Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Maniac on June 23, 2020, 08:15:04 PM
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I posted up a brief fig comparison previously, but have since finished up a decent chunk of the figures in my lead pile.
I’ve been interested in the crusades for over 20+ years now and more recently (within the last 3-4 years) expanded out a little beyond the well known ones in the middle east and been reading a little about some of the less popularized ones that happened in Europe itself (such as the Albigensian or Baltic Crusades). The Baltic Crusades, in particular, are very interesting as the situation was not wholly dissimilar to the Middle East. You had small Christian territories, surrounded by ‘pagan’ peoples with a nearby semi hostile Christian power in the Orthodox Church. However, unlike Outremer, these were essentially successful. From Prussia through to Estonia lands were effectively conquered and converted. The military orders, too, were more successful (the Teutonic Knights for 200 years were largely successful until 1410’s debacle, but even then, they could be seen as successful as the opponents were all converted by this time).
Fall of 2019 saw a perfect chance to pick up some figs to model this interesting, politically complex, and dynamic landscape in the form of the Baron’s War Kickstarter. I picked up a bevy of foot knights and troopers to add to various plastic and metal kits and got to painting work in February. Thanks to the virus causing widespread lockdown, I’ve managed a relatively decent clip building, converting, and painting a sizable force of models.
I chose earlier in the time period, circa 1220-1300ish as the arms and armor is more appealing, and the frontier was less defined. As most of the warfare took place in late fall to early spring, I’ve elected to base the figs with a feeling of early snows in autumn enabling a raid prior to full snow pack. To assist with ideas for painting I picked up the Codex Manesse and a copy of the Zurich Wappenrolle to look up arms for various German and Swiss towns or individuals. This added a lot of character and gave me a good excuse to convert some figs to capture the German penchant for flashy head gear on some of the figures.
First up some of the mounted cavalry:
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/6/23/1066565_sm-.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1066565-.html)
Left to Right: Fireforge, Conquest, Fireforge, Conquest, Baron’s War, Gripping Beast x4
The Conquest figs and the Fireforge are, in my opinion, the way to go for cavalry. Baron’s War figs are ludicrously expensive in this area, and the two plastic sets offers so much more in terms of variation. Gripping Beast is really showing its age as a range, the sculpts are chunky and generally have a lot of flash/miscast issues.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/5/26/1062306_sm-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1062306-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.html)
Left to Right: Fireforge, Fireforge
Here I did an overall commander and a banner bearer, with corresponding foot models to be used in games where their mounts can be ‘killed’. This also marked a first for me in using thin brass sheets to make my flags. I found it very fiddly when trying to mate the strips that went around the haft of the pole. It made for some nice, sturdy flags, but was a real pain to work with.
It wouldn’t be a crusade force without a bevy of foot knights, plus they look so good when painted up. It is perhaps less well known that the crusaders learned to use foot knights to bolster the ranks of their infantry. In the first crusade many knights lost their horses and fought on foot and this would be adopted as a normal form of war in the middle east. In Northern Europe, the heavy snows, woods, and difficult terrain would have suited this as well, and I’ve included such models in my force.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/5/26/1062305_sm-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1062305-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.html)
Left to Right: Baron’s War, Baron’s War (modified with Victrix bits), Baron’s War, Baron’s War (modified with a green stuff cloak and modified Crusader helmet), Crusader (modified), Crusader (modified with Fireforge hammer and helmet), Baron’s War, Baron’s War
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/5/26/1062302_sm-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1062302-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.html)
Left to Right: Baron’s War, Baron’s War, Crusader (modified), Baron’s War (modified), Crusader, Crusader (modified), Baron’s War, Baron’s War
Overall, I’m extremely happy with how they turned out. The helmet modifications give the group a nice Germanic feel, and every knight utilizes a known coat of arms. It’s a lot of fun (to quote Lawrence of Arabia, “It is recognized that you have a funny sense of fun.”) to do a little research and come up with some heraldry that you can translate. I did this with my Norman milites and foot, and enjoyed extrapolating simplified versions for an earlier period, while this was perfect for delving into items that would give the force diversity of color while still maintaining a proper feel. (not all of the families were active at this time, but their family does cross as least some portion of the 1200s-1400s that the crusades occurred in).
Then to go with my knights I have some lowly foot soldiers. The first unit is painted up in the colors of the Bishop of Riga (to go with the good Bishop). Directly displaying his heraldry would have been outlawed but maintaining his colors would have done a lot to let you know in who’s authority they speak/fight.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/5/26/1062303_sm-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1062303-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.html)
Next is a motley group of spearmen, including a couple in the livery of some of the foot knights. The models for both units are all Baron’s War and sport a mix of spears and the pole arms from Footsore. Let me say I am unimpressed with said polearms. They are not very well done. They have far too many injection points and are very flimsy. Even with careful handling I can already see where at least two of them are going to break (and one did require it to have a new haft grafted on). I think Footsore would have been much better off casting the heads separate and giving them a socket to attach to their wire spears. I ultimately did this for a couple of the models in the second unit out the gate. A shame, as the models themselves are lovely (just don’t buy the polearms unless you plan on modifying them yourself).
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/6/23/1066563_sm-.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1066563-.html)
Here I have a unit of archers, drafted from the local converts to Christianity. I’ve chosen a simple, basic scheme that still tries to maintain unit coherency. Inspiration can come in many forms, and these were inspired by another painter’s Slavic levy, which was all in white/off-white kit. The Teutonic order regularly marched into battle with native support and putting these in as archers/woodsmen seemed to fit with a more ideal sense of the heavies being Europeans. All of the minis are from Footsore, out of their Viking range. The look and feel lined up well for a ‘poor’, somewhat lower tech local population.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/6/23/1066564_sm-.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1066564-.html)
Lastly is a unit of crossbowmen, again done in very simple colors, intended to be members of the Teutonic Order. Crossbows were an extremely popular weapon for the Christian forces, and at various times their sale to the pagans was banned. They gave a tactical advantage in the dense terrain and raiding warfare that was hard to pass up. Good punch and easy to use gives the potential for a tactical battlefield changer.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/5/26/1062301_sm-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1062301-Baltic%20Crusades%2C%20Crusades%2C%20Historical%2C%20Medieval.html)
These are all crusader miniatures and look to be a little ‘older’ than the rest of their late crusade range. They do the job very well, but some are a little chunky (much more so than the knights). Less flash and miscasting then Gripping Beast, and they do the job very well. Not a bad pickup at $13 (purchased when the exchange rates were low).
The army has been based so that it can be used for Saga or Fistful of Lead. I still have a unit of Teutonic Knights, a third mounted group of knights, and another body of foot spearmen to add to the mix. That will have to come with time though as work is starting to gear back up. Not bad for a fun, characterful force painted during down time due to the plague.
A closing shot of the entire force so far.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/6/23/1066562-.jpg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1066562-.html)
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Very nice. I too have a Northern Crusades army, but composed of Gripping Beast and some 1st Corps. I must have bought my Gripping Beast when the moulds were new, and in any event no plastics were available . I think your crossbowmen may actually be Gripping Beast not Crusader.
I want to build a Muscovite army to go against them a la Lake Peipus, but can't decide on figures. The Gripping Beast are IMHO one of their less impressive ranges, and I'm not exactly sold on the Fireforge stuff.
Anyone have any other bright ideas?
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Great stuff. Very impressive force to have put together in the time.
I like the colour and detail you have gone into on the knights - great to have found and used the actual heraldry.
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An impressive group! Great work!
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Great posting ..i;m finally painting up my Teutonic knights and allies .plus Lithuanian light cav.I bought all these figures in 2005 at Historicon...better late than never...a mix of Mirliton SG ,Gripping beast and Old Glory .Lots of fun to paint...still need more infantry (cross bows and such and Russians...god thing I;m retired.Love you paint jobs ..something to aspire to..
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Good stuff and a great use for the Footsore Baron's War mini's 8)
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Thank you for the kind comments.
@juergen I also have some Mirliton figs I am working on as Teutonic Knights. Mine aren't quite that old, but getting close. I'd like to look at some of their civilians at some point. They look like a nice range of models.
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That is a very pretty army! Also how in hell did you get everything in focus? :o
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That is a very pretty army! Also how in hell did you get everything in focus? :o
Thanks! It is quite possibly the one thing I like about the iPhone, the camera.
Here are my 4 Teutonic Knights to join the rest of the army.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/6/26/1066890_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1066890-.html)
Oh, and small correction, the Crossbowmen are indeed Gripping Beast. I mixed up the boxes at some point and for some reason thought they were Crusader
Left to right: Mirliton, Mirliton, converted Gripping Beast body with Fireforge Head, on a converted Conquest Games horse, Mirliton
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Nice work, I love the colourfulness of this force.
For a few years, I have wanted to do pretty much the same thing... but without your knowledge on the subject. I'll be watching this thread for inspiration and information.
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I've come back to this again with another unit of four knights. These are all Crusader Teutonic minis, and will be painted up as secular German knights. I think I said it above, but the actual Crusader knight/human figures are quite good. They look the business, are not overly chunky and not overly spindly. The only gripe is that the modular helmets are all too similar. I had to buy the banner bearer to add some variety and get the fourth horse (frankly three with horns that are extremely similar is a bit much).
The horses are okay, but have a few flaws. First, the saddles are not well designed to go with cloaked figures. The rear pommel/horn has to be cut down for every knight or they will not fit. Also, being metal, they have the standard flaw of of a chunky caprison. This is not a flaw on Crusader's part, but merely a comment on the flaw in metal horses. In this regard, plastic horses are definitely superior. At any rate, wip of the knights:
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/8/31/1075505_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1075505-.html)
Then my scratch pad for heraldry. Like I mentioned above, I cobbled this together from multiple sources, and formed my 'bible' for knightly color schemes. For this upcoming batch, I will be using; Whitmar (f. Bremen), Heidelberg (the black/white horned one), Flotow (f. Mecklenburg, 1247-1471), and Bydelsbach (f. Wurttemburg, 1368-1458). So not all from the exact period, but close and certainly families alive during the main period (1200-1410).
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/8/31/1075504-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1075504-.html)
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Very nice. I too really enjoy the Baltic Crusades. I wish there were more figures dealing with the native forces
such as Estonians, Livs and Prussian. Yes I know people will say "just use these" but I would some dedicated
figures for the period.
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Great stuff!
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Very impressive stuff 8) 8) 8)
I love delving deep into heraldry and it looks very much like you do too 8)
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Thank you for the kind words. A WIP of the four so far:
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/9/4/1076036_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1076036-.html)
Still some detail work, clean up, and basing. However they are coming along.
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Excellent work Maniac 8)
Great to see the project coming along nicely :)
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And they're done...
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/9/13/1077294_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1077294-.html)
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2020/9/13/1077295_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1077295-.html)
Fairly happy with how they turned out. Just 8 spearmen left to do now.
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Lovely work :-*
I just popped over to Dakka to have a look at the full size pictures and they didn't disappoint 8)
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These look amazing! :o
The northern crusades, by Eric Christiansen is a great read.
Although, after reading, you'll most likely want the pagan Northerners to smite your crusaders! lol
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I agree - the Eric Christiansen book is a good read
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I wasn't sure I was going to add any more to this range, but I recently picked up Steed and Steel. That led me to coming back to this project as I needed some mounted and unmounted knights for the various tourney games.
From left to right: Beauchamp, Codex Manesse Inspired, Marshall (fitting for Steed and Steel plus his desire to go crusading), Rust, and Witmar
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/7/1108138_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108138-.html)
For Rust I already had the foot knight done, and so added the mounted version. He is a conversion of a 1st Corps fig with Fireforge helmet and Conquest arm with lance. For Witmar, I already had the mounted version and so converted a Fireforge body with a 1st Corps head that I modified, plus some green stuff.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/7/1108136_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108136-.html)
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/7/1108137_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108137-.html)
I have some tents I will get some photos of, plus some tilt barriers. Then two more minis coming. One of Berkely, and one of Mallin.
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That gave me four more mounted, four more foot, and soon I will have two more foot and one more mounted figure. That will give folks a good cross sampling of schema they can choose from when rolling up a knight for Steed and Steel, plus meshes in nicely when playing Saga or FFoL.
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Lovely painting. :-* :-*
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Very nice work 8) 8) 8)
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The tents are almost done, and Berkely is done. I will say that I dislike the 'white' sections are actually clear approach of some decals. That ultimately led me to not use the decals for the caparison on the horse. I had accidentally already painted it red when I saw it needed to be white. Simple mistake on my part, but one I may have done anyways as I've not liked the clear approach with past decals.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/14/1108797_sm-.JPG) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108797-.html)
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/14/1108798_sm-.JPG) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108798-.html)
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/14/1108800_sm-.JPG) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108800-.html)
Then two of the four Archery butts are done, one mostly done, and one on the way.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/14/1108801_sm-.JPG) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1108801-.html)
The tilt is four sections of 9 inches each, just shy of the 40" recommended in Steed and Steel. Not sure it will make a huge difference in play, but we will see.
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Beautiful painting. It might just inspire me to paint something.
I particularly like the Yellow/green knight with the red helmet, it reminds me of a Timpo knight I had when I was young.
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Last of the knights, plus a bonus character. My son and I are reading Prince Valiant, and are in book 7 of the collected editions. So I couldn’t resist painting up Valiant using a bunch of spare parts.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/28/1110200_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1110200-.html)
The foot knight in yellow was previously done, and so I modified a 1st corps figure to match using a Conquest arm and some putty. Valiant is a mix of Conquest, GW, Fireforge, and Footsore.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2021/6/28/1110201_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1110201-.html)
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This is a great project. If you don’t already have it, the WRG pamphlet on the Northern Wars s very good. Several years ago, I did I think half a dozen DBA armies, Teutonic Knights, Poles, Lithuanians, etc. I used the long gone 15mm Feudal Castings.
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This is a great project. If you don’t already have it, the WRG pamphlet on the Northern Wars s very good. Several years ago, I did I think half a dozen DBA armies, Teutonic Knights, Poles, Lithuanians, etc. I used the long gone 15mm Feudal Castings.
Nice, I will have to look that up. It is such a rich and untapped period/setting for wargaming.
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Great stuff, lovely painting and vision.
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Thanks very much all, most kind of you.
I'm hoping that my club will enjoy Steed and Steel. It looks like a fun set of rules. I'll target a night when there are four or five of us, and have each player draft up 2 knights to run through a tourney consisting of Archery, Melee, Jousting. Should make for a good round of playing.
Then I'll have to write up a mini campaign for Saga to use my Crusaders vs Oesel Vikings.
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Great project and use of time during the pandemic. I've dabbled here and there with some medieval stuff and the colors and heraldry you're using with your miniatures make it look super interesting. A friend of mine really loves the Northern Crusades and Baltic history in general. Seeing a nice cohesive collection like this is some nice inspiration to get back on some of my neglected projects. Keep up the good work!
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I have to correct what I said. The pamphlet is produced by The Society of Ancients, not WRG.
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Great looking minis! What size round bases are you using? Look bigger than 40mm?
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Great looking minis! What size round bases are you using? Look bigger than 40mm?
I'm using metal fender washers. For infantry they are 1", or ~25mm, for the mounted figures they are 1.5", or ~38mm. I do have some command stands for other forces that are on 2" fender washers. Those take a little more work, and need a piece of card to cover the hole with.
So fairly close to a 40mm base.
I like the fender washers better as they are heavier, and make models less top heavy. Plus a cast on base covers the hole in the washer perfectly. Lastly, they magnetize, so if you want to use them on a tray....
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81MYC98AcRL._SL1500_.jpg)
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Oh, nice idea!
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So it has been quite a while since I built anything new for this force, but we finally made it back to 'Ol Blighty after the fun and joy of Covid disruptions to travel. After hitting our old stomping grounds, Wales, Hadrian's Wall, and Scotland I came home with an itch to add some Northern English types. I chose Eustace de Vesci (who had signed the Magna Carta), an unknown Northumbrian lord whose arms we saw in Hexham Abbey, de Warenne, and Meyners (the originators of clan Menzie, who we are descended from).
The banner dates from the 1300s, but I couldn't pass it up as I love the clan's motto. Shown here with one of the de Warenne brood.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2023/7/29/1172071_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1172071-.html)
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2023/7/29/1172072_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1172072-.html)
Then de Vesci and the bannerman is a crest we saw in Hexham Abbey.
(https://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2023/7/29/1172070_sm-.jpeg) (https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1172070-.html)