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Other Stuff => General Wargames and Hobby Discussion => Topic started by: Vanvlak on 08 February 2015, 02:52:05 PM
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Given that toy vehicles are collectible, am I the only one to feel apang of guilt and loads of doubt when I weather or modify a vehicle for wargaming?
Do you actually check the value of the vehicle before going ahead?
I usually don't check, but very often also hesitate to the point of inaction before mucking up toy vehicles.
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I have no problem painting/converting my Marx cars of the future. On the other hand, I did copy-scratchbuild my Plasticville radio station. Both are equally OOP, but I don't see myself sculpting those cars ::)
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I don't have any qualms about chopping up/converting/modifying anything OOP or collectible if it will suit my purposes better with a bit of work.
I am sure there are plenty of collectors out there who would be horrified what I have, and will, take a saw or scalpel to.
:D
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Given that toy vehicles are collectible, am I the only one to feel a pang of guilt and loads of doubt when I weather or modify a vehicle for wargaming?
I bought it, own it, tis mine to bend to my will, whatever that may be.
'Collectible' or not, I've yet to pay enough to warrant guilt or doubt about "destroying the value" of a die cast vehicle or airplane.
I did buy a statue once, that moved me.
Wood You?
Post by Valerik » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:28 pm
Please help...
I just took possession of a magnificent ...article... that is destined to hit the table, in the midst of the jungle, sometime, in the future, soon, we hope...
Trouble is, it's old, clearly hand carved, NOT mass produced, and is made from
a single piece of some sorta extremely light weight porous wood...
It's not balsa, at least that I'm able to discern, possibly cypress, not really sure...
In it's new incarnation it will of course be representing a stone carving rather than a wooden object.
It needs some definition, perhaps light weathering, at least a mild wash to bring out the cuts, lines and details.
But what to use?
Just how far to carry the rockification process is the question.
I hate to paint fine wood, decidedly Mortal Sin-ish, so that's out.
All I've ever done to wood is oil it, wax it, stain it, seal it, or paint it.
Now without priming or overall painting, it needs to look like stone..
Gently...
This...thing...wasn't all that expensive, and it's mine, now, so I CAN do as I please with it, but the caretaker in me doesn't want it ruined, or defaced.
I'll be trying some things out on it's base before I tackle the surfaces, any suggestions?
I've considered oil, wax, stain, ink, dye, and very very thin paint, almost dirty water.
Plastic, resin, metal, china, glass and paper I've dealt with, successfully, surprisingly, beyond bits n'strips, never wood.
At least not a whacking great HUGE chunk of tree that weighs less than my conscience...
Those here, all with far more talent and experience than I, please chime in with your suggestions.
Just what Wood You Do?
Thank you
Valerik
We're approaching a year yet, and I've not yet touched the object.
Mass produced toys, nah. Hack On, Algie!!
I have more doubt about my ability to do a good job, & guilt about mucking it up.
Valerik
soft heart, soft head, depends on the day, don't it
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I received my Matchbox Rolls Royce armoured car in its (admittedly lovely) collector box, with a hand-signed certificate. There were offered for free on the boards and when no one took them they were binned. When it comes time to repaint it a drab green of some sort to cover the odd "lemon khaki" it comes dressed in, I will have no qualms about doing so (kind of a shame to cover the HMS Ajax bit though, since I lived for 15 years in the town named after that very ship).
And anyway, loads of stuff is sold as "Collectible" that really isn't.
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And anyway, loads of stuff is sold as "Collectible" that really isn't.
True dat!!
~ When it comes time to repaint it a drab green of some sort to cover the odd "lemon khaki" it comes dressed in ~
Green huh?
I had in mind a Navyish Grey, steely sorta, R.N.A.S. Personnel, for the use of...
add mud to taste...
Then the Wild Hair set in...
How about a dazzle camou'd Rolls Royce Armoured car!!
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_y3twxQO2UuU/S4-4j0InJUI/AAAAAAAAAE8/v58LGq---EU/s1600/FundraisingDazzle.png)
I'm pretty sure I'm incapable of doing even a half decent job at this in 1/43
(http://www.poheritage.com/Upload/timeline/1910/Gallery/PH-00606-00-GW.jpg)
The Malta pattern might be too regionally specific, but I DO like it.
(http://maltacommand.com/images/Austin%20Utility.jpg)
The BAOR Berlin Pattern is too late, even to my untidy mind
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/8d/83/98/8d8398ded2f580446b59d3ef0d0a1ba4.jpg)
Didn't somebody is East Africa paint their mounts as zebras?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-0ne3K2WrysQ/UrXLmgCrXlI/AAAAAAAACvE/WGLT3CbAOTY/s1600/PaintedHorseZebraADJ.jpg)
(http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad56/romanmars/CamoSteed.jpg)
One way, or another, on arrival from Canadia, my Rolls Royce A/C will have it's 'collectability' violated...
Valerik
Lifelong Talent Despiser, having none of mine own
EDIT my miserble spelling & punctuation
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If I can afford it, it probably isn't actually all that collectable. That goes for both new and OOP fleabay stuff. If I'm planning to hack something up, I don't want to pay a high price for what is basically raw material, so I don't buy expensive stuff for that. IMO above a certain price point the cost outweighs the convenience, so I might as well scratchbuild instead of mod.
But also I have an active disdain for the practice of manufacturing/marketing things as "collectable" from the get-go. Something that's earned it's collectable status legitimately through time and "free-range" scarcity I respect (and see the above on affordability as a barometer), but the attempt to deliberately manufacture that status seems like the exact same kind of BS as a Hollywood marketeer calling their latest movie an "instant classic". It's a shameless attempt to game the Greater Fool theory, and showcases how little the company in question actually regards/cares about the products in their own right. It announces they see their customers as rubes, and are happy to be a societal/cultural parasite instead of a contributor. I have no problem hacking up and/or repainting that stuff, as I don't see it as having any special value to be ruined.
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Oh dear, the Malta camo again.....and I do own a Rolls......
Thanks for the inputs. I guess the general feeling is 'get on with it'. I'll still worry I'm ruining something which might make a fortune in a decade or so, but.....
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Most die-cast cars are not particularly rare and die-cast cars are in general quite common. The odds of them becoming hyper-valuable is slim to none.
As for my armoured car, well, I will be going with a generic dull green because that way factions other than the British can use it, without it being too egregious of a historical violation. ;)
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If I can afford it, it probably isn't actually all that collectable...I don't want to pay a high price for what is basically raw material, so I don't buy expensive stuff for that...
...But also I have an active disdain for the practice of manufacturing/marketing things as "collectable" from the get-go...I have no problem hacking up and/or repainting that stuff, as I don't see it as having any special value to be ruined.
Said better than I could have. If I can find one at a price I can afford, I'll paint and/or modify it without any hesitation. If you look at ebay or amazon, almost every toy ("Collectors Edition" or not) seems to double in price as soon as it is discontinued. That doesn't make it a collectible.
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No qualms at all. I recently converted am ancient Dinky Toys ambulance into the Ghostbusters Ecto-1. And I daresay it looks better now!
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-CbyWJe6_gUs/VKkyjCSz20I/AAAAAAAACyE/SCPCenI4OHk/s1600/Ghostbusters%2B(2).JPG)
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Mint in box 1950/60s Dinky/Corgi/Matchbox Toys are valuable solely because relatively few survive in that condition. The ones that were played with and carry wear are only worth a fraction of that value, despite what some e-bay vendors would like to think. Collectors collect the former and pay for them, the market decides price and it will generally be considerably more than we'd be prepared to pay for conversion fodder.
Most things labelled "Collectors Item" are anything but, I've seen die cast models with "limited edition" certificates which run into the thousands, in my book hardly limited nor probably collectable.
If you can afford to buy it, it's yours to do with what you will.
Tim
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My Grandad served on this 'toy' during WWII:
There's an interesting story that goes with it, the crew mutinied but my Grandad was an engineer and did not.
Article:
http://www.hms-javelin.co.uk/hms-javelin-mutiny.htm
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No qualms at all. I recently converted am ancient Dinky Toys ambulance into the Ghostbusters Ecto-1. And I daresay it looks better now!
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-CbyWJe6_gUs/VKkyjCSz20I/AAAAAAAACyE/SCPCenI4OHk/s1600/Ghostbusters%2B(2).JPG)
:o :o :o
That looks brilliant!
:-* :-*
Do you have a thread featuring it?
:D
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Unfortunately I did not make a how-to. I was so happily building away I completely forgot to make pictures.
It will feature in a game of GASLIGHT, Pulp Alley or All Things Zombie sometime in 2015 I daresay :)
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Unfortunately I did not make a how-to. I was so happily building away I completely forgot to make pictures.
It will feature in a game of GASLIGHT, Pulp Alley or All Things Zombie sometime in 2015 I daresay :)
A stunning result whether there is WIP or not.
Pure eye candy.
:-* :-*
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Better to actually use an old toy than to preserve it I think!
I have had this debate with my son when rebasing some preslotta Citadel miniatures. Better they are used!
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Better to actually use an old toy than to preserve it I think!
I have had this debate with my son when rebasing some preslotta Citadel miniatures. Better they are used!
Definitely agreed,
Though with the miniatures, it's not as though they can' be stripped later...
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For me, it's not as much an issue of cutting up a toy car I have, collectible/valuable or not, as much as is it worth the asking price when I don't own it...
I happily put the saw to a near mint Dinky Toys Ed Straker car for my UFO project, but only when I was able to source one that was not horribly overpriced. I still believe I paid around 25 GBP for it, which is still a lot of money for one car, but not nearly the 200 GBP I've seen mint, boxed ones go for. And is is sort of iconic to the show, so I just had to have one. ::)
On the other hand, I am really looking for a certain type of lorry/truck to paint in 1/50 right now, and if you think those Dinky guys are off it, try the model truck collectors! You can easily pay 250 GBP for a truck and trailer. Granted; the products usually are stunning displays of scale modeling, but come on!
If I had the cash to burn, I would not not think twice about it, buy the damn thing and then disassembe, sand and paint it. But right now, it's those prices that are putting me off, not their collectible value; as has been said: when it's mine, I'll damn well do as I please with it... :D
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25GBP ($45USD) ! Yowza!
I try to never spend more than $10-20 USD for any die-cast vehicle that's going to get war-game-ified and most of my 1/43'ish die-cast are one buck resale finds. Probably just my natural cheapness. I've no problem modding cars of any value down for gaming, but if going to chop something particularly valuable, there's a voice in the back of my head saying "you could sell this and buy alot of minis…"
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Owwwieee that IS a lot, but I suppose that's one car and the hero's car at that.
In my case the real devil is trying to find cars in the right scale, as 1/43 is typically too big but is the most common die-cast size close to what I've been looking for. Luckily some series are not true 1/43 and are just sized for the box, which gives you a variety of scales. In other cases, the original real-life car was extremely small and so looks "right" even though it's a 1/43 model with 30mm minis (I've got several Fiats like this). This was made worse by the fact that this winter I decided I was unhappy with the scale of most of what I bought last year (too big) so I am replacing about half of what I bought with new purchases (and I thought I was done! ::) lol )
The worst both last year and now is trying to find "bland" cars - the ordinary saloons and such which were/are most common on the roads, and in a fairly narrow date range too. I pester model sellers a lot to try and suss measurements before I buy, which has resulted in my rejecting dozens of cars, but that's better than spending the money and being unhappy later. Right now I am waiting in the mail for two big "gambles" (I did get measurements that sound good, but you never know 100% until you get these things). If they work out, I will have a pretty fair fleet of useful cars. In the most recent case the "gambles" were each more than $20, but I will be extremely happy if they work out, as they will hit the perfect sweet spot of date, size, shape, and car type.
At the very least I already have a half-dozen cars and trucks which fit wonderfully, so I'm happy with that.
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Post up what you get I'd be interested to see them.
I'm fine with most 1/43 cars and 1/48 trucks. I know they're to big, but as long as they're all about the same amount of too-big, it doesn't bother me. Plus most 28mm figs are already as wide as 1/48 figs and with a slotta base, they're almost as tall and it's not too much of a jump from 1/43 to 1/48….
As for finding everyday, common cars, it's definitely a problem. BBurrago had a bunch at the US chain "Dollar general" for a while, but they're gone now. Being able to get Chrysler 300's, Chargers and Magnums for $2.50 was enough for me to overlook the cheap wheels. I've definitely got enough, but I keep looking for more...
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It is your duty, and a service you provide, to acquire, unpack and de-mint such collectible objects.
You should feel no guilt, and dismiss it if it raises its head!
Through your actions, and the actions of others like you, the number of available mint, still in packaging, OOP, "stuff" is reduced.
Through its reduction in availability, you enable true collectors of such objects, and their suppliers (e.g. e-bay etc, not the manufacturers) to inflate and justify the value of the few remaining examples of each item.
Do not even for a moment, hesitate. You are helping others gain pleasure and enjoyment of their hobbies and collections, whilst supporting the economy.
Everyone is a winner in your willful destruction of mass produced collectibles.
Keep up the good work and hack/smash/paint away!
The persons with the last one left, of whatever your mutilating, will forever be in debt to you and your blasphemy.
But don't forget to recycle the packaging where possible, unless you can find a buyer for it ::)
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The odds are that on the budget most gamers work on is if you can afford it on ebay then toy car collectors couldn't care less about that type of car any way.If they did they would have outbid you.
Having been dragged to the odd collectors fair,It's pritty safe to state the traders there have a very loose grasp of the term 'Rare'.
Rare isn't a vehicle that has a six figure production run.
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The toy car hackers' manifesto! :D lol
It is your duty, and a service you provide, to acquire, unpack and de-mint such collectible objects.
You should feel no guilt, and dismiss it if it raises its head!
Through your actions, and the actions of others like you, the number of available mint, still in packaging, OOP, "stuff" is reduced.
Through its reduction in availability, you enable true collectors of such objects, and their suppliers (e.g. e-bay etc, not the manufacturers) to inflate and justify the value of the few remaining examples of each item.
Do not even for a moment, hesitate. You are helping others gain pleasure and enjoyment of their hobbies and collections, whilst supporting the economy.
Everyone is a winner in your willful destruction of mass produced collectibles.
Keep up the good work and hack/smash/paint away!
The persons with the last one left, of whatever your mutilating, will forever be in debt to you and your blasphemy.
But don't forget to recycle the packaging where possible, unless you can find a buyer for it ::)
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This oughta be a stickey...
It is your duty, and a service you provide, to acquire, unpack and de-mint such collectible objects.
You should feel no guilt, and dismiss it if it raises its head!
Through your actions, and the actions of others like you, the number of available mint, still in packaging, OOP, "stuff" is reduced.
Through its reduction in availability, you enable true collectors of such objects, and their suppliers (e.g. e-bay etc, not the manufacturers) to inflate and justify the value of the few remaining examples of each item.
Do not even for a moment, hesitate. You are helping others gain pleasure and enjoyment of their hobbies and collections, whilst supporting the economy.
Everyone is a winner in your willful destruction of mass produced collectibles.
Keep up the good work and hack/smash/paint away!
The persons with the last one left, of whatever your mutilating, will forever be in debt to you and your blasphemy.
But don't forget to recycle the packaging where possible, unless you can find a buyer for it
I could find no possible way to disagree with this poster.
In fact, I find I am unable to agree with him MORE!!
Had I fewer figures awaiting paint I'd have already violated my Rolls Royce A/C.
Agreeing wholeheartedly with FF's "lemony Khaki" observation,
it is a distinctly odd shade of beige...
And requires damaging the intrinsic "collector value", a lot...
Valerik
"No false moves, I'm a dangerous man"
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Hear hear!
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Amen... :D