Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Fantasy Adventures => Topic started by: joroas on 10 September 2010, 07:58:41 PM
-
Just announced:
This is going to be a season for "firsts" - our first set in the new "Legacy of the Greeks" range (Persians), our first set in our "Horse & Musket: War of the Spanish Succession" range (WSS Infantry), our first set of Alternate History (Amazons), AND our first set for our fantasy range - Orcs!
(And, just between you, me, and the pixels - there are going to be several other seconds, thirds, fourths, and fifths over the coming weeks!)
The Orc Warband will feature bodies with separate torsos and legs for massive customization and a LOAD of arms, heads, shields, and weapons to make your horde as deadly as possible!
http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wargamesfactory.com%2FAnnouncementRetrieve.aspx%3FID%3D35407&h=f512d
-
You got me kind of excited then but it's Wargames Factory, not Warlord :-[
-
Hmmm .... the Amazons may be worth a look for Conan or PULP gaming.
-
Sorry, too excited, have now changed the title. :'(
-
I'm looking forward to them. My Saxons and Vikings have been coming along exceptionally well. A huge improvement over the Zombie set. The figures scale well with my GW Lord of the Rings miniatures, so I'm happy to get some more variety. It looks like my suggestion for the Medusa head for the Amazons may even happen. :)
-
they could be nice!
i'm happy, the time of alternative big armies instead of warhammer is starting...
there will be people at tournaments with not-yo!-man orks and realistic empire! :P
-
Wow, I go to Italy for 2 weeks and WF announce they're releasing the Amazons! I hope they're good, I've been pushing for them for months...
-
I really like the Angus Mcbride inspired Orcs
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_A_kUWzaUDUA/SpsJkaBQYmI/AAAAAAAAAdQ/K62HlsOA8RE/s1600-h/orcs.jpg)
but I'm not sure about the miniature's quality... going to have to wait and see
http://www.wargamesfactory.com/announcements/first-orc-render
Are there any other orcs like these in 28mm?
-
There ought to be some older metal orcs based on those designs, maybe Ral Partha or Genadier?
-
Hasslefree do some nice multiparts like the Mcbride art
http://www.hasslefreeminiatures.co.uk/pack.php?pack=1845
-
the grenadier orcs are different, they have their own charm and I also like them very much
the ral partha ones are a bit on the small side and aren't that different from the usual orc style
those hasslefree ones are really nice, didn't knew them! :-*
thanks for the info
-
First shot of the Persian sprues. Something along the lines of 38 figures for twenty dollars. I was thinking of using them as Haradrim, although they could work as non combatants.
(http://www.wargamesfactory.com/Images/WF41-PersiansSprue.jpg)
-
First shot of the Persian sprues...
I’m confused, they look nothing like the Persians in 300… lol
-
I like the sound of the Amazons... but... females seem hard to do well in 28mm. Some like Kev White's are spot-on, others just don't look right somehow. I've spoken to a couple of sculptors whose male figures are superb and they admitted that females are very tricky, so I'm dubious as to whether WF can do a good job.
Decent, cheap WSS infantry would be very useful as pirate-fodder and the orc pic is right up my street, so if they can manage replicate that I'll be a happy bunny :)
-
but... females seem hard to do well in 28mm.
you're right. the female faces are pretty hard to make; the best way is sculpting some barechests, to show clearly the difference!
i like those persians. they look really plain, but with a GREAT paintjob they could became pretty cool! :)
-
you're right. the female faces are pretty hard to make; the best way is sculpting some barechests, to show clearly the difference!
lol And draw the eyes away from the figure's face maybe ;)
-
I like the plain look, that will give me some options in terms of conversions.
you're right. the female faces are pretty hard to make; the best way is sculpting some barechests, to show clearly the difference!
i like those persians. they look really plain, but with a GREAT paintjob they could became pretty cool! :)
-
Well they are doing mini sprues at this point. A sprue with 300 Persian Immortal heads, and Viking bodies. That might look about right.
I’m confused, they look nothing like the Persians in 300… lol
-
Well they are doing mini sprues at this point. A sprue with 300 Persian Immortal heads, and Viking bodies. That might look about right.
actually, ninja-samurai bodies are neede for the immortals.
with some zombie heads (also from WF) for the uncovered ones... :P
-
I don't think there are any 28mm plastic samurai kits out there. ???
actually, ninja-samurai bodies are neede for the immortals.
with some zombie heads (also from WF) for the uncovered ones... :P
-
Looking forward to seeing more about these figures, especially the orcs.
-
The Test sprues have arrived. Here are some pics!
(http://www.wargamesfactory.com/Images/Orc-TestShots.jpg)
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs644.snc4/60458_436745211058_334302786058_5741343_1880739_n.jpg)
Looking forward to swelling the ranks of Mordor with these minis. :D
-
AAARRHHHHHHGGHHGHH
uglllyyyy aarrmmpiiiiiittssssssss
not bad for the sculpts, but the joints seems to be... pretty old-style. it reminds me some of the Drakonian range that i've hidden somewhere...
-
Didn't notice the arms. On some of them it might not look too bad, others I may have to do a bit of conversion / putty work. No biggie for me, I tend to use putty as a basing material.
-
As always with this company FAIL.
The arms don't fit, the weapons don't look like they are being held, merely hovering or glued to the hand and the detail is soft as anything. There is no convincing movement in the sculpts and it is pretty clear where the two halves of the mold meet. Wasting any time trying to get these to look even a little bit better is precious time you will never get back. Citadel was out performing them in '85 with their plastics.
I honestly can't see this company ever making a decent set.
-
that's the result of making only 3d sculpts.... ok for the sci-fi guys, but for the others the old uman hand gives other results... as shown by WG and Perry...
-
Really, 1985 citadel plastics outperforming them? Could you post some unpainted examples so we can compare.
As always with this company FAIL.
The arms don't fit, the weapons don't look like they are being held, merely hovering or glued to the hand and the detail is soft as anything. There is no convincing movement in the sculpts and it is pretty clear where the two halves of the mold meet. Wasting any time trying to get these to look even a little bit better is precious time you will never get back. Citadel was out performing them in '85 with their plastics.
I honestly can't see this company ever making a decent set.
-
citadel always used to make much "fat" miniatures, and their parts fitted pretty well, since the joint werent like sphere and cavity, but just flat ones...
the sphere - cavity grants you many more poses, but it is quite hard to sculpt enought good minis!
and i agree that tose orks are a totally fail!
like their zombies.
i'm much pleased by their historical range... quite good mixed with gripping beast or WF
-
http://www.solegends.com/citjour85bautumn/citjour85b057-01.htm
The picture isn't great but I have a regiment of these guys and once painted there is little difference between them and the lead command with them.
These are from '85 and whilst the detail is probably as soft as the rubbish from over the pond the pose actually works with some dynamism, the weapons don't float, the body doesn't fit together like a bunch of clearly separate parts and there was no clean up needed.
These Orcs can't even best a 25 year old competitor lol.
I'm also not convinced by their historical offerings, they are not terrible but better can be had for your money.
-
lol, they are so different that are pretty hard do make a comparison... ???
-
Well, I am going to have to politely disagree with you gentlemen, and leave it at that.
-
:)
-
Well, I am going to have to politely disagree with you gentlemen, and leave it at that.
And this here is why I love this forum.
-
Is there any pictures of the Dwarf WIP?
-
Is there any pictures of the Dwarf WIP?
Not yet. According to the coming soon page they are still being sculpted. Figure we should see one sooner than later.
-
Interestingly (I think it's interesting anyway) WF just won the 'Best New Historicals Range' vote over at TMP (http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/2010/09/23/the-votes-are-tallied-and-its-official/) for their Vikings. Not definitive proof that they're great figures, but they certainly seem to have impressed some people that they can get things right.
I've been a supporter of WF for a while not necessarily because they've yet produced the greatest minis in the world but because I really want the idea to work. As a model for how a comapny organises its production I think it could be absolutely awesome.
Sadly for me, the 'Amazon' models they've produced are not the Ancient Greek/South American/fantasy Atlantean mashup some of us were advocating, but fairly straight 'fantasy Greek' models. Nothing wrong with that, they're talking about doing Centaurs and other creatures from Greek mythology, so perhaps we can expect a kind of Odyssey/Jason and the Argonauts style background and mini range, but it knocks my plans for female Atlanteans back a bit, as well as the Tekemul potential of the original Fantasy Amazon sprue, I would think...
-
the weapons don't look like they are being held, merely hovering or glued to the hand
I think this is the biggest issue with their way of doing things, btw. I would much prefer weapons molded into the hands, then alternative weapons with hands molded on, so I just had to cut off the hand with the unwanted weapon and polycement the new one on. Would improve the looks a whole lot.
-
The arm/torso join in those pictures does look like it needs a bit of work. But I like the overall style of these figures.
-
I've mentioned this on their boards. The figures are a pain to put together until you get a rhythm going. Having the hands attached to the weapons would be a better idea, even if the hands were separate from the arms.
I think this is the biggest issue with their way of doing things, btw. I would much prefer weapons molded into the hands, then alternative weapons with hands molded on, so I just had to cut off the hand with the unwanted weapon and polycement the new one on. Would improve the looks a whole lot.
-
I guess the complaints here is a product of 3D computer modeled models, versus sculpted.
I have some Vikings and Saxons to review from them soon, so I'll see how well they go together, and if they look unnatural once assembled, or not. However, the Shock Troops models were quite nice I thought, and at a $20 bill for 18 models I couldn't complain too much about them.
I think even for 3D computer generated stuff, they have place in the market. Also eventually as the software evolves more, they'll be able to pull off a lot nicer sculpts, it's only a matter of time.
-
the Shock Troops models were quite nice I thought, and at a $20 bill for 18 models I couldn't complain too much about them.
The Shock Tropops have their right hand molded onto the handle of the gun, which looks more natural.
I don't really like the 'open hand' solution - I would still not hesitate to use the vikings/saxons as fillers for army units, as they are a cheap alternative to other models, but for small warbands/skirmish games I would choose other options, if for the hands, only - Gripping Beast's plastic Viking Hirdmen is a good example with 44 minis for £18 (£0.41 each).
-
I really like wargames factory stuff. I got a couple of shock troopers and zombies and the level of detail is just as good or better than most and the actual design choices are the best in the bluishness in my opinion.
The only problem are that the zombies are a bit small and have very realistic propotions so they can be difficult to paint. I carved down the necks on the shock troopers and used the long neck joint for the zombies to make them have unnatural poses. If a great painter gave the wargames factory zombies a chance I think a lot of people would change their mind. I really do not understand where all the dislike of wargames factory comes from? They are going for their own style of figures and should not be compared to games workshop at all. The shocktroopers guns are not at all lasguns, the zombies are VERY unlike warhammer zombies in every way.
In fact I think its sad that people do not open their eyes for wargames factory. Their shock troopers are amazingly cool and the realistic propotions of their zombies makes them a lot more scary than regular comical zombies.
Sorry for going on a minor rant its just that I have been a miniature fan since the 90'ties and its first now I seen entire lines from a company that makes cool, cheap minis that does not have unnecessary details.
-
The Shock Troopers were a huge improvement. I loved that the guns were attached, made the figures so much easier to assemble. Around the same time I put together some Starship Troopers plastic marines, they were an utter pain in the arse. Most of them didn't come out looking right.
When they eventually get to producing WWII minis I hope they go the shock trooper route and have the rifles and machine guns attached. The computer generated greens seem to suggest they are going to do it that way.
The Shock Tropops have their right hand molded onto the handle of the gun, which looks more natural.
I don't really like the 'open hand' solution - I would still not hesitate to use the vikings/saxons as fillers for army units, as they are a cheap alternative to other models, but for small warbands/skirmish games I would choose other options, if for the hands, only - Gripping Beast's plastic Viking Hirdmen is a good example with 44 minis for £18 (£0.41 each).
-
Around the same time I put together some Starship Troopers plastic marines, they were an utter pain in the arse.
I never managed to assemble more than 3 plastic cap troopers. I can paint an entire orc warband for LotR Battle Companies in the same time that it takes me to trim and assemble one of those lol
Absolutely crazy level of multi-parting - and almost entirely impossible to get the arms/weapons right :`
When they eventually get to producing WWII minis I hope they go the shock trooper route and have the rifles and machine guns attached. The computer generated greens seem to suggest they are going to do it that way.
I hope they go for that solution on all new sets they produce - and I would like to see a reboot of the existing ancient/dark age sets with remolded hands as well. Would make me much more likely to buy them.
And as I'm reading Bernard Cornwells story about Uthred of Bebbanburg (in bits - havingnot much time for reading...) I have an urge for vikings and saxons ;)
-
Funny you mention LotR. That's why I started collecting some of their ancient lines. The Vikings, Germans and Saxons are rounding out my forces of men. I'm eagerly awaiting the upcoming orcs.
The Starship troopers minis make the WF figures look easy. The zombies irritated me to no end, but I stuck it out and assembled / painted ten of them. With the Starship Troopers, I put together three of them and quit. The heads are nice, with the plastic see through visor. Given I got them on the cheap, they are going to stay in my closet till I come up with a use for them.
I never managed to assemble more than 3 plastic cap troopers. I can paint an entire orc warband for LotR Battle Companies in the same time that it takes me to trim and assemble one of those lol
Absolutely crazy level of multi-parting - and almost entirely impossible to get the arms/weapons right :`
I hope they go for that solution on all new sets they produce - and I would like to see a reboot of the existing ancient/dark age sets with remolded hands as well. Would make me much more likely to buy them.
And as I'm reading Bernard Cornwells story about Uthred of Bebbanburg (in bits - havingnot much time for reading...) I have an urge for vikings and saxons ;)
-
Weapons molded onto hands would be one step, I wouldn't be adverse to arms molded onto torsos either. A choice of legs, torso & arms, weapon hands and head would still allow variety. When they first came out I had a lot of good will for them, the Romans were pants but a first try so we let that slide. They've been going a few years now and still haven't learned...
When I can pick up lead historicals for the same price as these they really need to pick up the quality to compete. I really hope they do but taking the vikings as an example I waited a long time for them to finally be released and they were a big disappointment.
-
I actually like the first Roman set. Have it, and have assembled and primed a handful of them for use with Song of Spear and Shield. They are not Foundry quality, true, but they are VERY cheap, and one can actually make more different poses than you would think at first, although the sword arms have limited possibilites.
When judging WF minis, always remember they are meant for massed battles (like Field of Glory), and not for each individual figure to stand out on its own, as we are used to seeing it here - the Shock Troops are more targeted towards skirmish/non-unit games, and has a style and appearance that suits that role.
My first thought when seeing the vikings and saxons was also 'nice fillers for Rohan and other human factions', but the hands still put me off a bit - I think the open hands make them look more like action toys than wargames minis, somehow (if you know what I mean).
My overall feeling about WF is positive. They do some sets that I don't like much, like the colonials, and I hope they'll start changing their approach to hands on melee troops, but all in all it is nice to have a company producing minis at an affordable price, that can then easily be used for kit-bashing if the basic product does not quite fit the bill. Not that I have the time for kit-bashing, atm, but still :)
-
I really like wargames factory stuff. I got a couple of shock troopers and zombies and the level of detail is just as good or better than most and the actual design choices are the best in the bluishness in my opinion.
I have to disagree a little. I have bought both the zombie and the shock troopers set. The shock troopers are decent quality, only a few oddities in the way the greatcoats flow, but nothing serious. Having said that, I hope it is obvious that I'm not a blind WGF hater. The zombies however did not have very crisp details at all and a coat of primer followed by paint makes it worse. The heads seemed particularly bad.
On a lot of their other sets, and these orcs don't appear to be different, the arm-torso connection appears obvious and unrealistic. The open hand option is also a designchoice that simply doesn't look as good as sculpting the hands on the weapons.
They have vastly improved in terms of moulding quality and made some progress in terms of overall design, but there's still some way to go in the designing stage.
To be fair, I also think some of the current GW plastic sets are a step back from earlier sets too, like the empire state troops and handgunners/crossbowmen or the dwarves.
-
Yes, the Starship trooper CAP plastics were a pain, and don't come out looking right either, although the metal ones were pretty good.
Didn't care for the GW Empire swordsmen/halberdier handgunners/crosbowmen sets either - but then they turned around and released those excellent plastic greatswords and archers.
I think Wargames Factory is improving. I hate wrist-to-hand joins with metal figures, but it works pretty well with plastics. Maybe if we just keep making the point...
-
I suggested hands and weapons being attached on their forums. Some of their lines do have torsos with one arm attached, the Celts and the Zombies. I'd like to see more of that myself, the Warlord games does a good job with that.
Weapons molded onto hands would be one step, I wouldn't be adverse to arms molded onto torsos either. A choice of legs, torso & arms, weapon hands and head would still allow variety. When they first came out I had a lot of good will for them, the Romans were pants but a first try so we let that slide. They've been going a few years now and still haven't learned...
-
the Warlord games does a good job with that.
Yes, and then they have some issues with stances ('come and embrace me!'). Plastic injection has some limitations, and only when plastics are produced a pure 3D prints somewhen in the future, they will be near-perfect, I think.
I still think the main thing here is to discern between the need for cheap masses of minis that can be trimmed and assembled quickly, and the need for detailed, accurate, characterful single display pieces.
I think we could create a scale ranging between those two extremes, and place manufactures (sometimes products/product series) on it.
WF hit the first extreme well with their Romans, then went a bit away from that with the other ancient/dark age sets, probably because the public demanded more flexibility... and HERE is where they failed to follow their initial strategy, I think, and the result became something that is neither-nor - too many parts, hands and weapons separate, etc. GB's vikings are a far more appealing choice than WF's because they are more focussed on the appearance of the models than on flexibility (and it is stil plastic that can be so easily converted).
Like them or not, the zombies are much more in line with (what I think was) WF's initial stategy (they seem to have some fitting issues, which is a problem in regard to that, but at least they were meant to follow that maxim).
With the Shock Troops, they have taken a whole new direction, and those I'd place about the middle of the scale; they are still cheap enough for making massed armies, while being nice enough for skirmish games, and with a little extra work, display pieces.
From this can be concluded (IMHO):
1: Do not entirely base your design concepts on popular suggestions. Get some experienced designers to have the final call.
2: Make a plan, and stick to it. Some may argue that WF's plan is to meet market demand based on feedback. I don't quite buy it, to me it seems more an excuse for 'We haven't really thought about what we want to do' - with frustration on consumer end as a result. They were lucky to get the rights to produce 'official' FoG minis - IMO they should have PUMPED out sets for that, instead of going in all directions at once. Look at Mantic's way of doing things. Produce a line of minis that supplement each other, and support that, get a hold on a specific market segment, instead of trying to target the entire market all at once.
Pfuihh... back to work, now...
-
From the WF forums
One of the things Tim has been experimenting with is making a tighter open hand - with the thumb far in as possible. With the orcs - you literally have to push the weapons into the hand - snap them - so you get a better initial tight fit. We'll keep pushing on this because I agree with Sagh that the benefits are just so great with the possible combinations of open hands.
Even so the pictures of the Orcs do have that 'weapon hanging' issue mentioned. I like the idea of the weapons snapping in. Will have to wait and see how effective the new design is in person.
-
I've seen their release, now, and I'm not impressed with the orc hands.
They're not going to see much business from me if they continue the open hand policy - I don't like that, it looks more like some of the toys I had as a kid than model soldiers for wargaming.
I still may buy some of their zeds, though, as I don't care much about the soft detail on fillers for hordes for games like Dead Walk Again and the likes.
Now, first I have to break out of my moving stupor, painting and gaming wise, then start finishing some pending projects, and THEN I can start planning new purchases as needed...