Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => The Conflicts that came in from the Cold => Topic started by: Legion1963 on February 15, 2014, 05:01:15 PM
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Well yes, we all know that. But i was wondering if the new boxed set of ww2 pacific plastic marines from Bolt action could be converted to represent american special forces from the Vietnam era. I am looking for ways to build/get/buy some special characters for my Vietnam wargame that will be situated on and around the Ho Chi Minh trail. Does any of you LAF'ers has any hands-on experience with these miniatures. Any advice will be greatly appreciated. Cheers.
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(http://www.cartoonspot.net/looney-tunes/images-looney-tunes/road-runner-A.jpg)
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Off the top of my head completely the wrong weapons and wrong uniform for most (?all) of the Vietnam war in the plastics set. Even the early war Vietnam US uniform was introduced in the 1950s I think. Most of the Special Forces later in the war would have had the jungle gear designed specifically for the Vietnam War possibly with their own modifications.
That's going from a project about 20 years ago so I might be misremembering some details.
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Well, I suppose you could... but it would be a hell of a lot of work. As the man said, wrong uniforms and gear. You would have to convert all the footwear to combat or jungle boots, remodel equipment, change the headwear etc, etc. I'm sure there's an easier way.
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Okay gents. Thank you for you advice and info. I was aware that there were differences between the various uniforms and equipment that was used in those periods. But even the miniatures that i use presently (TAG special forces) are not totally historically accurate for the way i am using them as members of SOG. So going on that my line of though was that with some modifications these ww2 pacific marines could look like (in a way) U.S. Army Special Forces in Vietnam.
But there's an easier way i have been told. Does anybody know about it?
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(http://www.cartoonspot.net/looney-tunes/images-looney-tunes/road-runner-A.jpg)
Yes well.......indeed......most interesting 8)
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Off the top of my head completely the wrong weapons....
I have understood that both the Thompson and the grease gun were both used by American SF during the Vietnam conflict. As well as other firearms that dated from the ww2 period.
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Well, I suppose you could... but it would be a hell of a lot of work. As the man said, wrong uniforms and gear. You would have to convert all the footwear to combat or jungle boots, remodel equipment, change the headwear etc, etc. I'm sure there's an easier way.
I am curous as to know what that way is.
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The easier way would be buying the correct miniatures I guess :P.
Now from purely hobby point of view, as I see it, I think you could use them to convert them. Okay, the uniforms are all wrong, does this bother you that much? If you're satisfied with them having pants and shirts, I think they are good enough.
Webbing is all wrong, but personally, I wouldn't worry about that. Perhaps adding more kit, making some pouches bigger etc etc.
The problem I see are weapons. But if you got some (WGF Survivors came to mind, if you're looking for characters an AK47 sounds like a great choice to me) and are willing to do some cutting, I think it could come out just fine when painted.
It depends on how realistic you want them to be, I suppose.
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The easier way would be buying the correct miniatures I guess :P.....
It depends on how realistic you want them to be.....
Now there's a good point....buying the correct miniatures. But who has them? Who sells them? Do you know? Before i bought the miniatures that i use, i searched quite thoroughly and could not find a better range for my specific needs and that specific period than TAG. And yes that's in 28mm.
I want a fair measure of realism and good period look but it does not have to be 100% historical accurate.
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Ebor Miniatures has promised an Special Forces team for a time. And there are the models from Force of Arms, that are very nice. I´m not sure if Eureka has also Special Forces. Company Baker...
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Ebor Miniatures has promised an Special Forces team for a time. And there are the models from Force of Arms, that are very nice. I´m not sure if Eureka has also Special Forces. Company Baker...
Thanks for those suggestions Juan but these are all the usual suspects and of course i have visited their websites many times and am quite familiar with their products. Some have interesting miniatures of the quality i am looking for. The plastic i mentioned earlier had the advantage of easy conversion and some weapons that are specific for the type of soldier.
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You seem to have decided to use them anyway but the uniforms and gear are wrong, most of the weapons are wrong. Even the SMGs saw only very limited use by US units. If you're happy with them that's fine.
Grease gun wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M3_submachine_gun
"The M3 and M3A1 were largely withdrawn from U.S. frontline service in 1957, but continued to be used until the mid-1990s by armored vehicle crews and truck drivers."
Thompson wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thompson_submachine_gun#After_World_War_II
"During the Vietnam War, some South Vietnamese army units and defense militia were armed with Thompson submachine guns, and a few of these weapons were used by reconnaissance units, advisors, and other American troops. It was later replaced by the M16 assault rifle."
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Ok, here's my suggestion then. Depending upon the exact time period you are either looking for miniatures in jungle fatigues or the earlier 107 fatigues. I get the impression you don't want the former, as there are plenty of models available for those.
So the baseline figure needs an un-bloused shirt, plain trousers and some form of high boot, that can either be painted as jungle boots or the standard laced combat boot. Headgear, again depending on exact period or even individual, could be the baseball cap, Ridgeway cap or tin pot. Unstiffened Ridgeways seem quite common in contemporary photos.
Weapons choices could be quite varied but many photos show M-1 carbines where anything more than a sidearm is being carried. Early advisors might be using WW2 era webbing in conformity with both their own weapon and the equipment worn by the SVN unit they were attached to.
On that basis I would suggest that Artizan Design's Devil Brigade range is probably your best bet, in particular packs SWW604 and 605. The former has what looks like Reising SMGs but would easily convert to Thompsons by filing down the foresight. The latter are carrying M1 carbines. At least two figures in each pack are wearing shirts. All have Corcoran jump boots so suitable as combat or jungle boots.
The pants would require the cargo pockets being filed off to be wholly accurate or you could leave them on, maybe paint them up in local SVN camo. They are all in unadorned tin pots. You could swap these out for Ridgeway/ patrol caps or berets. Mongrel and Eureka both have suitable figures as head sources. Berets can be freely sourced from any number of manufacturers. You could of course just leave them in M1 helmets if depicting them in the field. The biggest visual impact will be achieved by having figures in shirts and combat or jungle boots. To get the period flavour you paint on the black and gold US Army and black and white name tags. I think that should work and probably save you quite a bit of time and effort.
Other option? Use the Commando Miniatures Indonesians with carbines as is, no conversion required. I haven't seen them in the flesh but they look the part. With helmets they would make decent early ARVN.
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You seem to have decided to use them anyway
"During the Vietnam War a few of these weapons were used by reconnaissance units, advisors, and other American troops.
I have not yet decided and open to suggestions but having searched countless websites i have not found anything that is a better choice. Again i am not looking for a 100 % historical accuracy. And yes that is exactly what i am trying to make.....a reconnaissance unit..... and there is lots of documentation as to what they used.
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Ok, here's my suggestion then. Depending upon the exact time period you are either looking for miniatures in jungle fatigues or the earlier 107 fatigues. I get the impression you don't want the former, as there are plenty of models available for those.
So the baseline figure needs an un-bloused shirt, plain trousers and some form of high boot, that can either be painted as jungle boots or the standard laced combat boot. Headgear, again depending on exact period or even individual, could be the baseball cap, Ridgeway cap or tin pot. Unstiffened Ridgeways seem quite common in contemporary photos.
Weapons choices could be quite varied but many photos show M-1 carbines where anything more than a sidearm is being carried. Early advisors might be using WW2 era webbing in conformity with both their own weapon and the equipment worn by the SVN unit they were attached to.
On that basis I would suggest that Artizan Design's Devil Brigade range is probably your best bet, in particular packs SWW604 and 605. The former has what looks like Reising SMGs but would easily convert to Thompsons by filing down the foresight. The latter are carrying M1 carbines. At least two figures in each pack are wearing shirts. All have Corcoran jump boots so suitable as combat or jungle boots.
The pants would require the cargo pockets being filed off to be wholly accurate or you could leave them on, maybe paint them up in local SVN camo. They are all in unadorned tin pots. You could swap these out for Ridgeway/ patrol caps or berets. Mongrel and Eureka both have suitable figures as head sources. Berets can be freely sourced from any number of manufacturers. You could of course just leave them in M1 helmets if depicting them in the field. The biggest visual impact will be achieved by having figures in shirts and combat or jungle boots. To get the period flavour you paint on the black and gold US Army and black and white name tags. I think that should work and probably save you quite a bit of time and effort.
Other option? Use the Commando Miniatures Indonesians with carbines as is, no conversion required. I haven't seen them in the flesh but they look the part. With helmets they would make decent early ARVN.
Okay this is very helpfull. Thanks Carlos.