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Author Topic: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size  (Read 14986 times)

Offline bazookajoe

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Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« on: October 27, 2018, 03:26:20 AM »
So following a suggestion on the Victrix website, I ordered some of their new Republican Roman cavalry to use as Carthaginian cavalry.  My Carthage army also includes some Numidian light cavalry.  Here is how a Victrix Republican Roman cavalryman looks next to a Victrix Numidian cavalryman.  The Roman looks like an ogre by comparison!  The difference in horse size is not too bad but if you compare the riders they are very different.  The same difference is there if you compare the Roman rider to Victrix Carthaginian infantry.

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2018, 03:39:49 AM »
Damn! That's ridiculous.

I am going to take a look at the Victrix Greek Cavalry I have and put them beside my Victrix Iberian cavalry now.

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2018, 03:50:03 AM »
That's a huge oversight on Victrix part.

Take a look at the infantry I own.




Okay, the Roman appears to be bigger, but if you look at the Numidian, he is crouching down. It's more or less not going to be noticeable on the field of battle.


But that rider!!!!  Shrek turned Donkey into a stallion, but forgot to turn himself into a human prince!

Offline bazookajoe

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2018, 04:14:55 AM »
The Victrix Rep Roman cavalryman is more akin to a 1/48 scale figure or even larger.  It is ridiculous for a manufacturer to have such a huge size variation within its own ancients range.  If I compare the cavalryman to my Numidian infantry (the same figure as in Weigraf's picture) the difference is huge.  Therefore, the size difference between Victrix Rep. Roman cavalry and Rep Roman infantry (which I don't have but which is pictured above) must also be significant.  I don't mind minor variations but this just dumb and a major ripoff for buyers.

Oh, and did I mention that my Victrix order was short a set of shield transfers and no one ever responded to my email about it? 

Way to go, Victrix!

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2018, 04:31:52 AM »
Quote
The Victrix Rep Roman cavalryman is more akin to a 1/48 scale figure or even larger.  It is ridiculous for a manufacturer to have such a huge size variation within its own ancients range.  If I compare the cavalryman to my Numidian infantry (the same figure as in Weigraf's picture) the difference is huge.  Therefore, the size difference between Victrix Rep. Roman cavalry and Rep Roman infantry (which I don't have but which is pictured above) must also be significant.  I don't mind minor variations but this just dumb and a major ripoff for buyers.

Oh, and did I mention that my Victrix order was short a set of shield transfers and no one ever responded to my email about it? 

Way to go, Victrix!

I collect Warlord Games ( Immortal )  Hoplites.  If you stick with the Macedon / Persian / Greek state models that were released earlier than 2017, then all the miniatures are for the most part, similar in size.  One oversight I think they had was that their recent metal spartan general (and possibly their Sacred Band of Thebes, I have yet to get them) are considerably larger in bulkiness and height compared to their older plastics and metals.  And if you venture out into Warlord's Caesarians, however, the scale changes are noticeable despite being all "28 mm " , as with their Gauls as well.

But for infantry, they're all roughly about 28 mm (except their old Imperial Romans, which are quite squat) and it doesn't bother me so much.. but for the Victrix Cavalry, I can see quite the difference.

I agree with you bazookajoe - if it is the same range of ancients and the size is that obvious... come on

Offline Hu Rhu

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2018, 10:04:31 AM »
On the back of the information in this post I have done a size check against the Roman Republican cavalry and the Spanish cavalry, Greek light cavalry and Gallic cavalry (I don't own any Numidians) in my collection. However I seem to recall that the numidians rode small, wiry ponies, which could be expected to be considerably small than other cavalry.

The horses from all sets are all of a similar height although the Roman and Gallic horses are slightly wider in the beam to the Spanish and Greek horses mostly due to the way the former two sets have separately cast saddles. However the differences are almost insignificant, especially as one is unlikley to be mixing the sets in the same unit.

The riders, however, are slightly different.  The Spanish, Greek and Gallic riders are slightly slimmer and and fractionally smaller than the Roman rider, which is a little bulkier, especially if you add the cloak, which makes it a much chunkier figure.  It certainly shows when you put them side by side (No photos available at this time). However the differences are not so noticeable as in the earlier pohoto of Roman and Numidian cavalry.

However as I said before, you are unlikley to be mixing these figures in the same units and once on the table the difference is hardly noticeable.  That however is no excuse for the scale creep in Victrix, especially since they are all CAD sculpts.

That said IMHO these are the best figures available for the period, cover the entire range of Punic Wars (with a small matter of Gallic slirmishers) and I for one will not stop buying them.

Offline Tonhel

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2018, 03:11:10 PM »
On the back of the information in this post I have done a size check against the Roman Republican cavalry and the Spanish cavalry, Greek light cavalry and Gallic cavalry (I don't own any Numidians) in my collection. However I seem to recall that the numidians rode small, wiry ponies, which could be expected to be considerably small than other cavalry.

The horses from all sets are all of a similar height although the Roman and Gallic horses are slightly wider in the beam to the Spanish and Greek horses mostly due to the way the former two sets have separately cast saddles. However the differences are almost insignificant, especially as one is unlikley to be mixing the sets in the same unit.

The riders, however, are slightly different.  The Spanish, Greek and Gallic riders are slightly slimmer and and fractionally smaller than the Roman rider, which is a little bulkier, especially if you add the cloak, which makes it a much chunkier figure.  It certainly shows when you put them side by side (No photos available at this time). However the differences are not so noticeable as in the earlier pohoto of Roman and Numidian cavalry.

However as I said before, you are unlikley to be mixing these figures in the same units and once on the table the difference is hardly noticeable.  That however is no excuse for the scale creep in Victrix, especially since they are all CAD sculpts.

That said IMHO these are the best figures available for the period, cover the entire range of Punic Wars (with a small matter of Gallic slirmishers) and I for one will not stop buying them.

Yes, they are the best and indeed as you said such scale creep / oversights should not happen. Certainly as it is all CAD.

I can only hope that this in the future will not happen anymore. Hopefully their new Dark Age line is more consitent scale wise.

Offline 3 fingers

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2018, 03:31:01 PM »
The Roman cavalry model on the right seems to have thick legs ? Or is it me o_o

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2018, 04:17:09 PM »
Quote

However as I said before, you are unlikley to be mixing these figures in the same units and once on the table the difference is hardly noticeable.  That however is no excuse for the scale creep in Victrix, especially since they are all CAD sculpts.



The Size difference is very noticeable on the battlefield, I personally think.   If you are using nothing but Victrix you may get away with this.  But if you're playing the Punic Wars and you want to field your Numidian cavalry beside your Republican Romans - you are going to see Ogres riding beside numidians!

Perhaps if you did an all Republican Roman Army, with pure native forces and all Victrix infantry. Maybe you'd not notice as much, then.
 
I did a quick  blog post on a whole bunch of comparisons in my collection.  There's no way I'd be fielding other types of Cavalry beside the Victrix Giants.  If the army is nothing but Victrix Greeks , maybe. But that means your other minis in your collection look a tad silly, even from a distance.
https://steepledhatstudios.blogspot.com/2018/10/victrix-made-shetland-pony-for.html
 

There's no excuse for them to have such a crazy scale creep - and even if the Numidian cavalry are wiry, which yes - you can see the horses are okay for Victrix size here, it is the horsemen here that are in question.  If you're a company making ancients you'd think with the technology they use to make these models they'd have a bit more consistency! 

Quote
That said IMHO these are the best figures available for the period, cover the entire range of Punic Wars (with a small matter of Gallic slirmishers) and I for one will not stop buying them.

For the infantry I agree with you entirely, Hu Rhu.  The Carthaginian box set and Republican Roman infantry box sets are great.   I love all the variation in the Republican Roman army.   But the scale creep and slightly weird variations between each of Victrix' set on the infantry is not as noticeable as this giant on his donkey.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2018, 04:26:57 PM by Wiegraf »

Offline bazookajoe

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2018, 05:26:45 PM »
Quote
The riders, however, are slightly different.  The Spanish, Greek and Gallic riders are slightly slimmer and and fractionally smaller than the Roman rider, which is a little bulkier, especially if you add the cloak, which makes it a much chunkier figure.  It certainly shows when you put them side by side (No photos available at this time). However the differences are not so noticeable as in the earlier pohoto of Roman and Numidian cavalry.


There is more than a "slight" difference in the riders.  The Numidian is like a hobbit and the Roman is like a GW orc.  The cloak has nothing to do with it.

I am usually not very fussy about small size differences in figures and I agree that it does not matter much when they are in different units.  However, this variation here is too much especially from the same manufacturer and range.  I don't such wide variation with Perry plastics so I think consistency is possible.

This will make me hesitate to buy certain products from Victrix again.  I think the infantry figures are usually good in this regard but they seem to have a problem with cavalry.  I was thinking of going for their Celts but I won't do that now for this reason.

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2018, 08:09:57 PM »
Put the Celtic cavalry from Victrix next to Warlords... yikes.

But that I can accept since they are different manufacturers. The thing I can’t understand is why Victrix is going more heroic 28mm

Offline Tonhel

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2018, 08:17:27 PM »
Put the Celtic cavalry from Victrix next to Warlords... yikes.

But that I can accept since they are different manufacturers. The thing I can’t understand is why Victrix is going more heroic 28mm

I don't mind heroic scale, also I don't really care how they look size wise compared with other companies / competion. So if they look bigger than other companies. It's not a problem. I even prefer it.

The only problem I have is the scale creep between a range of the same company. I don't care if Victrix Ancient Greeks are smaller than their Early Imperial Romans. So long that everything released for that range is the same. So if all the Celts and Imperial Romans are the same scale wise than there is no problem at all.

The scale increase is probably to don't make it so easy to use different company miniatures with Victrix mini's. Which is no problem solong Victrix provides an extensive range.

I will look at it at Crisis.

Offline Wiegraf

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2018, 08:34:55 PM »

Quote
The scale increase is probably to don't make it so easy to use different company miniatures with Victrix mini's. Which is no problem solong Victrix provides an extensive range.

Aye I could see that. But the riders between their own numidian and Roman are not the same.  They look ridiculous side by side.

That and one thing I’ve liked about historical wargaming is the openness to using all sorts of minis from all sorts of companies. If Victrix wants to make their cavalry match their infantry with a GW store can only use our models exclusive kind of mindset ,okay.   But it’s clearly going beyond that and even making stuff bigger than their own so that it isn’t really matching.

Offline aphillathehun

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2018, 06:46:47 PM »

The only cav I have from Victrix are Gauls and they tower above all my other 28mm manufacturers ancients.  So I ordered a bunch of A&A Gallic cav to go with my Victrix foot.

Offline bazookajoe

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Re: Victrix Republican Roman Cavalry Figure Size
« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2018, 07:48:36 PM »
Are the Victrix Gaul cavalry significantly larger than Victrix Gaul infantry?