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Miniatures Adventure => Colonial Adventures => Topic started by: Roustam on 17 November 2009, 08:49:25 PM

Title: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Roustam on 17 November 2009, 08:49:25 PM
For sometime I've considered dong the Italo-Ethiopian War.  After viewing the work+photos of James Morris, I've decided to take the plunge.  I intend to use mostly Askari and Empress figures.  Does anyone know where I could obtain suitable CV 33's or CV35's?
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Calimero on 17 November 2009, 08:53:12 PM

Look in the "tanks and vehicles" section of the Empress SCW for a CV35
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Westfalia Chris on 18 November 2009, 10:58:06 AM
I´ll second the Empress recommendation. I think those are the former Anglian/Chieftain models (they took over the range, but the image looks a bit different, don´t know why). Those are absolutely excellent, I got two of them.

(http://www.displacedminiatures.com/images/img.1194549651293.jpg)

Back when I purchased mine, they had parts for both variants included (single/double MG).
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Svennn on 18 November 2009, 11:50:50 AM
Nigel @ Anglian re-did this prior to selling to Empress. The original had weapon choices but no crew IIRC, I had one of each but sold them to Grimm.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 18 November 2009, 03:21:53 PM
I'm delighted that you're feeling inspired!  If you're interested, the next two issues of Wargames Illustrated (WI 266 & 267, Dec 2009 and Jan 2010) should be carrying a 2-part article by myself about gaming the Italian Invasion of Ethiopia.  Each article is about 10 pages and includes loads of pics and scenarios/rules based on Warhammer Historical Great War rules.  I've been told to expect the first issue to be available at the end of November.

The CV-33/35 tankette by Empress (ex Anglian) is a gem, it's in the SCW vehicles section of the Empress website at http://www.empressminiatures.com/userimages/procart24.htm     
I own 7 of these...only painted two so far, but am hoping to do the Battle of the Dembeguina Pass as a demo game at some point!  The first WI article includes a scenario using two CV-35s so there are going to be some close-up pics.

Cheers

James
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Roustam on 18 November 2009, 04:12:31 PM
Thanks to everyone for the information.  I'm now attempting to locating sources of uniform information, which should be a challenge as not much exists.  The Osprey book is of little help.  There are some Italian works, but they are OOP.


James, would you PM me please?

rbednarek@wi.rr.com

Thanks,
Russ
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 18 November 2009, 04:47:25 PM
You fellas have inspired me to go back and finish off my L3 Lf that has been gathering dust on the side since the summer. Nearly finished him now.

Well, this period certainly seems to be becoming popular, don't it. Few more recruits and we may almost be approaching the "wargaming fad" level of interest. That is all perfectly fine, as long as we all remember that as far as the LAF is concerned, it was my idea.  ;)
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Svennn on 18 November 2009, 04:48:57 PM
Mine actually  ;) :D
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 18 November 2009, 08:42:00 PM
Was this particular war not Mussolini's idea in the first place?  ;)

(NB: like all the periods I wargame, I'm very glad I wasn't there)

Cheers

James
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Helen on 18 November 2009, 09:27:05 PM
You fellas have inspired me to go back and finish off my L3 Lf that has been gathering dust on the side since the summer. Nearly finished him now.

Well, this period certainly seems to be becoming popular, don't it. Few more recruits and we may almost be approaching the "wargaming fad" level of interest. That is all perfectly fine, as long as we all remember that as far as the LAF is concerned, it was my idea.  ;)

Dylan, If the last lot of miniatures you painted for the period is anything to go by then we are all in for a reat treat.

Helen
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 18 November 2009, 10:06:13 PM
What a nice thing to say. Thanks, Helen.


Thanks to this damn topic distracting me from the things I was doing I'll have something new to show for my slow-burn Abyssinia side-project in a day or so (just base work and varnishing to do).
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Helen on 19 November 2009, 07:25:43 AM
What a nice thing to say. Thanks, Helen.


Thanks to this damn topic distracting me from the things I was doing I'll have something new to show for my slow-burn Abyssinia side-project in a day or so (just base work and varnishing to do).

Dylan, You are most welcome.

Helen
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 21 November 2009, 06:13:49 PM
Seconded.  Plynkes, I look forward to seeing more of your work too!  (I enjoyed the pictures you posted a while back, it was very reassuring to know when I joined this forum that I'm not the only person in the wargames world painting Abyssinians...)  If it's any consolation, my lovely baby daughter (5 days old) has seriously disrupted my painting schedule! I deliberately got a lot done recently in the knowledge that the happy event would somewhat curtail my output.  :)

My copy of Wargames Illustrated 266 arrived today, and I'm pleased to say that the Italo-Ethiopian War article has managed to jostle 10 pages of copy away from the orgy of colour and new product that is Battlefront/ Flames of War Vietnam!  Also got an Ethiopian standard bearer on the cover, which I feel is an achievement in itself... ;)
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 21 November 2009, 07:01:29 PM
Congratulations on the new arrival!  :)


I finished my L3 Lf flamethrower tankette the other day, but as yet haven't got around to taking any photos yet.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Helen on 21 November 2009, 08:41:46 PM
Hi james,

Congratulations on your new arrival an I look forward in reading the forthcoming articles in WI.

Helen
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 26 November 2009, 11:21:03 AM
Just got the new WI. Haven't had a chance for a proper read yet, but the eye-candy is very inspiring. Nice one, James.

I notice there is an Abyssinian Maxim gun in the article. Can you say what figures were used with it? It's a conversion I assume.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 26 November 2009, 12:50:04 PM
Just received my copy of WI and seems very interesting.
Lovely photos etc

Very tempting indeed!
[always wanted to do something like "Cry Wolf" story]

What I have seen is that we need some more variety in the Abyssinian figures.
Can the Copplestone's Somalis duplicate as ethiopians?

BTW some Italian manufacturer did/do some figures. They were 25mm, so smaller than empress. Are they still available, I cannot recall the manufacturer.
Another by the way question for Plynkes, specially: This Italo-Ethiopian / Abyssinian war is colonial era or interwar?
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 26 November 2009, 01:04:13 PM
As far as I'm concerned it is Colonial, as the remit for the board is 19th/20th Century. Inter-War gets anything from the period that isn't Colonial.

Others may feel differently, but that is my take on it. Inter-War can have the Italo-Ethiopian conflict when Jim Hale wrests it from my cold dead hands...  lol
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 26 November 2009, 01:12:10 PM
As far as I'm concerned it is Colonial, as the remit for the board is 19th/20th Century. Inter-War gets anything from the period that isn't Colonial.


OK understood!
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Plynkes on 26 November 2009, 01:16:22 PM
Personally I don't think I'd use Copplestone Somalis. They look too... well, Somali for me (the fashion in Ethiopia was for trousers to a certain extent, and the Somalis all wear those distinctive toga-like outfits, plus their shields are different and they have those Muslim charms against the evil eye around their necks). But this is one of those personal taste things where everyone makes their own line in the sand.

A greater problem I think that would put people off is that Askari and Anglian/Empress figures are quite small when put next to Copplestone's Somali giants.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Keith on 26 November 2009, 07:58:57 PM
Ahem ... I don't know if you gents are interested but AFAIK Empress have new Abyssinian toys coming out in Q1 2010  ;)
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: RJ on 26 November 2009, 08:38:34 PM
Ahem ... I don't know if you gents are interested but AFAIK Empress have new Abyssinian toys coming out in Q1 2010  ;)

speaking to the empress guys at warfare they mentioned something about a character pack, abyssinian cavalry and some italians on camels...   ???

Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Roustam on 27 November 2009, 02:01:28 AM
Argsilverson......I believe you are thinking of Mirliton miniatures.  Their Italian range is very extensive, and is 20mm.

Good to hear that Empress will release some new Ethiopians in 2010.  Personally, I'd like to see another pack of levies with tribal weapons, an Askari MG crew+gun, an Italian artillery crew,Ethiopian MG+crew, and an Italian with flamethrower.

Russ
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Helen on 27 November 2009, 02:11:23 AM
Hi Argyris,

Don't forget Artizan with their Italians that would be very suitable for the period.

I'll use mine for this purpose later next year.

Helen
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 28 November 2009, 11:10:59 AM
Just got the new WI. Haven't had a chance for a proper read yet, but the eye-candy is very inspiring. Nice one, James.

I notice there is an Abyssinian Maxim gun in the article. Can you say what figures were used with it? It's a conversion I assume.

Glad you enjoyed it!  Sorry for the delay but I've posted a new thread with pics and  details of the Maxim gun.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 30 November 2009, 02:45:28 PM
Argsilverson......I believe you are thinking of Mirliton miniatures.  Their Italian range is very extensive, and is 20mm.

Good to hear that Empress will release some new Ethiopians in 2010.  Personally, I'd like to see another pack of levies with tribal weapons, an Askari MG crew+gun, an Italian artillery crew,Ethiopian MG+crew, and an Italian with flamethrower.

Russ
It is not Mirliton. I found them it's Strategia e Tattica and here is the link:
http://www.strategiaetattica.it/miniature_base.asp?tipologia=25mmcoloniale
they are listed as 25mm, since I don;t have any askari miniatures or Empress miniatures I cannot make any comparison.
they have a set of an ethiopian  artillery piece with 4 crew. I do not know what gun is that, it is old.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 04 December 2009, 12:22:12 PM
Gentlemen,
I would like to advise you of a recent photo I found on the net:
A woman askari (topless) fighting for the Italians (wearing an eritrean askari fez)
listed a source link which was not working. also impossible to link to the photo.

does anyone else know something about women askari fighting for the italians (or other colonial power?)
if could find some suitable figure sounds an interesting addition.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 04 December 2009, 12:46:01 PM
(http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2230/hu051037.jpg)

Is this the image?
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 04 December 2009, 12:51:15 PM
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2230/hu051037.jpg

Is this the image?

exactly you got it.
is the first time I've ever had heard of a female askari!
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 04 December 2009, 12:57:18 PM
is the first time I've ever had heard of a female askari!

I have a feeling that this may be a bit of a cheesecake pic. Here's the caption from the original source:

Quote
Ethiopian Woman Wearing Soldier's Fez - barebreasted Ethiopian woman, representing the native Ascari soldiers fighting for Italy, is photographed wearing an Ascari fez in order to motivate the Italian soldiers.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/2230/hu051037.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ethiopianreview.com/forum/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D2%26t%3D14370&usg=__4vcgvhBFkzxaFUZilSpBu0jiwpg=&h=480&w=270&sz=42&hl=en&start=2&um=1&tbnid=GbRy128fQ9xGoM:&tbnh=129&tbnw=73&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dwoman%2Bascari%2Bitalian%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 04 December 2009, 01:00:53 PM
if could find some suitable figure sounds an interesting addition.

I would still buy that mini though, even if it was only for propaganda :)
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 04 December 2009, 01:06:07 PM
I would still buy that mini though, even if it was only for propaganda :)

me,too!


I found the picture on a "my space blog" source was not working.
it seems that it is quite propaganda, but to motivate whom? it sounds that the photographer just wanted to show that ALL population supports the "cause"!
I doubt if wilbur smith has not used it, if it were a bit true.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 04 December 2009, 01:18:42 PM
Propoganda for Italian soldiers. Not a bad way to persuade them that Africa's not all that bad. (see my last post on the previous page if you missed it)
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 04 December 2009, 01:48:42 PM
I have seen your last post, but I doubted  a bit.

Now I found the same photo on Ghetty images with the following caption:

An Ethiopian guerrilla during the Italo-Ethiopian war. (Photo by Hulton Archive/Getty Images)

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/2660093/Hulton-Archive

interesting!
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 04 December 2009, 02:27:04 PM
That is interesting! I wonder which one is true? If either.....

She wouldn't be too hard to convert. A Hasslefree numidian, a riffle and a little bit of greenstuff....
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 04 December 2009, 02:29:44 PM
That is interesting! I wonder which one is true? If either.....

??????????
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: dadlamassu on 04 December 2009, 03:06:50 PM
I think Foudry did/do a similar figure in their Darkest Africa range.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Overlord on 04 December 2009, 03:19:00 PM
I think Foudry did/do a similar figure in their Darkest Africa range.

Pack DA1/4:
(http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/collections/DA/1/4b.jpg)
http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/collections/DA/1/index.asp
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 04 December 2009, 08:26:07 PM
I'm pretty sure this image is a pure propaganda stunt dreamt up by Mussolini to drum up interest in the Ethiopian invasion.  I've read words to that effect but can't place the source at the moment.

Doesn't mean you can't dream about the figure though...
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Chairface on 05 December 2009, 03:59:26 AM
??????????

I meant was she a guerilla or a pinup girl? Or neither?
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: argsilverson on 05 December 2009, 10:52:38 AM
I meant was she a guerilla or a pinup girl? Or neither?

I also wonder whether is a guerilla or a "pin up", although I start believing that the photo is pure propaganda with a "touch of sex". [Sex always attracts more attention!
I'm pretty sure this image is a pure propaganda stunt dreamt up by Mussolini to drum up interest in the Ethiopian invasion.  I've read words to that effect but can't place the source at the moment.

Doesn't mean you can't dream about the figure though...

I second both
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Roustam on 05 December 2009, 05:10:06 PM
As interesting as this piece of propaganda is, I'd rather see the following figures produced:

*Ethiopian MG+crew
*Ethiopian artillery crew
*Italian artillery crew
*Askari MG+crew
*Italian flamethrower team

Just part of my "wishlist".

Russ
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: commissarmoody on 05 December 2009, 07:40:36 PM
As interesting as this piece of propaganda is, I'd rather see the following figures produced:

*Ethiopian MG+crew
*Ethiopian artillery crew
*Italian artillery crew
*Askari MG+crew
*Italian flamethrower team

Just part of my "wishlist".

Russ

I am with Roustam on this one
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 05 December 2009, 08:05:52 PM
As interesting as this piece of propaganda is, I'd rather see the following figures produced:

*Ethiopian MG+crew
*Ethiopian artillery crew
*Italian artillery crew
*Askari MG+crew
*Italian flamethrower team

Just part of my "wishlist".

Russ

Agree completely - not sure how common flamethrowers were, but the other items are essentials for the range, in my opinion.  I've submitted information to Empress for machine gun teams for Ethiopians, Italians and Eritrean Askaris, and I think they have plans for new releases in the new year.  Looking forward to them.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Durutti on 07 December 2009, 07:37:04 AM
Italian flamethrowers were limited to the Lanciaflamme option on the Cv33/35.

Use of images of topless or even naked women was prevelant at the time, used as a tool to persuade Italian soldiers that Abyssinia was full of semi-naked birds up for a bit!!!! :o

I have now got my mojo back, and have started work on the earlier Cv33 tankette, and two of the Lanciaflamme options.
Also have acquired plans for the Fiat 611 armoured car.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: James Morris on 07 December 2009, 05:58:47 PM
Italian flamethrowers were limited to the Lanciaflamme option on the Cv33/35.

Use of images of topless or even naked women was prevelant at the time, used as a tool to persuade Italian soldiers that Abyssinia was full of semi-naked birds up for a bit!!!! :o

I have now got my mojo back, and have started work on the earlier Cv33 tankette, and two of the Lanciaflamme options.
Also have acquired plans for the Fiat 611 armoured car.

Sounds exciting!

I believe that some hand-held flamethrowers were used to help clear the caves on Amba Aradam, my copy of 'The Rape of Ethiopia' seems to have a picture of one in use, but it is very indistinct.  Either way, I don't believe it was commonly used - MGs and artillery seem to have been much more prevalent.
Title: Re: Italo-Ethiopian War
Post by: Roustam on 07 December 2009, 06:51:47 PM
I believe hand held flamethrowers were used at the Gorrah Wadi's caves.
The picture James notes in "Rape Of Ethiopia" is page 92-93, and is not very conclusive as to detail of the weapon+crew.

Can anyone ID the machinegun used by Eritrean Askaris on page 85?

Thanks,
Russ