Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Mad Guru on January 28, 2019, 11:13:43 PM
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I'm a long-time Medieval wargamer who works as a screenwriter and TV writer-producer.
I had nothing to do with the creation of Knightfall or the writing and production of its first season, but I was heavily involved in the upcoming Season 2, which will premiere soon on History.
As a lifelong devotee of Medieval history, this job was a bit of a dream come true. We took a somewhat different approach to the material from the creative team on Season 1, but the characters and their stories do pick up right where the first season left off.
If interested in learning a bit more about the coming season (but no plot-spoilers!) and seeing a bunch of early 14th Century France behind-the-scenes photos, CLICK on the link to visit my recent blog post, and thanks in advance for your time should you do so…
BLOG LINK:
https://maiwandday.blogspot.com/2019/01/medieval-gaming-at-11-scale.html (https://maiwandday.blogspot.com/2019/01/medieval-gaming-at-11-scale.html)
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-A5q1EpFlJpk/XEql6H9srnI/AAAAAAAASJc/-mswnxQ_MAw73qtw9y-fO0h15_gnKltcACLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_9948.JPG)
(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-y3hfG44728g/XEql5llm0vI/AAAAAAAASJY/WF6QLXPKh3YG6g6S0KC6VdfLSQK65HiSgCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_9938.JPG)
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-WLk4auNQPdI/XE7E3y9kZhI/AAAAAAAASO4/g5HeIn-rEfoRZrwV8WaSXNtrfxUrakgsQCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_0778.JPG)
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-7ZAdUG3GOUY/XE7E6pJEzUI/AAAAAAAASPU/NhsPis_4svkBezxWRguUG203Ja-wcp6HQCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_0828.JPG)
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_5QvhknThf8/XE7E9qTrhHI/AAAAAAAASP0/Aq8RdlWvQsAY5Fze1KaC984Fm54z92-UgCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_1003.JPG)
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-m0cE6QhcXws/XE7E-kUCxdI/AAAAAAAASQE/x9SqniiwpNAz5PB3ArHmPqxrjX53FnEmQCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_1035.JPG)
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Nice pictures and definitely a usefull resource should anyone be building a medieval castle :)
For the next season you really should advise the modelmakers to go for 1/56 scale :p
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I tried to watch Season 1. It was awful. Really, really awful. I couldn't stand the nonsense nor the innaccuracies.
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Thanks, Munindk -- and if it does go to Season 3, I may try that!
Antonio: As mentioned on my blog, this upcoming Season 2 is very different from the season you tried to watch but couldn't. Obviously I can't really be a neutral judge, BUT I can promise you that what I believe you are referring to as "the nonsense" we dropped from the story. Re: "inaccuracies," as also mentioned on my blog, it's not a docudrama, and certain details in Season Two take liberties with the historical record, but compared with Season One, the overall tone is much grittier, and I think we paid more attention to historical accuracy -- again, with the caveat that it is a drama first and foremost.
No pressure to watch, but if you enjoy Medieval historical fiction, and especially if you're interested in the fall of the Templars and "Friday the 13th, 1307" (also if you liked reading "The Cursed Kings," which covers similar historical ground), I'd say it's worth another try. The first 3 episodes cover a nice character arc for the hero, and by then you'll definitely know if Season Two is worth continuing to watch... or just a different version of something you don't like.
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Fantastic pictures on your blog; the buildings are particularly inspirational for those of us who like to make terrain .
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Great pics, especially those of the sets and miniatures.
I must admit i was not a fan of the first season. I watched it only because im a sucker for period and fantasy drama and i will watch almost everything from Ator to GoT lol. I wanted it to be good, but not only it failed to be a serious period drama, it also failed to be a guilty pleasure like Spartacus or the first three periods of Vikings.
But Im willing to give it another chance. I mean Black sails started in the rather campy vein of Spartacus but in the end it evolved to something alot more serious with a great closure. So there is always room for improvement and surprise. Your reference of the Accursed kings already intrigued me.
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Hated the first season with all its soap operaness and thoroughly disliked the protagonist but stuck with it since the aesthetics were pretty good and the girlfriend liked it. Will give season 2 a chance. Heres hoping you did something good with it!
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Thanks very much, guys! Of course it's virtually impossible for me to be an objective judge of such things, but there's no doubt this second season is much more grounded and gritty, not just in the writing but also in the look and visual style. As Mrs. Esterhouse says, the Aesthetics of Season One -- which I take as referring to the production design of the buildings, sets, costumes, etc -- was very impressive, and the same people were involved this time around. We just took a different approach to putting their amazing work on film, so to speak. (No real film involved of course, just digital pixels!). As a lifelong student of Late Medieval Europe, I can say that we used as many primary sources as possible in an effort to connect the characters and their stories to the period, as well as having the useful services of more than one academic historical consultant. There are some big "soap opera" elements -- or maybe more accurately, old school "opera" elements, that are part of the mix, but they don't come a mile a minute, they are introduced, and then developed, and they take the story where where it goes. I hope you guys all enjoy it... but if not, you can blame me!
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Well, you've got me convinced to give it a second try - and I didn't even make it through the opening scene. "Where's he going? The boat will leave without us!" *click*
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Thanks, Bloodsbane, I hear you Re: that Season One opening sequence. Hope I don't steer you wrong!
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I watched the first season and wanted to like it really bad. I guess it was alright but I recently tried to watch it a second time and I just couldnt. Hopefully the second season will be quite the improvement. Gritty does sound good to get the ball rolling in the right direction.
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Breazer, I can assure you that Season Two is significantly different from Season One, though as mentioned on my blog it does pick up the story of the same characters right where they left off at the end of the first season.
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Just saw a preview for season 2. Now I’m stoked to see it after learning of the addition of a certain actor to the cast.
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Glad to hear it, Mrs. Estherhouse!
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-dIrnNr_47oE/XFbEFCOnOpI/AAAAAAAASWo/ivpaOPPe5fMhvpBG7uEvrcuZWNlx7PfAQCLcBGAs/s1600/Screen%2BShot%2BX.png)
Mark Hamil turned out to be a big-hearted and generous true gentleman, who showed up every day ready to work, no matter how physically challenging it might be. And on this show, between the smoke, rain, mud, horses, fight choreography, and then the bitter cold, it was often quite challenging. I've been a writer and producer in movies and TV for more than a quarter-century, and he had one of the best attitudes of any actor I've ever worked with.
RE: the protagonist... hoping you meant you disliked the character being portrayed, who was certainly quite flawed, rather than the actor himself. If it's the character with his flaws, fear not, much of Season Two is spent forcing him to own up to, and suffer for, the sins of his past.
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Glad to hear good things about Mr. Hamil. Always been a fan.
Nothing against the actor playing the protagonist. Mr. Cullen certainly portrayed him quite well.
*SPOILER* for anyone who hasn’t watched season 1
Just have no tolerance for chaps that bang their friends old lady. Also thought it was a dick move not letting Gawain use the grail to heal his old wound which he got while protecting him when he was willing to use it to heal his dying mistress.
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Mark Hamil is generally underused, and im not some kind of starwars fanboy. Its good to see him in more things.
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Ethan
Just watched the last two episodes on Netflix while on holiday in Hong Kong.my first love for miniatures is the crusades this wasn't so bad if you take out some of the scenes with the queen / pope/ assassins creed person etc.
I'm sure with your input it might get a bit more of the details correct albeit it is made for a more general viewer than us history buffs.
Looking forward too seeing which direction season 2 went in.
Best regards
Willie
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Willie, great to hear from you, my friend, and thanks for your enthusiasm Re: the upcoming Season 2! Holiday in HK sounds awesome; haven't been there myself since before the handover in '97. I actually just rewatched all of Season Two from start to finish. As you rightly say, it is not written or produced for a purely "history buff" audience, and does take liberties with various details for dramatic purposes. But we did our best to make the characters' mindsets and belief systems, and the setting itself, fit into our understanding of early 14th Century France -- despite the cast's various British accents! Hope you enjoy it when the time comes, and if not, I will pick up the tab the next time we are lucky enough to meet in person!
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OFFICIAL TRAILER for Knightfall Season 2 just uploaded to YouTube, featuring 2+ mins of footage from the coming season...
https://youtu.be/PIp1HInSTTE (https://youtu.be/PIp1HInSTTE)
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Pr-y7TS-Gt0/XGDIzxDNLLI/AAAAAAAASW0/CK07AIFZg0UsQ93iXC2ze9Yvpv0BWcmHwCLcBGAs/s1600/12018_KNIGHTFALL_S2_TEASE_20_digital_711x400_1433312323741.jpg)
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I mean Black sails started in the rather campy vein of Spartacus but in the end it evolved to something alot more serious with a great closure. So there is always room for improvement and surprise. Your reference of the Accursed kings already intrigued me.
I guess I'm the one weirdo who thought it was better as what it started out as. A prequel to Treasure Island, which is itself a somewhat campy pirate romp adventure story. I found the final two seasons incredibly dreary and tedious. And poor Ray Stevenson, who was so excellent in Rome, was completely wasted as Blackbeard, like they just hired him so they had production stills of Ray Stevenson as a pirate.
I may try out season 2 of Knightfall.
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I also crashed out of series 1, but will give it another crack.
Out of professional interest, who were your historical advisors, Ethan?
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Hi Janner,
Associate Professor Jason Glenn, Ph.D Medieval History, who teaches at USC (University of Southern California), and has written several Medieval history books; and author/historian Dan Jones from the UK, who served as the historical consultant for Season One.
Hope you will like Season Two enough to stick with it. Most of all it's a character and action drama, and as I've said before, it includes a number of historical inaccuracies. But we tried to stay true to our understanding of early 14th Century France, including the spirit (though not all the details) of the dynamics at work between the Templars, the Papacy, and the French Crown -- and I made sure there were mantlets for the siege!
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Yes, I know the name, but we've never run into one another. Glad to hear that you were happy with his guidance - I don't envy him (or you) having to cooperate with Janes though lol
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I can only guess that providing consulting services to a show, or movie must be one of those very strange situations for a historian. Like dating a woman that you know she is out of your league and in the end it will only end in tears, but you let yourself get carried away anyway.
At first you have a very exciting project, probably the chance to work with famous people that you might even be a fan of and get well payed on top of that. Then you get to meet the reality of financial and creative reasons for taking.... Afew liberties and by the time the angry mob of history buffs and colleagues come against you, you realise that maybe the classroom or the occasional speach is all the excitement you really need ;D
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You have to approach these things with more than a little pragmatiscm. A certain Blackadder Goes Forth quote comes to mind:
"Clearly, Field Marshal Haig is about to make yet another gargantuan effort to move his drinks cabinet six inches closer to Berlin!"
lol lol
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I tried to watch Season 1. It was awful. Really, really awful. I couldn't stand the nonsense nor the innaccuracies.
I felt the same way.I was really looking forward to it and was highly disappointed.
Mark
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I guess I'm the one weirdo who thought it was better as what it started out as. A prequel to Treasure Island, which is itself a somewhat campy pirate romp adventure story. I found the final two seasons incredibly dreary and tedious. And poor Ray Stevenson, who was so excellent in Rome, was completely wasted as Blackbeard, like they just hired him so they had production stills of Ray Stevenson as a pirate.
I may try out season 2 of Knightfall.
I liked Black Sails from the beginning but I really didn't like the end but I think it was a quality show.Will also give Knightfall a second chance.
Mark.
Mark
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You have to approach these things with more than a little pragmatiscm. A certain Blackadder Goes Forth quote comes to mind:
"Clearly, Field Marshal Haig is about to make yet another gargantuan effort to move his drinks cabinet six inches closer to Berlin!"
lol lol
lol
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(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iN4-UPJ28mM/XJXDbYlGJTI/AAAAAAAASX0/v2StM-YyHFk0QYLb3OmjtXzO6b33D6myQCLcBGAs/s1600/p16569361_b_v8_ab.jpg)
In case any UK-based LAFers are interested, Season 2 of KNIGHTFALL will be premiering on History UK on Tuesday July 2nd at 9:00pm.
As mentioned previously in this thread, it's a bit grittier than Season One, with more focus on the daily lives of the Templars and more attention paid to the religious/spiritual lives of the Brothers themselves. It picks up right where the previous season ended, but if you never watched any of Season 1, you can still enjoy Season 2, as it tells a self-contained story, centered around the growing conflict between the Templars and the French monarchy, with new characters added on both sides. It's not a docudrama, and takes liberties with some details of the early 14th Century historical record, but it tries to reflect the period and to accurately portray some of the dynamics which led to the downfall of the Temple.
I'm not an objective judge, but it features some excellent performances and production design.
On the Medieval Geek front, some highlights of Season 2 include: Templar Initiate training, Luciferian heretics, lo schiaffo di Anagni ("the Anagni slap"), Leper Knights of Saint Lazarus, a decent-sized siege, and l'affaire de la tour de Nesle ("the Tower de Nesle affair").
Hope you enjoy it if you watch!
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-etBU_BwZ1VY/XE9WXsTqTFI/AAAAAAAASWM/d-VHb8YWgS8jTTozfBAAxlrODtGVrr7QACEwYBhgL/s1600/knightfall_ka_r1_v2_1000.jpg)
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Looks Awesome
:o :o :o :o :o
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Suppose it won't cost anything but time when it shows up on Netflix at some point (as it currently has the first), so might well give it a go. Quite interested in fact to see how the two seasons differ then.
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I'm in...that looks like a lot of fun to make
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Coenus and smirnoff, you are both right! Somewhere farther down the line all of Season 2 will be available on Netflix, and working as an Executive Producer and writer on this second season was a lot of fun indeed!
Coenus, at some point I hope you will find the time to return to this thread to share what you will think of Season 2 -- good, bad, or indifferent -- and of the differences between the two seasons.
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Oh dear, am I the only person who actually enjoyed season one? I am not a medieval buff, my main interests lying before 900AD and after 1460AD, so I didn’t really notice the inaccuracies (bit like my lack of knowledge about tanks enabled me to enjoy the Battle of the Bulge more than my rivet counter friends). My one reservation was the lead actor, who was nowhere near as interesting as the King of France, the Pope or his best friend.
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Coenus and smirnoff, you are both right! Somewhere farther down the line all of Season 2 will be available on Netflix, and working as an Executive Producer and writer on this second season was a lot of fun indeed!
Coenus, at some point I hope you will find the time to return to this thread to share what you will think of Season 2 -- good, bad, or indifferent -- and of the differences between the two seasons.
If I remember to, I will! Shall wait for S2 to emerge on Netflix so that I can watch them right after each other.
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I watched the second season. I think that indeed it was better than the first one but still I have some criticisms (always constructive). I understand that the series wanted to keep going on a more adventurous-action style. Personally I think that the seventh episode was the best one and we got a glimpse of the real potential that series could have as a whole. A more political-dramatic direction closer to the actual events in the vein of The Accursed Kings novels.
I believe that the main problem was the scenario fall out from the first season. There were certain things set in motion that you could fix only if you totally reset everything script wise, something understandably impossible. Especially Prince Louis' arc could be so much better if the whole ''murdered mother'' plot line was dumped. I think there was potential to the character. I really didnt like the ''luciferians'' appearance. I mean it was something that looked as if it came out of Medieval Spawn comic. I would prefer something more subtle and believable. One thing that is a minor detail but really annoys me everytime its happening. Modern haircuts and styling. Whats with King Philip's hipster look?
On the good side, the fighting scenes are fun and the battles pretty decent for a tv production. I loved the fact that clearly somebody wanted to give Mark Hamil the respect that the new era Star Wars, denied him. He was great fun to watch and he looked having a good time doing this.
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I'll probably watch it just to support Mad Guru. lol
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@Leman: Absolutely nothing wrong with liking Season One, as much or more than Season Two! Sorry you weren't a bigger fan of our lead actor -- who is a very fine fellow and IMHO quite talented -- but hopefully you will like him more in Season Two, and the supporting cast you like is almost all back as well, plus some new talent you can evaluate and pass judgement on. After all, that's part of the fun of being the audience!
@Coenus Scaldingus: Binge watch it in its entirety on Netflix and I hope you enjoy from start to finish!
@Codsticker: Much appreciated my friend! If I see any of your figures, vehicles or terrain hereabouts in a competition setting, they have my vote!
@Captain Harlock: Glad you like Season Two, and appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts!
I agree that Episode 207 was one of, if not perhaps the, strongest of the season. Of course this was largely thanks to the highly-charged place it holds within the structure of the entire season.
Like you, some of my own favorite dynamics and moments from this season were the political ones. I think we actually have a good amount of that material scattered throughout the other episodes as well, with regard to aspects of French Royal policy and politics, early 14th Century church policy, internal debate on various issues within the Templar ranks, King Philip's relationship with Popes Boniface and then with Pope Clement (you probably noticed we skipped over Benedict IX entirely), the Tour de Nesle affair, the Royal debt, tensions between Nobles and Royal foot soldiers, the proper place of women at the Royal Court, etc. The potential Season Three which we developed and wrote the first portion of, leans more heavily into elements like those, as well as Anglo-French conflict in Gascony which will help lead to the Hundred Years War, and relations between the remaining Templars and the Hospitallers. We have room to do more of this since some of the story-lines we inherited from Season One are resolved by the end of Season Two. There is no guarantee a Season Three will come to pass, but the more people who watch Season Two, the better the chances will be, so thanks for watching Season Two before it shows up on Netflix! (if you wait to watch your viewership sadly will not count in the decision-making process on whether or not the show gets to survive.)
I hear you re: the Luciferians -- particularly their art direction/wardrobe -- but I love the story of the Templars' interaction with them, and how that story resolves itself, especially with regard to the hero, Landry.
I also hear you re: period inappropriate hair styles, but I would have to put that in the historical fiction vs. docudrama file. In the end it comes down to a question of the tastes of the creative powers-that-be, including various combinations of Network and Studio executives, the Showrunner, the hair-&-makeup artist, and the actor themselves. I completely understand that if a character's hair bothers you, it's really bad, since for obvious reasons, any time said character is in a scene, you can't escape it! So you have my sincere sympathy on that one.
On the good side, I'm glad you enjoyed the action scenes and Mark Hamil's respectable and fun presence.
I think I give us a higher overall grade on story-telling and character-development beyond pure "adventurous-action" than you do -- but I am far from an objective judge, and I am also the first to admit we crammed a goodly amount of Action-Adventure in there!
Since you singled out Mark Hamil for kind comments I will share with you that he was an absolute pleasure to work with. He came to the set every day with a purely positive attitude, filled with dedication and enthusiasm for the material and his colleagues in the cast and on the crew. He went out of his way to be as generous and helpful as possible to the entire company, something my partner and I and the other writers and producers on the show will always remember him very fondly for.
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The decision on season three seems a bit bonkers as my TV package doesn’t include the History Channel, so I see everything on Netflix.
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A decent number of shows available on Netflix begin life being aired on other broadcast and cable TV networks. When that's the case, the decision on whether or not a show lives on is usually made by the network where it originated.
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I really do hope you get a third season. After all the more history/fantasy dramas the better. I understand (or at least I imagine) that running such a show means dealing with many factors, people, conflicting interests and most of all budget decisions. By the way my favourite character was Tancrete for some reason and I liked much more the ''new'' recasted Isabella.
And maybe one day, someone, will discover how interesting and bad ass the eastern roman empire was and will create a series set in it. :D
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Netflix took on Lucifer after it was dropped by Prime, so a precedent has been set for a Netflix adoption of a series. I remember how disappointed many of my friends and I were when the network cancelled Firefly, yet something not particularly special, like Burn Notice, gets series after series. Puzzling.
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Netflix took on Lucifer after it was dropped by Prime, so a precedent has been set for a Netflix adoption of a series. I remember how disappointed many of my friends and I were when the network cancelled Firefly, yet something not particularly special, like Burn Notice, gets series after series. Puzzling.
The Expanse was almost canceled and it was picked up by Amazon only because Bezos took a personal interest in it. We are talking about the best sci fi series of our times hands down and could run for several more seasons. Sometimes its really hard to understand the way show biz executives think. Its like having a reversed Mida's touch non-superpower. They touch gold and turn it to shit.
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I really enjoyed season 1 of Knightfall so I'm looking forward to season 2. We just can't have enough decent historical drama.
I liked both the characters and plot of Knightfall series1 and found it entertaining. It's much better than the rubbish never-ending soap operas and reality tv shows which dominate UK terrestial TV.
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@bong-67: Glad you liked Season One, and I hope you enjoy Season Two!
@Captain Harlock: Casting is a very subjective thing, but I'm happy to hear you liked the new Princess Isabella from Season 2. One thing I left out from my brief sketch of the potential Season 3 is a new plot-thread set in England, involving Isabella's personal and political life with Edward II, and their interaction with her brother the King of France.
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(https://cdn1us.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeekus/files/styles/main_wide/public/2019/05/knightfall-season-3.jpg?itok=qnRvusRN)
The second season of History's (formerly known as The History Channel) KNIGHTFALL is now available for viewing on NETFLIX, I believe worldwide.
I worked as an Executive Producer on this second season and wrote 2 episodes with my writing/producing partner -- but even if that was not the case, I would be here promoting it to you, my fellow Medieval wargamers.
"Why" you ask"??
Well…
Because it is dark and gritty, and though it takes some liberties with the early 14th Century historical record, still makes an effort to give an accurate impression of the era, and IMHO features some excellent production design and great performances.
If you add up all 8 episodes of Season Two, they total just under 6 hours of Medieval story-telling (with no dragons or orc, elves or wizards in sight -- not that there's anything wrong with that) filled with an abundance of early 14th Century MEDIEVAL GOODNESS, including but not limited to:
-Heroically doomed Templars
-Cursed French Royals
-Bloodthirsty Luciferian heretics
-High Medieval military training
-Flashbacks to the persecution of Cathars in the Occitane
-Nobly decaying Leper Knights of Saint Lazarus (when's the last time you saw those dudes on the small -- or big -- screen???)
-Palace intrigue
-Curia intrigue
-Pope Boniface VIII and the Slap of Anagni
-Skirmishes galore
-The rise of the French Royal army
-The rise of Isabella the "She Wolf" of France
-The fall of Margaret of Burgundy in the Tour de Nesle Affair
-A full-blown siege
-Multiple burnings at the stake
I ask you my fellow Medieval history enthusiasts: what's not to like???***
Tune in (to Netflix) and enjoy!***
***If it turns out there is stuff not to like and/or you tune in and do not enjoy... no harm, no foul. And should we ever find ourselves playing in a wargame together, Medieval or otherwise, I will try to make it up to you.
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In case any UK-based LAFers are interested, Season 2 of KNIGHTFALL will be premiering on History UK on Tuesday July 2nd at 9:00pm.
Hi MG, it's been a while ;) . That might explain why it's not on Netflix UK.
Do you happen to know if it's scheduled to be on Netflix UK?
I watched the first series and it wasn't too bad though I did have to suspend belief on many occasions. Even though I understand it for the average viewer one of my pet hates for TV/film of the medieval era is when they have one army dressed entirely one way the entirely another way! It just drives me nuts but I'm happy to say that I can (kind of) put it to one side if the narrative is OK.
Knightfall is 100% better then that awful Last Knights which I just cannot watch at all.
Kind Regards
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Darrell,
Great to hear from you and to see you out and about the hobby related inter-webs!
On the other hand, it's a serious bummer for me to hear that KnightFall is in fact NOT as of yet available on Netflix.UK -- the friend who told me it was available internationally is located in India, and I wrongly assumed that Netflix brought new material out on the many and varied different markets outside the US at the same time. Stupid assumption on my part, no doubt driven by wishful thinking. My sincere apologies to you and any other UK LAFers whose expectations I mistakenly raised. I've tried to track down specifics on when it will become available in the UK, but so far I haven't been able to get an answer.
Glad to hear you enjoyed Season One, at least for the most part. As I repeat incessantly, I had nothing to do with it, so have no claim whatsoever to any credit for it. I hear you RE: your issue with "Medieval" armies dressing in perfectly uniform "uniforms." In Season 2 we tried to ride that line, with the Royal Household troops of France wearing slight variations on the same "uniform," and Templar Brothers and Sergeants doing the same. We impressed on the wardrobe and props departments that the more variation the better. I'm curious to hear what you think of Season Two when and if you get to see it, and hope it at least lives up to your "not too bad" judgement of Season One, and hopefully exceeds it -- even if just slightly!
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Darrell,
Great to hear from you and to see you out and about the hobby related inter-webs!
Thanks MG, 'tis good to be back :)
On the other hand, it's a serious bummer for me to hear that KnightFall is in fact NOT as of yet available on Netflix.UK -- the friend who told me it was available internationally is located in India, and I wrongly assumed that Netflix brought new material out on the many and varied different markets outside the US at the same time. Stupid assumption on my part, no doubt driven by wishful thinking.
Not stupid at all as most of the Netflix stuff makes it onto the UK site. It's probably just a matter of time, they will need to weigh up the pros ans cons of releasing at a certain date. I've done some serious binging on the first series, not to mention shows like Stranger Things, that offer an amazing emotional, humerous and somewhat historically explicit ride through the eighties! lol
My sincere apologies to you and any other UK LAFers whose expectations I mistakenly raised. I've tried to track down specifics on when it will become available in the UK, but so far I haven't been able to get an answer.
Glad to hear you enjoyed Season One, at least for the most part. As I repeat incessantly, I had nothing to do with it, so have no claim whatsoever to any credit for it. I hear you RE: your issue with "Medieval" armies dressing in perfectly uniform "uniforms." In Season 2 we tried to ride that line, with the Royal Household troops of France wearing slight variations on the same "uniform," and Templar Brothers and Sergeants doing the same. We impressed on the wardrobe and props departments that the more variation the better. I'm curious to hear what you think of Season Two when and if you get to see it, and hope it at least lives up to your "not too bad" judgement of Season One, and hopefully exceeds it -- even if just slightly!
It's inevitable as it would be a night mare knowing who was who in a battlefield situation if you had an untrained eye. It's a factor that, over time and watching many series, movies etc has driven me less insane lol . Having said that, I will can't get over the 'Welsh' shields in The Last Kingdom with the holes in the middle!! :? I doubt that I ever will lol lol lol
Now, I think I'll pop over to your blog and take a look to see how's the NWF treating you these days lol
Kind Regards
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Vikings has to be one of the worst offenders in the ‘lets give each army a specific uniform’ category. Each Saxon kingdom has a monopoly on helmet design, with the men of Wessex wearing C16th burgonets :o. Who knew they had gone out of fashion between 1066 and 1500? Different shield shapes per kingdom and different armour styles per kingdom as well. The Vikings are the best though with not a shirt of mail or helmet between them!
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Vikings has to be one of the worst offenders in the ‘lets give each army a specific uniform’ category. Each Saxon kingdom has a monopoly on helmet design, with the men of Wessex wearing C16th burgonets :o. Who knew they had gone out of fashion between 1066 and 1500? Different shield shapes per kingdom and different armour styles per kingdom as well. The Vikings are the best though with not a shirt of mail or helmet between them!
I think that Last Kingdom must be even worse in that department. And the irony is that Bernard Cornwall might not be the best book writer but he tends to present a quite accurate image of the historical timeframe that his tales are taking place in. All those hideous wardrobe and arms choices are made by the tv serial production team.
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I think that Last Kingdom must be even worse in that department. And the irony is that Bernard Cornwall might not be the best book writer but he tends to present a quite accurate image of the historical timeframe that his tales are taking place in. All those hideous wardrobe and arms choices are made by the tv serial production team.
Yep! :)
It's a bit of a mess.....
KR
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With a moniker like that you should know!
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Hi
Series 1 showing on Sundays at 10pm on Blaze, I’m watching it now.
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Recording and watching Series 2 on free to air in Oz.
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There is a tradition in British TV that all sorts of new programmes are aired at the start of Autumn. I imagine the Netflix people have done their research.
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Ethan
Watched season two a few weeks back this series had a much better feel to it than season one.
Well done your historical background has obviously influenced the direction the second series has taken albeit the wagon mounted ballista did make me wince a wee bit.
Looking forward to season three ? there's a good story in there as the Templars disperse across the continent rumour has it a contingent made their way to Scotland.
Even better renegade Templar Roger De Flors story is crying out to be told!
Willie
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Willie!!!! Great to hear from you my friend! Your comments are KILLING ME right now -- in a good way, mostly! I can't say much (at least not yet) except to tell you that we actually SHOT THE INTRO OF ROGER DE FLOR AT SEA as part of a tacked-on ending which the powers-that-be wanted to add to the season finale... but which they then decided against, and so was left on the cutting-room floor.
On a more purely positive note, I'm glad you seem to have enjoyed Season Two overall, and to have seen it as being a bit more historically inclined than its predecessor, and appreciate you letting me know, even more so for having done so in public! RE: the wagon mounted ballista...
Are you not familiar with the carroballistas of both ancient Roman and 16th Century Europa, which bracket the period in question???
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/046_Conrad_Cichorius%2C_Die_Reliefs_der_Traianssäule%2C_Tafel_XLVI_%28Ausschnitt_01%29.jpg)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f7/Ballista-quadrirotis.jpeg/2560px-Ballista-quadrirotis.jpeg)
I jest, but only slightly! But I also hear you and empathize with your wincing. I only hope we can discuss further over scotch whiskey or cold American beer the next time we are lucky enough to meet in person!
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I watched series 1 and when I managed to suspend my disbelief it was not a bad medieval romp, more 'Soapie with Swords' than any serious attempt to depict history. But so be it. Any story that tries to depict the Grail as a magical artefact is doomed from the start :)
I will watch Season 2 when it comes out, and if what you are telling me is correct, then I expect to be pleasantly surprised.
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Hi Ethan,
I had quite forgot about carroballistas but now you have reminded me I must get some haha.
I'm sure the Templars would have tapped into ancient writings/drawings on their travels and added this to their arsenal.
Likewise hope to meet at some point in the future it would be great to discuss over a drink!
Best wishes
Willie
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Very enjoyable to watch! I am going to watch episode 5 in a couple of minutes. ;-)
Question: The uniformity of the french army i.e in episode 4. Is it artistic freedom or did the royal french army had such uniformity at that time?
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Thanks Tonhel, and very glad to hear you're enjoying Season Two! RE: your good question, the truth is there really wasn't a full-time Royal French Army yet in the early 14th Century, but in Ep 4, the numbers involved in the fight against the few Templars and Lazarus Knights could be covered by the King's own Royal Household troops, who would have had a somewhat uniform appearance. When you get to Ep 6, there is a larger number or troops on the Royal side. At that point I must admit King Philip's army has more "uniformity" in appearance than I believe it would have c.1307-1314.
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Hey Mad Guru, as a man in the showbiz trade, do you think that there would be an interest for a period drama with an eastern roman theme? I mean from the point of view of a production studio.
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Hey Captain Harlock!
The short answer is: no.
I will also give you my long answer, which though fraught with peril, will at least be less negative...
From my perspective here in the Los Angeles-based American film & TV industry, there is no particular interest in a movie or TV project with a Byzantine setting, be it ancient or medieval. BUT nor is there any particular feeling against such a project, other than the fact that it's an obscure historical period unknown to most of the potential audience. This counts as a strike against such a project but not an absolute veto.
I know of one big-budget movie project with an Eastern Roman setting that a Hollywood studio spent money on, but it never got beyond the screenplay phase. There is an order of magnitude difference between the money spent on screenwriters and screenplays and the money spent on turning a handful of those screenplays into actual movies. Same as other businesses, movie studios and TV networks take far more risk at the "R&D" phase than when it comes time to pay for manufacturing and then marketing finished products. So even though a big studio spent real money to buy that Eastern Roman themed screenplay, in the end they could not convince themselves it was worth it to spend vastly more money turning it into an actual movie.
As a working screenwriter and TV show creator who's always been obsessed with history, I've sold several historical movies and TV shows that never made it into production. A few years ago my partner and I sold a historical Dracula TV series to the History Channel (set at the tail end of Eastern Rome). We were paid to write the pilot and do some development of how the series would proceed, but unfortunately that project never went into production.
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A few years ago my partner and I sold a historical Dracula TV series to the History Channel (set at the tail end of "Eastern Rome") and were paid to write the pilot and do some development of how the series would proceed, but unfortunately that project never went into production.
Damn! If the story was told with any degree of accuracy about Vlad III Dracula then it would be much more bloody then any Dracula movie I've seen!!
Very interesting too in many ways as his whole life was pretty much a struggle in one way or another.
Kind Regards
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Hey Captain Harlock!
The short answer is: no.
I will also give you my long answer, which though fraught with peril, will at least be less negative...
From my perspective here in the Los Angeles-based American film & TV industry, there is no particular interest in a movie or TV project with a Byzantine setting, be it ancient or medieval. BUT nor is there any particular feeling against such a project, other than the fact that it's an obscure historical period unknown to most of the potential audience. This counts as a strike against such a project but not an absolute veto.
I know of one big-budget movie project with an Eastern Roman setting that a Hollywood studio spent money on, but it never got beyond the screenplay phase. There is an order of magnitude difference between the money spent on screenwriters and screenplays and the money spent on turning a handful of those screenplays into actual movies. Same as other businesses, movie studios and TV networks take far more risk at the "R&D" phase than when it comes time to pay for manufacturing and then marketing finished products. So even though a big studio spent real money to buy that Eastern Roman themed screenplay, in the end they could not convince themselves it was worth it to spend vastly more money turning it into an actual movie.
As a working screenwriter and TV show creator who's always been obsessed with history, I've sold several historical movies and TV shows that never made it into production. A few years ago my partner and I sold a historical Dracula TV series to the History Channel (set at the tail end of Eastern Rome). We were paid to write the pilot and do some development of how the series would proceed, but unfortunately that project never went into production.
Thanks for the answer!
I was afraid of that. I understand the reasoning, but I also think that its most unfortunate.
There are so many tales to be told. I mean we are talking about the grecoroman world surviving 1000 years more than the fall of the western part. Constantinople is the original Gondor, the original Melnibone. Endless political schemming, love stories, murders, battles. Its has everything.
And lets not forget. VIKINGS!!!! Vikings and greco-romans how insanelly cool is that? I mean just imagine a series that will introduce the western audience to the insanity of the Roman court via the pov of a young Varangian. Battles from Italy to Mesopotamia against completely different foes and cultures.
Granted Im Greek and I can get over excited over this lol, but I really do believe that ERE is a scenario treasure chest waiting to be opened.
There was a russian movie called Viking. Its about Vladimir the Great. Granted it is plagued by the usual problems of these Putin Extravaganzas as I call those russian hollywoodesque movies, but I liked the costumes and most of the cinematography. Most importantly at a point the imperial dromons arrive! Tears of joy :'( lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsYsfi5_kpY
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It has taken quite some time for the season to make it to German Netflix. I had high hopes for it because I did not hate season 1, despite the various issues with it, it has Mark Hamill and Mad Guru gave me hope that some of those problematic issues had been addressed.
My wife and I are only a few episodes in but so far whilst Mark Hamill is a joy to watch the problematic issues continue. I am much more familiar with Templar history and their Rule than my wife, so she misses many issues... but we are both costumers from our re-enacting and larping days so some things just have us sadly shaking our heads.
I grasp that it is not a documentary but I do not understand why there are so many deviations from such well documented historical references that are available for Templar appearance and culture. My wife commented during the show that to her it looked like the Poor Fellow Soldiers of Christ and the Temple of Solomon had been recruiting a lot of Vikings and Roharrim. Whilst I liked visual story telling of Mark Hamill’s character Brother Talus having a Vitus, I am unsure of a historical precedent for that. I would be curious for a source on that and on an initiate training position in general. It has been two decades since I did any serious research on the Templars.
We keep hoping the show will improve but I am not as optimistic as my wife.
As for Constantinople and the ERE... I completely agree with you Mad Guru. A virtually untapped source of so much potential. That said, I am not sure how production friendly Istanbul is these days unless you want to film the Fall of Constantinople from the Ottoman perspective.
I would also love to see a series address the Knights of Malta during the Great Siege of Malta in 1565. Malta has been very accommodating of tv productions in the past and should be keen for revenue given the current international medical situation.
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Well, we finally got through all of Season 2. It is telling that it took us this long to get through it.
As I wrote on my blog…
“We also finally finished season 2 of Knightfall. Such a disappointment.
I mean it was cool to see Mark Hamill play a Templar more like how I pictured an old Luke Skywalker than what he played in the recent movies but there were so many unnecessary historical inaccuracies that it actually made me angry watching it. There is such good documentation available and the recorded history is interesting enough there is no need to “spice it up” in my opinion. With the costuming and set design, clearly much love, effort and money went into it but it runs so contrary to historical evidence that it is painful for me to watch.”
Season 2 was better than Season 1. The acting, writing and directing was overall better. However, the final few episodes of Season 2 started getting choppy, trying to do do much with too little time… a bit Game of Thrones like. The conclusion felt unresolved.
Is there going to be a third season.