Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Back of Beyond => Topic started by: Phil Robinson on October 09, 2009, 06:33:12 PM
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Just a heads up if you are in the UK, HMV have this in the sale for £4.99 :)
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Thanks for the heads up, Phil. I've seen it on youtube but at a fiver I think I'll get a better quality version. It might be innaccurate sometimes and its certainly very biased towards one view but if you don't let this bother you it is an entertaining film. I especially like the fanciful charge (accompanied by brass band) scene.
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Had this for my birthday, and watched it the other night.
...and its certainly very biased towards one view...
I'll say! It's funny to see how modern Russia is rolling things back and painting the Tsarist days as some kind of lost paradise. It was all fancy balls, days at the beach and stolen kisses in the rain! It seems inconceivable that there could be a revolution in such a jolly place. Can't say I found old Kolchak to be a very sympathetic character in this picture, and I must admit I was starting to lose interest towards the end (and cheering for the Bolsheviks so they would hurry up and kill him).
The navy bits were amazing, though. I want a whole film of that. More messing about in boats and less sitting around on bloody trains next time, please.
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H It was all fancy balls, days at the beach and stolen kisses in the rain!
I agree
"Titanic" meets "Dr. Shivago"
the ship scenes were really good, but the rest.....
noticed Kolchak resembled putin in appearance and style?
and the Bolsheviks - the anonymous faceless enemy
no charismatic Trotzky, no plotting Lenin
and the Tsar - grandaddy is nice to You
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Can't say I found old Kolchak to be a very sympathetic character in this picture
Yeah, I chuckled when the Commisar got the little 'how many wives have you got?' dig in just before they shot him and...erm...threw his body through an ice crucifix. That might well have happened for all I know but it just seemed to cap the Kolchak, Russian Messiah' theme of the film. Even so, I watched it again on DVD today and you're quite right the naval scenes are excellent.
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Had this for my birthday, and watched it the other night.
I'll say! It's funny to see how modern Russia is rolling things back and painting the Tsarist days as some kind of lost paradise. It was all fancy balls, days at the beach and stolen kisses in the rain! It seems inconceivable that there could be a revolution in such a jolly place. Can't say I found old Kolchak to be a very sympathetic character in this picture, and I must admit I was starting to lose interest towards the end (and cheering for the Bolsheviks so they would hurry up and kill him).
The navy bits were amazing, though. I want a whole film of that. More messing about in boats and less sitting around on bloody trains next time, please.
Russians are, as I know them and as a whole, a very romantic people. Come to think of it, I perceive Germans the same way.
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I'll say! It's funny to see how modern Russia is rolling things back and painting the Tsarist days as some kind of lost paradise. It was all fancy balls, days at the beach and stolen kisses in the rain! It seems inconceivable that there could be a revolution in such a jolly place.
True, but then one can hardly blame them after seventy-odd years of stifling Soviet propaganda portraying the exact opposite! Regarding this nostalgia for Imperial days one of the more amusing pieces of news I've heard in relation to Russia was this (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/big-in-russia-the-prince-who-brings-the-tsar-back-to-life-733679.html) (actually I think the restoration of the Russian monarchy with Prince Michael at its head was a plot of a Freddie Forsyth book (?)).
Anyways, so for somebody gaming the RCW is The Admiral worth investigating then? Sounds rather turgid from the accounts here! Surely, though, from an aesthetic point-of-view it is of interest?
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...one can hardly blame them after seventy-odd years of stifling Soviet propaganda portraying the exact opposite!
Well maybe, I guess. But after 70 years of Orwellian Doublethink personally I think I'd be ready for a bit of truth and honesty, rather than merely a whole new set of lies.
Anyways, so for somebody gaming the RCW is The Admiral worth investigating then? Sounds rather turgid from the accounts here! Surely, though, from an aesthetic point-of-view it is of interest?
I really enjoyed it up until the Revolution and Civil War. There are some really great naval battle scenes early on in the film. I was even enjoying him betraying his best mate and cheating on his wife, and even all the gorgeous "BBC period drama" stuff that made Tsarist Russia seem so appealing. But once the Civil War got going it turned into a real yawn-fest for me. Gets very talky as there is so much exposition to get through. That's the trouble with these bio-pics sometimes. There was lots of sitting around on trains and talking, saying which general was where and what those naughty Bolsheviks were up to; and frankly I couldn't care less what happened to any of them by the end.
It may well reflect the fact that I find the Great War endlessly fascinating and have no interest whatever in the Russian Civil War in my enjoyment the early part of the film and not the latter, but I think not. The film really does take a turn towards dullville about halfway through. I must say it is visually impressive right the way through. Certainly a feast for the eyes if nothing else.
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Thanks for your evaluation, Plynkes. I think I'll investigate further if only to be able to immerse myself in some period ambiance.
Personally I think a biopic following Baron Wrangel's last ditch attempt to carve out a non-Bolshevik enclave in the Crimea would be of more interest, but then what do I know? Given the Russian interest in this important period perhaps such a venture will not be short in coming? If so I can only hope it meets more approval than The Admiral seems to have!
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Anyways, so for somebody gaming the RCW is The Admiral worth investigating then? Sounds rather turgid from the accounts here! Surely, though, from an aesthetic point-of-view it is of interest?
Heck yes! General Kappel's attack across the snow has prompted me to get some nuns from Old Glory to paint as Sister's of Mercy. I'm even going to try my hand at converting some Old Glory WWI Russians in winter coats into a band to play a scenario.
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Heck yes! General Kappel's attack across the snow has prompted me to get some nuns from Old Glory to paint as Sister's of Mercy. I'm even going to try my hand at converting some Old Glory WWI Russians in winter coats into a band to play a scenario.
That's the spirit! Notating of course how the men were stirred into action on the death of one of the sisters - Truly inspiring fevour which know doubts brings on heroic deeds and medals.
I loved the film for what's worth. As an avid collector of RCW books, reading its turbulent history and knowing that we had an Australian naval delegation try to reach Kolchak by train is romantic in itself besides the two VCs that were awarded to Australians for our small part in this conflict.
Helen
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Lots of stuff on Youtube, Gospozha!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH4baePSjVU
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That's the spirit! Notating of course how the men were stirred into action on the death of one of the sisters - Truly inspiring fevour which know doubts brings on heroic deeds and medals.
My four nuns are almost finished. I even added a bag to one like the sister in the movie had in the snow assault scene. She'll be the one that gamers get to use to "stir" the men to charge!
I loved the film for what's worth. As an avid collector of RCW books, reading its turbulent history and knowing that we had an Australian naval delegation try to reach Kolchak by train is romantic in itself besides the two VCs that were awarded to Australians for our small part in this conflict.
There was just enough good war stuff to overcome the mushy love scene stuff. I've watched it countless times (I don't have a TV in my man cave so watch DVDs). I really like learning new stuff that leads me to gain new insight and info about the period like the music played during the charge. Neat stuff.
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(actually I think the restoration of the Russian monarchy with Prince Michael at its head was a plot of a Freddie Forsyth book (?)).
Icon. I read it ten or so years ago. Was pretty good as far as I remember.
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Koz, post some photos if you can. I'd love to see that.
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IMHO, the problem with movie picturing of RCW from the non Bolshevik side nowadys is the amount of support they received from abroad. It would be close to impossible to blend out the interventionist support and thus a need to accept that they did not manage in spite of the generous help. For a Russian propaganda movie to admit this nowadays would be a wonder, since they tend to portrait any foreign help as intrusion from the west. So I do not really believe in seeing any more RCW movies anytime soon.
The Admiral Kolchak plot was easy - he was successfull until betrayed by the French and Czekhs.
Not a mention that he had the non-Bolshevik rest of the Russian parliament shot or that there wouldn't have been any gain at all without the help of the Czekh legion.
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The Admiral Kolchak plot was easy - he was successfull until betrayed by the French and Czekhs.
Not a mention that he had the non-Bolshevik rest of the Russian parliament shot or that there wouldn't have been any gain at all without the help of the Czekh legion.
Pulllleeeeze - would you really think that Hollywood, Novgorodwood or whatever "wood" that Russia has (or anywhere else for that matter) would let truth and fact get in the way of making a movie? Surely, no one believes that Braveheart was even close to being historically accurate? Even Admiral had the Friedrich Carl around 2 years longer than it actually survived.
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Where, actually, is the port of Pilau?
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Pillau is near Königsberg / Kaliningrad in East Prussia. Today it's called Baltijsk.
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Pulllleeeeze - would you really think that Hollywood, Novgorodwood or whatever "wood" that Russia has (or anywhere else for that matter) would let truth and fact get in the way of making a movie?
I agree, but there is a slight difference between a wide interpretation and misleading inaccuracies that turn the historical events.
I don't care if the mine event of the Karl Friedrich was earlier in the movie or Kolchak gave the shooting order to his firing squad himself or not. But depicting the Czech Legion as traitors alone and ignoring what they did for the Anti-Bolshevik movement for 2 years is misleading.
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IMHO, the problem with movie picturing of RCW from the non Bolshevik side nowadys is the amount of support they received from abroad.
Not really an issue for a movie, since the support was diplomatic and material, not men on the ground. Sure a real White army should have some men clad in British uniform and using British weapons, but I wouldn't think badly of a movie that didn't show it (or showed it without comment, so most people would never know).
Kolchak's failure was as much about the inability of his army to get the Allied support to the front, thanks to the length of the train track and the interference of Semenov and the Japanese. But even the most supported army, Iudenich's, was propped up by the Estonians more than the British.
I think that the difficulties that modern Russians have in accepting that the Czechs not only fought against the Bolsheviks willingly, but did so to support a moderate Russian Socialist regime, is a bigger issue. And that Kolchak largely had himself to blame for alienating them so utterly.
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doesn't matter how You elaborate on it or how the details are, the movie depicts something else.
Anyway, it was about other RCW movies and why I thought hardly more would be made.
I think if Russians do recognize Czech (or Austrian for that matter) uniforms, they would also recognize British ones.
Janin was depicted so stereotypically french, I even think it is the actor who advertizes french cheese ;)
So how can anyone in Russia expect to see e.g. Yudenich's campaign supported by Estonians?
or other examples - British and French tanks, or whatever.
The only way one could turn this around in favour for the Whites would be to depict all foreigners would as traitors who abandonded the Anti-Bolshevik cause - but even this would show the White movement incompetent.
The historical fact is that Tsarist Russia was not as nice as depicted in the Kolchak movie and a revolution was inevitable - and that all democratic parties blew it and let the Bolsheviks assume the power. And that would tell a lot about the Russia of today....
The sad thing is that even democratically educated people often find something good about such movies and are forgetting how the entertainement propaganda changes the history - and this in favour of 2 hours fun. (of course this goes for a lot of other movies too)
just my very humble oppinion...
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I think where we differ former user is that I don't see the Russians being any different from most other countries in the making of movies.
But because you or I could not make an RCW movie that fits within our limits of acceptable authenticity does not mean someone else can't. They'll just bend history to fit their purpose and the audience will lap it up if it is good entertainment.
Same goes in Hollywood.
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All valid stuff. 'Braveheart' being the worst modern example (or as Billy Connolly called it "s***e"). And yes, I am Scottish.
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All valid stuff. 'Braveheart' being the worst modern example (or as Billy Connolly called it "s***e"). And yes, I am Scottish.
Don´t forget "Vercingetorix", or, as I prefer to call it, "The Revenge of the Gallic Ninja-Druids that left me wanting to bleach and scrub my eyes".
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True
the Russian film industry learned a lot from Hollywood
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Don´t forget "Vercingetorix", or, as I prefer to call it, "The Revenge of the Gallic Ninja-Druids that left me wanting to bleach and scrub my eyes".
hahahaha! I'll need to look out for it!
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hahahaha! I'll need to look out for it!
DON´T! I usually do not tell people to avoid movies, but this one is so bad, it´s not even good anymore. It´s really, really bad. Starring Christopher Lambert as an uninspiring Vercingetorix and Klaus Maria Brandauer as a hackey Caesar (good Lord, I think he really, really needed the money), terribly bad editing, Roman costumes not suitable to the period portrayed (but otherwise good quality, which is the worst thing about it), miserable dialogue... the list just goes on and on, like Hadrian´s Wall, but the latter is at least inspiring to look at.
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All valid stuff. 'Braveheart' being the worst modern example (or as Billy Connolly called it "s***e"). And yes, I am Scottish.
Well, speaking as a Yank, I found The Patriot to be heavy on flag-waving patriotic fervor and light on historical facts. The Russians aren't the only ones who use their movies to shape history into the way they want to see it.
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Well, speaking as a Yank, I found The Patriot to be heavy on flag-waving patriotic fervor and light on historical facts. The Russians aren't the only ones who use their movies to shape history into the way they want to see it.
Hmmm.... Yes. Mel Gibson again.
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WHAT!!! Mel Gibson, Hollywood, Braveheart, the Patriot and the Admiral aren't for real and twist history for their own purposes? Geeze, next you'll be telling me that pro wrestling is fake.
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what?
really?
damn!
;)