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Author Topic: Ideas for flags? (15th century mercenaries)  (Read 1171 times)

Offline Charlie_

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Ideas for flags? (15th century mercenaries)
« on: March 24, 2017, 10:40:39 PM »
Does anyone have any info or ideas on what sort of flags might be suitable for an English mercenary company of the mid-to-late 15th century?

My little project is going to be an English mercenary captain leading his company against various foes on the continent.
It's all going to be quite vague and thus flexible. The vast bulk of models will be 'neutral' and can be assigned to any faction. Flags and command groups will be painted up to denote nationalities and factions.
I'm vaguely thinking veterans of the 100 years war who stayed on in France when the rest of their countrymen were driven back home. Foes and employers can include the French, the Burgundians, the Germans and Swiss, the Calais garrison.... All good fun.

Anyway, I'm going to keep the captain himself a mysterious character or uncertain origins (Sir John Doe?). He claims to have been knighted, but who knows if that's the truth. I'll give him a coat of arms and thus a personal banner, but who knows if he has a legal right to it. Perhaps he is a bastard or younger son of some minor English noble? Or perhaps a commoner who rose through the ranks and invented his own back story?


So, flags....

My reading on the Wars Of The Roses shows me there were rules and such for flags and banners in England in this period. But looking at flags from the continent, in particular those of the Burgundians, Swiss and Italians... There is such a bewildering array of sizes, shapes and designs, some of them really quite bizarre, and there seems to be no universal system which covers all nations and armies..... I think I've decided that anything goes, particularly so when it comes to a mercenary company.

But if anyone has any info on flags used by such mercenary companies I'd be very interested.

I'm thinking one simple design would be nice, something all the units could carry. A cross of some sort? The cross of St George?
Or perhaps one more elaborate design for the whole company?

Hit me with ideas.

Offline Arlequín

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Re: Ideas for flags? (15th century mercenaries)
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2017, 01:21:56 AM »
I think you have some answers on your previous thread. My thoughts are...

There actually was a system of standards, we're just not entirely knowledgeable about its finer points; although continuity being what it is, the square infantry and pennon-tailed cavalry standards of the 16th century almost certainly began in the 15th. The system was fairly consistent across Western Europe too, with similar shapes and sizes, if not types of design.   

In 1473 the Burgundians had a large standard for the men at arms of a company, one pennant for its coustilier and mtd archers and a second one for the foot of the ordonnance. That would have changed when the division into squadrons came in, but a similar system would have been used within each. The Burgundian Ordonnance was copied from the French one originally and probably the shape and type of their standards were too. The incidence of arrows, or crossbows, or arquebus on the various standards pretty much designate what type of men stood under them.

The French only employed mercenaries/professionals on an individual basis after 1445 and they were paid directly by the crown, a system which broke the back of the old écorcheur captains, who had previously received the pay for their men. 

The red Cross of St. George was quite common across Europe, it was almost the universal badge of city crossbow societies in northern France and the Low Countries. Early German bunds used things like the 'bundschuh' or a cartwheel, things like that. You might opt for a one or two colour background, with a plough, sword, star, or other design like a saint or animal.

Sense of 'nation' was mostly an alien concept, you wore a national sign if you were being paid to do so. Scots in French service wore the white French cross, not their own St. Andrews one, as that would get them shot-up as Burgundians, who wore it in a variety of colours. A mercenary company would be expected to use the design of who they were employed by to save 'friendly-fire' incidents.

You can of course please yourself and certainly your plans will require a more neutral than specific scheme. I suggest avoiding any national symbols and picking something not in use by anyone. You might even ask why an English mercenary would feel obliged to carry 'his' national symbol, given that he was technically outlaw if he was not serving at his king's or one of his captains' pleasure. Charles the Bold had to get leave from Edward IV to recruit English soldiers in 1475, as did his widow in 1478 and 1480.

I would assume then that an English mercenary would indeed wish to disguise his origins and identity if he ever planned of returning to England, rather than displaying his nationality. Word still got around in Medieval Europe and how often do you travel several hundred miles today and bump into someone you know?

Offline Charlie_

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Re: Ideas for flags? (15th century mercenaries)
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2017, 01:07:26 PM »
There actually was a system of standards, we're just not entirely knowledgeable about its finer points; although continuity being what it is, the square infantry and pennon-tailed cavalry standards of the 16th century almost certainly began in the 15th. The system was fairly consistent across Western Europe too, with similar shapes and sizes, if not types of design.

What about the Francs-Archers? I've come across fork-tailed flags supposedly for Francs-Archers (thus infantry), like this one....

   

Quote
The red Cross of St. George was quite common across Europe, it was almost the universal badge of city crossbow societies in northern France and the Low Countries. Early German bunds used things like the 'bundschuh' or a cartwheel, things like that. You might opt for a one or two colour background, with a plough, sword, star, or other design like a saint or animal.

Ah perhaps I'll avoid the cross for my mercenaries then, and go for a simple design like you mentioned. 'Company of the Star', 'Company of the Lion' or something....

Offline Arlequín

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Re: Ideas for flags? (15th century mercenaries)
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2017, 03:55:06 PM »
Well even today battalion/regimental colours are square and companies have single or swallow-tail pennants, depending on the army. Other side of the coin are the square 'cornets' that cavalry troops carried for a time in and around the 17th Century, while tailed pennants and guidons were used before and after.

As I said the finer points are a bit of a mystery, but there is a vague system if you keep looking at contemporary illustrations... or it might just be the imaginings of a ravaged mind caused by the same.

'Company of whatever' seems fine and the naming of them I imagine was not unlike the naming of pubs before names got silly. Company of the Red Lion sounds better than that of the 'Slug and Lettuce'.

Mary Gentle did an impressive reconstruction (imo) of a mercenary company at the start of her novel Ash. The book went downhill fast for me after that, but her depiction of them felt quite authentic, female captain aside and it has stayed with me for some years since.   

 

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