Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Colonial Adventures => Topic started by: Plynkes on 30 May 2009, 06:41:37 PM
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(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y40/Plynkes/RasLMG.jpg)
Ethiopian Chief with Light Machine Gun is all the caption says. Not much of a gun expert myself, and the photo isn't all that it could be. I was thinking maybe a Hotchkiss Mark I (the LMG, not the tripod Hotchkiss) like the Brits used in the Great War? I'm certainly not sure, though. A BAR? (can't see a magazine). The photo is so abominably indistinct.
Any other ideas from the gang?
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Really hard to tell from the picture, but it does look more like a BAR to me than a Hotchkiss. The stock doesn't look right to me for a Hotchkiss and also how he's holding it on the front.
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I would go with a BAR too,
if it was the Hotchkiss, there would be a strip feed on one side, and it has a bipod too.
Looks just like a posed shot, with no actual mag on the gun.
Askari minis do a version of this figure, but he appears to be firing a rifle.
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Well I wouldn't take absence of strip feed and bipod as evidence of it being one or the other, as BARs came with bipods, too, and a strip feed can be missing in a posed shot just the same as a magazine can. :)
But I certainly am prepared to bow to other folks knowledge regarding the shape of the guns concerned.
Thanks, chaps!
I'm looking to convert one of Duruttti's fine figures into an LMG gunner, and was wondering what my options were. I don't know whether they had Lewis guns or not, but they will probably be getting one and will have to like it, as I happen to have one lying around. :)
But does anyone sell BARs as separate weapons?
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But does anyone sell BARs as separate weapons?
I know Darkson Designs has a blister of American WWII Airborne, which includes a BAR. It would be attached to an arm (arms are generally separated from the torso for their mini's so you can mix and match). Not sure how they would scale with the mini you want to attach it to though.
http://store.valueweb.com/servlet/darksondesigns/-strse-69/American-Airborne/Detail (http://store.valueweb.com/servlet/darksondesigns/-strse-69/American-Airborne/Detail)
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It is really hard to tell but the Magazine well looks indented and the barrel appears to be free floating, both of which eliminate a BAR. The barrel looks like that of a Bren gun. It could be Italian, Czech or French. I'm stumped.
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But does anyone sell BARs as separate weapons?
The Assault Group do; http://www.theassaultgroup.co.uk/store/product.php?productid=299&cat=27&page=1
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OK
now think its not a BAR, but possibly a French Fusil Mitrailleur M24/29 (Chatelerault) Its the bit where he's holding it at the front that made me think it could be this.
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That's no BAR, but there is a lovely 28mm BAR in the newish Reaper Chronoscope "20th century weapons" pack. For some unimaginable reason they have added a carrying handle to the top of the weapon, but it is easy to snip off.
http://www.reapermini.com/OnlineStore/century%20weapons/latest/50030
second from the right, folded bipod under the barrel.
Chick
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Phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range?! (Sorry - just saw Terminator Salvation.)
It could be a BAR but I think it's more likely some kind of French LMG.
That Reaper BAR that Chick linked to is pretty cool. Cannon Fodder Minis also makes an awesome 28mm BAR: http://www.canfodmins.com/
(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t20/ted_arlauskas/Flintlocksetc.jpg)
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I'd agree with Durutti
http://world.guns.ru/machine/mg53-e.htm
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Looking at the way he is holding it, there might be a pistol grip that he just does not know how to use. That would open up a whole group of possibilities.
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Just to be contrary... ;)
I do think it is a BAR. He is covering the magazine with his right hand. And yes, there is a bit of separation between the upper and lower barrels at the end of the weapon.
(http://www.acepilots.com/ww2/bar-m1918.jpg)
Who knows! :)
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I still think it's a BAR as well, but his hand isn't far enough forward to be covering the clip. I'm thinking this is just a "posed" shot and whoever handed him the weapon removed the clip for everyone's safety. Judging by his firing stance he's not much of a shooter anyway...
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If you look closely you can see where the top barrel becomes thicker towards the end, it just catches the light, like a BAR, however there is no grip on the lower barrel like a BAR would have. If they made BARs without this grip it could be one, if they always had the grip it can't be a BAR. Does anyone know if the grip was optional?
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Could be a BAR, a Fusile-mitrailleur mle 1924/29 or a czech Kulomet vz. 26. In both latter cases the magazine would be missing.
I don't think it's the ost obvious LMG for ethiopia, the Breda, but from this angle it might be one. Then the lower barrel isn't a barrel but a bipod.
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but there is a lovely 28mm BAR in the newish Reaper Chronoscope "20th century weapons" pack. For some unimaginable reason they have added a carrying handle to the top of the weapon, but it is easy to snip off.
http://www.reapermini.com/OnlineStore/century%20weapons/latest/50030
second from the right, folded bipod under the barrel.
Chick
Don't think it's a BAR, the pistol grip is missing and why should they make such an obvious mistake with the carriying handle?
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A BAR doesn't have a pistol grip, Poliorketes (except the Swedish versions which do). Though I'm not sure about that model Chick linked to either, the magazine looks a bit off for a BAR.
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Picture's too dark for me to tell.
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A BAR doesn't have a pistol grip, Poliorketes (except the Swedish versions which do). Though I'm not sure about that model Chick linked to either, the magazine looks a bit off for a BAR.
You're right, I had a pick of a FN licensed version on my lap which got the grip. My fault.
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Regarding the Reaper weapons pack, I've got six of the little mothas in the lead, and the second from the left is supposed to represent a BAR. Everything matches well with the third BAR photo posted above.
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I'm late to the party, as usual. When considering BARs, don't forget that the Belgian M-1930/Type D, produced under license, also had a pistol grip:
(http://www.helstongunsmiths.com/shop/images/Browning-7.92.jpg)
Some M-1930s *were* provided to Ethiopia. Just sayin'...
Allen
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Its no BAR look closely at the light gray grip just in front of the trigger. This grip is located in the exact spot a BAR magazine would be housed, just below the receiver. I believe its a French MAC M. 1924/29. This is clearly a posed picture without the magazine in place.
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I think it might be a Fusil Mitrailleur "Lewis" mle 1924 without magazine.
Don't think that it is a BAR.
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http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20francaise/artisans%20c%20d/a%20chatellerault%20fm%2024%2029%20a%20fr%20gb.htm
I thought it could be a Breda form certain angles, but convinced it's a Chatelerault.
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Yup, could be. I'm now 50/50 on the Lewis and the FM 24/29.
Given the huge numbers of Lewis guns I'd go for the probability that its a Lewis ... and having said that I realise that it will be something entirely different!
Alan
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It's not an FM 24/29. The barrel of an FM 24/29 is the same size along it's length. The gun in the picture's barrel is thicker towards the back. You can see the sun catching were it widens, just in front of the end of the gray handgrip.
I still think it's a BAR, and the gray 'handgrip' I think is a cover over were the magazine goes to keep out sand or dust. It seems to be rippled, like a cloth.
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The "rippled gray handgrip" look like the background to me… :?
I think we will never know for sure what kind of gun this is, but I would go with aecurtis and say it’s a Belgian M-1930…
BTW did we know if BAR were provided to Ethiopia in the 30’s?
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The "rippled gray handgrip" look like the background to me…
I'm seeing the same thing. It appears to be in the distance.
OK, where'd you find this pic, Plynkes?
Allen
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The relevant Osprey.
By the way, if one is after colour plates for uniform details and is too skinny to buy whole books, on their website Osprey has started posting links to Google Books that show off quite a few of the plates from each book. Not all of the plates from the book (yet still more than with Amazon's "Look Inside" feature), but one might get lucky with what one is after.
http://books.google.com/books?id=12dNTf2Qr1sC&pg=PA28&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=5 (http://books.google.com/books?id=12dNTf2Qr1sC&pg=PA28&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=5)
Jolly nice of them, what? Maybe they always did this, but I only just noticed.
Anyway, thanks to everyone for all the input. Though we don't seem much closer to knowing than when we started, I'm sure we've all had fun arguing about it. :)
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The relevant Osprey.
Huh. I should have thought of that. The photo is a bit more clear in my copy. I'm still thinking "à la Belge". But it's by no means conclusive.
It's also possible to "work around" the limited viewing pages in Google Books and Amazon, if you know that something is there. Sometimes.
Allen
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http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20francaise/artisans%20c%20d/a%20chatellerault%20fm%2024%2029%20a%20fr%20gb.htm
I thought it could be a Breda form certain angles, but convinced it's a Chatelerault.
I think you hit the nail on the head there. I knew it was French.