Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => The Conflicts that came in from the Cold => Topic started by: Westfalia Chris on December 03, 2019, 07:13:33 PM
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Hi all,
over the last few weeks, I've been getting renewed requests for a Vietnam-themed sub-board to the Cold War board.
Normally, we try to avoid board proliferation, for obvious reasons - topically-related issues can be split up, and there is more risk of duplicate content (requests, crowdfunding topics) since existing threads might be missed. Visibility of the more specific threads drops for the casual user who doesn't access the specific board directly, or uses the "unread topics" view.
Still, the number of Vietnam-related threads has increased quite noticeably, obviously prompted by the release of various nice new figure ranges. So, I thought I'd get a quantifiable opinion picture from those folks frequenting the Cold War board.
First off, since I cannot define a proper quorum, be advised that this poll will be strictly non-binding. Neither the LAF administration or myself as Cold War moderator will be bound by the result to proceed in a given way, but I will give any outcome supported by decent voter numbers due consideration, which will be helped if you choose to elaborate on your vote in a reply posting by making an argument for your chosen option.
The poll will run for four days (until Saturday evening GMT).
The ground rules for the new board would be as follows:
- The timeframe would be 1945 to 1975, that is, from the end of WW2 to the Fall of Saigon.
- That means that it will encompass the beginnings of the Việt Minh movement, the French Indochina War, the years before the escalation of US involvement, from Tonkin Bay to the Paris Peace Accords, and the "Vietnamization" era.
- Out of scope would be the Colonial era, WW2 and the Japanese occupation, as well as the Vietnamese intervention in Cambodia and the Sino-Vietnamese war of 1979.
- Note that all new topics within the scope will have to be posted on the "Indochina" board.
- All rules of conduct specified by the general forum rules and the Cold War board rules apply.
- Following its implementation, the board will run for a minimum period of six months. If it proves a fad and the fashion fizzles by then, we reserve the right to fold back the "Indochina" board into the Cold War board.
Please feel free to discuss below.
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I have a feeling, which I'm probably wrong about; that opening up another board would lead to the demise of the first,a redundancy if you like. I think I'd prefer no split.
Cheero
Guy
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It’s a current fashion driven by some wonderful new ranges. Could prove to be a precedent for other boards which could lead to me missing some great posts from many talented folk!
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The Cold War board is not the most active board on LAF so diverting traffic to another sub board seems unnecessary.
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It’s a “no split” from me :)
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Another no vote. It is a temporary wave of enthusiasm, have patience, it will pass.
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Is there enough chatter in the current Cold War board to necessitate a seperate one? Sure moving such threads may de-clutter the subject matter, but are enough people currently invested in other settings suitable for this board that there's actually traffic to interrupt?
The end result would be the main board and this child board having a few posts a day between them. Rather than it is at the moment ...where its quite similar. However the same could be set for other less currently frequently boards here. Though if that's the case then the lack of eventual traffic may not be as much of an issue.
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Nope. These things come and go and the proliferation of boards is usually a silly move.
Moot point but excluding the Vietnamese removal of the Pol Pot regime and the subsequent Chinese retaliatory invasion of Vietnam would have seemed a bit illogical to me. They are part of a continuam in terms of the geopolitical struggle in SE Asia anf from a gaming point of view the kit is almost entirely the same for the pre 1975 period.
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No like others have said, "its a passing fad" or something like that. :D
When I was posting my Vietnam projects it hardly raised an eye-brow so I instead posted mainly on FOF. The new enthusiasm is due to the nice new ranges which I have been trying to ignore as I have another four Platoons to paint already.
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Moot point but excluding the Vietnamese removal of the Pol Pot regime and the subsequent Chinese retaliatory invasion of Vietnam would have seemed a bit illogical to me. They are part of a continuam in terms of the geopolitical struggle in SE Asia and from a gaming point of view the kit is almost entirely the same for the pre 1975 period.
That can, of course, be discussed. It is my perception that they differ somewhat from the "liberation war period" in that it's either the People's Republic of Vietnam taking a more active role to establish themselves as a regional power to be reckoned with, and in the case of the 1979 war, a new iteration of centuries-old Chinese hegemonial aspirations. As for TO&Es, I'll agree it's visually of the same mould.
But it could be included in there. 1945-1975 is a bit rounder when it comes to years, but in essence, the delimiters are arbitrary.
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I suspect that there were more than a few Cambodians, grateful, at least in the short term, to be liberated by the Vietnamese from the tender mercies of the Khmer Rouge. ;)
I’m not sure that the Vietnamese were aiming for regional hegemony in 1978 but they could hardly stand by while the Khmer Rouge launched murderous cross border raids that butchered thousands of Vietnamese civilians. Throughout the 1980s Cambodia did turn into something akin to Vietnam’s Vietnam as they were locked into a fairly intractable counter insurgency, with the KR enjoying safe sanctuary in Thailand and extensive support in terms of weapons and funding from.
It might be a stretch covering the sporadic border conflict that waxed and waned between China and Vietnam throughout the ‘80s, I’ll grant you that.
The beauty of keeping the various Indochina conflicts within the main board is that most of the big boys and quite a few of the smaller ones get their own ‘Vietnams’. Afghanistan is oft described as the Soviet Union’s Vietnam just as Yemen in the sixties was Egypt’s Vietnam.
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I prefer to split it into two sub groups, early (pre-Badger Tooth) and late (post-Badger Tooth).
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I suspect that there were more than a few Cambodians, grateful, at least in the short term, to be liberated by the Vietnamese from the tender mercies of the Khmer Rouge. ;)
I’m not sure that the Vietnamese were aiming for regional hegemony in 1978 but they could hardly stand by while the Khmer Rouge launched murderous cross border raids that butchered thousands of Vietnamese civilians. Throughout the 1980s Cambodia did turn into something akin to Vietnam’s Vietnam as they were locked into a fairly intractable counter insurgency, with the KR enjoying safe sanctuary in Thailand and extensive support in terms of weapons and funding from.
Possibly poorly-worded, I'll admit that. It's mainly that we would have to draw a line somewhere - most books I read on the topic tend to hedge it in between 45 and 75.
Also, I've never seen anybody do Cambodia as a wargame (and probably thank goodness for that).
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Less is more... unless you're Yngwie Malmsteen :)
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For what it’s worth, I already have about a platoon’s worth of Khmer Rouge as opposition for the Vietnamese force I’m building. Converted and painted up with just the December 1978 Vietnamese blitzkreig in mind, plus the side goal of gaming the Mayaguez Incident some day. All done well prior to the current Vietnam ranges too. The promised range of Vietnamese from SASM/Footsore never eventuated.
Naturally enough, I have no interest in gaming the horrors of the Pol Pot regime, anymore than the average WW2 gamer fancies recreating Treblinka on their dining room or Vietnam buffs fancy a game of My Lai. I suspect there are a few folk out there who have German forces for their Berlin 1945 games. Alas, there have to be baddies in every game of cowboys or cops and robbers.
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For what it’s worth, I already have about a platoon’s worth of Khmer Rouge as opposition for the Vietnamese force I’m building. Converted and painted up with just the December 1978 Vietnamese blitzkreig in mind, plus the side goal of gaming the Mayaguez Incident some day. All done well prior to the current Vietnam ranges too. The promised range of Vietnamese from SASM/Footsore never eventuated.
Naturally enough, I have no interest in gaming the horrors of the Pol Pot regime, anymore than the average WW2 gamer fancies recreating Treblinka on their dining room or Vietnam buffs fancy a game of My Lai. I suspect there are a few folk out there who have German forces for their Berlin 1945 games. Alas, there have to be baddies in every game of cowboys or cops and robbers.
It's certainly fascinating in a slightly morbid way, as all these topics are - that said, the Mayaguez would certainly be something special. But we are veering off course, sorry for that.
My main point is that I personally don't really perceive Cambodia as part of the "Vietnam War" proper, but as said, one could be lenient with that (and the above is not final). It's so often the case.
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So, based on votes cast, it appears that currently there is not a strong need to have a separate board for Indochina, with 68.9% of the votes cast against, 15.5% in favour and 15.6% undecided.
This doesn't rule out a future need, but I think for the time being, it may be best to keep it all in one place. I'll track developments and we may return to this issue at a later time.