Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Kublaibenzine on April 30, 2024, 08:29:42 AM
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Folks,
Anyone have recommendations for a good set of Viking era rules? I am familiar with Saga, Lion Rampant etc, but I am looking for something suitable more for raids, skirmishes and able to handle the early viking period.
Any thoughts and strengths/weaknesses of the rules, greatl appreciated!
JP
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Dux Bellorum might be of interest? It’s pretty specifically designed to handle the period you’re describing.
Precisely what scale do you mean by skirmish though? A skirmish level game can vary from a hundred to half a dozen models, it’d be good to know how many models you want to be putting on the table.
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Thanks for getting back to me. I don't think I want more than say 60 figs on the table.
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Saga handles Viking raids perfectly.
Anyway.
What about Ravenfeast? It has the added bonus of being a free download (just Google it).
It's smaller than you say you were looking for - perhaps a dozen miniatures per side. For a simple game it does have some subtleties and nice extra features and gives a surprisingly enjoyable game.
I'm not sure Dux Bell (which is a very good game) is particularly suited to the 9th century. It's more aimed at the immediate post-Roman period. It does offer a 'sea raider' option though, so can be used.
What are you looking for in a skirmish game? You've mentioned numbers but are you looking at individually based miniatures (e.g. Saga and Ravenfeast) or do you want them on group bases (e.g. Dux Bell)?
There's also Lion Rampant. That comes out at about 60 figures per side.
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Folks,
Anyone have recommendations for a good set of Viking era rules? I am familiar with Saga, Lion Rampant etc, but I am looking for something suitable more for raids, skirmishes and able to handle the early viking period.
Any thoughts and strengths/weaknesses of the rules, greatl appreciated!
JP
There's Great Hall Burning, written by Ed T from 2 Hour Wargames.
https://rebelminispress.com/products/great-hall-burning-pdf
Has the same elements common to all 2 Hours rule books. Games are geared towards solo/same side affairs and they use Ed's 'Chain Reaction' system, it's a thing Ed has been refining over the last 20 odd years. Basically what you want your troops to do and what they will do might not be the same :)
Back to the rules, it can be played as a wargame/RPG Lite or a combo of the two. Book has campaign rules, Longship fighting, leader advancement; they cram a fair bit in the 76 pages; page layout can be a tad confusing at times. You field figures in groups of 8 for melee and 4 for missile, great for 20 - 30 a side.
The 'Reaction' system is not for everyone so Ed has free editions available for folk to test the water, Swordplay is nearest in flavour here.
https://twohourwargames.com/products/chain-reaction-2023
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I think both Lion Rampant and Saga can handle raids pretty well with the right scenarios. Rather than a stand-up fight, have skirmishes where the defenders have to prevent the Vikings from grabbing loot or people, and/or have a smaller militia force hold off the Vikings for x number of turns until reinforcements show up. Breakthrough scenarios, where the Vikings have to get through a defended point like a ford to get to a monastery (or back to their boats) would work too. I think LR has a ‘burn the village’ scenario in the book that seems like a natural.
The randomness in LR’s activation system feels like it reflects the chaos of a raid where neither side has much in the way of organized command. It also has enough variety in troop types so you can have the raiders and defenders behave differently instead of everybody being 'guy with beard, spear and shield'.
The Saga 'Book of Battles' has a bunch of scenarios that would work in the context of a Viking raid, although I haven't played them so I can't say how well they work.
Easy E from this forum has written a set of rules called 'Fury of the Northmen' based on his 'Men of Bronze' Osprey book. I haven't read the book, but they are probably worth checking out if you aren't interested in Saga, Lion Rampant or Ravenfeast.
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I like Dux Bellorum, but wouldn’t recommend it for skirmish games - it is designed as a battle line set of rules using multi-based figures.
I think the other suggestions above are all solid contenders. Depending on the style of game you rare after (grittier realism vs Hollywood), another possibility would be Fistfull of Lead: Bigger Battles. The model count is in the right range and it is designed for large skirmishes. It is “period agnostic” from ancients to sci-fi, but could certainly do dark ages. The turn sequence is based on cards (each player is dealt a card per unit, then units are activated in a descending sequence from king to 1). It’s on the beer and pretzels side of the game design continuum.
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Argad is intended for RPG-minded small skirmishes or adventures. :) It works better with a game master.
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Here are a couple of different options, but they may push your definition of a skirmish:
Longships-Wrath of the Vikings (by peter pig). It's more focused on 15mm - but you can use it for 28mm. The main game is based around raids and fighting them off. It has some intteresting mechanics for that - but may not be to everyones taste.
Dux Brit (with the extension for later forces in the lard magazine) has many scenarios for raids.
Both have good scenario's for raids etc which work.
The big thing with raiding is the scenario to make it not just a fight with a slight twist. Fighting and killing for the be secondary too getting the objectives. IMO a raid is much about movement than fighting. Otherwise it just becomes a kill everything with a slight twist - which is to be honest what a lot of poor raid type scenarios can become.
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Wow - thanks folks.
Bsaing is single with movement stands for groupings. I am looking for something more than line 'em up and bash heads - I'm more interested in raids, revenge, etc.
JP
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Just want to clarify something about Dux Bellorum - two different games are being mixed up here.
Dux Bellorum is an Osprey “blue book” game and is the full battle game.
Dux Britanniarum is by Too Fat Lardies and is a skirmish level game about the Saxon invasion of post-Roman Britain. As mentioned above, there’s a Viking period modification available as well. This one would probably be a good fit for the kind of raiding, etc games the original poster is interested in.
The similarities in the names of the two games often leads to confusion, but they’re both good for their respective game styles. You just don’t want to accidentally order the wrong one for the type of game you want!
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Some great suggestions have already been made. I'll throw Todd Kershner's Pig Wars into the mix. It's a very simple, beer and pretzels game, when men were men and pigs were money. I suggest having a look at it mostly for the scenario design, where there is a focus on grabbing loot and getting off the table (as the Viking player, that is, the Saxon player obviously wants to stop this).
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Another vote for Ravenfeast. You can't go wrong with a free download and the production standards are surprisingly high. We played it a few times and found it good fun, albeit maybe more at the " beer and pretzels" end of the scale and IMHO best played as a multi-player game.
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Pig Wars. Skirmish rules for the Dark Ages. Available as a reasonably priced PDF at Wargames Vault. Yes, its a bit old, but it fits your size game, and
handles the varying armor, weapon and skill of your figures. Lion Rampant, while a great high medieval set, wants you to have separate units of similar troops (ie: all bow, all unarmored, all armored) which is not Dark Age (well, except for Byzantines).
For those suggesting Ravenfeast, I've got them. They are a slightly simpler version of Pig Wars. I would go so far as to say that the similarity seems more than accidental.
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I second pig wars great fun and easily handle 60figs.
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Thanks folks - I'll check out all the ones I don't have. I'm looking for a good feel of the period in the rules,rather than just tossing dice.
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You will be tossing dice anyway. ;) The rules are just there to solve situations that can arise in the story you want to build. :)
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Like others said my vote goes to Ravenfeast. Simple rules with warbands of 20 or 30 figures and can also be used for other periods/themes with some small adjustments.
Just give them a try and see how it works for you.
You have a facebook page that helps with rules for other factions like Irish, Normans, Saracens, etc.
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I second the vote for Pig Wars. Also see if you can find an old set of rules from minifigs called "A knight to dismember." It was Norman vs Saracen vs Viking raiding parties.
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Blood Eagle: https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/209310/blood-eagle-skirmish-wargaming-in-the-legendary-da (https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/209310/blood-eagle-skirmish-wargaming-in-the-legendary-da)
Skjalborg, free and interesting: http://web.archive.org/web/20180816131004/http://www.shieldwallgames.com/rules.htm (http://web.archive.org/web/20180816131004/http://www.shieldwallgames.com/rules.htm)
Pig Wars (already mentioned)
Battle troll, maybe smaller skirmishers but fun to read and play ruleset: https://www.wargamevault.com/product/113552/BattleTroll (https://www.wargamevault.com/product/113552/BattleTroll)
Cheers,