Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Argonor on 31 March 2017, 02:13:13 AM
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Well, I had hoped that by now, somebody had done some better plastic Normans than the Conquest ones, but, alas, no luck, there.
With plastic thus out of the equation, I think I shall have to settle for metal models for a Norman warband for SAGA, which I have been wanting to do for, like, ever, at least for the mail-clad 'archetypical' warriors and hearthguards (I can make levies out of GBs Dark Age Warriors, or the new Archer set, I guess).
So - what manufacturer offers the best balance between quality and price, please? Preferably on the East side of the Atlantic, as postage and taxes have a tendency to lower my enthusiasm otherwise.
I have been looking at the Perry 1st Crusade range which seems to fit my image of Normans nicely, but would like to hear opinions on those, and other brands.
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Foundry? rather a nice range. LINK (http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/dark-age/normans)
Crusader are also pretty good. BTD also have some nice ones to fill out, their Command pack is great.
Perry - yes, if you can get some that are actually cast correctly.
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black tree do some nice ones as well
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Perry or Foundry.
I have some of the Gripping Beast Normans, and while the riders are nice, the horses are, errr, strange.
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The Saxon Miniatures Normans look nice.
(http://i1360.photobucket.com/albums/r660/Armchairsaxon/813865ea-d9b5-4e18-a0c5-67fb8f733379_zps30jsvere.png) (http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/Armchairsaxon/media/813865ea-d9b5-4e18-a0c5-67fb8f733379_zps30jsvere.png.html)
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Foundry, newer sculpts though.
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I'd go for a mixture of several manufacturers. If you go for Black Tree, remember that their horses are big, sorry, huge. Pretty but huge. Way too huge in fact for the period of time, so you will need to change mounts. Gripping Beast, I don't own their Normans but I do have Crusaders ( early ) and seen their Bretons and they're not the best miniatures out there. Not bad, but a bit "compressed in length" with sometimes very short arms. Their Carolingians on the other hand are marvellous ( I talk about the mounted figs now, foot troops always are of lesser quality with GB ). And don't forget the old Citadel - now Foundry - Normans, to me they are still up to it :).
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I like the look of the Perry stuff, but their metals are really a PITA to prepare - casting flash all over them. I have not seen the Saxon miniatures in the flesh, but I have some of their Vikings and they are first rate from both a sculpting and casting point of view.
One other thing I worry about with the Perrys are the horses ankles on some of the mounted I have from them are very thin. I worry whether they will stand the test of time of game handling.
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Foundry's Casting Room Miniatures normans are excellent.
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Seconded, in fact I'd say they were the best available:
https://www.castingroomminiatures.com/collections/normans
Will work fine alongside Crusader, BTD for variety.
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The Casting Room/Foundry look pretty good.
Sad about the continuing quality issues with Perry metals. They seem sensitive to criticism, but it doesn't appear they have done anything to fix the problem.
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Ebob has some Normans (http://www.ebobminiatures.com/products/darkages.htm) that look like very nice sculpts, but they are dismounted knights and not really useful in that capacity in Saga.
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If I didn't have shed loads of Normans already I'd be getting myself some of those!
I have shed loads of Norman's. Didn't prevent me buying a few more lol
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I've got a few of the Casting Room ones and they're nice figures. Reasonable variety too.
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I just bought some Saxon Miniatures Normans on the strength of this thread lol
I am so weak ::)
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Fantastic response, thank you, gentlemen! :)
I'll browse the suggested lines - I think I am going to stick to one manufacturer, as it makes buying shield decals easier, but as it is a project likely done in stages in between other stuff, I may decide on mixing after all.
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A few years ago I bought the Norman Saga box, nice miniatures but a little chunky like expected out of GB. I added a few Perry mounted for more warriors and the warlord. I felt they mix well, all things considered. I do recall thinking that if I did do it again I'd probably go heavier on Perry and mix GB in.
Here's a shoddy shot of my 4pt warband, complete with droopy spears, thick varnish, average paint and broken swords :D
(http://i736.photobucket.com/albums/xx1/shrubs350/normSaga03_zpscgukmfum.jpg)
I can do a comparison shot between Perry and GB mounted if anyone wants, I have since figured out the macro on my camera 8)
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I am tempted to get the SM 9-figure Norman Knights set. Not sure, yet.
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I've just bought some Saxon Miniatures Anglo Saxon huscarls and they're very nice figures, matching in well (for obvious reasons) with some of my older GB figures.
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Went for the Saxon Miniatures Norman's on Friday after thinking about this for ages. The figures I already have from Colin were ace!
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Foundry's Casting Room Miniatures normans are excellent.
Should this have a "said with a straight face" emoticon?
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I have Crusader with some Gripping Beast and new Foundry mixed in
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Nicest Norman infantry: definitely the one from Ebob!
And the mix well with Perry. So I would go for Ebbob + Perry.
But I would never play Normans in Saga lol
That Battleboard is just a mess ;D
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I like the look of Normans - so a SAGA warband might just grow into something else over time lol
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I'll add a vote for Saxon Miniatures Normans as well. Oh the Huscarls and the Vikings are very nice too...
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I have mixed GB, Perry, Essex Miniatures, Conquest, Drabant, Crusader and others in my trial warbands for Outremer: Faith and Blood.
I have found all ranges have their pros and cons but a mix gives by far the best results!
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Love the old foundry line.
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I always liked the old Foundry line by the Perrys. Alas they are rather small compared to modern lines.
(http://www.wargamesfoundry.com/files/5014/3069/4530/VNS014.png)
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Drabant Miniatures, sells some BEAUTIFUL 28mm historics, including a line of Normans.
I have only two small criticisms about their 28mm minis. First, the models are a bit on the small side, even for historics. When compared to 28mm minis from other historical manufacturers, they look a bit puny and their arms a bit stumpy. I should mention that this assessment is based upon 4 boxes of Drabant Vikings that I purchased a couple of years ago and that these were some of their earlier 28mm models, so the scaling of their models may have changed since.
My second criticism is that recesses in their chainmail armor are bit shallow. This is in no way a deal breaker for me, but it requires a different painting technique. Typically chainmail is painted by applying a basecoat of iron/steel, washing with black ink, and then dry-brushing with metal. Since Drabant's chainmail recesses are so shallow,applying too much paint to the armor is likely to fill in the recesses and give the black ink nowhere to go. I haven't tried it yet (my Vikings are still in their boxes), but if I were to paint Drabant chainmail I'd begin with a black basecoat or maybe even just use black primer, and then lightly dry-brush metal, followed by some spot washing and maybe some spot dry-brushing with a brighter shade of metal.
Below are Drabant's Norman crossbowmen, cavalry, and William the Conqueror. Beautiful models. Simply gorgeous.
(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2154/MO7o9e.png)
(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/4556/38H8qg.png)
(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/5715/BbHYfS.png)
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I have mixed GB, Perry, Essex Miniatures, Conquest, Drabant, Crusader and others in my trial warbands for Outremer: Faith and Blood.
I have found all ranges have their pros and cons but a mix gives by far the best results!
Totally agree here. I have complete catalogs from GB, eBob, Crusader, Foundry (Matthew Bickley's work), and Saxon. I love them all, but they do each have their pros and cons.
- Crusader casting requires a lot of work, and sometimes I found the chunks on horses easier to work around and nearly impossible to totally clean.
- Gripping Beast are soft on details, but easy to paint.
- eBob have sculpted spears (why?!), but beyond that they are one of my favorites (third).
- Foundry are beautiful and my number one or two.
- Saxon are another favorite, competing mostly with Foundry. They ship with cast spears, which I replace for wire spears; but he cast spears are great for scenics, etc.
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Koyote: thanks for mentioning Drabant. It's a new one on me. These figures look really nice. I'll have to try some Drabant - perhaps some of the Saxons.
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Drabant are wonderful, available in the UK from Old Glory UK :)
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Yeah, I'm loving those Drabant figures.
How do they scale next to Gripping Beast stuff?
The Drabant Vikings that I have are noticeably smaller than my GB minis. Then again, I'm kind of particular about scaling issues, so noticeably smaller to me may not be noticeably smaller to someone else.
Crusader Miniatures also runs a bit smaller, so if you are going to mix manufacturers with Drabant, Crusaders Miniatures may be your best bet.
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Humakt: Old Glory UK sell Drabant figures and they seem to sell the ranges in small packs - normally 2 cavalry or 3 / 4 infantry. I'm going to buy a small number to see what they look like in the 'flesh'.
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Those Drabant figures do look nice, but the proportions look odd. May just be the way they have been photographed but their top halves look too big for their bottom halves somehow.
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I'm painting some drabant Normans at the moment. I actually find them to be marginally (and I mean marginally) on the large side compared to other makers. Also the metal they use is very soft; so drop them once and you might end up with some deformities; you also have to be careful removing the flash as the soft metal comes away easily and can result in a loss of detail. That being said they are lovely sculpts!!!
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So all you chaps with Norman armies, planned, purchased and in the field, who do you pitch them against?
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I have a Lion Rampant force I used to fight against Scots raiders during the Harrying of the North; lots of scope for smaller battles during that period.
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The Normans had ding-dongs with themselves, or you could call them 'Bretons' or 'French' (all three pretty much looked the same and all three fought with each other).
The English is the obvious opponent. But they also fought against the Vikings/Norse/Danes/Whatever your preferred name is.
Post conquest you could use them against the Welsh, and for raids on the Scottish border (by the time they invaded Ireland their look had changed from the 'classic' Norman look).
You could use them as Spanish and fight other Spanish or Moors.
You could use them as first crusaders.
And not forgetting Italy and Sicily.
The point I was trying to get to is that the Normans are a really good army so unless the Vikings/Saxons are in a secure flanks/Hastings type scenario they aren't that well matched?
So Normans vs Normans is fine. I guess (as First Crusaders) Arabs and Byzantines are their best matched opponents?
Apologies for going a bit off topic here.
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Some interesting points there.
I didn't mean though the Norman army is good due to a cavalry force being superior to an infantry one. I feel the Normans are a good army because of the all round arms it contained, i.e. reasonable quality heavy and light cavalry, heavy infantry and light/missile troops armed with crossbows for example.
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So all you chaps with Norman armies, planned, purchased and in the field, who do you pitch them against?
King Stephen is a good one wiki link (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen,_King_of_England)
check out BTD for some really good kings and friends types.
get a few Arab types and do some El Cid.
The Barons were always fighting each other
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My thanks to all those who recommended Drabant. My Saxons arrived this morning and I really like the look of them. I'll no doubt be buying some more....
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Just put an order in for some Saxon Miniatures Normans, I think their Dark ages stuff is some of the best on the market.