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Author Topic: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future  (Read 1247 times)

Online Munindk

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 559
  • Denmark
Re: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future
« Reply #30 on: June 03, 2020, 05:41:27 PM »
You could also force movement via fluff. Maybe whatever drove people into subs also caused serious currents, nasty ubderwater monsters, earthquakes.

Offline Michi

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 3570
  • Hoist the colours!
    • Tableterror
Re: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future
« Reply #31 on: June 03, 2020, 05:46:54 PM »
That is visionary work! The art in it is as phenomenal as the craftsmanship. I pull my hat to you!

Offline Commander Roj

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 660
Re: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future
« Reply #32 on: June 03, 2020, 07:21:14 PM »
I can make the startling revelation that I have been eyeing certain liquid soap dispenser tops as the source of a fleet of manta-like boats for years, but not got around to it. I will take some photos later of the types I mean, if I can find some. I also have some old sketches of this sort of thing, again, if I can find them...

I know I have some bigger sketches than the tiny sub picture on the left, under the one marked drone, but you can see why I am looking at this particular soap dispenser. Iíve seen some other similar pumps which might also work very nicely...

https://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157714567066602
« Last Edit: June 03, 2020, 08:25:38 PM by Commander Roj »

Offline Macrossmartin

  • Librarian
  • Posts: 127
  • Hobbies from Other Dimensions!
    • The Miniature Martin Site
Re: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future
« Reply #33 on: June 04, 2020, 01:03:08 PM »
Hello, again, Martin!

Some thoughts:

1.  I *love* your scratchbuilds.  Both the hobby behind them and the philosophy underpinning them speak loudly to me.  And, of course, it has the "Rick Priestley classic deodorant bottle hover tank" thing going on.

2.  The concept of a subfighter combat game - especially one inspired by Stingray but with a 21st century aesthetic - is brilliant and seems eminently marketable, to me (to some extent, *more* marketable than your Saucer Wars game).

3.  The size of the converted/scratchbuilt vessels presents a problem in both marketing and play in that they represent a significant need for storage space when not playing and play space when on the table.  Fighter games like Aeronautica, Blood Red Skies and X Wing have been successful - among other reasons - because they've found a scale level that allows the players to utilize a modest table size with tactical aplomb.  It's no coincidence that these all have ships of a similar size (if not scale).

4.  You admit that the rules you currently have need a lot of work, so I would suggest that you need to take it in one of two directions.  Either the source of scratchbuilt minis needs to get smaller (less shampoo bottles and more lip balm sticks) and the large scratchbuilt vessels play a reduced role (or step back to being purely aesthetic projects).  Or you need to change the dynamic of the game to make the use of the larger models more thematic - for example, having a game where each player would use only 1-3 models and the amount of actual manoeuvre/movement is relatively limited, whilst "action" occurs "off table" in crew/tech interactions (a little like Space Cadet, for example).

Thanks for the thoughts, Omega. I am glad you share my rationale for the recycling angle, as I think it has merit as both an inspiration to revive the art of scratchbuilding which seems on the wane with the floodtide of models, minis and 3D printing now available. (Or am I just fighting against the current?)

However, I'd question the 'marketability' of Glory Deep compared to Saucer War One; Flying saucers have been a universal pop culture icon and a staple of science fiction for 70 years. Future submarines? A couple of old TV shows, and a computer game or three.

The potential is certainly there, but I am realistic about Glory Deep's chances of setting the gaming world alight!  :P

I'll suggest that games like Star Wars Armada and Adeptus Titanicus counter your argument regarding model size. The hulking dimensions of their 'hero' models have done nothing to hurt their sales. Both get away with it by diversifying the sizes of different units, leaving the big guys to act as the relatively static 'gunline' while smaller units do the zipping around, darting forward, and getting splatted. Notice how X-Wing has huge units that are almost display models as much as gaming pieces.

It's a question of the reality upon which the game is modelled. If the intent is to portray squadrons of subfighters wheeling and diving in huge, watery dogfights like WW1 fighters, then a small scale is definitely required.

But if the subs come in many sizes, then the big guys become 'battleships' and the smaller ones 'destroyers' and we have WW2 naval action.

Or, if it's more like an infantry skirmish, with just a handful of similarly-sized units per side, then the subs should be relatively big, lest they become little more than 3D chits lost on a vast area of open table.

In truth, I envisioned Glory Deep somewhere between WW1 dogfights and Star Trek ship combat. Few units per side, comparable dimensions and abilities. This seemed realistic, given the tendency of rival weapon systems to copy multiple aspects of each other in the evolution of supremacy. I didn't imagine ORCA as having untold fleets of subs, and HORNET's response would be consummate to that threat.

But at this stage, I think it best to hold off on revision of the game until further research is completed into the practicality and popularity of encouraging the creation of fleets of subs from scrap. If that key concept flies, then the game will be worth pursuing to its conclusion. Glory Deep is nothing without a range of miniatures, or the parts to construct those miniatures. As time in this industry has taught me, real miniature game marketing is just miniatures marketing, with the game a secondary aspect. Notice how a lot of companies offer free rules, but not free miniatures...?  ;)


Operating from an abandoned US spy base somewhere in the Australian outback, Miniature Martin produces games and scale miniatures set in parallel worlds, past and future. He is NOT trying to take over the Earth. This time.

Offline Macrossmartin

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Re: GLORY DEEP - Subfighter Combat in the Near Future
« Reply #34 on: June 04, 2020, 01:04:46 PM »
I know I have some bigger sketches than the tiny sub picture on the left, under the one marked drone, but you can see why I am looking at this particular soap dispenser. Iíve seen some other similar pumps which might also work very nicely...

https://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157714567066602

Ahh, NOW I see what you're thinking! I'd never thought of that, Roj!

 

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