Rules for Napoleonic Naval Games?

[Hu Rhu]

I was very interested in the new naval models from Warlord (Black Seas) but having played their Cruel Seas game was left very underwhelmed by the experience.

Does anyone have any suggestions for a better set of rules to cover both small squadron actions and bigger fleet actions?

[has.been]

I like the Osprey attempt, 'Fighting Sails'?

[Shahbahraz]

For small actions, I like the Langton 'Fast Play' but you will need to do some accounting. I haven't yet found a fleet set I consider useable and sufficiently 'real'.

[Shahbahraz]

In actual fact, I have been very tempted to write my own..  I mean, I've read all the O'Brien, Marryat and Forrester novels    How hard could it be.

In all seriousness, you could actually do a lot worse than convert the Full Thrust or Imperial Skies rules. Full Thrust vector movement would be an interesting way to model sailing.   

[Timmo]

I still really enjoy Avalon Hills Wooden Ships & Iron Men. It can be played with miniatures.

Kiss Me Hardy by TooFatLardies is also good – more suited to fleet actions than small engagements.

[SteveBurt]

The Black Seas rules are not bad - they certainly give a fun game.
Fighting Sail is fine for fleet action (no off table book-keeping)
Kiss Me Hardy is good, but for one on one ship actions Post Captain is great

[DeRuyter]

The Black Seas rules are not bad - they certainly give a fun game.
Fighting Sail is fine for fleet action (no off table book-keeping)
Kiss Me Hardy is good, but for one on one ship actions Post Captain is great

I'll go with what Steve said here. Of course it depends on what you want, fleet battles with ships of the line, small ships, single frigate actions etc. I run Kiss Me Hardy games at shows and it is definitely good for squadron and above actions. There is a supplement called To Covet Glory which brings in smaller vessels like schooners and sloops. Good for coastal and lake actions. Both are available as PDFs for very little $. KMH is 5 GBP on the TFL webstore.   Fighting Sail is only good for large fleet actions where an abstract set is wanted. Black Sails really require all the advanced rules to be used, advanced wind in particular. But it is Warlord so designed to be fast and fun rather than a simulation. I'd try Post Captain but $40 for a pdf keeps me away, but as Steve said that is for 1v1 style engagements.

Another set good for fleet actions is Fire As She Bears. Also available as pdf. I also play Ares Games Sails of Glory which uses a card system for movement and came out with it's own prepainted ships in 1/1000 scale. One ship per player for those.

[Inkpaduta]

I use Wooden Ships and Iron Men from Avalon Hill.

[DivisMal]

For a beer and bretzel approach, I always liked Games Workshop‘s Trafalgar rules. They are fast, easy and you still get them after the 4th can...plus they provide cinematic moments. But that’s not what everybody likes.

[SteveBurt]

If you do get Fighting Sail, make sure you get the rules amendments by the author because they improve the game a lot. No more ships blowing up after one broadside, or sailing through the wind. Available on Boardgamegeek and possibly elsewhere too.

[Belisarius]

I’ve used the Lardies KMH rules and got the cards printed by ArtsCow.com , they are a simple , fast play set .

[bluewillow]

For quick games I either use Trafalgar or Langton 'Fast Play'

Cheers
Matt

[TaltosVT]

I haven't played Black Seas yet, so I can't compare them, but I've been dabbling with War Artisan's free rules "Away Boarders!"

http://www.warartisan.com/rules

He wrote it with actions on the Great Lakes of America in mind, and has some nice papercraft model designs to go with the rules.  I'm working on the Valcour Island ships at the moment, hoping to play with a few others who live around the Lake Champlain area where the action originally took place.

[Admiral Hawke]

I, too, use Avalon Hill's Wooden Ships & Iron Men with some obvious tweaks to make it work for miniatures.

I like that the rules:
- Work well for squadrons of six to nine a side.
- Result in progressive degradation of ships as damage accumulates, rather than random sinkings or explosions.
- Can produce historically plausible outcomes.

There's not really any command and control element or signalling to the game to hamper an admiral's control.

I have not tried all the other suggestions here though.

[warrenpeace]

You could take a look at the cardboard wargame Flying Colors from GMT. There are reviews of the game on YouTube and on BoardGameGeek. Some people play the game with miniatures.