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Author Topic: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?  (Read 8273 times)

Offline ulverston

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 474
Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« on: August 18, 2018, 01:18:19 PM »
Hi Chaps,

I plopped a post on my blog about a recent purchase from Valiant/Rapid fire and have ust completed a British infantry Battalion. Amongst the responses was a very interesting snippet that Valiant are in the process of re scaling their miniatures to fit better with other manufacturers?  Does anyone have any information about this please?

Also whilst I am here if anyone could give me rough sizes of 20mm scale houses, doors windows etc please? I have asked before but cannot find the post now!

Thanks in advance.

Offline Pendrake

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2018, 02:41:16 PM »
1:1200 .. 1 inch equals 100 feet ...... 1.5 mm soldiers
1: 900 ... 1 inch equals 75 feet ........ 2 mm soldiers
1: 600 ... 1 inch equals 50 feet ........ 3 mm soldiers
1: 300 ... 1 inch equals 25 feet ........ 6 mm soldiers
1: 150 ... 1 inch equals 12.5 feet ..... 12 mm soldiers
1: 120 ... 1 inch equals 10 feet ........ 15 mm soldiers
1: 100 ... 1 inch equals 8 1/3 feet .... 18 mm soldiers
1: 90 ..... 1 inch equals 7.5 feet ....... 20 mm soldiers

1: 75 ..... 1 inch equals 6.25 feet ..... 24 mm soldiers

Windows vary by architect... Doors: standard 80 inch door  should be 22.5mm. But[!] pragmatically the minimum size door should be the diameter of an individual figure base and 24mm tall. Because: 3mm thick base + 20mm figure + 1mm to spare = minimum door height of 24. I would make ceiling heights at least 30mm...

A 10x10 inch building would be a small, 75 foot per side, square warehouse (a 5,625 square foot space).

Hope some of that helps.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2018, 02:53:27 PM by Pendrake »
Pendrake

Offline ulverston

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 474
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2018, 05:23:59 PM »
Pendrake that is fantastic, thank you. I have made lots of 28mm buildings but I am finding my feet in 20mm which I have found to be trickier.

Thanks again

Offline Ultravanillasmurf

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2018, 08:55:32 PM »
Interesting scaling, in the UK 20mm is normally nearer 1/76 (or 4mm to the foot or UK 00 gauge scale *).

PSC label theirs at 1/72.

US and Continental  HO (1/87 or 3.5mm to the foot) sounds close to the quoted 1/90.

Back to the top of the head or eye level...

(* it is OO gauge because it uses HO gauge track at 4mm to the foot scale, but that is a story for another day)
« Last Edit: August 18, 2018, 09:10:32 PM by Ultravanillasmurf »

Offline Tim

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2018, 09:08:25 PM »
Interesting scaling, in the UK 20mm is normally nearer 1/76 (or 4mm to the foot or UK 00 gauge scale *).

PSC label theirs at 1/72.

US and Continental  HO (1/87 or 3.5mm to the foot) sounds is close to the quoted 1/90.

Back to the top of the head or eye level...

(* it is OO gauge because it uses HO gauge track at 4mm to the foot scale, but that is a story for another day)

Yes, I've never heard of 20mm = 1/90.  1/76 pretty much and very generally applied to 72 and 76, though in the last century, the former was frequently referred to as 25mm.
--
Tim

Offline Ultravanillasmurf

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2018, 09:13:50 PM »
Yes, I've never heard of 20mm = 1/90.  1/76 pretty much and very generally applied to 72 and 76, though in the last century, the former was frequently referred to as 25mm.
Interesting, 25mm is often given as figure size for 1/64 (S) scale.

S Scale society http://www.s-scale.org.uk/figures.htm#Commercial

Offline Pendrake

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2018, 10:37:33 PM »
The maths of it could not be simpler:

20mm scale  is ten times  2mm scale.


(But once a host of manufacturers, a multitude of fudge factors, and a vile horde of marketing majors trying to shift product jump into the mix, it becomes a mess instead of math.)

Offline Etranger

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 917
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2018, 11:10:21 PM »
Yes, I've never heard of 20mm = 1/90.  1/76 pretty much and very generally applied to 72 and 76, though in the last century, the former was frequently referred to as 25mm.

Some of the very early products from the 'German' companies (Preiser, Roco etc) were nominally 1/90, before moving to the very similar but 100% compatible with HO, 1/87 scale.

20mm is a size, not a scale, & traditionally associated with 1/72, which is of course, 1 inch equalling 6 feet, in 'proper' (Imperial) terms.  ;)  It's a very long established modelling scale indeed & nothing to do with being 10 X the size of 2mm. Incidentally 1/720 is a long established ship modelling scale.

« Last Edit: August 18, 2018, 11:14:16 PM by Etranger »
"It's only a flesh wound...."

Offline Ultravanillasmurf

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2018, 06:26:55 AM »
That explains it, I wondered where 1/72 came from - it still seems irrational, 4mm to the foot makes  so much more sense ^__^.

Interesting about Roco, I had a bunch of Roco Minitanks back in the 'eighties, they seemed all over the place scale wise. my assumption was they were mixing 1/72, 1/76 and HO.

Offline MartinR

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    • The games we play
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2018, 08:20:22 AM »
Early 15mm used to be around 1/106, but these days it has standardised on 1/100th.

The sizes attributed to figures, 2mm, 6mm, 15mm or whatever are just labels and bear very little relation to actual scales. Scales can only really be determined by the attributes of physical objects which can be compared to their real life counterparts (vehicles, guns, aircraft, rifles). It is much harder for figures as there is no international scale police to determine whether you measure to eyes, crown or top of hat and does it include the base?
"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" Helmuth von Moltke

Offline NTM

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 215
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2018, 07:48:54 PM »
Valiant are indeed rescaling and I've seen pictures on another forum of pre-production figures obtained at Bovington including this side by side with Dixon, SHQ and Adler.


Offline Ultravanillasmurf

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2018, 08:19:20 PM »
They could all have been Platoon 20 figures in terms of height ^__^.

Offline Arlequín

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  • Culpame de la Bossa Nova...
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2018, 11:58:46 PM »
ROCO were nominally 1/87 - HO,  but 1/Box in reality.
Thanks to the adoption of 'foot to eye' measuring, you do get two scales being tied to minis, a '28mm' figure is actually about 31mm tall, so 5 and a bit mm to the foot, or around 1/57 to 1/60, rather than 1/65 which some people swear is the right scale.

A 'true' 20mm figure would thus be 1/87-ish, while a foot-to-eye 20mm would be 1/80. Likewise 1/76 and 1/72 are the 'inch high' or 25mm equivalents.

How 1/48 or O Scale fits in with its 40mm, or 37mm to the eye figure size, to 28mm, I couldn't begin to guess... unless it's to do with bases.

 ;)

Offline Pendrake

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  • Posts: 150
Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2018, 03:45:38 AM »
Real humans are 7 heads tall.

In ^ this ^ pic...
The first three are: 6.5, 6, and 6 heads tall.  :?

( What did I say earlier? “...host of manufacturers; multitude of fudge factors...” )

Edit: which one is the Valiant figure?
« Last Edit: August 20, 2018, 03:58:09 AM by Pendrake »

Offline Arlequín

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Re: Valiant Miniatures re-scaled?
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2018, 07:36:51 AM »
The *average* human is 7.5 heads tall, a *tall* human is about 8. The pubic bone is usually the halfway point on the body and the wrists typically line up with the hip joint, the elbows with the navel.

Walk down any busy street and you'll see numerous exceptions to the above.

But what has that to do with scale height?  :?

I'm guessing the Valiant figure is the plastic German, second from the right.