Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => The Second World War => Topic started by: brotherAkkyshan on February 01, 2010, 02:28:28 AM
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After a series of 'wasted' 28mm WWII purchases (bad castings, broken or deformed weaponry, etc) from a number of reputable (and it has to be said, much loved) miniature companies I have decided to turn my back on 'Gods own scale' and take a look at 15mm instead. Now as I was working on a historical/Weird War take on the defence of Berlin in April 1945 I'd quite like to do the same this time. For this reason I'm wondering if anyone does 15mm 'Volkssturm' and 'Hitlerjugend' models? Also can anyone recommend a ruleset that will allow me to mix these 'militia' type units with regular Wehmacht and Waffen-SS units? I may also want the option to add a little Weird Warness in the form of DP9's excellent Walkers!
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Peter Pig (http://www.peterpig.co.uk/german.htm)
also check out the spares section.
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Cheers for that redzed! There lloks to be almost all I could need in place... now have to track down a Königstiger. I'm going to use Untersharfuhrer Georg Diers' King Tiger as the centre piece of the force. Lots of Volkssturm, panzerfausts, etc. I may even do some scenary pieces, ruined SDKFZ 251's, that sort of thing.
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Peter Pig do a few wrecked vehicles as resin casts they look pretty good, including a wrecked 251.
They have a few Volksturm figures, but if you need more variety, there are some "tatty Russian partisans" in the WWI range (armed with rifles) that mix in ok.
No HJ yet, although if you email Martin and ask he might put it on the wanted list.
If you're looking at WWWII, Peter Pig have a Maus, plus the Panther with infra red fittings..
Kerr & King have a street barricade made from a wrecked tram too.
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Thanks for the Kerr&King link fastolfrus, that is some fantastic looking stuff they have there! I especially agree about the wrecked tram. I think I remember reading in the Joachim Fest book about the last few days of the war in Berlin that the army were using wrecked trams as make-shift hospitals... I think that'll be going on my list second after a Flames of War 'Königstiger' to represent Georg Diers tank (number 314 I believe - said to have taken out around 30 t-34's!). This supported by Volkssturm units will be my starting point. :D
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I would recommend looking at a book called "Bloody Streets" by Stephan Hamilton, published by Helion, although you'll probably want to order it through the library as (although it's a fairly recent book) it's now out of print and Amazon are charging £170 a copy. Abe Books are £120 a copy.
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Cheers for the suggestion fastolfrus, think I might try through the Inter-Library Loan service for that one! I'm mainly using the Fest book (though it's very short and doesn't really go into much military detail) and Anthony Beevors, Berlin. Thinking of investing in 'The Last Battle' by Ryan Cornelius too as that seems to get mentioned alot.
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I have spotted bloody streets in a waterstone just before Xmas and the price was more around 30 quid!
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Bloody Streets is out of print at present, but £30 would be a very good price.
It has a lot of detail - it goes through things day-by-day, and includes a lot of air-recon photos and maps.
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Does anyone have any experience with the FOW stuff in terms of the quality of the models. Their's is the only King Tiger I've found so far is it worth the £12 asking price? Also which book would most likely cover the Fall of Berlin? I'm guessing Fortress Europe as it covers the late war. Only asking as it seems most people in this neck of the woods are playing FOW.
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If you are talking quality of Battle Front models, their products are reliably good. As to FoW books, while the FE one is appropriate, I'm not sure the KT is in that book. The newer Hells Highway or the imminent Arnhem book (Feb 2010) are probably more suitable to use of a KT and I am led to believe that there will be a scenario (in the Arnhem book) that would suit the town type fighting that occurred in Berlin. That particular scenario will relate to Frost's defence of his end of the bridge and portion of the town that he held, albeit without armoured support.
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Does anyone have any experience with the FOW stuff in terms of the quality of the models.
Figures are average to awful.
The vehicles/artillery are average to excellent, some of their models are resin though and have an integral base.
Try the FOW forums (from the Battlefront homepage)
also Wargames@Nordalia (http://jeremy.nandgate.com/) has extensive reviews on various bits of 15mm bits of kit.
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Can't comment on FoW rules, but their vehicles are generally reasonable, although sometimes not the cheapest option.
As for King Tigers, Skytrex have a couple (and currently only £8.50).
Skytrex also have quite a good range of 15mm guns and equipment
http://www.skytrex.com/
I don't overly rate Skytrex figures, prefer Peter Pig for figures.
Essex have 15mm WWII figures too.
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Just been down to the local 'Hobbycraft' and had a good browse through the Flames of War section. The models (the ones I could see through the blisters) look variable in quality. Some were obviously a little 'mis-cast' so that makes me a little weary of buying the 'Königstiger' as its boxed. Also £12.49 seems a little expensive compared to the Peter Pig and Skytrex stuff I've seen online. Also has a flick through the rulebooks. They seem a little restictive in what you can and can't field. As there is no 'intelligence book' that covers the battle of Berlin I don't think this is the ruleset for me. I might have a look at Agis' Battlefield Evolutions: World at War, as it seems to be more 'late war' orientated. Does anyone know how well the rules translate to 15mm?
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Locally we tend to play "PBI" - a very different set of rules - and aimed at infantry company sized actions, although it is possible to play larger actions (we did Arnhem last year). There is a cut down version free on the Peter Pig website (very cut down, but it might give you some idea)
Otherwise the only rules I've got experience of was "Rapid Fire", but haven't played those for quite a while. We used to play RF in 20mm so should be easy to downsize to 15s.
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PBI? Is that Peter Pigs "Poor Bloody Infantry" ruleset? I think I've seen this, it divides the playing area into squares if I remember. Does it use a points system? What are the army lists like (if there are army lists!)? I'm assuming I'd be able to use Volkssturm units as Peter Pig manufacture them. I'd also want to take the King Tiger and a couple of smaller tanks supported by Waffen-SS (probably the Nordland) units. Is that possible?
Sorry about alll the question fastolfus... you've been a great help so far! I'm currently awaiting a copy of 'Bloody Streets' from the local library! :D
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You can get PBI, including the free Quick Start version here:
http://www.peterpig.co.uk/rules.htm
But take a look at Crossfire too:
http://crossfire.wargaming.info
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But take a look at Crossfire too:
http://crossfire.wargaming.info
I'm awaiting for Crossfire2 to be released, sometime soon hopefully.
The other 'big' WW2 game is 'I Ain't Been Shot Mum' by Too Fat Lardies (http://toofatlardies.co.uk/) a truly unique game
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Yes PBI is Poor Bloody Infantry.
It uses a squared board, so no measuring ranges or movement, and no argument about am I in cover or not, squares are set as open, partial terrain, or closed terrain.
There is a basic points list, a volksturm company is feasible with veteran tanks in support, but the game is aimed at company sized infantry actions.
Larger games are possible, but you need to get used to the rules first.
The rules book contains army lists, about half the book really, and there are some online scenarios etc on the yahoo RFCM group.
Keep an eye on UK shows, Peter Pig often take a participation game with them to shows, at Vapnartak (this coming Sunday in York) it will be PBI.
It gives you the chance to see the rules in action, or even sample them.
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=11923.0