Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Gothic Horror => Topic started by: Mosstrooper on November 25, 2008, 06:56:44 PM
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Got some Westwind Vampire Wars (?) figures second hand , any suggestions on suitable rules for them ? ???
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IMO "Chaos in Carpathia", simple the best in Gothic Horror I played!
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I'll second Agis. CinC are first class.
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Hmm, I have not played CinC so am not in a position to comment on it.
I am probably one of a very few people to champion the original Westwind Vampire Wars rules.
The problem with them was the horrendous typsetting which makes the rules very confusing to follow.
My gaming group has however stuck with them. We have made lots of house rules and changes but now use the system for all sorts of games including most of our Victorian adventures, Old West and even have modified them for Future Wars.
They are card driven for activation - so very random and use quality dice for each individual character ranging from D6 for peasants/ non coms through to D20 for heroes, master Vampires etc.
There is alot of fluff in the rules with background to each race or party. I guess it depends on how lazy you are about creating your own background or just using one straight from a book.
The two expansion books are good too. But you must be prepared to stick with them and fight your way through the confusion.
If you want a safe bet go with CinC as per the recommendations above.
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Yah, I was unfortunate enough to have purchased the Vampire Wars rules, all 3 books, sight-unseen. They suffer from what I heard characterized as 'editing while drunk'. I threw them in the dumpster, they were that bad, wouldn't consider inflicting them on anyone else, even as a gift.
Very studly of you, Malamute, to have persevered with them.
Chick
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Very studly of you, Malamute, to have persevered with them.
Chick
Yeah, either that or I am too mean to buy a different rules set. lol
We find the concept behind Quality dice and card generated movement very agreeable for the types of games we play, but you are right they are an absolute nightmare to read through and I wholeheartedly see why people ignore them.
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Many thanks for the replies , have heard mixed reviews of VWars , think a friend has a copy so I might try borrowing it . By the way I have WestWinds Gladiator Wars and found them hard to read - very hard ! , but I persisted and use them for my gladiator games now !, so will have a look at VWars . :)
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Many thanks for the replies , have heard mixed reviews of VWars , think a friend has a copy so I might try borrowing it . By the way I have WestWinds Gladiator Wars and found them hard to read - very hard ! , but I persisted and use them for my gladiator games now !, so will have a look at VWars . :)
If you ever have any questions drop me a PM. I have loads of stuff/add ons, home rules etc and pre generated character sheets I can send you.
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I am probably one of a very few people to champion the original Westwind Vampire Wars rules. The problem with them was the horrendous typsetting which makes the rules very confusing to follow. My gaming group has however stuck with them.
I have several of the rule sets using the VW system and they all suffer from the same problem. The trouble is I still think there is a good game in there somewhere if I can only find the time to work it out. When I asked the publishers politely why they had this problem I received a reply saying that it was because the rules had been written on a PC but the printer used a Mac :?
I might have another look at them. I would be interested to hear how you managed to get them to work Nick.
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Rippers : The Horror Wars is pretty good. Easy and fast gamin' to be had!
But CiC works wonders too..
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I might have another look at them. I would be interested to hear how you managed to get them to work Nick.
At the time they came out I bought all the figures and the rules unseen. There was nothing e se on the market at that time that was based around Gothic Horror.As it was based around one of my favourite subjects I was not going to give up!
So we stuck with them and persevered. The actual system is very simple, its based on quality dice and card driven movement.Its the fluff and way the book is put together that makes them very confusing.
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Vampire Wars is certainly worth the money for the background and fluff alone. If you have a very enthusiastic gaming group that is willing to invent MANY houserules I guess you can get them working.
The rules are fun to read as you always ask yourself how the hell somebody could publish something that is merely a rules draft. It's hardly a serious playtest version.
Quite a sad thing because I think the rules combined with the background have lots of potential.
"Rippers" uses the Showdown rules which also rely on Qualitydice. I don't the rules because the background is rather boring (the world is dark and sinister and everybody is somehow evil - 40K in the victorian times). The armylists are also very uninventive and don't work very well. They are also extremely incomplete and building your own troops if pretty difficult if you want them to fit into the points system. They are not my cup of tea.
Carpathia uses the very solid goalsystem mechanics. It can be used for competitive play as well as scenario games. The background is pretty much standard, not as lovely as Vampire Wars but also not as irritating as Rippers. The rules contain only four armylists but lots of special characters to spice them up a bit. The armylsits are not as balanced as they could be but that point is easily worked out with a few houserules.
It also has a working campaign system.
I use Carpathia for gaming and Vampire Wars for the background.
I'm not aware of any further Victorian Horror rules apart from these three.
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I did not feel that Rippers was sooooo Dark and Grity. I thought it had a neat kinda monster hunter or defending the village approach.
It uses a modified Great Rail Wars / Savage Worlds system, which I think is a great way to get 'kinda intersted' players gaming. It's fast and not too many rules to figure out.
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I thought it might be a good idea to make this sticky for anyone new to the forum or Gothic Horror looking for rule systems. ;)
I have rememebered another one: Occult Wars. It has had good reviews elsewhere, I think its aimed more at modern times than period games but could be worth looking at.
Feel free to add any further rule sets as they become available or if we have missed any.
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Has anyone tried Faces of Horror?
It seems to be a variant of the Face of Battle skirmish rules.
Introduction on their website saysFaces of Horror (FoH) is a new miniatures game from the designer of The Face of Battle. The game covers all characters, heroes, villains, creatures and monsters from literature and movies over the last few centuries. You can play The Mummy, Dracula, The Werewolf or modern horrors like Jason, Crawlers, or Rage Zombies.
Apologies if anyone's mentioned this before, I'm a new arrival here and just started sniffing around the boards.
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Has anyone tried Faces of Horror?
It seems to be a variant of the Face of Battle skirmish rules.
Introduction on their website saysFaces of Horror (FoH) is a new miniatures game from the designer of The Face of Battle. The game covers all characters, heroes, villains, creatures and monsters from literature and movies over the last few centuries. You can play The Mummy, Dracula, The Werewolf or modern horrors like Jason, Crawlers, or Rage Zombies.
Apologies if anyone's mentioned this before, I'm a new arrival here and just started sniffing around the boards.
Welcome on board. :)
Never heard of these rules before, where do you get them?
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http://www.thefaceofbattle.com/horror/enter.html
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Where can one purchase the CinC rules? Old Glory doesn't list them, nor does the Four Color Figures site. Also wasn't Chaos in Cairo supposed to be reprinted?
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The new CinC rules are due out later this year, using the same game mechanisms as Chaos in Carpathia. Blue Moon were waiting for the new figures to be ready for sale before launching the new rules.
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Where can one purchase the CinC rules? Old Glory doesn't list them, nor does the Four Color Figures site. Also wasn't Chaos in Cairo supposed to be reprinted?
You can get the Carpathia PDF here:
http://wargamedownloads.com/cat.php?cat=12&pics=
Buy the hard copy through Blue Moon:
http://bluemoonmanufacturing.com/index.php?cat_id=10
Thanks!
Scott
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I understand Ganesha Games will shortly be bringing out Fear and Faith for horror type games.
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I understand Ganesha Games will shortly be bringing out Fear and Faith for horror type games.
Interesting, tell us more?
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No more information at present, I'm afraid. However, they should be out shortly and I will post if I learn anything more.
I did ask if they would be suitable for the likes of Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Andrea did indicate that BTVS was a source of inspiration for the rules.
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Just to update the thread,
'fear and faith' from ganesha are out as well
as 'Strange aeons' from uncle mike.
regards
jim
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Just joined this forum and wanted to add in that I enjoy Chaos in Carpathia, I have also played the Ganesh games Fear and Faith which aren't bad but I prefer CiC. Still waiting for Chaos in Cairo to come out though, at the same time any recommendations for Foreign Legion figs?
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This site do Foreign Legion miniatures, but youill need wait till they redo there site
http://www.unfeasibly.co.uk/
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Shawnt, Cairo is out in .pdf form. A print version will be out within the next month or so I think.
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Sorry, but is Gothic Horror: Vampire Wars the original Westwind rule set, or a reworked one?
Thanks!
Is C in C still the clear winner?
Doug
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Its the original westwind set, not a reworked one. ( I like them, but am the only person that does lol) You might be bets advised to go with C in C.
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Thanks, Malamute.
I've worked out 'bad' rules before, even enjoyed the same on occasion. Not sure I'm up to it at the moment, though.
Looks like I'm on my way to Carpathia.
Doug
Edit: Of course, within a couple of days, I noticed one of my co-owners had dropped a copy of GH:VW into our used bin. Malamute, I may have some questions for you shortly...
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Wow, the typesetter's proofing on the book is AMAZING! The editing shows badly enough, but whole lines repeated later on the page, the missing half paragraphs, the... Getting a bit florid here.
Anyway, Gothic Horror: Vampire Wars is everything everyone says it is: beautiful backgrounds, intriguing mechanics, tortuous reading. Another book that needs CoC's San check applied to the reader.
Malamute: One quick question if you know; what is HMC? My guess was Holy Mother Church, but I'm not seeing it spelled out anywhere, and it's not completely clear from context.
I won’t pitch the book, but definitely need other working rules.
"Very studly of you, Malamute, to have persevered with them. "
I know my admiration has grown considerably! ;->=
Doug
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Tell me where you read MHC and I'll take a look.
If you can get past the horrendous type setting, appauling editing etc there is a reasonable set of rules. We like to quality dice approach and have adapted them to fit all sorts of genres, but it has taken a while to get used to them.
I am too tight fisted to buy another set (C in C) and have stuck with them. ;)
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Has anyone tried Faces of Horror?
It seems to be a variant of the Face of Battle skirmish rules.
Introduction on their website says
Apologies if anyone's mentioned this before, I'm a new arrival here and just started sniffing around the boards.
I've just got a set of Vampire Wars rules coming through...so will look at the background with interest ;) Always faced CinC but never taken the plunge, Faces of Horror, no not seen it.
I used to play Chill and Call of Cthulhu (other board I know) in my youth and Chill worked well with miniatures.
The Commander
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Tell me where you read MHC and I'll take a look.
If you can get past the horrendous type setting, appauling editing etc there is a reasonable set of rules. We like to quality dice approach and have adapted them to fit all sorts of genres, but it has taken a while to get used to them.
I am too tight fisted to buy another set (C in C) and have stuck with them. ;)
Sorry, in some of the tables, especially Blessed whatevers (don't have rules handy'), but have come to see HMC/MO are Holy Mother Church and Militant Orders in the fluff. Took a bit to dig them out, but if you're a fan of gothic horror, you'll have heard the terms near ad nauseum. ;->=
We know you love the rule mechanics, and I even admitted I had a glimmer of their worth, but only a glimmer so far. I still weep for hard drive...
Likewise to being 'tight fisted'; however your motivation, we admire your determination!
Doug
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I used to play Chill many years ago. It is a great rule set for story telling & role playing. But it is a role playing game & can bog down with more than a few characters or monsters on the table. BTW Askari Miniatures has some nice French Foriegn Legion figures.
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Tell me where you read MHC and I'll take a look.
If you can get past the horrendous type setting, appauling editing etc there is a reasonable set of rules. We like to quality dice approach and have adapted them to fit all sorts of genres, but it has taken a while to get used to them.
I am too tight fisted to buy another set (C in C) and have stuck with them. ;)
Not played C n C yet but I own a copy. It looks good ole fashion fun.
Cheers
Andy
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Do GASLIGHT rules work for gothic Horror?
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Do GASLIGHT rules work for gothic Horror?
Hadn't given it a thought; nothing actually made up in the rule set itself, so you'd have to be doing a fair bit of tweaking.
Worth a bit of diggin', on the Yahoo! group and the web in general; shall put it on my list. The whole feeling of 'cinematic' of the original certainly suggests it's pointing in the right direction. Van Helsing, Dracula would never die; they'd have to be available for the next battle 'scene'.
Doug
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To build on The_Beast's reply, I would say, 'Yes,' GASLIGHT would work great for Gothic Horror type games. It is a cinematic rules set, where players control Main Characters (the hero types) and Extras (the cannon, or in this case, monster fodder.) The rules are telescoping, and you can easily scale games from roleplaying type adventures to mass battles. The "To Be Continued...by GASLIGHT" Pulp supplment contains useful additonal rules for monsters, and magic among others. Be aware, that the GALSIGHT Compendium was just released last month and provides gamers with all the rulebooks under one cover.
For more information visit our website:
http://www.bucksurdu.com/Buck_Surdu/G.A.S.L.I.G.H.T..html (http://www.bucksurdu.com/Buck_Surdu/G.A.S.L.I.G.H.T..html)
-Chris
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I've done a few Cthulueque games using To Be Continued by GASLIGHT, and they went off very well. Most of the figures went insane when the monster revealed itself, but that is to be expected. It was fun.
Synjin
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have just purchased west winds empire of the dead rule book and some figures hope to have a game going soon
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Empire of the Dead is the most (current) obvious choice - but how about "Rippers - The Horror Wars" if you fancy a fun "rules-lite" set of rules.
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Empire of the Dead is the most (current) obvious choice - but how about "Rippers - The Horror Wars" if you fancy a fun "rules-lite" set of rules.
Unfortunately I can't stand anything steampunk, so it's Chaos in Carpathia for me (being hungarian, it is comfortably close to home as well :) )
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I HATE the Term Steam-Punk, there's nothing fracking "punky" about Victorian Sci-Fi/Horror.
There's VERY little Sci-Fi about EotD - a couple of the gadgets are very "techy" but thats about it
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Some thoughts about rules usable for 18th C. Gothic Horror (but hopefully of some wider interest) there (http://www.theoddfellowslounge.com/forums/showthread.php?288-Rules-for-Lacepulp-games).
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Ih5rwnHCgso/TnLNfHTcO_I/AAAAAAAACek/879GhObFgO0/s1600/Chasseur%252Bde%252Bloup.jpg)
(source (http://carpatland.blogspot.fr/2011/08/test-strange-aeons.html))
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6ii_svcr9uA/SZL8BX2HdQI/AAAAAAAABAg/148wO6JYCSs/s400/P2110879.JPG)
(source (http://husarenritt.blogspot.fr/search/label/Weird%20Seven%20Year%20Wars))
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Uz9_pMruTCQ/UYmqARyPT6I/AAAAAAAABfQ/ifab2zsRYWw/s1600/Don%27t+fire+until+01.jpg)
(source (http://adventuresinlead.blogspot.fr/2013/05/18th-century-horror.html))
(http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/7813/dscn09095270168.jpg)
(source (http://passageoflines.50.forumer.com/on-a-moonlit-night-in-pangaea-t364128.html))
(http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g183/Anatoli_2006/Strange%20Aeons/SAM_3317.jpg)
(source (http://anatolisgameroom.blogspot.fr/2011/06/3-games-of-strange-aeons-18th-century.html))
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-m46rCtIf2RM/UE-QYq_9ADI/AAAAAAAABPg/pA9zFBdxlLo/s400/Final%252BConfrontation.jpg)
(source (http://bogdanwaz.blogspot.fr/search/label/Clockwork%20Punk))
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http://mattsgamepage.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/rescue-from-schwarzherz-wald-fear-and.html
http://mattsgamepage.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/rescue-from-schwarzherz-wald-part-2.html
Two scenarios played out at the Gloucester club using Fear and Faith
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I have a new Gothic horror game coming soon. New miniatures now on Indiegogo. My website is vampireslayersclub.co.uk I know this is a bit late for a reply but see what you think.
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I have never played a Gothic horror game, so I don't know if I really like any of the rules in my posession; apart from a session or two of Horrorclix. But I am familiar with Deadlands: The Great Rail Wars and Savage Worlds, so I had a preference for Rippers: the Horror Wars. Except that, guys, Count Dracula not being killed at the end of Dracula, when the book clearly states he was, was cute once or twice, but boy did it get old before Rippers came out.
There are some free rules I have found:
http://necropolishorrorskirmish.blogspot.com.au/
http://web.archive.org/web/20070807212722/http://www.rwlee.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/slayer.htm
From the Blue Moon figure sets:
http://downloads.bluemoonmanufacturing.com/Thingsthatgobump_1.html
Otherwise I could only find two war-in-Hell rulesets, and a whole bunch of - yup - zombies.
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The Gothic expansion for IHMN is worth a look.
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Arkeo Obscura features detailed rules for games set in the 18th century onwards. It's aimed mostly at solo gamers and there aren't any rules for playing as the monsters though.
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I don't know if there was a new edition or they cleaned up the rules but I do not find
any of the problems people have with Gothic Horror Vampire Wars. To me they are very
easy to follow and the rules make for a good usually quick game. They did include a correction
sheet with the rules and help correct a few mistakes in the text.
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To date, I've been using Donnybrook Skirmish Rules for my Gothic Horror FIW games. The rules include a Cultist faction, and it's easy enough to pencil in other gothicky bits. There's a long rumoured Donnybrook Dark with more specific Fantasy/Horror elements that might actually get released one of these years. Currently, Donnybrook is available in pdf format only:
https://www.leagueofaugsburg.com/shop/products-cat-30.html
I also have a fairly new set of rules, and looking forward for a chance to play them, Devil In The Wilderness, witchhunting set in early colonial Salem Mass:
https://www.thegamecrafter.com/games/devil-in-the-wilderness-rulebook-and-cards
Looking forward to the Devil In Sleepy Hollow sequel game, due on Kickstarter this fall.
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I'm going to be looking at cobbling together a few sets to see how they will function together. Mechanically the goal system is pretty straight forward so Chaos in Carpathis should do the trick. I want solo gaming so the AI from Arkeo Obscurus is a strong possibility, and a campaign framework of some sort to keep the big story going so procedural ideas from 5 Leagues from the Borderlands.
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Newly arriving on the scene is 7TV Dracula, which is on Kickstarter at the time of this writing and quite likely available come March 2023 (Crooked Dice has a great track record for delivering on schedule).
The rules are a variant of 7TV Fantasy, specifically tailored for Stoker's narrative with a progression of scenarios.
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The AI system in Arkeo Obscura is excellent, worth the price of the rules even if all you want is to graft it onto another set of rules (which is a simple task).
It is not a bad set of rules in its own right and works really well played co-op.
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So many of the above games are OOP and tough to get.
Wiley Games' Fistful of Lead is well supported, much beloved and has a horror supplement: https://wiley-games.myshopify.com/collections/tales-of-horror (https://wiley-games.myshopify.com/collections/tales-of-horror)
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Seconded on Fistful of Lead. The Tales of Horror dovetail easily into any period.