Savolax regimented in Riga on 8/1700

[Jamo.fi]

My intention is to make the Savolax regiment in Riga in August 1700. I do not do it for gaming purposes, but to make the whole regiment. Since there were about 1020 men in the 1700 regiment in August, I would also make about 1020 figures. At first I thought to make a Major company with approx. 120 men. Another option is to make the regiment in April 1704. At that time there were about 350 men in the regiment.

Here is a link that summarizes the Major's company. I hope there is someone here who understands Swedish and could translate the text.
https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0054463_00272#?c=&m=&s=&cv=271&xywh=-2142%2C-288%2C10712%2C5706

6mm would of course be the cheapest size that would make a regiment. 15mm might be the best option. 28mm becomes expensive if you make about 1020 figures. What do you think about it? At the same time, which manufacturer's figures should be used for the project. The company's problem figure might be the musician. The company had 2 drummers and a musician. There are again 3 priests and a doctor and assistants in the regiment.

Jamo.fi

[traveller]

That sounds like a daunting task!

But to imagine to paint 1000 more or less identical uniforms sounds a bit tedious. I think the April 1704 version will still give you a massive force. You could then hopefully afford to use Ebor 28mm miniatures and that would give you an impressive unit which also would have a great second hand value. I look forward to see your progress with this! 

[carlos marighela]

Leaving aside the cost and tedium of painting it,  a 1020 28mm regiment would require a massive amount of shelf space. Being generous and assuming you could fit figures on to bases with a 1cm gap between them, a 1020 man regiment in four ranks(?) would take up over 2.55 metres in frontage or about 8 feet in the old money. Realistically I doubt you would squeeze most 28mm figures in with less than a 15mm gap, so broaden that out to twelve feet. If that’s two battalions of 600 each add a bit for gaps between battalions. Best invest in heavy duty shelving first.

[Jamo.fi]

You're right about that number of figureirs. I think I'm leaving the mitt. I think I will start with August 1702 (not 4/1704). At that time, the company had 42 troops. At the same time there are documents that I can use to help. Nor will the Battalion become the strength of about 200 soldiers. The service in Riga was very bad for the crew.

I'm considering a witch Ebor 28mm.

Jamo.fi

[Jamo.fi]

The pictures have alternatives on how I thought about implementing the company. Ebor doesn't have standing figures. Warware has standing figures. Similarly, Warwar officers are more useful to me.

 The next survey is how many musketeers I put on my company. Because the company was understaffed at the time. The company had 6 Corporals. Probably 4 Muskets and 2 Pikes. Were the 1st, 2nd, 5th and 6th corps a group of muskets? Also, in which company corporal group were the grenadies?

Jamo.fi

[traveller]

So, you will not do a 1020 men regiment but a 42 man company?

Anyway, here you have an extensive thread about formations if you can read Swedish:

http://forum.skalman.nu/viewtopic.php?t=30762&start=15

[FifteensAway]

Do the full regiment of 1,040!  But at 1:5 ratio.  Then you only need 208 figures.  And then you can do a couple more regiments if you like and actually have a battle or two if the mood strikes (both sides of course).  And figure size?  How can you beat 15 mm for such a large scale project?  Of course, consider the source of the advice.   

[LazyStudent]

Sounds like a great undertaking!! I wish you the best of luck and am interested in following your progress

I would suggest though that maybe 6mm has the most merits for this kind of project. Perhaps this thread will give some inspiration: http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=119258.0

[Jamo.fi]

Traveller, Thanks for the link. Helps me understand battalion and company. Based on the discussion, 1st and 2nd Corporal Group were Pikes. But for grenaries, I can't get a company. At full strength, the company had 129 men. 1st Corporal 21 men. 2nd Corporal 22 men. 3rd Corporal 21 men. 4th Corporal 24 men. 5th Corporal 21 men and 6th Corporal 21 men. If the normal Corporal group had 21 men, then there would be only three grenaries? We need to investigate that further.

First I make this company, then I wonder how I will continue. However, the goal is to make a regiment of some size.

FifteensAway, the point is really to make a 1/1 regiment. For game use I already have Dixons 15mm Swedish and Russian figures. The game is GÅBÅ.

The size of the figures is not yet certain. Can also be a tin soldier.
https://shop.princeaugust.ie/40mm-karoliner-moulds/

I'm not really putting a platform on the figures.

Jamo.fi

[traveller]

I think it will be very hard to understand the number of grenadiers on corporalship level. That would vary between companies. What we know was that according to the 1701 regulations there were 12 grenadiers per company whereof 2 were corporals.

[FifteensAway]

Point taken.  And don't forget 10 mm is a realistic option and a pretty good compromise between 6 mm and 15 mm figures.  Large enough for more detail, small enough for less detail - and still look good.  And it takes a LOT less space than 28 mm or larger.  40 mm?  Wow, that would be an impressive undertaking but if brought to full fruition of 1,040 figures a most astonishing accomplishment.  Rather expensive at 40 mm, though, relatively speaking - but not out of reach for some.

As to painting that many figures in the same, essentially, uniform, well, that would be more than I can imagine completing but assembly line painting can get it done.  I have two regiments of US Plains War cavalry to paint with each over 150 mounted figures plus dismounted figures to match and copious numbers of casualties in dead men and dead horses which will be quite a task.  One of those regiments is primed and ready for paint.  Even unpainted it is quite a sight to see in person, based and in column.  1,040 figures will be exponentially more impressive.

Keep us posted and let us know what the final decision is.

Caveat - only one of my 2 regiments are full regiments, one is the 7th cavalry with all 12 companies, the other is battalions of other regiments to make up to equal size to a full regiment, 12 companies (later referred to as troops).  And those regiments have 12 figures per company plus regimental command.  So, not a full regiment in the same sense as Jamo's project under discussion.

[abu iskander]

Jamo - Maybe this is helpful?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caroleans

I've been doing something similar in 6mm. Here's what one of my companies looks like, so 8 stands like this to do 2x battalions. Total frontage of 480mm for the formation.

[/img]

[Jamo.fi]

Now I'm a little studied grenaries. At many places it has been said that they were the greatest and strongest men. Also mentioned that every 10 musketeer soldiers would be grenatories. From the available archive data, I have not found a mention of who the grenatories were. So information over 300 years old is hard to find. Each man in the regiment had a number. I think I make the last 3 numbers of each musket corps group from the grenatories. I'm using August 1700 data, then the company was missing a 3 man number.

Abu Iskander, Will your 6mm figures stand upright without support? Because my purpose is to make figures without a platform. The company I'm starting from is really badly underutilized. Maybe I'll supplement it sometime. It may also be that somewhere in between when I find more information, I make a regiment of the Narva Battle.

Jamo.fi

[Jamo.fi]

Now the regiment's organization would be ready. No guarantee that right. Situation of the regiment April 1702 in Riga.

LIFE Company
Capitan sergeant major? (Kapitan wälb.)
Capitanlieutenant (Kapitan l�at)
Second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
Furir
Rustmästare
Drummer (trumslagare)
2 Corporal and  14 Pikes
1 Corporal and 22 Musketer
1 Grenaries
Total 49

LIEUTENANT COLONEL`S COMPANY
Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
2. second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
2 Drummer (trumslagare)
flutist (Pipare)
1 Corporal and 11 Pikes
3 Corporal and 29 Musketer
1 Grenatories
Total 58

Major`s  Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
Drummer (trumslagare)
1 Corporal and 14 Pikes
3 Corporal and 17 Musketer
6  Grenatories
Total 51

KUOPIO Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
Drummer (trumslagare)
flutist (Pipare)
1 Corporal and 9 Pikes
2 Corporal and 23 Musketer
2  Grenatories
Total 48

Pumala Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
 rustmästare
Drummer (trumslagare
1 Corporal and 12 Pikes
2 Corporal and 25 Musketer
1 Grenatories
Total 51

JUVAN Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
Drummer (trumslagare)
flutist (Pipare)
1 Corporal and 16 Pikes
1 Corporal and 12 Musket
3  Grenatories
Total 48

PIEKSÄMÄEN Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
 2 Drummer (trumslagare
1 Corporal and 12 Pikes
1 Corporal and 20 Musketer
Total 43

IISALMEN  Company

Captain (Kapitan)
Lieutenant (l�ant)
second lieutenant (fänrik)
Sergent major  (fältväbel)
sergeant
scorer (m�erskrivare)
f�e
Furir
rustmästare
 2 Drummer (trumslagare)
flutist (Pipare)
1 Corporal and 14 Pikes
2 Corpra and 24 Musket
1  Grenatories
Total 54
Summary of the regiment.

1 Capitan sergeant major? (Kapitan wälb.)
1 Capitanlieutenant (Kapitan l�at)
6 Captain (Kapitan
7 Lieutenant (l�ant)
8 second lieutenant (fänrik)
8 Sergent major  (fältväbel)
8 sergeant
8 scorer (m�erskrivare)
7 f�e
8 Furir
8 rustmästare
11Drummer (trumslagare)
4 flutist (Pipare)
9 Corporal and 104 Pikes
18 Corporal and 172 Musket
15  Grenatories
Total 403

The Life Battalion with the life Company, Major Company, Puumala Company and Pieksämäki Company.

1 Capitan sergeant major? (Kapitan wälb.)
1 Capitanlieutenant (Kapitan l�at)
2 Captain (Kapitan
3 Lieutenant (l�ant)
4 second lieutenant (fänrik)
4 Sergent major  (fältväbel)
4 sergeant
4 scorer (m�erskrivare)
3 f�e
4 Furir
3 rustmästare
5 Drummer (trumslagare)
5 Corporal and 52 Pikes
10 Corporal and 84 Musket
8  Grenatories
Total 197

[Jamo.fi]

The regiment headquarters are still missing. Some points are still unclear. At least the Colonel and the Major will join the battalion.

Jamo.fi