Lead Adventure Forum

Miniatures Adventure => Colonial Adventures => Topic started by: Atheling on July 23, 2020, 08:03:46 PM

Title: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 23, 2020, 08:03:46 PM
Hi,

I'm about to embark on a substantial Second Afghan War project, pulling in all the troops types from both protagonists as well as adding (re: probably converting) some of the more esoteric stuff. I can't really say more on the subject as of yet- ooh, mysterious

I recently came across the image attached to this post vie the net. It is attributed to Wiki so I supposed that it ought to be reasonably accurate- or at least fact checked?

I'm assuming that the gun on the left is a Seven Pounder (Screw Gun?) but what I'd like to know is what type and caliber is the gun on the right? I'm thinking 24 Pounder?

If it is a 24 Pounder (or 18??) then is it a Heavy 24 Pounder or a 24 Pounder Field Gun?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on July 24, 2020, 04:12:58 PM
I believe it’s a 40LBR.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Mad Guru on July 25, 2020, 09:34:03 AM
My good friend Sgt. Guinness AKA: JBaumal is 100% correct.  It is indeed a RBL 40-pounder Armstrong gun,  a 4-gun battery of which formed part of the garrison of Kandahar during the siege of that city following the British defeat at Maiwand.

Here's a LINK to said gun's Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun)

Several years ago a small number were produced in 28mm scale for private subscription, a few of which JBaumal and myself are lucky enough to have had the opportunity to purchase.

Here's a not-very-good pic of one posed atop the unfinished tabletop for my fast-approaching 140th Anniversary Battle of Kandahar game:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SbRQZzJKY3g/XwTHqWQZdiI/AAAAAAAAU3E/GwK2F4eOe_0VZxilrT54G3VnrQqGucU2QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_7049.HEIC)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 25, 2020, 09:45:52 AM
I believe it’s a 40LBR.

My good friend Sgt. Guinness AKA: JBaumal is 100% correct.  It is indeed a RBL 40-pounder Armstrong gun,  a 4-gun battery of which formed part of the garrison of Kandahar during the siege of that city following the British defeat at Maiwand.

Here's a LINK to said gun's Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun)

Several years ago a small number were produced in 28mm scale for private subscription, a few of which JBaumal and myself are lucky enough to have had the opportunity to purchase.

Here's a not-very-good pic of one posed atop the unfinished tabletop for my fast-approaching 140th Anniversary Battle of Kandahar game:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SbRQZzJKY3g/XwTHqWQZdiI/AAAAAAAAU3E/GwK2F4eOe_0VZxilrT54G3VnrQqGucU2QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_7049.HEIC)

Thanks guys.

So, in effect I'm going to have to scratch build one.

Could I ask a favour. I have downloaded the wiki pics but just so i can get a sense of scale for the 28mm crew could I please ask if when you manage to find the time could you take some side on horizontal and aerial view pictures of the whole gun please?

No rush or anything.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on July 25, 2020, 04:57:03 PM
I am considering a 40pdr scratch build too, but for an armed train project.

The Wikipedia page has a dimensioned drawing of the barrel:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun)

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/69/RBL_40_pounder_35_cwt_gun_diagram.jpg)

Cheers
JJ



Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on July 25, 2020, 09:47:10 PM
(https://i.postimg.cc/4dRXcKvv/40-pounder-parts-3.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on July 25, 2020, 09:52:47 PM
(https://i.postimg.cc/MvJ9589L/40-pounder-parts-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/MvJ9589L)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on July 25, 2020, 09:58:04 PM
(https://i.postimg.cc/mPYfjw3Y/40-pounder-parts-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mPYfjw3Y)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on July 26, 2020, 08:13:25 AM
Nice! How many of these were made?

Since I am planning something along these lines

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/71/The_Armed_Train_at_Alexandria.jpg)

I will need to make a suitable carriage.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 08:13:37 AM
I am considering a 40pdr scratch build too, but for an armed train project.

The Wikipedia page has a dimensioned drawing of the barrel:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun)

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/69/RBL_40_pounder_35_cwt_gun_diagram.jpg)

Cheers
JJ

Keep me up to speed on how you go about the construction JJ. I've never attempted to scratch build anything that is 'straight' line I and I don't mind admitting that I'm quite nervous of the idea- though the enthusiasm to get this build done it very high!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 08:18:36 AM
(https://i.postimg.cc/MvJ9589L/40-pounder-parts-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/MvJ9589L)

(https://i.postimg.cc/mPYfjw3Y/40-pounder-parts-1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/mPYfjw3Y)

Are these available from anyone  :o ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Mad Guru on July 26, 2020, 08:51:49 AM
My good friend Rhingyll was another of we happy few 40 Pounder Bounders, so to speak, AKA: devoted Second Afghan War types.

Here's some comparison pics with a Perry screw-gun and I think an Old Glory field gun of the same era, alongside some hopefully handy measuring sticks:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-_RW8tttDky0/Xx1CPVm__tI/AAAAAAAAU54/nky258jfTA0aQEWlqMS_FqR_cpQ46FvwACLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_8985.jpg)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-8NfFpv5pC8s/Xx1CPZ9rshI/AAAAAAAAU5w/q-LDmyltCEQrRemkytVZSicraqffETxzQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_8986.jpg)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-s9QWnvftiJE/Xx1CPbrv-PI/AAAAAAAAU50/UL-XuBS9WUMX33HIIuodBoJg9LYKuA6EgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_8987.jpg)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-zsFufP9bl2U/Xx1CQtyaB3I/AAAAAAAAU6A/FWb_YsUXsvs3xJ8icBqDKj_FMQ1clI1ZQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_8989.jpg)

RE: If they're currently available... I don't know, but I doubt it.  They were made in pretty limited number.  I will try to the email the maker and inquire.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 09:07:15 AM
Thanks for posting the pics MG- they have been added to the growing collection  8)

RE: If they're currently available... I don't know, but I doubt it.  They were made in pretty limited number.  I will try to the email the maker and inquire.

That would be enormously appreciated. The more I look at the RBL 40-pounder Armstrong gun the more daunting a prospect it is!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: sjwalker51 on July 26, 2020, 09:28:07 AM
If there’s the possibility of another production run, I’d happily order a couple.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 11:04:48 AM
If there’s the possibility of another production run, I’d happily order a couple.

Indeed. I would certainly be up for ordering a few MG- if you could pass that on too please? :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on July 26, 2020, 12:04:37 PM
RE: If they're currently available... I don't know, but I doubt it.  They were made in pretty limited number.  I will try to the email the maker and inquire.

I would also be up for ordering a few … three or four I reckon.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Leunstoelgeneraal on July 26, 2020, 12:18:45 PM
I am a very curious person (;-))), so I looked at etsy:

https://www.etsy.com/nl/search?q=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&_qc=RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong

This link shows the website of PengModelWorkshop from Saskatoon, Canada, showing 3D-models. I think what is offered is software for 3D-printers. So, since 3D-printers seem to grow in popularity and declining in price, more people make use of it. Perhaps it is worth the trouble to inquire whether this software can create the wished-for guns ?
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 01:09:16 PM
I am a very curious person (;-))), so I looked at etsy:

https://www.etsy.com/nl/search?q=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&_qc=RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong

could be useful- I don't have a 3 D printer though..... nor does my local library at present, not that i could visit even if I wanted to as I have to 'shield' :(

This link shows the website of PengModelWorkshop from Saskatoon, Canada, showing 3D-models. I think what is offered is software for 3D-printers. So, since 3D-printers seem to grow in popularity and declining in price, more people make use of it. Perhaps it is worth the trouble to inquire whether this software can create the wished-for guns ?

I think it's fair to say that it is a 3D download. I don't know very mich at all about 3D stuff- not even what sort of files are used for particular printers.

Does anyone have a better understanding(?) not that it could be worse then mine  lol
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on July 26, 2020, 03:34:27 PM
I saw the 3D renders too. Great references. I think the issue with 3D printing is resolution, that is the dimension of the layers, which determines fidelity of rendering.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 26, 2020, 04:42:26 PM
I saw the 3D renders too. Great references. I think the issue with 3D printing is resolution, that is the dimension of the layers, which determines fidelity of rendering.

I think I know what you mean- in layman's terms; the definition might not look right if the layers of 'print' are not thin enough?

It would be much nicer to have one cast in metal or resin. :)

Mind, having said that, I will take what I can get if it means I can avoid the complication of scratch building such a complicated gun!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on August 01, 2020, 09:52:20 PM
I have several naval guns that were 3D printed and they are quite nice! I’m sure this would be a very viable option if someone can generate the program.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: WillieB on August 01, 2020, 10:03:25 PM
I think I know what you mean- in layman's terms; the definition might not look right if the layers of 'print' are not thin enough?

It would be much nicer to have one cast in metal or resin. :)

Mind, having said that, I will take what I can get if it means I can avoid the complication of scratch building such a complicated gun

A friend of mine is printing 28mm small bits for me like shakos and such on a resin printer.  Absolutely no print lines.
This is one of his 1/700th scale ships
(https://scontent.fbru1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/116911566_2811178809130526_3442039365488985571_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=b96e70&_nc_ohc=IyGqfHctZosAX8cXx1v&_nc_ht=scontent.fbru1-1.fna&oh=cb3512a0765f0272afb3c2a84de9b41d&oe=5F4B634A)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 01, 2020, 10:54:12 PM
I have several naval guns that were 3D printed and they are quite nice! I’m sure this would be a very viable option if someone can generate the program.

I'm willing to give anything a go at this stage. Any imperfections in the printing, if indeed there were any, could be filled in. Though ideally I would ideally love to see the gun in resin or in metal I would definitely settle for a 3D print.

What do you think?
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Admiral Benbow on August 03, 2020, 04:16:35 PM
I am a very curious person (;-))), so I looked at etsy:
https://www.etsy.com/nl/search?q=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&_qc=RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong
This link shows the website of PengModelWorkshop from Saskatoon, Canada, showing 3D-models. I think what is offered is software for 3D-printers. So, since 3D-printers seem to grow in popularity and declining in price, more people make use of it. Perhaps it is worth the trouble to inquire whether this software can create the wished-for guns ?

My impression is that you would buy an Autodesk file for a 1:1 3D-drawing of that gun. From there you would have to scale it down correctly, convert it to a printerfriendly file-format and prepare sections including supports to print the single components. I don't know much about printers but that is what I understood from the descriptions on that page.

And yes, if that gun would be ever available as 28 mm model, please count me in for some ... 8)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Admiral Benbow on August 03, 2020, 04:44:59 PM
From an Autodesk specialist I just got the information that the Autodesk software Fusion 360, in which that 3D-drawing was created, can export STL-files to print from in a 3D-printer. So, if anybody does know someone who qualifies as a 3D-printer expert, that would be the way to get this gun ... :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 03, 2020, 04:51:30 PM

And yes, if that gun would be ever available as 28 mm model, please count me in for some ... 8)

You can count me in 100% too.

Which is kind of why I started the thread ;) :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 03, 2020, 06:32:42 PM
Ehm ..if to justify the production you need another buyer ..count me please 😏
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: gamer Mac on August 03, 2020, 10:02:42 PM
I would change your thread title
And ask directly for some one with the required skills, I am sure there are people on this forum with the required skills
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 04, 2020, 05:35:06 AM
If the quality of the 3D print is as promised by the render on the web site I would be up for three guns.

There is just one potential issue, though, the terms of use (on the web site):

‘These 3D files are for personal, non-commercial use only. Without a written permission from me, you may not sell, copy, exchange, transfer, publish, assign or otherwise distribute anything you copy or derive from these files.’

🤔
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 04, 2020, 10:40:46 AM
If the quality of the 3D print is as promised by the render on the web site I would be up for three guns.
Quote

Hi JJ,

Have you a link to the site please? I'm getting more confused by the day- have some 3D renders been made of the guns?

There is just one potential issue, though, the terms of use (on the web site):

‘These 3D files are for personal, non-commercial use only. Without a written permission from me, you may not sell, copy, exchange, transfer, publish, assign or otherwise distribute anything you copy or derive from these files.’

I think that just means keep them for personal use. yeah?
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 04, 2020, 03:50:36 PM
Here you go …

https://www.etsy.com/listing/687020431/3d-model-british-armstrong-rbl-40?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&ref=sr_gallery-1-1 (https://www.etsy.com/listing/687020431/3d-model-british-armstrong-rbl-40?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&ref=sr_gallery-1-1)

best viewed on a desktop/laptop … different views are shown on the left, just click …

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 04, 2020, 04:43:17 PM
Here you go …

https://www.etsy.com/listing/687020431/3d-model-british-armstrong-rbl-40?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&ref=sr_gallery-1-1 (https://www.etsy.com/listing/687020431/3d-model-british-armstrong-rbl-40?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=28mm+RBL+40-pounder+Armstrong&ref=sr_gallery-1-1)

best viewed on a desktop/laptop … different views are shown on the left, just click …

Cheers
JJ

Right gotcha. Thanks JJ  8)

Bearing in mind that 3D printing it completely new to mew how would I get one printed up to 1/56?

1/56 is a little smaller then most 28mm mini's nowadays so what would be the ideal scale?

Also, where is the best place within the UK/EU to get one printed up? Opinions from customers only please ;) :)

I hope to hear from someone soon :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 12:06:21 AM
Well as someone that does do 3D printing, it all depends on what scale the designer made it in. On the item description it says 28mm. FYI, often people design in a given scale, 1/48, 1/72, etc....as you need to tailor certain things to the scale. However, some design in 1:1 and then it is up to the person to decide what scale they want to do it in. The guy made this in Fusion 360, which is pretty user friendly. That said, it also depends on how the guy has configured the parts, as this would be best printed in resin and you need to support the parts for them to print properly.

If you are interested in getting this I could give it a try printing it out for you. PM me if your interested.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 12:21:11 AM
For clarification, Jack wrote:

Quote
‘These 3D files are for personal, non-commercial use only. Without a written permission from me, you may not sell, copy, exchange, transfer, publish, assign or otherwise distribute anything you copy or derive from these files.’

This is a standard bit that 3D designers do when selling their files. My guess would be that if each interested party bought the file the designer would be happy with that. Then each license holder could print up as many of the things as they wanted for their 'personal usage'.  In short, this is not for filing sharing and that is way uncool to even consider.

If any of you are serious about this then let me know. It would give me a break from printing Star Wars Legion minis for my son and AFV conversions parts for me! :)

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 05, 2020, 08:02:19 AM
For clarification, Jack wrote:

This is a standard bit that 3D designers do when selling their files. My guess would be that if each interested party bought the file the designer would be happy with that. Then each license holder could print up as many of the things as they wanted for their 'personal usage'.  In short, this is not for filing sharing and that is way uncool to even consider.

If any of you are serious about this then let me know. It would give me a break from printing Star Wars Legion minis for my son and AFV conversions parts for me! :)

Thanks ARKOUDAKI. PM inbound :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 05, 2020, 09:07:36 AM
On the item description it says 28mm.

The web site states that the scale is 1:1:

‘The model is extremely detailed. Many contemporary and modern documents were consulted during the creation of this model. The scale is 1:1 with the drawing unit being millimeters.’

Anyhow … I have PM-ed you.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 12:15:14 PM
Hi guys, Wow, got a flurry of IMs from people. Okay, let me sum up things rather than answer individually all the IMs.

(1) I have already messaged the designer of the guns on Etsy asking some basic questions. Once I get a response, I will revert to people here.

(2) As for those of you that want this piece, as I stated I am happy to do the printing on my Photon resin printer. You can just cover costs as none of you can afford my time (LOL). I will sort that out with people individually ONCE I get a response back from the designer. Given past experiences, I would then set-up the pieces for printing (this sucks loads of time) and then print a test one out (more time). Then I would post some pics and we can go from there.

(3) For those of you wanting to get these guns you would EACH need to buy a license directly from the designer but DON'T DO THAT YET, as I am still waiting to hear back from the guy. If the designer has done the work in Fusion 360 as I would suspect, it would be a bunch of separate components that one prints out and then assembles to make the gun.

In closing, this looks like a fun project but UNTIL I hear back from the designer on the questions I asked him, please hold your horses and keep your powder dry.

PS Lastly, as most of you know, I have been around on the forum for awhile and I am a trustworthy type...so please act accordingly. :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 05, 2020, 12:35:16 PM
Got it.

I wait with baited breath :)

.....and many thanks for going to all this trouble  8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 12:40:27 PM
@ Jack Jones

Quote
The web site states that the scale is 1:1:

‘The model is extremely detailed. Many contemporary and modern documents were consulted during the creation of this model. The scale is 1:1 with the drawing unit being millimeters.’

I didn't spot that I just saw the file search on your item saying "28mm RBL 40-pounder Armstrong"...but perhaps that was your search parameter.

If the gun is 1:1 it can be done in scale but just bare in mind that things don't always print well if they aren't designed for a specific scale. I know that may not sound logical to everyone but trust me, it is how things work, as you may not technically be able to make everything in detail as you scale down. For example, I work with a lot of files for 1/48 AFVs but I also do 1/72 AFVs, so I need to rescale them. However, just because it works in 1/48 (for which is was designed) doesn't mean it will work in a smaller scale.

In any event, I still haven't heard back from the designer but once I do I will post up here and let you guys know what is happening. :)

FYI, my next big project is printing a Star Wars Clone Wars LAAT (ie Republic Gunship) for my son in 1/47 (Legion scale). That should be interesting...and time consuming
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 12:41:36 PM
Quote
.....and many thanks for going to all this trouble

I will get you painting all my Perry plastic Sudanese!  lol
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 05, 2020, 12:42:51 PM
I will get you painting all my Perry plastic Sudanese!  lol

Gulp!  lol
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 06:58:14 PM
Hi guys, Wow, got a flurry of IMs from people. Okay, let me sum up things rather than answer individually all the IMs.

(1) I have already messaged the designer of the guns on Etsy asking some basic questions. Once I get a response, I will revert to people here.

(2) As for those of you that want this piece, as I stated I am happy to do the printing on my Photon resin printer. You can just cover costs as none of you can afford my time (LOL). I will sort that out with people individually ONCE I get a response back from the designer. Given past experiences, I would then set-up the pieces for printing (this sucks loads of time) and then print a test one out (more time). Then I would post some pics and we can go from there.

(3) For those of you wanting to get these guns you would EACH need to buy a license directly from the designer but DON'T DO THAT YET, as I am still waiting to hear back from the guy. If the designer has done the work in Fusion 360 as I would suspect, it would be a bunch of separate components that one prints out and then assembles to make the gun.

In closing, this looks like a fun project but UNTIL I hear back from the designer on the questions I asked him, please hold your horses and keep your powder dry.

PS Lastly, as most of you know, I have been around on the forum for awhile and I am a trustworthy

type...so please act accordingly. :)

Sorry but if somebody want to buy a model it’s ridiculous to oblige everybody to “buy a license” ..if stated in that way by the designer ..from a juridical perspective its simply an exortsion ..I’m ready to buy the product even at a cost higher than his bloody license but I’ll never buy his license
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 07:19:35 PM
Quote
Sorry but if somebody want to buy a model it’s ridiculous to oblige everybody to “buy a license” ..if stated in that way by the designer ..from a juridical perspective its simply an exortsion ..I’m ready to buy the product even at a cost higher than his bloody license but I’ll never buy his license

Well your choice but I definitely will not be printing you out anything if this goes ahead. In short, what you are suggesting is flat out 'pirating' where you buy one item and then make multiple copies of it! Perhaps you think that is okay but I don't! I don't pirate other people's work to sell on.

Let's be clear how this all works. If a designer goes to the trouble of making something it is his/her intellectual property, and if they offer up a 3D file then that is what the license fee covers. In fact, unless they are selling a lot of the item the designer usually doesn't earn back his/her time and effort put into actually making the thing. By buying the files you agree to the designer's terms and conditions. If you don't like it, go get a CAD program and make your own.

Since getting my 3D printer I have collected quite a few files of things I want to print out. Some I paid for (license for my own personal usage) and some were free (again, with a license for my own personal usage). That is how it works and I respect that.

I originally jumped in and offered to help out but there is always somebody that thinks they are somehow a 'special' person who wants to take advantage. I have no time for such people.

Hope this clarifies matters.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 05, 2020, 07:29:21 PM
@ ARKOUDAKI

I didn't spot that I just saw the file search on your item saying "28mm RBL 40-pounder Armstrong"...but perhaps that was your search parameter.

If the gun is 1:1 it can be done in scale but just bare in mind that things don't always print well if they aren't designed for a specific scale. I know that may not sound logical to everyone but trust me, it is how things work, as you may not technically be able to make everything in detail as you scale down. For example, I work with a lot of files for 1/48 AFVs but I also do 1/72 AFVs, so I need to rescale them. However, just because it works in 1/48 (for which is was designed) doesn't mean it will work in a smaller scale.

Yes, 28mm was a search criterion.

I think I understand your point about quality of print … some details may be too small to render, or may need modification if they are to reproduce at all ?

And quite right – your points about IP.

Thanks for your interest and effort here … all very exciting.

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 07:29:44 PM
I’m not asking you anything so your answer it’s totally out of place..I underline the absolutely wrong and unfair stance of the designer that you seem to support so much..is it this guy an attorney entitled to rule against the common law or maybe it’s god?
Arkoudaki it seem that you ve instead plenty of time if you represent this guy with the aim of trying to sell both the product and a supposed to be license plenty of time for the same object ..probably your doing worst than supporting piracy (as you just Seem to admit) If your aim is to ask people to pay twice for the same item..I’m sorry for you but you ll not get my money
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 07:40:00 PM
Italwars, with all due respect, you clearly don't know much about law and definitely don't have a grasp of the tenets of 'copyright' law. Hence, I would suggest you read up on it before you go off making statements that lack adequate legal basis. To reiterate, what you are suggesting is illegal, as it would be copyright infringement of the designer's intellectual property, and the law is pretty clear on that subject.

End of discussion.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 07:45:24 PM
Quote
Arkoudaki it seem that you ve instead plenty of time if you represent this guy with the aim of trying to sell both the product and a supposed to be license plenty of time for the same object ..probably your doing worst than supporting piracy (as you just Seem to admit) If your aim is to ask people to pay twice for the same item..I’m sorry for you but you ll not get my money

Italwars you are totally out of line, accusing me of what amounts to criminal activity, which is without any basis and subject to libel. I have notified the moderators of your misconduct.

You clearly can't read and don't have a clue what you are talking about. Your just one of those 'flamer' types.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 07:49:54 PM
I invite you to study and obtain a university degree! I know better than you ..what YOU seem to support (the designer attempt ) it’s illegal ..even if you ‘re nt aware of that..PS: your proposal of oblige to pay  twice For the same item as nothing to do with copyright ..are you joking? Please
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 07:55:09 PM
I did the same Report to the moderator following your insults!!! very curious about why you represent this designer bizarre commercial policy!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Westfalia Chris on August 05, 2020, 07:56:47 PM
I invite you to study and obtain a university degree! I know better than you ..what YOU seem to support (the designer attempt ) it’s illegal ..even if you ‘re nt aware of that..PS: your proposal of oblige to pay  twice For the same item as nothing to do with copyright ..are you joking? Please

Italwars, please calm down right now. I suspect it may be a language problem, but Arkoudaki is quite right and you may be misunderstanding things.

Let me outline the issue at hand.

1. The designer created an own work. Assuming he holds the rights to said work and may exploit it economically, it is fully within his rights to sell licenses to others allowing said others to use said item.

2. This is relevant if the item is to be reproduced, in this case by 3d printing. For this, there would be two main options:

A) the owner issues a license including rights to the licensee to reproduce and sell the design. In this case, the licensor may be recompensed by a higher license price or ask for royalties for items produced and sold, but the latter will be very hard to police.

B) if the owner/licensor does not allow licensees to sell copies of the printed item, the proper way will be for each interested person to purchase a license that allows them to print it for personal use. Depending on the national legislation, the licensee might now task a third party (here, Arkoudaki) to print copies of the design for him if he doesn't own a printer himself, provided the printer does not profit financially from it or the tasking of a third party is explicitly allowed.

Another example: if you purchase a downloaded file, e.g. a PDF of a wargames magazine, you may not sell copies of said file unless specifically authorised to do so by the terms of said purchase. Depending on the national legislation, you should be allowed to re-sell the original item without keeping a copy for yourself.

To sum up: if you buy the 3d file, modify and print it for your own use, this should be okay and covered by the license. If you sell copies to third parties or pay a third party to produce it on your behalf, this must be allowed by the license.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 08:01:41 PM
Ok i calm down
But from a legal point the statement “each one has to buy a license” and above all “nobody can swap, sell ecc a product derived from that software” is wrong if not fraudolent but I’ve not said that! The poster A. Is reporting something which is totally absurd from a legal point of view ..is like to say “you can buy my nespresso coffee machine but you can’t prepare coffee “
And finally I didn’t ask anything to A. But if he advertise an unknown seller or designer that want Me before  selling a me a product also buy his license I cannot accept that without  saying a word
That S the end of my post
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 05, 2020, 08:30:13 PM
Ok i calm down
But from a legal point the statement “each one has to buy a license” and above all “nobody can swap, sell ecc a product derived from that software” is wrong if not fraudolent but I’ve not said that! The poster A. Is reporting something which is totally absurd from a legal point of view ..is like to say “you can buy my nespresso coffee machine but you can’t prepare coffee “
And finally I didn’t ask anything to A. But if he advertise an unknown seller or designer that want Me before  selling a me a product also buy his license I cannot accept that without  saying a word
That S the end of my post

Well … I am a designer working in the UK, and my work is protected by the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988. I can assure you that it gives me complete control over who uses my work and the terms of usage.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 08:35:54 PM
I m happy for you but I suppose you ve 3 Alternative options :
A) sell the item (miniature , tank ecc)
B) sell the license (or software)
C) sell nothing
Really difficult to understand from a legal point of view and from a business one how to pretend that your customers have to accept 2 options together and adding that even you have the license you’ve to buy for each item a new one ?...
I should resist to be carried out by this real incredible discussion ..i prefer historical than fantasy 😉
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Westfalia Chris on August 05, 2020, 08:44:16 PM
Ok i calm down
But from a legal point the statement “each one has to buy a license” and above all “nobody can swap, sell ecc a product derived from that software” is wrong if not fraudolent but I’ve not said that! The poster A. Is reporting something which is totally absurd from a legal point of view ..is like to say “you can buy my nespresso coffee machine but you can’t prepare coffee “
And finally I didn’t ask anything to A. But if he advertise an unknown seller or designer that want Me before  selling a me a product also buy his license I cannot accept that without  saying a word
That S the end of my post

Italwars, re-reading this I really think you are misunderstanding the issue.

The site linked offers for download a digital file containing a 3d model of the gun in question, which may then be used by the purchaser on a strictly personal level. The creator is not selling a "physical" product, e.g. an actual model of the gun. Neither is Arkoudaki proposing selling the item if he purchased it, but rather doing someone a favour who bought the item but doesn't own a printer.

If you buy this 3d model, then modify it so that it will print all right, this is well within your rights.

You may not make this model available to others who didn't pay for it, be it for sale or for free. You must also not sell 3d prints of the 3d model, since the original terms of the purchase, I.e. the license, do not allow you to do this.

The main question is: may someone print this item for you and be recompensed for his cost of material, time and electrical energy? He must not do so if only he owns a license, since he may not redistribute it, since it would deprive the original file author of his due revenue.

That said, the shape of the gun isn't that bad. Given good plans, one could easily do their own design using a free solution like Tinkercad.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: italwars on August 05, 2020, 08:53:17 PM
Sorry Westafalia Chris I cannot understand that ..thanks for your patience but I cannot understand why should I buy a license and become a proud owner of a tool that would allow me to print even 100 miniature guns and
and then ask somebody else to print it for me at a cost of one license for every model🤨🤨

Ok I’ll not add anything more on that ..sorry but it’s too much for my brain

Said that an Elephant battery big gun in 28mm is really a heavy piece ..TSATF rules book should probably allow no more than one shot every two turns and only at long range..I ll better scratch build one and mount it on my Britain plastic elephants of which I own at least ten without any license
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Westfalia Chris on August 05, 2020, 09:12:22 PM
Sorry Westafalia Chris I cannot understand that ..thanks for your patience but I cannot understand why should I buy a license and become a proud owner of a tool that would allow me to print even 100 miniature guns and
and then ask somebody else to print it for me at a cost of one license for every model🤨🤨

Ok I’ll not add anything more on that ..sorry but it’s too much for my brain

Nobody is asking you to do that. You are supposed to buy one licensed file, after which you could modify it yourself and print it as many times as you like for your personal use.

Every person who would want at least one print of the gun would need to buy one (1) license first, not one (1) for each printed model. One license per person, not one per gun model printed.

I'm sorry, but you clearly misread what was discussed earlier in this thread.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Dr DeAth on August 05, 2020, 09:34:26 PM
FYI, my next big project is printing a Star Wars Clone Wars LAAT (ie Republic Gunship) for my son in 1/47 (Legion scale). That should be interesting...and time consuming

That looks an interesting model - will you be in a position to offer a similar service as the one you are proposing for the gun?  I'd be interested in a 1/100th scale for 15mm.

Re the IP and Copyright for it, where would I purchase a license?  I'm assuming the originator of the 3D files has permission from Disney?

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 05, 2020, 09:50:34 PM
@Dr Death
Quote
That looks an interesting model - will you be in a position to offer a similar service as the one you are proposing for the gun?  I'd be interested in a 1/100th scale for 15mm.

Sorry but I am not offering any 'printing services', as my time is far too valuable. My original input on this thread was to help out Atheling (Darrell) on this project, nothing more, as he has helped me out in the past and I was just returning the favor. :)

If you go on Thingiverse you might find what you are looking for. https://www.thingiverse.com/search?q=republic+gunship&type=things&sort=relevant

If so, you just need to download the file, and print it out yourself or pay someone to print it out for you. There are loads of companies that do this but they are usually expensive.

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 06, 2020, 07:45:19 AM
Hi,

Apologies for being a little blunt/slightly didactic here..... this is not a great thing to behold when one has just finished gulping down ones morning coffee.....

1/ This thread was originally a quest to find out what equipment was depicted in the image I originally posted re:Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns.

2/ Many people have been very helpful and I thank you for your kindness.

3/ ARKOUDAKI is going out of his way to help me. He is being attacked on grounds that are at best flaky and most likely deliberately contentious and quarrelsome.

4/ If you have nothing to offer the conversation in regard to the theme of the original post please butt out and stay out. I am sorry to have to use such language but the LAF I remember being a part of was a fora for wargaming, painting etc and not an amphitheatre for legal debate.

Again, sorry for being so prescriptive about the content of the thread but this is getting very out of hand and has drifted dramatically away from the point.

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Dr DeAth on August 06, 2020, 08:47:57 AM
Hmm,  didn't mean to be contentious or quarrelsome, I jumped in to the thread mid way so didn't see the op about the gun.

I was just asking about licensing from Disney out of genuine interest, there seem to be lots of people making Star Wars items and I suspect not all of them have Disney's permission. I don't want to fall foul of copyright laws by printing unlicensed items.

As ARKOUDAKI has made it clear his printing service won't extend to Star Wars, but will be limited to the specific artillery piece in various scales, I'll leave this thread to those that need the gun  :)



Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 06, 2020, 09:14:11 AM
This.

Hi,

Apologies for being a little blunt/slightly didactic here..... this is not a great thing to behold when one has just finished gulping down ones morning coffee.....

1/ This thread was originally a quest to find out what equipment was depicted in the image I originally posted re:Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns.

2/ Many people have been very helpful and I thank you for your kindness.

3/ ARKOUDAKI is going out of his way to help me. He is being attacked on grounds that are at best flaky and most likely deliberately contentious and quarrelsome.

4/ If you have nothing to offer the conversation in regard to the theme of the original post please butt out and stay out. I am sorry to have to use such language but the LAF I remember being a part of was a fora for wargaming, painting etc and not an amphitheatre for legal debate.

Again, sorry for being so prescriptive about the content of the thread but this is getting very out of hand and has drifted dramatically away from the point.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 06, 2020, 10:04:56 AM
Hmm,  didn't mean to be contentious or quarrelsome, I jumped in to the thread mid way so didn't see the op about the gun.

I was just asking about licensing from Disney out of genuine interest, there seem to be lots of people making Star Wars items and I suspect not all of them have Disney's permission. I don't want to fall foul of copyright laws by printing unlicensed items.

As ARKOUDAKI has made it clear his printing service won't extend to Star Wars, but will be limited to the specific artillery piece in various scales, I'll leave this thread to those that need the gun  :)

Yeah, I'm sorry to have to been so verbose. It's not something particularly enjoy doing.

Re: 3D and the guns- that is the scale of things. A favour kindly offered to a friend with the proviso that I buy the license. :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Admiral Benbow on August 27, 2020, 07:02:22 PM
Hello, just want to ask if we have any progress here? Had the designer been contacted? I'm still very interested in the gun model and would of course buy a licence if it could be realized.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 27, 2020, 08:16:08 PM
Hello, just want to ask if we have any progress here? Had the designer been contacted? I'm still very interested in the gun model and would of course buy a licence if it could be realized.

No sorry. No progress. It doesn't look like a metal gun will be available  :'(
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on August 28, 2020, 09:22:19 AM
Was the Admiral referring to the 3D print option?

Cheers!
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on August 28, 2020, 09:26:33 AM
Was the Admiral referring to the 3D print option?

Cheers!
JJ

I'm not sure. I haven't heard back on whether that would be viable yet and I want to allow the chap who volunteered his services to do it in his own time as he is doing me a favour (if it is possible- complicated as the only files available are actually 1/1 scale and need to go down to 1/56!!)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on September 03, 2020, 08:10:32 PM
Sorry guys, I was out of the country for a week collecting the family and bringing them back here (school started today). Just settling in but will try and get back to this when time permits...the boss says I left the house messy while she was away, so I might have KP duty this weekend!  :'(

And just to clarify, I did already contact the designer a few times and he was very helpful. The problem is that he designed the gun at 1:1 scale and made all the pieces. Hence, for scaling it down there will no doubt be some issues getting all the various parts to print. I might be able to combine parts in a CAD program but it would take some time.

I previously suggested to Darryl that it would be best to go ahead and buy one (1) license and see if the project can actually be done. If it is doable and I can get it to print as a descent looking gun, then I will let other interested parties know (so far two of you contacted me) and move from there.

FYI, there is one person that under no circumstances will I be doing anything for, and I am sure you know to whom I refer.

Like Darryl said earlier, I am helping out here and time will be the issue. In general it takes quite a bit of time to do all the supports so that model can be printed. However, once you have it set-up right on the computer then you can print the model out over and over, usually with a good level of success. The intricate nature of the gun and its many parts will be the issue as to whether a 1:1 gun can be done properly in 28mm (1/56). 

More later on....  ;)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on September 04, 2020, 09:35:30 AM
Thanks for the update ARKOUDAKI. Mucho appreciated.

I'll PM you later on today  mate.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on September 09, 2020, 01:12:46 AM
https://i.postimg.cc/RZFqBzgs/Elephant-Gun-and-Limber.jpg
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on September 09, 2020, 01:16:10 AM
https://i.postimg.cc/TPv8cV5V/Elephant-Limber.jpg
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on September 09, 2020, 02:57:44 PM
https://i.postimg.cc/TPv8cV5V/Elephant-Limber.jpg

Thanks for that Rhingyll. Do you know who owns them or where indeed I could buy one (please)?
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Rhingyll on September 09, 2020, 08:51:09 PM
I only know of one person who may have one of them but I am not positive. It would be JBaumal who often posts on this site. Maybe you could reach out to him. I think he may have most recently posted on Madguru's Battle of Kandahar.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on September 09, 2020, 09:36:31 PM
I only know of one person who may have one of them but I am not positive. It would be JBaumal who often posts on this site. Maybe you could reach out to him. I think he may have most recently posted on Madguru's Battle of Kandahar.

Thanks. I think he's been contacted on my behalf already by Mad Guru, sadly to no avail.

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Monty on September 10, 2020, 07:41:52 AM
Good morning gentlemen,

that a great project!
Actually I'm looking for a 40pdr since I started with NWF.

In case that a printable file becomes available I'd be very interested and of course I'd be willing to buy any appropriate licence for personal use. Unfortunately I don't know how to support. Although I've been 3D printing since a couple of months I'm an absolute 3D sculpting noob.

Cheers
Stefan
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on September 10, 2020, 07:53:31 AM
Good morning gentlemen,

that a great project!
Actually I'm looking for a 40pdr since I started with NWF.

In case that a printable file becomes available I'd be very interested and of course I'd be willing to buy any appropriate licence for personal use. Unfortunately I don't know how to support. Although I've been 3D printing since a couple of months I'm an absolute 3D sculpting noob.

Cheers
Stefan

Hi Stefan,

I can't speak for ARKOUDAKI but the very kind chap that he is going to try to do the printing is a very busy man ans is doing this for me as a personal favour. I'm not sure he would be up for doing any more though I could be wrong. The main problem is that it is a 1/1 scale model and will; need resizing down to 1/56 which is very difficult.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Monty on September 10, 2020, 08:00:34 AM
Many thanks for the update.

I have only a rough idea how much work it might cause to do such a re-scalling. Tiny things like chain links, nuts, bolt and all this stuff must be terribly painful to re-scale by hand. All the more I appreciate your and ARKOUDAKIS's efforts.

If there's a way I could support the project please let me know.

Cheers
Stefan
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on September 10, 2020, 04:59:46 PM
Hi Stefan, I sent you an IM.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on March 14, 2021, 02:23:03 PM
Hi All

I have just stumbled on this …

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RBL-40-pounder-Armstrong-Field-Gun-for-War-Games-28mm-Scale-Resin-Plastic-Kit/265087010305 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RBL-40-pounder-Armstrong-Field-Gun-for-War-Games-28mm-Scale-Resin-Plastic-Kit/265087010305)

🤔
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on March 14, 2021, 05:13:23 PM
Hi All

I have just stumbled on this …

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RBL-40-pounder-Armstrong-Field-Gun-for-War-Games-28mm-Scale-Resin-Plastic-Kit/265087010305 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RBL-40-pounder-Armstrong-Field-Gun-for-War-Games-28mm-Scale-Resin-Plastic-Kit/265087010305)

🤔

I managed to get a couple of models through a very generous guy on this forum (Thanks Stefan- hope you don't mind me using your name?) so I have no need to purchase any more. Two will be enough considering the artillery train I'm going to have to cobble together :)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on March 14, 2021, 08:28:48 PM
Cool!

I ordered one 40pdr and a casemate gun and carriage for conversion with a view to making a model based on this:

(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-YqW-UDxE2r4/UBMPc7AH17I/AAAAAAAAAYA/zzmFkjuirs4/s1600/Egypt+Armored+train.jpg)

… the armed train is a longer term project though.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on March 18, 2021, 09:26:38 PM
The kits arrived …well packed and nicely detailed:

https://sandsofsoudan.blogspot.com/2021/03/armstrong-rbl-40pdr-on-naval-carriage.html (https://sandsofsoudan.blogspot.com/2021/03/armstrong-rbl-40pdr-on-naval-carriage.html)

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 05, 2021, 07:58:31 AM
I’m making a bit of progress with the 40pdr … just ordered some tiny hooks and blocks from a maritime modelling source …

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-j1xJAnISgmI/YGjCBO6aIYI/AAAAAAAAAls/l7-3bA3s3i8I0DMt4rGVnWaiW3HPRUOoQCLcBGAsYHQ/s800/WiP%2BGG%2BLimber%2Band%2B40pdr.jpg)

More on my blog.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on April 05, 2021, 11:05:59 AM
JJ, those look awesome!  Your attention to detail is motivating me to work on my 40LBR. I’m looking forward to seeing your progress.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 05, 2021, 11:47:14 AM
Thank you!

Just noticed that the barrel is mounted upside down … so much for attention to detail! I’ll sort it when I glue it, obvs …

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 10, 2021, 08:25:27 PM
While doing some research on the elevation mechanism for my model I stumbled upon this awesome 1/9 live firing 110pdr …

https://jefenry.com/main/110PounderArmstrong.php (https://jefenry.com/main/110PounderArmstrong.php)

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on April 11, 2021, 07:45:29 PM
JJ, what an awesome group of videos! Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Mad Guru on April 17, 2021, 08:09:36 AM
Wow.  Jack, your 40 pdr is awesome, can't wait to see it when it's completed!  Also... the website of the guy who built that 1/9 scale working 110pdr is quite something indeed.  As JBaumal already said, thanks very much for posting the link!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 17, 2021, 11:20:09 AM
Thank you!

I have had some correspondence with the author of the 100pdr site on the subject of the elevation mechanism (he knows his stuff) … which is likely operated by the levers on the side of the carriage.

I have all the components now … just psyching myself up for the task:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-gJQBsy71VA0/YHrBcmKZGxI/AAAAAAAAAnE/09E0Sw7cQdkdsvjSHQaoudeBtbr-3WWZACLcBGAsYHQ/s800/40pdr%2Bcomponents.jpg)

More on my rather informative blog (it actually is 😬)… which needs more followers – over 3,000 page views in just over a year, and only four followers … one of which is me, from my dormant ancients blog 🤔

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on April 20, 2021, 03:41:57 PM
JJ, great stuff indeed. Your attention detail is infectious! Keep on posting. I do visit your blog frequently, am a follower, and can highly recommend it!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 20, 2021, 09:18:58 PM
Thank you. You are very kind.

The blog functions as a kind of notebook for me, while recording the course of my little adventure.

I am torn though – the tension between modelling and gaming … and I really enjoy the research … but it has taken me ages to get momentum into the project, but that is established now.

JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: bc99 on April 21, 2021, 02:30:37 PM
Jack I feel the same way. I want to game so much but am a one man band when it comes to the hobby. I enjoy your blog as well and your posts serve as motivation.

Piece by piece we go I can only work at my best pace and I enjoy greatly my little accomplishments, as well as those made by other LAF members.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on April 21, 2021, 09:58:50 PM
Thank you!

Yes … chipping away … while looking forward to projects on the horizon like the armed train … just now I am painting the Naval Brigade Gatling gun crew figures … a distraction from the Armstrong 40pdr.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on June 11, 2021, 10:55:48 PM
The Gatling gun battery is finally finished.

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Qnb9qJLjKpo/YMEYn47K9rI/AAAAAAAAAsk/VKzbpLDC0SotIxLq9D52QoaVJKkfoosNACLcBGAsYHQ/s800/NB%2BGatling%2Bgun%2B01.jpg)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-z2mIJZZc2IY/YMEYn9KifFI/AAAAAAAAAso/rhhz8EQ29VcJK0HwjN0y2yuVPEK8g3QeQCPcBGAYYCw/s800/NB%2BGatling%2Bgun%2B02.jpg)

Not too shabby. I am considering modelling a towed version to represent the battery prior to deployment.

More on my blog.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Hu Rhu on June 12, 2021, 07:11:08 AM
Very nice indeed.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on June 13, 2021, 03:02:22 AM
WOW, simply wow! I love it!
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Plynkes on June 13, 2021, 09:37:02 AM
Well they look just smashing, Jack.

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Diablo Jon on June 13, 2021, 10:48:44 AM
Cool stuff. I wonder what the Jack tars think about ending up on the Northwest frontier not quite the life on the ocean waves they signed up for  lol. One day I will get around to a Royal Navy force for my Darkest Africa games.
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on June 13, 2021, 11:35:21 AM
Thank you! Thank you!

There was a certain tyranny about the limber model … that and not having painted anything for about three years. But I’m on a minor roll now … and when I have enough done I’ll begin a separate thread hereabouts.

Apologies for hijacktaring this thread 😬

Meanwhile … more on my blog.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: gamer Mac on June 13, 2021, 08:05:55 PM
Cracking job is the limber a perry miniatures model
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on June 13, 2021, 09:13:47 PM
Cracking job is the limber a perry miniatures model

The limber is based on their ACW plastic model (I just bought the limber sprue), the wheels are from the Gardner gun (the ACW wheels are way too large – the track and wheel size for the limbers were the same as for the guns), and the remainder is scratch built.

More on my blog …

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: gamer Mac on June 13, 2021, 10:44:32 PM
Scratch build I am impressed :-* :-* :-*
Cracking job
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on June 14, 2021, 06:41:56 AM
Scratch build I am impressed :-* :-* :-*
Cracking job

Thank you! It was a bit of a challenge, but the result, while not 100% accurate, looks the part.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: JBaumal on June 15, 2021, 12:38:34 AM
JJ, nothing is 100% accurate. Sterling work! Carry on sir ….
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on June 18, 2021, 07:55:20 AM
JJ, nothing is 100% accurate. Sterling work! Carry on sir ….

Thank you! I’m on to much simpler tasks of painting miniatures now.

Cheers
JJ
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: LuciaSanchez1997 on July 01, 2021, 05:06:20 PM
My good friend Sgt. Guinness AKA: JBaumal is 100% correct.  It is indeed a RBL 40-pounder Armstrong gun,  a 4-gun battery of which formed part of the garrison of Kandahar during the siege of that city following the British defeat at Maiwand.

Here's a LINK to said gun's Wikipedia page:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RBL_40-pounder_Armstrong_gun)

Several years ago a small number were produced in 28mm scale for private subscription, a few of which JBaumal and myself are lucky enough to have had the opportunity to purchase.

Here's a not-very-good pic of one posed atop the unfinished tabletop for my fast-approaching 140th Anniversary Battle of Kandahar game:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SbRQZzJKY3g/XwTHqWQZdiI/AAAAAAAAU3E/GwK2F4eOe_0VZxilrT54G3VnrQqGucU2QCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_7049.HEIC)
this looks so good! the level of detail is impressive
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Mad Guru on July 02, 2021, 09:30:18 AM
Thanks for the kind words, Lucia!  Don't want to derail this thread from focusing on Jack Jones's AMAZING work, but here are a couple more pics showing that same 40-pounder on the finished tabletop when that Kandahar game was played last August:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iG_8bRJcKR8/Xzm2tE7hqII/AAAAAAAAU8U/rKwFd6FMevQvahAnBFST31wpOOdYHPxqwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_9873.HEIC)

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nb_yz7RFDcg/Xzm2zVxFdfI/AAAAAAAAU9Y/74ptjGC2JA88X-oHp2cigDsIIJrDcgo5ACLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/IMG_9999.HEIC)

Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Atheling on July 02, 2021, 09:52:56 AM
Excellent stuff MG.

Very inspirational- my 40 Pounder is nearing the front of the painting queue  8)
Title: Re: Second Afghan War Elephant Battery Guns?
Post by: Jack Jones on July 03, 2021, 08:19:50 AM
Nice!

Don't want to derail this thread from focusing on Jack Jones's AMAZING work

I am the interloper!

😬

My 40pdr is parked … once I have the rolling stock I will get a shift on … but will be a while.

I began a new thread about the armed train here:
https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=130607.0 (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=130607.0)

JJ