Lead Adventure Forum
Other Stuff => General Wargames and Hobby Discussion => Topic started by: Rob_bresnen on 17 August 2014, 09:42:55 AM
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This is a hypothetical discussion because there is no way I could afford to get this project off the ground but I was wondering what, if any, civilian models you would like to see and for what periods?
There seems to be a lot of discrepancy in the availably of civilian models for wargaming....I collect 28mm but I assume that this is the same for other scales too. For example, if you want Victorian civilians, or 18th Century Pirate/F+IW civilians there is no shortage at all, but the period in-between, Napoleonic/Regency, is woefully under-supplied with civvies.
So here is my Question...What civilian models would you like to see, and what periods do you this have been neglected by the model makers as far as civilians go?
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I few years ago I was looking for Napoleonic/Regency Ladies, very distinctive style of clothing, there was nothing even remotely suitable, which I found quite surprising given the amount of Napoleonic/Regency military figures available. But I've moved on, so I probably wouldn't buy them if they became available.
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I observed the same gap when looking for Carnevale minis as posted here (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=41256.msg482721#msg482721). I'd appreciate both completely unarmed and militia-type people with improvised weapons. Right now it feels I can only shoehorn in some very generic farmers and beggars in rags with an odd fantasy blacksmith thrown in. Or maybe a sailor if I can find a pirate without a parrot and an eye patch. Didn't anyone, you know, make stuff with tools and such back then?
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Foundry's SYW road makers?
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Considering how popular VBCW and WWII gaming is, there's a surprisingly low number of Interwar/WWII cilivians; not zero, but certainly not as many as I'd have imagined, especialy women and children.
I've made do with some excellent Cluedo figures as well as by converting some of the Copplestone gangsters (the ones in simple shirts, pants, & flat caps) to become generic labourers.
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I few years ago I was looking for Napoleonic/Regency Ladies, very distinctive style of clothing, there was nothing even remotely suitable, which I found quite surprising given the amount of Napoleonic/Regency military figures available.
That. No damsels in distress for Sharpe to rescue, no village and townspeople, no priests or monks. Very fustrating.
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Personally, wild west townsfolk.
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I'd agree with Rob, that there is a real shortage of civilians for certain periods.
I tend to play mass skirmish/quasi RPG and so the more civvie types the better, either as objective markers, someone to be protected/avoided, and for general colour to the games.
Even with modern games there seems to be a lack of unarmed minis...most "survivor" figures seem to have access to a DIY store judging by the number of chainsaw wielding minis.
For this reason, the first commission for my new contemporary project is all unarmed civilians - it's also relatively easy (and cost effective) to take a barehanded civilian and convert them.
:)
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Napoleonic (non-spanish) civilians and irregulars is something I would like
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GHQ make excellent variety of 6mm Mid East civilians, as well as Viet Nam, but oddly no WW2/modern Europe ones.
I have used both civilian packs in various games.
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A bit niche; men, women, children representing pre-contact Indians, Mission Indians, and unarmed Spanish for North American New Spain from 1680 until the 1840s.
Gracias,
Glenn
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Gosh, that one is a bit niche. I can see why your having problems with that one. ;)
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Gosh, that one is a bit niche. I can see why your having problems with that one. ;)
I never actually expect it to be done... Just wishing...
Gracias,
Glenn
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Basically nude dollies would be the best place to start and then convert...
Gracias,
Glenn
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Not to mention the fact that you're looking for them in 15mm, not 28mm. lol
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Not to mention the fact that you're looking for them in 15mm, not 28mm. lol
Well, in an ideal world...
Gracias,
Glenn
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Considering how popular VBCW and WWII gaming is, there's a surprisingly low number of Interwar/WWII cilivians; not zero, but certainly not as many as I'd have imagined, especialy women and children.
This.
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Not VBCW. I would have to disagree.
Between west wind French ww2 civvies, musketeers VBCW, wargames foundry Dads army civvies, gripping beasts not-Dr Who thirties range and the many unarmed models from Artizan designs thrilling tales range, I always felt VBCW was one of the better supported eras for civvies. That was one of the attractions for me.
Just off the top of my head I can think of about 40+ models that would fit the bill (I own a good number of them).
Not that the above list is exhaustive either. Look at Copplestone castings, Dixon, pulp figures... Not really a shortage of civvies if you look, they are just hiding in pulp or ww2 ranges.
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There are a lot of armed heroes or fighters, or shifty types, but not as many plain civilians. There are almost no children.
Your suggestion of Copplestone is a perfect example: Gangsters and pulp heroes and alley thugs are technically "civilians", but if you're looking for an unarmed fellow then of all his packs only the "Honest Citizens?" pack fits the bill and if you need women or teenagers or children or old duffers forget it.
I agree there are certainly some available - I own a number myself, and you can certainly cobble something together - but it's nothing even remotely close to say, medieval/fantasy civvies in terms of what's available.
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Not sure if I am allowed to recommend my own figures, by we at Eureka have a range of Civilians in 28mm, for various periods.
Check them out here: http://eurekamin.com.au/index.php?cPath=87_126_138&sort=3a
Cheers
Nic EUREKA MINIATURES
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Yep, I've done a lot of modern skirmish and getting unarmed civilians is a chore.
I've converted some "survivor" kits, but the poses tend to become rather stupid once you cut the guns off.
I find that small scale skirmishes really benefit from bystanders. And besides it gives you something to do after you've painted your five combatants...
In mass battle games it's not such an issue.
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Not sure if I am allowed to recommend my own figures, by we at Eureka have a range of Civilians in 28mm, for various periods.
Check them out here: http://eurekamin.com.au/index.php?cPath=87_126_138&sort=3a
Cheers
Nic EUREKA MINIATURES
the Eureka stuff is great, but would you consider some regency/Napoleonic civvies (Jane Austin style period drama style...I think it would fit into your range well) ;)
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The world is full of European minis and the WF survivors provide some useful civilian types for N. America. Eureka does a limited range of African civvies, there are even some Indian miniatures out there and one or two SE Asian type figures in various Vietnam ranges.
Personally I'd like to see some modern civilian figures in lightweight summer clothing suitable for South or Central America, Africa and SE Asia. It would be nice to populate games with suitable civvy types. Choice of heads covering major ethnic types.
I'd also love to see some 1960s type civilian figures in similar lightweight kit. Shirts, slacks, Bermuda shorts maybe even a safari suit or two. Always fancied a Thunderball type game and folk in jackets and coats just look silly for a tropical or Caribbean setting. . Maybe 7TV will get around to it?
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Rob, I do have some Regency civilians, four chaps, four ladies and a French bull dog.
We are going to release hem with our Napoleonic zombies, when we get chance.
They were sculpted by a very nice French chap for us. If you would like to see pictures, drop me a line at Eureka (I haven't found out how to post images here yet).
Cheers
Nic
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That's why I'm sculpting civilians for my Astan setting.
Couldn't find any suited mini in 28.
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Rob, I do have some Regency civilians, four chaps, four ladies and a French bull dog.
We are going to release hem with our Napoleonic zombies, when we get chance.
They were sculpted by a very nice French chap for us. If you would like to see pictures, drop me a line at Eureka (I haven't found out how to post images here yet).
Cheers
Nic
sounds exciting
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(http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c249/jackgarley/DSC_0707_zps2984859c.jpg) (http://s28.photobucket.com/user/jackgarley/media/DSC_0707_zps2984859c.jpg.html)
(http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c249/jackgarley/100FrenchMaleCivilians_zpscf687655.jpg) (http://s28.photobucket.com/user/jackgarley/media/100FrenchMaleCivilians_zpscf687655.jpg.html)
(http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c249/jackgarley/100Frenchfemalecivilians_zpsacd5cb7d.jpg) (http://s28.photobucket.com/user/jackgarley/media/100Frenchfemalecivilians_zpsacd5cb7d.jpg.html)
Rob, these are the figures I was referring to.
Cheers
Nic
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Those are great figures, Nic. Any idea when they might be available?
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There are Monks & Nuns available, I got mine from Grubby Tanks (nice guy) and for Napoleonic labourers look at Trent Miniatures, their Irish rebellion figures. The pikemen are open handed (& he too is a nice guy).
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Bogdanwaz, drop me a line at Eureka HQ and I can let you have some pre-release versions now.
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I could (and will) find some use for the seated figures- they are lovely!
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The seated figures look splendid.
Any idea if they will fit Warbases hansom cabs?
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What I'm working on.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-dU7uIPQVq2A/VBk50PMQgsI/AAAAAAAABLY/unZnFQojNvQ/w958-h732-no/ultramodernYann002.jpg)
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They are very nice. :)
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Yes! Rather good!
Moderns games especially need civilians too, given the problems of insurgency and counter-insurgency warfare.
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Is this old news? I ended up reading Foundry's front page (http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/). It's a bit of a mess of undated updates, undated updates to undated updates, and undated updates to undated updates of undated updates. Anyway, I noticed this:
Ronny's most eccentric moment was probably his "mob" range. Some considerable time ago, Ronnie sculpted more than 200 Armed Civilians: they are usable for anything from the seven years war through AWI to Napoleonic. There are men and women, horses, gentry and peasants and everything in between. Recently, we experimentally put most of them up on Ebay. We were surprised when three customers each bought most of the complete set, So we're going to sort out some photographs and put them up Somewhere on the web site in the foreseeable future. We will come up with a list and photographs relatively shortly. Watch this space
It's kinda fascinating that they have unreleased or barely released ranges of 200 models just lying around.
(In unrelated news: God of Battles is £12.50 and some fantasy stuff is finally returning.)
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They are on Ebay through castingroomminiatures, there are some very nice figures in those packs.
Is this old news? I ended up reading Foundry's front page (http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/). It's a bit of a mess of undated updates, undated updates to undated updates, and undated updates to undated updates of undated updates. Anyway, I noticed this:
It's kinda fascinating that they have unreleased or barely released ranges of 200 models just lying around.
(In unrelated news: God of Battles is £12.50 and some fantasy stuff is finally returning.)
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I doubt you are considering it but there are very few sci-fi civilians. I think civilians are a problem especially since the current trend is to make combatant minis look so dynamic that they seem to be starring in Wushu films rather than fighting realistically.
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This thread has actually prompted me to dig out the OG Eastern Rioting Mob pack that I had lurking among the lead mountain pile. I want to use these for Gangs of Rome which will be translated to Gangs of Judea. Beer & pretzels stuff but fun.
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I doubt you are considering it but there are very few sci-fi civilians. I think civilians are a problem especially since the current trend is to make combatant minis look so dynamic that they seem to be starring in Wushu films rather than fighting realistically.
That is true. Civvies for Scifi are few and far between.
Zombiesmith makes some and so does Atenociti.
The trouble with 'scifi' civvies is what genre are we talking about? Post apoc? Startrek style Clean scifi? Grim Dark Future? there is as many genres for scifi as their are historical periods, and all with their own look.
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That is true. Civvies for Scifi are few and far between.
Zombiesmith makes some and so does Atenociti.
The trouble with 'scifi' civvies is what genre are we talking about? Post apoc? Startrek style Clean scifi? Grim Dark Future? there is as many genres for scifi as their are historical periods, and all with their own look.
Post Apocalyptic is science fiction but aesthetically it is kind of it's own thing. Clean sci-fi or Hard sci-fi I think would blend with everything better. Even 40k was not so grimdark when it started. Something inspired by Moebius (Jean Giraud) would fit nicely into a number of settings.
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And you can find several fantasy civilians out there despite being as diverse as science fiction.
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I received these from Eureka today you may find interesting. A diary set with 2 maids and a churn boy, and a bunch of cats and dogs.
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I do like them. Where about in the eureka range are they from?
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Still to be officially released.
If you would like a set now contact me at Eureka.
Nic Eureka Miniatures
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Now on Foundry's front page:
We will be at both the SELWG SHOW: Crystal Palace, National Sports Centre, October 12th and CRISIS, Antwerp, Belgium, November 1st
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We will be bringing 15 metres of show stand to SELWG, so we will have rather more stock than in the past.
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Also appearing (for the first time) is our Horse and Musket Blackpowder Revolutionary Mob range: featuring armed and enraged civilians suitable for the period from the American and French Revolutions, through the Vendee Uprising and on to the various unpleasantnesses in South America and through Europe.
As an occasional Carnevale player, I can't wait to see what they've got. Someone post a pictorial report, please...
From the same announcement:
we have taken the opportunity to bring more of our most popular fantasy items (including the much requested return, after quite a number of years now, of our Kevin Adams' Orc ranges)
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Here are the Foundry Vendée to Buenos Aires civilians:
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-nn6oErtn89c/VDFogS2gSLI/AAAAAAAAGXs/e4Cxirdu2kI/s1600/Screenshot_3.jpg)
More details and better pics here:
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Casting-Room-Miniatures/18th-Century-Armed-Civilians-/_i.html?_fsub=12967570018&_sid=1163963228&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322 (http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Casting-Room-Miniatures/18th-Century-Armed-Civilians-/_i.html?_fsub=12967570018&_sid=1163963228&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322)
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I quite like them, even though they might not be the best sculpts ever. There are certainly some useful figures- I never thought I would find a civilian artillery crew, and the female civilians look nice too. The mounted figure with a scythe is a bit odd- I am pretty sure t would be impossible to wield a scythe while mounted, but it would be a piece of cake to convert the scythe to a spear.
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Rob, nice topic on civilians.
I´ve being reading this topic with enthusiasm since i love civilians in my games.
I´m doing a project of gangs of rome (as well as others) so civilians would be necessary.
Wargames foundry and Eureka are two of the manufacturers that have more unarmed civilians available for several periods
Rob, for your napoleonic project check Empress miniatures for a pack of civilians that are suitable for that period.
Without wanting to abuse of this topic and from Rob, if all of you find suitable civilians for any period please put pictures so that it may help more on our search for them and decide if they are suitable or not.
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You mean these? Very nice Paul Hicks sculpts I would say. The ladies dresses are possible a tiny bit late for the Napoleonic period, but close enough if you are not an obsessive Jane Austen fan.
(http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq155/Rob_bresnen/NZ16.jpg) (http://s443.photobucket.com/user/Rob_bresnen/media/NZ16.jpg.html)
Mr Hicks also did these French Scientists for Brigade games that are on my wish list next time I put in an order to Brigade.
(http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq155/Rob_bresnen/BG-NF130.jpg) (http://s443.photobucket.com/user/Rob_bresnen/media/BG-NF130.jpg.html)
I think the idea of posting civvie photos (of any genre) in this thread is an excellent idea as it will make this a useful resource for everyone.
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Yup. That same pack Rob.
Tankyou for the support on the pictures.
I havent noticed that Brigade Games pack for napoleonics. Nice ones.
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You mean these? Very nice Paul Hicks sculpts I would say. The ladies dresses are possible a tiny bit late for the Napoleonic period, but close enough if you are not an obsessive Jane Austen fan.
William Makepeace Thackeray drew his own illustrations for Vanity Fair. In a note, he explained that he had not drawn the women in authentic Regency period costume, because he thought it was too ugly and unflattering. Look upon these as your Thackeray minis!