Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => VSF Adventures => Topic started by: Red Orc on 05 November 2010, 10:58:58 AM
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Not sure to be honest whether this should be here or in Gothic Horror, as I suspect such luminaries as Transylvanian Counts and possibly London Detectives to turn up, but I'm trying to get a handle on fitting Ruritania into some sort of late C19th narrative.
We've kicked around a lot of ideas on this thread here (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=17318.0), after an intrigiung idea from Argsilverson was picked up by former user and myself (ably monitored by Captain Blood) and we went crazy with it.
So, I still haven't read 'Rupert of Hentzau' or the prequel to 'Prisoner of Zenda', nor have I read the Graustark novels, but in gerneral, I'm still up for the idea of incorporating Ruritania, Molvania, Graustark and Grand Fenwick (and the Flashman book if possible) into some plausible VSF Alternate Mittel-Europa timeline and setting.
Anyone else still up for it?
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Keep the map vague and the countries small so they can scrap with each other and keep under the Great Power's notice, otherwise Bismarck will be sending in the troops to 'restore order'.
Or just ignore the historical map altogether. You have your countries. They have armies. They fight. You play games.
I have vague thoughts on the armies of "The Duchy of Mantovia" from the 11th century, through the 18th century and into the 19th! But it's all pretty vague.
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I've never thought about trying to 'fit it in'; borders were fluid and in dispute for much of the time, right? The exact sovereignty of a principality might, shift as well, right? I assumed I could just apply handwavium for any scenario.
Maybe not as much as I'd play it, but I'll try not to research a good game plot line out of existence. There, you see? I probably am not rigorous enough in separating VSF/'punk/CA/Edwardian/... lol
As others argue the points, I'll probably not have a lot of good ideas, but you know I'll be paying rapt attention, as well as my simple, stunted folk, for room to squeeze in.
Doug
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Jamesmanto: I'd say go for it, what can possibly go wrong?
Where is Mantovia to be (even vaguely ;))? It sounds like an Italian ducal city-state to me; I'd certainly be interested in hearing about any alternative history you do develop.
The Beast: well, it depends what we want to with it all I suppose; if it's more a narrative thing, then we don't really need a map (there's no map of Ruritania in the books after all) but if we have a Risk-style game, then maybe we do.
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Mantovia is run by a meglo maniac king who is married to a saintly queen with two wonderfull princesses who are being educated in foreign lands. The family crest is a rampant bunny theme.
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lol Rico is fairly accurate in his assesment! Various Dukes have been rather meglomaniacal. The current incumbent is rather bookish.
some of the Medieval backstory of the beginnings of the Duchy of Mantovia can be found here: http://rabbitsinmybasement.blogspot.com/2010/09/some-early-medieval-figures.html
Mantovia is sort of Medieval Provence meets 18th century Bavaria and Piedmont with a bit of Austria thrown in for good measure. The Duke is an Imperial Elector by the 18th century and staunch supporter of the Hapsburgs. The nobility are (mostly) cultured and quite literate. The peasants are happy and industrious. Good food and drink are highly valued.
Lack of funds has been keeping the 19th and 18th century versions of the Mantovian armed forces from becoming reality. although I may have a line on some cheap tricorne era minis...
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That sounds immensely cool. I'd be interested in seeing it devlop towards the 19th century, you never know, maybe there's a possible link-up somewhere...
In the meantime, for a bit of fun, I thought I'd post this excerpt from Ruritania's only English-language paper in the 1800s, the Streslau English Gazette...
(http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm219/redorc01/newspaper.jpg)
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Very good Red Orc!
Is this a challenge to make a "newspaper" campaign?
I got some alarming information. During my recent visit in Paris (as a correspondent of the weekly "Strelsau Kurrier" -the only bilingual -german and english- newspaper in town) I overheard some rumours.
Sorry, I cannot expose my source but believe me is a well informed attache posted in embassy of one of the major powers. here in Paris. Usually mixes upper class gossip with diplomatic secrets, a lethal combination.
The first clue is that Count Maximillian's mistress is heading to Streslau.
The second is that Princess Flavia is raising troops to form a new hussar regiment (or I dare say Hussarette regiment?).
Why?
Sorry, Red Orc, my editor promised to find the funds (i.e. link) to print the next issue of "Streslau Kurrier" with these and other alarming stories.
(After my recent computer crash I lost most of my data and achives and had no time to refind the link for the newspaper you used. It is a shame that the software does not allow to design a full front page of a vintage newspaper)
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Not a challenge at all, unless you want it to be! Really just testing a few ideas out. I'm thinking that fleshing out a few details of people that don't appear in the source novels, but could, might be fun.
Interesting, that Count (I suppose we should call him 'Graf' really) Maximillian's mistress is going to Streslau is indeed very interesting... I can't recall her name but I'm sure she'll be important to future developments ;)
If your editor doesn't help you out, , perhaps clicking here will be of use (http://www.fodey.com/generators/newspaper/snippet.asp).
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Whether a challenge or a joint effort, I, for one, do hope you continue!
As I said, I shall follow with rapt attention, mainly for 'cracks' into which other powers will step to attempt to influence, by whatever means, these strange and foreboding incidents...
OOooooooo....
Doug
PS I think we can leave out the extra-terrestrials and Atlantians for the moment, okay?
As I said before, wouldn't say no to a wee shadow of the Bavarian Illuminati, though.
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As far as I know, there is no extra-terrestrial involvement in Ruritania, Graustark, Grand Fenwick, or Molvania.
Secret and sinsiter cults however I'm quite certain are involved in something or other...
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Thanks Red Orc
I prefer the title of Herzog (=duke) while Graf (=Count). But I will keep the the title grag Maximilian.
I am trying to find the lady's (real) name. One name that comes in mind is Lily L' Amour but this sounds like an alias!
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Is there any other information yet on the (slightly suspicious?) Lily L'Amour, Argsilverson?
As for Maximillian's title, I need a minor nobleman to be a plot device - nobody very important, certainly not as important as Duke Michael of Streslau, or even Rupert of Hentzau. More of an evil Fritz von Tarlenheim type. I'm sure there are other more senior figures in (and out) of Ruritania who may be manipulating these events for their own ends...
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Replying to my own posts again...
anyway, I spent a fun evening obliterating countries and re-naming cities in Central/Eastern Europe, and came up with this:
(http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm219/redorc01/austria-hungary-1.jpg)
It's based on a 1911 map that I found in a US government archive (on the web, not in a secret bunker or anything), and I've fiddled around to add Ruritania (with Streslau, Zenda and Hentzau); Graustark (with Edelweiss and Ganlook) and Axphain; Molvania (with Lutenblag); Barschiett, Doppelkin and Hohenwald; Leutha; Samavia (with Melzarr), Carnolitz and Jardasia; Wallaria; and Evallonia.
I dunno; going to far? Just about right? Not enough messing about? Does anyone still care?
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I do
excellent!
sorry, unfortunately I am not able to contribute a lot for the time being, as I have to prepare my trip to Sudan and will be gone till March
keep up the spirit, I like what You are doing
btw, du You a have a continuation of the map to the east? got the feeling there has to be some border to the Ottoman Empire....
I'll fill in some Molvania Details as soon as I am back
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I really like the map. Great job.
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...unfortunately I am not able to contribute a lot for the time being, as I have to prepare my trip to Sudan and will be gone till March...
lol I think I'll let you off then. Make sure you pack your Pith Helmet! Glad you like the map. I hadn't realised it was such a long way from Lutenblag to Streslau.
Unfortunately I don't have a continuation to the east, if there is one out there I haven't found it yet. But I've found a relatively easy way of working so that if there are other maps I can alter them quite easily (if they don't have mountains on them).
MrJ: glad you like it too.
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Nice work :) In fact I now follow your blog Mr Orc :D
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lol I think I'll let you off then.
Thx
how about these maps?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Distribution_of_Races_on_the_Balkans_in_1923.jpg)
http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/historical/history_europe.html
http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/historical/shepherd/races_balkan_shepherd_1923.jpg
(http://pontosworld.com/images/stories/Pontos/Maps/ethnicturkey1911_lge.jpg)
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:D
That second map looks suspiciously like a continuation to the south-east of the map I was using. Even down to the (frankly quite suspect) use of the term 'Races' instead of 'Languages' in the title.
Nice work! Once I've finished the latest Atlantis stuff and sent it by Galvanic Aetherograf to Christian, I'll have a go at screwing up the Balkans in the same way I screwed up the Carpathians!
EDIT:
This should be the version of the Balkans/Lower Danube map (don't tell Christian, I haven't done the Atlantis stuff)...
(http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm219/redorc01/ottoman.jpg)
Any missing countries that could go on these? It's easy enough to alter them, if anyone knows of an imaginary country or territory they'd like to see included.
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If you need more countries, you could consider including the Grand Duchy of Pontevedro, from Lehar's classic operetta "The Merry Widow"/"Die lustige Witwe"
The country is widely known by the dedication and professionality of its diplomatic service
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Molvania will surely have some African Colony somwhere ;)
Bangalla or Kukuanaland (no offense intended), where the Waziri live
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@ former user: The way I've done Molvania (essentuilly north-western Romania with some of Serbia), it doesn't seem to have any coast.
Of course, it may have used Aeronefs to conquer other parts of the world.
@ Zopenco: I will add the Grand Duchy of Pontevedro; it sounds like it might be more Italian-Spanish than Balkan (though there's no reason it can't be on the eastern Adriatic coast I suppose). On the other hand, the info I have puts it and its neighbour Marsovia 'between Hungary and Bohemia'... so who's to say?
Where would you like it to be placed?
@ anyone who wants a country/microstate added - let me know what it's called, where it's roughly located, and any pertinent details of history, geography, politics etc (eg, is it in the Austro-Hungarian, German, Russian or Ottoman Empire in 1891, is it independent, does it border Bulgaria, is it an island etc) and I'll see what I an do.
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I must say this is a smashing beginning! I knew I could offer little to the effort, and am pleased little is needed.
I've no principality to try and shoehorn in, but I suspect my own dark, hidden history will suggest powers whose borders do not match any published map or gazetteer.
Even Baedeker does not have all necessary information, contrary to common opinions...
Doug
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@ Zopenco: I will add the Grand Duchy of Pontevedro; it sounds like it might be more Italian-Spanish than Balkan (though there's no reason it can't be on the eastern Adriatic coast I suppose). On the other hand, the info I have puts it and its neighbour Marsovia 'between Hungary and Bohemia'... so who's to say?
Where would you like it to be placed?
You can place Pontevedro wherever you want, of course ;)
The music has always sounded to me more Viennese than Balcanic, but the libretto puts the the Duchy firmly in the Balkans
You only have to make sure that the Pontevedrin Embassy in Paris is within easy reach of Maxim's
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Well, I don't know much about 'The Merry Widow', 'between Hungary and Bohemia' isn't very far from Vienna anyway. I'll see if I can squeeze them in near Bratislava somewhere. Maybe just rename Slovakia and Moravia if I'm feeling lazy... I can't use Montenegro (according to my research, some of the names are nicked from Montenegro) because I've already renamed that Carnolitz... ::)
I'm not designing an Alternative Paris - though if anyone fancies it, the Pontevedran Embassy needs to be near Maxim's. And can I request a massive tower that's supposed to be the first stage of the French moon-shot (I've been reading 'Starclimber' by Kenneth Oppel).
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Just out of curiosity, was Potsylvania, possibly a variant of Pottsylvania(?), ever in the planning?
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=11967.30
Doug
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It wasn't, but there's no reason why not. Except maybe space! There may be room for Potsylvania in northern parts, nearer to where Poland is now - north of Evallonia, in other words...
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It wasn't, but there's no reason why not. Except maybe space! There may be room for Potsylvania in northern parts, nearer to where Poland is now - north of Evallonia, in other words...
*breathlessly*
You ARE a mastermind! ;->=
Alas, they seem to be from the 'Balcans'(sic); I suppose an ancient area/province not indicated on the map.
Doug
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Could be. It's also described as a peninsula, a landlocked country, and only accessable by submarine, so... your guess is as good as mine! If elThyge wants me to include 'his' Pot(t)sylvania, I'll happily try to fit any or all of those (?) into the mix.
I know I haven't added the Grand Duchy of Pontevedro and Marsovia yet for Zopenco: I will get round to it soon, honest.
In other news I now own copies of both 'Rupert of Hentzau' and 'The Heart of Princess Osra' so expect some tightening up of the Ruritanian chronology...
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Molvania is of course a landlocked country :D
what would be the fun of having an african colony otherwise ? ;)