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Author Topic: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?  (Read 4836 times)

Offline Rhoderic

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Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« on: December 27, 2015, 02:13:45 PM »
I'm seriously considering ordering about £100 worth of terrain pieces from Ainsty's Refinery range. Their December Sale is on, so now is the time to order it if I want it, but I can't seem to get myself to commit.

I'd probably have quite a lot of use for a chemical plant style set-up in various 28mm sci-fi projects that I have going on or intend to start at some point (gang wars, old skool grimdark space fantasy, Infinity, etc). It would also be right at home in spy-fi or modern action movie style gaming if I ever take either of those up (which I kind of want to). With a bit of work and forethought I could even make it multi-scale so I can use it for 15mm sci-fi and Heavy Gear Blitz (12mm) as well.

On the other hand, being essentially a modern-day plant by appearance, it doesn't work with all flavours of sci-fi I'm into. Notably, my Antares figures would look out of place fighting over a relatively archaic industrial landscape of greebly silos and pipes. I'd still like to have some sort of terrain set-up that is in broad strokes similar to what Ainsty is selling (that is, a "playground" of pipes, silos, platforms and raised walkways), but... maybe it's not worth £100? I mean, it's mostly just cylinders with greeblies stuck on, plus some platforms and support pillars, which I could at least try to scratchbuild for much cheaper...

The variable factor which keeps me vacillating is whether or not Ainsty's refinery terrain looks good. I mean, is it realistic enough? I don't know what a refinery or chemical plant "should" look like, and pictures that show up on Google Image Search are a jumble to say the least. I would like a reasonable degree of realism in a set-up like this, not to the point where it would pass muster with an actual chemical plant/refinery engineer or technician, but at least to the point where an ordinary adult using a bit of common sense can't very easily figure out that it simply doesn't make sense.

So, I'm looking for comments and observations on the Ainsty refinery set, and recommendations (or warnings) regarding other alternatives (including scratchbuilding). Anything to make me feel that either I'm dodging a bullet by not buying from the Ainsty range, or I really can't hope for something better than £100 of Ainsty refinery terrain at 20% off.
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Offline uti long smile

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2015, 02:46:21 PM »
I have loads of Ainsty stuff. Quality casting, highly modular (designed to be) and great folks to deal with. I've used it for modern gaming, but it would work perfectly well for sci-fi. Recommended.
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Offline Rhoderic

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2015, 04:14:08 PM »
Awesome terrain, Scurv!

It does highlight some of my insecurities when it comes to modelling industrial terrain, though; I don't understand industrial constructions. Pipes disappearing into the ground are a good example. I've seen them in photos of real life refineries and chemical plants, so I know it's not just a wargamers' fancy, but I don't quite get what the real life purpose of a layout like that is (within the bounds of a chemical facility, you'd expect overground pipes to always be more practical). And when I don't get the purpose of something, I'm afraid that when I try to represent it in miniature, I'll be "doing it wrong", like some cargo cult building mock airfields in the jungle.


the thing you want to ask yourself is. What terrain do I actually need right now and what would be nice to have. If you need a bunch of hills then a refinery might not be the right buy. (I wish I had some nice hills, got a good refinery though.... lol )

I definitely know that feeling! One thing that complicates things further is that I like to avoid the common miniature wargamers' "mistake" of combining terrain/scenery that wouldn't really occur in each others' immediate vicinity. For instance, a refinery or chemical plant would (to the best of my knowledge) typically not be built anywhere near any hills (in fact, from what I can tell, refineries and chemical plants are almost always located in extremely flat landscapes, often lowland shores or alluvial plains). So, using the example of hills and refinery / chemical plant terrain pieces, I "can't" really get a few of both with the reasoning that combining them will make a good battlefield or skirmish/adventure location. ...Well, I can, but I'd rather not.

So, yeah, maybe I should get back to basics and figure out if there's anything more rudimentary I should be focusing on instead. That said, I do want some sort of industrial, man-made landscape for my sci-fi games. Now I think about it, one of the things that drew me to the Ainsty refinery terrain in the first place was the possibility of simply getting an almost ready-made terrain set-up in a box so I could concentrate my own terrain-building efforts on other things instead (desert outcrops are on the workbench). It's just that, upon further reflection, I might want to save that £100 for some other ready-made terrain that's not as easy to scratchbuild. Not that I can claim to know that a refinery will be easy to scratchbuild, but the more I look at it (EDIT: The Ainsty stuff, that is), the more I think that it's mainly just lots of cylinders and tubes with greeblies stuck on.


I have loads of Ainsty stuff. Quality casting, highly modular (designed to be) and great folks to deal with. I've used it for modern gaming, but it would work perfectly well for sci-fi. Recommended.

I have a few Ainsty pieces myself, mainly from the Cargo Hold range. I actually wouldn't say they're perfectly cast, because I had to remodel a few small surface details that were "filled in" with resin, but it wasn't much trouble and the overall quality was decent enough that, generally speaking, I would buy from Ainsty again (and will, because I'll be ordering some other Ainsty items during this sale regardless of whether I get the refinery pieces or not).
« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 04:20:01 PM by Rhoderic »

Offline Westfalia Chris

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2015, 05:31:50 PM »
I definitely know that feeling! One thing that complicates things further is that I like to avoid the common miniature wargamers' "mistake" of combining terrain/scenery that wouldn't really occur in each others' immediate vicinity. For instance, a refinery or chemical plant would (to the best of my knowledge) typically not be built anywhere near any hills (in fact, from what I can tell, refineries and chemical plants are almost always located in extremely flat landscapes, often lowland shores or alluvial plains). So, using the example of hills and refinery / chemical plant terrain pieces, I "can't" really get a few of both with the reasoning that combining them will make a good battlefield or skirmish/adventure location. ...Well, I can, but I'd rather not.

I wouldn't limit myself unduly by that assumption. Take a look at the vicinity of the Scholven refinery and power plant in the Ruhr Area:

http://www.dominobahn.de/scholven.jpg

The Ruhr Area is very hilly in places, and a more decisive factor, especially in the past when such plants were founded would be good accessibility, usually by river or by train. The Gelsenkirchen refineries, where I worked for a while, are smack dab in the middle of the Ruhr area, and are actually mainly fed by a pipeline from Rotterdam (or Antwerpen, it's been some years); before the advent of tank lorries, the finished product was mainly shipped by train and inland waterways.

Of course, building a pipeline and such a plant on flat ground is easier and less costly than in hilly country, but I guess it should be more of an economic decision as to where a plant is built - e.g. where does the raw material come from, where is the product to be shipped to? So, if there is lot of industry in the vicinity, it might be more economic in the long run to build a facility close-by.

Also, you don't need to limit yourself on using the parts as a refinery. A fuel depot would be another nice option and would actually be easier and more believable in scale (a proper-looking cracker converter column is damn unhandy in 28mm).

Offline fastolfrus

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2015, 07:15:26 PM »
The refinery pieces look good but don't have to be chemical or fuel based facilities.
If you had a Tatooine style layout they might be the above ground bits of a water storage/purification facility.
Maybe you could add in a lot of storage tanks etc from suitable tubs (CD storage tubs look quite good), and use the Ainsty parts just for detailing/character setting?

Mix in a few Down Below pieces or Az Tech walls pieces for added variety.

If you're considering the scratchbuilding route just pick up specialist bits such as lots of airlock doors, Base Camp reception desk and control consoles etc.
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Offline Rhoderic

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2015, 07:48:46 PM »
Thank you, Westfalia Chris, that's the kind of stuff I need and want to learn about "how the world works". I really like the terrain & scenery aspect of miniatures wargaming but, to me, that implies a strong "demiurgic" element wherein the set-up of any table ought to be reasonably realistic (unless of course the setting being gamed is intentionally unrealistic, like retro pulp sci-fi), internally consistent and stress the importance of interconnectedness in the world (ie. the fact that every terrain piece tends to have a significance in regard to what else can exist on the table, and where). I do still strive for what I think of as a high degree of "abstract representation" of reality in regard to the small detail, though. If for instance I'm modelling railings for platforms, walkways and stairs in an industrial landscape, the point is just to give the general impression that "this is the kind of place that has railings", not to follow actual Health & Safety regulations! :)

Also, you don't need to limit yourself on using the parts as a refinery. A fuel depot would be another nice option and would actually be easier and more believable in scale (a proper-looking cracker converter column is damn unhandy in 28mm).

Yeah, I've basically been thinking that any practical-to-model "landscape" of chemical silos and pipes in 28mm would have to be either the edge of a large refinery (the really big stuff being situated off-table), or a mini-refinery or other kind of chemical plant that isn't a refinery. Hadn't thought of a fuel depot, though. Thanks for that!


The refinery pieces look good but don't have to be chemical or fuel based facilities.
If you had a Tatooine style layout they might be the above ground bits of a water storage/purification facility.
Maybe you could add in a lot of storage tanks etc from suitable tubs (CD storage tubs look quite good), and use the Ainsty parts just for detailing/character setting?

Mix in a few Down Below pieces or Az Tech walls pieces for added variety.

If you're considering the scratchbuilding route just pick up specialist bits such as lots of airlock doors, Base Camp reception desk and control consoles etc.

Good ideas! I'm leaning toward something like this now, so I might get some Ainsty refinery pieces, but much less than £100 worth.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 07:51:12 PM by Rhoderic »

Offline Elk101

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2015, 09:15:52 AM »
I live near the chemical works that inspired those opening Bladerunner shots and the surrounding (flat in this instance) area is full of closed and still working plants.

You will see a lot of stuff that looks like the pipeline junctions and high level pipes that Ainsty sell.You'll also see a lot of the 'Pringle tub' cylindrical tanks complete with access ladders or winding steps for the larger ones. There are also a lot of pipes disappearing into the ground. There are safety cages, barriers and such like everywhere,  usually highlighted in contrasting colours like orange or yellow. There are also a lot of cooling towers and stacks too, as well as large bits of plant that look like the stuff Wargame Modelling Mods sell in mdf.

http://www.wargame-model-mods.co.uk/ourshop/cat_806136-Industrial-Buildings.html

The Ainsty ones perhaps look a little more sci-fi than what I see here but I think that's the intention. I'm a big fan of Ainsty and I'd reiterate that they are great to deal with and any business sent their way helps keep them about for the rest of us!

Do a Google image search on Teesside chemical works and that should give you some useful ideas as it will also bring up film shots from Bladerunner.

Offline 6milPhil

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2015, 11:01:33 AM »
I like that Ainsty range, will not buy 80 quids worth and spend twenty on scracthbuilding something to go with it?

Offline Rhoderic

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2015, 09:07:39 PM »
Well, I decided in the end to opt out of the Ainsty refinery range - at least for now - as I've been thinking of more and more scratchbuilding ideas. I did still make a very large (by my standards) order for other Ainsty stuff, though.

Thanks to everyone for the input.

Oh, and I also realised that when I said I own some Ainsty products and they're not "perfectly cast", I wasn't being entirely accurate: I bought them from Old Crow, not Ainsty, in the time between Ainsty selling the range to Old Crow, and Old Crow subsequently selling the range back to Ainsty again o_o

Offline eilif

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #9 on: December 31, 2015, 01:17:57 PM »

In summary, I would not worry about how things work and instead focus on how they look.


This is my suggestion too.  I understand the desire to be realistic, but the fact is that in 28mm gaming there usually isn't room to really be realistic.  Virtually everything we build, from spaceships, to houses, to industrial facilities is incredibly compressed.

 I'd just look at some source material and go with it.  Two points of encouragement though. First, there really are some situations where you'll find small installations.  Propane distribuitors, small bits of industry, distillery's, etc.
Second, if you're gaming sci-fi then there's no telling what kind of refining/formulating/etc processes will exist, or how compact we may learn to make the machinery, so you shouldn't be constrained by current functionality.

Really though, I'd just look at a bunch of source material and find a section that both looks good and will provide good utility in the game.

Here's a chemical instalation I built.  It's made of
-Halogen light bulbs
-a toy silo
-"girder and panel" toy building pieces
-single sided corrugated cardboard
-"Chemical Plant" kit pieces from Pegasus/Tenolog
-A base from "Base 10" counting bricks.

I just figured that much of chemical production is mixing chemicals in precise amounts under pressure/heat/etc, and moving the result into a storage tank. I let that guide my imagination along with some consideration for making the top of the tower function as a protected lookout in-game.

Here's another one from assorted toys and junk

This one has no rhyme or reason. It just looks futuristic and cool and blocks line of sight.

You can see more about them here
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2014/09/more-terrain-small-chem-plant.html
and here
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2014/06/sci-fi-industrial-buildings-from-old.html

Lastly, here's a post with two other industrial/chemical terrain pieces.  These two have pre-paint and finished pictures so you can see how they were assembled.
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2015/06/more-toybashing-creepy-crawlers-and-egg.html

« Last Edit: December 31, 2015, 01:20:58 PM by eilif »

Offline katie

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2016, 07:04:10 PM »
Another option might be to look at Hirst Arts -- they do a couple of moulds of pipework/cylinders and some "machinery parts" ones.

There's some photos on the page about how to construct complete "sections" of terrain from them.

Offline eilif

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2016, 03:19:02 AM »
that is great stuff.

That base ten brick bought back a flood of memories of tiny scurv at school. If you are a teacher use those things cus they bloody well work.

I note you used bits of the chemical plant set (I had the refinery which I think is same stuff rebranded.) I would recommend the OP tracks that set down as it seems to be the go to set for industrial gribbles.

That big orange thing looks like a mining separator. The sort of thing they use to extract gold from alluvial sands.

Once againm jolly good show all round with your work.

Thanks for the kind words!
Per your description, I've decided to rename the orange tank a "mining separator". 

I also 100% agree about the Chemical-Plant/Refinery kit. It was/is a bit hard to track down in some areas, but it's ace for industrial models. It can become samey if you use it for entire models, but when used to add specific details to models, it looks great and one box will go along way.  I'd say that around half my sci-fi terrain has something (or alot of somethings) from that one box.

Another option might be to look at Hirst Arts -- they do a couple of moulds of pipework/cylinders and some "machinery parts" ones.

There's some photos on the page about how to construct complete "sections" of terrain from them.
If you've got the interest and time for casting, then Hirst arts is a great options. I've never cast any myself, but I've used tons of their bits for greebling up my creations.   It's pretty ingenious the many ways they can be used. As you say, the website and the Hirst forums are packed with support, tutorials and tips for getting the most out of those molds.

Offline Lfseeney

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2016, 06:17:34 AM »
I like Walt's stuff here as well.

http://impudentmortal.com/product-category/terrain/28mm-terrain/industrial/

I do 15mm but he has some great stuff in 28mm as well.


Offline Etranger

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2016, 08:23:14 AM »
I've got some of the Ainsty 28mm stuff that I use for 15mm, successfully IMHO.





Other bits and pieces are GZG, scratchbuilt or castings from Hirst arts moulds. Figures are GZG 'cops'.
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Offline Rhoderic

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Re: Opinions on Ainsty's Refinery range?
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2016, 09:29:43 PM »
I'll just resuscitate my own thread for a bit to say this:

I just watched the 2009 Star Trek movie again, and there are some scenes early on of the shipyard where the Enterprise is being built - it looks a lot like a big old chemical plant. Very inspirational, I must say. For that matter, there is even a large part of the interior of the ship itself (later on in the film, when Kirk and Scotty beam aboard without permission) that looks like it could be very successfully imitated with select pieces from the Ainsty Refinery range or another similar set of "chemical plant" type terrain.

So, this...






... could easily be both a sci-fi (space)shipyard or the inside of a big spaceship!

 

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