*
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
March 28, 2024, 10:16:02 PM

Login with username, password and session length

Donate

We Appreciate Your Support

Recent

Author Topic: All Quiet on the Martian Front  (Read 5665 times)

Offline Whiskyrat

  • Mad Scientist
  • Posts: 599
All Quiet on the Martian Front
« on: March 28, 2013, 06:42:54 PM »
From the webpage ...

"Developed by world famous game designers Alessio Cavatore, Ernie Baker, and Rick Priestly (creator of Warhammer and Warhammer 40k) All Quiet on the Martian Front is guaranteed to deliver fresh and exciting game play!"

http://www.martianfront.com/

Not a scale I game in but some of the Martians may be useful for 28mm.  :)

Offline fastolfrus

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 5247
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2013, 07:46:08 PM »
Quite keen at first and then saw the "tanks".

I'm sorry but why use the GW-looking "Mark IV male with extra big guns randomly added"?
If you're going for a SPG design why not use the Mark I gun carrier rather than sticking a howitzer on the roof of a Mk IV like a Basilisk?

Rant over.

But it puts me off the kickstarter straight off.
Gary, Glynis, and Alasdair (there are three of us, but we are too mean to have more than one login)

Offline answer_is_42

  • Mastermind
  • Posts: 1637
  • Mostly Harmless.
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2013, 08:23:23 PM »
Hmm, yes, not really don't think much of the figures shown, if I'm honest, but certainly potential. They're largely managed to avoid the steampunk pitfall, anyway, so that's a plus.
I told you so. You damned fools.
 - H.G. Wells

Offline rob_alderman

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 3718
  • Dribbling wreck...
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2013, 08:40:04 PM »
I'd be all over this if it was 28mm...

Offline Conquistador

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 4375
  • There are hostile eye watching us from the arroyos
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2013, 03:01:17 AM »
"... With grime purpose..."

Sweet Jesus, get a decent editor!

Pardon my language, but fucking strike two (after the crap looking tank) is a failure to use a decent editor and the Mark I eyeball instead of just depending on spellcheck.  Really?  

Even, no especially, if your native language is not English, (UK/American/Aussie versions,)  and you are marketing in English don't make such dumb ass mistakes.  

Gracias,

Glenn

who was kinda excited despite the risk of "40K in 1910" possibility until I actually looked at the pre-kickstarter page...

Edit:  This kind of poor business practice gives me a headache...
« Last Edit: March 29, 2013, 03:03:36 AM by Conquistador »
Viva Alta California!  Las guerras de España,  Las guerras de las Américas,  Las guerras para la Libertad!

Offline zebcook

  • Librarian
  • Posts: 199
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2013, 03:38:00 AM »
Saw a bit of the range on display at Cold Wars. Although 15's are not my scale, there were some nice pieces. They had a number of other AFV's that were better than what's shown -- a gun tractor with separate loading crane comes to mind that could work as a small tracked field howitzer in a larger scale. Likewise, the tripods could work in a 28mm game. Not massive all but still towering over a standard figure and easily 2 stories tall. Definitely a line worth picking and choosing from.

workerBee

  • Guest
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2013, 03:32:30 PM »
Saw a bit of the range on display at Cold Wars. <snip> Definitely a line worth picking and choosing from.

Yeah, guess we should wait and see but still not jumping up and down with joy...

Gracias,

Glenn

Offline rob_alderman

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 3718
  • Dribbling wreck...
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2013, 07:30:44 PM »
"... With grime purpose..."

Sweet Jesus, get a decent editor!

Pardon my language, but fucking strike two (after the crap looking tank) is a failure to use a decent editor and the Mark I eyeball instead of just depending on spellcheck.  Really?  

Even, no especially, if your native language is not English, (UK/American/Aussie versions,)  and you are marketing in English don't make such dumb ass mistakes.  

Gracias,

Glenn

who was kinda excited despite the risk of "40K in 1910" possibility until I actually looked at the pre-kickstarter page...

Edit:  This kind of poor business practice gives me a headache...

Mate, take a chill pill. People make mistakes...

You have to remember, editors cost money. I can't imagine this is a huge company, they are probably paying a lot of money for concepts, sculpts, writers, rules developers and then editing comes last.

Also, if English was not their first language, I would have patience with them and accept the mistakes. Better yet, offer your services for free if it is such a big bloody deal!

'Gracias',

Rob

Offline Conquistador

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 4375
  • There are hostile eye watching us from the arroyos
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2013, 05:15:53 PM »
Mate, take a chill pill. People make mistakes...

You have to remember, editors cost money. I can't imagine this is a huge company, they are probably paying a lot of money for concepts, sculpts, writers, rules developers and then editing comes last.

Also, if English was not their first language, I would have patience with them and accept the mistakes. Better yet, offer your services for free if it is such a big bloody deal!

'Gracias',

Rob

It's a part of business expenses.  It's one of the big complaints I have about the lack of professionalism in "Hobby business" in general.  It's improved over time (I remember mimeographed rules) but if you advertise  and market in English (or any other language) then you need a professional edit of your presentations. As a person who is extremely challenged (spelling and grammar) in two languages I think it is incumbent on me if I was a business to get that help. 

Gracias,

Glenn

Offline Conquistador

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 4375
  • There are hostile eye watching us from the arroyos
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2013, 05:18:34 PM »
<snip>

Also, if English was not their first language, I would have patience with them and accept the mistakes.
<snip>


Alessio Cavatore, Ernie Baker, and Rick Priestly - in this multi-cultural world you can't tell by names but I believe the last two of these are native English speakers?

Gracias,

Glenn
'

Offline Conquistador

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 4375
  • There are hostile eye watching us from the arroyos
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2013, 05:26:29 PM »
<snip>
Better yet, offer your services for free if it is such a big bloody deal!

'Gracias',

Rob

I don't work for free in a business matter.  You get what you pay for when you rely solely on free.

And, even at free you would get what you pay for, I spend significant time with spellcheck and grammar check at work plus the review of the my local Grammar Nazi and/or Evil Editor (usually both) when I write Supplemental Intelligence Reports or Geospatial Quick Notes so I don't look like the 1950s/1960s product of the Los Angeles school system that I am.

Gracias to you too, without the quote marks,

Glenn

Offline rob_alderman

  • Scatterbrained Genius
  • Posts: 3718
  • Dribbling wreck...
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2013, 10:38:12 PM »
I congratulate *anyone* making a move into this niche market, regardless of the odd bloody spelling mistake, which in the grand scheme of things, is not a big deal. I'm sure it's certainly not worth swearing about...

Also, I think you'll find helping out in the gaming community is very rewarding. I love my hobby and have 'worked' for several companies in the past in this manner. I also believe in karma to an extent (not the mystical kind, but at least that good intentions are often met with good return favours) and that is how I find it rewarding in business terms.

I apologise for putting your catchphrase into quotation marks, I will admit, that was me being a knob.

Offline fastolfrus

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 5247
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2013, 09:57:59 PM »
I'm not sold on the background.
I asked why the GW-esque designs, got this reply:

"Thanks for your inquiry/observations. We are getting lots of emails at the moment but we are trying to get back to everyone.
Sorry you are disappointed in the first wave of tanks. Perhaps some context will help.
While we are using Mark III and Mark IV and so on, the vehicles are not supposed to be derivatives of the British tanks designs. Any resemblance to GW stuff is coincidental and related to them using the WWI British tanks as their inspiration.
This is not a World War One game. In fact, the evolution of the American vehicles started to occur before the actual historical date of World War one. We use World War One as a reference to keep things easier because ten years after the initial invasion places it there.
Only a few designs have been shown to date. The Basilisk one you refer to will most likely not make it into a produced model.  The Mark III Baldwin Steam tank IS small and very cramped. There are two larger chasis in the works.
As to why steam, this dissertation which is going out in our next Newsletter may or may not help you get your head around it. 
I appreciate your feedback as most of it has been “cool” or “when can we some even bigger guns?”.  Nice that people like it, but not reflective of the amount of thought going into it."

Offline fastolfrus

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 5247
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #13 on: April 01, 2013, 09:59:38 PM »
Why Steam? Actually the real question is “Oil or Coal?”

We have had a few folks ask about the human vehicles: “If it’s World War One, why steam instead of internal combustion engines?” The answer to that question is actually it’s not all steam and it’s not actually World War One. It’s also not a secret agenda to do “Steam Punk”! There is much more to it than that. In fact, the majority of human vehicles that have been shown and some of the new ones to come are American equipment because the American theater is the focus of Part One of the Great Interplanetary War that goes by the title All Quiet on the Martian Front. The British Expeditionary Force operating in the American theater uses a quite different group of power sources-more on that later.

Anyway, the reason American Forces use steam power for their larger vehicles is as follows:

In 1910, America runs on coal. With the largest and most advanced railway system in the world, huge coal reserves, and the petroleum industry still in its infancy in many ways, coal was the fastest resource to exploit in defending against the Martian invasion. In addition, steam engines were a well developed technology, the manufacturing base to produce more was in place on a large scale, and it could all be done fast. This last bit was particularly important as the American army was very tiny in comparison to the amount of territory that had to be defended and technologically ill equipped.  With the exception of a few primitive trucks and steam tractors, the American Army was a horse drawn affair of towed guns, cavalry, and infantry. These forces were virtually useless against the Martians. If America had any hope of survival it needed new weapons, vehicles, and technology IMMEDIATELY. It was both natural and logical to turn to the strengths of its current industrial base.  While defensive lines of massive trench works and fortifications could slow the Martians, it certainly didn’t stop them. What was needed was defense in depth and the ability to relocate resources to repel an attack at its point of origin.  The War was becoming a far more mobile affair. The one advantage humans did have was numbers. Getting enough numbers into action to absorb the Martian attacks was the key. This meant vehicles and due to the appalling losses against the Martian technology, LOTS of vehicles. There was no automotive industry beyond the cottage level. The biggest producers of vehicles were the railroad companies. Baldwin Locomotive Works, The American Locomotive Company and others soon started building more steam tractors that eventually became armored to improve their survivability and then tracked to increase their mobility. Within a matter of months it was clear that standard designs would speed production immensely. Thus was born one of the single greatest accomplishments in perhaps all of human industrial history. American went from having virtually no self propelled military equipment to assembly line production of thousands of vehicles in the course of a single year.

So there you have it. Steal and Coal are the fuels and materials of choice. The great locomotive companies of the industrial east bring their expertise to production. Oil and the refining of it into suitable fuels like kerosene, gasoline, and diesel fuel is far less abundant than the vast coal fields of West Virginia and Pennsylvania. Petroleum does make it onto the battlefield in the form of internal combustion engines used for motorcycles, armored cars, the new aero planes etc., but it is steam that powers the huge gun carrying vehicles with their heavy steel and ceramic armor on the battlefield. At the time of the Great Interplanetary Wars beginning, internal combustion engines simply were not advanced enough to provide the power needed for some of the larger military constructs and in America and refined oil products were in short supply compared to the need.

Offline fastolfrus

  • Galactic Brain
  • Posts: 5247
Re: All Quiet on the Martian Front
« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2013, 10:01:15 PM »
My thoughts on their reply?
I referred to the Mk IVs at Bovington purely because I'm aware of how cramped they are (even with petrol engines).
I also saw that the second invasion begins at the end of 1908, a few months after Model Ts started to come off the Michigan lines.
America already had armoured cars, although only fitted with bullet-proof shields, in 190, the Davidson from Illinois.
Since both Model Ts and Davidsons are petrol-driven it seems illogical to propose coal-power as a superior alternative.
Even the Belgians had armoured cars by 1912 (the Minerva) although the Belgian army in 1914 still had machine-guns on carts pulled by dogs.
For steam power I would suggest some variant of armoured train, perhaps HG Wells Land Ironclads (1903) - a 100 foot long vehicle.
But looking forward to hearing/seeing more

 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
140 Replies
22418 Views
Last post June 23, 2014, 12:57:15 PM
by Ray Rivers
9 Replies
3257 Views
Last post July 22, 2014, 11:10:56 PM
by Mindenbrush
32 Replies
7350 Views
Last post August 27, 2014, 01:58:07 AM
by Ray Rivers
28 Replies
9032 Views
Last post June 03, 2015, 11:16:59 PM
by dexter
1 Replies
1708 Views
Last post June 13, 2015, 03:58:36 AM
by Hobby Services