Lead Adventure Forum
General => Announcements and forum stuff => Events and Conventions => Topic started by: Sterling Moose on March 07, 2019, 02:52:37 AM
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Ok, a month out so it's time for the perennial question.
Who is going to Salute? What's on your shopping list this year?
Usual meet up to say 'Hi' to fellow LAFers? Oshiro stand at 1pm?
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TB04 near the entrance if you do :D
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Will be there and have a look at some more cruel seas boats and other stuff
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I'll be there bright and early. I've ordered Mysorean Sepoys and Renaissance civilians from Eureka. I'll probably grab a few more Oathmark Dwarves as well.
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I'll be there. Saying hello to James' and picking up the new Gothic minis from his stand, also saying hello to Nick at the Oshiro Gothic Horror game table and generally wandering around, randomly and haphazardly over spending. As I've not previously met any fellow LAFers I'll aim to be back at James' stand for 1.00 p.m. Hope to see/meet a bunch of you soon.
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I'll be there as always on the Ainsty stand. Unfortunately towards the other end of hall from James so the chances of making the meet up are non-existent :(
Feel free to say 'hello' though and apologies in advance if I'm too busy to chat.
I'll probably grab a few more Oathmark Dwarves as well.
Which, perchance, we stock ;)
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I am taking two of my daughters who have never been. One of them is looking for dragons. She is very fussy about what sort of dragons she likes. I have no plans to buy anything for myself at the moment! That can change. ;)
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I'm planning to go as a punter this year. Haven't got a ticket yet and haven't thought about my shopping list either...
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I will be there for the first time, together with 2 friends.
Is it better to order the tickets online or pay when entering?
Will there be any limitation on acccess?
thanks Thomas
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I'll be there, traveling from the US to help run the Fistful of Lead:Tales of Horror games across from the Oshiro table. Say hi, and try out the rules.
-J
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I will be there for the first time, together with 2 friends.
Is it better to order the tickets online or pay when entering?
Will there be any limitation on acccess?
thanks Thomas
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Whoops, don't know what happened there. What I was trying to say was:
Hi Thomas, I've only been once before but I think I'm correct in saying its £10.00 per head for tickets in advance or £20.00 cash only on the door. Not aware of the capacity but there didn't appear any issues with entry when I was there last. Whichever way I'm sue you'll enjoy it, all the best, Joe
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I actually have a game under (mostly) my own steam for the first time, so I'm certainly in. GM18 when you finish your shopping!
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I don't know, but it seems to me that £20 on the door is extortionate for a show.. what makes Salute 4-5 times better than most other shows?
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I don't know, but it seems to me that £20 on the door is extortionate for a show.. what makes Salute 4-5 times better than most other shows?
Nothing. They just really really rather you paid online ahead of time.
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I don't know, but it seems to me that £20 on the door is extortionate for a show.. what makes Salute 4-5 times better than most other shows?
its significantly larger than other shows and as for the cost it is in London - enough said
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I don't know, but it seems to me that £20 on the door is extortionate for a show.. what makes Salute 4-5 times better than most other shows?
As has already been said, it’s cheaper to buy online in advance. In fact significantly cheaper at £10 rather than £20. I would suggest that the intent is to disincentivise ‘on the door’ purchases, presumably to better manage the event budget, aim to improve entry times (though I believe that in some years the relatively few cash payers have got in quicker), and avoid cash handling charges and associated security risks, etc. :)
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Sally 4th will be attending Salute on Saturday 6th April
We will be bringing the following lines with us:
• Sally 4th Classic Movie Miniatures
• Albedo Miniatures 28mm Anthropomorphic Sci-Fi Miniatures, vehicles and ‘Critter Conversion Kits’.
• Terra-Former – Terrain tile making kits
• Terra-Blocks including Exotic Locations, Starter Sets, Tomb, Dungeon, Fothrington Hall, Shopping Mall
• 28mm Photo-realistic Normandy and Modern British Range
• Clear Bases
• Really Useful Box Inserts & Warchests – Figure Storage and Display
• Combat Patrol – WW2 Skirmish Rules
• Pulp Alley – Pulp Adventure rules, scenario books, cards and accessories
• Statuesque Miniatures Pulp Alley Figures and spare heads and weapon packs.
• Sloppy Jalopy Interwar and Cold War Vehicles & Miniatures
• Otherworld Miniatures
• Pulp Figures
• Lucid Eye Savage Worlds / Ice Age / Plot Device / Red Book of the Elf King / Toons
If you would like to pre-order anything from these ranges (or indeed any of the other products we manufacture or distribute), to collect at either show, we have set up ‘Collect at Salute’ as a ‘free postage’ option to use when you check out. Many of these ranges are very popular at shows, so although we will have a good stock of them at the start of the day, we would advise pre-ordering to avoid disappointment.
Sally 4th is the official show stockist for Lucid Eye. We will have their complete product range with us.
Ann & I look forward to seeing you at the show.
Check out our full range at www.sally4th.co.uk
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Sally 4th will be attending Salute on Saturday 6th April
I can already feel my wallet groaning ;) ;)
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Sally 4th will be attending Salute on Saturday 6th April
Sign me up for some Suburbanauts.
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We will have plenty of Suburbanauts (and everything else), but our advice is always to pre-order at Salute to ensure some one else does not snaffle the stock you were after before you get there!
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I'll be there, helping run a game and working a stand as part of the Gaming a Crusader Castle project. Come by and say hi! It's GG10 for the game and TG06, right across the aisle, for the Supreme Littleness / University of Edinburgh stand.
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I'm going, and child free this year! I can play demos again. Yay!
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It’s my own fault - I should have checked - i let my good wife book a holiday and yes it clashes with Salute - so for the sake of marital harmony I will not be attending this years show!!! :(
Have fun everybody - plenty of photos please
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We shall be there.
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and this what we will be gaming
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Great to hear Crisis is going ahead.
We had not got an invite yet, so thought it might not be going ahead due to Brexit.
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I'll be there, traveling from the US to help run the Fistful of Lead:Tales of Horror games across from the Oshiro table. Say hi, and try out the rules.
-J
I'll be there with Jaye promoting both a Fistful of Lead - Tales of Horror, my new Highgate Miniatures range and the fine terrain from Oshiro Model terrain at the participation game "Horror in Limehouse" table GA06.
You'll be able to spot us easily enough we will be sporting luxurious facial hair and tasselled smoking caps ;) :D
All the Fistful of lead rulesets, and Highgate Miniatures will be available from Oshiro Model terrain stand TBo4.
Come and say hello!
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I'll be there with Jaye promoting both a Fistful of Lead - Tales of Horror, my new Highgate Miniatures range and the fine terrain from Oshiro Model terrain at the participation game "Horror in Limehouse" table GA06.
You'll be able to spot us easily enough we will be sporting luxurious facial hair and tasselled smoking caps ;) :D
All the Fistful of lead rulesets, and Highgate Miniatures will be available from Oshiro Model terrain stand TBo4.
Come and say hello!
I think if I was a trader I would want to wait to see how hard it would be to bring stock into the EU in November, and what documentation would be required.
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I think if I was a trader I would want to wait to see how hard it would be to bring stock into the EU in November, and what documentation would be required.
Eh?
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Eh?
This assumes a UK trader going to Crisis in Belgium post Brexit. What additional documentation will be required, who do you pay vat to, will there be tariffs etc..
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This assumes a UK trader going to Crisis in Belgium post Brexit. What additional documentation will be required, who do you pay vat to, will there be tariffs etc..
Oh no, not Brexit talk, I get enough of it in the news, in the papers, in the pub everywhere, please not here! ;) lol
Besides we're not attending Crisis in November, I was talking about Salute. ;)
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Oh no, not Brexit talk, I get enough of it in the news, in the papers, in the pub everywhere, please not here! ;) lol
Besides we're not attending Crisis in November, I was talking about Salute. ;)
Apologies, I meant to reply to Chris.
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Apologies, I meant to reply to Chris.
Ok, no worries. :)
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Sorry, just replying to Johan who posted his Crisis advert on the Salute thread.
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I have to report that I was a little underwhelmed with Salute. Very few inspirational games - Ged’s Game was a worthy winner, but there wasn’t much competition to be honest.
I found it too much of a weird fantasy convention - some of the stands, I thought nice figures but what the hell is that about. Lots seem to be kickstarters. Far too many 2x2 games, that didn’t entice me to play, in fact I had no idea what they were.
Painting competition was a good standard, but just one case of historical miniatures against 5 sci-fi/fantasy - come on people, don’t force me to enter my own mediocre stuff just to make up numbers!
Having said all that, I did pick up a lot of figures, got to see some figures ‘in the flesh’ so will order more, and met a lot of people i hadn’t seen for a while, so not all bad. I must remember to pre-order stuff next year - I will go again.
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I was sick as a do, still not improved today, had aircraft tickets and express entry also, devestated I could not be there.
matt
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Poor show with only a few good games to inspire surronded by a sea of mediocrity.
Fantasy dominates traders except plastic box sets that can be bought anywhere . Hardly any historical metal manufactures.
Warlords have a responsibility to set standards but as many of their own members stuff is shabby , put together in minutes we haven't got a chance of any improvement.
Sad that so many friends feel the same and can't be bothered to make the effort to go anymore.
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Very few inspirational games - Ged’s Game was a worthy winner, but there wasn’t much competition to be honest.
Your own subjective opinion is of course subjectively true, but I find that statement incredibly belittling and mean spirited. If you aren't inspired then maybe you should get involved and show those of us who are putting these games on (at enormous cost and no material reward) what we're doing wrong.
I found it too much of a weird fantasy convention - some of the stands, I thought nice figures but what the hell is that about.
This old refrain? You complain you aren't inspired but can't be bothered to follow up and actually find out what the hell X is about?
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Please keep it civil. Whether one agrees or not with views expressed by other members, there’s no need to raise the temperature. Thanks.
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Personally I'd give my left one to attend any British show or European one for that matter.
Be grateful you have these amazing events to attend at all.
Now bring on the photos please!!!
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Your own subjective opinion is of course subjectively true, but I find that statement incredibly belittling and mean spirited. If you aren't inspired then maybe you should get involved and show those of us who are putting these games on (at enormous cost and no material reward) what we're doing wrong.
This old refrain? You complain you aren't inspired but can't be bothered to follow up and actually find out what the hell X is about?
I have been involved with games that have won awards at the show . Time , great cost and an unbelievable effort. You recieve a £5 quid trophy for a years work, so we realise the pain .
What we see is countless poor offerings that should be culled from the show as itsa a spectacle.
The show should be a showcase, inspirational and reward the paying public.
It does not deliver.
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I have been involved with games that have won awards at the show . Time , great cost and an unbelievable effort. You recieve a £5 quid trophy for a years work, so we realise the pain .
What we see is countless poor offerings that should be culled from the show as itsa a spectacle.
The show should be a showcase, inspirational and reward the paying public.
It does not deliver.
And yet a couple of years ago people were complaining that games should be representative of the majority of the hobby and not the elite who can afford to lay on spectacular games.
As one of those who assisted with presenting a non historical game I am so sorry you didn’t enjoy the show or felt our game was not worthy of your attention. Mind you I’m not sure where it says historical games only in the show guide....
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Personally I'd give my left one to attend any British show or European one for that matter.
Be grateful you have these amazing events to attend at all.
Now bring on the photos please!!!
Well said Frank, would love to have seen you there. ;) :)
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I got on a plane at 07.00, followed by a train and a couple of tubes, spent 3 hours at the show, popped off to The Imperial War Museum for a couple of hours and then did the reverse journey home where I arrived back at 21.00.
I enjoyed the show. I'm not a Historical wargamer - to be quite honest, I'm not really a wargamer at all, although I'm working on rectifying that. I collect mini's, some of which I paint, badly, I scratchbuild and convert scenery and vehicles and love seeing the skill, effort and imagination that others put into their builds and games in pretty much any genre.
I loved Nick and James' board and game, and thought that there were many other inspiring and effort filled participation and exhibition games around the show.
A great day out for me, hope the majority of attendees thought so too.
GDonk, Guernsey
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captain blood - I don't normally 'contribute' this kind of content, but waitwhat's comments seemed reasonable (I was thinking the same) and all he said was 'bothered'.
key point: there's a luminary on this board (used to be a mod, not sure if he still is) who I've seen using the 'f' word more than once in a thread in a totally unnecessary and aggressive manner - and that's just in the few posts of his I've seen.
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Forum rule 1.5
(And the cardinal rule of this forum since day 1)
The Lead Adventure Forum Rules of Use
1.5 Swearing and other strong language.
Basically, nothing beats a decent bout of swearing, which most wargamers will be used to considering the way the dice roll, and we all know Lady Luck is a fickle b***h. I personally do not care about it, and most others don’t, either.
You are not allowed, under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, to use swear-words or slurs when addressing a fellow user!
You may use such in a theoretical or “general” context, but NEVER to attack someone personally.
In other words, there's no LAF rule against swearing in general. But there is a rule against using language aggressively directly against another member.
Calling someone mean-spirited and saying they 'can't be bothered' is out of line with that. Fine to disagree, but not with aggression against another user. Thanks.
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Forum rule 1.5
(And the cardinal rule of this forum since day 1)
In other words, there's no LAF rule against swearing in general. But there is a rule against using language aggressively directly against another member.
Calling someone mean-spirited and saying they 'can't be bothered' is out of line with that. Fine to disagree, but not with aggression against another user. Thanks.
I didn't want to get drawn into this but...
I don't see how demeaning game producers as "a sea of mediocrity" or "[not] much competition" is anything but a slur, and further I'll note that i didn't accuse the person of being mean-spirited, I accused the statement - because it is. If the games are allowed to be slandered but not defended then I think the forum rules need to be revised.
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I was sick as a do, still not improved today, had aircraft tickets and express entry also, devestated I could not be there.
matt
There aren't 'express entry' tickets anymore. Hasn't been for several years in fact... ;)
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I'm going to chime in here too.
I feel that Wait, What's response was far less aggressive to the original instigator and yet he is getting berated and not the other.
I feel that stepping in too soon in this situation may have amplified a perfectly adult conversation into one where suggestions of aggression were being made where they hadn't been before.
As it is though, the facts are the facts. There were as many historical games as there were fantasy and sci fi. South London Warlords do their best to try and balance this every year hence not everyone gets to put on a game.
As part of a group of gamers from around the world, we were two tables in a run of four participation games. One sci fi, two modern and one fantasy. Every one of those tables was superb. One won an award for being the most innovative. It happened to be 3x2 I believe.
I still see the seas of historical manufacturers, many big players in their markets. Gripping Beast, Perry, Warlord, Foundry etc. All were there plus the many, many others.
Every year Salute gets the same response, from the same vocal minority and yet despite the South London Warlords themselves pointing to the balance they persist.
I do feel some folks will not be happy with a show until it is full of the things they would prefer to see. In reality it needs to be balanced. I suspect they don't get as much say over companies. I mean lets say a show has 200 trader spaces and gets 130 scifi/fantasy traders apply and 70 historical, do they turn down 60 traders to please the few folks that are militant towards the other? No, that way leads to no show.
Outside of that, perhaps it is the modern market. Perhaps in general, the traders attending are the ones that can afford to and ergo are currently those in the better financial position due to popularity to do so?
I do believe that the criticism is vastly unfair, hugely disrespectful of the efforts the South London Warlords put into it and at it's core, disrespectful of the hobby.
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I had no.intention to belittle or offend, so my apologies if I did.
I have come away from many Salutes hugely inspired, on this occasion I did not. I have been involved in running several games at previous salutes and I have been a trader so I have some understanding of what is involved.
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@mcfonz: The forum has rules. One of the rules is that you don't direct insults at fellow members even if you don't agree with them. That's it. I know you have your own views about moderation here being too heavy-handed. You've told me before. But as a moderator here, my experience is that once people start using terms like 'mean-spirited', 'can't be bothered' and 'why don't you show us what we're doing wrong', all that happens is it degenerates into flaming and anything but a perfectly adult conversation. So please let's just keep it civil towards each other, per the original request. Thanks :)
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@mcfonz: The forum has rules. One of the rules is that you don't direct insults at fellow members even if you don't agree with them. That's it. I know you have your own views about moderation here being too heavy-handed. You've told me before. But as a moderator here, my experience is that once people start using terms like 'mean-spirited', 'can't be bothered' and 'why don't you show us what we're doing wrong', all that happens is it degenerates into flaming and anything but a perfectly adult conversation. So please let's just keep it civil towards each other, per the original request. Thanks :)
You say "start" but it was a response. Explain to me why it's ok to say things like "sea of mediocrity" and then this is at an end.
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As I said to you in a pm a little while ago, criticising a wargames show isn’t against the forum rules, even if you find those opinions or how they’re expressed out of order.
Being directly insulting to a fellow member is against the rules.
He made a general comment about the show. You made personal comments about him. That’s the difference.
If he’d used aggressive phrases towards you personally, I’d be saying exactly the same to him.
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Apart from he wasn't.
Whatever is in the past is in the past.
But the 'show' wasn't insulted. The people that put on games were... There are several people amongst the LAF community who put on games, so this becomes a blanket insult to all of their efforts...
That's what is being pointed out here. And a stance I happen to agree with. After all, the show doesn't put all of the games on. It merely provides the space for games.
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I had no.intention to belittle or offend, so my apologies if I did.
I have come away from many Salutes hugely inspired, on this occasion I did not. I have been involved in running several games at previous salutes and I have been a trader so I have some understanding of what is involved.
Accepted.
I would kindly challenge your view of what the show is for though. To create a truly 'wowing' table it either takes thinking out of the box like the Scarif table last year, a lot of money or both. But I don't believe it's a club, group or society's job to wow anyone. The most important thing about any show is that it is a celebration of our hobby, has a positive atmosphere and engages with the regular punters.
After all, most of those putting on games are just punters with extra responsibilities.
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I enjoyed SALUTE and I took two of my daughters (16 and 12) for their first wargames show and they had a great time too. I go most years and the games vary from year to year. Last year many of the games on display were absolutely spectacular so it would be hard to match that kind of visual standard every year.
I agree with mcfonz about a show being a celebration of our hobby first and foremost.
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As I said to you in a pm a little while ago, criticising a wargames show isn’t against the forum rules, even if you find those opinions or how they’re expressed out of order.
Being directly insulting to a fellow member is against the rules.
He made a general comment about the show. You made personal comments about him. That’s the difference.
If he’d used aggressive phrases towards you personally, I’d be saying exactly the same to him.
I understand the rules. I profoundly disagree with your interpretation of what has happened here. I am personally offended at the aggressive phrases directed at the games provided because I was one of the providers.
It is intolerable to me that it is acceptable to criticise a group of people, but unacceptable to criticise an individual in defence of the group. If those are the rules, then the rules are inadequate. If I am in the wrong then I want no part of being in the "right". As such, I'm done with LAF.
I hope you can find a way to improve on your rules and your community.
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I found it too much of a weird fantasy convention - some of the stands, I thought nice figures but what the hell is that about. Lots seem to be kickstarters. Far too many 2x2 games, that didn’t entice me to play, in fact I had no idea what they were.
Inspired by another thread on another forum, I’ve just crunched the numbers from the games listed in the show programme. The programme gives them the following headings: Historic, Fantasy, Sci-Fi and alt-History, along with undefined (reenactors, etc)
According to SLW’s list (some of these may have pulled out, but were in the list):
Historical: 47
Fantasy: 14
Sc-Fi: 22
Alt-History: 13
Undefined: 2
So, the numbers show that there was quite a lot more historical than both sci-fi and fantasy put together. It balances out if you include the alt-history with the latter. Not entirely sure what this proves though… 😀
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As such, I'm done with LAF.
That would be a real shame and would achieve nothing. Just my view, Joe
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I think Salute is always going to draw flak from all quarters because of it's perceived pre-eminance among UK shows. Too much/not enough fantasy... too many 'big games beyond the reach of 'ordinary' gamers/too many club type games, Excel is great/Excel is terrible etc.
I thought yesterday's Salute was a very good show. There were a lot of traders selling fantasy/SF stuff but it hardly seems fair to criticise them for following the market and I suspect that emphasis may also explain why there seems to be a lot more younger people and women at Salute than at other shows. The small 2' x 2' games that were quite common do lack the wow factor of a big game but they all seemed to be busy with people playing and presumably having fun. I did think it seemed a little bit lacking in the big spectacular games although there were some notable examples of this.
There are photos and more thoughts on my blog... https://wargaminggallimaufry.blogspot.com/2019/04/salute-19.html (https://wargaminggallimaufry.blogspot.com/2019/04/salute-19.html)
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Thanks for providing photos @alastair!
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@Nick - one day I hope mate!
@alastair - thanks for the pics - most excellent!!!
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Ouch, as someone who put in a lot of effort in to provide 2 3'x3' tables for participation games, neither of which were remotely historical or won an award I guess I'll very much place myself amongst the mediocre masses. But I wont be insulted as the moderators say that the remark was aimed at the show as a whole and not at those of us that provided the games.
I hope, despite the lack of 30' long recreations of some obscure battle from the nether reaches of history, you all at least enjoyed some part of the show.
Let us remember, Its just toy soldiers. If it doesnt interest you pass on by but if you pass everything by then maybe broaden your horizons a little.
Thanks for the encouragement to continue, but for now I'll head off back to my mediocre obscurity to think how to improve for next year....
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Although I have never been to Salute I have been following it for years through the wonder that is teh internetz. Aside from the inclusion of more fantasy/SciFi (which doesn't hurt my feelings at all) the pictures show many great looking games, just as in every previous year.
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There wasn't more fantasy/sci-fi games, that's the point. The organisers balanced game applications and announced before the show, presumably to head off this annual accusation, that the numbers were evenly weighted....
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Can we just agree that England is a sea of mediocrity and be done with it?
In all honesty - the pictures and videos here and elsewhere online has a lot to inspire - well done to all that put something on.
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Although I have never been to Salute I have been following it for years through the wonder that is teh internetz. Aside from the inclusion of more fantasy/SciFi (which doesn't hurt my feelings at all) the pictures show many great looking games, just as in every previous year.
See my post above about the amount of historical/scifi/fantasy game split. It's about fifty fifty.
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Guilty as charged sir! (It was a great laugh to do the speed comp in armour lockdown). Eavier Metal were great sports too. All good fun.
Cheers for taking the pic.
The Commander.
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Glad you found the photo!
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For me Salute checked all the boxes I expected it would. I got 99% of the purchases I planned, 100% of purchases I hadn't planned, picked some bits up for folks this side of the pond, saw some nice looking games, chatted with vendors, played on the Limehouse board with good rules, lovely toys and terrain and met up with old and new friends, something I only get to do at Salute.
I was well worth the flight from Canada and I intend to do the same next year.
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100% of purchases I hadn’t planned
:D