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Author Topic: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread  (Read 1029973 times)

Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #930 on: April 29, 2014, 02:53:16 PM »
Doubt it. The figs are still ridiculously expensive.

£2.35 for a figure that can be assembled as one of two different models? I wouldn't call that "ridiculous". Not the cheapest model out there, sure, but still at least affordable (which is more than I can say for many GW releases!).

Instead, I think expecting people to buy and paint 20-40 of these per regiment is ridiculous. <shrugs>

Offline Timbor

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #931 on: April 29, 2014, 03:01:51 PM »
If those prices are correct, then it is a very good thing.  The recent dark elf witch elf dual kits are  £35 for 10...
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Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #932 on: April 29, 2014, 03:25:53 PM »
Well, assuming I'm not breaking any forum rules by linking to it, you can see the prices in all currencies here.

Offline Timbor

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #933 on: April 29, 2014, 03:58:41 PM »
Wow, that is quite reasonable compared to recent releases.  I will likely pick up a box of each just to play around with.  The greatswords were $50CAD when released, and this is forecasted to be a bit cheaper than that, with more components for the infantry.

Offline Dr.Falkenhayn

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #934 on: April 29, 2014, 04:31:41 PM »
looks like 7th Edition 40K is coming sooner than expected  :o

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2014/04/40k-6th-edition-is-being-pulled.html

Quote:
Multiple Retailers are reporting GW reps are calling to inform them the following products are being pulled:

- Warhammer 40,000 rulebook

- Dark Vengeance starter set

- Warhammer 40,000 Psychic Powers cards

- New Edition Release date of May 24th

Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #935 on: April 29, 2014, 05:16:27 PM »
I gather it's not such much a new edition, as a re-issue of the current edition... So 6.5 if you will!  ;D

Time will tell I guess.

Offline pixelgeek

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #936 on: April 29, 2014, 07:07:41 PM »
I wouldn't call that "ridiculous". Not the cheapest model out there, sure, but still at least affordable (which is more than I can say for many GW releases!).

So its cheap for a GW release. Its still more expensive than almost everything I've bought in the last year. Including boxes of 30-35 hard plastic multi-part figures from other companies, pre-painted terrain, entire companies of 15mm plastics, etc etc.

GW figures should be cheap. They churn them out in huge volumes, they have a huge distribution system in place and the material itself is the cheapest part of the process. They benefit from an economy of scale that none of their competitors have.

If the Perrys and Warlord can put out similarly priced plastic sets then something is seriously wrong with GW and its pricing.

So yes, these are not as egregiously priced as some of their recent plastics, and, as usual, they look pretty nice, but they are ridiculously priced for what you get.



Offline Diakon

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #937 on: April 29, 2014, 11:38:22 PM »
Not sure about the infantry but I really like those riders steeds. Very Miyazaki in my opinion. That's why I want them  :D

Offline Vermis

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #938 on: April 30, 2014, 12:40:00 AM »
I AM NOT ASHAMED



In other news, the new sculpting tools are indeed an improvement on the last one, but I still wouldn't buy 'em. The flat surfaces are good 'n' smooth but the edges are as thick and blunt as I thought they looked in the photos.

The files are kinda interesting, though. Both diamond files, the coarser one is as fine as the better diamond-coated stuff I have (admittedly a Lidl knife sharpener) and the finer one is... finer still. I don't know how good they'd be at filing down thick metal mouldlines (I think they'd need that chalking tip Major Gilbear mentioned!) but given GW's push to plastic I guess it doesn't bother them, and you'd probably get a good final polish on metal or plastic minis with them.

Also, picked up the White Dwarf Weekly and I think that treeman's growing on me. :-X Especially after Seb Perbett's designer's notes. I still think it's more 'bark-armoured demon' than 'not-ent', but it's not bad for all that.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2014, 12:42:10 AM by Vermis »

Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #939 on: April 30, 2014, 08:48:45 AM »
@ Pixelgeek:

You can always find something cheaper - a bag of plastic Army Men style figures are even cheaper still, and are very often quite well sculpted when you consider them carefully.

GW models should be cheaper, but they are not for a lot of reasons; some of which are obvious like money, and some of which are less obvious like their overheads as a company.

I don't think £2.35 a figure is ridiculous if I'm buying <20, as that still falls within a reasonably affordable sum. Not cheap, but affordable. I won't be buying tons of them for huge blocks though - I'd just use a unit filler or three for that.

Please also note that I say this as somebody who's usually the first to complain about GW's pricing!  :-X


@ Vermis:

So have you used the scraper yet? Was it worthwhile? Has it turned you into the next David Soper?  ;D

Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #940 on: April 30, 2014, 08:55:15 AM »
Both diamond files, the coarser one is as fine as the better diamond-coated stuff I have (admittedly a Lidl knife sharpener) and the finer one is... finer still. I don't know how good they'd be at filing down thick metal mouldlines (I think they'd need that chalking tip Major Gilbear mentioned!) but given GW's push to plastic I guess it doesn't bother them, and you'd probably get a good final polish on metal or plastic minis with them.

Be wary of chalking files that have the abrasives bonded to them as opposed to being cut. It may still work, but their nature is rather different. I'd probably suggest regularly talcing them rather than occasionally chalking them.

Either way, I use cut files for modelling because they have a much longer life than coated files when used as hard as I do!  lol

Offline pixelgeek

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #941 on: April 30, 2014, 07:34:51 PM »
GW models should be cheaper, but they are not for a lot of reasons; some of which are obvious like money, and some of which are less obvious like their overheads as a company.

Well they are trying to float the company on a diminishing number of gamers is the main problem. Perhaps this reduction is an indication that they've finally seen that as a bad idea but, the plan they have followed for some years, charging a premium for their figures, is slowly strangling them.

They have some much competition now, across a range of markets, that just making really nice figs isn't enough of a draw.

I could have been clearer but my point is that GW has a lot of competition for the average gamers dollar which provide much cheaper alternatives. If what I want to do is paint some minis and have a tabletop game I can get involved in a lot of games now that provide a complete solution at a fraction of the cost.

I love their minis. I especially love the Wood Elves. But the market for their products is either Warhammer/40K gamers or people who want some sort of figures for their generic fantasy or sci-fi gaming.

The later market is pretty small and often satisfied with a single purchase. How many non-GW fantasy games are there that would require a person to buy more than a single box of the Wood Elf cav?

There are some figs that they make that aren't available elsewhere, like most of the Wood Elf range, but I suspect that for people not playing Warhammer or 40K, their figs are too much of an outlay.

Also, don't forget that due to their differential pricing, you get a much better deal for GW minis in the UK and US than elsewhere. Most GW boxed sets and single figures left the realm of impulse purchases a long time ago in Canada.


Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #942 on: May 01, 2014, 10:35:22 AM »
Pixelgeek, I pretty much agree with your last post.

I also think that some of their more recent extreme styling has turned a lot of people off.

For example, their terrain is very expensive, and *covered* in SKULLZ! That makes removing the skulls as much work or more as simply making your own terrain from scratch. This in turn negates the point of paying the high "convenience" premium of the terrain.

Or some of their "centrepiece" models that nobody normal can reasonably expect to ever take anywhere without serious and justifiable fear of breaking them. Examples of such silliness include the Dark Elf Cauldron of Blood and the Vampire Mortis Whatsit.

I understand that they want to have models that are more unique (and therefore trademarkable), but that's not what many of their customers want. By not recognising that, other companies have been able to fill the gap (often at similar prices even) and take their revenue away. Avatars of War and Raging Heroes are two good examples, and Mantic's early business model was based on GW derivations.

I don't think that £15-25 for a box of 10-15 infantry models is unreasonable if:

1) they are very nice models that assemble well
2) you only need a few such boxes for an army

But when you expect to sell 2-3 boxes per regiment, and for players to have 4-5 such regiments at a minimum just to play a basic version of the game... Well, then you're going to struggle to sell the game as well as before.

What makes is somewhat worse is that older players will often have built up a collection over time of GW models anyway, and can play without purchasing more than the books.

That's one reason the books are so expensive I think, and also why the model count has gone up so drastically (i.e., not just to get players to buy more boxes, but to get existing players to supplement/replace their existing regiments).

The other thing is... None of their games are very well balanced if you set out to build a distorted army. And by distorted army, I mean not building a one-of-each studio-type army. So, really, if you and your group are already in and happy enough with one edition of a game... Why update to the the latest edition (especially if the edition supercedes your army book)? I mean, it's not mandatory.

Personally, I will probably grab a couple of the new WE model kits. But then, I already have lots of WE stuff, and am not likely to buy into a new edition of WHFB (since I have complete 5E, 7E and 8E already). For me then, this will be a completionist activity that will close off the current edition for me nicely, and from which I will not likely graduate to the new edition.

Offline Vermis

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #943 on: May 01, 2014, 11:37:12 AM »
@ Vermis:

So have you used the scraper yet? Was it worthwhile? Has it turned you into the next David Soper?  ;D

I was given an SM backpack to try it out on and it wasn't too bad. It's also handy for a bit of a manicure after clipping your fingernails. ;) I have no idea who David Soper is, though.

Be wary of chalking files that have the abrasives bonded to them as opposed to being cut. It may still work, but their nature is rather different. I'd probably suggest regularly talcing them rather than occasionally chalking them.

Noted! Ta.

Offline Major_Gilbear

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Re: The LAF Games Workshop Discussion Thread
« Reply #944 on: May 01, 2014, 11:48:26 AM »
I have no idea who David Soper is, though.

A very talented man who paints plastic models rather well.  ;)

 

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