Lead Adventure Forum
Other Stuff => Workbench => "Build Something" Contest => Topic started by: Mick_in_Switzerland on 11 January 2025, 10:57:23 AM
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I saw the new LOTR film "War of the Rohirrim" in December and bought the new Games Workshop LOTR starter set of the same name.
You can see my progress on that here https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=147656.45 (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=147656.45)
I have an extensive collection of the GW LOTR models and will probably add more as new things come out.
I have the resin GW Minas Tirith gate and walls which is a magnificent set.
Unfortunately GW never made matching siege towers based on the film, "Return of the King".
The Meta Workshop design art is available on-line https://wetaworkshopdesignstudio.artstation.com/projects/182QKG?album_id=3370094 (https://wetaworkshopdesignstudio.artstation.com/projects/182QKG?album_id=3370094)
Here is the concept artwork for the siege tower. There is also a plan on the Weta page.
(https://cdnb.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/037/999/191/4k/weta-workshop-design-studio-seige3-df.jpg?1621897905)
I plan to rescale it to match the GW walls and figures.
The film walls were about 19 meters high, which is about 315 mm at 1/60 but the GW walls are only 135 mm to the top of the castellations, so my version will be much shorter.
I want to build it mostly in wood and card using coffee stirrers, cocktail sticks and thin section wood.
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Well then, guess we should all pack up tools now. This is going to be good.
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Nice! I like how the metal armour on the tower looks like a fist raised in threat.
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Good luck.
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This should be a fun build!
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Thank-you all for the encouraging comments.
@Burgundavia
I have entered BSC four times.
Last year was the first time I got past round 1.
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That is going to be big! :O
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I watched this for inspiration - Siege Towers attack.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcJwKVAaIWM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcJwKVAaIWM)
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Last year was the first time I got past round 1.
I have entered about the same number and never got past round one. It is always a tight competition.
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Thank-you all for the encouraging comments.
@Burgundavia
I have entered BSC four times.
Last year was the first time I got past round 1.
Well that made 2024 a record for both of us. I finished something and you nearly won!
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On Sunday, I cut up the picture of the Weta elevation drawing so that I had tower side below bridge, tower side above the bridge.
I then pasted this into word and resized the pictures so that the bridge is 135mm above ground to match the GW Minas Tirith Terrain.
This is quite a big change because the film walls are 315m high.
I also built a quick Lego model to test the dimensions with GW orcs, a Mordor troll drummer and the scenery.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54266683774_f0f680a395_k.jpg)
Based on the Lego model, I almost doubled the height of the structure over the bridge to accommodate orcs with weapons.
I stretched the side elevation to make the top platform 60mm long.
I matched the front elevation and widened it so that the top platform is 50mm wide.
I printed these off and stuck them to card.
Then I drew on the structural poles and floors with a fluorescent highlighter.
Yesterday, I projected from the WETA drawing of side, front and batch elevations to work out the wheels and chassis.
I can now calculate the materials that I will need for the framework.
I may convert the troll drummer into a pusher.
I may also buy some Morannon orcs and make a densely packed group for the top platform.
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You have been busy. I'm digging the lego mock-up.
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A good idea with the mock-up
:)
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On Wednesday, I ordered a pack of Morannon Orcs and they arrived on Thursday.
The box contains two sprues of 12 orcs. About half of these can be used or easily converted to make a densely packed group.
One figure looks easy to convert to a ladder climber.
The troll is decoration rather than part of the competition build.
I have started to convert the troll drummer to become a tower pusher.
First, I removed the drums and drumsticks.
I drilled out hands to remove remainder of drumsticks.
I sawed through the arms at the left shoulder, right elbow and both wrists.
I have reassembled the troll with arms level at shoulder height and hands pushing a horizontal pole.
I will tidy up the sawn bits with Green Stuff and repaint him.
The tower could be made in plasticard with plastic struts and sheets.
This would be strong and easy to build.
However, miniature wood joinery will look better so that is the plan for the final build.
I went to DIY store and bought some wood and wood stain, for the next round of experiments.
I stained some wooden strips to a dark brown shade.
I had problems with last year (BSC 2024 Workplace) that staining the finished workshop frames did not work very well.
Glue smears did not absorb the wood stain.
This left bright areas of the stained wood. I am hoping that staining before glueing will look better.
I think I have a good construction plan for the sides but I am still trying to work out the geometry of the chassis and the front.
The angles and corrugations are very difficult to work out.
I think there will be several prototypes before I get the right form for the front.
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I went to DIY store and bought some wood and wood stain, for the next round of experiments.
I stained some wooden strips to a dark brown shade.
I had problems with last year (BSC 2024 Workplace) that staining the finished workshop frames did not work very well.
Glue smears did not absorb the wood stain.
This left bright areas of the stained wood. I am hoping that staining before glueing will look better.
Yeah, I always forget this bit, then get annoyed at myself. lol
Looking forward to the build. I want to do something similar as well in the future.
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This is not the model. This is a second mock up in plasticard to explore the size and shape.
This is made in plasticard with various struts and bits of sprue.
I think I have a good size to fit in with the figures and the GW Minas Tirith walls.
I think the side profile is good. The front is getting there but still not quite right.
The upper front armour should have four pleats and currently only has three.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54275038471_5d48fe8ea1_k.jpg)
I will keep ripping bits off and remaking them until I am happy with the form.
To make the final version in wood, I will dismantle the plasticard mock-up to make templates.
I will need to make some form of jig to make the side profiles exactly the same size and shape.
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You sir...are making me feel really behind lol Your mock-up looks great and a cracking idea to make sure you get it scaled just right.
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You sir...are making me feel really behind lol Your mock-up looks great and a cracking idea to make sure you get it scaled just right.
I'm not even sure what to build lol
Looks great already.
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Impressive pre-production work well ahead of my own which consists of a rough sketch and locating some wooden beads and chopsticks from under the work table.
Both ends of the evolutionary scale in evidence, it seems.
I'm going to tell myself you're an engineer whilst I am an artist.
:D :D ;D
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@Spinal Tap.
You are very perceptive. I do have a degree in Mechanical Engineering but that is almost 40 years ago. I also worked in product development for many years on backpacks & sleeping bags. I work for a Swiss mountaineering equipment and clothing company in Purchasing.
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@Spinal Tap.
You are very perceptive. I do have a degree in Mechanical Engineering but that is almost 40 years ago. I also worked in product development for many years on backpacks & sleeping bags. I work for a Swiss mountaineering equipment and clothing company in Purchasing.
Wow.
If that's Mammut then I've possibly slept in one of your designs.
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Yes it is Mammut. I worked for Karrimor before that.
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Yes it is Mammut. I worked for Karrimor before that.
I still have some Karrimor stuff from the 1990's; was brilliant kit at that time.
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I was at Karrimor from 1986 to early 2001 and then I went to Mammut.
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Not much progress this week as I had a cold.
I have started to make a jig for the pleated front armour (left) and one for the side frames (right).
The side frames jig is most important. I plan to make two siege towers and that means I need four identical side frames.
This is a piece of plasticard embossed with small squares (Evergreen 4502).
Onto this I carefully drew the side frame and glued on small pieces of right angle so that the position of the frame struts and floors is fixed.
The jig is not finished yet as I need to decide on the size of the beams.
I will probably use 4mm square section wood, but 5mm will be easier to make joints.
The front jigs will allow me to build up the armour plates in pleats.
I think I will use thin plasticard and an awl to create holes representing nails or rivets.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54289159034_d2498ce257_k.jpg)
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Cracking work sir. The more I look at this plog the more and more behind I feel o_o lol
I'm looking forward to seeing you start on the real thing.
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Awesome work! Your plasticard mockup would be an acceptable final model for most of us!
Builds like this require constant test fitting and prototyping, and I love seeing others doing this (for a change lol ). I'm not in the BSC this year, but watching your process has got me turning over all kinds of ideas in my head regardless :D
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I had a quiet weekend so was able to put some time into the build.
The side frame jig enabled me to make two matching side frames in about an hour.
When the white PVA glue dried I drilled each joint with a 1.2mm drill in a pin vice.
Then I used the Dremel with a 2mm drill to drill through.
I had to do a few repairs with superglue as some of the joints separated during drilling.
I used cocktail sticks as dowels, held with PVA.
Once dry I used side cutters and an emery board to remove the extra cocktail stick.
I now have two strong and almost identical side frames.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54302475566_04a7699b77_k.jpg)
Once the sides were made I made the three floors using coffee stirrers.
I clamped about 20 coffee stirrers at a time into the Proxxon drill vice and then sawed them to 60mm long.
After a few minutes, I had 60 x 60mm planks.
The floors only took only a few minutes.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54302716389_cc42bef4d1_k.jpg)
I made a simple roof and bridge and clad one side with planks.
This also only took a few minutes but gave me the shapes and sizes for the next part.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54302716384_e57a0dbdf3_k.jpg)
Today, I started to work out the drawbridge, the roof and the front armour.
It is starting to take shape but a lot of things are not quite right and most of it will need to be done again.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54302728178_5cd074b862_k.jpg)
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Looks great, but you're going to pull it all apart? Madness
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All the individual sub assemblies are separate, and two clamps are enough to hold it together.
- Two sides with planking
- Roof
- Three floors
- Drawbridge
- Front upper armour (shape in balsa wood)
- Front lower armour
This means I can build a subassembly and then look at it and rework as needed.
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Looking great so far.
Again? You have already build six mockups including the 1/1 scale in your back garden!! lol lol
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This week I tried several things to get the front shape right.
I have tapered it so it is 80mm wide at the base and 60mm wide at the top.
This meant that I had to remake the floors and front panels.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54313484232_dc9f29501b_k.jpg)
However the shape of the front is now much better. I am happy to be on the right track.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54314596784_9fcda88ca9_k.jpg)
I might get a bit more done tomorrow but then there will be a two week pause while I go to visit factories in the Far East,
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That's looking awesome.
When are you taking orders?
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The front looks fantastic.
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HOt dam that is looking good.
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Very nice. Really happy to see such a variety of things being done.
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I arrived back from the Far East on Wednesday morning.
This weekend I worked on the wheels and chassis.
My son printed some wheels for me.
I have also started to add the armour plating with Milliput.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54346069860_ac5de2db1c_k.jpg)
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That's looking grand Mick.
I hope at some point we'll be seeing some pics of the finished model in action with your orcs fighting their way over the walls of Minas Tirith.
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Looking great Mick.
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Very nice work so far. The hides are spot on.
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I added more hides to the front and sides. It is starting to look like a thing of purpose.
The hides are simply balls of Milliput squashed and overlaid like scales.
I am not sure whether they are animal hides or iron plates. In the film they appear to be metal.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54352764558_4b78465d35_k.jpg)
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Verrrry Coool!!!
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That does look like one tough war machine.
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When using real wood for terrain/model projects, urethane stain works really well: it colors the wood, ages it, and the urethane coating makes it really durable and resistant to chemicals. A matte clear coat is necessary, but the end results look superb.
When making scratch-built terrain, it is a real challenge to get the sizes to be workable. Mock-up's are a really great idea. Using Lego's for said mock-ups is a brilliant idea. Cheers!
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The "development" siege tower is now more or less complete.
This one has been built as subassemblies so that I could easily assemble, disassemble and change bits.
I plan to build a second "finished" tower taking into account the lessons learned with this build.
The "development" tower looks good but as it was modified several times, there are some bits which don't fit very well.
In particular the front armour is quite heavy so I will need some ballast at the back to stop it falling over.
I will build a lighter version on the final model.
Front View
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54363415865_16bc68eddd_k.jpg)
Back View
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54363221509_69f578a664_k.jpg)
Subassemblies
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54363415860_e070e34884_k.jpg)
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Development model...so this isn't even the real thing?! Blimey Mick. I admire your dedicated and skills.
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In my head, I had always intended to have two towers.
I think that I need two siege towers for a balanced game.
Otherwise, if the attacker loses one tower, they have lost the game.
I think the second will be easier as I will know what I am dong and the sizes of each bit.
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I love the Red Box (not LotR) Troll pushing the Siege Tower! Very much after the Jackson LotR films.
If you have never tried The Dip Technique before, I highly recommend it for terrain pieces that need to look aged, worn, and just plain weathered. Get some urethane stain which is water based, not solvent based: dries within 30 minutes (not days, like the solvent based formulas...), very little odor when dry (again, the solvent based formulas have a strong odor that will last for 5-10 years -- seriously), durable sealant over the paint (made to be walked upon, wearing rubber soled shoes!). Any dark brown color will work: Minwax Tudor (black) is the default color, but I prefer a dark shade of Walnut stain. Apply a matte clear coat after it dries (for this, I wait a full 24+ hours, just to be sure). It is simple, effective, and fast.
I use throw-away school paint brushes (not worth bothering to clean them @ $0.30/brush) to paint it on, heavily. It will pool, and it will run down onto the bottom of the figure/terrain piece, so make sure to account for this before you apply it. Pooling too heavily in recesses can be either brushed away with a dry brush, or use the edge of a paper towel to soak it up; pooling at the base of the figure is more serious, as it tends to accumulate, heavily, on the base, so cover your work surface to avoid contamination. Nitrile gloves are a must, as it tends to get onto stuff you did not intend to apply it to.
Here is an old Marx toy Fort, made of brown HDPE plastic (https://photos.app.goo.gl/1GnPv8jbXrzere5c7). I modified it for 25mm - 28mm gaming. I beefed up the catwalks, but the outside of the fort timbers is what really shows off what urethane-stain can do for you: the HDPE plastic had very little texture molded into its surfaces, but the urethane-stain brought out what was there. I painted the hewn tips of the 'logs', along with the wooden pins holding up the catwalks on the inside, with Sunflower craft paint. The logs, themselves, were left unpainted, as they were already a brown plastic. If you zoom in, you can see more of the texture brought out by the urethane-stain -- there isn't much texture there, but it certainly brings out what was there, exceptionally well. The base is made of MDF, with the Fort Hot Glue'd to it after the urethane-stain, and the matte clear coat, were applied, and fully cured.
The Fort will not win any awards, but it is a blast to use on the tabletop. It has been a focal point in four major games, thus far, since I mod'ed it for my gaming needs. It is usually occupied by Hobgoblins (https://photos.app.goo.gl/LSRHzFThcBPaeJ49A), Orcs, or Goblins, being attacked by Humans and/or Dwarves (as in the game photo shown, the Dwarves are on the far side of the Fort).
Applying the The Dip Technique on figures will not win any painting contests, but for terrain, it is superb in its results, its ease of application, and time it will save you on weathering. It can be combined with other techniques, if desired. You can apply acrylic paints, powders, whatever, over the top of the urethane, once it is cured. Cheers!
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I plan to build a second "finished" tower taking into account the lessons learned with this build.
I knew it. You are going to build a 1/1 scale tower in your back garden. lol Bet the neighbors won't play their music loud once it is done. lol lol
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@SgtSlag,
The Troll is an official GW LOTR model. There is a plastic kit that can be made as an Isengard Troll, a Mordor Troll or a Troll drummer.
I bought the drummer on Ebay several years ago.
For this build, I am using an acrylic wood stain. In Europe, most DIY stores have switched to water based paints and wood stains.
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outstanding build :-*
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Yesterday, I started on the 2nd siege tower.
The sides are basically the same as the first tower but without the chassis and with a 10mm deep beam for the drawbridge.
I used the same template as 2nd February. I used a bench disk sander to shape the slanted joints.
Everything joined together with cocktail stick dowels.
The big difference is the chassis and wheels. This is made from 6 identical pieces of 5mm x 10mm wood cut to 105mm (underside) with 45 degree slope at the front and about 70 degrees at the back to match the rear strut. I use a pillar drill to drill three "finger-tight" holes for barbeque skewers, which gave me some flexibility to widen and narrow the chassis. When it matched the front claws from the 1st tower, I made cross beams as spacers. This rolls quite nicely.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54390747359_4e743eef11_k.jpg)
From here the whole tower was assembled with the roof beams and chassis defining the taper. This is much better construction than tower1.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54390931580_b36afff7cc_k.jpg)
I then added the roof slats and floor boards. (sorry about the focus on this pic)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54390931610_19c81200f0_k.jpg)
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This is much better construction than tower1.
Mate, this is much better constructed and engineered than anything that I build. Bravo! :o
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That looks fiddly as...tis in great shape though.
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I would suggest equipping the attackers with ladders, in addition to the two Siege Towers. If they rely entirely upon the Towers, they can only threaten the defenders at two points on the wall, allowing them to feed their troops into the mash, all too easily.
Ladders allow attackers to approach in single file, but if they employ 20 ladders + 2 Towers, that is 22 attack regions on their walls they must simultaneously defend, not just two points on the wall, where the towers are.
Search the Internet for makers of miniature ladders -- at 28mm, cast metal look the best; they paint up fast and easy, and they're inexpensive. Cheers!
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Ladders are a good idea.
Somewhere, I have the GW Uruk Hai Siege Troops set which has four ladders.
I think they would work with the walls that I have.
I plan to make some internal ladders in the siege towers.
I will probably make them with plastic rod.
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That build is looking great.
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Yesterday, I looked at the calendar in shock and thought OMG there is no way I will finish this in time.
But I decided to put some effort in.
I finished the assembly and gluing of the modular tower. This was more work than expected.
I had to do a lot of shaving and sanding to get everything to fit.
Yesterday, I hit a major snag on the second tower. I made the chassis and finished both ends.
As I started to do the planking, I tried the lower front piece from tower 1 and realised that it didn't fit at all.
I needed to make a new chassis about 8mm shorter or somehow shorten the existing one.
I worked out that I could saw it in half and remove the extra from the middle.
I did it and it worked but I feel like I cheated in my goal of a neatly built woodwork tower.
On the other hand, you only see the mistake if it is upside down.
I carried on and planked the sides.
I broke my expensive but superb Tamiya Side Cutters (74123) after using them to trim a hundred or so planks.
Here is the progress so far.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54403043771_6f043903aa_k.jpg)
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On the other hand, you only see the mistake if it is upside down.
If your armies Siege Tower is upside down, you will have other worries :)
Looking great and nice save!
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Very respectable work. Nice to see the second one coming along.
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Great looking build.
I broke my expensive but superb Tamiya Side Cutters (74123) after using them to trim a hundred or so planks.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54403043771_6f043903aa_k.jpg)
I know it's a bit late now but check out "MYLEUS Multi Angle Miter Shear". These are great for cutting coffee stirrers, balsa, bamboo skewers etc.
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Dear Ragnar
I bought a new pair of the Tamiya ones, and they arrived yesterday lol lol
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I feel very much against the clock to get these two finished by Monday but I have made good progress this week.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54414925307_ae6a14de54_k.jpg)
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We have until Monday the 7th, not this coming Monday, don't forget.
Supposed to be tools down and painting for the last week, in theory, mind you.
Those are both looking really good!
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They do look really good mate.
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Sure you'll get them done in time.
Looking forward to seeing the finished articles.
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I think I am finished.
Here is a dress rehearsal with the scenery set.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54419348121_cb610624a8_k.jpg)
I will start painting soon.
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Very nice work Mick.
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I think the orcs in the right tower have gotten a bit confused :D
They look good sir and I'm digging the scene mock up.
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Both looks really good.
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Picture sent
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The Towers are gorgeous! Really looking forward to seeing the castle wall sections, towers, etc., painted. These will be really sweet eye candy! Cheers!
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Here is the finished pair of towers.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54537770591_62f978f9c6_b.jpg)
I will set up some wargames pictures with the scenery set.
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really nice
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Well cool.
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Those are lovely. Final paint job really does the job.
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They really do have a brutal, solid look. Excellent execution sir.
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Brilliant, love 'em.
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I have bought some Gondor Ruins and the Tower.
Slowly getting closer to a game with the siege towers.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54726874920_10087b5215_b.jpg)
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excellent