movies.
I love that it's a Samurai/Western, too. I never got into those kinds of movies because the environment looked physically unpleasant, more the Westerns than Japan.
I grew up in California. I hate the desert, the dry heat, the allergies, I don't know why anyone would actually move here but people did for many years. Now, everyone is fleeing, including us, soon.
Mandalorian takes these genres' stories and puts them in places I find interesting instead of the miserable American desert. This is wonderful!
I just wish there were more episodes!
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I feel like directors miss that the more mooks you throw at heroes, the less scary they become. A few scenes showing Stormtroopers saved by their armor would add to the immersion of the Star Wars universe.
This is such a solid observation, I wish the creative team would bear it in mind. The show introduced Storm Troopers as at least looking quite dangerous, like hungry coyotes. And remember how in Season 1, it took an entire Mandolorian Clan to fight some gangers on Nevarro? With Season 2, we’re at the point were they have to introduce Dark Troopers because no amount of Storm Troopers poses any threat to the characters.
But it’s not just about Storm Troopers being unable to hit an unarmored protagonist despite being expert marksmen when it comes to hitting Din Djarin’s laser-proof Beskar armor. Even that can be fine when the episodes focus on character development. S2E6 was just too short and crammed with (essentially boring) action scenes to accomplish much beyond brute-forcing the plot forward toward the season finale.
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One thing to say about stormtrooper armor is that is could just be thin and designed to protect against getting thrown around against walls and objects and stuff.
If you recall, in Blackhawk Down, the Delta guys wore light helmets aimed at protecting them from banging their heads on something as opposed to being bullet proof.
In Graz, Austria, I remember a museum filled with metal armor (called "Rüstung" which sounds like "rusty" :D) from the Landsknecht times with motocross armor displayed right next to it. It dawned on me that there are different purposes driving levels of protection.
That's always been my take on stormtrooper armor.
I do wish that they'd show the armor working, though, and stormtroopers hitting something and being useful.
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Fair points Manchu and ErikB.
There are some interesting videos on Stormtrooper accuracy on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2TA9coGLzM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFQ9uO4GxkQ
One of the few things I dislike about the Mandalorian is the continued jokes about Stormtrooper accuracy. My wife smirks at me every time there is another joke about it. I have mentioned it on this forum before but it really irritates me because it is an example of something repeated so often that people believe it despite evidence to the contrary, perhaps because people want to believe it. Never let the truth get in the way of a good story?
As funny as the scene is with the Speeder Bike Scout Troopers chatting and missing in Mandalorian, their comedic inaccuracy is countered by the death of one of my favorite characters Kuiil. I guess the Force (plot armor) was not strong with him.
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Yes it’s amazing how Storm Trooper accuracy goes through the roof when the script is done with their target (see Rogue One for many examples).
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At this point Stormtroopers are only a distraction.
When the dropships landed and troopers cames out, I told my wife " it's okay, it's only stormtrooper."
I mean, the so called elite soldiers of the Empire should be competent beyond knocking on doors and bullying peasants.
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I have no idea if this is true but I vaguely remember something about stormtrooper armour being designed to dissipate energy from impacts rather than actually stop blaster fire.
I too am getting sick of the nudge nudge wink wink references to storm troopers being crap soldiers. in the first series they were sort of intimidating, and the bit with the two on speeders chatting and shooting cans was fun, but without context it just makes you wonder how the empire lasted as long as it did.
Now if we had an episode where mando has to say - infiltrate an imperial training facility and finds that most troopers are press ganged farm boys given some quick brainwashing and then shipped off in poorly made armour with inferior blasters to try and push back the new republic, that would do alot to make them a bit less mookish and answer the question of why alot of them suck. you could play up the difference between old imperial troopers like those that were hanging around with werner herzog, and new recruits in what will become the first order. another rung down the ladder from mandalorian, to clone, to strom trooper, to first order.
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Yeah, I like that Mammoth Miniatures. Context.
Perhaps I am too influenced by...
IMPS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHJkxEVENPI
Which is admittedly fan fiction.
And even though this references Clone Troopers, this clip really appeals to me. The language and tone strikes a familiar chord to my veteran ears.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCHOpfv5n08
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Unfortunately it's in the public consciousness.
(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-424a840718758e6dbb57a82b7fa06a93)
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I do think there was a big change in troop quality between the clone troopers and stormtroopers. I have never thought of stormtroopers as being elite any more than I think any doughboy in a trench as being elite. Still, any idiot with a gun is intimidating for the average person. I think that stands true today and it would carry forth into a galaxy far away. This is my point though. We are so used to seeing the galaxy's finest (Jedi/Sith) galavanting about without a sweat as they swat laser blasts with a laser sword (that is for your benefit, Rick) that we lose sight that the galaxy is full of krill and moisture farmers. I don't agree that a few missed shots make a stormtrooper the laughing stock of the galaxy so much as it is a poorly conceived bit of plot armor. Frankly, it is the same plot armor that saves Josie Whales and other western protagonists too. Mexican banditos are the original stormtroopers, in a sense.
That said, I like the speeder bike scene. I don't mind a show poking fun at itself.
I loved the latest episode, and while I would have liked it to be longer I really can't say I felt ho-hum about it when the credits rolled. The Dark troopers were ominous, Boba was finally seen in action and lived up to his reputation, and Grogu working over two guards was fantastic. Too bad the little guy gets tuckered out so quickly.
It seems that Mandalorian is pursuing a plot similar to the Reborn of the Jedi Outcast video game, where you could create "dark Jedi" through artificial infusion. I don't know that the video game ever explains the process, but it would seem that some Grogu blood is the potential delivery method in the show. With that in mind, would Kyle Katarn be a potential "Jedi" to respond to the child's call? In terms of timeline, Kyle Katarn is a figure between 5ABY and 12ABY in a series of video games with this Reborn plot. Mandalorian is set in 9ABY. By Dark Jedi, the Empire (remnants of) had managed to potentially create an army of thousands of Reborn Dark Jedi through the infusion of the Force.
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I think the other implication is that Grogu is being used to figure out how to clone the Emperor. The things in vats, while proto dark troopers looked an awful lot like Snoke.
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Soldiers in WWII and Vietnam were pretty accurate at the range too. I think we all have seen the stats on how many bullets it took per kill....... a feth ton.
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Soldiers in WWII and Vietnam were pretty accurate at the range too. I think we all have seen the stats on how many bullets it took per kill....... a feth ton.
Also a good point. Easy to shoot straight when you aren't running up a hill taking fire or trying to race down a corridor with minimal cover towards an enemy that is dug in. I mean, the Empire seems to treat stormtroopers the way Stalin treated his forces. Just keep tossing them at a problem until it is solved. Body count doesn't seem to be an issue that Darths and Moffs worry about.
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A bit of headcanon about stormtroopers - We don't KNOW that these are actually stormtroopers. apparently the stormies are only the elite of the imperial forces, and are vastly outnumbered by the generic soldiers of the imperial army.
Now personally i think it would be a bit more dramatic if the soldiers we saw were just generic troops and that way, the stormies would seem more menacing when we see them. But what if the imperial remnant is just dressing up any troops as stormtroopers to try and look more menacing than it is. think about it, you've lost control - you flee to the outer rim with all the gear and men you can take - no doubt the hyper loyal stormtrooper regiments are gonna come with you and you want to keep them equipped, so you put what resources you have into making new stormtrooper armour etc. but what about all these generic human soldiers you have kicking around? it's gonna look pretty crap if the new empire rocks up and they've got 5 fearsome stormtroopers and 200 rag wearing schlubs who just happened to have tagged along. So you stick them in old stormtrooper armour, use them to replenish the ranks, generally try and big up your image by making everyone look that little bit snazzier.
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A quick bit re: stormtrooper armour. The way I see it, is we see them fall over when shot in their armour, so we're assuming that means they've snuffed it. It could be that, like modern combat armour, getting shot in it means you're still probably going to fall over, maybe be out of that firefight, but you will survive and be back on duty after some medical treatment.
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Cubs... that is head cannon I have used previously, I forget where I first heard it though.
To be fair though, Stormtroopers aside... I am still stunned Jango has had his canon lore changed to make him a Mandalorian!
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I half wonder if Luke or Ben won't show up in the end. It would tie the show back into the universe at large, as Luke is running around starting a new academy right now in the timeline.
This has been doing the rounds recently.
(https://wegotthiscovered.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/sebastian-stan-luke-skywalker.jpg)
Seems fans either want Mark Hamill 'deaged' digitally or have Sebastian Stan cast as Luke Skywalker.
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Cubs... that is head cannon I have used previously, I forget where I first heard it though.
Aha! Then I'm not being a n eejit with it. Or maybe I am, but I'm in good company.
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Cubs... ta, mate!
Nozza.... hmm... interesting!
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How does one determine which troopers are stormtroopers vice regular Empire soldiers? I mean, naval uniforms and the occasional pilot/scout aside I've never even seen "normal" front line infantry type grunts anywhere that I can think of. I've always been of the mindset that stormtroopers were the grunts, not the elite. It hardly makes sense to have your elite soldiers wandering the decks of a star destroyer as patrols, but this seems to constantly be happening in movies. Wandering troopers here and there, around every corner walking in small groups. It is really confusing behavior for a "ship at sea."
I have to say that the Sebastian Stan thing looks interesting. I was underwhelmed by Hamill's participation in the final trilogy. I don't know that I was ever all that impressed with him in the original trilogy either, to be honest. I don't know that I ever wanted to root for Luke as a kid. Solo, yes. Vader? Yeah. Luke? Not so much.
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How does one determine which troopers are stormtroopers vice regular Empire soldiers? I mean, naval uniforms and the occasional pilot/scout aside I've never even seen "normal" front line infantry type grunts anywhere that I can think of. I've always been of the mindset that stormtroopers were the grunts, not the elite. It hardly makes sense to have your elite soldiers wandering the decks of a star destroyer as patrols, but this seems to constantly be happening in movies. Wandering troopers here and there, around every corner walking in small groups. It is really confusing behavior for a "ship at sea."
I have to say that the Sebastian Stan thing looks interesting. I was underwhelmed by Hamill's participation in the final trilogy. I don't know that I was ever all that impressed with him in the original trilogy either, to be honest. I don't know that I ever wanted to root for Luke as a kid. Solo, yes. Vader? Yeah. Luke? Not so much.
Well after the movies there was the Star Wars RPG which developed a lot of what became Canon (and mostly is now Legends). They even first mentioned Coruscant in the sourcebooks....and it was here that Stormies where mentioned as Elite and normal Imperial Army as the standard.
In the accompanying tabletop we then got models for the army. I actually thought (and still think) the mud troopers from Solo, where a young Han joins, are the standard, and Stormtroopers are indeed some form of elite.
What I still cannot understand is why the Empire stopped cloning their troops, though.
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Solo shows off some imperial ground troops. They're apparently the leftover troops from the grand army of the Republic - come regiments become stormtroopers and normal troops get upgraded to stormtroopers gear bit by bit according to wookiepedia.
I do think it'd be a shame if after such a strong first series the show is used simply as a way to try and redeem the poor plot devices of the latest films. But the introduction of cline wars characters and plot lines is nice to see.
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I do think it'd be a shame if after such a strong first series the show is used simply as a way to try and redeem the poor plot devices of the latest films.
I agree very much with that. As the series inches closer to the sequels, I find myself wishing it wouldn't.
Did anyone else think that the latest episode's honourable Boba Fett was somewhat at odds with the mercenary character sketched (very lightly!) in The Empire Strikes Back? I mean, two of his four lines in that film are "What if he doesn't survive? He's worth a lot to me." and "He's no good to me dead." That wasn't really the impression I got from the post-sarlacc version.
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Greedo did not seem that motivated to bring in Han alive... so knowing a bit more about Jango’s and therefore Boba’s now canon background maybe his desire to have Han alive is part of his Mandalorian honor? Maybe not.
Maybe Boba has spent time among the Tusken Raiders (Sandpeople) and this has affected his values? The new canon suggests they are still raiders but honorable ones at least. Boba seems to have Tusken gear but that does not necessarily mean he spent time among them though.
How did Boba know where to find Din and Grogu? I entertained the thought Boba might be working for the Empire, since they did not shoot Slave 1 but once Moff Gideon has Grogu why not Boba turn on Din?
“Back in the day” from the the canon expanded universe (now called Legends) I seem to recall Han failed a flight academy on Corelia. The movie Solo having him be a grunt instead surprised me. I figured what folks call Mud Troopers are the regular army, whereas all the various white armored troopers are elite stormtroopers... at least as elite as US Marines are, which as a former US Army Infantry myself is a matter of much debate! “Elite” shipboard duty and Embassy/White House guard duty?
“Aren’t you a little short for a Stormtrooper?” from Leia would indicate at least a height requirement.
Much as I dislike the latest films if the Mandalorian can in any way help fix that rubbish I would appreciate it. It has already made me more interested in Clone Wars and Rebels.
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I completely agree, Hobgoblin. This guy does not seem like Boba Fett from the OT. In the same way that the Jedi of the Prequels do not seem anything like the Jedi referred to in the OT.
With Boba, I have no doubt that the five years since RotJ could be (back)filled in with any number of experiences that might have made him more honorable. But introducing him without anything but potential visual references to such experiences means he just feels like a completely different character to whom the producers cynically assigned a familiar name.
Like Rogue One, this latest episode abandons substance in favor of style and, just like in Rogue One, that ends up being to the detriment of style as much as substance ... because the style isn’t even that good. What a pity that Boba Fett is just casually thrown into the mix, as one thing among a bunch of things that happen in a paltry 27-minute episode. It should have been handled much more like the introduction of Ahsoka in the previous (45-minute) episode.
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Boba seems to have Tusken gear but that does not necessarily mean he spent time among them though.
And he finally proves the usefulness of those Gaffi sticks better than any Tusken did in the past!
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A big hittin’ stick is really useful when the boys with guns politely cease fire and queue up so each one can walk up and receive a solid crack on the head, in an orderly fashion.
nyuk nyuk nyuk
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Did anyone else think that the latest episode's honourable Boba Fett was somewhat at odds with the mercenary character sketched (very lightly!) in The Empire Strikes Back? I mean, two of his four lines in that film are "What if he doesn't survive? He's worth a lot to me." and "He's no good to me dead." That wasn't really the impression I got from the post-sarlacc version.
Maybe, but the same is true of the Mandalorian himself in a way. Before he meets the child, he's much colder and more ruthless. Not needlessly cruel, just stoically getting on with the job. That's how I always saw Boba Fett as a kid, just a dude doing a job for the money. If you weren't on his list and didn't try to stop him doing his work, you were safe.
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“Back in the day” from the the canon expanded universe (now called Legends) I seem to recall Han failed a flight academy on Corelia. The movie Solo having him be a grunt instead surprised me.
In Solo he was kicked out of the flight academy and sent to the grunts :)
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I agree with Cubs, if you go only off the original trilogy there is latitude in his behavior for a lot of different directions to go. As a kid I thought Boba was a Mandalorian... but an outlaw renegade of the law and order obsessed Mandalorians. I am not sure where I got that idea into my teenaged head. That was all turned upside down with Jango and Lucas saying Jango/Boba were not Mandalorians. Now they are.
Munindk... I forgot the throwaway line in the movie. But thanks to your comment I found this deleted scene.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYfX4iS4hxY&feature=emb_logo
One of the problems I have with the movie Solo giving Han an Imperial background is that in later films he seems completely unaware of Imperial protocol except when the ships dump garbage. The deleted scene above has him flying a TIE but unable to recognize the rank of a superior officer. A cringe worthy scene that in concept could have been decent but instead played as a joke. Which is a reoccurring problem with the film Solo.
Could this episode with Boba be better? Yeah, definitely. The episode with Ahsoka was definitely better on a technical level.... but again it feels to me like it most suffers from ruthless over editing.
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Back to last episode.
Who had Slave 1 and was who looking after it?
Given that Jawas in the first series pretty much took the Razor Crest apart in a day, I can't see Slave 1 surviving intact for long on Tatooine with it's Jawa population. Of course, we don't know how long it took Boba to crawl out of the Sarlaac Pit, but I was surprised Slave 1 was there.
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I suspect there is a difference between being a man of your word, and being honorable. Like the difference between Lawful Evil and Lawful Good characters in D&D. You can be evil (or more likely neutral) and still want to uphold rules and laws. I might argue that most of the Empire is Lawful Evil in nature. They uphold law and order to a seemingly nefarious end. I only see Boba (and Mando) as upholding their word without a lot of desire to make the world a better place. Boba agreed to swap his armor for keeping the child safe. Perhaps he regretted the phrasing, but I believe there are a lot of rules and regulations in the bounty hunter's guild, and so perhaps more than Mandalorian "honor" it is simply the way social contracts are upheld. After all, if you aren't worth your word then it would seem that the guild itself may turn against you, and then where would you be? Hunted and without work seems to be a strong motivator to keep one's word.
I was always under the impression that Boba was a Mandalorian. Again, I think that depending on where you look and what source material you pick and choose from. It also seems that Mandalorian is more of a club that you can join than someone debating whether or not they are a Wookie. The books even have him rising to be THE Mandalore through the Yuuzhan Vong War somewhere in 23-29ABY. That sounds about as Mandalorian as one can get. lol
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An interesting question. Was it landed somewhere building up dock fees, like Mos Eisley? Did Boba have to recover it from some survivor of the Jabba debacle? How did Jawas get the armor? Where did Boba get the Tusken gear? How did he survive the Sarlaac?
A spin-off series just waiting to happen....
I would agree with you Andrew that the Empire is LE. Din seems LN most of the time but also breaks from that description from time to time without much thought to it. I do not think we know enough about Boba (without relying on things like the books that have now been determined non-canon) to know his alignment preference.
Speaking of Legends... would the Yuuzhan Vong returning to canon one day be a good idea or not?
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All fair points. My memories of Boba Fett are probably coloured by his original, nastier voice (I think I'm right in saying that he's been redubbed since).
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A spin-off series just waiting to happen....
Already in the pipeline, or so I’ve heard.
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Was there a Council of Nicea for Star Wars canon? lol
Honestly, with any of these intellectual properties (WH40K, Star Wars, Star Trek) with wide-reaching lore, there will develop some inconsistency over time. If anything, that simply mimics our own tendency towards revisionist history. The more people who research and provide commentary on a figure like Churchill, the more inconsistency we will find in his story. The least reliable source being Churchill himself. lol
I don't find any of that confusing or frustrating. On the whole, I think we get a better picture of who a character is over time, from all sources. If the story of Star Wars was a tale told from the view of many outside witnesses, it would not be unreasonable to think that no single source would know the whole tale and that no single source may understand the true origin, motivations, or actions of the characters we are following. Within the Star Wars galaxy itself, we see that there are rumors and legend around something as "known" (to us as the observer of a story) as a Jedi. If those who live in that galaxy have a spotty understanding of what a Jedi is, then the telling of that story when it reaches us may also be spotty, or open to artistic license and interpretation. The same way as any other story that comes to us from long ago and far away.
As for the Yuuzhan Vong, why would it be a bad thing? It would open the door to new stories in this same universe and provide an opportunity to visit a place I rather enjoy. I can't honestly see any effort to keep Star Wars going as a bad one. Not bad financially for Disney, and not bad for me as a guy who just enjoys a good tale with pretty visuals and a big production budget. I suppose that anyone not enjoying a movie or book is entitled to stop participating or to provide alternate realities to their liking and enjoyment. Certainly, there is enough fan fiction out there from people who choose to do just that. I would prefer the franchise branch out and give me new stories in a different light. That was part of my original "please don't give me Jedi in the Mandalorian" soapbox. There is SO much more out there, I don't need a Jedi in the story to connect me to the larger picture. I don't even need the Force for it to be Star Wars for me. That is not all there is to Star Wars, which is an exciting prospect if you...
(https://i.redd.it/1276lvxd9md11.jpg)
lol
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Surely, we have had more than enough existing characters show up in Mando this season, whereas what is riskier but probably more enjoyable is to see new places, meet new characters, and to discover new concepts.
Bringing back the Yuzhan Vong doesn’t tick any of those boxes, plus that whole story arc was divisive even among the subniche of EU fans.
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Someone asked how Boba Fett escaped the Sarlac. This is answered in the book "Star Wars Tales of the Bounty Hunters". In the tale of Dengar, Boba is found in the desert near the Sarlac pit. Boba it seems set off a bomb in the Sarlac and crawled out. He was found by Dengar.
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In Solo he was kicked out of the flight academy and sent to the grunts :)
Legends had him essentially be picked for officer training from being a pilot, then he encountered someone beating a wookie and Han killed the guy and saved Chewie...got him kicked out of the Navy and he went smuggler.
Of course, he'd joined up in the first place because he was a street rat and it was basically that or prison or dead at the time...
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Fair point about the Council of Nicea Andrew. That made me laugh! At this stage it seems Kathleen Kennedy is wearing the big hat.
I have not followed all the Expanded Universe/Legends stuff but I have read a few of the books and played a couple of the computer games.
For example I remember that story about Boba and Dengar... was that a graphic novel? My question about how Boba survived stands though precisely because there has not been a canon confirmation of that story. And therein lies the importance of canon. It provides a foundation for the continuing stories.
Now you can deal with canon and continuity uses the Mad Max way... apparently there is no canon because the stories of Max are stand alone folklore. Apparently.
https://screenrant.com/mad-max-fury-road-movie-sequel-reboot-continuity-explained/
Or you can create alternate timelines.... like the infamous Star Trek Kelvin Timeline.
Or you can just ignore canon, with the subsequent confusion and division... as in Star Trek Discovery.
I have to admit I just wish creators stuck to established canon or created clever work arounds, like the whole Klingon genetic manipulation resulting in the changes of Klingon appearance... which may be a bit cheesy but is certainly no lazy considering the amount of work that went into supporting that plotline.
Folks like continuity in a movie right? Glasses refilling themselves, guns never needing to be reloaded, bullet holes in walls before the shots are taken. So why not over several connected films as well?
With so many reboots and so many interconnected universe franchises continuity will only be important to producers if audiences demand it. When folks say don’t overthink it, just enjoy the ride... they make it easy for producers to cut corners and make lesser quality films. Why spend big budgets on costuming if people do not reward shows with good costumes/props and criticize those with poor costumes/props. The same with continuity. What stops producers from making decisions that creates the last season of Game of Thrones for example if people do not complain?
As for the Yuuzhan Vong, I do not know much about them and their storyline. I have read a bit online and heard the plotline had mixed reviews. Seems like it may suffer from power creep, ie you always need a bigger villain until it “jumps the shark”.
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Back to last episode.
Who had Slave 1 and was who looking after it?
Given that Jawas in the first series pretty much took the Razor Crest apart in a day, I can't see Slave 1 surviving intact for long on Tatooine with it's Jawa population. Of course, we don't know how long it took Boba to crawl out of the Sarlaac Pit, but I was surprised Slave 1 was there.
It was left parked in Jabba´s Palace backyard.
Seriously, I think there is no time in the season for such details of plot. Enjoy it as it is.
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That was a good article about Mad Max, Rick. In my mind, I think that is how the Star Wars Universe has its story told, though the kidding about the bible might not be far off from a reasonable analogy. While Mad Max might be disparate stories told around an archetypal character (wasteland wanderer), I tend to think of the Star Wars universe as being told to us by a number of people who witnessed the events, but not as being told by a single omnipotent observer and not as something like a biography of Anakin/Luke, etc. In this way, it might be closer to an epic story about the Khans. We start with Ghengis as a kid (Temujin, then in another story, we see him uniting the clans. Same Ghengis, but we assume that anyone who would have been around to see the story of Temujin was not also around to tell the story of Ghengis' rise to power, let alone long-lived enough to see Ogedei through Kublai. So you get the full epic, but you see the story from a wide number of sources which can be combined and massaged into one coherent story for us, today. We have the benefit of knowing which sources in the story of the Khans were enemies, who would portray Ghengis as a bloodthirsty maniac, or which were allies who would tell us of his great deeds.
In Star Wars we don't really know that element, but it might help to explain why Anakin is a whiny twerp in one scene and a legendary swordsman in the next. An observer, not fond of Anakin and perhaps having survived the rise of Vader, might recall that he was epically bad with the ladies. A Stormtrooper who followed Vader into battle, and lived to tell the tale, may have passed along the story of Vader in the Blockade Runner. An imposing figure, unscathed by blaster fire. It hardly makes sense that Anakin would have been the source for all of that information, as you would hope that he didn't portray himself so epically bad at romancing his baby mama.
Without the mechanism of alternate realities and breaks in a time stream, I think that viewing Star Wars as an epic tale derived from multiple sources provides the greatest latitude for the inclusion of stories that may not have all their edges lining up cleanly. Ultimately, I don't know if it matters whether Boba is a Mandalorian, or how he got out of the pit. The story Dengar tells in the bar might not be the same story Boba tells, and I think that is ok for the purpose of entertainment.
I do agree that there is a problem with the ongoing need for every bad guy to be bigger and badder than the last. The Death Star was meant to be an ultimate weapon, but then... a bigger ultimate weapon? Why did it need to be bigger? Putting a planet-killing weapon on a ship made sense from an engineering standpoint, but then why would you need a fleet of them? You would think that just one would be deterrent enough, and after you destroy all the planets you wanted "pacified" that you would just be left with a weapon that wasn't worth much. That said, look at the list of super weapons that the Star Wars universe has spawned over time: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Superweapon/Legends (https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Superweapon/Legends) Canonical or not, this is lore that loves its existential threats. Again, I think this is why I'm also drawn down to the level of stories on backwater planets without Jedi. There is enough interesting conflict in the galaxy without planets blowing up left and right.
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To be fair to the fleet of planet killers, that is actually a proved out concept in both real life and in fiction. The nuclear arsenal of the US and Russia was distributed across a wide area, so that no one strike could take out retaliatory action.
In Star Wars, not 1, not 2, but 3 uber weapons were destroyed by being the only one. Sooner or later you'd learn, put them on multiple, disparate assets so that a single battle doesn't take down all capability (but then they ignore it by parking them all in one spot and magically forget to fire the cannons during the battle...so....).
Fatman and Little Boy went across the ocean in two different ships after all.
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That is quite some list of superweapons.
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To bring it back on topic...
Another great episode with even more vehicles to make lol
Nice to see the sonic charge being used again 8)
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A good episode. Bill Burr did better than I expected. Some nice marksmanship from the Stormtroopers, at least at the bridge anyway.
I was going to say it was a solid episode but I am not so sure about that. It was a little confusing to see some scenes evoking empathy for Imperials only to have them go back to cannonfodder immediately thereafter. It felt a bit like Finn being so quick to gun down his former comrades.
Pirates... or Rebels? Why would pirates blow up the transports instead of stealing them? Since discontented locals were set up in the previous scene, makes me wonder if they were locals or maybe mercenaries hired by locals?
Too short yet again! I would have liked some more interaction between Cara Dune and Fennec Shand... as well as between Din and Boba (who came across as a glorified chauffeur this episode).
Was Moff Gideon’s entire flightplan logged in that terminal?
Gripes aside I liked the episode overall. As usual lots of old tropes but done well. I liked the points Mayfeld (Bill Burr) was making both in the transport and in the cafeteria. Brilliant costuming and set design. Great camerawork and special effects. It may not have exceeded my expectations as some of the previous episodes have but it delivered a decent half hour of entertainment.... now if only they would make the episodes an hour each!
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Well,I’ve just gorged on 15 episodes,fantastic!
So much fab and coolness . A lump in my throat a few times, IT Crowd homage to Emily Swallow channeling Galadriel (look it up),for me,best Star Wars since Empire.
Can’t wait for the next one :)
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I liked it, some cool action :-* :-* :-*
What are you building next Jim? :D
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What are you building next Jim? :D
Everything!
lol
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Jim, I think you'd better block out the next couple of years since Disney have just announced they are making Ahsoka, Obi-Wan, Bad Batch and other SW Universe series.... :o
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I know lol
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There are a lot of Star Wars projects, tv shows and movies, on the horizon if COVID allows....
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/disney-mandalorian-season-3-ahsoka-lando-release-date
... and not just Star Wars. Willow and Indiana Jones!
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Jim, I think you'd better block out the next couple of years since Disney have just announced they are making Ahsoka, Obi-Wan, Bad Batch and other SW Universe series.... :o
You missed the best announcement! Donald Glover in a Lando series! Bad Batch sounds good, but I wish they would have not gone the animated route.
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Also Visions which will be a series of short animated movies in the SW universe which sounds like it has a lot of potential... well, for Jim's crazy scratch builds anyway! :D
And one on Droids which could be interesting.
I'm enjoying how much awesomeness they are getting into shorter shows. I think it's bang on and reminds me of the black and white re-runs I used to watch with my dad before school in the 1980s. Stuff like Flash Gordon and the Lone Ranger. Pretty sure those were not 1hr long. And to be fair, most things aren't by the time you have thrown in adverts etc. It's fine as it is IMHO.
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45 minutes... leaving 15 minutes for commercials as I recall back in the day but I may be misremembering. I am not suggesting pointless bloat but the current 30ish minute episodes are leaving unnecessary plotholes.
Some more info... and teaser videos on coming Star Wars projects....
https://www.beastsofwar.com/star-wars/star-wars-bad-batch-andor-rogue-squadron-teasers/
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We just watched it, and liked it a lot. The last episode may not have had the greatest plot, but it wqs a solid Infiltration/escape story with two good action scenes and a few decent dialogues plus so much eye candy!
I really am looking forward to seeing more! Sadly next week the season will be over.
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Man last week’s episode was a big let down ...
But THIS week’s episode was back on track.
“Here’s to the Empire.”
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45 minutes... leaving 15 minutes for commercials as I recall back in the day but I may be misremembering. I am not suggesting pointless bloat but the current 30ish minute episodes are leaving unnecessary plotholes.
Some more info... and teaser videos on coming Star Wars projects....
https://www.beastsofwar.com/star-wars/star-wars-bad-batch-andor-rogue-squadron-teasers/
Remember, these are going back to the roots of Star Wars, movie serials. That they are as long as they are is a testament to more modern sensabilities. They aren't supposed to be deep, rather conjuring images of a Flash Gordon, Dick Tracy, or Superman serial (with a Western/Samurai film tone to them).
As to the episode, they do seem to have been more guerilla fighters than pirates. Pirates would want to steal something, not just blow it up. I wasn't crazy with him taking his helmet off, and it seemed overly forced (people have been crying for it for so long, and it felt to much like Iron Man or Spider-man always loosing their mask so that the actor can show their face). Didn't care for that, but otherwise it was a pretty good episode.
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One thing I really liked was that we got to see a bit of how Slave 1 works on the inside. It has always bothered me a bit this whole changing orientation thing.
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One thing I really liked was that we got to see a bit of how Slave 1 works on the inside. It has always bothered me a bit this whole changing orientation thing.
Yeah, me too, like anyone inside would get tipped backwards if it took off or landed. I'll bet the drinks holder has a hell of a gyroscope.
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Yeah, that was a nice touch 8)
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It took me a bit by surprise seeing it - For a second I thought I'd missed a scene and they were all in some sort of washing machine.
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I loved Bill Burr in this episode. Can you imagine him and Woody Harrelson together as an arguing father/son duo?
I liked how they showed how an Imperial officer justifies the empire. It was heavy handed but they gave it a good go. I always wondered what went on in the minds of med-level imperial leadership.
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I agree on both points ErikB.
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Finally managed to watch the episode as well. I liked it but so far the Ahsoka episode ins unrivaled.
Also: Trooper Armour of any kind does not seem to withstand anything... Blaster shots, heavy impact from blunt weapons, seems these guys are clad in chinaware or eggshells :D
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Also: Trooper Armour of any kind does not seem to withstand anything... Blaster shots, heavy impact from blunt weapons, seems these guys are clad in chinaware or eggshells :D
Well, that's what happens when government puts it out to contract and lowest pitch wins. Bleedin' budget cuts.
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That would also explain the bent blaster rifles. Because Stormtroopers are actually excellent shots. It is the material that is no good.
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Those Stormtroopers seemed to be excellent shots with quality weapons when they gunned down those “pirates” at the bridge. Consider how few shots were fired before they down all of them with unless I misremember zero casualties. But moments like that get lost don’t they in the popular idea of Stormtrooper accuracy.
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In order to get the ship coordinates Mando had to have his face scanned. He let it happen and he got the information.
Does this mean he is in the system and has clearance to view the materials? What is the point of the face scan if it isn't for clearance? Is it just a record of who accessed what in the Imperial database?
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In order to get the ship coordinates Mando had to have his face scanned. He let it happen and he got the information.
Does this mean he is in the system and has clearance to view the materials? What is the point of the face scan if it isn't for clearance? Is it just a record of who accessed what in the Imperial database?
Mayfeld explained it when they decided who has to go. Nobody who is registered as illegal, criminal or Rebel/Republic will get access. Supposedly clearance for everybody else...doesn't make sense, but that's the way.
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In order to get the ship coordinates Mando had to have his face scanned. He let it happen and he got the information.
Does this mean he is in the system and has clearance to view the materials? What is the point of the face scan if it isn't for clearance? Is it just a record of who accessed what in the Imperial database?
You have to have a record of who has accessed information. Bloddy GDPR rules...
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Mayfeld explained it when they decided who has to go. Nobody who is registered as illegal, criminal or Rebel/Republic will get access. Supposedly clearance for everybody else...doesn't make sense, but that's the way.
The rate that they go through troopers I'm not surprised they do away with setting up new accounts and passwords...
It's because it's in an Imperial base, surrounded by Imperial troops. It's a lot like R2 being able to access almost anything from one terminal...
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I reckon Fett dies this week :D
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I reckon Fett dies this week :D
Cara Dune and Moff Gideon.
And at the end Thrawn will come up and take Grogu. ;)
No jedi will answer
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I didn't mind the helmet removal scene. It played well in terms of how far Mando is willing to go to save the Child.
By the way, I hate the name Grogu. Grogu sounds like a Gammorean name to me. It sounds oafish/lumpish. Not a fan of that choice. Being that the two other beings of this race that we know are Yoda and Yaddle, wouldn't it have made more sense to go with Yogu? After digging on the internet it would seem that others of this species are named Oteg, Minch and Vandar Tokare. Very inconsistent naming conventions all the way around. Still don't like Grogu, and how are there so many of these critters about and nobody knows their species or origin? Yaddle and Yoda are on the Jedi Council. Oteg is a Jedi Master and Fleet Admiral. Minch is a Jedi knight, and Vandar Tokare is a Jedi Master, head of the Dantooine Jedi Enclave and held seats on both the Jedi Council and Academy Council in 3952 BBY. I mean, over thousands of years and with many prominent Jedi they can't figure out where these dudes keep popping up from? Yes, some of this might not be Canon, but still...
Anyway, I liked the episode. I think that the pirates would have made a bit more sense as freedom fighters trying to remove the Remnants from the planet, but maybe the pirates blow up the vehicles and scavenge materials from the wreck? Perhaps it is easier to go that route and just remove the troopers from the equation than it might be to blow out the drive train and have to fight it out. Still, they seemed pretty set on blowing up the transport even in the face of heavy losses. There would have to be something pretty valuable in the salvage to need that last transport despite having lost an entire skiff crew and bagging two other transports just minutes earlier.
I didn't mind Fett's involvement as the getaway driver. After all, it is his ship, and he had ruled himself out of going into the tunnel to hijack the transport earlier. I think that left driving as about the only thing he could contribute. I liked Mayfield's return, but I wasn't sure I understood why he didn't stay on for the next mission. Or, at a minimum, got a ride off-planet? I did like his reaction to the jerk officer who played fast and loose with his comrades' lives. I wonder how much of that kind of thing happened after WWI or WWII. I can imagine some poor guy who survived trench warfare, having watched all of his friends and fellow soldiers ground up in the face of certain death, having a similar reaction if he ran into a general out in town. Especially if that general felt proud of his "accomplishments" at the expense of so many of his fellow countrymen. Honestly, I thought the scene was well done for what it was.
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I reckon Fett dies this week :D
And Mando gets Slave 1...
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And Mando gets Slave 1...
Yup :D
I reckon Fennec dies (again) as well so there's a clean slate for next season...
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By the way, I hate the name Grogu. Grogu sounds like a Gammorean name to me. It sounds oafish/lumpish. Not a fan of that choice. Being that the two other beings of this race that we know are Yoda and Yaddle, wouldn't it have made more sense to go with Yogu? After digging on the internet it would seem that others of this species are named Oteg, Minch and Vandar Tokare. Very inconsistent naming conventions all the way around.
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Not sure about the inconsistency: it's similar to Yoda in being disyllabic with a long O as the first syllable. Of Yoda, Grogu and Yaddle, it's Yaddle that looks the odd one out to me.
And surely Grogu is closer to Yoda than Luke Skywalker is Obi Wan Kenobi or Dengar!
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Not sure about the inconsistency: it's similar to Yoda in being disyllabic with a long O as the first syllable. Of Yoda, Grogu and Yaddle, it's Yaddle that looks the odd one out to me.
And surely Grogu is closer to Yoda than Luke Skywalker is Obi Wan Kenobi or Dengar!
Yoda and Yaddle both have the Y and the D going for them on top of being disyllabic. Dengar might make sense as a Yoda name. It is in the same realm as Grogu in terms of sounding like a clod. Dengar and Grogu sound like barbarian pit fighters in Conan, to me. lol
But then you have Oteg (disyllabic), Minch (mono) and Vandar Tokare who... well, has a last name? Maybe he isn't famous enough to just be "Prince" or "Madonna?" Vandar Tokare seemingly knows enough about where he comes from to understand his family lineage, it would seem.
I still don't care for Grogu as a name. I still think it is lazy that Yoda's people don't have lore when they feature rather prominently. I mean, I know about the Gammoreans and they really only feature as Rancor food in the grand scheme of things.
I was hoping that Mandalorian would establish where the homeworld was and return the child. I don't have much hope for that at this point, but I was thinking that would be awesome when Mando's quest first started.
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Actually, I think Grogu's name is very clever; it is a cypher if you like. All too often names in pop culture et cetera are descriptive of the character (what if Darth Vader was called instead Cecil Fotheringham?), it allows the character to grow into the name,not vice versa.
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Yoda and Yaddle both have the Y and the D going for them on top of being disyllabic.
Yes, but the 'swallowed' -le syllable is a bit different from the pattern in the other two names. All three have the stress on the first syllable, but Yoda and Grogu don't have the last syllable 'swallowed'. Yoda and Grogu sound like they could come from a language with similar phonemes to Japanese (it would have to be Gurogu in Japanese, but that first U would be 'swallowed').
Dengar might make sense as a Yoda name. It is in the same realm as Grogu in terms of sounding like a clod. Dengar and Grogu sound like barbarian pit fighters in Conan, to me. lol
Maybe - but isn't Dengar the tougher-sounding one by far? That final U sound in Grogu has a sweet, cute or diminutive ring to it: think of Boo Boo (in Yogi Bear), Babu (in Bangla), Papou (in Greek) and Baloo (in The Jungle Book). I'd want to face a Grogu in a pit fight rather than a Dengar! ;)
But then you have Oteg (disyllabic), Minch (mono) and Vandar Tokare who... well, has a last name?
Yeah, none of those immediately sounds like it's from the same language as Yoda and Grogu, given the 'closed' syllables of Oteg, Minch and Vandar. The species could have several languages, of course; don't we see a human talking in a different language in the first episode of Season One? But Star Wars does tend to do that thing where planets have one biome and species one language.
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My predictions:
- Moff Gideon dies
- another sabre v beskar spear fight
- New Republic intervenes
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.... saved by.....
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For some reason I’m itching to buy a Fine Molds Slave 1.
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If they rescue Grogu, someone has to die or it would be too easy.
For non story reasons I could see Cara dying, to please some fan segments.
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For some reason I’m itching to buy a Fine Molds Slave 1.
Do it!
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"Henceforth you shall be known as Cecil Fotheringham."
"Arise Lord Fotheringham!"
Personally I like the name Grogu, it's grown on me. There's such a wide range of naming conventions in society today that it doesn't bother me that it's different from established little green guy names.
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I like the name Grogu, too. Especially being a semi-pun on “grow” or even “grow good.”
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"Cobb Vanth" does sound much more alien to German ears than "Grogu"...
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Bo Katan needs to kill Moff Gideon and reclaim the Dark Saber. Maybe with the spear.
Check the envelope. Its in there: Bo Katan, on the Imperial Star Destroyer, with the Beskar Spear.
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So, who's going to binge everything before the final on Friday? :D
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Cobb Vanth sounds like a lisp to me.
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Bo Katan needs to kill Moff Gideon and reclaim the Dark Saber. Maybe with the spear.
Check the envelope. Its in there: Bo Katan, on the Imperial Star Destroyer, with the Beskar Spear.
If they kill Moff Gideon this soon it would be a bit disappointing to be honest. I suspect that Asokah's connection to Bo katan will mean that they may save more of that storyline for her series.
Though I suspect that the different series will overlap. Ultimately Bo Katan is about the liberation of Mandalor (the planet) and returning it to some form of previous glory. The Dark Saber is part of that as is the Beskar Spear. I'm tempted to say that the spear has more meaning than we have been told... perhaps a relic of Mandalor himself? But I see this as being a central story so I'm not sure we will see it entirely resolved just yet. Though perhaps something happens to Moff and the Sabre reclaimed... or perhaps he is dispatched in an uncertain way to make a reappearance in the future?
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I heard that Moff Gideon is defeated and unmasked to be none other than Mr Greenway from the amusement park. He would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for that little green guy and those pesky Mandalorians.
No idea where Friday's finale will go. It'll be interesting to see whether it's a cliffhanger or a story arc resolution?
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I heard that Moff Gideon is defeated and unmasked to be none other than Mr Greenway from the amusement park. He would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for that little green guy and those pesky Mandalorians.
I suspected as much, when I saw the gang running past the same bit of Imperial base corridor four times.
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Killing Moff Gideon feels a better fit for the end of the entire Mandalorian series (which this may be, I honestly have no clue if there is a planned third season). Since he popped up at the very end of the first season and has yet to feature much in this season, it feels like we have simply not had enough screen time with him for it to be curtains on him. I could see a valiant rescue effort only to find that Gideon had left his ship mere hours before Mando and gang stage the heroic rescue. A final scene with Gideon handing the child to Thrawn would be a significant end to the season while leaving room to develop the ongoing story. That would also set up Gideon to exit the series by way of a battle to the death in the first 2-3 episodes of season 3, and would also allow the Dark Saber to jump sideways into a different series at a point where the next series is in post-production and ready to hit the small screen.
I do believe that our hero needs to run up against a force that puts him in his place. Isn't that the hero's journey? Luke doesn't defeat Vader the first time he really gets a chance to confront him. Luke needs to get a spanking so he can go off and do a training montage. Punch some beef, pull a sled in the snow, trim a bonsai and paint some cars, do a handstand, lift a rock... etc. So far Mando hasn't had to seek out his mentor. Mando has no Obi-Wan or Yoda. Seems to me that getting his butt handed to him might give him reason to take on Boba as a mentor? Bo Katan? At this point Mando is still growing and hasn't reached his ultimate form yet.
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The third Season of the Mandalorian is scheduled for December 2021 according to a few online sources.
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Well, there you go. Thanks, Rick.
I'm thinking Gideon gets out of the impending confrontation this time but doesn't live long in the next season. It is about time to hand the torch over to a bigger bad guy though, and that will make Gideon disposable in short order.
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Happy to help, mate.
I am thinking... Darth Maul and his “Acolyte” Darth Talon.
http://abcnewsradioonline.com/entertainment-news/darth-maul-lives-leias-the-chosen-one-george-lucas-reveals-w.html
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Sadly, I think Maul was killed (the second time?) many years before the Mandalorian timeline. Again, depending on how you view the various sources for Star Wars stories, it would appear that Maul was killed by either Kenobi or Vader. There are storylines for both... and then a storyline that tells of Luke killing hologram Maul (unplugging?)
Anyway, it would appear that by the time Mando and the Child are on their quest, Maul is well and truly deal many times over lol
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Happy to help, mate.
I am thinking... Darth Maul and his “Acolyte” Darth Talon.
http://abcnewsradioonline.com/entertainment-news/darth-maul-lives-leias-the-chosen-one-george-lucas-reveals-w.html
Not related, The Acolyte is set during the High Republic, roughly 200 years before the prequel trilogy.
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Folks have a way of not staying dead in Star Wars. I knew he made a comeback for Clone Wars, Rebels and Solo but did not know of his death at the hands of Obi-Wan until now.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Maul
You are correct Cypher226, thanks for the information. I missed that in the all the release data.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_The_Acolyte
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LUKE!!!!
Oh, and make sure you watch until after the credits :D
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LUKE!!!!
Oh, and make sure you watch until after the credits :D
Faarrk! Brilliant,and what a reveal :)
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Great episode, tied the season together really well. I kinda hope its the last we see of Din Djarin as I cant see them topping this.
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Faarrk! Brilliant,and what a reveal :)
What time over there was it shown? It’s from eight in the morning here.
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Great episode, tied the season together really well. I kinda hope its the last we see of Din Djarin as I cant see them topping this.
WHAT?!!
Of course it isn't the last we have seen of Din. And this episode is exactly why we should see more of him.
Also re the end scene. I've just read that it's the start of a Fett miniseries which has already begun filming and is due to be released at the end of next year alongside the next season of the Mandalorian. I wonder if it will essentially be the Fett movie that got pulled but serialised?
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I have to admit my eyes teared up a bit when I saw the green light saber and single black glove. It was predictable that someone would come to help. I was wondering if Boba Fett would show up but when I saw the X-Wing I thought... is it Luke? Would they really bring him in? And have kept that secret until now? Wow! My wife did not share, nor really understand, my joy at seeing him... even if the CGI was as dodgy as Leia and Tarkin in the Sequel movies. She wanted a new Jedi character to be introduced. But the arrival of R2 was perfect for me!
I really liked the scene with Boba Fett and Bo Katan’s sidekick.
The Dark Troopers were underwhelming although it was cool seeing Luke cutting through them. They reminded me of how disappointing Phasma was. More hype than substance. The IG units were portrayed better (can I say cooler?) in my opinion.
Nice touch with the Dark Sword ownership requirement. What happens next?
Good acting on the part of Pedro Pascal with the helmet removal/goodbye scene. It would have been a bit more epic if he had not removed his helmet in the previous episode though.
The post credits bit.... “The Book of Boba Fett” coming December 2021?! Is this a chapter of The Mandalorian or a new series coming?
https://www.ign.com/articles/book-of-boba-fett-spin-off-tv-show-release-date-december-2021
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It was a great end to the series.
Loved the very end bit too.
Gamorrean Guards look very thin.
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After three terrible episodes this fantastic show! I was blasted away and hope Disney now will make more Starwars again, not these Disney influenced Sh.t. I was afraid of singing Wookiee’s and androids, but Mandalorian saved Star Wars at Disney. And this great out view to the Future - Boba the barbarian... :o
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It was a great end to the series.
Loved the very end bit too.
Gamorrean Guards look very thin.
Watched it with my eldest and we were literally on the edge our seats when the x-wing showed up.
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Damn!!!
No character deads!!!
A Jedi came!!!
Grogu was saved!!!
What a lovely episode. Great finale. :-* :-* :-*
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No character deads!!!
lol
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What time over there was it shown? It’s from eight in the morning here.
I think about 7.30 pm :). So you must have been up early :D
Spot on Rumacara :)
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Incredible finale. Loved it. This show IS Star Wars. I know there are those who like the new trilogy, but to me The Mandalorian is an insight into what they could've been if people who loved Star Wars had been put in charge all along.
Great to see Luke!
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Absolutely amazing finale!
When the single x wing arrived I thought "could it be luke?" And the reveal with the green lightsabre and gloved hand was excellent.
I thought the jeopardy was done well, even if nobody died!
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I thought the jeopardy was done well, even if nobody died!
Stormtroopers are people too lol
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Luke! Luke!!! LUKE!!!!
....and he went through the Dark Troopers like a hot knife through butter...
...and Grogu lives!
...and Boba took over the Hutt‘s empire of crime on Tatooine!
...and Mando might be the next Mandalore!
So much good stuff, I’m kinda high at the moment!
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Really didn’t like that they brought Luke into it. Thought we were done with the skywalkers (apart from Obi Wan series)
There’s other Jedi running around in the outer rim, I’m sure we could have had someone one else, a bit lazy I thought (or just the bad CGI has annoyed me)
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Really didn’t like that they brought Luke into it. Thought we were done with the skywalkers (apart from Obi Wan series)
There’s other Jedi running around in the outer rim, I’m sure we could have had someone one else, a bit lazy I thought (or just the bad CGI has annoyed me)
I also did not particularly like that they tied the series into the Skywalker arc so quickly. As far as I understood the series concept when it first aired was that it would be a different way to show adventures in the SW universe. Maybe with an epic story to be developed at some point but not grasping for stuff from the movies to "borrow" the epic-ness.
Maybe it is just bitterness because I really did not like the new trilogy (apart from the first quarter of the first movie) and now seeing how Grogu is part of that arc (resurrecting the Emperor, being somewhat trained by Luke) will keep reminding me how much they botched the movies, at least in my view. Even the stuff they do well will then show me how good it could have been had they actually gotten people who cared about the IP to do the movies.
For me the best episode this season was the one with Ahsoka, because it let the characters breathe, as I have said before. Seing that they then reverted back to "Questgiver-NPC-or easy to grasp their story-purpose in an instance"-Style shallow characters does not make me be excited for the stuff announced. Will probably still check out The Acolyte, since the show runner is very creative, but until then my Disney+ subscription is on hold.
I am still glad The Mandalorian exists, because it is definitely WAY more StarWars than the last movies and it has reignited the passion for the IP in many people. On top of that the music and a lot of the visuals are fantastic. I do honestly hope that many people will have much joy with the stuff offered and in development and judging by the reactions here, they will! I however will remain skeptical and probably watch the other stuff only when people I know tell me it is very, very good. Until then I will enjoy all the splendid StarWars stuff you lads and ladies show here on the forum! :)
PS: It did not help that The Expanse Season 5 started this week and instantly grabbed me with the more "talky" approach. Very different show concept though!
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Loved Chapter 16.
Outstanding.
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You know, I cannot stand Bo Katan, and wish Boba had killed her dopey sidekick. Cara Dune though, I could get behind a short series of episodes where she takes down some random bad guy as a Marshall. Bo just comes across as a low rent bad guy, waiting to stab you in the back. There is nothing to interest you in her character at all. And where was Woves? He can't show up so the girls can have an all female assault?
Enjoyed seeing the riff on Rogue One with Luke showing up, that was pretty cool watching him annihilate Dark Troopers like Vader goes through the rebels on the corvette. Nice homage and way to try and right the rather poor showing that was the modern trilogy with Mary Sue and her band of otherwise useless companions.
Lastly the Boba Fett and May-who-actually-kills-her-foes might be a good show as well. Although my wife and I were laughing about how John Wayne she is (can only play one character). The whole ROTJ throwback scene was well done, and they make a decent pair.
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This is what people have wanted since 1983.
Not 8 y.o. Anakin. Not Palaptine’s “granddaughter.”
My lord, how much time has been wasted on such tripe. But, finally, it is here.
Master Luke Skywalker.
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So much hate for one little thread lol
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I think hate is a strong word. ;)
I'm excited for that Boba Fett show! As had been said, they make a great duo!
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I am almost as happy as after Empire!
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I admit it. I had tears in my eyes when that green lightsabre ignited :'(
Instantly I was taken back to 1983 and being 10 years old again. Really, really enjoyed that episode and this series has more than made up for "The Rise of Skywalker". 2021 has the potential to be a really good year for Star Wars fans.
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I think hate is a strong word.
My lord man, let’s be honest, it isn’t nearly strong enough.
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I really liked it. It's bitter sweet as it's the end of a fantastic show. I would love to see more Mando adventures even if little Grogu has gone to school.
Man, I didn't get it at first when first I saw the X-Wing, but when May said: "Only one X-Wing" I was jumping in my seat while my wife was still trying to figure it out.
I understand the desire to see characters beyond those of the films, but the show became connected to the Skywalkers as soon as we saw Ashoka and it was so cool to see Luke Skywalker, Jedi Master, go through the Dark Troopers. At first I thought that since he was holding the Dark Saber, Mando would have been the one going through them, slicing and dicing. Did Luke steal his thunder right before taking his kid? Poor Mando, he had a bad day :)
That final scene washed the after taste of the latest movies. This feels like the true sequel, following the events of RotJ. That show was great, that show was Star Wars.
The Book of Boba looks promising. I loved how Bib Fortuna became all fat after taking over Jabba's gang.
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My lord man, let’s be honest, it isn’t nearly strong enough.
But it leads to the Dark Side! lol
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Great ending to the season, got my interest in starwars again after the last 3 awful films
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Does it get any darker than Rise of Skywalker?
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Does it get any darker than Rise of Skywalker?
Certainly not. That movie made the two Ewok pictures as well as the Christmas special look like decent entertainment! :'(
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Just a polite reminder, this isn’t a sequel/prequel bashing thread. It’s a thread about The Mandalorian.
Keep it on topic :D
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Just a polite reminder, this isn’t a sequel/prequel bashing thread. It’s a thread about The Mandalorian.
Keep it on topic :D
Yes please
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Some of you guys may have missed the subtext of not only the most recent episode of The Mandalorian but also of the ENTIRE SHOW, generally speaking. The sequel trilogy movies went in one direction, to the effect of dividing and frustrating the audience. The Mandalorian went in pretty much the exact opposite direction, to the effect of uniting and entertaining the audience. The issue of how Luke Skywalker was portrayed in Episode VIII is probably the most controversial aspect of the sequel trilogy and lo and behold The Mandalorian just happened to punctuate its main arc by weighing in on that specific matter.
I mean, this isn’t a coincidence. You don’t accidentally spend two hundred million dollars or so making a couple seasons of a show that aesthetically, thematically, and emotionally critiques the work of your peers and rivals. The Mandalorian has started to function as Favreau’s open letter to Bob Iger, stating something to the effect of “everyone knows I should be in charge of Star Wars.” His show has made an increasingly powerful argument for that proposition over the last two years and this season/series finale, with its fan-pleasing portrayal of Luke, is the most eloquent argument yet.
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Well, to steer it back on topic: The Mandalorian has, for me, not only reignited my interest in Star Wars wargaming, but also set on a course of telling well-made stories after the two trilogies I enjoyed. The more it moves to the ST, the more I would grow suspicious, I thought.
On thr contrary, though, I even can see myself enjoying some aspects of the new movies (though I‘ll never forgive them the death of Han and Luke and RoS in general).
I now desperately want Dark Trooper minis!
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Someone has almost certainly already made STL files for the Legion community.
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I remember Dark Troopers in the old Battlefront game on my old Playstation years ago. They weren't much like these guys though, just standard troopers with black armour, jump packs and an odd scattergun thing. I wondered where the idea for them came from.
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I remember Dark Troopers in the old Battlefront game on my old Playstation years ago. They weren't much like these guys though, just standard troopers with black armour, jump packs and an odd scattergun thing. I wondered where the idea for them came from.
The original Dark Troopers were a terminator cyborg like thing (and extremely dangerous) from the Dark Forces PC game, one of the better Doom clones of the 90s.
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The original Dark Troopers were a terminator cyborg like thing (and extremely dangerous) from the Dark Forces PC game, one of the better Doom clones of the 90s.
Looks like the Mandalorian's dudes are following this then.
Just saw the last episode by the way and I think I had a multiple nerd-gasm. I'm also really happy I converted MrsCub to being enough of a nerd to love Star Wars almost as much as me, although she's not so steeped in the lore.
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Am I the only one who got a bit of a Disney “Black Hole” vibe from the Dark Troopers?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKYFa9FHEU4
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just watched it - I have never really had a major desire to game star wars. Watching Luke slice through dark troopers and then jumping to boba fett performing a coup in jabbas palace really changed my mind!
Also if Grugo goes with luke, does that mean he dies during kylo rens rampage/massacre at the new jedi academy? that would seem to be the implication unless disney are now basically declaring the sequels non canon.
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I admit it. I had tears in my eyes when that green lightsabre ignited :'(
Instantly I was taken back to 1983 and being 10 years old again. Really, really enjoyed that episode and this series has more than made up for "The Rise of Skywalker". 2021 has the potential to be a really good year for Star Wars fans.
Same.
I called Luke coming in answer to the call from Tython to save the day a couple of eps back, but I was still giddy. Even with the slightly uncanny valley.
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So much hate for one little thread lol
Are you suggesting that the Sith is present among us?!! lol
Cara Dune won't be getting her own show any times soon it would appear. There was talk of her getting her own show but then other stuff got in the way. I do wonder if she'll be part of Rangers of the New Republic though...
I don't get the hate, it's Star Wars, just enjoy it. It's movie and not TV escapism. Just switch off a bit and enjoy it.
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I don't get the hate, it's Star Wars, just enjoy it. It's movie and not TV escapism. Just switch off a bit and enjoy it.
I get where you're coming from, and there is definitely a tendency online for negative conversation to spread exponentially. But I think that it's unfair to not at least understand that for some, particularly fans of world-building, some of the story decisions and character developments of the latest Star Wars offerings are disappointing. I for one feel that way, and think the story beats of the sequel trilogy harmed the entire saga. It's made worse when you read about how behind the scenes they were scrambling to figure out what to do, to come to some kind of ending that'd please everyone, hence they had no plan. It shows a lack of care that Star Wars didn't deserve. Star Wars can and has been more than brainless laser-show entertainment.
The Mandalorian shows a lot of care has gone into it, including the respect it shows to what was built before. The difference is really night and day, to me. I also repeat, hate is a strong word. If Star Wars is just silly escapism that no one should take too seriously, then no one should take criticisms of it too seriously either.
I know the mods might frown on this diversion, but I enjoy discussing these things with this community. I hold no hate at all, or anger, or disrespect. Please don't tell me off! ;)
To steer it back to the topic, though, I did find myself with a nice reminder that Star Wars is a real pulp adventure. The plucky heroes either don't get hit, or all the shots his their bits of armour. It was great to see Luke annihilating those Dark Troopers. One particular nod to his power was when he crushed one with the force! He's come a long way even by this point. I'm curious to see where they go with all that. Is taking Grogu the only part Luke has to play? Who knows?
I also am curious to see how the dark sabre conundrum is resolved.
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With where the Mandalorian has gone story wise I think it is impossible to separate it completely from the sequel trilogy... even as much as I would like to.
Whilst I agree with much of what Gibby says, I do in fact hate the sequel trilogy. I dislike the prequels but I absolutely abhor the sequel trilogy. That feeling ruined The entire IP for me, so much so I did not even like hearing Star Wars music any more... and it was at one time my all time favorite film soundtrack music. I am the Star Wars loving fan who memorized dialogue from A New Hope back I the day and the inept handling of the sequel trilogies made me feel like I could not enjoy Star Wars Assault or Legion. The Mandalorian gets credit for bringing back the love. It is important to discuss that because it is relevant to the nature of the Mandalorian and it influences what can be made in the future.
Comments of do not over analyze it, just sit back and enjoy it is the kind of thing that keeps getting things some of us do not like made... and things some of us want never made. Saying the sequels were good enough would have us seeing more of those and no Mandalorian.
People can like the sequel trilogy, they do not have to feel about it the way I, and others, feel. But then bring up the positive points. Hating alone is no good, or loving.... constructive criticism has considerably more value in improving things. Honest, respectful debate improves art and community.
When I ask for feedback on my painting I want genuine, honest respectful compliments and suggestions on improvement. Empty platitudes feel nice, like junk food, but are not going to make my art better. I only improved for example the eyes on my figures because some friends encouraged me toners harder.
So since I want more like the Mandalorian and less like Rise of Skywalker, I am going to praise the things I like in both and criticize the things in both I do not like. I am going to share my thoughts to influence others and read the thoughts of others to see if they can influence me.
The Star Wars IP is worth billions of dollars and influences millions of people. What people think of what is created with all those resources matters and influences the future.
Mentioned earlier... it is interesting to compare space opera Star Wars with sci-if Expanse, both are excellent for what they are. They can be different from each other and not detract from each other. But one Star Wars story can, and does, impact all the others.... even the Ewok Christmas Special.
Edit: And yes, the Mandalorian has made me optimistic about the Star Wars future. I am hungry for more. I am listening to Star Wars music whilst painting and trying to figure out how to get some Mandalorian vibe going in my still in Development Core Space project.
And will Din become the Mandalore?!
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Just finished watching season two and came to the LAF for some wargames porn and this was at the top of the Recent list so I thought I'd give it a read.
As a result I thought I'd add my perspective and personal observations
1. Star Wars is just a western set in space, it's not a religion, credo or guide for life :)
2. Just because you're the 'biggest Star Wars fan evva', doesn't mean the Madalorian is wrong, it's just a TV series ;)
3. Perhaps time could be better spent painting minis and playing games rather than writing a thesis about space westerns and how they could have done it better? lol
Just my point of view.
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Since the season's apparently over and folks cannot take a hint, ;) I'll lock this thread for a bit so everyone can cool down a bit and remember this is about the Mandalorian show and not the sequels/prequels trilogies.