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Miniatures Adventure => Colonial Adventures => Topic started by: ushistoryprof on 10 March 2010, 08:37:38 PM

Title: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 10 March 2010, 08:37:38 PM
I am looking for 28mm US Marines in the soft hat, often called a "Montana."

Does anyone make these besides Pulp Figures?
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: traveller on 10 March 2010, 08:45:00 PM
Brigade Games has them in their Caribbean range. They mix well with Pulp figures
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Smokeyrone on 10 March 2010, 09:54:57 PM
Brigade Games has them in their Caribbean range. They mix well with Pulp figures

yeppers.   And while there, don't forget  to take a gander at their sandanistas, Haitians and haitian Zombies.

Do I sense a  Chesty Puller or Smedley Butler scenario in the works, professor?   :)
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 11 March 2010, 12:09:46 AM
yeppers.   And while there, don't forget  to take a gander at their sandanistas, Haitians and haitian Zombies.

Do I sense a  Chesty Puller or Smedley Butler scenario in the works, professor?   :)
Yes I was looking a some Banana Wars island actions in the Caribbean, Dan Daly, Butler and the like. Thanks for the idea about the other figures.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: carlos marighela on 11 March 2010, 12:44:38 AM
A couple more to add to the mix. I suspect some of the figures in Old Glory's 'Poncho Villa' [sic] range would work. They are in shirtsleeves and Montana Hat and allegedly are some of the best OG figures has ever cast. The photos on their site do seem to bear this out.

Greg Blake sculpted some fairly indifferent USMC figures for China between the wars but they do have some unique items like mounted Marines, which you probably want for Nicaragua. These are now available through Blaze Away miniatures. On balance I think the Brigade figures look the best although some of the hats have brims like traffic cones and they are sold in silly and expensively sized packs, still always good to have some variety.

I used to have a link to a report by a very young Matthew Ridgway who was serving as an observer of the Marines operations in Nicaragua. I lost it when my old hard drive died but if you like I'll have a look for it. Gives some interesting detail on the breakdown and TO&E of USMC battalions down to company level and you can extrapolate the data for smaller sub-units.

Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Smokeyrone on 11 March 2010, 01:21:14 AM
You know, that's where the first "dive bombing" by aircraft was invented, by the Marines, no less, at least according to John Keegan and others.

I love the whole banana wars gaming.  I even bought a freind "Savage Wars of Peace" in hopes of luring him into future games, and it worked.

(I LOL when I watch "Up In Smoke" and Chong's dad says "I can get you a job with United Fruit Company.  You can start by picking bananas, and maybe you can move up to strawberries!" )  lol lol lol

I think it's "Outpost" miniatures, that has a new 15mm range of Pacific War figs, that intrigues me.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 11 March 2010, 04:12:25 AM
Thanks for all the great ideas!  I hadn't thought of Marine bi-wing divebombers, cool. 
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 11 March 2010, 04:14:53 AM
A couple more to add to the mix. I suspect some of the figures in Old Glory's 'Poncho Villa' [sic] range would work. They are in shirtsleeves and Montana Hat and allegedly are some of the best OG figures has ever cast. The photos on their site do seem to bear this out.

Greg Blake sculpted some fairly indifferent USMC figures for China between the wars but they do have some unique items like mounted Marines, which you probably want for Nicaragua. These are now available through Blaze Away miniatures. On balance I think the Brigade figures look the best although some of the hats have brims like traffic cones and they are sold in silly and expensively sized packs, still always good to have some variety.

I used to have a link to a report by a very young Matthew Ridgway who was serving as an observer of the Marines operations in Nicaragua. I lost it when my old hard drive died but if you like I'll have a look for it. Gives some interesting detail on the breakdown and TO&E of USMC battalions down to company level and you can extrapolate the data for smaller sub-units.


Thanks for the info Carlos, the TO&E info would be very helpful if it's not too much of a hassle.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Cory on 11 March 2010, 03:49:42 PM
We've done some skirmishing using the late Nicaraguan period 4 man Marine squad with 1 BAR, 1 Tommy gun, 1 rifle, and one shotgun. Definitely gives the Marines a different feel than their opponents.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: postal on 12 March 2010, 11:03:48 AM
I love to see people doing more MARINES in thier games SEMPER FI.Yeah were the first to use combine arms.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Smokeyrone on 12 March 2010, 02:06:26 PM
I love to see people doing more MARINES in thier games SEMPER FI.Yeah were the first to use combine arms.

That's what I heard in a Keegan inteview, when he said that three of the five great modern concepts of war were "developed"  (not the best word IMO, I think he mean't "Popularized"/"put into practice"?) by US Marines (Dive Bombing, Amphibious Invasion and helicopters)

I know William the Conquerer might have a thing or two to say to Keegan about amphib operations?   :)

Yes Postal, Marines rock!   :D
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 12 March 2010, 05:14:14 PM
Thanks for all the great input guys.  Below are two links for those interested in US Marines, the first is a photo of my son a pfc (soon to be lance corporal) and the second is a unit of WWI Marines I painted last week. 

http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/2010/03/pfc-thomas-wall.html

http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/2010/03/1918-us-marine-devil-dogs-going-through.html
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Smokeyrone on 12 March 2010, 05:24:00 PM
Thanks for all the great input guys.  Below are two links for those interested in US Marines, the first is a photo of my son a pfc (soon to be lance corporal) and the second is a unit of WWI Marines I painted last week. 

http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/2010/03/pfc-thomas-wall.html

http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/2010/03/1918-us-marine-devil-dogs-going-through.html

That's great, prof.  Congratulations on your son!

 Pensacola, eh?  That's Seminole territory  lol

And nice paint job.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: carlos marighela on 24 March 2010, 12:12:03 AM
Ok so it took some time. Frustratingly the bookmark at the Army Historical Centre has moved but here are some notes I made on another forum:

After the better part of two years I have re discovered a document on the web that provides a great deal of organisational detail for the USMC in Nicaragua.  Notes on Operations in Nicaragua, July 1927 - October 1928 by a certain Captain Matthew Ridgway is instructive reading, confirming some of the detail Greg put into his article on the Marines in CPQ12.  The document is an official report made by Ridgway to the Chief of Infantry, detailing the nature and conduct of operations.Whilst unfortunately the document is missing the appendices detailing the official peace strength regimental and brigade TOEs the text in the body makes fascinating reading, including the observation that the USMC battalions were similarly configured to US army battalions at peace strengths.
 
For those interested the USMC forces involved in the Nicaraguan expedition consisted of the USMC 2nd Brigade, made up of the 5th Marines, the 11th Marines and a 'Battle Fleet Regiment (Provisional)" drawn from the fleet units supporting the occupation. The 5th and 11th Regiments each consisted of 3 battalions, each of 3 rifle companies and an MG company. the 2nd battalion of the 5th Marines being drawn from fleet detachments of the Scouting Fleet. The Battle Fleet Provisonal Regiment consisted of 2 battalions, each of 4 rifle companies.
 
Ridgway goes on to detail the rifle companies right down to the distribution of weapons . The rifle companies were of 2 platoons each of 4 squads. Ridgeway lists the weapons distribution of a typical company, the 45th Company, which interestingly enough as well as the 8 BARs and 8 Thompson SMGs (one each per squad) includes 4 Browning MMGs , 1 3" trench Mortar and one 1 Pdr (AKA the 37mm Infantry Gun). he further notes that the Machine gun company had a provisional organisation of  a four gun MMG platoon plus a "howitzer section'' of  one 3" trench mortar and one 1 Pdr (37mm IG).
 
It seems, perhaps not surpsrisingly, that on actual operations the 37mm gun was largely deployed in static garrison locations and that only the 3" trench mortar was utilised, accompanying 'strong patrols' presumably for planned assaults.
 
All this seems to suggest on the basis of the battalion holdings (12 MMG, 4  3" Stokes mortars and 4 37mm Infantry guns) that the USMC battalions (and presumably from Ridgway's remarks concerning the similarity of organisation) US Army battalions.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: carlos marighela on 24 March 2010, 12:18:54 AM
And here is the original link: http://www.carlisle.army.mil/cgi-bin/usamhi/DL/showdoc.pl?docnum=7. Alas it just takes you to the general CMH site now. I've searched without joy for the document but it's somewhere on their files.

Orginal document is Notes on Operations in Nicaragua, July 1927 - October 1928. As I pointed out in my earlier post it's a fairly faint copy of the original and alas missing the tables at the end but it is a fascinating read. Hopefully someone will have more jo y than me and can post a direct link to the document.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: Aaron on 24 March 2010, 11:45:56 AM
I checked the Combined Arms Research Library to no avail, but entering your title into the search field did yield some other works that might be of interest. http://cgsc.cdmhost.com/cdm4/results.php?CISOOP1=all&CISOFIELD1=CISOSEARCHALL&CISORESTMP=%2Fcdm4%2Fresults.php&CISOVIEWTMP=%2Fcdm4%2Fitem_viewer.php&CISOMODE=grid&CISOGRID=thumbnail%2CA%2C1%3Btitle%2CA%2C1%3Bcreato%2CA%2C1%3Bdescri%2C200%2C1%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%3B20%3Btitle%2Ccreato%2Cdate%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOBIB=title%2CA%2C1%2CN%3Bsubjec%2CA%2C0%2CN%3Bdescri%2C200%2C0%2CN%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%2CN%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%2CN%3B20%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOTHUMB=20+%284x5%29%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOTITLE=20%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOHIERA=20%3Bsubjec%2Ctitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOBOX1=Operations+in+Nicaragua%2C+July+1927+-+October+1928&CISOROOT=all (http://cgsc.cdmhost.com/cdm4/results.php?CISOOP1=all&CISOFIELD1=CISOSEARCHALL&CISORESTMP=%2Fcdm4%2Fresults.php&CISOVIEWTMP=%2Fcdm4%2Fitem_viewer.php&CISOMODE=grid&CISOGRID=thumbnail%2CA%2C1%3Btitle%2CA%2C1%3Bcreato%2CA%2C1%3Bdescri%2C200%2C1%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%3B20%3Btitle%2Ccreato%2Cdate%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOBIB=title%2CA%2C1%2CN%3Bsubjec%2CA%2C0%2CN%3Bdescri%2C200%2C0%2CN%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%2CN%3Bnone%2CA%2C0%2CN%3B20%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOTHUMB=20+%284x5%29%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOTITLE=20%3Btitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOHIERA=20%3Bsubjec%2Ctitle%2Cnone%2Cnone%2Cnone&CISOBOX1=Operations+in+Nicaragua%2C+July+1927+-+October+1928&CISOROOT=all)
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 24 March 2010, 08:01:21 PM
Thanks Carlos and Aaron for all the great information.  I just got my first figures for this project from Pulp Figures and all your assistance has shown me what pieces to get to full up my unit.  Thanks again for all the work you did in finding this info!
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: postal on 24 March 2010, 11:09:04 PM
outstanding ushistoryprof tell your son semper fi for me,I had a boot camp buddy from canyon country I use to live in the antolope valley.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 24 March 2010, 11:41:05 PM
outstanding ushistoryprof tell your son semper fi for me,I had a boot camp buddy from canyon country I use to live in the antolope valley.
I very proud of Tom, he is now with the 26th MEU training for depolyment in September.  My over all project is to do a minimum USMC platoon strength unit (as correct as possible), and hostiles,for each war the Marines were in from the Revolution to present day.  I finished WW I, am completing Spanish American (the Spanish have to wait) and am starting Banana Wars.  When I'm done Tom and I will be able to skirmish at any time period he wants to when he is home on leave.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: carlos marighela on 24 March 2010, 11:55:43 PM
It might be a little too 'up close and personal' for him upon return but if you are covering off all the time periods for the USMC then you might want some of these:

http://eurekamin.com.au/news.php?newsid=EkylZFEuFAJQTJpZVW.

Brigade Games do USMC for the Great War and I'm sure someone does them for the Barbary Pirates/ Shores of Tripoli era. You could even sneak in some gangster figures as you might recall that marines were deployed as guards on mail trains during the 1930s.

Good luck with the project and safe travels for your son.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: postal on 28 March 2010, 02:06:44 PM
very good I love to here that.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: ushistoryprof on 10 April 2010, 08:09:20 PM
Here are my first Banana War USMC troops that I have painted for this project. A section of Springfield armed Marines with a 12 gauge Trench Gun and Tommygn for support.  My next set of troops will be a Browning MG, BAR, officers and additional infantry to bring the unit up to squad strength. 
[/img](http://i955.photobucket.com/albums/ae36/ushistoryprof/011.jpg)


If you want to see additional pics check my blog:

http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/search/label/USMC%20Miniatures
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: carlos marighela on 10 April 2010, 08:44:32 PM
Nice!
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: traveller on 11 April 2010, 07:25:05 AM
Cool  :o
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: postal on 12 April 2010, 11:48:21 AM
ooh SEMPER FI!thats some great work you done.
Title: Re: USMC 1920's Heavy Weapons Added
Post by: ushistoryprof on 28 July 2010, 12:48:16 AM
Nothing makes you day better than more added firepower.  For my 1920's USMC detachment I added the following support. A .30 Cal Browning two Lewis guns, a Tommygun, Trench Gun and BAR.  Some serious firepower for any occasion. [/img](http://i955.photobucket.com/albums/ae36/ushistoryprof/Worldhistoryprof%20miniatures/ShellysHouse2019.jpg)


more pics are here:
 http://worldhistoryprof.blogspot.com/search/label/USMC%20Miniatures

Thanks for looking, Prof
Title: Re: USMC 1920's
Post by: S J Donovan on 28 July 2010, 05:03:53 AM
Try this website http://www.sandinorebellion.com/HomePages/airwar.html loads of information