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Author Topic: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread  (Read 3758 times)

Offline seldon

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2020, 08:27:29 PM »
I have bought it and it seems to be a good simple system to play large battles.

I like complex games for large battles such as Fields of Glory and War & Conquest, but sometimes you don't have the time.. sometimes you want a system that allows you to play Cannae quickly in a short afternoon... Men of Bronze fills that space and it well explained despite the restrictions in size of the blue books...

And hey.. they are very accessible so I think for anyone that likes ancients it is a great addition...

Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2020, 06:06:34 PM »
I have a verrry minor interest in the Punic Wars so I am a little excited about following this. I feel I should buy Men of Bronze just to support you Easy E as it seems like we have been "internet acquaintances" for many years. :D

If you did pick up a copy, I would appreciate it.  You can find it for very reasonable prices at your favorite online retailer.  :)

I can not believe how long I have been active on Wargame Boards.  Portent (RIP) from so long ago.  I was looking at a few threads on Warseer and saw they were over a decade old in some cases.  Unreal that I have been doing this since 1985.... that's like..... 35 years now?  Ouch.  I am old!   
Support Blood and Spectacles Publishing:
https://www.patreon.com/Bloodandspectaclespublishing

Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2020, 08:39:25 PM »
A Draft of the rules went to Osprey to begin the process of editing.  Only 10-15 more drafts to go until it is done!   lol lol lol

Offline Codsticker

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2020, 04:45:45 AM »
A Draft of the rules went to Osprey to begin the process of editing.  Only 10-15 more drafts to go until it is done!   lol lol lol
Try not to go crazy. o_o

Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2020, 01:28:31 PM »
Anabasis of the Seleucids

The Seleucid Empire was founded by the successor’s of Alexander the Great.  These successors fought a series of wars with each other for control of his empire.  Eventually, the Successors and their children were able to establish their own stable empires.  All though smaller than that of Alexander, they were regional power players.

The Seleucid Empire covered much of the Middle East and Eastern parts of the known Ancient world.  They were a major player in the Hellenization of the Near East.  Their main power base was in Syria but their empire extended into the East and even came up against the Mauryan Empire of India.

When Antiochus the III came to power, he went eastward and restored various vassal states back under Seleucid control.  This included Parthia and Greco-Bactria.  During this process, Antiochus defeated the leader of a Greco-Bactrian king named Euthydemus at the battle of Arius.  Interestingly, this man was also Greek and previously aligned with the Seleucids.

After the Battle of Arius, the Bactrians retreated back to their capital.  Antiochus III put the city under siege for three years before they came to a negotiated truce.
 

Today’s battle will be using the Wars of the Republic rules, but again I am using the lists creatively to simulate other ancient combat to test what they can do.  Today will be the Seleucid successor list vs. the Lesser Satrapy list to represent the Bactrians.  We will be using a Scout the Area scenario to represent the advanced forces of both armies scouting out the geography.

Forces

Seleucids
1 Heavy Cavalry
1 Bronze Shields- General
1 White Shields
1 Agema

Greco-Bactrians
1 Heavy Cavalry Cataphracts- General
1 Bronze Shields
2 Light Infantry
1 Archers

Seleucids will have 5 Commander’s Gaze, while the Bactrians will have 6

Mission
The Secure the Area scenario has 6 tokens scattered across the board, and is set-up by the defenders after terrain is set-up.  As a unit puts a token into their Zone of Control, they have scouted the terrain there and can put the token on their side of the board.  The side that uncovers the most tokens wins OR if they can force the enemy to collapse in 8 turns.

Set-up
Today’s game is using 1 inch as an MU, and is being played on a 72 by 48 MU board. 

For terrain, we used the terrain placement rules straight from the rule book.  The Seleucids got to place terrain first.  In the center terrain on their side of the board a small wall was placed towards the left corner.  The Satrapy matched it on the opposite side with a grove of trees in the forward right corner.  This left the center a bit congested.  On the left corner in the Satrapy's side of the board the Seleucids placed a 1 level rocky hill in the center of it.  On the Satrapy's left flank grid space they placed another rocky, one level hill towards the front of it, again blocking up the center of the board.  The Seleucids placed a wall on their right flank grid space to act as a defensive location for the flank.  Finally, on the Seleucid left flank the Satrapy placed a small rock hill in the center of the grid space. 

The Exploration tokens were then placed in on these terrain pieces.  The battlefield was somewhat congested in the center of the board, and that would make capturing objectives there a bloody pushing match.  The Seleucid Phalanxes liked there chances there.




For Deployment, the Seleucids were the attackers and began to deploy first.  This was an alternate deployment process so the Defenders could react to where the Attackers were located.  Interestingly, the Seleucids decided to put their Phalanxes in the center, across from the enemy light infantry.  The Greco-Bactrian Phalanx and Archers were on the right, and facing the Agema.  The Cavalry forces were facing each other on the left flank.  Some interesting match-ups. 

Most of these two armies have miniatures EXCEPT the cataphracts are paper templates!  Boo!  Hiss!



Let's see how things turned out....

https://bloodandspectacles.blogspot.com/2020/05/battle-report-wars-of-republic-anabasis.html

Offline Jjonas

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  • Posts: 421
  • Ancient Modeler
    • Ancient Hellenistic Battles mostly
Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2020, 05:22:47 AM »
I have a very stupid question, that I can hope someone can point me towards the answer. 

I am not 100% sure if the Pontic army used elephants in their line of battle.  Could someone point me to a primary or secondary source to help me understand this issue?

Thanks in advance.....

Nope. No elephants in Pontic armies. Pontus used scythed chariots as their wonder weapons. The Parthian empire sufficiently cut off access to Asian elephants to the west.
 Romans used elephants by way of Numidia in the Macedonian and Syrian and Celt Iberian wars, but did not use them against Mithridates VI.

Scullard is still the place to go for elephants:

https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Greek-Roman-World-Aspects/dp/0801409314

Easily found in university libraries.

Kistler has lots of useful information mixed with some less than accurate stuff:

https://www.amazon.com/War-Elephants-John-M-Kistler/dp/0803260040#customerReviews


The Osprey has nice Peter Dennis images:

https://www.amazon.com/War-Elephants-John-M-Kistler/dp/0803260040#customerReviews

(Sadly some of it seems awfully close to Kistler's text).

I cannot think of a rules set that has Pontics with elephants.
JJonas

Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2020, 03:04:30 PM »
Nope. No elephants in Pontic armies. Pontus used scythed chariots as their wonder weapons. The Parthian empire sufficiently cut off access to Asian elephants to the west.
 Romans used elephants by way of Numidia in the Macedonian and Syrian and Celt Iberian wars, but did not use them against Mithridates VI.

Scullard is still the place to go for elephants:

https://www.amazon.com/Elephant-Greek-Roman-World-Aspects/dp/0801409314

Easily found in university libraries.

Kistler has lots of useful information mixed with some less than accurate stuff:

https://www.amazon.com/War-Elephants-John-M-Kistler/dp/0803260040#customerReviews


The Osprey has nice Peter Dennis images:

https://www.amazon.com/War-Elephants-John-M-Kistler/dp/0803260040#customerReviews

(Sadly some of it seems awfully close to Kistler's text).

I cannot think of a rules set that has Pontics with elephants.

Great information!  Thank you. 

That is one of the best and worst things about trying to design rules for ancients..... someone always knows way more than you on the subject!  Best because you can get great information and assistance, worst because it is very easy to make yourself look like a fool! 

Offline Jjonas

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #22 on: May 27, 2020, 06:31:51 PM »
The best place to start is by joining the Society of Ancients where you can buy a CD of forty years of articles on pertinent subject matter.

Over the eons ancient army lists builders start here, because these are vetted by much rich crowd sourced and academic research, and then they branch out:

https://www.amazon.com/D-B-M-LISTS-DEBELLIS-MULTITUDINIS-WARGAMES/dp/B003UHATSS

Or via Scribd:
https://www.scribd.com/document/37195050/WRG-DBM-de-Bellis-Multitudinis-Army-Book-2-500BC-to-476AD-2nd-Edition





Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2020, 08:47:32 PM »

Offline Easy E

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Re: Wars of the Republic- Playtest Thread
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2020, 01:24:49 PM »
Battle of Scarpheia

Shortly after the Fourth Macedonian War, the Greek Acheaen League rose up against Rome.  This war was one of defiance after Rome's high-handed treatment of the League during the 3rd adn 4th Macedonina War.

The Roman's took hundred of hostages from the League and refused to return them or even entreat the ambassadors sent to secure their release.  In addition, populist generals were elected to the Achaean League leadership on a platform of reforms and taxation that would be counter to Roman interests.  Finally, Rome's efforts to reduce the size of the League by severing several cities and limiting the size of the League.  These three issues were politically unbearable to the Acheaen League and war was decided upon. 

It is unlikely that the Greeks had any hope of beating the Romans.  After all, the Romans had just defeated the much larger Macedonians and the Seleucid Empire.  However, it was a war of defiance.  It is best known for two key battles, the Battle of Scarpheia and the Battle of Corinth.  There may have also been several smaller skirmishes that were unrecorded.

The outcome was the total defeat of the Acheaen League.  As punishment, Rome complete destroyed Corinth, killed all the men, and sold the women and children into slavery.  All of the cities wealth was looted and sent back to Rome.  The Greeks were no longer a force in the Eastern Mediterranean after this cataclysmic defeat.


We know nothing about the Battle of Scarpheia except that it happened in 146 BCE between the Romans and the League.  Rome won the battle and it is believed the Greeks took heavy losses, but there are very few sources on this particular battle.  That is what makes it so interesting to us as wargamers!  It gives us free reign to play as we wish!

Forces

Roman Triplex Acies- Praetor Matellus
1 Skirmisher
1 Triarri
1 Principes- Praetor
2 Hastati

Rival City-States- Critolaus of Megalopolis
2 Drilled Hoplites- 1 with General
1 Militia Hoplites
1 Light Infantry- Peltasts
1 Archers
1 Skirmisher- Psiloi

The Acheaen League will be represented by my Men of Bronze Corinthian army. 



Sadly, for this playtest, the Romans will be my famous Paper Templates.

Set-up
This was completed using the rules laid out by the rules in the booklet.  The board is 72 x 48 MU with an MU being 1 inch.  The board was divided into 6 grid spaces and terrain rolled and placed using the chart.  The Players took turns rolling and placing terrain, with the player being able to place the terrain anywhere they wished in the grid square.

This system led to the following set-up.

Grid 1 is the Roman right, 2 Roman center, and 3 is Roman left.  Grid 4 is Greek left, 5 is Greek center, and 6 is Greek right.

Grid 1- No terrain
Grid 2- 2-level hill
Grid 3- Grove of trees
Grid 4- Stone walls
Grid 5- Stone walls
Grid 6- Swamp or spring

The Greeks place the supplies 12 inches in from their board edge and across the frontage of the army.  1 by the swamp, two in the open field, 1 inside the stone walls, and 1 in the ruins.

The Romans deploy from left to right as Principes, Hastati, the skirmishers on the hill, Triarri on the opposite side of the hill, and then the Hastati again.  The Greeks facing them from right to left are, Drilled Hoplites, Drilled Hoplites, Militia Hoplites, Archers, Light infantry (Peltasts), and Skirmishers (Psiloi)