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Author Topic: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread  (Read 1017399 times)

Offline Condottiere

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9990 on: July 17, 2019, 05:34:17 PM »
Rats, I wanted to post that ^___^
As the primus poster, I had thought of bringing this up, but realized contemporary "Warhammer" is about as edgy as hipster lettuce...

Offline FramFramson

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9991 on: July 17, 2019, 05:56:09 PM »
As the primus poster, I had thought of bringing this up, but realized contemporary "Warhammer" is about as edgy as hipster lettuce...


Offline Ultravanillasmurf

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9992 on: July 17, 2019, 06:07:22 PM »
You do not have that old paired Chaoa mutations: Exploding Head plus Regeneration?

Offline Coenus Scaldingus

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9993 on: July 17, 2019, 08:42:02 PM »
So, well.. looks like there might be a Warhammer 40k TV series in the near future. Live-action and everything.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/07/17/heretic-traitor-rogue-inquisitor-tv-stargw-homepage-post-2/
~Ad finem temporum~

Offline Belligerentparrot

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9994 on: July 17, 2019, 08:57:10 PM »
So, well.. looks like there might be a Warhammer 40k TV series in the near future. Live-action and everything.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/07/17/heretic-traitor-rogue-inquisitor-tv-stargw-homepage-post-2/
Yikes, I won't be watching that! No disrespect at all to anyone who feels differently, but I find the fiction is the weakest part of GW's output by a long way. GW hooked me through the look of the thing, especially the Goodwin sculpts and Blanche conversions. I'd see a cool mini in WD and it would suggest all sorts of world-building possibilities (even more true now of the amazing multi-part kits that all fit so well together - soooooo much conversion potential). I never got anything much out of how the fiction bits would fill up that space of possibilities.
 

Offline beefcake

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9995 on: July 17, 2019, 09:10:13 PM »
I like the backstory but don't really think grimdark translates well to the screen.


Offline mcfonz

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9996 on: July 17, 2019, 09:33:30 PM »
Being a bit old school and having worked for them back in '98 (in a store as a keytimer for not a long period of time) I was reliably informed back then that game canon and Black Library were two different things.

As such, I look at them as two seperate product lines that whilst related are not as entwined or reliant upon each other as some would think.

The books have been successful though and it's only logical that they would try a TV show at some point.

A group of friends and I were discussing this the other day and felt that an Inquisitor or Rogue Trader crew would be the best approach. Coupled with a Firefly vibe.

Grimdark isn't how GW has always been depicted. Most of the fluff is written from the perspective of the higher echelon's of the Imperium, but in the past planets and stories  have been far more steeped in popular culture. So there is plenty of room to minimise that.

It could be fun, my main worry is they tie it down too much to existing books rather than using a possible show to be a way of introducing and visiting various aspects of the 40k universe.

Offline Dr Mathias

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9997 on: July 17, 2019, 09:46:13 PM »
The Eisenhorn series isn't all that 'grimdark' from my point of view, it's more of a cyberpunk/noir action series set in the 40K verse. Abnett's stuff is called "Abnettverse" by the fandom because it is fairly non-canon and has a lot of stuff that doesn't seem to fit the rest of the established fiction.

That said I like his stuff quite a bit, just re-read the Eisenhorn books last week and am almost through Ravenor again.
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Offline AWu

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9998 on: July 17, 2019, 11:29:48 PM »
Damn.. that should ba a last story on page 666.. Some moderator need to cut few post :P


As a general rule I do not read stuff about space marines as I find it mostly lacking or hack and slash but I like to read some non marine stuff. Off course its a bit silly pulp literature for the most part but some of the characters and stories are really cool and well made.
Shia Calpurnia Arbitrator series are cool noir meets Dread, Ciapas Cain is quite repetitive but well done parody, Necromunda stuff is really down to earth  and Inquisition series are things worth read if one likes broader world of 40k.
In my opinion Eisenhorn is best piece of fiction out of GW stable.

So they chosen wisely but lets hope they will do him justice or there will be a lot of disappointed fans :)

But I hope for models accompanying the release most of course :)

Offline Blackwolf

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #9999 on: July 18, 2019, 01:51:10 AM »
Yep,Dan Abnett is the best,though the last 1st and Only novel was disappointing, Shia Calpurnia is great, possibly the most literate 40k novel, and the Night Lords trilogy is good too(can't remember the author, oh that's right Aaron Demski something or another). Most of the others are repetitive, and a bit boys own adventure...
PS Double  Eagle by D. Abnett is my fave,along with his hard sci fi novel Embedded (not a 40k ).
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Offline Daeothar

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #10000 on: July 18, 2019, 09:01:18 AM »
I have a bit of mixed feelings about this news.

On the one hand, I'm rejoicing, as it's long, long overdue that a high production value 40K movie or series is made. Considering the fact that much smaller franchises have made it to the silver screen, riding a big budget, it's baffling that 40K never got this before now. Especially since the 40K fandom, even though often subdued and (somewhat) secret in real life, is quite substantial and global.

Part of the reason for this on the other hand, probably is GW's former stance on fan projects such as Damnatus, which was in production for years, had a very tight budget (all self funded I believe), had a (sort of) stamp of approval from GW, but when they wanted to release it, it was C&D'd to death (because of German copyright laws, if I understood correctly).

It, and many other (much less ambitious) projects, were quite bad obviously. Shoestring budgets, amateur actors, directors, prop makers etc, all made these projects fall into the 'so bad it's good' category most of the times. But they were all lovingly made, and they at least gave us 40K on screen, something GW hadn't done since Inquisitor. This was the last (and only) official live action GW movie, and it was on par with, or even worse than, a lot of fan made stuff (especially Damnatus). It was official, but apparently suffering from the same restrictions as all those later fan projects; low budget, well willing but inadequate actors, low quality props, etc.

Then, after many years, GW released Ultramarines, a CG film heralded as cutting edge, with a great story, but it was equally terrible, with dated CG, a badly scripted and edited story (if you could even call it that), and it was an all out disappointment. Most computer games cut-scenes (including those from 40K games!) were much better quality. In fact, in-game footage of contemporary 40K computer games such as Space Marine was much better!

GW just never put in the funds required to release a film worth the watch, because they wanted to keep everything in-house, and they simply did not have the funds to do it right. So teaming up with larger production houses is the only way to go, and with the new direction GW has taken, they have now finally seen the light.

So here's to hoping this project will do the entire franchise justice (for once), and we won't be solely dependent on fan projects for our on-screen 40K fix. What is desperately required though, are people who understand the universe through and through and know about all the intricate little details of the 40K world. And not through just reading Eisenhorn front to back (which certainly is worth it), but also the other fiction, especially the older stuff, so they also know about the evolution, retcons and progression of the fluff.

And it's obvious they will have to live up to quite the standard these days. I mean; check out the more than excellent recent fan projects, such as Astartes, Helsreach or Guardsman... 8)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2019, 09:57:15 AM by Daeothar »

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Offline beefcake

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #10001 on: July 18, 2019, 09:26:11 AM »
The Eisenhorn series isn't all that 'grimdark' from my point of view, it's more of a cyberpunk/noir action series set in the 40K verse. Abnett's stuff is called "Abnettverse" by the fandom because it is fairly non-canon and has a lot of stuff that doesn't seem to fit the rest of the established fiction.

That said I like his stuff quite a bit, just re-read the Eisenhorn books last week and am almost through Ravenor again.

That's good, hopefully they'll go down the non grimdark path and bring in some of the old school poking fun at the hobby look too.

Offline FionaWhite

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #10002 on: July 18, 2019, 10:22:11 AM »
I hope they can reach the levels of awesome seen in Final Liberation's cutscenes.

I really have no idea what I'm doing.

Offline Daeothar

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #10003 on: July 18, 2019, 11:14:50 AM »
I hope they can reach the levels of awesome seen in Final Liberation's cutscenes.

Eisenhorn is decidedly more low key than the epic (sic) battles in Final Liberation.

As said; it's more a detective/noir type of narrative, with a lot of cloak and dagger stuff. But there is a lot of skirmish sized action which would translate into live action perfectly. And most of those scenes are really thrilling. In fact, the entire trilogy is one big page turner.

Especially the widely differing settings on all the planets he visits are gripping, as each is completely different from the next, with local cultures also vastly different from each other, just like customs, clothing, technology etc. It's an almost Dr. Who-ish kaleidoscope of settings.


My favourite 40K book though, is Space Marine by Ian Watson. In many ways, it was the seminal work on Space Marines, basically defining the SM fluff, as at that time (late Rogue Trader), there was no clearly described background for Space Marines. Ian Watson was specifically hired to flesh this out in fiction. He was also an established scifi author, and not an eager GW employee writing sanctified fan fiction (as happened a lot later on), and it shows. It's quite a ride, as its content feels almost feverish and constantly on edge, and much weirdness is included that has later been watered down, changed or completely omitted.

He went on to write the Draco trilogy too, which would later be known as The Inquisition War (Draco, Harlequin and Chaos Child). This work probably was the inspiration for Abnett to later write Eisenhorn. I have to admit though that the Eisenhorn trilogy is far superior to the Draco one. Especially the ending of the Draco trilogy feels rushed, but here too, much of the foundation of 40K fluff was laid down, a lot which resonates to this day.

Much of the content of Space Marine and Draco, Harlequin and Chaos Child has been retconned in one way or another in the following decades, but for me, they still stand as the granddaddy of all 40K novels that came after 8)

Offline FionaWhite

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #10004 on: July 18, 2019, 12:29:00 PM »
Eisenhorn is decidedly more low key than the epic (sic) battles in Final Liberation.

As said; it's more a detective/noir type of narrative, with a lot of cloak and dagger stuff. But there is a lot of skirmish sized action which would translate into live action perfectly. And most of those scenes are really thrilling. In fact, the entire trilogy is one big page turner.

Especially the widely differing settings on all the planets he visits are gripping, as each is completely different from the next, with local cultures also vastly different from each other, just like customs, clothing, technology etc. It's an almost Dr. Who-ish kaleidoscope of settings.


My favourite 40K book though, is Space Marine by Ian Watson. In many ways, it was the seminal work on Space Marines, basically defining the SM fluff, as at that time (late Rogue Trader), there was no clearly described background for Space Marines. Ian Watson was specifically hired to flesh this out in fiction. He was also an established scifi author, and not an eager GW employee writing sanctified fan fiction (as happened a lot later on), and it shows. It's quite a ride, as its content feels almost feverish and constantly on edge, and much weirdness is included that has later been watered down, changed or completely omitted.

He went on to write the Draco trilogy too, which would later be known as The Inquisition War (Draco, Harlequin and Chaos Child). This work probably was the inspiration for Abnett to later write Eisenhorn. I have to admit though that the Eisenhorn trilogy is far superior to the Draco one. Especially the ending of the Draco trilogy feels rushed, but here too, much of the foundation of 40K fluff was laid down, a lot which resonates to this day.

Much of the content of Space Marine and Draco, Harlequin and Chaos Child has been retconned in one way or another in the following decades, but for me, they still stand as the granddaddy of all 40K novels that came after 8)

Ooh, I wasn't quite referring to the scale of conflicts depicted, rather to the epicness of acting and effects seen.  :D

 

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