Lead Adventure Forum

Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 05:37:47 PM

Title: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 05:37:47 PM

Below is an early WIP pic of the troops starting to muster.  All the models pictured here, with the exception of the Sea Wolves leader (Gorgon Studios), are Footsore Miniatures' minis.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/9528/GPNgN7.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 05:56:30 PM
Selecting my mounted Warlord was a fairly easy choice.  Footsore Miniatures' King Arthur model is fantastic, plus using an Arthur model as the foundation for my Mordred model is ironic.  One of my favorite features of the FS Arthur model is its  helmed head, but sadly this just won't work for my vision of Mordred.  So, in the words of the Queen of Hearts, it was "off with his head." 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/4531/0SkI9P.jpg)

I began with a simple head swap.  I removed the head and replaced it with a head from Warlord Games' Imperial Roman Veteran sprue.  It looks like the sculptor based this helm on the Romano-British Ribchester cavalry helmet on display at the British Museum.  I like the head because it reminds me of the helm worn by Mordred in the 1981 movie, Excalibur. Ah, memories.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2885/xIVx2e.png)

I want to reuse Arthur's head, so I had to make a deep v-cut to remove the head without damaging it.  I then rebuilt the neck and fur trim with Green Stuff.  I also used GS to make his right foot a bit larger.  This model, like many historical metals, suffers from small-footitis.

Below is a WIP pic of Mordred.  I like that the new head's engraved laurels give it a regal look, while the expressionless face mask makes the model look cold-hearted.  Both are attributes that fit my vision for Mordred.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/2019/584fD5.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:06:34 PM
The model that I've selected to serve as Morgan is a Bad Squiddo Games mini. The sword and breastplate balanced against the long dress and cloak gives her just the right balance of martial prowess/war leader and enchantress/seductress. Yes. I know. I think about this kind of stuff way too much. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003766//e5003766.gif)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/8119/0DLkXv.png)

If your minis are armed with spears, I highly recommend 'wire spears' (which is a misnomer because they are made from thin metal rod, not flexible wire).  Spears made from white metal (the metal metal minis are cast from), are too bendy and typically so thick that they look kind of ridiculous in the mini's hand.  Plastic spears are better than white metal spears, both aesthetically and in the bendy-department, but they can break if the model takes a tumble or you snag the spear on something.  Wire spears do not break and they fit nicely in the hands of 28mm models. 

If you purchase wire spears, be mindful of the thickness.  I ordered some wire spears from Arcane Scenery & Models, but I failed to read the description of what I purchased.  The diameter (thickness or gauge) of the spear shafts is tiny (about 1mm). If cut down to the right length they'd made good arrows for 28mm minis or perhaps good spears for 15mm minis, but they don't work as spears for 28mm minis.  Doh!  The spears pictured above are sold by Gripping Beast and are just the right thickness.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ogrob on April 23, 2017, 06:08:20 PM
I randomly browsed your SAGA stuff on another forum yesterday, and all of it is just lovely. Your conversions and miniature choices and paint jobs are always on point.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:15:38 PM
I've settled on pill-shaped bases for my cavalry.  The bases pictured below are 25mm x 50mm x 1.5mm Pills, made by LITKO Game Accessories.  The bases look a bit thin in the photo, but they're actually the same thickness of the Renedra & Renedra-style bases that I mount all of my SAGA minis on. Like my Irish warband, my Britons will be mounted on magnetic bases. The magnets that I inserted are glued to both the surrounding wood and the bottom of the metal horse base, so hopefully they won't pop out.

Despite the fact that all of my cavalary minis were originally made by Musketeer Miniatures (now Footsore Miniatures), King Arthur's horse (now Mordred's horse), is noticeably smaller than the other MM horses. I can't have my Warlord being dwarfed by his men, so I used pieces of styrene sheeting to give Mordred a little boost.

The Companion to the left of Mordred is the bannerman from King Arthur set and the Companion to the right is from Late Roman Cavalry Command set.

I don't like using duplicate models in a warband, but I really like the overhand pose of one of the Late Roman Heavy cavalry models. I solved this problem by twisting the model's head so that it's pointed to the model's left rather than to the right. White metal has some give to it, so you can do a certain amount of bending and twisting without breaking the model. The challenge is to twist the head without crushing its features or putting pliers shaped grooves in its head. My solution is to use a small piece of cork sheeting to cushion the teeth of the pliers (SEE below). I used the same technique on the crested helmeted model, third from the left. I moved the head from facing left to facing forward.

One of my frustrations with two part, metal cavalry models is that they rarely sit on the horse properly. I always end up taking my hobby knife to the horse's saddle and rider, but even then the fit is far from perfect. To get the fit just right, I stick some GS to the bottom of the rider, wet the saddle with some water, and then gently place the model on its mount. Once seated, I apply a little bit of downward pressure to get the model seated just right. Then I remove the model from the horse and use a clay shaper and hobby knife to clean things up. It may require multiple seatings to get the right fit.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/4702/RqrKDY.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:18:00 PM
I randomly browsed your SAGA stuff on another forum yesterday, and all of it is just lovely. Your conversions and miniature choices and paint jobs are always on point.
Thanks.  

The Tomahawk forum doesn't get a lot of traffic, so I reproduced my Briton thread on this forum.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on April 23, 2017, 06:26:04 PM
Very fine conversions for your theme.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:34:55 PM
CAUTION: MUCH NERDINESS AHEAD



Okay, you've been warned...


With much of my warband mostly assembled, I got to work on my baggage models.

I'm going to stick with what worked for me in the past and use my baggage models as an opportunity to tell a story. This particular story depicts Mordred's plot to seize the throne of Britain.

As the legend goes, Arthur and the bulk of his warriors have crossed the Oceanus Britannicus and landed in Gaul. Depending upon what version of the story you prefer, they are either pursuing Lancelot or fighting against the Romans for control of Gaul. Mordred, Arthur's nephew has been left in charge of the kingdom.  Mordred believes that how Arthur was conceived makes him unfit to rule, so Mordred has placed himself on the throne.  

The first baggage model is titled, Merlin's Arrest. Mordred must silence Arthur's most trusted (and devious) advisor, so he has ordered his warriors to imprison or kill the wizard. The tree adds some height to the diorama and gives me a place to put an owl, which, like Merlin, is a symbol of wisdom and watchfulness. Merlin's magic is comes from Britain's pagan past, hence the rock with the Celtic swirl engraving.

The second baggage model is titled The Death of Gawain. In one version of the Arthurian myth, Sir Gawain is grievously wounded by Lancelot and returns to Britain to recover.  When Gawain learns about his brother's move to seize the throne, Gawain organizes an armed resistance. Gawain may be a paragon of knightly virtue, but the wounded knight is no match for Mordred, who slays him in a 'death duel.'  In my version of the story, Mordred has had Gawain's head removed from his corpse and paraded about (à la Joffrey) to serve as a warning to others.

The second baggage model shows one of Mordred's warriors holding Gawain's head aloft (which is an ironic nod to the story, Gawain and the Green Knight) and the gore stained axe. Gawain's sword, helmet and battered shield, are also on display. In the background a warrior holds aloft Mordred's banner and second warrior blows a horn to draw the common folk to the spectacle.

According to the Inter-netz, Mordred's coat of arms depicted a double headed eagle. As a former 40K player, I have plenty of Imperial Eagle bitz collecting dust, so I had no trouble finding a good banner pole topper for Mordred's standard. Gawain's coat of arms is either a gold pentacle or, like his brother's coat of arms, a double headed eagle. I don't want Gawain's heraldry to be confused with Mordred's, so Gawain's battered shield will display another heraldic symbol associated with Gawain, the gold pentacle.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/5392/rLtpir.png)

The third baggage model, will depict Guinevere's fate. In at least one version of the Arthur story, Mordred abducts Guinevere and forces her to marry him. In others, she evades capture and escapes to the Tower of London. Since I'm on Mordred's side here, she doesn't get away.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:39:18 PM
My Little Big Men Studios Arthurian shield transfers and banner have arrived. I cannot recommend LBMS transfers highly enough.  They are really easy to use and they look great. Once they are sealed with some brush-on matte clear coat, you can modify the designs to your liking by painting directly on the transfer.

I knew that the symbol that looks like a combination of the letters P and X was associated with Arthuruan Britons, but until very recently I had no idea what it meant. This symbol is called a Chi Rho (pronounced "KEE-roe").  It is a Christian symbol consisting of the intersection of the capital Greek letters Chi (Χ) and Rho (Ρ), which are the first two letters of "Christ" in Greek (ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ, Christos). It's use as a military symbol is purportedly based on Constantine's use of the symbol after receiving his famous vision before the Battle of the Milvian Bridge in 312 AD.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/1838/MNHrVG.jpg)

Below is a WIP of my warband with the hard-basing added.  For the larger rocks, I used small pieces of plaster of paris leftover from another project.  I used my snips and a hobby knife to shape them an cut them to size. I've also added some debris from an old battlefield (e.g.  damaged shields, weapons, helmets, etc.) to most of the bases. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/4355/nXuFAV.jpg)

The skulls and bones skulls and other bones come from Toad King Casting's (http://www.toadkingcastings.co.uk/) Skull and Bone sheets.  For years, I've been cutting up plastic skeletons to add bones and small sections of rib cage to my bases. These sheets will make that task largely unnecessary.  The quality is quite good, but many of the bone fragments are really, really small. They are dwarfed by a grain of rice, small. Nevertheless, $3.75 a sheet is a good price for the usable bits.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/2323/EafqzE.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:43:10 PM
Putting a Warlord on a big base looks cool, but during game play I prefer keep my Warlord's footprint on the table as small as possible.  This makes it easier for me to move my Warlord in between my units and around enemy units and obstacles.  My solution to the Cool vs Utility problem is to base my Warlord on a regular base (my "game base") and then create a large display base with a magnetized insert for my Warlord's base.

The last time I did this I placed the Warlord's game base on the display base and puttied around it with grey-stuff.  This worked fairly well, but after the grey-stuff cured, the sides of the insert weren't vertical, so I had to reshape the hole with a hobby knife.  This time, the plan is to use a styrene cut out to create the insert.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/8204/EiDmUS.jpg)


Because of my Warlord's pose, the other models on the base need to be in motion.  My plan is to have Mordred accompanied by huge mastiff.  The war hound will be leaping at a hapless Saxon warrior who is reeling back in terror.  The mastiff and victim models haven't arrived yet, so the mock-up pictured below includes a stand-in for the war puppy.  

The 60mm base doesn't leave much room for Saxon, so I've ordered some 4 inch (102 mm) bases from LITKO.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/391/njn7VU.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on April 23, 2017, 06:49:24 PM
Cracking thread this, wonderful vignettes and back stories.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 23, 2017, 06:52:35 PM
The display bases at this year's Adepticon SAGA tournaments put mine to shame, but next year, things will be different.  Well, at least I hope so...

Like many of the best display bases at this year's event, I want my display base to tell a story.  Inspired by my mounted Mordred model, which looks like it's about the chuck a spear into some poor bastard's chest (or back), my display base will depict a battle scene.  More specifically, it will portray the rout of a Saxon warband.  Casualties will lie scattered on the ground where the Saxon shield wall once stood. The ranks of my Britons will be advancing and on one flank the Briton cavalry will be galloping ahead of Briton infantry, in pursuit of the fleeing Saxons. 

The models that I will use for the prone casualties arrived this afternoon.  They are made by Curteys Miniatures and sold by 1st Corps, out of the UK.  The two columns on the left are Saxons and the two columns on the right are Britons.  The models are resin and the detail is amazing.  For casualty models, I give these 4.5 out 5 stars. Or, if you prefer, 4.5 out of 5 butchered Saxons.  (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14144//e14144.gif)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/1808/QDrTA2.png)


I ordered some blisters of birds from Kromlech, hoping to get a good crow/raven for Morgan Le Fay's base.  In contrast the Curtey models, these models are terrible -poorly sculpted and cast.   (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14093//e14093.gif) Nevertheless, I was able to find one that, with a bit of GS, will work for what I need.

I may want to play my Britons as all infantry, so I've assembled a foot Warlord and companions and another unit of 5 foot Hearthguard. I distinguish my HG by their cloaks -HG have them, warriors don't.  I'm not going to include any War Banners in this warband, but I want each Briton unit to have a Roman style Draco.  I ran out of cloaked models that are suitably posed to hold a Draco, so I broke out the GS and added a (passable) cloak to the standard bearer from Footsore's Mordred blister.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/5977/ZHopdr.png)


Here's my foot-Warlord (center) and his two Companions.  Foot-Mordred is the Arthur model from the 2006 Salute model, Arthur & Mordred.  The The Companion on the left is (ironically) West Wind Productions' Mordred. There can be only one Mordred, so I replaced the original Mordred helm with a different head.nnThe Companion on the right is Footsore Miniatures' Vortigen. The half drawn sword and the face are what drew me to this model

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/2797/kDu6ZA.png)


The models the foreground are my auxiliary unit of foot HG. The models in the year will be my first string HG foot.  I love the model holding its helm in its arm.  It's made by West Wind Productions. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/350/UuxFzZ.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on April 24, 2017, 07:11:37 PM
Great project!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 24, 2017, 09:07:52 PM
Below is a (very) rough sketch of the plans for my display base. 

Guides are A&A mercenaries that are armed with javelins and not slowed by uneven ground.  Guides permits the owning player to: 1) move one element of terrain, or 2) remove one element of terrain, or 3) add to the table one M x M element of terrain.  I have the perfect piece of 6" DIA modular terrain (made by Worldsmith Industries), that I will rest in a circular insert in the display base.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/2487/kW5K3P.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on April 24, 2017, 09:26:51 PM
This looks like an amazing project. Can't wait to see it all coloured up!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on April 24, 2017, 09:57:05 PM
I'll second that - the thought you're putting into this is commendable.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on April 24, 2017, 10:02:08 PM
Clearly this is going to be great  8) :-*

I've just been painting a whole lot of the very same figures myself, with the new Saga supplement in mind... they'll be appearing in rounds 7, 8 and 9 of the current Lead Painters League.

But I love the thought and detailing that's going into your collection :)

I need to sort out some levies for my Arthurians... that's the only outstanding item on my list, so I'll be watching yours take shape with keen interest  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Jacksarge on April 24, 2017, 11:32:39 PM
This is an inspiring thread - please continue  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on April 25, 2017, 02:06:11 AM
This project looks like it will be great.  What Saga force did you have at adepticon this year?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 25, 2017, 04:59:07 AM
This project looks like it will be great.  What Saga force did you have at adepticon this year?

Thanks. I played Irish.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/6600/jjoFLA.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Dr. Zombie on April 25, 2017, 06:21:19 AM
This looks awesome. That is some brilliant conversions. Can't wait to see them with some paint.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Little Odo on April 25, 2017, 09:00:53 AM
All looking great so far.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rumacara on April 25, 2017, 09:42:59 AM
Following with interest.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on April 26, 2017, 02:47:05 AM
Just noticed the Saga Irish link in your signature!  lol
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on April 28, 2017, 03:21:58 PM
I've played a few games with my Britons and I'm beginning to wonder if I should add some 'shooting' to my list.  The Sea Wolves' Marauders ability gives me a nice advantage in scenarios where the objective is to be somewhere or capture something, but Guides, Deserters, or Briton Levies will give me shooting attacks to degrade certain types of units that I'd rather not tackle in melee, such as Beserkers, Attecotti, or mounted Hearthguard.  Also, shooting attacks can be used to encourage a reluctant opponent to close with me. 

Hmm?  More play testing required.  (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5017366//e5017366.gif)


Also, my first test-model is ready for painting.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/331/LoM56a.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Miantanomo on April 30, 2017, 03:27:56 PM
Great stuff!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Viden on April 30, 2017, 10:18:27 PM
Awesome project! Your work is truly inspiring.  :o
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Littlearmies on May 01, 2017, 03:32:25 AM
You mentioned crows in an earlier post. Ask Nic at Eureka Miniatures - he has a set of four crows in metal which are really nice. They aren't on the website but drop him an email.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ajax on May 01, 2017, 03:05:54 PM
Respect ! It's a beautiful project. I will follow it with interest.
Irish are a really good faction in SAGA, hard to play but hard to beat.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 01, 2017, 05:26:24 PM
Thanks, everyone.

I didn't make much progress on my Britons this weekend.  I spent most of my hobby time assembling some Vikings for use in demo games. 

I did get my Cymry Guides (Footsore Miniatures' Scots), assembled and mounted on bases. So they aren't confused with Picts, I equipped them with the bucklers that came with my FS Early Saxons. Because these fellows operate best in uneven terrain, I used the extra white-stuff to sculpt some logs and stumps for their bases. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/965/LtbZxk.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on May 02, 2017, 11:51:01 AM
very cool. I also love the footsore miniatures. they are absolutely stunning.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 04, 2017, 03:08:11 PM
Queen Guinevere arrived in the post yesterday.  The model is made by Dragon Bait Miniatures, which sells several lines of quirky minis.  I am very pleased with my purchase.  Both the sculpt and the quality of the cast are quite good and my order arrived fairly quickly. It's hard to make out in the photo, but her wrists are manacled and connected by long chains.

The Bishop, who is extolling Mordred's virtues and trying to convince Guinevere that her impending marriage to Briton's new king is certainly no reason to cry, is made by Gripping Beast.   The guard is a Footsore mini. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/8890/uQmGl4.png)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/5420/v7BXs3.png)

The other two baggage models include a bird (the owl and the two headed eagle banner topper), so I added a feathered friend to this model as well.  The bird reminds me of this little fellow:

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/9138/SkC2IQ.png)

"Stand by the grey stone when the thrush knocks, and the setting sun with the last light of Durin’s Day will shine upon the key-hole." (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003766//e5003766.gif)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on May 04, 2017, 05:52:54 PM
Another fine looking vignette and story.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on May 04, 2017, 06:16:18 PM
Brilliant!  Footsore makes some of my favorite minis! 

I have that same group of minis and have been trying to make interesting 2-3 figure bases, including the druid, dogs, and so on.

I love what you're doing.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 08, 2017, 03:31:47 AM
I finished my test model.  I think it turned out ok.

Painting eyes is always challenging, but painting them in the recesses of a helm is even harder.

I tried something new. I added a light red wash to the models lower lip.

As always, I am very pleased with the LBM shield transfers.  I went with the iconic white and red motif that you see in many modern illustrations of shields from this period.  I also have the same design in white and black. I haven't decided if I'm going to mix them or use the colors to distinguish different units or just stick with the red.

I tried using some of my Skull Craft Autumn Mix Leaf Scatter to add some fall leaves to the base, but it just didn't look right, so I removed it.  More experimentation needed.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/9354/3AdqYH.jpg)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/6969/TNMFrc.jpg)


About a month ago, I ordered a set of very cool mastiff mins from Sgt Major Miniatures, but after receiving the order confirmation I haven't heard a peep.  No minis. No notice of shipment.  Nothing.  He won't respond to my email so I opened up a dispute with PayPal.  It's too bad, because the set included a mastiff posed perfectly for my Mordred display base.  Oh well, Sgt Major Minis' loss is Footsore Minis' gain.  Looks like I now have an excuse to order Footsore's new wolfhound minis.  Oh darn. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003766//e5003766.gif)

In the meantime, to give you a better idea of what I have planned, I have place a proxy war hound on the base along with the Saxon casualties.  The doggy is one of the Dog Companions from Zombicide.

So I can play this warband as either Britons or Romans, I purchased Gripping Beasts' Late Roman Manubalista kit.  I question its effectiveness, but how could I resist trying out SAGA's first war machine.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/3262/ItdAAo.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on May 08, 2017, 07:55:27 AM
Very nicely painted and yet another fine vignette, one wounded man v man on a horse and a big dog, I think he will need more than a six :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: majorsmith on May 08, 2017, 08:09:38 AM
Wow! Love this thread some really nice stuff 👍🏻
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on May 08, 2017, 09:48:07 AM
nice paintjob on the first one. The dog issue is always sucky but Footsore makes fine miniatures so that is a nice win!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Barry S on May 09, 2017, 12:17:19 AM
I'm really enjoying watching following your project. Thanks for taking the time to share it.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on May 09, 2017, 03:18:07 AM
I really like the leather on the test model. What did you use there?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on May 09, 2017, 05:07:17 AM
I really like the leather on the test model. What did you use there?
I'd like to know, too.  It looks fantastic.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 09, 2017, 05:20:20 AM
I'd like to know, too.  It looks fantastic.
GW's Doombull Brown washed washed with Agrax Earthshade and then highlighted with Doombull and then with an 80/20 mix of Doombull + Karak Stone.

In general, if you find that your bands of highlights are a bit too distinct and don't blend well, you can do what I call a 'cheat-blend' to smooth the transition of color. I do this by spot washing just the transition areas with a watered down mix of whatever wash I am using on the color.   

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on May 09, 2017, 09:20:44 AM
Looks fantastic!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on May 09, 2017, 04:51:46 PM
GW's Doombull Brown washed washed with Agrax Earthshade and then highlighted with Doombull and then with an 80/20 mix of Doombull + Karak Stone.
In general, if you find that your bands of highlights are a bit too distinct and don't blend well, you can do what I call a 'cheat-blend' to smooth the transition of color. I do this by spot washing just the transition areas with a watered down mix of whatever wash I am using on the color. 
That's it?  You make it sound so... doable.  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Sitric Caech on May 10, 2017, 02:49:29 PM
Love this thread.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 10, 2017, 04:24:36 PM
That's it?  You make it sound so... doable.

Yes, it's really quite easy. 

One of the not-so-secret secrets to highlighting is to use paint that you've thinned with water or a thinning agent (I use water).  In general, whether you are painting base colors or highlights, thinner paint gives you more control and produces smoother surfaces.  I rarely paint directly out of the pot. Thinner paint is semi-translucent, so if you use it to paint highlight colors, you will find that it produces a more gradual blend of colors.

Below is an illustration that may help you visualize the basic process of highlighting and how to cheat-blend.  In this example you are highlighting an oval shaped raised area.  Let's call it a 'bump'.  The bump's surface is broad and its rise gradual, kind of like the leather vest on my test model.  If the part of the model to be highlighted is narrow and sharp, like a sword blade, the area covered by your lightest (topmost) highlight will be much smaller and the the area covered by shading and basecoat much larger.

You begin by painting the entire bump with your base color.  Once dry you wash the bump with an ink/wash.  This color is your shading.  The shading will run around the circumference of the bump, framing it and setting it apart from adjacent features.

Next, you apply your basecoat again, but you leave a ring of the shading unpainted. 

Next you add your first layer of highlight.  A highlight is a lighter version of the color that lies beneath it.  You can buy highlight colors (GW sells separate basecoat and highlight colors) or you can make your own by adding a bit of white* or off-white* to the basecoat. As in the previous step, you leave a small ring of previous color beneath the the highlight color. 

* Please note that white doesn't work with every color.  If you mix red with white you get pink, not a lighter shade of red, so you want to mix red with yellow or orange.

Next, you mix and apply another layer/level of highlight that is a lighter shade than the one before it.  You can add as many layers/levels of highlight as you wish.  I tend to stop at two or three.  Each time you add a highlight, you paint a slightly smaller area.  As I mentioned before, if the shape of the rise is broad and flat(sih), the last highlight will cover a relatively large area.  If the highest point of the rise is small and sharp, the last highlight will cover a very small area.

When you blend, you apply a thin highlight color and draw some of that color over a portion of the color that came before it.  This overlapping of a semi-translucent highlight color creates a gradual blend of color -hence the name, blending.   Blending takes practice and it's certainly not for everyone.  As for myself,  prefer to do what I call cheat-blending.  When I cheat-bend, I paint my highlights as normal, and once my paint is dry, I mix water and ink to create a very thin wash.  Rather than apply this wash to the entire bump, I carefully apply this wash to the rings where my colors transitions.  The top of the bump is not washed. 

Alternatively, if you'd like to darken the shade of the topmost highlight, you can apply your cheat-blend mix to the entire bump. If, after it dries you decide that it's too dark, you can always add another layer of highlight to the topmost level.  Painting is all about trial and error, so don't think that you have to get it right the first time.  If you don't like how something looks, you can wash it again, add another highlight, or paint over it with a base color and start again.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1223/ife9vy.png)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on May 10, 2017, 07:06:26 PM
Great tutorial!  Thanks heaps for writing it!

I try doing that kind of highlighting, sometimes using base + white, and, for the life of me, I cannot physically see the edges so it's hard to know how small/large to make that next surface as I work up.

I have managed to do this and the effect looks nice but, I swear it, I cannot really discern the edges, only get a sense of "oh, that looks nice."

I'll have to keep practicing.  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Unlucky General on May 13, 2017, 11:24:18 AM
I'm enjoying your project very much. Thanks and keep it coming.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 14, 2017, 04:03:12 PM
And so it begins.
(http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/10011970/New2/roman_zpszmo0syid.gif) . . . Man your painting stations!

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/5613/mWVxbZ.png)



Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 29, 2017, 08:46:36 PM
I've (mostly) completed my first 10 Briton warriors. 

I need to do some experimentation with basing materials and I'm still waiting for my Ammo Autumn leaves to arrive, so I haven't added any static grass and/or tufts to the bases.  Once I figure out what I'm doing, I'll post another photo of the completed models.

Their shields are so large that getting and angle that shows more than just shields is difficult.  I suppose I should include shots from the side and the rear. 

I will need to take their shield size into account when determining how to arrange the models on my army display base.  The Briton warriors will need to be angled so that a viewer looking at the display from directly in front of the display will see the models' bodies and not just their shields and heads.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2441/X2MPrx.jpg)

I've been complaining about this for years, but I really need to buy a better camera and get myself a decent backdrop.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ray Rivers on May 29, 2017, 10:41:33 PM
Very nice work!

Fantastic, in fact.  :-*

BTW, you don't have to have all the dudes looking the same way for your photos. The guys on the wings can be looking off to the flanks, for example. That way you will see the backs on a couple on the left of the photo and the front on a couple on the right.

You seem to be quite a resourceful person, I'm sure you'll work it out.  ;)

Keep up the good work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on May 30, 2017, 06:39:06 AM
Brillig!
They look the business  8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on May 30, 2017, 06:43:22 AM
They look really cool. I like the lancelot model for a leader.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rumacara on May 30, 2017, 07:47:32 AM
Very good. :-* :-*
Keep it coming.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tancrede on May 30, 2017, 12:38:48 PM
Really nice work !  :-*
Hope to see more of them soon....
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Larry R on May 30, 2017, 02:01:45 PM
I'm really enjoying your modeling work! Thanks for sharing. This may push me over the edge to try SAGA.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hupp n at em on May 30, 2017, 02:48:51 PM
I don't need another period! You're making me want to do Arthurians with these conversions and paintjobs.  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 30, 2017, 04:04:14 PM
Thanks, everyone. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003765//e5003765.gif)


From time to time, Jim Graham, the proprietor of Worldsmith Industries (https://worldsmithindustries.com/) gives me some of his miscasts and other resin terrain goodies.  One such gift was a circular 6-inch diameter area terrain base.  He plays Wood Elves, so I suspect that he made the original to serve as the 'free-forest terrain' that Wood Elves get to bring to the table. 

The Aetius Arthur mercenary unit, Guides, have a mechanic similar to the WFB/9th Age Wood Elves, except that the owning player may remove or move an existing piece of terrain or add a M x M element of uneven ground to the table.  I've used Guides in my last three games and they've been nothing but win, so it was certainly worth my time to paint a purpose-built piece of terrain for them. 

The Celtic swirls work great for my Britain based warband.  Also, I decided at the outset of my Briton project that my Guides are Cymry mercenaries, so the swirls symbolize these largely, non-Romanized Britons.

The modular nature of the terrain lets me decide between terrain types.  The photos below depict Rocky Ground, which doesn't block LOS, but it does give my Guides hard cover.  If I need terrain to block LOS, then I replace the rocks with trees and voilà, it's a Wood.

The rocky outcrops are made by Worldsmith Industries.  The gnarled tree comes from GW's, Citadel Woods kit.  The GW trees work great with the Worldsmith area terrain because the diameter of the GW tree bases match that of the Worldsmith Industries' spotface recesses. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/1265/M4sfnj.png)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/5448/qrSB4p.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on May 30, 2017, 11:13:20 PM
That's a miscast?  Looks pretty good to me.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on May 31, 2017, 08:44:58 AM
Fantastic painting  :-* - and many thanks for the tutorial about your way of highlighting!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Larry R on May 31, 2017, 12:38:08 PM
And you use white primer! I haven't used white primer in years. I may have to use that again. Your painting is excellent and I love those GW trees, I'd love to get my hands on some!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hupp n at em on May 31, 2017, 02:48:31 PM
Just noticed your lovely layering guide (somehow missed it before) and I have one question - for the final spot-wash, what shade of the process is the ink matched to?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 31, 2017, 03:57:04 PM
Just noticed your lovely layering guide (somehow missed it before) and I have one question - for the final spot-wash, what shade of the process is the ink matched to?
It depends upon the effect you are trying to achieve.  If you want the colors to be darker, use a darker wash.  If you want it to be lighter, use a lighter colored wash.  You could even mix it up, using a darker wash near the lowest recess and a lighter wash near the top. 

I'm lazy, so tend to use the same shade of wash that I used to wash the basecoat and if it makes the lightest highlight too dark, I lighten that highlight with another coat of thinned down paint.  One of the reasons for using thinned paint is that if you make a mistake, you can add additional coats without creating too much build up. 

Regardless of shade, it's important to use a very thin wash.  Also, it has been my experience that washes don't stick to paint very well, so the first coat will go on fairly light, sometimes near invisible.  However, washes do 'stick' to washes, so once that first coat of wash has dried, any subsequent coats of wash will be much darker than expected. 

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on May 31, 2017, 03:57:25 PM
Except for one pose (which is poorly scaled), the Footsore Miniatures wolfhounds are quite nice.  Nevertheless, once I got to see them in person, I realized that none of the poses are quite right for what I have in mind.  Plus, I wanted Mordred's doggies to look a bit more vicious.

After searching around a bit more, I decided to give the Malifaux Guild Hounds a try.  Neither their armor or breed matches that of the Roman war dog (dobermans were first bred in Germany, 1,400 years after the fall of Rome), but their scale, poses and best of all, viciousness are all spot on.   Will I be forgiven for this anachronism?  Who knows.  Do I care?  A little, but I really like these models, so my Britons may end up including two time traveling canines.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/3264/MJNDZ2.png)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/5176/p9DvyT.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rumacara on May 31, 2017, 04:40:27 PM
Not even painted yet and they look great already. :-* :-*
Keep it coming.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on June 01, 2017, 05:41:46 AM
Great looking  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Paul Richardson on June 02, 2017, 08:56:04 AM
This is a tremendous thread. I've been thinking for ages about buying some Footsore Romano British, and this has been the push I needed - I've just ordered some. The figures look superb and you're basing and painting them with real flair. 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on June 02, 2017, 04:14:17 PM
I have a big collection of these Footsore Byzantine and Arthurians.  They are some of the most impressive minis I've seen.  Great job, Footsore!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 02, 2017, 06:41:46 PM
I have a big collection of these Footsore Byzantine and Arthurians.  They are some of the most impressive minis I've seen.  Great job, Footsore!
Most of them were made by Musketeer Miniatures prior to Footsore acquiring the rights to them. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14136//e14136.gif)

Not that this, in any way, diminishes my love for Footsore Miniatures.  Footsore is still my go-to company for most historicals. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14144/e14144.gif)



Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 05, 2017, 05:19:19 PM
I need some Viking SAGA dice for my Viking demo Warband.  Not even Gripping Beast can keep them in stock, so I've repurposed some (now worthless), scatter and artillery dice.

I painted white the black numbers and symbols so that they won't show through the SAGA die stickers.

Yes, I know. I could simply use regular D6s (1-3 common, 4-5 uncommon, & 6 rare), but when I'm teaching the game to a beginner, I want his or her focus to be on the rules and battle board options, not translating die pips into unfamiliar symbols.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/4342/CigO3m.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 09, 2017, 06:34:54 AM
Except for their bases (I'm still waiting for those damn leaves to arrive), I've completed another 6 warriors.  I now have two painted units of 8 warriors, each with a Decanus (or the Romano Briton equivalent) and an infantryman holding a draco.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/3402/cUbSPf.jpg)

The 6 point warband that I've been playing includes 3 points of warriors.  Because I've been fielding 1 point of mercenaries (typically Guides), in order to generate 6 SAGA dices, I need for my warriors to generate 3 SAGA dice.  I've experimented fielding them as either three units of 8 warriors or two units of 10 warriors accompanied by a unit of 4 warrior that hides in the rear.  I've found that a unit of 10 combined with their Briton defensive orders can take (and deliver) a pretty good hit and remain combat effective, while the units of 8 warriors tend to struggle.  Right now, two tens and a four is my preferred configuration.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Jacksarge on June 09, 2017, 06:50:02 AM
Such splendid work, well done indeed!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tomogui on June 09, 2017, 06:59:10 AM
These all look amazing — makes me want to pick up a brush again. Terrain is wonderful too. Looking forward to seeing those hounds painted up.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Paul Richardson on June 09, 2017, 08:25:20 AM
Marvellous painting.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Maxromek on June 09, 2017, 07:47:09 PM
Great job! Awaiting the finished bases now!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Unlucky General on June 10, 2017, 08:23:21 AM
What a magic project - just delightful. I wouldn't get hung up over your dogs - Arthur is legend and not history after all. Thanks for making such a detailed reporting project out of your build project. I'm loving it.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 11, 2017, 07:38:03 AM
As I noted in an earlier post, my preferred distribution for my 3 points of warriors is 10, 10, and 4.  If the game goes well the unit of 4 warriors spends the entire game where it was deployed.  If the game goes less well, it spends the second half of the game in a "strategic retreat" in order to preserve the SAGA die that it generates.

This small unit doesn't see much action, but that doesn't mean it has to be an easily forgettable unit of grunts. To jazz up the unit, I assembled it from cool command models that I couldn't fit into my other units or baggage models.  Perhaps this unit represents the century's aging centurion and his bodyguards.

Except for their bases, the first two models are done.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/4481/Sz6i5X.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: moiterei_1984 on June 11, 2017, 08:07:09 PM
Impressive painting!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on June 11, 2017, 10:16:15 PM
I love the new additions. Great stuff and really characterful minis.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 15, 2017, 06:40:04 AM
Except for the bases, my  "reserve" unit of 4 warriors is done.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/562/OAs0OV.jpg)

The autumn leaves saga continues...

The AMMO autumn leaves and basing materials that I ordered from Kings Hobbies & Games (over 3 weeks ago), are still on back order, so I cancelled my order.   Kings Hobbies refunded my order immediately and with no hassle, which I greatly appreciate.  Thanks KHG.   

I placed a new order with the manufacturer in Spain.  My order shipped the next day and I expect to get it early next week.  The expedited shipping from Europe cost me a bit more, but buying products directly from AMMO is 20% less expensive, so it is essentially a wash. 

Because of the savings and larger variety of products to choose from, I went a bit crazy.  I added to my order some of AMMO's grass mats material, tufts, shrubs, ferns, and meadow flowers.  I have tufts from a few manufacturers, so it will be interesting to compare them to AMMO's products.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on June 15, 2017, 11:32:00 AM
excellent painting once again. I am also curious what they will look like when you add the leaves. I'm sure though, they will look even more striking.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on June 19, 2017, 10:22:45 AM
Wonderful painting  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on June 19, 2017, 12:59:54 PM
Just awesome...  So enjoying your thread!!!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Antonio J Carrasco on June 20, 2017, 08:45:29 PM
This is a very inspiring thread! Lot of great information and ideas.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 21, 2017, 05:00:26 PM
Thanks, everyone. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14144//e14144.gif)


The autumn leaves saga continues...

The AMMO autumn leaves and basing materials that I ordered from Kings Hobbies & Games (over 3 weeks ago), are still on back order, so I cancelled my order.   Kings Hobbies refunded my order immediately and with no hassle, which I greatly appreciate.  Thanks KHG.   

I placed a new order with the manufacturer in Spain.  My order shipped the next day and I expect to get it early next week.  The expedited shipping from Europe cost me a bit more, but buying products directly from AMMO is 20% less expensive, so it is essentially a wash. 

Because of the savings and larger variety of products to choose from, I went a bit crazy.  I added to my order some of AMMO's grass mats material, tufts, shrubs, ferns, and meadow flowers.  I have tufts from a few manufacturers, so it will be interesting to compare them to AMMO's products.

When I see a great product or get great service, I am not shy about letting people know.

I placed my order with AMMO (I live in the US and AMMO is located in Spain) on June 13th and it arrived on my doorstep on June 16th.  Sure, I paid for expedited shipping (only $15), but it was worth every penny.  AMMO accurately filled my order (which was fairly large) and they threw in two extra boxes of birch leaves.  I am very pleased with my experience and I will be ordering from them again.

I still haven't had a chance to test out the leaves on my models.  When I do so, I will let everyone know how it goes.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Larry R on June 22, 2017, 01:37:10 PM
Do you have a link to AMMO? I've never heard of them.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Codsticker on June 22, 2017, 02:50:55 PM
Ammo by Mig Jimenez (http://www.migjimenez.com/en/).
Ammo by Mig, US store (http://www.ammomigjimenez-usa.com/).

I have been looking at ordering some of the jungle leaves sets but haven't until I find out how many there are in a blister; that info seems elusive...
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: nikko on June 24, 2017, 01:00:36 PM
Hello,

Excellent late roman project !!

Nikko
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Larry R on June 26, 2017, 07:13:35 PM
@codsticker, thank you!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Codsticker on June 27, 2017, 02:51:21 PM
@codsticker, thank you!
My pleasure. :D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: OSHIROmodels on June 27, 2017, 03:04:03 PM
Superb thread  :)

cheers

James
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 29, 2017, 06:28:51 AM
Here are my first four Cymry Guides (or Scotti Sea Wolves).  I'm still dragging my feet on adding tufts and leaves to the bases, so the models aren't quite finished.

I experimented with a couple of different shield transfers and finally settled on the LBM's Saxon buckler transfers without shield design.  Initially I reasoned that their shields are unadorned because these men are local raiders and brigands who don't want to advertise their clan or tribal affiliation for fear of reprisal.  However, after appraising the results, I decided the shields made the models look unfinished, so I added some simple, hand-painted designs.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1017/AZnIqd.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on June 29, 2017, 07:27:44 AM
Very crisp painting again. Love what you do with the footsore miniatures. Great job!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Jacksarge on June 29, 2017, 10:48:07 AM
Love your work mate, looking forward to more :-)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on June 29, 2017, 08:01:22 PM
They look great. Are they a mix of Footsore Picts and Irish? Or just Irish?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on June 29, 2017, 10:33:24 PM
They look great. Are they a mix of Footsore Picts and Irish? Or just Irish?

This batch is all Footsore Picts.  The next will include an Irish model or two and the Bad Squiddo Games mini that I'm using for Morgan Le Fay.




Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Antonio J Carrasco on June 30, 2017, 08:20:20 PM
Again another great looking unit! Very inspiring.
 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 04, 2017, 06:38:12 AM
My last four Guides (or Sea Wolves).

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/7079/qR7kSp.jpg)

When planning my color scheme for Morgan Le Fay I knew that I wanted her hair and at least some of her garments to be black, but I'm not a good enough painter to pull off both a black dress and a black cloak, so I knew I that either the cloak or the dress had to be a different color.  Also, I wanted her coloring to both fit in with the other models in the unit and stand out. In the end I opted for a 'Guide' green dress framed by black hair, a black shield, and a black cloak (the latter of which is hard to see in this photo).  Matching the color of her studded leather vest to the leather shield covers to the other Guides also helps to tie her coloring to the rest of the models in the unit.

I realize that the Morgan's sword blade looks really bright.  The flat surface of blade is facing the lamplight, causing the brightness. In RL the blade looks darker and more tarnished.  Next time I photograph her, I will try turning her a bit more.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on July 04, 2017, 06:44:39 AM
Very nice. She's turned out well :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ajax on July 04, 2017, 08:04:06 AM
It's always a pleasure to come on this topic. Very beautiful painting !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on July 04, 2017, 11:45:41 AM
She turned out great! she looks very imposing.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Madhouse Workshop on July 05, 2017, 12:12:05 PM
Very nice looking miniatures.  Well done.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 05, 2017, 09:56:30 PM
Thanks, everyone.

My "reserve" unit of 4 warriors turned out so good that I couldn't resist buying Footsore's 4-pack of Late Roman Elite Infantry.  I REALLY like the look of the plumed helms.

My plan is to have enough painted minis to play either a Briton or Late Roman warband.  I want the composition of my Roman warband to differ from my Britons, so when I play Romans, my cavalry elites will be replace with infantry elites.  I think that these lovely models plus the four I've already painted will fill that role nicely. 

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/2605/qUhVIZ.png)

I began experimenting with flocking my bases.  I have several different colors of static grass, a box-load of tufts, and of course my AMMO leaves.  I didn't want to use my painted models as guinea pigs so I put texture on an 'empty' base and painted it like I normally do (Rhinox Brown base with half 'wet brushed' Vermin Brown and part Blue-Grey/Codex Grey/Administratum Grey).  I wanted the yellow and light brown leaves contrast with the static grass, so I applied some dark green static grass and added the leaves.  The static grass blended into the dark brown of the base and I couldn't get the leaves to look right.  Next I tried a lighter shade of static grass and I didn't care for the look of that either.  Then I blended the light and the dark static grass and still just, bleh.  I gave up on the leaves, but continued to pursue the Autumn look I had envisioned. Try as I might, I just couldn't get good mix of static grass and brown "Autumn" tufts. The problem was dark brown base.  Unless I completely covered it up with static grass, I couldn't get a good contrast of between the dark brown base and Autumn colored flocking.  In the end I settled on Army Painter XP Mountain and XP Winter tufts and no static grass or leaves.

It's kinda funny.  After spending all that time and money on different types static grass, tufts, and leaves, I ended up using simple tufts. Doh! (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5020524//e5020524.gif)

My cavalry and "baggage" bases are larger than my infantry bases, so perhaps I will have better luck devising a more sophisticated flocking recipe for them. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003766//e5003766.gif)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ataman on July 06, 2017, 05:30:04 AM
I stumbled across this thread by chance today, and I'm very happy I did! Smashing work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 08, 2017, 06:49:04 PM
Four Briton/Roman elite infantry assembled, puttied, based, and now ready for primer.  I made too much Apoxie Sculpt, so I used the extra to do a bit of work on my Warlord's display base.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/2582/e8pUYx.png)


Below is a photo of the simple device that I use to primer and paint shields. I cut each dowel down to a blunt tip and add a small dab of superglue to hold the shield in place.  When I've finished painting the shield, it's easy to snap off the dowel.  I use a pin vice with a large bit to remove the dried glue from the rear of the shield.  To protect the painted surface I lie the painted shield, face down, on a folded up paper towel and drill straight down to 'drill out' any dried glue.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/9907/WaCtdw.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 09, 2017, 05:55:25 PM
Below is my first group shot of painted models.  Four more models and I will have all the infantry I need for my 6 point warband painted and ready to go.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2453/HQVkDm.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on July 09, 2017, 08:50:26 PM
Superb  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on July 09, 2017, 09:51:45 PM
Bloody brilliant.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: nikko on July 10, 2017, 11:47:15 AM
Hello,

Excellent !!!
What colors do you use to paint the flesh 's Cymry Guides ?

Nikko
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: gostgost on July 10, 2017, 07:35:27 PM
Nice army
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on July 10, 2017, 08:34:44 PM
excellent looking force
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Antonio J Carrasco on July 10, 2017, 08:36:50 PM
Brilliant and inspiring!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 10, 2017, 11:03:43 PM
In this week's episode of 'Koyote's Revisionist History,' working backwards, I attempt t justify the coloring of my Britons' bases.  

For a while now, the coloring of my Briton's bases has bothered me. The Rhinox Brown basecoat highlighted with Vermin Brown produces a warm, brownish orange color that contrasts nicely the rocky portions of the base and compliments the greens and bluish-greys on my models.  I am quite fond of the coloring, but when I think about the soil of Britain, a burnt orange color doesn't immediately spring to mind.  In fact, it's not a color that I associate in any way with the color of British earth.

I thought about moving my warband's backstory to northern Iberia, but before stretching my backstory to its breaking point, I decided to do a bit of research into whether there is any orangish or reddish soil in Britain.

Well, it turns out that my initial assumption is wrong. Redish/orangish soil can be found in Britain.  In some areas this color is the product of the leavings of centuries of copper mining, while in other areas the mix of minerals that produces these colors near the surface of the earth is more naturally occurring.  

Staffordshire, a county in the West Midlands of England, has areas of reddish/orangish soil. Even better, Staffordshire contains heathlands, which is sorta-kinda what my bases look like.  

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/8605/MkXJWl.png)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img922/7206/qKbEQV.png)

Because of the county's proximity to Wales, locating my warband in or near Staffordshire helps to justify my inclusion of of Cymry guides.  

Both Geoffrey of Monmouth and Chrétien de Troyes place Camelot in Caerleon, South Wales, one of three Roman legionary forts in Britain. The modern Welsh count among their ancestors the Romano-Britons who were pushed back towards the west of Britain by the Saxons in the 5th and 6th centuries, so the placing of Camelot in Wales and my warband in western Britain works nicely for me.  

Also, there's THIS (http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/stoke/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_8399000/8399485.stm).

The human mind's ability to rationalize just about anything is both a wonderful and peculiar trait. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003765/e5003765.gif)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: nic-e on July 10, 2017, 11:16:58 PM
Absolutely gorgeous warband!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 11, 2017, 03:18:43 AM
Hello,

Excellent !!!
What colors do you use to paint the flesh 's Cymry Guides ?

Nikko
Thanks.

I begin with white primer.  Next, I apply a basecoat of GW's Cadian Fleshtone.  Once dry, I apply GW's Reikland Fleshshad.  My first highlight layer is Cadian Fleshtone mixed with a small amount of Reikland Fleshwash.  The next highlight is Cadian Flesh. The final highlight is 75/25 mix of Cadian Flesh mixed with Vallejo's Dwarf Skin.

If after, applying a layer of highlight I find that the transition are too stark, I use the cheat blending technique, described on page 4 of this thread.  I thin the Reikland Fleshshade with water and apply the mixture to the transition areas.  If I feel that a recess isn't dark enough, I may spot wash it with straight Reikland or a thinned Reikland.  If a recess is too dark, I may make a thin wash of Cadian Fleshtone to soften the recess.  After spot washing I may apply another thinned down layer of Cadian Fleshtone or the Cadian/Dwarf Skin mix. 

It isn't always as simple as basecoat, wash, apply two highlights, and then done.  Typically, I go back and rewash a certain area and then reapply my highlight and if I don't get it right, I may repeat the process again. 

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tancrede on July 11, 2017, 07:55:20 AM
Wonderful warband !  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on July 11, 2017, 05:01:26 PM
What reds and off-whites are you using?  They photograph wonderfully.

Also, with those Little Big Men transfers, how did you get them to look so opaque and visible?

I've had to put them on a white background and then paint over any white showing around them.

Did you paint the design over the transfer?

Great work, by the way.  Just fantastic.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 11, 2017, 07:33:05 PM
What reds and off-whites are you using?  They photograph wonderfully.

Also, with those Little Big Men transfers, how did you get them to look so opaque and visible?

I've had to put them on a white background and then paint over any white showing around them.

Did you paint the design over the transfer?

Great work, by the way.  Just fantastic.
Thanks.

My recipe for red is:
1) white primer
2) basecoat of GW's Scab Red
3) wash of GW's Agrax Earthshade
4) highlight GW's Khorne Red
5) highlight GW's Wazdakka Red
6) touch up, rewash, and re-highlight as needed

My recipe for off-white is:
1) white primer
2) basecoat GW's Karak Stone
3) wash of GW's Agrax Earthshade
4) highlight Karak White
5) highlight 70/30 mix Karak White and Vallejo's Bone White
6) add a little more Bone White to the mix and highlight again
7) touch up, rewash, and re-highlight as needed

As for the transfers, I prepare the surface with white primer, apply the LBM transfer, and then brush on a coat of matte varnish (I use Valejo's matte varnish).  The reds on these transfers aren't especially strong, so after the varnish dries I paint over them with a thinned Khorne Red.  Using thinned paint is important.  Not only does it give you more control over where the paint goes, but it dries smoother and when you are painting on a flat surface, like a shield face, you want your paint to dry flat and smooth.

Painting over the thin, often irregular shapes of the shield symbols can be tricky.  Even with a detail brush and a steady hand, one small slip and you've changed the shape of the symbol.  To help safeguard against this, I don't bother painting to the very edge of each symbol, but rather try to restrict my paint to the center or center line of the symbol, as illustrated below.  if you paint 'out of the lines,' you can always go back and clean it up with some off-white, but that takes extra time and can create areas of paint buildup that are visible to the eye.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2227/9GTM69.png)

On occasion I use the same technique on the white portions of the shield, but because I want some of the underlying scuffs and stains to show through, I mix my off-white fairly thin; not so thin that it's a wash, but thin enough that it dries slightly transparent.  If I need to add stains or just darken up the shield rims or areas touched up, I spot-wash these areas with a thinned mixture of Agrax Earthshade and water.



Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on July 13, 2017, 02:11:16 PM
Wonderful tutorial.  Thanks heaps.

I'll try the thinned paint technique on mine.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: nikko on July 15, 2017, 05:09:35 PM
Hello and thanks for your answer.

It's always interesting to know techniques used by very good painters....

Nikko
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on November 25, 2017, 08:09:50 PM
I've finished painting the last two Briton infantry wearing crested helms.  This completes my third unit of 8 Briton infantry.  At Adepticon, I' plan to use them as Warriors, but if I were to play them as Romans, they'd likely serve as Hearthguard.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/8114/Yh7V2e.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on November 25, 2017, 09:21:34 PM
They're very beautiful - the fact that the red looks both bright and worn is a nice effect.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Phil Robinson on November 25, 2017, 10:59:04 PM
Top job Sir.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: moiterei_1984 on November 26, 2017, 09:31:25 AM
Simply stunning!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Davea on November 26, 2017, 07:11:32 PM
Very nice - they look stunning
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: frenchfever on November 26, 2017, 07:32:30 PM
whoooaa   Pro painting at his best  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on November 27, 2017, 07:49:47 PM
The painting on those minis is top drawer.  What eye candy.   :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on November 28, 2017, 10:41:53 AM
Wonderful looking!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on November 28, 2017, 09:07:19 PM
Thanks, everyone. 

Now it's time to get started on my 9 Briton cavalry models.  I'm not looking forward to this.  :?

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/1353/5RrRaw.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on November 29, 2017, 08:12:47 PM
Now it's time to get started on my 9 Briton cavalry models.  I'm not looking forward to this.  :?


Oh but we are.   ;)  Your thread is most inspirational.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rumacara on November 29, 2017, 09:21:17 PM
Dito.
Lovely thread. :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on November 30, 2017, 12:51:37 AM
Absolutely fantastic job!  Wow!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on November 30, 2017, 03:53:47 PM
And so it begins...

(http://imageshack.com/a/img923/9629/AG4xeF.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on December 01, 2017, 11:36:06 AM
Alfie: "Hey Jamie, does that pin hurt?"
Jamie: "Too right it does."
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Paul Richardson on December 02, 2017, 05:31:40 PM
Great thread. I'm afraid I'm planning to copy your colour schemes.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on December 17, 2017, 06:23:22 PM
Well, here's the first two mounted Briton Hearthguard. 

The horses didn't turn out half bad considering these two horses represent my second and third attempts at painting horses, ever.  Nevertheless, I'd be lying if I said that I enjoyed painting them.  I do not like painting horses.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/2515/oDL8JT.jpg)

(http://imageshack.com/a/img924/7250/iatuFE.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Lt. Hazel on December 17, 2017, 06:33:04 PM
Lovely! The horses turned out very well, considering these are your first steps into horsepainting I am curious what the next will look like  :D
Jan
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Jeff965 on December 17, 2017, 06:54:33 PM
Beautiful clean crisp painting  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Dr. Zombie on December 17, 2017, 08:04:09 PM
They look brilliant.

No one likes painting horses.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Codsticker on December 17, 2017, 08:09:37 PM
No one likes painting horses.
I do  :)... but I think I am the only one  :-I.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Axebreaker on December 17, 2017, 08:37:29 PM
The whole entire thread is excellent! :-*

Christopher
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on December 18, 2017, 06:26:31 AM
They just look great!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on December 18, 2017, 11:50:18 AM
Beautiful painting om those cavalry.  This is one of my favourite threads.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: THE CID on December 18, 2017, 12:37:58 PM
Those cavalry are lovely, I hate painting the reins and saddles etc.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on December 18, 2017, 05:02:05 PM
These are some of the best paint jobs on some of the bets minis that I have seen!

I have a similar collection, so I can appreciate what you are doing, but mine aren't at this level.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ephrael on December 27, 2017, 11:57:32 PM
Your army is inspirational. I’m seriously considering shelving the Vikings army I was planning and painting something more Arthurian instead.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on December 28, 2017, 03:11:35 AM
Wow.  Thank you everyone.  You are too kind.

It was a chore, but I managed to finish two more commanipulares.  Four down, five to go.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/9027/lJUWX3.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/8008/iduHzd.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on December 28, 2017, 03:52:27 AM
They are lovely - and I like the touch of that skull on the base.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on December 28, 2017, 05:21:42 AM
Might not be as fun as foot for you but they look great.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Utgaard on December 28, 2017, 01:23:10 PM
Great work again - especially the black horse is a real beauty!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on December 28, 2017, 02:51:17 PM
Amazing work mate!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 02, 2018, 01:11:43 AM
Six down, three to go.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/1302/6HRlz3.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/4189/26qPP9.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ephrael on January 02, 2018, 02:55:24 AM
Each pair of horses looks better and better.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on January 02, 2018, 09:51:26 AM
Wot he said.

Looking forward to your Breton army. ;)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 02, 2018, 11:30:28 AM
Oh those are wonderful.  I especially like the horse colours and the Draco.  Keep them coming.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on January 02, 2018, 04:59:31 PM
Like a lot, specially the horses.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 02, 2018, 05:52:01 PM
Looking forward to your Breton army. ;)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/528/pp0gcQ.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: gostgost on January 02, 2018, 08:12:40 PM
Great work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on January 02, 2018, 08:55:19 PM
Like the rest of us - the more you do something in this hobby the easier it gets (as we are lazy creatures). The enjoyment part might not happen though. I'm sure someone's written something about that in art/hobby stuff more succinctly than me before I've had my first coffee.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 03, 2018, 05:07:18 PM
Some of the best painting on some of my favorite minis.  Amazing job.

You're making me want to take a road trip up from California just to see your work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 03, 2018, 06:03:55 PM
Some of the best painting on some of my favorite minis.  Amazing job.

You're making me want to take a road trip up from California just to see your work!

Like you, I do love Footsore's minis.  They are some of the best historicals on the market.

If you or anyone else wants to see my Britons in person, you can do so in March at Adepticon 2018.  I'll be playing my Britons in both the SAGA doubles and singles tournaments.  Stop by and say hi.  You'll find me at one of the bottom tables.  :D

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/9718/DYtoSA.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on January 03, 2018, 11:38:46 PM
I am in the Hail Caesar battle usually held after the tournament in the same room. I will have to get there a bit early to check out your force on the table.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 04, 2018, 07:47:35 AM
I am in the Hail Caesar battle usually held after the tournament in the same room. I will have to get there a bit early to check out your force on the table.

Last year, there were dozens of great looking warbands and display boards. I don’t expect this year to be any different.  

The best time to view the warbands is during the breaks in between rounds. This is when we set up our warbands for judging.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 07, 2018, 05:13:34 PM
Seven down, two to go.  I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.  (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003765/e5003765.gif)

This is the first of my Warlord's companions.  I used the black and white chi rho shield transfer to distinguish the model from the other commanipulares.   I'm not 100% satisfied with this decision.  The shield design is too simple.  It doesn't properly communicate this warrior's rank.  I've already ordered some transfers that may work better.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/1168/dqOXH5.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/4860/1FHeLP.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 08, 2018, 09:50:06 AM
That is a serously great mini, shield design or not.  Wonderful colour on that horse and very crisp painting.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Michi on January 08, 2018, 10:02:16 AM
That is a serously great mini, shield design or not.  Wonderful colour on that horse and very crisp painting.

I second every single word!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on January 08, 2018, 10:04:03 AM
Thirded.

Maybe blood splatters on the shield to a) show they're not to be messed with and b) that'll give you black and red (i.e. giving you two colours) on the shield?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 08, 2018, 04:41:05 PM
How do you do the crevacess?  Do you leave some black primer showing?  Do you use a wash or ink and then paint up to it?

The definition is excellent, especially the leather "skirt" and the scales.

I struggle with making definition like that.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 08, 2018, 07:14:59 PM
How do you do the crevacess?  Do you leave some black primer showing?  Do you use a wash or ink and then paint up to it?

The definition is excellent, especially the leather "skirt" and the scales.

I typically use white primer for minis and black primer for terrain.

My recipe is very simple: primer > base coat > wash > highlight.

When washing, I use GW's Nuln Oil on anything iron/steel, GW's Reikland Flesh on skin, and GW's Agrax Earthshade on everything else.  If want a lighter brown wash, I use diluted Agrax or Army Painters Soft Tone Quickshade (from the dropper bottle, not the can). 

While highlighting, I make sure to keep the paint out of the recesses.  If accidentally get some paint in a recess or if I decide that I want to better define a certain recess I use a fine detail brush to apply the wash/ink directly to the recess.  This may require two or more coats to get the desired effect. 

To give iron/steel a more realistic, tarnished look, after the Nuln dries I apply spots of Agrax here and there and directly into some of the recesses (as described above).

I think it's helpful to think of painting a miniature as a dialogue rather than a monologue.  Yes, I have a recipe that I follow (base coat>wash>highlight), but in practice, the process isn't that liner.  In practice, I apply paint or a wash and once that dries, I stop and look at what I've done.  If it doesn't look quite right, I may apply more base coat color, more highlight color, or a wash to all or part of what I've done.  The wash may be straight from the bottle or diluted.  It's a constant back and forth. I apply paint or wash and by looking at the mini it tells me if what I've done is correct or not, and if it's not quite right, I apply more paint or wash.  Once dry I take another look and based upon what I see, I may apply more paint or wash.  And so on.

Because any particular part of a mini may be covered in multiple layers or paint and wash, it's important to thin your paint before applying it.  Multiple thin coats will produce a smoother surface and a more consistent color than a single thick coat.  Also, a thick layer of paint (or multiple thick layers) can diminish or entirely obscure a sculpt's fine details, like the tassels at the ends of a pteruges (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pteruges).  As such, I rarely paint straight out of the pot.  Instead, whether I'm applying a base coat or a highlight, I use small squares of plastic (cut from blister packs) as a paint palette for mixing and thinning the paint.  It takes longer than painting straight out of the pot, but the results tend to be better.


 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 08, 2018, 07:48:24 PM
I do all the things you describe but... my stuff doesn't look as cool as yours.  ;-)

I tend to use soft and strong tone, thinned with lahmian (?) medium and sometimes some liquitex flow improver.  Water tends to create these mucus-colored spots.  What do you use to thin those washes?

When I thin my paint it looks nice on flat surfaces but tends to pool in the crevacess, causing the loss of detail that thinning paint is meant to avoid.  Any advice on that?

Good idea with finely brushing in the washes.  I tend to put a thin coat all over and then lament that it has affected the flat surfaces when all I wanted was the crevacess.

When you go back over your washed surfaces, how precise are you with repainting the flats and edges (like on those scales)?  I am never really satisfied when I do this.  Maybe the detail is too small for me (as I get older) or maybe the light drybrushing I tend to use doesn't get the surfaces so much as the detail.

I would LOVE to watch how you do your painting, especially on the same group of minis that I am working on.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 09, 2018, 12:14:49 AM
If your thinned painting is running down the side of the model, it's too thin.  Your paint should be thin enough that it flows off your brush smoothly and leaves little or no brush marks on the model, but it shouldn't be so thin that it floods off your brush like wash/ink does.  

In 90s GW painting parlance, using a line dark color (typically black) to separate colors and equipment is called "black-lining".  I do essentially the same thing, but rather than using black or brown paint, I use washes.  

I tend to reserve my dry brushing for terrain the texture on bases.  Sometimes I will use a light dry brush on fur or hair to pick out he raised areas, followed by a 'wet brush', and then finished off by using the tip of the brush to pick out the highest areas.  I tend to 'wet brush' chainmail.

When I painted the Companion's scalemail, I started by painting the entire area Leadbelcher, followed by a wash of Nuln Oil.  I then went back and individually painted each scale with Leadbelcher and then went back again and painted the tip of each scale with brighter steel color.  Once dry, I used a fine detail brush loaded with a small amount of Nuln Oil to further darken the areas between the scales.  Because I wanted the armor to look well used, I lightly loaded another brush with Agrax and poked at the armor here and there, creating a few areas of tarnished metal.  
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 09, 2018, 05:02:56 PM
Thanks for the description.

Sounds like we do the same things with similar ingredients but you take more time to precisely paint each scale.  I tend to just drybrush with two shades over the wash.  I guess I should be in less of a hurry to get results like yours (if I ever can).

I use a wet pallet and keep the paint from getting dry.  When people say wet, I envision more water than paint.  I guess I already am using "wet" paint without calling it that.

DWArtist got me into using glazes (with lahmian medium) and multiple layers of super-thin paint (thinned with water).  This is nice on flat surfaces. 

I am still trying to get the fine detailing done efficiently.  The hardest for me is painting puttees.  If I paint a solid area and then wash it all, I get most of the crevacess shaded but it discolors the main surface.  Going back to drybrush gets edges but not the whole surface.  Trying to paint the straps always results in spillover into the crevices.  Maybe fresher brushes would help. 

Your posts are really inspiring me. 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Munindk on January 10, 2018, 09:23:15 AM
A tiny tiny bit of dishwashing soap in your wash will break the surface tension of the liquid and most of the wash should go into the recesses leaving the raised parts more of less free of wash.

Another way to go is to only wash small parts of an area, but this can get very time consuming.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 10, 2018, 08:26:30 PM
Trying to paint the straps always results in spillover into the crevices.  Maybe fresher brushes would help.   

There are two techniques whicj might help. Use a very fine brush but only use the very tip.  It is slower but more precise. 

The second is to paint the strap first and then go over any areas of adjacent colour that have spilt, with the base colour.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 10, 2018, 09:56:13 PM
Good ideas, thanks.

I have been doing the latter - not intentionally - and it's worked okay for me.  Not as nicely as the minis in this thread (then again, how many are that nice?) but it's how things seem to work out.

Still have a hard time keeping the edge of the strap on its edge and not in the middle of the strap, though.  I guess that's just dexterity.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 12, 2018, 08:24:35 AM
Eight down, one to go.  (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5013914/e5013914.gif)

Companion number two. 

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/1139/pB71o6.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/5118/uX3JM0.jpg)


To strengthen the visual tie between my warlord and companions, my warlord's shield will display a symbol that matches the companion's pennant.  It's not something that I had planned ahead of time.  After adding the pennant to the companion, I remembered that another one of my LBM sheets includes a shield transfer with a similar device.  Sometimes things just work out. (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003765/e5003765.gif)

Oh, and speaking of my warlord.  I added texture, small logs, and rocks to Mordred's display base. Warlord and display base are now ready for primer.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/9744/jE4lhZ.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on January 12, 2018, 09:20:12 AM
That looks suitably dynamic!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 12, 2018, 05:39:04 PM
Oh the Warlord looks brilliant. Can't wait to see him painted up.  :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on January 12, 2018, 06:30:18 PM
Oh the Warlord looks brilliant. Can't wait to see him painted up.  :-* :-* :-* :-*

Ditto! Where are the dogs from?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 12, 2018, 06:54:28 PM
Ditto! Where are the dogs from?

They are Guild Hounds made by Wyrd Miniatures.  I realize that the breed and armor isn't from the correct period, but in this instance I've elected to take some artistic license.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tancrede on January 12, 2018, 09:07:06 PM
Wonderful painting, as always.  :-*
And your Mordred looks very promising. I hope to see the painted version soon !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on January 13, 2018, 04:35:38 AM
The warlord looks very promising.  Good choice on the dogs.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 19, 2018, 03:09:35 AM
The metal bits didn't photograph very well, especially the face on the Ribchester face-mask helmet -which is my least favorite part of the mini.  Oh well.  As a child of the 80s I couldn't portray Mordred without his Excalibur-esque helmet.  Once I finish the model's display base, I will try to get a better photograph.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/6931/yOQH6l.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/9876/dAyJlx.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on January 19, 2018, 10:10:04 AM
Nice!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 19, 2018, 05:40:47 PM
That is a beautiful mini.  I love the facial armour, despite your misgivings.  I think it fits Mordred perfectly.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on January 19, 2018, 05:51:40 PM
I remember the movie you are referring to.  I really liked it, though, even as a kid the full plate looked funny to me for the Dark Ages.  I was a strange kid.

Could I suggest a little shading and highlighting of the gold/bronze helmet?  It looks a bit monochromatic.

And those ears, perhaps, should be flesh as opposed to metal.  Just my unsolicited two cents on your magnificent painting.

The silver/steel face looks PERFECT, though.  You did a GREAT job of capturing that cold, heartless look.

On a side-note, I remember a guy who had a faceplate like this in a Battle of the Nations tournament.  It was, somehow, terrifying to go up against him even though he was smaller than I and had a light weapon that tied up both hands. 

My eye saw a human face but it was, somehow, just not right.  The other helmets looked like helmets and were not so scary but this faceplate had a surprising and deep effect.  So strange.

https://www.youtube.com/user/battleofthenations
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Coenus Scaldingus on January 21, 2018, 07:33:45 AM
Great painting all around. Once finished this will be another magnificient force.

And those ears, perhaps, should be flesh as opposed to metal.
Pretty certain the ears too are metal on this type of helmet. Nobody said they were practical!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Norm on January 21, 2018, 08:20:13 AM
Very nice, I like the vibrancy, helps bring out the dynamic nature of the pose.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 22, 2018, 05:36:04 PM
I finished Mordred's display base.  Looking at the completed model, I wish I had added some red to the hounds to strengthen the visual connection between hounds and Mordred.

Here's Mordred and his two faithful hounds, Satan and Lucifer. 

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/2995/bFiaAT.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/1033/r6imou.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Neunfinger on January 22, 2018, 06:08:12 PM
Wow, that base is just fantastic.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 22, 2018, 07:14:45 PM
Wow, that base is just fantastic.

Thanks.

The plan is to incorporate into my army display board a dozen or so fallen and fleeing Saxons.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 22, 2018, 07:29:52 PM
Very nice indeed. I see what you mean about the red but I don't think it diminishes what is a fantastic composition.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tancrede on January 22, 2018, 07:48:35 PM
Wow, that base is just fantastic.
+1 !!  :-*
Another wonderful painting, sir.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Neunfinger on January 22, 2018, 09:07:44 PM
The plan is to incorporate into my army display board a dozen or so fallen and fleeing Saxons.

That sounds like a great way to tie the whole army together and make a wonderful display. I'm looking forward to seeing it.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Dr Mathias on January 22, 2018, 09:48:16 PM
Amazing work. Following with great interest!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on January 22, 2018, 10:53:31 PM
Superb!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on January 30, 2018, 02:34:02 AM
I finished my first baggage marker.  It's titled The Death of Gawain.  

Grievously wounded by Lancelot, Sir Gawain returned to Britain to convalesce.  Upon learning that his brother had seized the throne, Gawain hastily organized a resistance. Gawain may have been a paragon of knightly virtue, but the wounded knight was no match for Mordred.

As a cruel irony, Mordred had Gawain's head removed from his corpse and paraded about under Mordred’s banner.

As king, Mordred has chosen a red dragon to serve as his sigil.  As a nod to his family’s heraldry, Mordred’s standard is topped with a double headed eagle.

Piled on the log are Gawain's helmet, sword, and shield.  In the story, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, Gawain's shield device is not portrayed as his family's double headed eagle, but rather a gold pentangle (pentagram) on a red background.  I couldn’t find a suitable LBM transfer, so I had to hand paint the shield.  Gawain was among the most virtuous of knights, so I painted his scabbard and sword handle white.  I chose the face mask helm because, well, it looks cool.  

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/687/konXjh.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on January 30, 2018, 07:40:01 AM
Beautiful  :-*
Great idea, perfectly executed. You are a clever and talented fellow  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Dr Mathias on January 30, 2018, 02:44:34 PM
Beautiful.

After seeing this thread, and the really cool Romano-British stuff in last years LPL, I'm getting tempted to jump in to this era.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on January 30, 2018, 07:14:27 PM
Excellent diorama with some wonderfully painted and posed figures.  Truly brilliant.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Axebreaker on January 31, 2018, 02:23:51 AM
Excellent just excellent! :-*

Christopher
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: syrinx0 on January 31, 2018, 02:45:08 AM
A wonderful diorama. Beautiful work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: archiduque on January 31, 2018, 05:01:01 PM
Fantastic work!! :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on January 31, 2018, 06:20:17 PM
Yeah, that's pretty awesome.....
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Little Odo on January 31, 2018, 08:02:42 PM
That is a fantastic little vignette - nicely done  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Treebeard on February 01, 2018, 09:07:43 AM
This army will look awsome
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ErikB on February 01, 2018, 04:34:45 PM
This army will look awesome
I would be afraid to play with this army.  I would be heartbroken when any of those exquisitely painted minis "dies" and, even worse, if they get scuffed up from being handled.   :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 01, 2018, 06:18:18 PM
Thanks, everyone.  Your comments are much appreciated.

I'm working on marker #2, The Reluctant Bride.  I hope to have it done this weekend.

I would be afraid to play with this army.  I would be heartbroken when any of those exquisitely painted minis "dies" and, even worse, if they get scuffed up from being handled.

I don't seal entire models because I find at that varnish dims the colors.  I do apply a matte varnish to those parts of the model that are most likely to chip, such as the edges of the bases and the tips of pointy things that stick out, like animal tails, the tips of capes, and sword points.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: THE CID on February 01, 2018, 06:59:36 PM
Inspiring, 1st class.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Anselm van Helsing on February 02, 2018, 08:16:26 AM
Only had time to zoom at Gawain &Mordred. Boy they are beautiful vignettes! You wouldn't think primarily of wargames when you come across this level. The shields and the standard alone are incredible.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: arget8 on February 02, 2018, 01:09:25 PM
I've been following this thread for months now, your minis are simply fantastic. I love the theme as well, it's rare that you see anyone play the "bad" guys as the Romano-British. I'm really looking forward to the display base as well.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 02, 2018, 04:38:42 PM
Only had time to zoom at Gawain &Mordred. Boy they are beautiful vignettes! You wouldn't think primarily of wargames when you come across this level. The shields and the standard alone are incredible.
Thank you.  

Except for the pentangle shield, all the shields and banners are transfers, so I can't claim full credit for them.  I have added paint to some of the shield transfers to enhance their color (see Reply #117 of this thread), so I'll take a little bit of credit there.

All of my transfers were made by Little Big Men Studios. 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 04, 2018, 05:28:41 PM
I've finished the second baggage marker.  It's titled The Reluctant Bride.

Here we see the kingdom's Bishop extolling Mordred's virtues and trying to convince Guinevere that her impending marriage to Briton's new king is certainly no reason to cry.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/3226/OejalA.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on February 04, 2018, 05:54:05 PM
Fantastic.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on February 04, 2018, 10:48:00 PM
Nice!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on February 04, 2018, 11:08:48 PM
Really loving your faction!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 11, 2018, 06:09:06 PM
I've finished the third and final baggage marker.  It's titled Merlin's Arrest.

With Arthur away, Merlin is the greatest threat to Mordred’s primacy. As such, Mordred has ordered the arrest and imprisonment of Arthur's most trusted advisor.

The tree adds some height to the diorama and gives me a place to put an owl, which, like Merlin, is a symbol of wisdom and watchfulness. Merlin's magic is comes from Britain's pagan past, hence the rock with the Celtic swirl engraving, the dead tree, and the many skulls. At these angles you can't quite see it, but next to the tree is a pile of 4 skulls.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/6346/fivnRI.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/9625/6QRvX3.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: OSHIROmodels on February 11, 2018, 06:36:56 PM
Great work  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: soldieroftheline on February 11, 2018, 07:06:00 PM
Where is the Merlin model from? Fantastic work BTW!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on February 11, 2018, 07:37:29 PM
Wonderful work.  I just love these vignettes and your painting.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on February 11, 2018, 07:38:40 PM
Where is the Merlin model from? Fantastic work BTW!

They’re all Footsore figures.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Coenus Scaldingus on February 11, 2018, 08:32:02 PM
Fantastic, the poses fit the scene perfectly.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 11, 2018, 11:38:20 PM
They’re all Footsore figures.

The model I used for Guinevere is made by Dragon Bait Miniatures. All the rest of the “baggage” models are sold by Footsore Miniatures. 

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Marine0846 on February 12, 2018, 02:09:06 AM
Really love all your extras. :-*
They are a treat to see.
May I ask, "Are you going to Enfilade in May?"
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 15, 2018, 04:43:30 PM
May I ask, "Are you going to Enfilade in May?"

I've been in the past, but not this year.  Adepticon is my only event this year.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 15, 2018, 07:12:07 PM
Here's a mock-up of my warband display board.  The finished board will have a hill in the upper left corner, upon which the baggage markers will sit.  Where the rocks are now, will be some kind of uneven ground, either trees or rocks.  I haven't decided.  I'm still undecided whether to include the casualties.  It guess it will depend upon how much time I have to work on it.  Sorry for the lousy photo.  I shot it by hand with my iphone.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/7030/jlcTRE.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on February 15, 2018, 07:24:14 PM
Wonderful collection.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rumacara on February 16, 2018, 03:58:44 PM
Lovelly. :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on February 16, 2018, 06:38:08 PM
They look great!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Treebeard on February 16, 2018, 07:00:48 PM
Gorgeous
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 16, 2018, 07:25:31 PM
I ordered some of these 5x7 cards printed on card stock.  I will use them as army lists to give to my opponents and the tournament organizer, and as part my display for the painting judges.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/9720/fIC7by.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Klingula on February 18, 2018, 10:10:35 AM
This is one of the most amazing armies of the Late Roman that I've seen  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on February 18, 2018, 06:59:27 PM
No sideboard? :D

Very inspiring stuff!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: tancrede on February 20, 2018, 11:35:25 AM
This is one of the most amazing armies of the Late Roman that I've seen  :-*
+1 !
And your display board looks very promising !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 20, 2018, 04:26:57 PM
I've made some progress on the display board.  It needs to fit in my suitcase, so the trees won't be glued to the board.  Instead, they will sit inside of inserts.

I used a rubber mold made by a railway scenery company to cast the rocks.

My original plan was to paint the trees foliage in Autumn colors, but now that I see the full warband displayed, I think that green (likely a darkish green), will look better, as it's a opposite of red on the color wheel.

I have another sizeable painting project to take care of before Adepticon, so it's looking less and less likely that I'll be adding the Saxon casualties to this board.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/295/1Skhgm.png)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 24, 2018, 06:44:43 PM
Progress.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/4215/SdYTcm.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 25, 2018, 01:53:00 AM
(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/6187/M6Jh00.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on March 05, 2018, 05:09:26 PM
I've made some good progress.

All that's left to do is touch up the black on the sides of the board and add grass and flower tufts to break up the open areas and strengthen the visual connection between the board, trees, and my models' bases.

My hope is that all the green areas will contrast nicely with the red on my models.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/5969/WLnLTm.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Hu Rhu on March 05, 2018, 07:34:58 PM
Nice.  Looking forward to seeing it finished and with the models displayed.  If that doesn't win you some prizes then the judges must be blind.  :D :D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Vanvlak on March 05, 2018, 07:43:05 PM
I love the presentation base - and the Britons too, of course  8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on March 20, 2018, 04:59:07 PM
Here's my team's "army list" for the 2018 Adepticon SAGA Team Tournament. The fleeing Roman soldier is guaranteed to strike fear into the hearts of our opponents.  (http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e5003766//e5003766.gif)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/9364/SYIna5.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on March 26, 2018, 02:00:18 PM
Wow!  What an amazing three days of tournaments.

I played doubles with Fluger. We won second place overall, but the most rewarding part of the tournament was getting a chance to play SAGA with six amazing opponents. In the first round we played against Tracy Beech and THE Andy Lyon.  The outcome was never in doubt.  We lost handily. Our next two rounds were played against great guys that I met at last year’s SAGA events, Farshad & Chicago Mike, and Rich & Missouri Mike (or is it Michigan Mike?).  By winning both games we secured second place overall.

My first round opponent in SAGA Singles was played against the host of the SAGA podcast, SAGA Thorsday, Joe (aka ‘The Dude’, aka the ‘Wiscohorndog’).  He played a beautifully painted Byzantine warband. Ultimately the Byzantines triumphed and sent the Briton provincials packing.

In round two I got another shot at Missouri/Michigan Mike. He avenged his earlier loss from the day before by holding me to a draw.  What a great game.

My last game was played againt Jeff and his devious Moors. This was my first game against Moors, so it was really fun learning about what they can do.  Using his superior knowledge of the game and Moorish trickery, Jeff pulled out the win.

I ended the Day 1 Singles tournament with a losing record (my first ever), but I did win ‘best painted’. Woo-hoo!

I began the Day 2 Singles tournament with a game against Chicago John’s gorgeous Spanish Warband.  The Spanish gave John a huge advantage in the scenario, so I was amazed when I ended up losing by only the narrowest of margins.  BTW John went on to win Best Painted, and if you ever get a chance to see his spectacular hand-painted shields, you’ll know why.

I played game two against the overall winner from the Day 1 Singles tournament, Nicholas. Midway through the game I believed that I had him, but then he played (with my urging), The Long Dark, and took back the advantage.  Left with only one SAGA die, my only chance to narrow the scenario point gap and avoid total annihilation eluded me when I failed (two turns in a row), to roll the SAGA die I needed to move my last unit of warriors into the safety of a nearby forest.  On the last turn the Rus Princes’ Warlord and Druzhina cavalry charged and obliterated my last unit of warriors. He kept apologizing for me tabling me. I told him that he had nothing to apologize for. He played a great game and was a fantastic opponent. I was very happy for him. 

I played game three (my very last game of SAGA 1.0) against my good friend Seth.  The game was played with a crowd of our friends around the table and plenty of trash talk.  It looked like I was doing really well, so in a stunning display of cockiness, I used my final turn to pull my entire warband back, out of Seth’s vikings’ reach. I did it to be funny and to tease Seth, but in the end, my hubris was my undoing.  My initial count of the slaughter points put me 4 points ahead of Seth.  Then I realized that I had forgotten to count my 4 hearthguard casualties, so the game ended in a draw. That’s what I get for being a jackass.  We all had a good laugh at my expense, and after thinking about it, a draw against good friend was the perfect way to end 3 days of SAGA tournaments and my last game of SAGA 1.0.

(http://z6.ifrm.com/8152/110/0/e14118//e14118.gif)

Champions of King (SAGA Doubles) and Rune Carver (SAGA Singles)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/8499/gOK3eg.jpg)

 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Codsticker on March 27, 2018, 05:32:41 AM
Congratulations on an excellent tournament. :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: von Lucky on March 27, 2018, 09:00:03 AM
Well done on being a jackass Briton ;) It really is a lovely warband you painted. Any in game photos?

PS Your signiature links need to be updated for the new site.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on March 27, 2018, 10:28:17 AM
Congratulations Koyote. I've seen your army pop up here and there already on the internet.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on March 27, 2018, 05:33:12 PM
Well done on being a jackass Briton ;) It really is a lovely warband you painted. Any in game photos?

PS Your signiature links need to be updated for the new site.
I've updated my signature. Thanks.

Sadly, I didn't take very many photos and the pics that I did snap were taken with my iPhone and in bad light, so they aren't very good.

Here's a couple of photos take by Bill Thornhill, owner of Footsore Miniatures.  I nabbed them from Footsore's Facebook page.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/7339/lq0rSU.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/7623/7cP8xB.jpg)


Here's one of my photos.  It was taken midgame against 'The Dude's' beautiful Byzantines.  It's a shame that I didn't take any close ups.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/9812/G90dkq.png)


And here's my Britons castling-up against the Moors.  The Moorish battle board punishes opponents who spread out, so I thought it best to deploy everyone within 6" of my Warlord.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/8562/CWUns4.png)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/2783/PfjMGK.png)


Here's Mike's berserkers charging my doomed guides.  This was a hostage scenario, so the individual viking models standing directly behind my Briton units are prisoners, not active units.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/919/gZHlb1.png)


Here's a shot from my game against John's Spanish.  The decision that he's making right now is what won him the game.  By using Battle Chaos to place 2 fatigue markers on each my warlord and healthguard,  he saved one of his two remaining mounted units of warriors.  If I had been able to catch and destroy both units, the game would have ended in a draw.  Curse you John and your Spanish trickery. :)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/3818/lRMsc7.png)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/8109/wEADqo.png)


Lastly, here's the set up for the game against my buddy, Seth.

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/3231/tWjiU1.jpg)

(https://imageshack.com/a/img924/672/ZIqYdK.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: rokurota on March 27, 2018, 07:54:01 PM
Superb!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Codsticker on March 28, 2018, 04:14:20 AM
Great pictures, thanks for posting them.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Too Bo Coo on March 28, 2018, 07:31:53 AM
Looks great! My mate Steve Holdeman was there, I think with his Byzantines. How did you place overall?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on March 28, 2018, 12:49:30 PM
Looks great! My mate Steve Holdeman was there, I think with his Byzantines. How did you place overall?
My team placed second overall in the Doubles.  I forgot to snap a pic of the Day 1 Singles, so I don’t know where I placed, but in the Day 2 Singles I placed 10th (out of 32). My combined Day 1 and Day 2 Singles scores put me at 13th (out of 32) for the Singles “Ironman”.

It looks like Holdeman’s “Ironman” ranking was 14th.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Ajax on July 14, 2018, 10:47:11 AM
Your army is absolutly fantastic. One of the most beautiful I have seen on Internet. Congratulations !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 20, 2018, 06:40:50 PM
Your army is absolutly fantastic. One of the most beautiful I have seen on Internet. Congratulations !
Thanks.  It was a fun project.

A lot of the credit goes to Footsore Miniatures for making such great minis.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: wkeyser on July 23, 2018, 03:34:19 AM
What an inspiring thread, the hobby is always stronger with these kind of posts. I just ordered a bunch of Vikings to start Saga. Thanks for the posts you have inspired me to get into a new period.

William
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Cyrus the Great on February 10, 2019, 06:18:03 AM
Well, I'm late to the show. I just wanted to comment on your backstory, which not only was the theme of your army, but also dictated your choice of vignettes. Great painting and your color palette choices really, thematically brought the warband together.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on February 11, 2019, 06:25:25 PM
Well, I'm late to the show. I just wanted to comment on your backstory, which not only was the theme of your army, but also dictated your choice of vignettes. Great painting and your color palette choices really, thematically brought the warband together.
Thanks.

It's a shame that I won't make it to Adepticon this year.  I've heard that one of the SAGA events is a themed Aetius & Arthur event where the participants battle for control of Camelot.  My Briton warband would have been a perfect thematic match for this event.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 12, 2019, 06:13:14 PM
One of the brilliant aspects of SAGA Age of Magic is the ease in which you can bring your historical SAGA warbands into AoM. 

I had already planned to add a unit of 12 levy archers to my Britons to take advantage of levy rules in SAGA v2, but now that AoM has landed, I've decided to expand the warband even further so that my Britons can be played as a Great Kingdoms warband.

I want to keep my original Arthurian "villains" theme, so I am going to restrict my weapon selection (e.g. no crossbows or firearms) and monsters to the early Welsh Arthurian stories.  My first AOM additions will be a mounted Captain (or Paladin) and a Static War Machine.    The Captain will be Mordred's oldest (half?) brother, Sir Agravain the Hard Hand.  Like Mordred, in the earlier versions of the myths Sir Agravain is a flawed character but he isn't the villain Mallory makes him out to be.  Sir Agravain is a brute so he'll make a good enforcer, but he isn't especially charismatic, so Mordred needn't fear his men switching loyalties.  The model that I'm using Sir Agravain comes from Footsore Miniature's Late Roman Cavalry Command set.

The war machine is Gripping Beasts' Late Roman Scorpio.  Like most of GB's older minis, the sculpts are meh. 

Warlord Games sells a much better scorpion, but it's triple the cost of the GB model.  If I find that the war machine works well for me, I may break down and order Warlord Games model and donate this one to a friend.

Stronghold Terrain sells a very nice Late Roman Manuballista (which I own), but the models are very small, even for historicals.  It's advertised as 28mm scale, but compared to GB and Footsore 28mm historicals, the Stronghold Terrain manuballista looks like it is being crewed by children. (https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/smilies/52929/1534797199.5587-smiley.gif)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4721/QdkeqG.jpg)

The next new addition to my AoM Britons will be much more fantastic in nature.  Giants play a prominent role in the early myths of Britain's founding, so it's not surprising that they pop up, time and again, in many of the Arthur myths.  In a Welsh myth, Arthur uses treachery to kill 3 giantess sisters and when their brother, Cribwr Gawr, reproaches Arthur, Arthur threatens Cribwr Gawr with death. 

In my warband's AOM backstory the giants are no friends to the Britons, but when Mordred offers Cribwr Gawr the opportunity to kill Arthur, an uneasy alliance is formed.

I spent quite a bit of time online searching for a model that fits my vision of a giant from Celtic myths.  Even though it's a giant, I don't want the model to be too tall as this could make it look too out of place among the rest of the warband.  Even though it's monster in a fantasy warband, I don't want it to have any armor or carry any weapons that would look out of place for the semi-historical period that my warband inhabits.  I finally settled on a hill giant miniature printed/cast by a seller on Etsy.  The model is a bit too plain, so my plan is to gussy it up some using greenstuff and plastic bits from other kits.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9372/P5Avre.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Coenus Scaldingus on July 13, 2019, 10:12:38 AM
Nice bit of backstory. Looking forward to seeing what you end up doing with that giant.

Warlord Games sells a much better scorpion, but it's triple the cost of the GB model.  If I find that the war machine works well for me, I may break down and order Warlord Games model and donate this one to a friend.
Which one are you referring to? The metal ones are less than twice the price, while the plastic one is only slightly more expensive. The only ones at a higher price point are sets of three.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 13, 2019, 12:29:00 PM
Which one are you referring to? The metal ones are less than twice the price, while the plastic one is only slightly more expensive. The only ones at a higher price point are sets of three.
Shipped to my address in the US, the GB Late Roman Scorpio is £7.90 ($9.93).

Shipped to my address using “standard shipping” the Caesarian Roman Scorpion is $31.75.

Warlord’s Imperial Roman Scorpion would be only double the price of the GB Scorpio, but the Imperial Roman crews’ helms and lorica segmentata armor differ greatly from the helmets and armor of my Britons, so I’d have to scrap the crew and find entirely different crew models. 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Gandalf the G on July 13, 2019, 10:24:01 PM
This is a great project! I really enjoy adaptations of old Saga warbands into the Age of Magic.



Concerning the giants, Reaper should soon be releasing a couple of Hill Giants that might fit.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-bones-4-mr-bones-epic-adventure/posts/2381576
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: John Tailby on July 19, 2019, 07:28:49 AM
Warlord games are currently offering free international shipping on orders over 10 pounds. They also make a plastic bolt thrower. You could couple that with some plastic Gripping Beast models.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 21, 2019, 05:17:43 AM
@Gandalf the G and John Tailby:  Thanks for the tips. (https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/smilies/52929/1534797201.7229-smiley.gif)


I’ve started work on a Sacred Ground terrain piece for Age of Magic. It can also be used as a Ruins terrain piece in standard Saga.

In both my “historical” and AoM warbands, most of my Britons are early-Christians, but Mordred, Morgan Le Fay, and many of their men keep the old gods and the old ways.

In my “historical” version of the warband the unit of mercenary Guides is represented by Morgan and her Cymri Warriors.  In my AoM version I am going to use the same idea to add crossbows to my warband. Instead of Guides, Morgan’s contribution to my AoM Britons will be a unit of Picts armed with crossbows and the giant, Cribwr Gawr.

My AoM Britons’ ties to their pagan past give me the excuse to incorporate some terrific standing stone models (made by Scotia Grendel Miniatures) into my Briton’s AoM Sacred Ground terrain.

I purchased the the rocky hill from Terrainify, a 3D printer that sells on Etsy. They sell this hill in 3 different sizes. For this project, I’m using is the middle size. It measures roughly 7.5” x 6”.

Below are some WIPs.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3549/RtYSZV.png)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/913/Fe15m8.png)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/9530/007DPI.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Captain Blood on July 21, 2019, 07:16:17 AM
Gorgeous as ever. Looking forward to seeing that piece finished in all its glory  8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 24, 2019, 03:53:02 PM
I've completed Sir Agravain and the first four Levy archers.

I need to do a bit more work on Agravain's face. Right now he looks like Sir Agravain the Terrified.  Narrowing his eyes should help.

To signify the Levy's lower rank and distinguish them from my Warriors and Hearthguard, I painted their tunics are the color of unbleached cotton.

As usual, my camerawork and lighting are poor.  In person, the reds are a deeper shade.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7177/brWxbC.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3041/T8JB6B.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Breazer on July 25, 2019, 04:08:55 PM
This is very cool! Keep em coming Koyote
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on July 25, 2019, 04:20:31 PM
I've created a thread in the Fantasy Adventure forum ( LINKY (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=118478.0)) to host my SAGA Age of Magic content.  If you want to see my progress on my AoM Britons, you can find it there.  Britons content that is "historical" will be posted here in the Medieval Adventures forum.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8889/Q1phg0.gif)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on August 05, 2019, 05:10:29 PM
Since these models are arguably both for use in my "historical" Britons and my AoM Britons, I'm posting them here as well.

These models are Footsore Late Roman Archers. The unit's leader is the standard bearer from Footsore's Romano-British Warlord set.  I replaced the model's right arm with a bit from a Gripping Beast's Arab Heavy Cavalry plastic kit, and replaced the left hand with a bow hand from the unused Footsore archer.


(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3259/JUiM0E.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Neldoreth on August 05, 2019, 05:17:43 PM
Those archers look great painted up!

The conversion worked out really well also, a great commander for the unit.

Thanks
n
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Koyote on August 25, 2019, 05:42:31 PM
This model is Arthur from an Arthur & Mordred vignette made by Westwind Productions. It’s part of my project, along with my Briton archers and Hatra ballista, to make my Britons playable as Romans (or AoM Great Kingdoms). It’ll make a great Roman foot-Warlord (or AoM Captain or Paladin).

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4365/2f0syM.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1751/4Oyhbj.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: Michi on August 28, 2019, 12:46:18 PM
Most excellent man! That Arthur is a gem!!! :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons
Post by: ulverston on September 22, 2019, 10:11:33 AM
Every now and then I come across a thread and become engrossed. Your work is simply amazing and inspiring, thanks for sharing you have made my week with this.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Koyote on September 28, 2019, 12:02:30 AM
Back in 2017, like many in the hobby, I got phucked by Photobucket.  This left my Lead Adventure Forum Irish thread a shambles, so I asked the moderator to delete it.  I recently recovered many of the lost photos from the Photobucket fiasco, and rather than create yet another 'Koyote' thread, I decided to add the photos to this thread and call it good.

I assembled and painted this Irish warband in 2016 and 2017.  This was before Footsore Miniatures came out with their lovely Irish slingers and Fianna with dane axes, so I had to make my own.

My backstory for this warband was that it represented an Irish clan that had resisted conversion to Christianity and still held to the old ways.  As such, I included women in my warband and that my Curaidh looked more like ancient Celt champions than Dark Age Irish.

I apologize in advance for the quality of the photos.  :D

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2856/1fuiaN.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1883/CMvTxb.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4045/mP4jX9.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3710/yslaCN.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3439/A71eVE.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1400/FdFrlA.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2347/DjoCDF.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4922/iolLeE.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1373/MEu7pA.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/298/1UgniB.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/5712/9kF0KE.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4712/OlaR3Z.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3151/O0wTXq.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/5360/NSbwcs.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/2324/y3j1x5.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4125/OLv7y2.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3026/ldvRo9.png)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3978/KE4Gvc.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/7392/biKwqi.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/5450/YCIVoQ.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8093/ftqqzh.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6453/wwmp5o.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3707/D2fP52.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3251/9dDmeY.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/9068/Ht5ddV.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5518/R71u99.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/471/fC0Mka.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3694/0gaptN.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3166/M0HHp2.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2596/jYKwKw.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/7482/6AK99M.jpg) (https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2848/21WhV8.jpg)

(https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/hotlinkimg/ce7b02d7b4cf5a5290c58c953dd1148559448eae)

(https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/hotlinkimg/172ed5e6df1131ec29438b31acf89b994b53dbbd)

(https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/hotlinkimg/e11469793b1bee00f1d669eb7e4d0baa36428986)

(https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/hotlinkimg/504c14ee583c84cbb269915ddeb2a6b57643d230)

(https://groups.tapatalk-cdn.com/hotlinkimg/d8457903417dd7d0395179467419379021a2596b)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6131/4k49fe.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Koyote on September 28, 2019, 02:16:22 AM
These photos were taken at the Adepticon 2017 SAGA Tournament.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4931/eefV6a.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6869/2uyOo0.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/9355/UGhIzm.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3333/hqajeD.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4258/xknGsX.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2193/R6RQm8.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3561/dzMVnT.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/8021/laENiy.jpg)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: syrinx0 on September 28, 2019, 04:06:58 AM
That is a beautiful army.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Ogrob on September 28, 2019, 07:51:28 AM
Great looking army! One of the inspirations in making my own Irish.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Ragnar on September 28, 2019, 08:13:15 AM
Excellent stuff Koyote.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Olsson on September 28, 2019, 08:17:16 AM

Looked through this while avoiding doing some work and it is a really enjoyable thread to read with wonderful miniatures. I especially like the thought you seem to put behind a lot of it and that you share it with the rest of us. Makes the project more fun to follow and invest in. I have never tried SAGA myself but after a period of having looked more into historical wargaming I'll grant seeing your work makes it tempting to try.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Captain Blood on September 28, 2019, 11:10:38 AM
Marvellous to see these again, rising like heroes from Tír nAill...
As usual with your projects, wonderful modelling and attention to detail in selection of figures and components. You have made some fairly shonky plastic components look a million dollars with your kitbashing and painting.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Too Bo Coo on September 28, 2019, 02:13:17 PM
AWESOME!!! What plastic sets did you base these on?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: gamer Mac on September 28, 2019, 04:31:08 PM
Lovely stuff :-* :-* :-*
The tattoos are amazing how do you do them?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Koyote on September 28, 2019, 05:37:45 PM
@Too Bo Coo: I used Gripping Beast’s Dark Age Warriors for the slingers, Conquest Games’ Norman Infantry for the Hearthguard with Dane axes, and Warlord Games’ Celtic Warriors for the Curaidh (champions).

@gamer Mac: The tattoos are simply hand painted using a fine brush.




Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: has.been on September 28, 2019, 08:18:17 PM
Beautiful work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Breazer on September 29, 2019, 10:15:14 AM
Good to see you recovered the pictures and this looks great!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons and Irish
Post by: Sangennaru on September 29, 2019, 10:23:08 AM
Amazing pictures, i don't know how i missed this thread so far!

And your modding is inspiring!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on September 30, 2019, 07:02:56 PM
Here are some more recovered photos from the Photobucket-Fiasco of 2017.

My basic philosophy for wargaming terrain is that it should be aesthetically pleasing, reasonably realistic looking, but most importantly, it must be playable.  And by "playable" I mean, that placing models on or within the terrain should be easy.  I've seen some absolutely gorgeous, realistic looking terrain that's a pain in the ass to play on because the models are constantly tipping over, or in order to put the models on the terrain, you must lie the models on their side.  I also prefer that terrain be modular, so that players don't have to play the exact same set-up, over and over again.

Pictured below is most of my SAGA terrain. I purchased my SAGA area terrain bases, rocky outcrops, and blank inserts from Worldsmith Industries, which closed shop at the beginning of 2019.  I purchased the flocked trees from Scenic Express.  I made the shrubs using leftover branches from GW's Citadel Woods kit and adding flocked foliage.  I used Magic Water for my water effects.  My buildings are 4Ground pre-painted Saxon Hovels mounted on styrene bases that I textured and flocked.  The sections of road (which I made for the Crescent & the Cross Captured! scenario) are made from styrene sheets.

Once again, I apologize in advance for the quality of the photos.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/8133/XEtyc3.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6444/uE9aZR.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/544/Nfpysc.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/148/2W57Ak.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3672/WEy76V.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3234/Iuwarf.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/7861/KOwsDX.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3492/D1pLYa.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/531/xO3I3O.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/5069/9RQInm.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8043/xl3Gsh.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8998/PcLrxF.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3388/XjCOT3.jpg)


I purchased to top portion of my hill from Broken Egg Games. I bought the hill because its gradual slope looks 'model friendly'.  There was no mention of the "hill's" elevation in the webstore's product description, and without anything in the product photo to give me a sense of scale, I couldn't gauge its height.  I didn't expect the hill to be very tall, but when it arrived, to my dismay, its elevation was roughly 1/2" high.  I wasted $22 + shipping for a resin lump that came up to the waist of 28mm model.  I should have sent it back, but I had the materials on hand to fix it, so I did so. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9493/BnQ47M.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1774/ERX735.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3936/hR0HRv.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8946/pNxCFy.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9395/oVYvwG.jpg)


Storing and traveling can take its toll on terrain, especially flocked terrain, so I built some custom storage boxes for this purpose.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/8484/v33dT3.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9518/hIdz0Q.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: gamer Mac on September 30, 2019, 11:56:38 PM
Some very nice bit and pieces :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Sangennaru on October 01, 2019, 07:34:11 AM
Very well done! Everything is blending together very well!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on March 16, 2020, 03:27:40 AM
At the risk of being accused of necromancy, I only just came across this amazing thread and had to try to find words to express just how incredible it is. Part of me wishes I found it sooner but another part realizes some of the magnificence of the work would have escaped me at my earlier skill level.

So much thought going into the background and the execution, especially those baggage pieces. And such generosity in explaining techniques. Absolute respect. Thank you for continuing to inspire and more so to teach.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: duivelindoosje on March 22, 2021, 12:53:22 PM
like Rick W i only saw that post recently, AMAZING
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 23, 2021, 03:57:21 PM
Thank you for the kind word Rick W and duivelindoosje. 

I really enjoyed building the Britons warband.  It allowed me to delve into a history and mythology that I am familiar with and quite fond of.  Best of all, since it was part of an Adepticon doubles-tournament project, it allowed me to share the Adepticon experience with a good friend of mine.  We got to play against (and lose to) THE Andy Lyons.  We went 2 and 1, placed second overall, and won the Champions of Kings prize (best general?). Good times.

The Britons remains my favorite SAGA project of all time.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Too Bo Coo on March 23, 2021, 04:11:30 PM
Thank you for the kind word Rick W and duivelindoosje. 

I really enjoyed building the Britons warband.  It allowed me to delve into a history and mythology that I am familiar with and quite fond of.  Best of all, since it was part of an Adepticon doubles-tournament project, it allowed me to share the Adepticon experience with a good friend of mine.  We got to play against (and lose to) THE Andy Lyons.  We went 2 and 1, placed second overall, and won the Champions of Kings prize (best general?). Good times.

The Britons remains my favorite SAGA project of all time.

Mine too, perusing those pages is glorious! I would love your feedback on my own Britons project!

https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=129855.0
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 04, 2021, 06:38:54 PM
It's time for some threadomancy.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/418/dazyvI.gif)


After a 3 year hiatus, I hope to attend the Adepticon 2022 Saga tournaments.  To limit the number of warbands I have to transport via my carry-on, I had hoped to use my Moors (or Mutatawwia) as Umayyads in the Age of Viking tournament(s).  However, if the 2022 Age of Viking rules match the most recently published Adepticon AoV rules (2020), then warbands from the the Old Friends, New Enemies warbands will not be allowed.

As a fall back plan, I am going to prepare my Irish for the trip.  I don't want to simply reuse an old warband.  Additionally, the V2 Irish warband is more focused shooting than the original Irish warband, so some updates are in order.

My new list will include 2 units of Levy slingers. One unit will be the levy that I painted for the original warband, but didn't use in the Adepticon tournament.  The second unit will be an entirely new unit, converted from Wargames Atlantic's brilliant Dark Age Irish Warriors kit. 

My only criticism of the Wargames Atlantic kit is that out of 30 models the kit includes only enough slings to arm 5 models with slings. WTF!?!?  What use is 5 slingers?

I made my original unit of Irish slingers from the Gripping Beast Dark Age Warrior kit, which includes plenty of sling bits.  However, the GB hands are noticeably larger than the hands on the Wargames Atlantic Irish models, so I couldn't perform simple hand swaps.  Instead, I carefully carved each hand into the shape of a small peg, and then inserted that peg into a hole I drilled in the hand of each Wargames Atlantic model.  Since the pegs aren't long enough to stick out from the bottom of the Wargames Atlantic hands, when I removed the original weapons (mostly javelins), I took care to leave a little nub sticking out of the bottom of each hand.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1594/oMMD3y.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/7373/kyKVnd.png)


I'm quite fond of the Wargames Atlantic hound models, so I am going to replace my current hounds with WA hounds.

Also, if the Adepticon Age of Viking tournament allows Swords for Hire units, my plan is to include a unit of Gall-Gaedhil.  I assembled the "foreign Gaels" from Footsore Miniatures' Viking and Irish model lines.  The plastic axes and swords come from the Victrix Viking kit.  The shields are made by Brother Vinni Miniatures.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2403/8WOVSS.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on October 04, 2021, 07:47:14 PM
Looking great so far. Now to get some colours on them.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Codsticker on October 04, 2021, 09:07:24 PM
That's the way t do it! Nice work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 26, 2021, 05:37:17 PM
I played my first game with my Irish in V.2.  It was a 6 point match against Anglo Danes. 

Irish: Warlord (javelins), 1 Curaidh (javelins), 6 HG (javelins), 2 x 8 Warriors (javelins), and 2 x 12 Levy (slings)

Anglo-Danes: Warlord (hvy wpn), 2 x 6 HG (hvy wpn), 3 x 8 Warriors (no equip)

We played the Battle of Heroes scenario and randomly drew all 5 cards.  The Irish board is shooty and 3 of the 10 advanced abilities rely on uneven terrain, so you can imagine my dismay when we drew the Fog card (no shooting over 6" for the first 3 turns) and the Marshy Country card (the first 2 pieces of terrain must be dangerous terrain and then die rolls determine when terrain placement ends).   After placing the marshes I placed a piece of uneven terrain centrally and my opponent placed woods in a corner, then terrain set up ended. 

We drew the Confusion card for deployment so, the deployment zone was a lengthwise diagonal.  We rolled for table edge after terrain was set up, and my opponent won the roll, so I ended up with wide open deployment zone with woods far to my rear.  The victory condition card was Carnage, which determines victory by survival points and awards 2 bonus points for each unit more than 12" away from its starting board edge.  Since the terrain and Fog meant that I would spend the first 3 turns falling back, I was unlikely to earn any of the bonus points for being more than 12" from my table edge. 

In essence, the game began with my opponent having every advantage, and me wondering if the Irish was the warband I wanted to bring to Adepticon.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4696/eZIo7B.jpg)

As planned, I spent the first three turns falling back.  This wasn't much fun for my opponent, but thankfully he empathized with my predicament and didn't hold it against me. 

At the end of Turn 3, the fog lifted and the Irish had their backs to the table edge. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/4403/bAneWu.jpg)

Leary of my massed shooting and concerned about building up fatigue chasing me, my opponent didn't double activate to catch up with me during his first four turns, which may have been a mistake on his part.  At the bottom of Turn 4, I was in a good position to unleash a hail of sling stones and javelins, decimating a unit of Anglo Dane warriors and damaging a second unit.  My opponent struck back on Turn 5, but did so piecemeal, so my casualties were limited to my Curaidh and a unit of warriors.

The game went six turns, but for all intents and purposes ended on the bottom of Turn 5 when Irish's stones and javelins eliminated a unit hearthguard, which spread fatigue to the surrounding Anglo Danes and opened up a charge lane to my opponent's warlord.  The Irish Fianna brought down the Anglo Dane warlord, but it cost me 5 of my 6 hearthguard.  When measured by Survival points, it was an uneven trade, but it reduced the Anglo Danes to 2 Saga dice and left them without the benefit of the Warlord and his We Obey ability, so on balance the exchange favored the Irish.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/7213/dNcOXA.jpg)

The Anglo Danes started their Turn 6, but soon realized it was pointless to continue, so we called it there.  Victory to the Irish raiders.

I began the game with quite a few disadvantages specific to my warband's battle board and build, but my opponent's cautiousness and the composition of his warband (all infantry and no archers) gave me the time I needed to regroup and exploit my warband's advantages. 

After playing this game, I've decided to stick with 2 units of Levy slingers, so these fellows are next in line to get some paint.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/5892/YG0pqk.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on October 26, 2021, 05:42:27 PM
Haven't played my Irish in a bit, but yeah, I found them a little bit rock - paper -scissor, where sometimes they are fantastic and sometimes the situation is really rough. Fun to play though. My list is similar to yours, but 2 Curaidh and no HG, more warriors instead.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 26, 2021, 10:04:15 PM
Haven't played my Irish in a bit, but yeah, I found them a little bit rock - paper -scissor, where sometimes they are fantastic and sometimes the situation is really rough. Fun to play though. My list is similar to yours, but 2 Curaidh and no HG, more warriors instead.
Being able to wriggle out of the predicament I was in from the game’s outset, has given me some confidence that my Irish lads can face long odds and still do well.

I get the impression that most Irish players use 2 Curaidh, but I'm not yet convinced this is the best choice for me.  The Curaidh are certainly beneficial for the The Old Way and Sidhe abilities, but their fragility makes them a liability early to mid-game when enemy units are still at full strength.  The rank-and-file Irish are fragile enough as it is. The last thing I want is clever player targeting a vulnerable Curaidh in order to splash fatigue over nearby units.

Then again, I do recognize a number of advantages to having a second Curaidh.  It gives the Irish a spare hero in the event that the other Curaidh is eliminated. It makes the The Old Way more effective.  In certain scenarios, it gives the Irish an extra unit (that can activate for free) to grab objectives.  It also provides a spare unit to sacrifice in a suicide run against a warlord or other target.

Decisions, decisions…

Like you, if I do field 2 Curaidh, I'd likely opt for a unit of 8 warriors over the remaining 4 HG.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on October 30, 2021, 03:55:05 PM
Koyote, I've been stealthily going through your SAGA logs and stealing inspiration just as I'm finally getting into the game myself. Thanks for the inspiration, these logs have been a real joy to read.

If I may, I have a question not immediately connected (I don't think) to any of your recent work in this thread. When you worked on your Pagan Rus, you built a couple vignettes to represent advanced abilities, with some really interesting trees. Could you tell me where you got these trees from if it's not a hassle?

(https://i.imgur.com/RTyQw6C.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 31, 2021, 12:35:37 AM
Koyote, I've been stealthily going through your SAGA logs and stealing inspiration just as I'm finally getting into the game myself. Thanks for the inspiration, these logs have been a real joy to read.

If I may, I have a question not immediately connected (I don't think) to any of your recent work in this thread. When you worked on your Pagan Rus, you built a couple vignettes to represent advanced abilities, with some really interesting trees. Could you tell me where you got these trees from if it's not a hassle?
They are limbs from Games Workshop’s Citadel Woods kit.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Blackwolf on October 31, 2021, 06:09:20 AM
Smashing thread! Good to see the RBG miniature too 8)
Your thread has inspired me to do a Saga force using Lucid Eye Miniatures,just have to find someone to play…
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 02, 2021, 07:19:24 AM
This last weekend I finished painting a unit of Greek peltasts for my AoH Epirote warband.  Before tackling yet another unit of Levy (Irish slingers), I opted to tackle a smaller project and give a "facelift" to some Irish models that I painted in 2017.

In Saga 1.0, Irish warriors had the same melee armor value as warriors from other Dark Age warbands, and they could close ranks (i.e. form a shield wall).  The models I used were unarmored, so to distinguish them from Levy, I equipped them with large round shields and hefty plastic spears that I sourced from a online bits supplier.  As in Saga 2.0, the 1.0 Irish warriors were armed with javelins, so I equipped about half of my warrior models with wire javelins as well as spears.   

Now that the Irish's stats, rules, and play style have changed somewhat, I've elected to refresh the Irish models that I will bring with me to the Adepticon 2022 Saga tournaments to reflect the 2.0 Irish.

For starters, I replaced their large round shields with small round shield from Wargames Atlantic's Dark Age Irish kit.  The decals are LBM transfers made to fit Footsore Miniatures' Irish bucklers. 

I also replaced all of the plastic spears with the thinner, wire javelins.  This task was tricky, as it involved some careful snipping, drilling, and repainting.

I touched up any chips, refreshed some top layers, and repainted their flesh tones.

Lastly, I removed the original grass tufts, repainted the bases, and added new tufts.  The flowers add a nice splash of color to the bases and match the yellow on the bucklers.

Overall, I'm pleased with the results.  Eight down, eight more warriors to go.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6408/DU6c9J.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ajax on November 02, 2021, 07:21:42 AM
As usual, beautiful !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: RedRowan on November 02, 2021, 07:31:36 AM
They look great.

Steve
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on November 02, 2021, 03:02:49 PM
I would say the facelift is a definite success.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on November 02, 2021, 04:07:15 PM
The facelift was a stunning success mate, they look great!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 03, 2021, 03:10:18 PM
I started work on giving my second unit of Irish warriors a "facelift". 

The tufts I used in 2017 didn't have a strong adhesive, so I reinforced each tuft's bond with a tiny dab of white glue.  Consequently, the removal of the tufts leaves behind a mess and sometimes torn up sections of texture.  In many instances, it's easier to remove the underlying texture than clean up the mess -hence the bases stripped down to the green plastic.

After stripping them of their shields, plastic spears, and tufts, this is what unit looks like -a hot mess.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9440/VasqZh.jpg)


And here they are, with the texture patched and armed with their new metal javelins.  The next steps will be brush-on primer, new shields, and paint.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4492/vhPZ1o.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: MaleGriffin on November 05, 2021, 05:13:07 PM
First off, I'm not really into this period and I don't play Saga, but this is ABSOLUTELY AMAZING!!!!! Between the basic figures, the conversions, the terrain and the brushwork, "ABSOLUTELY AMAZING!!!!!" is not hyperbole, it's an understatement! Brilliant! Superb! Inspiring!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on November 05, 2021, 05:17:31 PM
Really great stuff.

And thanks for the reply about the GW Citadel Woods bits. How I wish that kit were still in production somewhere.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ranthony on November 05, 2021, 05:33:18 PM
I concur, really nice brush and handiwork, a great job.

Very easy to get something like this wrong, so thumbs up from here.

Cheers

Ry

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 08, 2021, 07:04:27 AM
Another weekend, another unit "facelift".  This unit will be the last of the models that I recycle from my Adepticon 2017 Irish warband. The rest of my 2022 Irish warband will be new models or refurbished models that didn’t make it into my 2017 Adepticon lists.

It's not a great photo, but you're not going to get a better one out of me tonight.  Shortly after taking this pic I accidentally knocked my digital camera off my table and broke it.  Don't mourn for my loss. I f*cking hate that infernal device. I'm glad it's dead. I wish it had broken long ago.  Now I have the excuse to buy a new one. :)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1566/4SX8Sl.jpg)


The model pictured above on the far left is Footsore Miniatures Irish Hero.  As you can see from the photo below, the model and shield are one piece. Equipping the model with a buckler required a shield-ectomy followed up by some reconstructive surgery and hand transplant.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1497/w265Gj.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/8062/t6TpHt.png)


My next victim will be a Curaidh, and then a unit of 12 slingers that I painted in 2016.  By then, my V&V order should have arrived, and I will begin work on a new warlord and his Fianna.

I'll likely save my Wargames Atlantic slingers for last.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 10, 2021, 03:16:24 AM
Here's another shot of my second unit of Warriors.

I'm still trying to figure out the settings on the new camera, but even though I'm shooting under poor lighting and with no backdrop, I can already see an improvement.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2319/aTspAk.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on November 10, 2021, 06:24:36 AM
That looks really good indeed.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 11, 2021, 06:22:55 AM
Below is another old model who has “gone under the knife”. I originally painted this Curaidh in 2017, but it wasn't in my Adepticon 2017 warband.  I've replaced its original spear with a wire spear, replaced its shield, touched up flesh and pants, sculpted new feet (the original shoes were pointed), replaced and repainted the base's texture, and added new tufts.

The model's bald head, blunt nose, and the shield on its back reminds me of a turtle, so I've named him Turtar (pronounced tur-tur), which according to the Google-machine, is 'Turtle' in Gaelic.

I'm still on the fence about whether to include one or two Curaidh in my 6 point Adepticon list, but either way, Turtar is guaranteed a spot on my roster.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6617/O1pXHj.jpg)

The model is a Redbox Games mini, from their Norse model line -Ullr the Red.  Below is old pic of my original conversion work. I replaced its two-handed hammer with a spear (which I have since replaced with a wire spear/javelin). The model’s cranium was a bit small and pointy, so I used GS to enlarge it and give it a better shape. I also sculpted a proper belt, and added a strap across its chest.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/3944/91c5Qe.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on November 11, 2021, 06:36:13 AM
He looks brilliant mate! The tattoo is excellent and you are right about his looks, good call on the name.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on November 11, 2021, 04:04:06 PM
Wow. Talk about badass.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 11, 2021, 04:56:28 PM
Thanks.

Even though Christianity was introduced to Ireland a few hundred years before the beginning of the Viking Age, I chose to portray my Viking Age Irish as a clan who has resisted the spread of Christianity and still follows many of the 'old ways'.

I portray this by the inclusion of a handful of women fighters, the Celtic engravings depicted on some of the bases, the tattoos on the clan's champions (i.e., the Curaidh), and the baggage marker depicting the harassment of some passing Christian monks.  I did include a couple of banners depicting crosses, but these are equilateral crosses surrounded by a circle or circular in shape, so in my telling of my warband's story, these are solar crosses (or sun wheels), used by pagans in the worship of the sun god, Lugh.

Below is a shot from my 2017 Adepticon warband and display base.  Here you can see all of the elements I described above. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/4931/eefV6a.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on November 11, 2021, 05:33:12 PM
Lovely. Finding your original project thread was one of the main reasons I chose to make an Irish force for SAGA myself.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 13, 2021, 11:02:10 PM
I’ve begun to lay the groundwork for a new Irish Hearthguard unit.  In keeping with the theme of an early Viking Age Irish clan that has not yet converted to Christianity, I'm numbering among the nobles and royal household who comprise my warlord's Hearthguard, a woman warrior and a druid.  I've read that there is some evidence of Druids in Ireland as late as the 8th century.  Oxford professor Sir Barry Cunliffe, notes an 8th-century Irish hymn that asks for God’s protection from “the spells of women, blacksmiths, and druids”.

The Druid model is from Victrix's Celt Chariot kit.  It was originally painted as a sorcerer for my Age of Magic Celt Horde warband, but it's such a fun model, I couldn't resist adding it to another warband.  The woman warrior is a shield maiden model made by Brother Vinni.  It too was painted for my AoM Celtic Horde warband.

The remainder of the models are V&V Irish.  V&V models are cast in resin and sculpted at something close to true scale, so the detail is very fine. To my eye, the level of detail makes them look a bit out if place when mixed with plastic or metal models. Also, the tiny detail can be challenging to paint and doesn't show up well when viewed from a distance of only a few feet away.  With this in mind, I cut away the models' tiny pouches and the minuscule straps holding the pouches to the belts.  I also replaced the tiny belt buckles with slightly larger, GS buckles.  Lastly, I replaced couple of the V&V heads with Wargames Atlantic Irish heads, which are easier to paint and will help the models fit in better with the other metal and plastic models in my warband.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9145/hDJAK5.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ranthony on November 13, 2021, 11:25:30 PM
A short history bite that makes me want to delve deeper into the period.
A theme, conjured in your own mind that makes me want to know where it's going.
A short explanation of how you have and intend to continue kitbashing a unit for it.
A single photo with beautifully brushed figures in varying states of completion that make the viewer want more.

An inspiring post for gamers and non-gamers alike, that I will be watching closely.

Thanks for posting this.

Cheers

Ry


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 16, 2021, 04:44:01 PM
A new Irish warband deserves a new Irish warlord.

I kitbashed this model using parts from the V&V Miniatures Irish (command) and Irish-4 kits. I used the body from one model, the head from another, and the cloak from still another model.  The body wasn't designed for a cloak, so I had to cut away some of the mail and straps from the top of its shoulders and upper back to get the cloak to fit right.  The shield comes from the Wargames Atlantic Irish kit.  The plastic pouch, which I used to cover up a defect in the casting, comes from an old GW Empire model.  I had to reposition he arms and wrists to wrestle him into the pose I wanted.  I still need to do a bit of GS work to fill in some gaps.

In many warbands, this particular model wouldn't be grand enough to warrant the rank of Warlord, but since it'll be the only model in my warband in mail armor, I think he'll stand out well enough.  Plus, the V&V Irish are a bit taller than the Footsore metal Irish and the Wargames Atlantic plastic Irish, so the model's height will help.  Gold cloak pin and trim around the helmet will also help signal the model's status.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2914/X1rkmt.png)


When displaying the model, I will likely reuse my old 40mm insert display base to give the model a bit more gravitas.  The pic below shows Brian Boru occupying the base.  Brian's base fits into the large base via a circular insert, and is held secure by a magnet.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7031/SZaaQ2.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Mesh on November 17, 2021, 08:48:44 AM
Great painting and great planning efforts. Really shows you put a lot of thought into your projects. After a few armies that look more like a band of clowns I realized how much an army benefits from some preplanning.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: 2010sunburst on November 17, 2021, 09:51:10 AM
Fantastic modelling and painting there.  Truly inspiring.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Captain Blood on November 17, 2021, 04:34:48 PM
Beautiful, brilliantly thought out kitbashing and lovely paintwork. A creative masterclass  8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 19, 2021, 08:33:34 PM
While I was waiting for a batch of inked models to dry, I began work on a simple 40mm insert display base for my new Irish warlord.

I had considered reusing my old Irish display base.  However, while the reds on the display bases' banner and standard bearer's shield complimented the reds on the shield and clothing of my old Irish warlord and my Brian Boru model, I want my entire my Irish 2.0 warband to adhere a bit more strictly to unifying color themes.  Thus, what I need for my warlord's base is a yellow banner that will tie in with some of the model's yellow clothing and trim, the yellows on their shields, and the yellow flowers on many of the bases.

Fortunately, I already have painted standard bearer model holding an impressive yellow and black banner, so this model will get a quick "facelift" to update its flesh tones and smooth out its highlighting, and then it will removed from its current 25mm base and added to my 40mm display base. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6594/08QVYB.jpg)

A mock up (you see below) revealed that the Footsore standard bearer looks quite small in comparison to my V&V warlord. I will correct this some by building up that part of the base that the standard bearer will stand on. The scale between the two models will remain "off" but the added height will help conceal it.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6517/FAPPoc.jpg)


Making the insert base is quite simple. I set the smaller base on top of the larger base and drilled a hole through both bases. Next, I inserted magnets to hold the two bases together, and then used Apoxie Sculpt to build up around the smaller base.  In this instance, the height of the Apoxie Sculpt was thicker (higher) on that portion of the base where the standard bearer will stand. Some of the Apoxie Sculpt spilled over onto the smaller base.  This is fine. Once it cured, I trimmed away the extra Apoxie Sculpt.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5648/p21cKh.jpg)


The next morning I carefully removed the smaller base by popping out the magnets and carving around the outline of the smaller base. Then I reinserted the magnets and glued them in place.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2848/h17Kel.jpg)


I used the hobby knife and sandpaper to carefully shave the smooth sides of the insert.  It's important that you create a small gap between the smaller base and the walls of the insert.  This is done to ensure that the small base still fits in the insert once both are primered, painted, and sealed with matte varnish.  Varnishing the sides of the smaller base and the walls of the insert is important. Inserting and removing the smaller base will likely result in the two rubbing together, causing the paint to chip or wear over time. Varnish will help protect against this.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1371/1kuGYl.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on November 19, 2021, 08:50:15 PM
Nice, always cool to see your process.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 22, 2021, 01:21:11 AM
I can check another item off of my Adepticon 2022 to-do list.  I finished refurbishing a unit of 12 levy slingers that I originally built and painted in 2016.

Except for the logs and large rocks, I stripped all of the bases down to the plastic and applied new texture and paint.  I also repainted the slings, scabbards, and a few sets of shoes a red brown (GW's Doombull Brown), so they differ from the dark brown belts, straps and satchels. I repainted all of the models' flesh, smoothed out highlights, and repainted other bits here and there.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3245/MTn46M.jpg)

When I assembled these slingers, Footsore Miniatures hadn't yet released its metal Irish slinger models. If the Footsore Irish were available at the time, I don't think I would have bothered making my own.

I assembled these models mostly from parts from Gripping Beast's Dark Age Warriors kit. This kit's per-model price is low (75 cents each), plus it includes an ok selection of melee weapons, and the models are easy to assemble.  This makes it a pretty good kit for beginners, but for more advanced hobbyists, the quality of the sculpts, chunky spear shafts, and limited poses leaves a lot to be desired.  My favorite thing about this kit is that it includes FOUR sling hands on each sprue. 

To make the most out of these models, I added sheathed daggers and greenstuff sling stone satchels.  For variety, I put daggers in the hands of a few models, and included a horn-blower model.  I also converted a few models into women by using greenstuff to add breasts and adding long braided hair to beardless head from a Warlord Games' Celts sprue.

Below are some old WIP shots. You can find more on Page 19 of this thread.
 
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2856/1fuiaN.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1883/CMvTxb.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on November 22, 2021, 07:10:59 AM
Great work as usual, thank you for sharing your techniques. I have learned so much from you.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: RedRowan on November 22, 2021, 10:07:17 AM
Great work on these, this is such a fascinating thread.

Steve
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 29, 2021, 01:11:49 AM
Pictured below are the first two of my new V&V Hearthguard, posed alongside the unit's druid and shield maiden.  These two fellas are the ones I kitbashed using bitz from Wargames Atlantic's Irish kit.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5065/7F8ADI.jpg)

The inclusion of the shield maiden miniature in this units makes her a bit of an oddball.  Gender aside, her fantasy-Viking panoply really makes her the odd (wo)man out. To better connect her to the other models in the unit, aside from the Druid (another oddball), I've elected to equip all of the models in this unit with similar shields -all painted in yellow and black.

Below is an old picture of the shield maiden's shield.  I have since lightened the yellows to better match the yellow on the other hearthguard's shields.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/763/DDkLdr.jpg)

The downside of this choice is that the shields' irregular surface means that I cannot use transfers.  In general, I prefer transfers.  Hand painting shield designs is very time consuming and can be quite difficult to do well. 

I used the Irish LBM transfers as inspiration for my designs. By sticking to some fairly basic designs, I managed to knock out a couple of okay shields.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: 2010sunburst on November 29, 2021, 07:55:12 AM
Really nice paintwork on those guys.  The shields are more than OK, I would say they are the stand out items on the bunch.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on November 29, 2021, 08:00:48 AM
Stunningly brilliant work mate! They all look gorgeous. Your freehand painting on those shields is excellent.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on November 29, 2021, 05:24:12 PM
I concur - those shields are more than OK.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on November 29, 2021, 05:51:51 PM
Oh yeah, the shields are fantastic!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Hu Rhu on November 29, 2021, 06:59:04 PM
Wionderful work as always.  Your threads are an inspiration.  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 29, 2021, 07:08:13 PM
This discussion of hand painted shields reminds me that I need to add some more detail to the shield held by my chariot model. I really wimped out when I painted the shield.

I originally painted the chariot serve as a Warlord on Beast for my Age of Magic Celt Horde warband.  However, now that Age of Invasions allows an Irish (Scotti) Warlord to be mounted on a chariot with javelins, this model will certainly get more use. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/1919/wa30M1.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/57/I5wfuw.jpg)


Age of Invasions also allows an Irish (Scotti) warlord (and Curaidh) to be mounted on horse with javelins.  This fella was originally painted to serve as an Age of Magic mounted Lieutenant for Celt Horde warband, but now I can use it as a Scotti Warlord or Curaidh.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/9943/8N9Y7D.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3630/OmKvso.jpg)

There are certainly some opponents, scenarios, and terrain set-ups that favor keeping one's Irish Warlord and Curaidh on foot, but it's nice to have options.  I understand why Age of Vikings doesn't allow Irish Warlords to be mounted on chariots, but I wish they had included the 'mounted with javelins' option in AoV.  I'd happily trade away the heavy weapon (dane axe) option for it.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: David H on November 29, 2021, 07:10:50 PM
Lovely work, and I always appreciate a hand painted shield - takes time but worth the effort.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on November 30, 2021, 08:31:40 AM
Fabulous looking minis - the paint work is superb  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on November 30, 2021, 08:33:28 AM
I am not normally a big chariot fan but that looks brilliant as does your rider. You always manage to impress me with your artistic skill mate.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Tonhel on November 30, 2021, 03:54:44 PM
Beautiful!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: brunei35 on December 02, 2021, 10:55:18 AM
Excellent colours on the warlord, very impressive.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 27, 2021, 01:11:59 AM
It's been almost a month since my last update, so this afternoon I broke out the camera and snapped some shots.

I finished the last two of my V&V Irish HG conversions (center left and center right). I replaced the center left’s original head with head from the Victrix Viking sprue.  This unit will be used as a 4 pack or, with the addition of my druid and shield maiden, as a 6 pack.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2479/T4Elte.jpg)

The weekend of the December 18th I brought my Irish to a small Age of Vikings tournament.  It was a 5 point tournament that permitted the new Finalize Warband Mustering rule from the SAGA 2021 FAQ.  I used the rule to replace 2 HG with 4 Warriors, which I fielded as Irish Wolfhounds.  In preparation for the tournament I rebased and touched-up 3 Wolfhounds and their handler from my 2017 Irish warband.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6589/OPXdes.jpg)

In my 6 point list, I may want to use the the Finalize Warband Mustering rule to field 2 units of 10 warriors, so I painted 4 more warriors.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6207/BP2RZN.jpg)


I'm still toying with the idea of fielding my Warlord and Curaidh on horseback, especially if I play my Irish as  Scotti in Age of Invasions.

Below is a Gripping Beast Irish mounted HG model that I will serve as my mounted Curaidh.  As you can see, I made a few modifications.  All the GS work on the model's shield arm is the result of cutting away model's original shield so I could use a shield design of my own choosing.  The original model's legs were too wimpy and too short, so replaced those as well.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2928/vKTzll.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1541/wBAqa9.jpg)

Finally, I couldn't play in last weekend's tournament without my new Irish Warlord, so he too took his turn on my painting table.

The warlord turned out ok. It doesn't really blow my skirt up. I wish I had elected to go with an unhelmeted head.  Alternatively, I wish I had made him a redhead.  Most of the model's face is hidden by the helmet. Reddish hair would have created a stronger contrast with the metal helm and dark recesses around the face.  I may still go back and change this, but the detail on V&V models is so fine that I worry that putting another layer or two of paint on top of the existing primer and black paint will fill in the hair and beard's fine detail.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/8752/p2fYSz.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2648/zlZuo0.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2484/IzVvrM.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on December 27, 2021, 06:44:27 AM
Beautiful work mate, truly gorgeous. I see what you mean on the warlord. Red hair should do the trick.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ajax on December 27, 2021, 06:47:37 AM
Just "Waaahou  :o" !
As usual.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Captain Blood on December 27, 2021, 12:18:47 PM
Another superbly curated, converted and painted collection. Brilliant  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: MaleGriffin on December 27, 2021, 02:48:25 PM
Absolutely amazing work! Fantastic brushwork and brilliant conversions!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 27, 2021, 05:03:50 PM
Confident conversions and beautifully painted  :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Tonhel on December 27, 2021, 06:50:13 PM
Amazing work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on December 27, 2021, 08:07:49 PM
Lovely as ever. Your colours and green stuff both are super smooth.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: James Morris on December 27, 2021, 09:08:06 PM
Very beautiful paintwork and conversions.  I enjoy your thoughts on the choices you have made.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: RedRowan on December 28, 2021, 09:57:16 AM
Really like the colour scheme you have used for these.

Steve
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 28, 2021, 05:41:13 PM
Really like the colour scheme you have used for these.

Steve

Thanks.

Whether painting an army for a large scale game or a warband for a skirmish game, it has long been my practice to use one or two unifying colors to tie the models together. For soldiers in uniform and warriors who wear some form of uniformed livery or heraldry, this is easy to pull off and looks quite natural.  For armies or warbands composed of disparate groups or warriors responsible for obtaining their own clothing and wargear, you can weave together the individual models by using your unifying color(s) in more subtle ways.  For instance, some models may have all or part of their garments painted in this color, while others may have their garment's trim or other items (e.g., belts, pouches, scabbards, backpacks, shields, weapon grips, etc.) painted in the unifying color.   The end result is non-uniform army or warband that is tied together, sometimes quite subtly, by one or two unifying colors.  For my Irish, I used particular shades of green and yellow to achieve this result.

Before painting my Irish I did some of online "research" into the colors used by the Irish in Viking Age Ireland. According to multiple sources, green didn't become widely associated with Ireland until the 1600s.  Green wasn't even the original color associated with Saint Patrick and the Irish church.  Moreover, one source states that in early medieval Ireland, certain colors of clothing were used to indicate one's social status, thus certain colors (red, purple, blue, and green) were reserved for the nobility and others (black, brown, grey, and yellow) were reserved for the lower classes. 

Even though SAGA is, to a certain degree, a "historical" wargame, I deliberately chose to buck historical accuracy in favor of an ahistorical color scheme that is a bit more lively than boring browns, yellows, and black, and uses a modern heuristic to help people quickly identify my faction.

A heuristic is a mental shortcut where one uses information gleaned from past experiences to assess and quickly make decisions. In this instance, since many, if not most SAGA players associate the color green with Ireland, when they see my warband for the first time, they see a a bunch of barefoot, unarmored models armed with spears or javelins, their minds tells them that these are likely Irish (or possibly Scots).


Another example of my personal preferences blurring historical accuracy was my decision to make my Irish pagan holdouts*. You can see evidence of this in my tattooed Curaidh, the lack of crosses, the inclusion of women and a druid in my warband, and in baggage markers I made back in 2017.  I chose the Irish back in 2016 as my first SAGA warband because of my fondness for pre-Christian Irish myths and heroes.  Since Viking Age was the only time period one could play SAGA in back then, I turned back the clock a bit on my Irish to make them a bit more like Irish from the my favorite myths.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3296/KqNfRK.png)

*Christianity came to Ireland in the 5th century, but it's unclear when the Irish conversion to Christianity was, for all intents and purposes, "completed". The druids and their beliefs weren't simply exterminated overnight, but rather they disappeared gradually as Irish Christianity absorbed, rebranded, and appropriated them. There is a prayer from 8th century Ireland that asks God for protection from "the spells of women, and smiths, and druids", so there could have been some Druid holdouts in Ireland at the beginning of the Viking Age.  I'm tempted to put a Dark Age blacksmith into my warband, so my warband will represent all three threats listed in this prayer. ;)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: metalface13 on December 28, 2021, 06:12:27 PM
They look fantastic! I have no idea what colors the Irish used in the Dark Ages, so it doesn't bother me one bit. But using it definitely communicates what faction they represent.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Hu Rhu on December 30, 2021, 07:25:23 PM
The painting, conversions and basing are some of the best I have ever seen here on the LAF. Your attention to detail and the care in which you put togther your forces are superb.  :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on December 31, 2021, 11:26:54 AM
Excellent painting and conversions. A great looking warband.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on December 31, 2021, 01:51:48 PM
Definitely add a blacksmith mate.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 01, 2022, 08:09:24 AM
Definitely add a blacksmith mate.
I shopped around a bit online, but couldn't find a smith model that would fit in with my other Irish, so I made my own.  His name will be Goibniu. :)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2052/xwmHaD.png)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2056/1g28uf.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on January 01, 2022, 10:52:51 AM
Loving it mate! Perfect!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on January 01, 2022, 11:16:01 AM
Nice!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: SotF on January 02, 2022, 02:04:51 AM
He looks similar to the older Reaper Townsfolk Blacksmith with added weaponry
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on January 02, 2022, 01:32:32 PM
Lovely GS work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: sir_shvantselot on January 02, 2022, 10:57:24 PM
Remarkable stuff. Love the conversions and paintwork. Do you rate the new Gripping Beast Irish plastics?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 03, 2022, 09:37:57 PM
Remarkable stuff. Love the conversions and paintwork. Do you rate the new Gripping Beast Irish plastics?
I haven’t seen the GB plastic Irish in person, but I have seen photos of the sprues and of assembled figures.  Also, I own and have assembled minis using many of GB's other plastic kits  (i.e., Dark Age Warriors, Late Roman Infantry, Arab Infantry, Arab Heavy Cav), so I am familiar with their products.

Since Wargames Atlantic released their own Dark Age Irish kit last year, a comparison between the two kits will help highlight some of the shortcomings of the Gripping Beast kit.

COST

The Gripping Beast kit sells for £18 ($25) and includes 25 models, which comes to £0.72 ($1) per model.

The Wargames Atlantic kit sells for £25 ($34) and includes 40 models, which comes to £0.63 ($0.85) per model


OPTIONS

As you can see from the side-by-side images below, the Wargames Atlantic sprue includes a greater variety of weapons, shield options, and fun 'extra bits' than the Gripping Beast Sprue.  Just look at all of that empty (wasted) space on the Gripping Beast sprue that could have been filled with extra bits.  What a shame.

The Gripping Beast sprue has one more cloak than the Wargames Atlantic sprue, but two of the Gripping Beast cloaks have extra details (e.g.,tassels) that were not executed particularly well, so I am going to call the ‘cloak contest’ a wash.

From the perspective of a SAGA player, the one thing that Gripping Beast got right that Wargames Atlantic got wrong is the decision to include dane axes (heavy weapons) on the sprue.  On the other hand, Wargames Atlantic includes missile weapons on its sprue (e.g., a sling and a thrown rock), whereas GB does not. Wargames Atlantic doesn't get full credit for this because, as I've stated before, I would MUCH rather that Wargames Atlantic had included a second sling than a hand throwing a stupid rock.  Or if they insisted on the rock, then ditch one of the javelins and include a second sling.

As a SAGA player, Wargames Atlantic scores additional points by adding two wolfhounds to each sprue, but for non-SAGA players I can imagine that the wolfhounds may not be much of a selling point.

Also, I f*cking LOVE the blackthorn shillelaghs (cudgels) on the Wargames Atlantic sprue!  It's such a novel and well executed choice of weapons for Dark Age Irish.


Gripping Beast Irish Sprue (left) Wargames Atlantic Irish Sprue (right)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1576/ns9fh2.png)

SCULPTS

The Gripping Beast bodies and poses are mediocre, uninspiring, and thanks to their short necks, appear slightly hunched.  The spear shafts are too thick and the spearheads too large. The sword hilts and blades are blocky and boring. A couple of the heads are okay, but most are meh.  The arms are generally short and stubby, and the hands are not well defined.

The Wargames Atlantic bodies and poses are in an entirely different league than the Gripping Beast bodies.  The clothing is much more varied and their wide stances make the models look more heroic.  The size, scale, and design of their spear/javelins is a huge improvement over the Gripping Beast spears. The sword hilts, blades, and scabbards are more more refined and interesting. Most of the heads are quite good and overall there exists a good variety of head and facial hair styles.  The facial features are bit cartoony, but in my opinion, this makes them easier to paint.  Overall, the arms are a good length (a few are a bit short) and the hands are well defined, but the size of the fists on the bodies and the fists holding some of the weapons are a bit mismatched.


Overall, Gripping Beasts's Irish kit is no worse than its other plastic kits, but IMHO, with companies like Victrix and Atlantic Wargames now producing Dark Age/Viking Age plastics, Gripping Beast needs to stop making plastics kits like its still 2013.  To make their plastics competitive, Gripping Beast must improve the quality of their sculpts, figure design, and sprue design. 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: RedRowan on January 04, 2022, 08:00:59 AM
That's a really great comparison of the two sets.

I have some of the Wargames Atlantic Irish but the Gripping Beast set just didn't appeal to me which is a shame. Agree that they seem a little dated when compared to some other modern plastic kits.

Steve
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on January 04, 2022, 10:46:07 AM
Also thought GB missed the mark on their set, and looking at the sprues you are very much correct about the empty space on there. I mean, 7 different heads for 5 different bodies is really quite poor.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on January 04, 2022, 05:42:06 PM
I quite agree with you guys. Great comparison Koyote, very informative.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 05, 2022, 07:17:29 AM
Here are my first four lightly converted (see page 20 of this thread) Wargames Atlantic Irish slingers. 

They were a delight to paint.

I f*cking love this kit! 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/7796/cwMXoj.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ninefingers on January 05, 2022, 07:54:19 AM
I bought a box of the GB Irish and they mix in alright with my two already built boxes of WA Irish, but I did find myself using a lot of left over bits from the WA sprues to make the GB models better and more varied. I think I would have been disappointed if I had just bought the GB on their own.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on January 05, 2022, 11:04:24 AM
Slightly off-topic - My son got a box of the WA Irish for Christmas, and I agree they are lovely sculpts, but the box says 32 miniatures - there are only 30 (plus 10 hounds) that I can see (5 identical sprues with 6 warriors and two hounds on each). Have I missed something or was this a printing mistake on the box?
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 05, 2022, 04:13:46 PM
Slightly off-topic - My son got a box of the WA Irish for Christmas, and I agree they are lovely sculpts, but the box says 32 miniatures - there are only 30 (plus 10 hounds) that I can see (5 identical sprues with 6 warriors and two hounds on each). Have I missed something or was this a printing mistake on the box?

The hounds are miniatures.  They are too large to be mere base decorations.  As such, 30 warriors + 10 hounds = 40 miniatures.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9721/IrK9rK.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on January 05, 2022, 07:50:59 PM
Thanks Koyote. We must have got an older box (says 2nd priniting on the side) that mentions 32 miniatures? Main thing is, he has got the right amount according to what it says on your box below.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 08, 2022, 08:04:06 PM
Definitely add a blacksmith mate.


Below is an excerpt from an 8th or 9th century prayer of protection ascribed to Saint Patrick, titled: Saint Patrick's Breastplate.

I have set around me all these powers
Against every hostile savage power
Directed against my body and my soul
Against the incantations of false prophets
Against the black laws of heathenism
Against the false laws of heresy
Against the deceits of idolatry
Against the spells of women, and blacksmiths and druids
Against all knowledge that binds the soul of man


My warband represents an early Viking Age warband from a clan that has not (yet) converted to Christianity.  And since warband already includes both women warriors and a druid, it would be a shame not to add a blacksmith.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5899/oJulOX.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on January 09, 2022, 03:13:59 AM
Great work mate!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ajax on January 09, 2022, 12:01:12 PM
Fantastic topic, great work !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: glenning on January 13, 2022, 09:47:31 PM
Awesome stuff, very inspirational to say the least! Keep up the great work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Axebreaker on January 16, 2022, 04:42:00 PM
Beautiful work on the whole collections! :-*

Christopher
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 16, 2022, 09:36:21 PM
Four more slingers completed, four to go.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/659/1NyTar.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 22, 2022, 10:58:00 PM
My levy slingers are done, which means that my Viking Age Irish are, more or less, ready for Adepticon. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5761/TGV5k0.jpg)

Now it's time to finish off my Moors for the Adepticon "Age of Melee" event and the extra models that I will need to play my Moors as Lords of the Wild in the Saga Age of Magic event.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on February 08, 2022, 05:01:42 AM
It will be a great looking force on the table!  Have fun at Adepticon.  I hope to get there at least once if only to walk through the hall.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 07, 2022, 02:34:27 AM
I will need three 40mm Irish objective markers for Adepticon.

My plan is to repurpose the Sons of Dana marker that I made for my first edition Irish warband (which is already based on a 40mm round) and make two more objective markers made from scratch.

The trees are limbs and canopy bits from GW’s Citadel Woods set.

The resin model is a V&V Miniatures Pagan Priest.

 The unpainted metal model is from the Gripping Beast Dark Age Casualties set. The cast is absolute crap, so I replaced the stump of a left hand and reconstructed the rest with greenstuff.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2079/RvtvkW.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: LazyStudent on March 07, 2022, 07:55:29 AM
Very nice looking vignets!
Although, I'm sure it's just me, but I'm getting a real Tolkien Fellowship vibe from them. Perhaps one of the stone throwing children should have a ring on a necklace...
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 07, 2022, 04:23:47 PM
Very nice looking vignets!
Although, I'm sure it's just me, but I'm getting a real Tolkien Fellowship vibe from them. Perhaps one of the stone throwing children should have a ring on a necklace...
That certainly wasn't my plan, but you're right, they do look like vignettes from the LOTR.  There is Gandalf on the right, a pair of hobbits in the middle, and the fallen Boromir one the left.

:)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: LazyStudent on March 07, 2022, 05:55:57 PM
Exactly! Perhaps you need a few more to complete the fellowship ;)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 14, 2022, 01:51:02 AM
My Irish objective markers (aka Boromir, Merry & Pippin, and Gandalf) are ready to go.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3900/89b0Pg.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: rumacara on March 14, 2022, 12:11:23 PM
More lovely goodies. :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: LazyStudent on March 14, 2022, 12:18:54 PM
Very nice! I really like the addition of the crow to the 'Boromir' stand. In my minds eye he has his sword out to fend off the crows more than any enemy.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Hu Rhu on March 14, 2022, 05:12:44 PM
Great work on those objective markers.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on March 15, 2022, 06:38:29 AM
Beautiful work, as usual mate!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 16, 2022, 05:20:25 PM
In this week's episode of Pimp My Crappy Old Historical Mini (aka Koyote can't leave well enough alone), I attempt to improve on a Gripping Beast Irish Mounted Fianna model. 

Years ago, I purchased the GB Irish Mounted Fianna set. I previously converted/upgraded the model pictured below center-right to serve as a mounted Curaidh.  Now I need a second mounted Curaidh model for Adepticon, so my next victim is the model pictured on the far right. This model has some issues, namely, casting defects, skinny little stick legs, and the convex shield on its back that reminds me of a turtle shell.

[Photo from Gripping Beast online store]
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6374/WozRzj.png)


I began the conversion by replacing the legs and feet removed from hapless plastic model, and then using some snips and rotary tool, I removed the metal shield.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1955/iyNxJz.jpg)


The original shield was convex in shape, so it was sculpted in such a way that a portion oft the model's back was covered by the shield.  Thus, removing the shield left the model with no back and missing portions of its shoulders.  I used greenstuff to rebuild the missing parts and to fix some of the casting defects on other parts of the model.  Lastly, I added a shield that matches the shields I used added to my warlord, HG, and other mounted Curaidh.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7033/suDbVC.png)

 
Below is the converted model.  All that's left to do is to add the spear and basing materials and it will be ready for primer and paint.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5540/LmqNA7.jpg)




Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Maniac on March 16, 2022, 06:51:11 PM
That looks fantastic.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: rumacara on March 16, 2022, 07:53:38 PM
Great conversion. :-* :-* :-*
I have that same miniature and i may steal your idea. :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Golgotha on March 16, 2022, 08:10:42 PM
Love the soft green muted tones. Do like the trees on the vignettes can't wait to see these all completed.

Thank you for the comparison - will now certainly go with Wargames Atlantic Irish.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 17, 2022, 05:59:13 AM
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9521/lQX17P.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on March 17, 2022, 07:48:30 AM
Lots to marvel at here - the three vignettes are lovely and that conversion is fantastic work.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Bloggard on March 17, 2022, 10:01:37 AM
blimey, missed a lot of stuff in this tread. Superb  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Hu Rhu on March 17, 2022, 12:02:15 PM
Lovely little conversion.  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 17, 2022, 06:01:27 PM
Great conversion. :-* :-* :-*
I have that same miniature and i may steal your idea. :)

Back in December, I performed a similar conversion (i.e., leg transplant and shield-ectomy) on another model from that same GB Mounted Fianna set to make my first mounted Curaidh.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2928/vKTzll.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/1541/wBAqa9.jpg)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: rumacara on March 17, 2022, 09:04:35 PM
Another great conversion and painting. :-* :-*
I need to rewatch your entire thread. :D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Blackwolf on March 17, 2022, 09:42:16 PM
That miniature is spot on,lovely work :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on March 18, 2022, 08:35:06 AM
Great conversion and painting - he looks very regal.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on March 18, 2022, 08:42:43 AM
Fantastic work all around, you conversion and sculpting skills match your painting! Really impressive!

It's a shame that the Gripping Beast minis are often so badly cast, the minis themselves often have a lot of character!

How do you sculpt saddles ? Do you add a blog of Greenstuff and then press the mini into it before sculpting details? I have a bunch of metal cavarly models from GB and Footsore and non of the riders seem to really sit properly on their horses... >:(
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: gostgost13 on March 18, 2022, 05:01:34 PM
Know what you mean.It's really annoying when the riders don't fit !
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 18, 2022, 10:50:11 PM
It's a shame that the Gripping Beast minis are often so badly cast, the minis themselves often have a lot of character!

How do you sculpt saddles ? Do you add a blog of Greenstuff and then press the mini into it before sculpting details? I have a bunch of metal cavarly models from GB and Footsore and non of the riders seem to really sit properly on their horses... >:(

Gripping Beast has been around for almost 30 years, so many of its metal minis were originally sculpted decades ago.  Also, if you compare the popularity and price point of historicals vs modern "main stream" manufacturers (e.g., GW, Privateer Press, Wyrd, Corvus Bell, etc) my guess is that Gripping Beast and other 'old school' historical manufactures (e.g., Old Glory, Essex, Perry miniatures) don't make much money, thus they can't afford to replace old molds and/or upgrade their manufacturing technology.  So, while I often gripe about the quality of these manufacturers' products,  I understand the underlying causes.


If the rider's legs are too wide apart or the model simply doesn't sit correctly on its mount, there are a number of ways to make adjustments:  (1) you can carefully bend the legs together, (2) use a hobby knife or rotary tool to reshape the mount's back or the U-shape formed by the inside of the rider's legs, (3) glue the model to the mount's back (or stick it to he seat with greenstuff) and then use greenstuff to fill any gaps, or (4) use greenstuff to augment or add a saddle or saddle blanket.

When I make saddle or saddle blanket, I will begin by roughing out the shape and smoothing out the surface, using my fingers, metal sculpting tools, and clay shapers.  If it's just a saddle blanket, I will essentially look like a rectangle draped over the mounts' back.  Next, I give the greenstuff 15-20 minutes to cure.  This will give it time harden up slightly and become less sticky.  Next, I apply a water to the greenstuff blanket, dip the bottom half of the rider in water, and then seat the rider on the mount and gently push it into the greenstuff.  Once I'm satisfied with how the rider is sitting, I will remove the rider. The curing and the water should prevent the rider from sticking to the greenstuff. Then, using my sculpting tools and shapers, I will smooth out those areas where the GS bulged or became misshapen when I seated the model.  Finally, clean up the shape of the blanket's edges and I sculpt any details into the blanket, such as borders or fringe.

Once the greenstuff is fully cured, I reseat the rider. When GS cures it can slightly expand in some areas and contract in others, so the seat may not be quite right. if this is the case, you can use a hobby knife with a new blade to carefully shave down parts of the saddle until the rider sits just right.

If you closely examine the saddle blanket picture below, you can see the discolored areas where I used a hobby knife to make small adjustments to accommodate the rider's seat and legs.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2928/vKTzll.jpg)


Below are before/after photos are from my SAGA Moors & Mutatawwi'a thread. They are examples of using greenstuff to fill gaps. If the model's armor or tunic touches the saddle, you can fill the gap and cover up the 'fill' by using greenstuff to extend the armor or tunic.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9966/C2GUVY.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4379/YavM3c.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on March 19, 2022, 10:14:44 AM
Very smart putty work Koyote  8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 28, 2022, 12:04:09 AM
:)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3444/eWBmzx.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on March 28, 2022, 06:12:36 AM
Another one!  :o Respect!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Tactalvanic on March 28, 2022, 06:37:54 AM
+1 Respect!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Little Odo on March 28, 2022, 09:47:46 AM
Congratulations
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Michi on March 28, 2022, 11:33:17 AM
:)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3444/eWBmzx.jpg)

Well done that man!  :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on March 28, 2022, 02:51:47 PM
Another one!  :o Respect!
Yup.

Adepticon 2022 held 4 days of Saga tournaments. Day 1 Age of Magic. Day 2 Age of Vikings doubles (teams of 2 players each fielding 4 points). Day 3 Age of Melee (factions from any book except for Age of Magic). Day 4 Age of Vikings.

On Day 1 I played my Lords if the Wild using my Deep Desert Nomads (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=118478.225 (https://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=118478.225)). I won my first two games (Great Kingdoms and Horde) and fought to a draw in the third (Undead). I squeaked out 1st place overall by one point.

On Day 2 I started my rental car and quickly realized that someone had stolen its catalytic converter. Welcome to Chicago!   :-[

I had to bow out of the Viking-Doubles tournament to deal with police, the rental company, and my own insurance company. I also had to drive the VERY LOUD car back to the airport to swap it for a new rental.  The extra insurance that I purchased from the rental company doesn’t cover theft, so the claim will likely end up on my personal policy -which has a $500 deductible.

On Day 3 I played my Moors. I won my first 2 games (Norse-Gael and Anglo Danes) and lost the 3rd game to a very good Hun player. The Huns needed a 3 point difference or greater to win and got exactly that, so it was very close to a draw.

On Day 4 I played my Irish. I won all 3 games. No blow outs in any of my games. All 3 games were pretty close.

The cherry on top of Day 4 was that my first game was against Rodge from the Saga Thorsday Youtube podcast. The matchup favored me (my Irish against his Norse Gaels) but the scenario (Battle Around the Campfire) favored Rodge. Rodge is a much better player than I am, but thoughtful play, the faction advantage, and good die rolls won me the game.

My second Day 4 opponent played Anglo Saxons.  It was the Desecration. scenario. He brought an all Levy build (73 models including his warlord). Anglo Saxon Levy are not pushovers. His 60 melee Levy had armor 4/4, an aggression of 1/2, and an advanced ability that let them all fight for a turn as Warriors. Yikes!

It was bloody, but I eked out a win by grinding down the units with my shooting and a last minute dash by my mounted Curaidh who destroyed an Anglo Saxon objective.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/8964/DOM1lz.jpg)

My third Day 4 opponent played Vikings. It was a straight up Clash of Warlords scenario. I thought it’d be a much easier match than my first two, but that hope was crushed when he got Ragnarock off TWICE, and tore my Warrior and Hearthguard units to shreds.  Fortunately my slingers and heroes survived, so I was able to rally and finish off most of the remaining Vikings. The Viking warlord went down from a hail of sling stones. At the end of the game, all that the Vikings had left were his 12 Levy archers, that remained in the rear the entire game, serving as two units of Saga die generators.

Going into Round 3 I was probably in third place due to my modest massacre point total. However, the two players who were ahead of me played against each other and the game ended in a draw. If either of them had won, I would have likely have come in second place overall. So once again, I squeaked out 1st place overall win.

Overall it was a fantastic event attended by wonderful players. You can’t ask for more than that.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on March 30, 2022, 02:00:41 AM
Sad to hear about the converter theft.  Losing money and even worse valuable playing time is harsh.  Sounds like you had several great days worth of games otherwise.  Congrats on the wins.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on March 30, 2022, 03:54:45 PM
Congratulations!

Thank you very much as well for the in depth description of your converting process of mounted miniatures on the previous page  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on April 30, 2022, 08:55:35 PM
I didn’t get a good group photo of my Irish warband at Adepticon, so this morning I unpacked my display board and took some shots with my phone.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/9676/VO8RAh.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2425/efLYKz.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on April 30, 2022, 09:12:28 PM
It's such a nice army, the new additions are great.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: diehard on April 30, 2022, 09:32:45 PM
Your warband is downright beautiful, excellent brush work throughout. Congratulations on your victories and, except for the whole theft fiasco, sounds like you had a good time playing. Thanks for taking the time to set up and get pics of your force and sharing them with us. Looking forward to your next project.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on May 01, 2022, 02:10:19 AM
Epic work mate, they look incredible!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: RedRowan on May 01, 2022, 07:13:43 AM
Amazing work.

Steve
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Bloggard on May 01, 2022, 10:28:13 AM
knock-out.  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on May 01, 2022, 10:54:20 PM
Brilliant stuff. Really inspiring!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on May 02, 2022, 02:30:28 PM
Fab to see them all arrayed like that Koyote  :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Mesh on May 02, 2022, 04:16:09 PM
Great Warband and great display board. Tones of the board and the minis work really well together.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on June 03, 2022, 06:54:41 PM
In August 2019 I added a unit of late Roman/Briton archers and a warmachine to my collection so I could play my Britons as either Sage: Aetius & Arthur (now called Age of Invasions) Romans or as Age of Magic Great Kingdoms.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/3259/JUiM0E.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1751/4Oyhbj.jpg)


I am intrigued by the current Age of Invasions Roman, so I want to add a couple of new units to my Britons so they are playable as Romans.  This new mini-project also gives me the excuse to add Footsore Miniatures' Belisarius model to my collection.  When I play the warband as Romans, he will be the warband's warlord.

I'm very particular when it comes to a model's scale and pose. And while I love most of the aspects of the Belisarius model, I feel that the horse's length is a bit off.  It just seems too short. The same holds true for Footsore's Mounted Irish Warlord model armed with a cudgel.  I understand that the horse's pose makes the horse's body bunched up, thus appearing a bit shorter then when it's all stretched out in a full stride, but even taking this into account, the horse's length just feels off to me.  Especially when you place the model side-by-side with my other Footsore Romano Briton cavalry models.  It makes it look like Belisarius is riding a pony while his hearthguard are riding proper horses.

Another issue I have with this model is that the top half of Belisarius doesn't match his bottom half.  The model comes in two pieces.  One piece is a horse with attached rider legs (the 'bottom half') and the other piece is a torso head and arms (the 'top half').  It looks like top half was sculpted/cast at a certain scale and the bottom half was sculpted/cast at a slightly smaller scale.  Thus when you put them together, the top half hangs over.  You can see this in Footsore's marketing photo below.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/7581/E993ix.png)

To fix short horse issue, I cut away the horses rump just behind the saddle blanket. Then I inserted a small, rectangular block of cured greenstuff and glued (and pinned) it back together. I used greenstuff to fill in the gaps, and extend the saddle blanket.  To fix the mismatched scale between the two halves I sculpted a new section of lamellar skirt covering Belisarius' posterior.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img921/8595/HkWl4y.png)


Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on June 03, 2022, 08:07:50 PM
Cracking putty work Kayote.

You have pulled off a lovely paintjob on Belisarius too.   :-*
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on June 03, 2022, 09:58:13 PM
Cracking putty work Kayote.

You have pulled off a lovely paintjob on Belisarius too.   :-*
I haven't painted the model yet.

The painted model pictured in my post is from Footsore's webstore.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on June 04, 2022, 06:39:11 AM
I haven't painted the model yet.

The painted model pictured in my post is from Footsore's webstore.

 lol Ah well, 'tis a fine paint job regardless  lol
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Knight-Captain Tyr on June 04, 2022, 11:38:29 AM
I haven't painted the model yet.

The painted model pictured in my post is from Footsore's webstore.

When you're being mistaken for official promo material, you must be doing something right ;)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on June 04, 2022, 12:39:56 PM
Lovely greenstuff work as always.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on June 04, 2022, 12:56:40 PM
I love to read the thoughts that go into the army and each miniature here. Great attention to detail and dedication to make the most out of existing miniatures, the green stuff work really paid of!

Also really happy to read that you are going to expand into Romans as well! Very inspiring as usual...because of you I ordered Gripping BEast Ponies for my Welsh, because the footsore ones are just too thin and frail. Now they all need new saddle blankets  o_o lol
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on June 29, 2022, 07:37:28 PM
Aside from expanding my SAGA terrain collection, I haven't done much painting since Adepticon.  I've done plenty of assembly and conversion work, but I just can't make myself paint minis. 

Part of the problem may be that starting new projects always seems so daunting.  So rather than tackling an entirely new warband, I'm going to get myself back into the habit of painting by beginning work on a smaller project, further expanding my Britons so I can use them as Age of Invasions Romans.

Below are my planned additions, a new warlord, 12 Levy (no equipment), and 12 Roman horse archers.  I've already started putting paint on the Levy. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/6471/ExxpWy.jpg)


(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8485/DwdMj3.jpg)

The list that I have in mind is a shooty, Warrior heavy list.

WL - mounted
10 Warriors -bows
10 Warriors -mounted & comp bows
8 Warriors -no equipment
8 Warriors -no equipment
12 Levy - no equipment
1 Manuballista
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on June 30, 2022, 06:53:57 AM
Ah new Britons! What a joy!

Great selection of miniatures as usual, looking forward to seeing the levies painted! They will get shields though? Otherwise their empty hands look a bit strange...

Quote
Part of the problem may be that starting new projects always seems so daunting.  So rather than tackling an entirely new warband, I'm going to get myself back into the habit of painting by beginning work on a smaller project, further expanding my Britons so I can use them as Age of Invasions Romans.

Sounds like a good plan...the first miniatures of a new project always feel so daunting because it feels like they determine how all the rest is going to go. But it's often after painteing 8-10 minis that you really get into things.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on June 30, 2022, 02:15:39 PM
Great selection of miniatures as usual, looking forward to seeing the levies painted! They will get shields though? Otherwise their empty hands look a bit strange...
Yes. The Levy will be equipped with same oval shields carried by my other Briton/Roman infantry.  To further distinguish them from my Warriors, I’m going to use the black Chi Rho LBM transfers.

Due to the size and placement of the shields on these models, I will paint the model and shield separately.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 11, 2023, 08:42:36 PM
It took me a year, but I finally found my way back to my Saga, Age of Invasions Roman warband.

When possible, I like to use my warbands to tell a story.  This makes the project more interesting and gives me some guidance on theme, paint, and model selection.

The theme for my AoI Romans will be Belisarius' Gothic campaign, which took place in the mid 6th century and involved the Eastern Roman's (temporary) reconquest of Italy. 

My warband will be led by Belisarius himself, but I'm not going to use the Legendary Unit for him. instead, he will be a standard, mounted Warlord.

One cannot field Besilarius without his faithful 'biscuit eaters' (Bucellarii), so the warband will include hearthguard cataphract and the option to field a unit of Warriors as mounted bowmen.

The warband's foot Warriors will be represented by the Romano Briton models that I previously painted for my Briton warband.

Since a big unit of Warrior archers will serve as my warband's anchor, I want this unit to stand out. So rather than use the Late Roman/Briton archers that I originally painted for this role, I am going to use the 'eastern archer' models from Victrix's Early Imperial Archers set. The Victix models are a bit anachronistic, but I like the eastern-look of them and they do present better than the bland, unarmored Late Roman archer models. Moreover, since Besilarius army was a mix of Eastern Romans (Greek and Latin people), Romanized "barbarians", foderati, and mercenaries, the Victix Eastern archer models add to the polyglot theme.

Besilarius' army included 3,000 Isaurians, who came from fierce tribe from southern Asia Minor. My research on the Isaurians has turned up very little, but it stands to reason that during this period their armor and weapons would have been influence by the nearby eastern people.  As such, my eastern Warrior archers are going to be Isaurians.  Below are a few test models that I assembled last night.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/124/FgA46n.jpg)


As previously planned, I am going to use Footsore Miniatures' unarmored Late Romans as levy. They will represent a unit of "Romanized" Heruli, an early Germanic people who contributed warriors to the Eastern Roman Empire. As a nod to their early Germanic heritage, I spent last night sculpting tiny little mustaches on each model. I still need to paint the mustaches, so right now they look like they have giant green caterpillars on their upper lips.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6383/FRFxIa.jpg)


Belisarius' army also included both Hunnic and Berber mercenaries.  I really like Victrix's newly released, Late Roman Unarmored Cavalry models, so I am toying with the idea of fielding a unit of these as mounted Foederati Dogs of War (the AoI equivalent of mercenaries). 

The Roman battle board doesn't support Dogs of War units, but since the battle board has the unique Impetus rule, in practice Roman players end up spending extra Saga dice on almost every advanced Saga ability on the board. However, if I field a Dogs of War unit that can activate itself without Saga dice and has special abilities that don't require Saga dice, then that frees up Saga dice to use on Impetus and advanced Saga abilities for my Roman units.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4245/nUwkEd.png)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on October 11, 2023, 09:13:00 PM
Always fun to see your process!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 14, 2023, 05:45:42 PM
I'm pleased with the look of my WIP foederati Isaurian archers.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/2779/Jm1YXX.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on October 16, 2023, 09:27:50 AM
I am really glad to see that you picked up this fantastic project again !

I really like the look of these archers and the backstory that justifies their use in Italy. I always loved those more than the plainer western Roman archers from footsore.

All in all a very nice mix of figures, you once again show that one shouldn't hesitate to mix different manufacturers and even plastic and metal in the same army!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 17, 2023, 08:08:43 PM
I've been shopping around for cataphract models for my AoI Romans. The metal GB and Footsore models are, meh (although the models in Footsore Arthurian Romano-British Heavy Cavalry Deal look pretty good). The plastic GB are worse than their metals. I own some Aventine cataphract, but I never painted them because the horses are tiny -more pony than horse.  The V&V and Fireforge cataphracts look like they are from a later period. 

I was just about to breakdown and order the Footsore Arthurian Heavy Cav Deal when I got an answer to an earlier PM inquiry to Victrix.

The Victrix Late Roman Cataphract kit is only 6 weeks away. F*ck yeah!

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8619/wGnKxB.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on October 17, 2023, 08:19:14 PM
Six weeks? damn, I may need to prepare the wallet.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on October 18, 2023, 06:54:58 AM
These look indeed stunning!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on October 24, 2023, 04:05:28 AM
I’ve made some progress. 

Except for their shields (my LBM transfers got lost in the mail), my Levy are done. 

I’ve started work on my bow warriors. My test model turned out good, so I am going to stick with the color scheme.

Once my shields are done I’ll take proper photos.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7585/CUo7vm.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on October 24, 2023, 08:19:30 AM
Stunning as always!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on November 14, 2023, 12:10:20 AM
It's been a while since I've posted an update, but I assure you that I've been making slow but stead progress.

I'm almost entirely finished painting a unit of 12 Roman Levy (no special equipment) and 12 Roman Warriors (bows).  I'm still waiting for the units' vexilla transfers to arrive. They should be here this week. And once the vexilla are done, I'll post proper photos of the two units.

In the meantime, here's a WIP of the Warrior archer vexillium. Originally, I modeled him without the bow, but the Rule of Cool won out. :)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7809/51dk7a.jpg)


I've also finished assembling my mounted Foederati. Once my latest Victrix order arrives, I may replace some of the heads with helmeted heads. 

Overall, I'm very happy with this kit. IMO, these new horses are best Victrix has made so far. They actually have proper, round, barrel bodies.  My only complaint is that like so many other Victrix kits, the warrior's arms are often a tad bit short, but it's nothing that pinning and GS can't fix.

Once I texture the bases and sort out the heads, I'll start work on painting them. 

I got the green-light from the Adepticon TO to treat mercenary equipment options like the equipment options of non-mercs. As such, my plan is to paint 8 mounted Foederati and 8 foot Foederati.  This will let me pick the option that best suits the terrain, objective, and opponent.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/7420/jrYQfA.jpg).

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 13, 2023, 04:21:11 AM
Well, I finally got around to photographing my Late Romans. 

This warband represents part of Belisarius' invasion force during the Gothic War, so I'll begin with the man himself, accompanied by an alternative foot Warlord representing the Belisarius' trusty commander, Pharas the Herulian.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7827/BqTv7M.jpg)


Next up are 4 mounted Hearthguard. As soon as my Victrix Cataphract arrive, these models will become an alternative HG choice. You may recognize these fellas from my 2017 Briton warband.  I've freshed up the paint and replaced the original shields.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6058/0VyiZu.jpg)


Next are 10 Warriors.  The vexillium is new, but the models are from my 2017 Briton warband with refreshed paint and bases.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/4894/2KKNbx.jpg)


These fellas are Levy. They represent a unit of new Herulian recruits. As a nod to their "barbarian" roots, I gave each model and GS mustache and equipped them with shields that don't display the Chi Rho symbol.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5074/B720MZ.jpg)


A sizeable unit of Warrior archers is must for Age of Invasions Roman warband. Except for the unit leader, the models are from the Victrix's Early Imperial Roman Archer kit. This makes them appear a bit anachronistic, but I want these models to represent some of the 3,000 Isaurians that joined Belisarius in the Gothic War.  Since the Isaurians are people from south-central Asia Minor, the idea is that the use of the eastern helms, armor, and garb would give these models and eastern feel.  And since they are Warriors and not mere levy, I wanted them to look a bit more elite than what you typically find in Late Roman archer kits.

I also have in my collection a unit of typical Late Roman archers, which I painted a few years ago. Truth be told, I'm torn between which unit to bring to Adepticon.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4487/2MWJBx.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9311/sH1TWS.jpg)


Another 'must have' for an Age of Invasions Roman warband is a manuballista. This model is a Hatra ballista, made by Gripping Beast.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/9880/l9G8Bb.jpg)


Lastly, I am going to include a unit of mercenary Foederati. These fellas represent Lombard mercenaries or mercenaries from another Germanic tribe.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/809/RZTKzz.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on December 13, 2023, 05:02:52 AM
Fantastic looking updates to your forces.  I really like the new archer unit.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on December 13, 2023, 06:21:17 AM
Excelsior! Magnificent work. I would go with the Eastern archers. They look amazing and they make for an interesting conversation piece regarding the Isaurian participation.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 13, 2023, 08:13:42 AM
Lovely brushwork Koyote  8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on December 13, 2023, 09:36:05 AM
Fantastic painting on these and a greak mix between classic Footsore miniatures and the newer Victrix sets!
I love the colours of these overall, but thoese Foederati are just special :-*

I would also go with the eastern looking archers, the backstory is good enough and they are a real eyecatcher.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 13, 2023, 07:32:58 PM
While I wait for my Victrix Roman Cataphract to arrive, I'm going to focus on my thematic objective markers for my Romans.

The casualties are made by Wargames Foundry. The sitting soldiers on the left are a West Wind Productions model. The kneeling fella holding up the shield is one half of Salute 2006 vignette.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/7819/Ir6SvT.jpg)


WARNING.  Brace yourself for some next level historical wargaming nerdiness.

The Roman battle board includes a unique Impetus mechanic that requires the player to spend Impetus to use certain advanced battle board abilities. Impetus is tracked using the yellow circles that run down the left side of the board.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6848/mOJfkh.jpg)

As someone who enjoys creating custom markers for my Saga warbands, I turned my mind to coming up with a fun way to track Impetus. What I landed was simple: a small coin from that era. 

After shopping around online, I purchased two coins that I believe fit the bill.

The first candidate is a bronze 5 nummi coin purported to have been minted in Ravenna when Italy was ruled by Ostrogoth king Theodahad. Since my warband represents the Eastern Roman invasion force that eventually took Italy back from the Ostrogoths (i.e., the Gothic War or Gothic Campaign), the coin was arguably in circulation in Italy during this period.  As a historical note, two years into the invasion, Theodahad was murdered on the road to Ravenna. He was killed on the orders of the Ostrogoth general Witiges for his failures in defending the Ostrogothic kingdom from Belisarius. Upon Theodahad's death, Witiges assumed the throne.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3682/AYZgrA.jpg)


The second candidate, comes in a fancier case and a printed (but unsigned) certificate of authenticity. The slick packaging, while cool, makes me question the coin’s authenticity.

The seller purports the coin to be a copper 5 nummi coin from the reign of Justinian I.  Justinian I was the ruler of the Eastern Roman Empire during Belisarius' conquest of the Vandal kingdom in North Africa and Belisarius' campaign against the Ostrogoths in Siciliy and Italy.  Rather than use this coin as a marker, I may simply put it on display next to warband's display board to add some additional flavor to the experience of viewing the models.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/7341/DUTCHW.jpg)

The take away is that I will be playing a game the "recreates" battles fought almost 1,500 years ago, using a coin from that specific time period and geographic area. In fact, each coin depicts the head of one of the rulers whose armies fought the Gothic war, Theodahad and Justinian I. Crazy!


As I was researching the Gothic War, I stumbled on another fun idea.  In 536 AD Belisarius was preparing to abandon the siege of Naples when an Isaurian soldier under his command discovered an entrance into the city through its disused aqueduct. Belisarius' engineers widened the hole in the wall created aqueduct and used it gain entrance into the city. 

Whereas I'm not interested in creating an elaborate diorama of the siege of Naples, Sarissa Precision does make a fun little 'aqueduct under construction' kit, that I plan to position near the rear of my display board along with a small placard briefly describing the siege of Naples and the use of the aqueduct by the Romans sack the city.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/7831/bcBKLX.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on December 13, 2023, 07:49:04 PM
As always, fantastic attention to detail. And those foederati, phenomenal!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Freddy on December 13, 2023, 08:30:31 PM
What a great looking Late Roman army!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Basementboy on December 13, 2023, 10:45:22 PM
The army looks fantastic so far, and the coins are a lovely touch :-*
Looking forward to seeing more!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: has.been on December 14, 2023, 06:36:53 AM
Most excellent work, all of it!  Well done.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on December 14, 2023, 10:45:12 AM
The real coins as markers are such a cool idea!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on December 14, 2023, 02:50:51 PM
You always take things to the next level mate. Bravo! 👏🏻
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on December 15, 2023, 01:22:02 AM
Next level historical wargaming nerdiness indeed! That is a very fun way to enhance the game play.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 15, 2023, 09:48:06 AM
Apologies. Posted by mistake.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 22, 2023, 04:26:26 AM
I finished my objective markers for my Age of Invasions warband.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/218/lvIXfz.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on December 22, 2023, 06:30:53 AM
Great work! 👍
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 22, 2023, 08:43:12 AM
Lovely work Kayote  :-*

So, I see from left to right; the West Wind "Death of Arthur" vignette with a skinhead head swap on Arthur, A dead Wargames Foundry Viking and one more dead Wargames Foundry Viking being guarded by the one miniature from the old Arthur Salute vignette? Am I hot, warm or cold?  :D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Bloggard on December 22, 2023, 10:56:04 AM
catching up with this thread. wonderful painting.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 22, 2023, 05:15:29 PM
Lovely work Kayote  :-*

So, I see from left to right; the West Wind "Death of Arthur" vignette with a skinhead head swap on Arthur, A dead Wargames Foundry Viking and one more dead Wargames Foundry Viking being guarded by the one miniature from the old Arthur Salute vignette? Am I hot, warm or cold?  :D
The only thing you missed (and it is a very small thing) is that I did a head swap with Salute mini. The mini is the Mordred half of the original Arthur v Mordred SALUTE 2006 model. It originally had a roman face-mask helm, which I assume was inspired by the 1981 film Excalibur. The replacement head is from Victrix's Late Roman Armored Infantry kit.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9868/6Vnxxi.png)

BTW, the Arthur half of the SALUTE vignette is my Roman Warlord on foot.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7827/BqTv7M.jpg)


Also, I prefer to think of the Vikings as Goths and that the kneeling Roman isn't protecting the fallen Goth, he is protecting himself from Goth archers, who are very unhappy with him for breaking his spear in the fallen Goth warrior's gut.  ;)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on December 22, 2023, 05:44:46 PM
Wonderful vibrant painting.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 23, 2023, 09:51:44 AM
The only thing you missed (and it is a very small thing) is that I did a head swap with Salute mini. The mini is the Mordred half of the original Arthur v Mordred SALUTE 2006 model. It originally had a roman face-mask helm, which I assume was inspired by the 1981 film Excalibur. The replacement head is from Victrix's Late Roman Armored Infantry kit.

Ah ha! There's always something :)

My Salute 2006 model has long disappeared into conversions that I cannot even remember! which probably means they didn't/haven't been painted yet!  :o
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: syrinx0 on December 24, 2023, 02:24:35 AM
My Salute 2006 model has long disappeared into conversions that I cannot even remember! which probably means they didn't/haven't been painted yet!  :o
Perhaps 2024 would be a good year to rectify that?  ;D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Atheling on December 24, 2023, 07:49:57 AM
Perhaps 2024 would be a good year to rectify that?  ;D

Maybe..... though who knows. lots of choices and I like to minimise the number of projects I have to contend with in one go.

Apologies for the slight post hijack Koyote.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Basementboy on December 25, 2023, 09:53:08 PM
Beautiful vignettes! Thanks for sharing, mate :D
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 26, 2023, 03:27:52 AM
These two fellas are AoI Roman Challengers for the Old Feud scenario from the Book of Battles. The model on the left represents the "non-fighty" archetypes (e.g., Counsellor and Traitor) and the model on the right represents the "fighty" archetypes (e.g., Brute and Soldier).

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/5203/EFT3B8.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Dean on December 26, 2023, 06:08:18 PM
Loving this, you are a continuous source of inspiration!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 26, 2023, 09:10:56 PM
The Cataphract have arrived!

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/6905/7psuON.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Ogrob on December 26, 2023, 09:17:23 PM
Oh, this should be good!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on December 26, 2023, 09:29:10 PM
Exellent! Looking forward to seeing these painted! Mine have arrived just on time for Christmas as well - a lovely set with lots of options!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 27, 2023, 08:14:53 PM
As I assemble my Cataphract, I'm also working on a mini-display base for Belisarius. The base is larger than 60mm maximum size for mounted warlords, so it is for display purposes only.

The first photo depicts me experimenting with the placement of terrain features. The second photo shows the final selection and placement of terrain features and how I use Apoxie Sculpt to shape the surface of the base. In the third photo I added an insert and magnets so that the standard bearer can be fixed to the base in a manner that allows me to remove the model for storage and transport.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/1950/oaWoVQ.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5687/8XtBlM.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5080/ungjGI.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/7681/zt8ugE.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Basementboy on December 29, 2023, 11:24:18 AM
Looks gorgeous so far! Out of interest, what is the quality of the cataracts? I’ve been debating getting them for a Sassanid Persian project.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on December 30, 2023, 12:12:22 AM
Looks gorgeous so far! Out of interest, what is the quality of the cataracts? I’ve been debating getting them for a Sassanid Persian project.

Overall, I am very pleased with kit.

The horses went together quite nicely, and required only minimal gap filling with greenstuff.

As with many Victrix kits, some of the arm pieces are a bit janky and when assembled don't align and/or fit as flush against the body as I would prefer. 

Another issue with the arms is that some of the 'stirrup holding' left arms seem a bit short.

Also, I wish there was a second overhead stabbing pose in the kit, but that is more a matter of personal preference than a deficiency in the kit.

Lastly, I wish they had included a couple of belt pouches and daggers on each sprue. The models' right side seem a bit bare to me, especially for those models in the overhead stabbing pose. I made daggers for their right side by cutting up and reassembling extra sheathed swords.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4480/YLSFiD.jpg)

I didn't use any of the fancier heads because of the time period that I am trying to depict. However, I think the "fancy" heads would look great in Asiatic warbands and later Eastern Roman/Byzantine warbands.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Basementboy on December 30, 2023, 09:41:58 AM
Thanks very much for the response!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 01, 2024, 05:44:01 PM
Flavis Belisarius, Magister Militum.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/4268/NooJ5R.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Freddy on January 02, 2024, 06:13:00 PM
Great looking Belisarius, I really like the composition with the flag (to show his commanding presence but would be weird in his own hands) and the ruined antique column so metaphorical for the era he lived in.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 02, 2024, 09:14:52 PM
Great looking Belisarius, I really like the composition with the flag (to show his commanding presence but would be weird in his own hands) and the ruined antique column so metaphorical for the era he lived in.
Well said. Yup, both the ruined columns and the injured standard bearer are symbolic of an Empire in decline.

The reds, particular on the banner, are darker IRL. The lighting I sued lightened the tones.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: nikkobourges on January 04, 2024, 01:24:46 PM
Just superb !!!!

Nikkobourges
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: sir_shvantselot on January 04, 2024, 03:24:20 PM
Really nice.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Basementboy on January 04, 2024, 07:13:47 PM
A little late to jump on the bandwagon but it looks absolutely fantastic :)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 09, 2024, 03:49:25 AM
“Foedus” means treaty, alliance, or pact between states. The AoI Roman’s’ Foedus ability inflicts an extra fatigue on enemy units that shoot or engage in melee. As a Saga Old-Timer, the ability’s name and effect reminds me of the Saga v1 Moor ability, The Moor’s Gold. Accordingly, when casting about for ideas for Foedus markers I landed on the idea of Roman representatives using promises of friendship and/or bribes of gold and grain to bribe negotiate a pact with certain elements of my opponent’s faction, causing disunity and disloyalty within their ranks.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/4562/h9evXV.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/3906/3aZ3QI.jpg)


The markers are Sally 4th Miniatures’ Roman civilians and 3D printed base placards.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2875/et9w1P.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Pattus Magnus on January 09, 2024, 04:50:28 AM
Cool idea for how to represent the effect! Those markers are going to look great on the table once they’re painted.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Dean on January 09, 2024, 03:18:44 PM
Oh man, you are really setting the bar with those markers, very cool, and I will think about how to emulate you shamelessly  lol
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: syrinx0 on January 10, 2024, 04:50:26 AM
Quote
"and 3D printed base placards."
Damn.  Brilliant.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: richardpate on January 12, 2024, 03:22:41 AM
Very well done and the figures really “speak to the viewer” great job!
 ”
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 12, 2024, 09:37:26 PM
On Tuesday, I took my Romans out for a spin. In preparation for an upcoming AoV + AoI Saga tournament in Langley, British Columbia, my buddy (playing Normans) and I played a scenario from the tournament packet. 

The scenario is essentially a six turn version of the Ambush scenario from the Book of Battles.

I brought my shiny new (but still unpainted) Foedus markers with me.  However, as luck would have it, I didn't roll even one 'rare' Saga die result until Turn 6. And since I 'went second,' I didn't have a single opportunity to use Foedus all game. Clearly the painting gods and dice gods had conspired against me. ;)

You can see in the upper right corner of the photo where the Foedus markers sat, pouting and unused, for the entire game.

Despite the poor Saga die rolls, it was a good game and I managed to eke out victory against a veteran player. This was only my third or fourth game with the Romans, and despite my victory, it's clear that I still a have a lot to learn about the Roman battle board.

The photo below was shot during Turn 3.  At this point, the Romans and Normans each have one objective marker (the round mdf markers) and the last remaining baggage model stands there nervously, between the two warbands. 

The baggage marker would make it another 12 inches towards the opposite short table edge before a unit of Romans Warriors were able to destroy it and capture its objective marker. This marker was subsequently lost when the Norman archers shot down the last surviving Roman Warrior from that unit. At the bottom of Turn 5, my Roman levy recovered the lost marker and held onto it for the rest of the game.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/8138/9Rkzh0.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: syrinx0 on January 13, 2024, 01:35:00 AM
Appease the dice gods and get painting.  lol
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 17, 2024, 09:27:57 PM
Here's another not-so-great photo of my Romans arrayed for battle.  I added white flower 'tufts' to all my cav, the manubalista, and about 3/4 of my infantry models in each unit. It's hard to tell from this photo, but the splashes of white on the bases breaks up the dark(ish) bases and matches the models' shields and tunics.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/3112/3J4LW9.jpg)

Last night we played another scenario from the Langley tournament packet, Holy Ground. A hill was placed in the center and each player placed one piece of terrain within the central 'L' corridor as shown below. VPs were earned solely by conquest points, which a player earned each turn based upon the number of models entirely on the three terrain pieces.  Thus, all that mattered was getting units into the terrain and holding out as long as possible.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/1883/Q82zP7.png)


Since most of the fighting was to occur in and around the central terrain pieces, I opted to field by 4 HG on foot. I also deployed poorly, causing me to move a few units laterally, rather than directly towards the terrain.

On Turn 2 the Norman archers fired a volley at my foot HG and by using Superiority the archers inflicted a total of four wounds. I flubbed the saves and all 4 HG were removed from the board, splashing extra fatigue on 4 nearby units. Next, a 4-pack of Norman HG circled the Woods and using Pursuit and Charge slammed into my 10 Warrior bowmen who WERE hiding behind the unit of now annihilated unit of HG.  Eight of my ten archers were slain, but the scrappy archers managed to wipe out all four HG in return.  Another 4-pack of Norman HG hit my 12 Levy, but by closing ranks and using Scuta I lost only one Levy and dragged down one Norman HG.

At the start of my Turn 2 things were looking pretty bad for the Romans. The Normans held the woods and the hill and two of my units were out of the game, either literally or figuratively. Nevertheless, I soldiered on and thanks to some clever planning and a lot of luck, I was able finish off the last 3 Norman HG with my Foedrati, and then charge my Levy into the woods, mauling the Norman archers and forcing them to flee from the woods.

On Turn 3 the Norman warlord tried to avenge his fallen HG, but my Foederati fought like maniacs and simply refused to die.  This resulted in only two dead Foerati and an exhausted Norman Warlord. 

On my Turn 3 my Levy finished off the Norman Warlord with their Dark Age lawn darts (Plumbate) and my berserk Foederati charged up the hill and murdered a unit of Norman crossbowmen, who were at full strength but encumbered by 2 fatigue due to death of the Norman Warlord and my previous use of Foedus (Yes, I FINALLY managed to roll a rare).  The three un-murdered crossbowmen fled off the hill.

At that point my opponent called it quits. At that point my 10 Levy held the woods. A unit of 10 Roman Warriors held the field to the right of the hill, and between my crazed Foederati and my manubalista, the few remaining Norman Warriors on the hill were in trouble. It was clear that the Normans simply didn't have enough models left to catch up to the Romans in VPs.

The takeaway from this game is to not let early setbacks cause you to give up.

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Dean on January 18, 2024, 10:50:38 AM
Wow, yep that didn't end the way I thought it was going after reading the first turn, well played sir! 
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 28, 2024, 07:51:40 PM
On Saturday, I brought my Romans to the West Coast Viking's Lindisfarne in Langley Tournament, which was a 3 round AoV + AoI tournament.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/524/9Sa5Ua.jpg)

First round I drew Jomsvikings in a variant of the Ambush scenario. My opponent was a very good player.  It was a relatively low casualty game, so the deciding factor were the baggage objectives. At game’s end, the Romans held 2 of the 3 objectives, earning the Roman a victory.

Second round was a mirror match, in that my opponent also played Roman’s. The scenario was a variant of the old King of the Hill scenario. A hill was placed in the center of the table and one terrain piece to either side. Conquest points were earned by models in the terrain at the end of the opponent’s turn. It wasn’t an especially high scoring game, but at game’s end my Romans came out on top.

Third round I drew a very good Hun player who caused an earlier opponent to concede on Turn 2. Yikes!.  We played a variant of Change of Plans. The twist was that at the end of the game, all models the weren’t on their opponent’s side of the table counted as destroyed.

I castled up on the right, in a denied flank deployment, which kept my opponent’s unit of Mercs out of the game entirely.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9129/YqktCi.jpg)

The Huns went first and hit my melee Warriors pretty hard, but I this left the Huns' two largest units of comp bow cav directly in front of my lines on my Turn 1. I hit back, but I rolled all commons on my Saga dice and my opponent’s dice were hot, so my counter attack didn’t land as hard as I had hoped. What followed was 3 more turns of tough play before time ran out. Due to the rule that killed all models not in the enemy half of the table, both sides lost quite a few models. At the end of the game, the only models left alive were 11 Roman Levy and 4 Hun Warriors. Roman victory!

With a record of 3-0, the Romans took first place. I also took home the trophy for best painted. My Hun opponent took home the trophy for most massacre points. My buddy won second place with his Normans, and another American won the Wooden Spoon with Vikings.

Below are the final standings based upon rank, warband, and W/L/D.

Final Standings:
1. Romans 3-0
2. Normans 2-0-1
3. Scots 2-1
4. Huns 2-1
5.Last Romans 2-1
6. Jomsvikings 1-1-1
7. Welsh 1-1-1
8. Picts 1-1-1
9. Romans 1-2
10. Scots 0-1-2
11. Visigoth 0-3
12. Vikings 0-3

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/910/Sz1Jvr.jpg)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on January 28, 2024, 09:50:03 PM
“Foedus” means treaty, alliance, or pact between states. The AoI Roman’s’ Foedus ability inflicts an extra fatigue on enemy units that shoot or engage in melee. As a Saga Old-Timer, the ability’s name and effect reminds me of the Saga v1 Moor ability, The Moor’s Gold. Accordingly, when casting about for ideas for Foedus markers I landed on the idea of Roman representatives using promises of friendship and/or bribes of gold and grain to bribe negotiate a pact with certain elements of my opponent’s faction, causing disunity and disloyalty within their ranks.
...
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2875/et9w1P.jpg)

I was up unitl midnight the night before the tournament putting the finishing touches on my Foedus markers.  I think they turned out pretty good.  They were certainly fun to paint.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6372/Sglim3.jpg)


Since I didn't get a chance to post these before the tournament, here are my cataphract HG.  I also brought 4 HG on foot to swap out for' King of the Hill' type scenario, since I knew that the objective was to get models into terrain. 

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/9566/biGDAE.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/6920/8Ngnd6.jpg)


Lastly, since I won't be able to use beloved Foederati at Adepticon (no Mercs allowed this year), I freshened up the paint on another unit of 9 Warriors and added a brand new vexillium.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/5403/i3sYiV.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: syrinx0 on January 29, 2024, 03:50:05 AM
Damn, that is one fantastic looking group of Romans! I love cataphract in general and yours are wonderful - especially the stripes.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on January 29, 2024, 06:39:22 PM
Brilliant work all around, special mention for these cataphracts, love the variation in materials of the armor.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Grumpy Gnome on January 30, 2024, 07:23:13 AM
Beautiful work mate! 👍
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Basementboy on January 31, 2024, 08:14:42 AM
Beautiful work!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Old Hob on January 31, 2024, 04:08:20 PM
These are all wonderful. Beautiful brushwork.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Other Stuff
Post by: Koyote on January 31, 2024, 08:48:57 PM
A sizeable unit of Warrior archers is must for Age of Invasions Roman warband. Except for the unit leader, the models are from the Victrix's Early Imperial Roman Archer kit. This makes them appear a bit anachronistic, but I want these models to represent some of the 3,000 Isaurians that joined Belisarius in the Gothic War.  Since the Isaurians are people from south-central Asia Minor, the idea is that the use of the eastern helms, armor, and garb would give these models and eastern feel.  And since they are Warriors and not mere levy, I wanted them to look a bit more elite than what you typically find in Late Roman archer kits.

I also have in my collection a unit of typical Late Roman archers, which I painted a few years ago. Truth be told, I'm torn between which unit to bring to Adepticon.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/4487/2MWJBx.jpg)

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/9311/sH1TWS.jpg)

I continue to have mixed feelings about Warrior archers. The models turned out okay, but without me there to describe to the viewer the mix of forces arrayed for the Gothic campaign, they seem out of place and a bit anachronistic.

A few weeks ago, YouTube's algorithm suggested to me a video about the staff sling. When the video mentioned that it was used by Romans, particularly in sieges, this got me thinking. The Victrix Late Roman archer kit includes some wonderful staff slinger models AND the theme for my Roman display board is going to be the Siege of Napes.  Also, this will be a great opportunity to incorporate some unusual and very fun, period appropriate models into my warband.

I equipped each with a helm, buckler, and sword, to hint at their status as Warriors rather then mere Levy.

If I decide to replace my "Eastern" Roman archers with staff slingers in my Late Roman warband, those archers will likely find a home in another one of my warbands when Studio Tomahawk releases its Age of Caesar rules.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img923/1313/JBGgsJ.jpg)

I picked up these transfers for their bucklers.

(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/7127/qM7mnx.png)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Ogrob on January 31, 2024, 08:54:26 PM
So much lovely stuff posted in the last week! The slingers are a very nice effective kitbash, certainly a testament to what is possible with the Late Roman range.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on February 01, 2024, 10:37:51 AM
These are imho the best part about the new archer and slinger Kit, the poses are nicely designed and it's something that wasn't available from other manufacturers before. Great idea with the helmets, swords and bucklers, they definitely look more elite. However I find them a bit too uniform. Maybe one without helmet but with the flat cap (and helmet on his belt) would bring a bit more variety.

I only noticed now that you removed the plastic puddles under their feet! Great idea, looks more natural!
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on February 01, 2024, 05:01:28 PM
@Gunslinger: You make a good point. Let me see what I can do.
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: OSHIROmodels on February 01, 2024, 05:40:01 PM
Lovely work again  8)
Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: Koyote on February 02, 2024, 07:11:33 AM
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img924/2478/0r4dND.jpg)

Title: Re: Koyote's SAGA Britons, Irish, & Late Romans
Post by: .:Gunslinger:. on February 02, 2024, 08:04:18 AM
Perfect now! Great little adjustments :-*