Russian platoon organization (Imperial Army, Red, White, whoever...)

[Wirelizard]

I'm planning on using TooFatLardie's "big skirmish" Great War rules "Through the Mud & the Blood" for the RCW, so I've been looking around for information on how the Russians typically organized infantry platoons and similar low-level organisation details - and I'm not finding one heck of alot out there!

The Osprey WW1 Russian book doesn't even go below company level, saying only that a company's nominal strength was 240 men & NCOs and 4 or 5 officers.

A thread over on another forum breaks this down to 220 privates, 20 NCOs and the aforementioned 4-5 officers and speculates that the Russians used 4 squads of 10-12 per platoon and four platoons per company, very similar to the British system.

This gives us nominal numbers of 12-14 men & NCOs per squad and ~55 per platoon, which is a big platoon!

Both the Red & White RCW Osprey MAA books are fairly light on organisational details below regimental or brigade level.

Mark's excellent Pygmy Wars has a TOE page which mentions "150 bayonets" as the nominal basis for an infantry company for some forces and confirms the general four-up organization, but he plays higher-level games than the "grand skirmish" of M&B, so has no breakdowns below company.

Now, granted it was a messy war and any numbers and even actual organisation would be highly theoretical, but what was the "standard" Russian sub-company structure like?

(I'm going to throw this out out to the TooFatLardies Yahoo mailing list as well, and will report anything interesting from there back here too, so as to keep good information from vanishing behind that damned Yahoo Groups members-only wall...)

[Golgotha]

I like the organisation suggested in Heroes of the Russian Civil War 3rd edition  - but do keep us posted on what you find.
Namely a squad of infantry is 9 men plus leader (officer or NCO) - 5 to 10 squads is a company so 50 to 100 men. For cavalry 4 men 1 leader and 5 to 10 squads a squadron so 25 to 50 men. For Machine guns use 3 to 5 for a MG platoon, armour 1 to 3 vehicles and artillery 1 to 3 pieces. While this is admittedly not ideal - organisation was a loose and flexible and dare I say it unorganised affair during the RCW. With there being a marked difference between official organisation and the reality on the ground.

[cuprum]

Description of the Infantry Regiment of the state from May 6, 1910 on the military structure:

 - The regimental commander (Col.)

 - Headquarters of the regiment
    - The chief economic of the Regiment (Lieutenant Colonel)
    - The regimental adjutant (Captain)
    - Ranks assigned to Regimental Headquarters:
       - Senior doctor
       - Junior doctor * 4 people.
       - Treasurer
       - Clerk of housekeeping
       - Quartermaster
       - Head of Arms
       - Medical Assistant
       - Padre
    - The lower ranks assigned to Regimental Headquarters:
       - The regimental drummer (Senior Sergeant)
       - The regimental bugler (Senior Sergeant)
       - Batman * 13 people.

- Infantry Battalion * 4
    - The battalion commander (Lieutenant Colonel)
    - Batman
   - Infantry Company * 4
       - The company commander (captain)
       - Junior officer Company * 3 (captain, lieutenant, junior lieutenant)
       - sergeant Major
       - Kaptenarmus (junior non-commissioned officer)
       - The regimental drummer (Corporal)
       - The volunteer
       - Platoon Sergeant * 4 (senior non-commissioned officer)
       - Petty Officer - Commander Branch * 16 (junior non-commissioned officer)
       - Corporal * 20 people.
       - Banded ordinary * 180 people.
       - Non-combatant soldier * 15 (4 batman 7 porters, 2 Cook, 2 working in the kitchen)

- Machine-gun team
 Head-machine-gun team (captain)
 - Junior officer command * 2 (a lieutenant, junior lieutenant)
 - Feldwebel
 - Kaptenarmus (ml.unter-off.)
 - Platoon Sergeant * 2 (senior non-commissioned officer)
 - Junior the machine-gun sergeant * 6 people.
 - Corporal-gunner * 8 people.
 - Private * 59 people.
 - Reserve Gunner * 8 people.
 - Porter bullets * 24 people.
 - Driving * 8 people.
 - Carriage driving * 16 people.
 - Cartman * 3 people.
 - Non-combatant soldier * 7 (3 batman, 2 Cook, 2 working in the kitchen)

- Team communication
 - Head of team communication
 - Senior non-commissioned officer - telephone operator * 2 people.
 - Junior non-commissioned officer - telephone operator * 2 people.
 - Private - telephonist * 17 people.
 - Junior non-commissioned officer (sowar)
 - Private sowar * 12 people.
 - Private cyclists * 4 people
 - Batman

- A team of musicians
 - Team chef (regimental adjutant-time)
 - Class rank - Kapellmeister
 - Senior non-commissioned officer
 - Junior non-commissioned officer * 10 people.
 - Private * 24 people.
 - Batman

- Non-combatant company
 - The company commander (captain)
 - Junior officer Company (Lieutenant)
 - Feldwebel
 - Kaptenarmus * 4 (senior non-commissioned officer)
 - Assistant kaptenarmus (junior non-commissioned officer)
 - Clerk * 10 people.
 - Medical Assistant * 23 people.
 - The warden of patients
 - medical servant * 6 people.
 - cleric
 - cutter
 - shoemaker
 - Artisan working * 26 people.
 - * 46 non-combatant people.:
 - Senior lithographer
 - Assistant lithographer
 - Cook * 4 people.
 - The waiter at the officers' mess * 10 people.
 - Working in the kitchen * 4 people.
 - Work with the officers' mess * 2 people.
 - The driver of cattle and butcher * 24 people.
 - We denote
 - Senior non-commissioned officer * 5 people.
 - Corporal
 - Carriage driving:
 - 8 to pair cartridge carts
 - 43 one-horse carts to (16 cartridge wagons, 4 carts apothecary, 2 telephone carts, 21 wagons household)
 - 26 to paired sample carts 1884
 - 8 to medical carts,
 - 18 to the marching field kitchens
 - 8 to spare the horses
 - Batman * 2 people

[cuprum]

Changes in state Infantry Regiment of the Russian Imperial Army (1917) Information from the book, OD Leonov, "Mobilizing the Russian army in August 1914 and the completion of the army during the war. Changes in the organization of the infantry."

Some changes have affected the organization and staffing of the infantry, except where the transfer of infantry and rifle regiments of the 3rd battalion, as noted earlier, the beginning of 1915 in the infantry and infantry divisions were abolished brigade control, and all the existing separate infantry brigades were reorganized in infantry division.

  By war's end, resulting in a significant increase in firepower of infantry (nearly 2-fold), increased its combat capabilities. Now it had its own artillery in the form of trench guns (mortars and mortar), and the number of machine guns has increased from 2 to 4 per battalion. In addition, in the companies began to appear machine-guns. In view of this it is no longer homogeneous. Only two thirds of personnel in combat infantry regiments operated rifle with a bayonet, and the third infantry consisted of a machine gun, grenade launcher, communications, etc.
To protect against chemical weapons, the infantry has masks.

The staffing of a 3-battalion infantry regiments consisted of 67 officers (commander, chief of the economic, the regimental adjutant, head of the training team, head of machine-gun team, team chief cavalry scouts, team chief communications; chief sapper team, team manager of trench guns, police chief of a team; 3rd Battalion commander, 12 company commanders, combatant commander, company officer and 41 junior), 10 officers (senior and 4 junior doctor, clerk in economic side, the head of arms, treasurer, quartermaster, Kapellmeister), 3399 front-line of lower ranks (including 16 sergeant-majors, 70 platoon commanders - senior non-commissioned officers, 18 kaptenarmusov, regimental bugler, 228 junior noncommissioned officers, 276 corporals and 12 volunteers) and 250 non-combatant lower ranks (clerks, medical assistants, supervisor of patients, hospital attendants, churchman, artisans and workers is denoted series) and regimental priest. At the same time in the companies and commands the regiment, in accordance with the staffing level should be:

in the company - 4-5 officers (commander, 3-4 junior officer), sergeant, five senior non-commissioned officers (4 platoon commander and kaptenarmus), 16 junior non-commissioned officers, 20 corporals, 180 privates and 16 non-combatant (porters, cooks , working in the kitchen orderlies), the lower ranks. Total 238 enlisted men;

 in a machine-gun team - four officers (the chief and three junior officer), sergeant, 7 senior non-commissioned officers (3 platoon commander, three machine-gun commander and kaptenarmus), 9 junior non-commissioned officers, 12 corporals, gunners, 108 rank and file enlisted men (12 second number to the machine-guns, 36 rounds of ammunition porters, 24 people with ammunition carts, 28 machine gun mounts to carts, carts and cartridge to spare the horses, 2 cook, 2 working in the kitchen and 4 batman. Total 137 enlisted men;

team mounted scouts - an officer (Team chef), Senior and junior non-commissioned officers, 6 corporals, 54 privates and orderly. A total of 63 of the lower ranks;

 communication in the team - Officer (Team chef), 61 telephone operator (senior and 2 junior non-commissioned officer, Corporal 4, 54 privates), 10 horse-orderlies (junior non-commissioned officer and nine privates), cyclists and orderly. Only 73 of the lower ranks;

 in sapper team - Officer (Team chef), Feldwebel, three senior non-commissioned officer (with kaptenarmus). 6 junior non-commissioned officers, 8 corporals, 76 privates combatant lower ranks, 2 Cook, 2 working in the kitchen and orderly. Only 99 enlisted men;

trench guns in the team - Officer (Team chef), 21 people in bombometnom department (senior noncommissioned officer, 4 junior non-commissioned officers and 16 privates enlisted men) and 12 people in mortar office (senior non-commissioned officer, two junior non-commissioned officer , 8 rank and file enlisted men and batman). A total of 33 team of the lower ranks;

 the regimental training team - Officer (Team chef), Feldwebel, 4 senior, 8 junior non-commissioned officers and orderly. The training team for training non-commissioned officers of each company was sent to 6 people, which is at the same time should have been trained not less than 96 ordinary enlisted men. Training period was 2-3 weeks;

Police in the team - Officer (Team chef), a senior and 2 junior non-commissioned officer, 3 corporal, 24 privates of the lower rank and orderly;

 in non-combatant company - an officer - and 263 lower rank;

 as a team to collect the trophy weapons - senior noncommissioned officer (senior team), 2 corporal and 22 privates of lower rank.

[Wirelizard]

And cuprum comes through with a huge amount of awesome detail!

Thank you, sir, that will all be very, very helpful.

[Mark Plant]

My TOEs are based on actual examples, because I don't think book values are at all useful at any level. So 150 men means that many actual "rifles".

RCW platoons were mostly just riflemen: from what I've read even LMGs (when available) were separated out. Few took the non-combatant roles of WWI, though obviously there would be a few orderlies and cooks.

Their platoons were large, due to a shortage of officers.

Imperial practice was quadrangular, and this was kept by Kolchak (in theory as Cuprum has posted, although they didn't have anywhere near the support weaponsof WWI).

Most modern armies had worked out that triangular was better, and the Reds and Denikin adopted that instead.

[Mark Plant]

This was posted by Tom Hillman years ago on the RCW Yahoo group:


Here is the "New Army" division that Denikin's boys dreamed up in Nov. 1918. It is cut and edited from a longer report. Denikin wanted them to key in on Maneuverability, Flexibility and Firepower. It was a modifications to a three-regt. division concept from late WWI. They never could totally fill its entire roster, but you can bet all the units were present (just understrength). This applies to the AFSR, I'm not sure about Yudenich and Kolchak's forces.

INFANTRY.

Company consists of 5 platoons - 4 combatant and 1 machine-gun. The structure in the company to be 7 officers and 255 soldiers; the combat composition is 160 bayonets, the remaining 95 men - machine-gunners and officials. With each company 2 machine-gun.

Battalion consists of 4 companies and a battalion machine-gun detachment (4 machine-guns). In all the battalion has 640 bayonets and 12 machine-gun (2x4=8, 8+4=12).

Regiment consists of 3 battalions and machine-gun detachment - 12 machine-guns, training detachments, bomb-throwing detachment - 2 bomb-throwers and 2 mortar; field engineer company - 3 platoons; connection and horse orderlies; foot reconnaissance; horse reconnaissance; commands commandant and musical. Also in regiment - non-combatant company, wagon train 1st and 2nd class. Total in regiment: 3 battalions - 12 companies, 1,920 bayonets and 48 machine-guns, 2 bomb-throwers and 2 mortars, with general regular number of regiment in 149 officers and officials, 4 274 soldier, 599 horses and 242 wagons. In regimental communications detachment - 35 telephonic sets, 60 versts wire. Also with regiment - 4 bicycles.

[H.M.Stanley]

Excellent work gentlemen. I'm looking to adapt this for WW1/Chain of Command

[Will Bailie]

Hi, Brian

One more resource you should check is Chris Stoesen's 'Empire to Revolution' supplement for Through the Mud and the Blood.  It covers most of the questions you present in your OP and also talks a bit about the specifics of using Russians in TtMatB.

Cheers

Will

[Wirelizard]

Hi, Brian

One more resource you should check is Chris Stoesen's 'Empire to Revolution' supplement for Through the Mud and the Blood.  It covers most of the questions you present in your OP and also talks a bit about the specifics of using Russians in TtMatB.

Cheers

Will

  Already own it and have recommended it to others. This is another four+ year old thread that's been revived - folks have been rummaging through the dusty archives, it seems.

[H.M.Stanley]

Guilty as charged 

I'm keen to tackle Scrivs and James Morris' LW Germans and French with my Russians for CoC

[Will Bailie]

Whoops - missed the threadomancy.    Still, I recommend E2R for Mr Stanley!

[H.M.Stanley]

Thanks. Have bought the Pdf

[Leapsnbounds]

I just have to ask Cuprum, how do you organize your Russian Civil War Armies?  The rules I use are a Modified Sword & the Flame.  It's what I grew up with and gives a good feel of the period I think, at least from what I know about the period. Cuprum you have been a wealth of information and I really want to thank you for all the wonderful articles you have provided.

[cuprum]

Alas - I do not know these rules. So that I find it difficult to advise. I'm using the modified rules "Red Actions!".

In fact, strict observance of staffing table there was none one side of the conflict. Military units were in the approximate accordance the old staffing tables Imperial Army, and then the new - has developed by the new authorities (red, white or national) staffing levels.
Necessary also look of the theater of military operations, as it also imposed its own peculiarities.
In general, white in the first stage has always been much more cavalry at the expense of the Cossack troops. Then, on the South Front the situation corrected strategic Red cavalry - horse army.
At the initial stage of the war White had an advantage as troops due to their high saturation experienced combat officer-volunteers. There were even whole officer regiments composed entirely of former officers of the Imperial Army. But over time, these units are washed out due to losses and mobilized soldiers, often military units of both sides replenished prisoners soldiers opponents. Among the Bolsheviks best military units were completely gone over to their side - military units Imperial Army (Latvian riflemen, some other professional military units, sailors, international detachment formed of prisoners of war). Then process of erosion these units forcibly mobilized people also occurs in Reds.