Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Colonial Adventures => Topic started by: Donkeymilkman on October 07, 2024, 01:54:58 PM
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Hi everyone,
Subject says it all. I am doing a couple units for an Indian Mutiny/Rebellion project. One unit I wanted to do was a 2nd Bellochee unit. I am finding it very difficult to find reseach of descriptions or illustrations of what the unit looked like in 1857. Foundry do some Indian Mutiny Beluchi figures. However, I find the poses very static. Want I wanted to know was could I use the Perry's Jacob's rifles figures for the 2nd Afghan war instead for the Indian Mutiny? Attached images for ease of understanding.
Thanks,
Samuel
(https://i.postimg.cc/n9jmpb0M/Foundry-Indian-Beluchi-infantry.avif) (https://postimg.cc/n9jmpb0M)
(https://i.postimg.cc/gwjkfyM2/Perry-Jacob-rifle-s-command.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/gwjkfyM2)
(https://i.postimg.cc/vcvYT2km/image.png) (https://postimg.cc/vcvYT2km)
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Wonderful unit, and yes information is limited on these chaps sadly.
Based off what I've read and seen, I'd say no on the Perry Sculpts but honestly its your project and its close enough to the Foundry ones!
Sometimes a little historical "what if" is absolutely OK to me.
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As with all these tings it depends how accurate you want to be. The Jacobs rifles figures have later rifles not available to troops in the mutiny, their webbing is later as you might expect and they have puttees which the troops in the mutiny were not using. There is loads of choice of troops in the right uniforms and kit from manufacturers like Empress who do some lovely figures.
If you are looking for troops you can use for different Wars, many of the Sikh Wars troops can be used for for the later Mutiny and the earlier 1st Afghan War so these are worth considering.
Having said all that its your game so whatever you and your opponent are comfortable with.
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The Wargames Foudry book on India in the mid-Ninteenth Century (by Bob French I think?) has about as much info as it has on any other units in the mutiny. Also there was a tradition (?) magazine from the 70's that has an entire article on them and describes their uniform. The Foundry Baluchis are the only ones that I have seen that even remotely resemble the original unit.
Tradition Magazine Number Sixty-Three (year? 1970's I'd bet). "Further Notes on the Uniforms Worn During The Indian Mutiny 1857-58" By C.A. Norman. There is a paragraph of 1st hand descriptions, and one line drawing. I found a copy on Ebay, and it's signed by the author!
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Found a copy here if anyone is looking to track one down.
https://www.paulmeekins.co.uk/product/64083/TRADITION-THE-JOURNAL-OF-THE-INTERNATIONAL-SOCIETY-OF-MILITARY-COLLECTORS-NUMBER-SIXTY-THREE
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As has been said, it really depends how much of a stickler you want to be. Personally I would find them jarring on an Indian Mutiny tabletop, like using Korean War figures to game the Somme. But it's absolutely your call.
Mutineer Miniatures (are they still going?) do some Mutiny-era Sikhs that are much closer. If you felt like it, a little conversion work could de-Sikhify them a little.
I did a head-swap with some green stuff work to turn one into an 1860s Baluchi in the Abyssinian campaign, but I'm sure you could get away with a much smaller job and come out with something presentable...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/17/163_03_06_14_8_47_54_0.jpg)
Yes, the turban does look ridiculously big, but that's what they looked like in the few photos I managed to find. :)
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This of any use Sam?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/142544260450?_skw=mutineer+miniatures&itmmeta=01J9NQBNJCWNJNK8V0KR2PX43B&hash=item21304ccd62:g:a30AAOSwdIFXzpiI&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA0HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKmt7%2FM20FiTshzPLNOxhCWx2uIiB1odMOslIj8CzVrXCXDrEaA80FeC6xvOA3QbDMcUwl4KWi0rFqjn2TDb0U1eSj9mC2k4JZN48O%2B4lPFO%2FCu%2F7lsoEYC9JdhzlG3gGgKUXf53N%2Bw%2Bi2EG%2Bfypv17LO8fgpLQvWwVdsI4a6c978rCnpP7XyWJodgq3RQE%2Fvqd6mJNGrp8%2FzO2bLOEowMsI9dQ7Ne05uPxWlIu5%2Fc%2B6Z2XjNDY08aZ46gb4YiEQVjg%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR6DZrrfNZA
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Seems Mutineer Miniature are still selling.
https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=6a5ad282ea317508JmltdHM9MTcyODM0NTYwMCZpZ3VpZD0zM2RmMmM5OC1mOGM4LTY1N2ItMzY3MC0zYzFhZjllZjY0OWUmaW5zaWQ9NTIxNQ&ptn=3&ver=2&hsh=3&fclid=33df2c98-f8c8-657b-3670-3c1af9ef649e&psq=Mutineer+Miniatures&u=a1aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubXV0aW5lZXItbWluaWF0dXJlcy5vcmcudWsv&ntb=1
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Seems Mutineer Miniature are still selling.
Mutineer Miniatures (are they still going?) do some Mutiny-era Sikhs that are much closer. If you felt like it, a little conversion work could de-Sikhify them a little.
Yes Mutineer are still going and they figures are brilliant, bought a unit of Gurkhas last month and the figures were really nice. Only took two days to come!
Out of interest Plynkes were are the heads for your figures from.
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This of any use Sam?
Nice figures but they're are sepoys, as it is a group project I'm trying to do some of the more unique uniformed infantry units to make the game a little more interesting. I do intend to get some figures from AW at some point.
Does anyone have any recommendations of good sources for uniform guides? A lot of the info I am stumbling upon is more post mutiny records and illustrations.
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The head was from a Darkest Africa Baloochi mercenary. As it was a single figure for the Colonial Painting Club it wasn't too painful, but it isn't really economically viable for a whole unit unless you have oil shekh or Russian oligarch money. You might still be able to something with those figures, though.
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The Ospreys are pretty good uniform guides, also some interesting info on the Iron Duke Website you might find useful. There is loads to go for in terms of unusual units, you could even put together a Native Princes bodyguard which is perfectly historical.
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Sadly the Iron Duke Miniatures website is no more, and the wealth of information that was on it seems lost, since Mike stepped back from being a manufacturer of little toy soldiers.
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I cut and pasted much of Colonel Mike's information into .doc files for my own use.
If anyone can suggest a site that these might be uploaded to, I would be glad to help my fellow colonialists out.
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These docs could probably be uploaded to the Colonial wars io group page which used to be the old Yahoo Groups site. I guess the other alternative could be on one of our blogs, though either of these may cause copyright issues.
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Certainly copyright issues. I follow Colonel Mike on FB.
Maybe the appropriate and proper thing would be for me to message him and ask permission?