*
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
March 29, 2024, 03:02:51 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Donate

We Appreciate Your Support

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 1686663
  • Total Topics: 118120
  • Online Today: 815
  • Online Ever: 2235
  • (October 29, 2023, 12:32:45 AM)
Users Online

Recent

Author Topic: Warlord becoming the next GW?  (Read 18797 times)

Offline Codsticker

  • Supporting Adventurer
  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • *
  • Posts: 3276
    • Kodsticklerburg: A Mordheim project
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #90 on: February 14, 2020, 05:24:00 AM »
Yeah I don't see it that way either. The vast majority of those kids will drop GW before they become adults. Out of those few that stay in, some will eventually migrate to other games; of those a handful will become interested in historical games (probably WW2  ::)).

Offline Volleyfire!

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 451
  • At 100 yards................Volleyfire!!!
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #91 on: February 14, 2020, 09:40:53 AM »
Yeah I don't see it that way either. The vast majority of those kids will drop GW before they become adults. Out of those few that stay in, some will eventually migrate to other games; of those a handful will become interested in historical games (probably WW2  ::)).

That's the problem in a nutshell. A handful will become interested in historical wargaming, and add that to the relatively small handful when compared to other hobbies who will take up the hobby without gravitating across from GW fantasy, and you have a future problem regarding financial profitability for the majority of wargames suppliers somewhere down the road in about 10/15 years time. There will be the ones who come back later in life after marriage, kids etc but the influx isn't there to sustain the kind of turnover some businesses, such as WG, require to keep the wheels turning forever without them turning into a kind of Death Star and absorbing other firms. It has happened in my industry sector over the past 20 years where we now have one major firm controlling virtually the entire UK market along with a handful of other firms of slightly smaller proportion who mostly supply themselves, and then some very minor (by comparison of size) firms picking up the specialist trade. As long as we have producers who are happy to run their business as a part time enterprise then we will continue to see roughly the number of traders we see today, but there will be companies disappearing as they sell up and get out over the next few years due to competition and too much choice in the marketplace in certain areas.

Offline Elbows

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 9452
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #92 on: February 14, 2020, 05:12:25 PM »
That has been the nature of tabletop wargaming as long as I've been doing it though - that isn't something new.

Look at any wargaming convention that isn't based around a GW style event, and you'll see (at least in the US) it's 80% people above the age of 35-40.  The few younger people who are there tend to be friends or children of the older gamers, etc.

The transition from "kinda sorta" wargaming, aka playing 40K when you're a teenager rarely does convert into a lifelong hobby.  That's not something new though.  Even before the internet, video games, etc., it's simply not a mega-popular hobby.  It's always been propped up by most manufacturers being rather small.

Now I agree with you, there isn't room for several companies of GW's size right now - I don't think the market would support that.  Smaller companies need to be extremely frugal and realistic with their expectations, and they need to be putting out a solid product now, as there is quite a bit of competition in a variety of genres.  I just don't think we're seeing a "new" decline in future customers, etc.
2024 Painted Miniatures: 166
('23: 159, '22: 214, '21: 148, '20: 207, '19: 123, '18: 98, '17: 226, '16: 233, '15: 32, '14: 116)

https://myminiaturemischief.blogspot.com
Find us at TurnStyle Games on Facebook!

Offline Kommando_J

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1217
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #93 on: February 14, 2020, 06:37:13 PM »
I can see why the OP asked the question but Warlords similarity to Games Workshop in that there was that enthusiasm for the hobby and also the engagement of the news letter and (originally the forum) was part of the initial attraction of the company to me in the early days.
Unfortunately I don't find the quality of their products matches the hype around them. They sell a lot of stuff but I find it to be of variable quality. Even with their plastic box sets for bolt action, I find that one does not necessarily have the quality of another. The blitzkrieg Germans and the Fallschirmjager plastics are quite good imho. The grenadiers box set, not so. I have also heard others say that they find US airborne plastics are fairly ropey too.
There seems to be a lot of inconsistencies in the size of their figures even across one range and even within their box sets. The plastic grenadiers are an interesting mix of sizes which wouldn't matter so much if they didn't all use a standard set of arms.
Let's not get onto discussing the casting issues with some of their metals...
To sum up Warlord okay - but could do better...

I miss the god old days when WG had lots of great hobby articles and such, lots of articles getting recycled now, also I see warlord are doing ANOTHER WW2 BOAT GAME...ffs lol.





Offline Volleyfire!

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 451
  • At 100 yards................Volleyfire!!!
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #94 on: February 14, 2020, 09:24:00 PM »
I just don't think we're seeing a "new" decline in future customers, etc.
I don't think there is a decline per se. I just don't see the current business and general hobby model as sustainable in their current form in say 10 years time.

Offline Elbows

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 9452
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #95 on: February 14, 2020, 10:12:16 PM »
Most companies can easily be sustained by the hobby market if they're handled properly and maintain a reasonable expectation.  The problem is that many companies do a Kickstarter, raise a million bucks...and suddenly think they've hit it big and they'll be the next GW.  So many of these companies over promise and underdeliver on KS because they try too hard to generate interest with freebies and stretch goals.  I seem to see a company (with a previously successful Kickstarter) close shop almost every month or two.

I don't think that reflects a market issue, but rather a failure to simply run a business properly.  Same reason so many hobby stores and game stores close between 6-18 months.  It's a business first and your hobby second...but way too many people get carried away with it all.

Offline Codsticker

  • Supporting Adventurer
  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • *
  • Posts: 3276
    • Kodsticklerburg: A Mordheim project
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #96 on: February 17, 2020, 04:57:04 PM »
That's the problem in a nutshell.
I guess I don't see it as a problem per se; just a consequence of a small, marginal business environment. With GW promoting itself there is a certain amount of trickle down effect to other sub-sectors of the war gaming hobby. I think it is unlikely that there would be more kids ending up pursuing historical games or future historical gamers, more custom for mom and pop businesses without GW doing what GW does.

 Often those ranges are offered to Warlord by the owners as they want to get put for various reasons. If  Warlord wanted to increase there chance of staying viable they wouldn't buy up other ranges they would just sit back and pump out more Bolt Action and Naps :D.  You will know the hobby is really in trouble when there isn't a company like Warlord around for them to sell their ranges to.

Offline mcfonz

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1602
    • Poison Spurs - blog and reviews
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #97 on: February 17, 2020, 07:30:17 PM »
That has been the nature of tabletop wargaming as long as I've been doing it though - that isn't something new.

Look at any wargaming convention that isn't based around a GW style event, and you'll see (at least in the US) it's 80% people above the age of 35-40.  The few younger people who are there tend to be friends or children of the older gamers, etc.

The transition from "kinda sorta" wargaming, aka playing 40K when you're a teenager rarely does convert into a lifelong hobby.  That's not something new though.  Even before the internet, video games, etc., it's simply not a mega-popular hobby.  It's always been propped up by most manufacturers being rather small.

Now I agree with you, there isn't room for several companies of GW's size right now - I don't think the market would support that.  Smaller companies need to be extremely frugal and realistic with their expectations, and they need to be putting out a solid product now, as there is quite a bit of competition in a variety of genres.  I just don't think we're seeing a "new" decline in future customers, etc.

I don't see this to be honest.

I just see the same conversation every so many years. I think it's a bit like music though. Folks will bemoan the lack of decent music out there. But what they call music and what the modern tastes are, can be very different.

If we drop 'wargames' and instead use 'tabletop gaming' I think you'll see the market, support and interest is as high as it ever has been if not stronger.

Wargaming used to be the shunned, un-cool corner of that umbrella. Probably sharing space with RPG's. But over the last 20 years 'tabletop' has become more mainstream and the distinction between different parts of that term have become less clear.

We now get boardgames which are essentially lite RPG's. Tabletop games which are essentially wargames on boards.

My reflections on Salute over the last few years is that we are seeing a much more diverse crowd. More younger folk, more women, more families. That is how you maintain a hobby, you pass it on.

The gaps we sometimes see in ages are't that unusual. I ran a football (soccer to those not in the UK) team for a decade before hanging up both my boots and my joint manager/chairman responsibilities. I rarely got 16-23 year olds asking to join. Socio-economic mostly I think. Costs and being drawn to other things youngsters do at that point in their lives. Computer games, out with the lads, courting etc. Plus university and education. Some also played in youth teams which means to the adult game, they are invisible - like school wargames clubs I guess.

It's definitely a hobby that is far easier to get into now than it has been.
RP Tabletop Blog:


RP vlog channel: https://www.youtube.com/@RandomPlatypus

Offline Kommando_J

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1217
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #98 on: February 28, 2020, 04:47:20 PM »
As if the comparisons couldn't get more apt, saw this on warlords new releases alongside a suspiciously familiar ogre hunter and ogre chef.

Offline Cubs

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 4914
  • "I simply cannot survive without beauty ..."
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #99 on: February 28, 2020, 08:00:34 PM »
Oh dear.
'Sir John ejaculated explosively, sitting up in his chair.' ... 'The Black Gang'.

Paul Cubbin Miniature Painter

Offline Coenus Scaldingus

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 669
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #100 on: February 29, 2020, 07:02:18 AM »
I mean, those are just Warhammer Fantasy replicates as produced by about 50 companies out there, and these aren't even produced by Warlord Games themselves, just sold through them...
~Ad finem temporum~

Offline pixelgeek

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 2026
    • Zac's Gaming Blog
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #101 on: February 29, 2020, 03:10:55 PM »
I can't see the photo. Just shows up as an html attachment

Offline Belligerentparrot

  • Scientist
  • Posts: 480
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #102 on: February 29, 2020, 04:49:14 PM »
I can't see the photo.
Count yourself lucky!  :D

Offline pixelgeek

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 2026
    • Zac's Gaming Blog
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #103 on: February 29, 2020, 05:08:10 PM »
It appears that it was saved as a .webp file that doesn't work on Safari.

Offline Atheling

  • Elder God
  • Posts: 11906
    • Just Add Water Wargaming Blog
Re: Warlord becoming the next GW?
« Reply #104 on: February 29, 2020, 05:46:03 PM »