Gaming with unpainted models?

[FierceKitty]

An abomination.

[GDonk]

Really people?? who gives a damn what others do with their miniatures as long as they're enjoying themselves.  Stop wasting your time typing diatribes against others' choices and get on with your painting.

[armchairgeneral]

The aesthetics of the hobby are my main motivation so I personally wouldn't game with unpainted figures. That said some people are so enthusiastic to game they can't wait to get their figures painted. An attitude I also admire.

As a teenager having large 28mm Napoleonic games with my elder brother, he could paint so much faster than me so I was often forced to field my army with some units with jackets, trousers, shakos and flesh only having a hasty coat of paint. Something I hated but back then it was all about getting as many figures on the table as possible.

[warlord frod]

I never play a miniature game with unpainted minis and have often painted several armies so that when I invite others to play they can use my stuff. I think such games should look as nice as possible in fact that is one of the things I like most about miniature gaming.

Now board games with minis is different. While I hope to paint the minis eventually and have painted some I will play the board game with "naked" minis.

I understand those who don't paint but feel they are missing one of the most enjoyable sides of the hobby ie playing a game that looks as great as it plays.

[Norm]

I’m in the ‘it’s good to see people gaming’ camp.

I like to paint my stuff, but I am slow, so for new periods, I am happy to base up unpainted stuff with temporary glue, while I explore the best basing system, the best organisation, shopping lists and choosing rules. I might discover that I want to abandon the project and I would rather do that before painting hoards, so that my brush hours only go on deserving cases. I will then work on converting those bases over to painted ones.

It seems like the whole thing is a personal one, which is fine for solo playing, but may need the tolerance and understanding of others outside of that. 

[FramFramson]

In a nod to Frod, I do generally have painted models ready for many factions too, so as to be able to provide everything necessary for a game myself. After all, if you want a table full of nicely painted minis, what better way to ensure that everything is up to your standard by doing it all yourself (note that this is rather easier for skirmish players like myself)?

Plus if you have friends who've never heard of the game you're playing, or who don't have the wherewithal, space, time, or ability to assemble their own armies, you've got them covered. This is not only being a good friend, but also helps ensure you can play with more of your friends than you otherwise might!

In any case, I can allow that there's a breadth of acceptable opinions on this. But I will say that "someone who doesn't paint my minis would no longer be a friend of mine" absolutely baffles me as a sentiment.

[Coenus Scaldingus]

Objectively, this hobby of ours is a bit of a strange one. To paint miniatures and play games with them is the norm, but none would dispute that merely collecting and painting them is also an equally valid form of enjoying things. So why would only playing and not painting them be any different? Should anyone with an interest in the social and tactical aspects of the games naturally have an interest in the creative side of things too?

There is quite a difference between using tokens and unpainted models, as indeed there is between unpainted models and painted ones. In both cases, there are differences in immersion as well as in functionality. A square piece of cardboard reading "goblin" and another piece reading "giant" are not broadcasting the difference as clearly as a 2cm miniature of a goblin and a 20cm miniature of a giant would. People are not typically in a habit of painting there chess sets, and for some players this is just another game using differently formed playpieces denoting different troops (which it is). One of the reasons for X-Wing's popularity was the ability to play the kind of game normally reserved for those willing to build and paint their aeroplanes, without having to do that. You are free to repaint and perhaps modify the ships, but it was not compulsory.

I have played with unpainted miniatures. I have probably spent more time painting models in the dark hours the night before some game, to get them done in time, than I have spent time playing with unpainted figures however. Nonetheless, I'd rather have a good time playing some games with friends, than not to play at all. I have never played a game with unpainted miniatures that I would have preferred not to play - but each time, the experience would have been even better had everything been fully painted and based. If I attend a tournament, club night or other event where I might play against relative strangers, I would consider it discourteous to bring unpainted soldiers - for if they, like people in this thread, highly value fully painted armies, their experience would be diminished. Similarly, I would expect my opponents to do the same. Indeed, as said, the game is bound to be better with two resplendent forces. But if playing a game at my own or a friend's home, and we just want to try a new game/army/unit.. I'd rather play the game regardless, than not play it at all.

[Blackwolf]

This thread is going to Erehwon.

[carlos marighela]

As such topics inevitably do.

[Blackwolf]

As such topics inevitably do.

Indeed 

[Dave Knight]

I think most of those dripping scorn on using unpainted minaitures are not wargamers at all they are painters and collectors who might deign to put their beautiful creations on the table once in a while.

They often load the table with figures spend ages admiring them (and expecting others to faint in pleasure at the sight of them) and get 2 moves in before it is time to finish.

I on the other hand am a wargamer.  I prefer painted figures but painting is a chore.  I have never inkwashed or highlighted or whatever in 45 years gaming.  I proxy like mad.

I don't know why some posters seem to think I am some sort of unclean abnormal being for this.

[Jemima Fawr]

I think most of those dripping scorn on using unpainted minaitures are not wargamers at all they are painters and collectors who might deign to put their beautiful creations on the table once in a while.

They often load the table with figures spend ages admiring them (and expecting others to faint in pleasure at the sight of them) and get 2 moves in before it is time to finish.

I on the other hand am a wargamer.  I prefer painted figures but painting is a chore.  I have never inkwashed or highlighted or whatever in 45 years gaming.  I proxy like mad.

I don't know why some posters seem to think I am some sort of unclean abnormal being for this.

Quite right!  I too have incredibly low standards and therefore everyone else must have equally low standards or they're not a real wargamer!  Fight the power, brother!

[jon_1066]

It is an interesting conversation.  There is obviously a large element of visual spectacle in the mini gaming world.  It is interesting though that some consider board games "better games" to the extent that the only appeal of mini games is the visual.

It is also interesting that painted figures are a must for some yet other weird visual elements don't bother them.  eg a Napeoleonic infantry battalion of 1000 men is represented by 32 figures and the scale difference between ground scale and figure scale make the entire battle tableau totally unbelievable.  I see many tables with beautifully painted figures and scenery but the scale difference is so jarring to me.  Plus the formations - every unit is a roughly square block, even in line the unit has nowhere near the correct depth and width ratio.  Not only does this impact the visual look but it also makes an attempt at history more difficult as the units interact in ways not possible for the units they represent.

In all this though I always think of the Batley Townswomens' Guild recreating the battle of  Pearl Harbor.

[FierceKitty]

I think the cruiser Wyoming is overacting.

[Duncan McDane]

(sort of ) On topic, nowadays many models come in parts on sprues. And, when talking about GW, are not cheap. And consist - in some cases - of 6, 8 and sometimes even more parts on a 32mm fig. That's a lot in my book. Those parts need carefully removing from the sprue, removing of mouldlines, afterwards soapwashed to remove the mould grease/release, glued together, filled out the gaps and only after that they are ready to prime. That's time consuming and I refuse to spend 25 euro's on a single model just to clip, glue, spray and paint it up in a very basic sort of way. Waste of my money and waste of my model imho. And I'm only tabletop with a very very small + level painter but my models deserve all the attention I can give them.
But, compared to the olden days when we bought single part unit troops ( and most characters were that aswell, monsters consisted of about 4 parts ) it's really, really time consuming and I still don't like the gluing part, sticking together models isn't the fun part of the hobby over here ( but I know for many people it is and they are getting amazingly good results out of it ).
Anyway, my last post in this topic is this: If the "I paint everything in 3 base colours and then climb on my soapbox shouting around how bad it is to play with unpainted models" -people are complaining about my unpainted mini's then they can stick it because that's not painting in my book, that's colouring any 6 year old could do and I'd tell them rightly so.