Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Age of the Big Battalions => Topic started by: **GS** on 08 November 2022, 10:54:50 AM
-
Hello everybody!
I'm trying to step into a new theme. I want to play scenarios of the fight for independence in South America, especially in Argentina. (approx. 1809-1826)
I'm looking for advice regarding books and pictures showing the troops of both sides.
Any ideas?
I've found an essay or two describung the general situation in South America. But they seem to lack any descriptions of uniforms and clothing or the weapons used.
Cheers
GS
-
As a start point you might want to start with Robert Harvey’s ‘Liberators’. It’s by far the best English language work on the independence movement across the continent.
For uniform details, you can do a lot worse than Guillermo Roux’s ‘Uniformes Militares Historicos, Republica Argentina’. It covers a broader swathe of history than your period of interest but it has some great colour plates.
-
There is also two wargaming books called Liberators. You would need to look for them as they are no longer available from the publishers.
They have tons of uniform information. Eureka, I believe, now carries the figure range of the old Grenadiers line of figures. 15mm and specifically
made for the Wars of Independence. I have them and they are great figures.
-
There is also two wargaming books called Liberators. You would need to look for them as they are no longer available from the publishers.
Parkfield Miniatures still have these in stock, and yes they are a great source of uniform information.
-
Hey,
thanks alltogether!
I will consider ordering one or two of these books.
I also found this interesting official site:
https://www.argentina.gob.ar/armada/historia-naval/uniformes (https://www.argentina.gob.ar/armada/historia-naval/uniformes)
Cheers!
GS
-
Osprey produce "The Armies of Bolivar and San Martin intheir MAA series. It is quite old ( 1991) and I have no idea how accurate it is.
-
Osprey produce "The Armies of Bolivar and San Martin intheir MAA series. It is quite old ( 1991) and I have no idea how accurate it is.
How in the world could I not find that? :o
Thanks!
GS
-
I think they also produce a more general history on the period in their Essential Histories series.
-
They did. Good for background and possible scenarios but nothing for uniforms.
-
You may want to have a look at Steven Thomas' Balagan blog, which features a fair amount of material on the Liberators era including potted histories, scenarios, orbats and pics of his own armies which may also double as uniform guides of sorts :
https://balagan.info/gunpowder-warfare/liberators (https://balagan.info/gunpowder-warfare/liberators)
-
This topic slept very long, but I woke up to work onit again. I found some stuff on argentine architecture of the time: https://issuu.com/minculturaar/docs/tomoi_ok (https://issuu.com/minculturaar/docs/tomoi_ok). There are loads of pictures Thanks to Flodden1513 I now have a copy of Liberators! by John Fletcher detailing the overall look and feel of the Royalist and Patriot uniform codes and army compositions.
Pictures of my first attempts of creating Argentine soldiers will come soon.
I now have the question to answer: What Miniatures do I take for Royalist/Colonial Spaniards?
-
Rather depends on what scale you are building your arnies in.
In 28mm there are these: https://www.parkfieldminiatures.co.uk/28mm-south-american-liberators
Even though the range is more pitched at Gran Colombia, you can use select models from this range for both Royalists and some of the rebels.
http://www.orinoco-miniatures.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=33_60
Of course there's quite a numer of Napoleonic ranges, especially the plastic ones you can raid for variety.
In 15/18mm I know Grenadier used to produce specific ranges for the wars but they seem to have disappeared.
-
First Patriots painted.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/62/5257-090524130737-62529983.jpeg)
-
1st Cavalry man
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/62/5257-100524145155-62542150.jpeg)
-
I have absolutely no idea if those figs are accurate or not, but they sure look good. Well done!
-
Grenadier figures are still around. Eureka has the line now.
It may not be up on their site. I had to email them for a list.
I can tell you, the figures are really really nice.
-
Nicely painted!
-
Thanks a lot!
Late Response to the kind comments. Real life took more of my time lately so I just have small progress to show:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/62/5257-230624172110-628731431.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/62/5257-230624172110-628781155.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/62/5257-230624172110-628791455.jpeg)
Shown here are the first Argentinian Patriot Units. All Perry Miniatures with some head/hat swaps and minor green stuff mods to riders shakos.
-
Very nice. Which manufacturer are these? I have long thoight about this period for Sharp Practice.
-
. All Perry Miniatures with some head/hat swaps and minor green stuff mods to riders shakos.
Most are Guerra de las tres allianzas. Some ACW all with head swaps
-
Well, they look good to me!
-
Returning to the project. This time for two samples of Spanish in summer uniforms:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-140325123647-653922187.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-140325123647-65388461.jpeg)
-
Sorry for double posting.
Have finished the first unit of royalists:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-160325104223-653932123.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-160325104223-653962114.jpeg)
now on to the second..
-
Nice work, they definitely have a campaign-look to them. The terrain you used as a backdrop looks great as well - any wider photos available?
-
Looking really nice. I like the use of various Napoleonic figures to craft your armies in 28mm. Your brushwork is excellent as well. I have partially painted armies in 15/18mm, mostly Grenadier Productions figures (sculpted by the late, great Mike Broadbent) and some of the old Fantassin range.
I had the opportunity to visit the Chilean Military History Museum this past fall, they had some excellent displays and dioramas and it was a lot of inspiration to resume my Wars of Independence project as well as my War of the Pacific project (in 10mm).
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEgMzTPQnKGDZXZZfQ2VZ-9b5n6n9QAZErEhFjgDHYd0cYu90CQY8Yg3PnuekmxIPMu6yP-44mzIDvAAKrDyR-HwkwiY3hHfsDWFvZ7QOWXLnyx37kSGkeCM7lId4DYyoTLDmf7ykO6J_Knl8vNa0BY3-6rGkvcKl8gi6uCb5kM35E1tpNe3PwGebkzDn16D/s280/PXL_20240926_184830554~2.jpg)
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEi0JRWxR-DUmPwZ1ixULoVJ9_9pWIr6W1fpGgnDbvjuRvBfKiKaLa85NzzhHMwiP0OlZXyXNP2RabKRSugKyEPzUy4_L_vTHuRF8MhkfE1NgCOt3fp5NGpho1vjBqM4umms1KClZeOXSynJiRy7DB3RGQTes1zBvP5zZlyXn99cTKzrwUCI7abjPQgJSfRP/s4080/PXL_20240926_185257953~2.jpg)
-
Nice work, they definitely have a campaign-look to them. The terrain you used as a backdrop looks great as well - any wider photos available?
Thanks!
The terrain is my photo installation, nothing bigger. If you meant bigger pictures of the minis:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-170325070506-654201369.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-170325070506-654231636.jpeg)
-
:-* Very nice!
-
Lovely stuff
-
Very cool. Looking forward to seeing to seeing more.
-
Lovely painting.
Given how the last half century has panned out I often wonder whether Argentines feel independence was actually worth it.
-
Lovely painting.
Given how the last half century has panned out I often wonder whether Argentines feel independence was actually worth it.
Most folks greatly preferred being misruled by their own kind.
-
Two more Units for Liberation of Argentina. Again Royalists: White with blue applications: Arequipa Regiment, Green with red: Talavera Regiment, alternate Uniform.
Dos unidades más para la liberación de Argentina. De nuevo realistas: blanco con azul: regimiento de Arequipa, verde con rojo: regimiento de talavera, uniforme alternativo.
Zwei weitere Einheiten für den Befreiungskampf Argentiniens. Wieder Royalisten. Weiß mit blau Arequipa Regiment, Grün mit Rot: Talavera Regiment, alternative Uniform.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-040425164818-65667842.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-040425164818-656691424.jpeg)
-
Looking great!
-
They really do. I don't want another project but this is very tempting.
-
Thanks!
The story goes on:
A new unit for the Argentine liberation struggle. Royalists of the Chichas Militia, deployed in Tucuman.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-100425204900-657441448.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-100425204900-65749379.jpeg)
-
Nicely done. Tucuman eh? May be their great-great grandchildren will go on to be Montoneros?
-
Nice! Are there any good books on the subject of the independence wars in Argentina and Chile (preferably with colour plates á la Osprey)?
-
Thanks!
Yes there are:
Liberators by John Fletcher (ISBN 0-9770742-0-X)
The wars of Spanish American Independence 180-29 by John Fletcher (ISBN 978-1-78200-766-1)
Guerras Civiles I, La independencia de los virreinatos de la monarquía espanola en America by José A. López Fernández (ISBN 987-84-947836-5-4)
Guerras Civiles II, La independencia de los virreinatos de la monarquía espanola en America by José A. López Fernández (ISBN 978-84-947836-9-2)
Guerras Civiles II, La independencia de los virreinatos de la monarquía espanola en America by José A. López Fernández (ISBN 978-84-948917-6-2)
Meanwhile:
A new unit for the Argentine liberation struggle. Royalists of the Abascal Carabineros, deployed in Chacabuco.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-190425133230-658651332.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-190425133230-65867653.jpeg)
-
Very cool.
-
Thx!
Once more:
A new unit for the Argentine liberation struggle. Royalists of the Cazadores de Montevideo, alternate hats.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-250425144858-65912750.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/65/5257-250425144858-659112477.jpeg)
-
Loving the colorful look of many of these units. A
-
Thanks again!
So do I. The color plates and history state that the military organiszation of spanish colonial forces had been transformed from professional peninsular Spaniards to colonial militia. That meant, the uniforms and structures being diversified over the years. Resulting in colorful and sometimes fancy uniforms. I took to take the more colorfol ones,of course!
-
Got to start with the peacocks, before the drab main affair arrives. :D
I am busy trying to convert over British to American Regulars and state militia for war of 1812 at the moment. I should problem post some of them up once i get them done.
-
Thanks again!
So do I. The color plates and history state that the military organiszation of spanish colonial forces had been transformed from professional peninsular Spaniards to colonial militia. That meant, the uniforms and structures being diversified over the years. Resulting in colorful and sometimes fancy uniforms. I took to take the more colorfol ones,of course!
They largely went back to standardised uniforms after independence. Actually they take on a decidedly Napoleonic French look by the time of the Cisplatine War.
-
They largely went back to standardised uniforms after independence. Actually they take on a decidedly Napoleonic French look by the time of the Cisplatine War.
Right!
I am currently building royalist forces. The patriots are yet to come. They really tend to look like French Napos.
-
And now some Cavalry:
Granaderos a caballo, patriotas, desplegados en Torata.
Granaderos a caballo, patriots, deployed in Torata.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-130525072016-66061690.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-130525072016-660841362.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-130525072017-660852319.jpeg)
-
Very nice figures!
I am very keen on this conflict but I only game in 10/15mm so I wouldbe looking for proxies, which may not be too difficult. But it is a little way down my 'to do list'
I do have one of the 'Liberation' books which is great
-
Thanks!
One more unit for Liberation of Argentina. Again Royalists: White with green applications: Arequipa Regiment.
Una unidad más para la liberación de Argentina. De nuevo realistas: verde con azul: regimiento de Arequipa.
Eine weitere Einheit für den Befreiungskampf Argentiniens. Wieder Royalisten. Weiß mit grün Arequipa Regiment.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-190525171428-661531546.jpeg)
-
Arequipa? So Peruvian Royalists?
-
Getting a pretty sizable force of royalist built up.
-
Argentine infantry for the Liberation War against Spain.
Made from Perry Miniatures AWI Infantry with British Napoleonic Infantry covered shakos also from Perry Miniatures.
Argentinische Infanterie für den Befreiungskampf gegen Spanien. Gebaut aus Perry Miniatures AWI Infantry mit British Napoleonic Infantry verhüllten shakos auch von Perry Miniatures.
Infantería argentina para la Guerra de Liberación contra España. Hecha a partir de figuras de infantería de la Guerra de Independencia Americana de Perry Miniatures con shakos cubiertos de infantería napoleónica británica, también de Perry Miniatures.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-240525160000-661801528.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-240525155959-661791462.jpeg)
-
Sorry for double posting. I just made some group shots of my of Argentine liberation struggle to this day.
I'm allmost halfway through ;)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-250525142500-661971350.jpeg)
Realistas:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-250525142500-661931549.jpeg)
-
Very colorful army.
-
:)
THX
Thanks to the network of Fellow Nerds. I now have top hats for troops of the Argentine war of independence.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-290525160922-663192167.jpeg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-290525160923-663201420.jpeg)
-
nice, looks a little high on that chap though.
-
Right, I am still experimenting. Will paint it as on a piece of cloth wrapped around the head. 😉
-
unless it's a duvet, it's still going to be too high...
bandanas/headscarves aren't going to be that thick, look at other sculpts of top hats from the period, you barely see any forehead.
-
Ok, thanks!
-
Where did you get those top hats? I need some to convert some of my perry AWI in hunting shirts over to war of 1812 fronter militia. :D
-
One friend supplied the STL, another did the printing. I just sat here and waited.
Cheers
GS
-
Good friends 😄
Have you seen the new perry Spanish sets? They as are doing a guerrilla set as well.
-
Good friends 😄
indeed!
Have you seen the new perry Spanish sets? They as are doing a guerrilla set as well.
Yeah, I am looking forward to getting some. The Guerilla set especially looks like lots of fun converting and kit bashing.
-
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-220625160201-664432485.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-220625160201-66445731.jpeg)
Cazadores del Peru, deployed at Tucuman. From Perry Miniatures British Napoleonic Light Infantry.
Cazadores del Perú, desplegados en Tucumán. De Perry Miniatures Infantería Ligera Británica Napoleónica.
-
Another great looking company.
-
Yep - they do indeed look good.
-
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-220625160201-664432485.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-220625160201-66445731.jpeg)
Cazadores del Peru, deployed at Tucuman. From Perry Miniatures British Napoleonic Light Infantry.
Cazadores del Perú, desplegados en Tucumán. De Perry Miniatures Infantería Ligera Británica Napoleónica.
Hi GS, very impressive collection.
I was wondering if you could list the proxi miniatures you use as I am think of this period in 10mm
-
On Saturday, it happened: My works from the past 14 months saw the light of the gaming table!
Two-part scenario: First, a reconnaissance and flanking battle to determine the extent of a flanking movement in the second part. During this partivcular game, the Patriots had a sweep in the first part due to the dice, resulting in a massive flank attack in round two of the second part. Since fate decided to completely change the odds in the second part, this, including the flank attack, became a disaster for the patriots, and thus the royalists were able to hold the bridge against the patriots.
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165242-66957534.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165627-66968599.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165627-669691204.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165628-669702179.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165628-66971885.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/66/5257-270725165628-66972607.jpeg)
-
Great looking table and game!
-
Indeed. Good looking game.
-
erste Flaggen / first flags / primeras banderas
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/67/5257-020825141353-67003578.jpeg)
-
That will make it easier to figure out what side I am looking at. lol
-
Indeed! ;)
-
Nice flags! And though I'm a tad late, the game above is fantastic looking- is that Lion Rampant rulebook you're using?
-
Nice flags! And though I'm a tad late, the game above is fantastic looking- is that Lion Rampant rulebook you're using?
Thanks a lot!
The game was played at my "Home Con". An invitational with 6 tables. That's the reason, the book strayed from another table to this one. I actually use "Rebels and Patriots" für my Argentina games as I really like the engine and the "Beer & Breze" vibe. Fast games with focus on the decisions on the table ratherv than flleecing the rulebook for the ideal action. ;)
-
So, weiter im Programm: Reserveinfanterie der Patrioten, eingesetzt in Tucuman.
OK, on goes the show: Patriot reserve infantry deployed at Tucuman.
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/67/5257-050825184941-67052747.jpeg)
(https://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/67/5257-050825184942-67057697.jpeg)
-
More good looking figures.
As for the game - that's a nice looking table, and those figures look the part on it. Interesting how the Gods of War(games) switched sides between the 2 parts. Fate can be a fickle b***h, can't she?