Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Weird Wars => Topic started by: atomic ray on February 02, 2009, 03:10:54 AM
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I have seen little in the way of movement to filling the Japan side of the house...
...how do you or would you like to see the Japan of WWWII?
Me?
I like the idea of ceramic armor, classic look with near bullet proof results...
I like the kamikaze take another direction, simple bag over head gas mask connected to special "vapor" tanks on their backs...augmented speed, endurance, strength, no fear...
I like the idea of battery powered weapons...electrified swords, static grenades, lightning guns....
I like the DNA experimental side of the house with aqua-men...gills, webbing, insulation, bio luminescence...
and I like troopers that are goaded on with area field affect weapons...great fogs of poison that the Japanese are immune to but that choke and blind the enemy...
How about you?
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All good ideas. It's always so hard to come up with good WWWII ideas for non-Germans. You might also want to look at the Kamikazi spirit as the perfect way to get those iffy inventions into play.
Got a super serum that has possible lethal side-effects? Get a Kamikazi.
Need somebody willing to carry that weapon that could explode if you look at it funny? Kamikazi again.
Hey, who can you get to carry that ancient artifact of evil that corrupts and destroys its wielder? Hmmmm..a kamikazi might work.
You also have a long tradition of martial arts both real and mythological to draw from.
Ninjas are an easy one...
What about enhanced Sumos who are both fast moving and pack on extra injury absorbing pounds?
How about a new breed of Samurai who wield your hi-tech weapons?
Maybe they can call on the spirits of Thunder, Lightning and Rain to battle the foes of their land?[/li][/list]
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Well, I have thought about it and started getting some models (like the urban war sumatori, some ninja's converted with the addition of ww2 weapons (grenades, sniper rifle, pistols,...), a conversion of a hero in mystical armour (samurai mini with some ww2 touches added (ww2 helmet, boots, etc...), zombies of course (though I've only completed one at this point), a sufficiently retro looking mobile suit (it *is* a japanese fixation after all) for conversion,...
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For WW2 Era Japanese, I try to think of traditional Japanese beliefs mixed with Japanese technological obsessions at the time. As such, I tend to avoid things like giant robots and mechs, which are definitely products of the atomic age in Japanese culture.
What I'd like to see would be things focusing on Japan's obsession during the period with chemical experimentation and racial purity, maybe even some atomic stuff, mixed with traditional Japanese views. For example, Brigade Games makes some absolutely spectacular "German Spectres" in their own line; I'd love to see Japanese Spectres, as the Japanese had (and continue to have) a strong cultural belief in ghosts, spiritualism, etc.
Perhaps some Samurai types in gas masks wouldn't be out of place, but you could just as easily take the SNLF field gear (which was supposed to involve landing with gas masks worn), throw in some things like the folding arisakas used by the Paratroopers, etc.. and get some good looking stuff.
Zombies would be great too. What about a Zombie tank with crew?
There's also an argument for gigantic tanks. The Japanese were fascinated with tanks after the First World War; the first ones designed were mostly multi-turreted monstrosities (by Japanese standards), but they performed very poorly in China, and so were withdrawn, and Japanese tank design from that point tended to focus on light vehicles with low ground pressure, light armor, etc.
What if they stuck with their original direction of thought?
It's not that I don't like robots, it's just that I like to try to focus on the things that might have been prevalent at the time.
Just a few thoughts on my part. I did propose some Weird War II Japanese Zombies to the Wargames Factory "Liberty and Union League" a couple months ago, but they have yet to be posted.
-Doc
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I use ninja,a before in games.and warzone stuff as elite japanense soilders.
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Check out the Sumatori from Arcane Miniatures:
http://www.arcaneminiatures.co.uk/triad-miniatures.asp
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They are the Urban War ones I mentionned. :)
They are perfect for WWW2.
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The Japanese are one of the Major Powers and will have releases in Pulp War II late 2009 and early 2010. I don't want to give too much away, but they do have a strong Supernatural Faction at least as good as the Germans if not better IMHO. Access to mythological equivilents of vampires, weres-, Spirits and Demons, plus unique units.
As far as the mecha being an atomic age phenomena; I agree that is mainly the case, but allowing Germans and other major powers to field Mechanised Walkers and not the Japanese would be wrong, so they will have a fully developed range Mechanised Walkers, and Body armour for their infantry.
The big tank concept was developed to various stages by the major powers so the hypothetical Oi Super heavy Tank will also be making an appearance along with the other types of AFV they were developing.
Good thread with interesting ideas.
Oliver
MAJIC Miniatures
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What about picking up the Jin Roh Panzercop / Panzerjaeger idea and develop it further into a direction more fitting to the traditional stuff? Like Ninjas with MG42?
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I'm stumped. Maybe a Votoms mech in 1/60, Samurai and or Ashigaru in gas masks. I think I could convert some warzone figures, especially Mishima. Plastic Trenchers might be cool.
Maybe an Alterra1 Mech.
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For mecha, the Sakura Wars machines are pretty good for retro mecha. They may look a bit old fashioned by WW2 standards but might do the trick. You couls also look at some of the smaller Mobile Suit Gundam Mecha, specifically the Zaku model that has a cyclops like mono-optic, and a less streamlined shape than most mecha.
Another thought that comes to mind on a non-mecha front, while they are free-flowing for the moment, is infected peasants. A variation on the zombie concept, you could have the less motivated civilian population turned into frothing rage zombies capable of spreading their disease.
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As a fan of the actual sport since about seven years back, I don't know about the idea of enhanced sumo wrestlers. To me it seems like rather the same thing as fielding a WWWII British force with "enhanced cricket players", only difference being that it seems cool because of the cultural distance.
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I think the main distinction here is the physical presence. A sumo is a powerful figure. He's a mountain of meat muscle and otherwise and is already something larger than life. Even in his own culture he is a real superstar and imbued with all manner of mystique.
I don't think the same could be said about a critcket player, golfer, baseball player or the like.
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Maybe that's true. I'm just used to viewing them as athletes.
Keep in mind though, that as you go back in history, the average weight of the sumo wrestler goes down. A typical rikishi in 1940 would not have been quite as fat as a typical rikishi today. And even today, there's a lot of rikishi who are nowhere near as bulky as the typical western conception would make them out as. Mass media just has a tendency to focus on the really fat ones (although in fairness, this isn't new - even in the old woodblock printings, all you see is the exceptionally fat rikishi). Sumo and judo were more-or-less the same sport back in the day.
Ultimately, I guess it works, given the zaniness of the WWWII setting.
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One word... Oni.
We use them in our Amazing War Stories book. And we have a new scenario with them coming in Thrilling Expeditions Quarterly #1.
Think Japanese super soldier with a distinctive demonic appearance.
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The question is are you going for pulp horror or pulp comicbook. I prefer pulp horror. To make it really work in a weird war it should be just enough to make things bad for regular troops without getting to far out.
I would avoid things like super sumos, they are a little to comic book for my taste and even ninja (people seem unable to write ninja rules that aren't driven by the more modern super powers mind set.) Also avoid too much supernatural or it loses its impact.
Light walkers for jungle fighting are good, also air/land or aquatic hybreds might also have a place. Chemical weapons would be dead on, zombies from a gas attack like V gas in SOTR would work. Kamakasi units would be ok, but just don't go overboard or the game could quickly stop being fun for everyone.
My main point is, use japanes troops with a touch of weird and not the kitchen sink approach that a lot of people seem to go for.
For my personal taste I like SOTR with its approach to the weird, lots of options but not over done. AEWWII is a good system but for me has so much weird stuff that its losing the WWII feel.
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Metal magic Yoyodyne?
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Yay - WWW2 Japanese!
To some extent it depends on who and where you are going to fight with your Japanese - against the Yanks and Commonwealth troops in the jungle or on Pacific islands, or against Soviets in Manchuria.
For jungle/islands I would want Japanese in standard light kit, possibly with converted weapons - LMGs cut down as assault rifles?
For Manchuria it would have to be greatcoats. If Westwind did separate Jap heads I would use these on Pig Iron militia figures.
I think the other postings on this thread have covered the obvious weapons/troop types. However, these are my own thoughts:
Chemical weapons - definately. Perhaps V-gas technology provided by the Germans?
Walkers - these would be perfect for the Jungle and add a touch of manga style. My personal choice would be to use the MaK Gradiator 4-legged walkers.
Oni - if the Germans can use creatures from European myths, than its only fair that Japanese demons can make an appearance. A few manufacturers now do suitable figures. The Amazon Miniatures website lists some nice demon types with guns in the Chinatown range.
Kamikazi - a distinct possibility. However, with a prolonged war this would be a waste of manpower, especially since the Japanese would have their own (or inherited German) advanced technology weapons to counter the US or Soviet armour. A massed assault preceeded by fanatics with explosives would be an interesting twist. Also, the fanatics need not have to do suicidal charges, but could sneak up on ememy positions wuth anti-armour/bunker weapons in advance of an assault (think of Vietmamese 'sappers' against US positions in 'Nam)
Snipers - these are a must. Maybe some armed with heavy anti-mech rifles
Korean 'colonial' troops - providing much-needed manpower (use Jap figures in 'historical' WW2 uniforms and equipment)
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The question is are you going for pulp horror or pulp comicbook. I prefer pulp horror. To make it really work in a weird war it should be just enough to make things bad for regular troops without getting to far out.
I would avoid things like super sumos, they are a little to comic book for my taste and even ninja (people seem unable to write ninja rules that aren't driven by the more modern super powers mind set.) Also avoid too much supernatural or it loses its impact.
Light walkers for jungle fighting are good, also air/land or aquatic hybreds might also have a place. Chemical weapons would be dead on, zombies from a gas attack like V gas in SOTR would work. Kamakasi units would be ok, but just don't go overboard or the game could quickly stop being fun for everyone.
My main point is, use japanes troops with a touch of weird and not the kitchen sink approach that a lot of people seem to go for.
For my personal taste I like SOTR with its approach to the weird, lots of options but not over done. AEWWII is a good system but for me has so much weird stuff that its losing the WWII feel.
I am having a hard time figuring out where the line in is in this post. So, sumo warriors of great ability and ninjas are too comic book, but animal hybrids, chemical spewing troops and zombie gas are okay? Somehow mechanical walker machines are okay bit things drawn from actual JApanese culture don't make the cut?
I guess it all comes down to what you are looking for in your own games.
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Interesting you should mention this. I was just thinking that the big sumos with the gasmasks and hoses might make good figs to use for the Oni.
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Oliver (et all) -
I certainly don't object to the Japanese having access to technology similar to other "Weird War II" Armies, but in my opinion, the main problem with Mechs and Walkers is that most are not things that would have been conceived in period Science-Fiction. Instead, they tend to be takeoffs from Anime or Gearkrieg. I'd desperately like to see some of the conjectural technology of the 20s, 30s, and 40s actually show up in a game rather than a Battlemech with rivets, if you follow me. It's one of the reasons I was thrilled to see that AE WW2 is doing the "Tumbleweed" tank, right from a cover of an early 1930s Popular Science magazine, as a vehicle.
I certainly think that mechs, walkers, and giant robots are cool, don't get me wrong, but I would like to see some uniquely period items for the Japanese. Ghosts, Super Tanks, Chemical Weapons, Kamikaze troops, Onis, that kind of thing, in addition to the stock and trade most consumers come to expect from typical WWW2 games.
-Doc
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A while back, I made a Weird Japan addition to the WWW2 showcases, with some suggestions for miniatures: http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/wwwjapan.htm (http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/wwwjapan.htm)
Of course, these need to be complemented by a backbone of regular WW2 Japanese:
http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/ww2japan.htm (http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/ww2japan.htm)
And since I'm getting my links out, I'll show these conversions again:
WW2 Japanese zombie (TAG body + Spyglass head):
(http://blogsimages.skynet.be/images_v2/002/646/777/20080927/dyn007_original_711_306_pjpeg_2646777_7dd3fb3bd7d5055485e9a96cde5fe0bb.jpg)
WW2 ninja (Perry ninjas + TAG weapons)
(http://blogsimages.skynet.be/images_v2/002/646/777/20080830/dyn003_original_651_345_pjpeg_2646777_310cc64e8fb45b2af16968c89b36d749.jpg)
(http://blogsimages.skynet.be/images_v2/002/646/777/20080830/dyn003_original_668_338_pjpeg_2646777_3c0f71b17c8e93994ff02659a3eb72e4.jpg)
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heres a couple of pics from the game I ran at mil. con XI it was american,british,and russia vs germans and japanese.here some of the japanese
(http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc311/gympostal123/johspics352.jpg)
(http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc311/gympostal123/johspics353.jpg)
(http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc311/gympostal123/johspics356.jpg)
(http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc311/gympostal123/johspics357.jpg)
the ninja were in the building yes that was a russian bear.
john
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Nice looking game!
Good to see kids at the table... that means you're doing something right!
Or maybe... they are hostages... :o
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they enjoy to play time to time,they both are a little curse my girl was born on the day a local game store open up and my boy was born on june 6th.So both been around for there whole lifes.
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While watching Ray Rivers Aeronef project (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=9250.0[/url) and Sinewgrab's Aeronef project (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=9346.0;topicseen), I started envisioning a world where the pacific theatre (or hell, all theatres) used light Aeronef's instead of fighter and bomber aircraft.
Perhaps enclosed turrets, and more modern machine guns, but still lightly armoured, and not "too fast".
I'm a big fan of the Battleground WWII system, and now I think I have a reason to try to work up some rules for Aeronef's in the skies of Weird WWII/Battleground WWII. I also have an excuse to build a couple aeronef's also ;) I'd been looking for one, without getting the VSF bug, although I think I'm catching it . . . . . . . . achoooooo . . . . . .
pardon me, does anyone have any of Doctor Tachyon's most excellent Sneezing, Hair Loss, and Limp Pickle tonic?
Links are 'bolded'
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There was an old board game that focused on a Pacific war in the early 30's with the US and Britain fielding dirigibles that launched aircraft like carriers, along the lines of the Akron.
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Rabbitz "Another flyer to add to the collection" (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=9480.0;topicseen) post has a great Japanese Aeronef in 28mm.
I've started drawing up plans for an American WWWII 'nef. Part of me thinks that a couple Stuart turrets on the front deck, and a quad fifty on the back deck would be a reasonable armament, with a couple 'waist' guns for defending against aircraft. Would airplanes have advanced as rapidly technologically as they did, if 'nefs were patrolling the skies?
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Pointless Japanese Stuff for my (and others) Amusement
Warning: this isn't NSFW but its a little grim so if a background involving slave labour and tests based on Unit 731 isn't your cup of tea pass this up.
Introduction
Japan has suffered in recent years. Her fleets lie broken, her armies are scattered and even the precious homeland has been invaded. With weapons of the flesh increasingly proving useless the Japanese turn to the fringe of modern technology. In Japanese scientific establishments across Korea, China and Thailand hideous experiments are conducted by the Series 7 groups. Slaves provide the labour and act as test subjects. Hideous noises erupt from bamboo shacks and concrete temples. Combined with technology provided by their German allies the Japanese are creating a new and more horrific army. The allies might well invade in their so called Operation Olympic but not one ally with leave their island...alive that is!
Akabeko
Japanese volunteers, mad kamikaze who sought death by science than through the burning wreckage of a suicide plane, these men have been experimented on using technology originally tested on slaves to create a weapon of the soul. For a moment they stand stock still, silent like the flower petal that drops. Then their body moves again, their face becomes animated and somewhere an enemy drops ashen faced to the ground to convulse, shake and die. Akabeko fight not with rifles or tanks but with their souls, freeing their spirits to attack the spirit of the enemy and rend it. These spirits cross the battlefield finding targets and duelling with their spirits in great spiritual battles until one or the other dies. Visible in their red paint these men fear no enemy for in any tank or plane is a man and that man has a spirit that can die...
Ten Plates
The horrors suffered by the slaves of the Japanese is heart-rending and even after death it continues. Some slaves are baited, tortured and abused until death whereupon their spirits are captured in giant spiritual conductors, well-like shafts lined with iron rods. Each rod contains the anger and horror of a single dead spirit. In battle these rods are issued to Japanese soldiers who throw them like grenades. Any enemy who is touched by the rod is suddenly haunted by a shrieking ghost. Pursued by voices and screams it is only a matter of time until that soldier commits suicide or is driven mad whilst in battle their performance becomes erratic, they take to startling at any thing and the mind becomes clouded. Truly the rods the Japanese call 'Ten Plates' are no civilized weapons...
Oniwaka
Children may be the future but in the ruddy dying days of Imperial Japan they are a monstrosity, the greatest adherents to old horrors and horrible ideologies. Much like Nazi Germany so to has Imperial Japan taken to recruiting mere boys, teenagers, and sending them to die. Equipped with crude anti-tank weapons and surplus weapons the Oniwaka are most effective in urban areas, appearing wild haired from their hiding places to attack with warrior screams that crack with the onset of puberty...
Otsuyu
As the foreign soldiers walk cautiously through the blazing war-cracked landscape of Japan some hear a call and see a woman standing near the shadows. Trapped in emotion they follow, weaving through hostile streets looking for that woman again until she stops, turns and says a single word, 'Now'. The trap is sprung and the foreign soldier killed, by a booby trap he ran into in his haste, by an enemy waiting in hiding. The 'Otsuyu' is an iron rod containing the spirit of a dead Japanese woman, able to kill even beyond death with their siren looks and irresistible entreaties.
Zennyo
There is the rippling sound of water being shook off, the light step and the dry thump of something scaly that for only a moment drags across the ground. A Zennyo is coming. Sleek and swift the Zennyo is a modified Japanese soldier, though rumour has it even women are accepted in these dark days, whos body has patches of rough scaly skin culminating in a long and sinuous tail. Capable of breathing through neck gills and able to kill with the whiplash tail A Zennyo is a consummate guerilla, able to emerge from the wet night and strike fear into Allied units who thought they were safe. After all they cleared the town...just not the ponds and lakes!
Yurei
In days like these not every death in Imperial Japan is peaceful. Series 7 units have, after use of a small version of the so-called 'Bell' devise given by the Germans, managed to contact the spirits of the many dead of the war so far. Now the dead of Imperial Japan appear again. Their hair hangs from under their helmets, items of clothing are bleached white and they seem almost to float in the air, moving without muscles. By their sides hang two balls of light of blue, green or purple. In battle they move stately towards the enemy before raising their ghost lights which flash towards the enemy setting them ablaze with ghostly spirit flames that water cannot extinguish.
Yuki-onna
From the snowy mountains of Japan came the inspiration for this horror. The most beautiful women of Japan transformed by Imperial Science into monstrosities. Tiny ice blue cables pierce the lips and skin, threading through the body, culminating in the mouth from which fierce blasts of cold are emitted. At war the Yuki-onna gets close before opening her mouth and blowing a ghastly cloud of the cold. Skin is pierced by ice crystals, weapons and helmets stick to skin until finally the body freezes. Tall glassy ice-corpses populate whole villages in invaded Japan, the most visible sign of Japan's mad desire to win.
More available if anyone wants and if my brain re-energises.
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I certainly think that mechs, walkers, and giant robots are cool, don't get me wrong, but I would like to see some uniquely period items for the Japanese. Ghosts, Super Tanks, Chemical Weapons, Kamikaze troops, Onis, that kind of thing, in addition to the stock and trade most consumers come to expect from typical WWW2 games.
At least a few of the above things are already rumored for when AE-WWII gets to the Pacific theater. In the background, the Japanese have already bombed San Francisco with chemical and biological weapons that lead to... unexpected consequences...
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I always thought it was cool that squad leaders carried katana, so in a fictional fantasy sci fi ww2 Id like to see soem samurai style warriors, maybe camo but certainly armoured and with swords.
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hey who actualy makes Jap's for ww2 anyways?
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hey who actualy makes Jap's for ww2 anyways?
See them all here:
http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/ww2japan.htm (http://wk.frothersunite.com/sc/pulp/ww2japan.htm)
;)
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And, as noted, AE-WWII will be doing them once they work on the Pacific theater, which will likely be after they fill out Europe.