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Miniatures Adventure => The Second World War => Topic started by: Rich H on May 03, 2021, 03:09:04 PM

Title: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 03, 2021, 03:09:04 PM
So the idea is that this was in the ChTZ Tractor Factory at Stalingrad for repair but the encroaching Germans forced them to mobilize everything that would move

This example was in for engine work and the engine deck and transmission cover are off so I suspect it's a wobbly mess but it won't last long enough for that to be a problem... The hatches were cannibalized for a previous repair.

It's already been repaired once as the turret is off a tank from a different factory. 

I still need to sort the fuel tanks and some pipes and wiring.

It'll be in every shade of green I can muster and the engine is a good mix of colours too.  Hopefully will look the part :)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 03, 2021, 04:21:22 PM
Printing the fuel tanks now
(https://scontent.fman4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/182214724_10159377161621774_3505989251908197839_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=dbeb18&_nc_ohc=jXtDbP0Q98oAX-khuFE&_nc_ht=scontent.fman4-1.fna&oh=1772803f5d546302fd846780e27bb8b6&oe=60B64C72)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Ballardian on May 03, 2021, 05:02:35 PM
Lovely job on the T-34 & engine :-*
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: alcal on May 03, 2021, 05:34:00 PM
Great idea  something different on the table.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 03, 2021, 06:27:40 PM
Thanks chaps.

One thing I realised is how tiny the fighting compartment really is, especially for 4 men!

Fuel tanks printed and in.  They aren't particularly accurate but I've not found any decent references (I will now find the perfect detailed drawings obviously) however they do fill the gap and look the part.

Now did the political officer daub slogans on the side..?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Tim Haslam on May 03, 2021, 09:01:51 PM
Superb, as usual.
Have you got the engine running yet?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 03, 2021, 09:08:33 PM
LoL
Sick of tiny holes and wires now...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 04, 2021, 06:47:15 AM
A great looking build - and now with even more detailing!

One thing I realised is how tiny the fighting compartment really is, especially for 4 men!

Me too, with the engine exposed it really brings home how small the fighting compartment is
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 04, 2021, 06:52:03 AM
It's obvious really when you think about it but laid bare it really makes it plain.  It's a tiny space. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 04, 2021, 07:22:36 AM
I think when you look, you probably mentally draw a line somewhere around the back of the turret overhang. But actually the engine goes that far along. And considering there was ammo and and weapons to fit in the fighting compartment as well!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Gunner Dunbar on May 04, 2021, 07:42:30 AM
That’s a pretty good idea, might steal that for my own Stalingrad Russians.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 05, 2021, 11:49:21 AM
Paint WIP. It's not really this shiny!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 06, 2021, 08:50:38 AM
Done I think. 
I'm always nervous about screwing up weathering so I tend to keep it simple.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 06, 2021, 08:53:27 AM
The next one will get a "short track" and missing road wheel plus a missing back deck again (with a Soviet flag over maybe)

These are test pieces not the final version.  I might try and swap the rubber rimmed front and rear wheels in too...

The engine file has been tweaked to make it into a single drop in block with fuel tanks attached. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: has.been on May 06, 2021, 09:28:12 AM
Quote
One thing I realised is how tiny the fighting compartment really is, especially for 4 men!

Very much yes to that. On my first visit to Bovington Tank Museum,
I & a mate prized ourselves into the (thankfully) cut-away turret of
their Pz III.   I was in the commander's position. I would have said,
'sat' but that would imply some degree of comfort. The guns recoil
would have come very close to my stomach, honest I'm not that fat.

As an aside, I asked my mate to have a look out of the vision block
next to him, & tell me what he could see. His reply was, 'If I didn't
know we're parked next to a Jagdpanther, I would not be able to
tell you there is a Jagdpanther parked beside us!'.
Wargamers please note this level of visability.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 07, 2021, 11:22:10 AM
Indeed, the assumption is that the interior of a tank is empty and available for crew.

I didn't want an Stalingrad force but I'm now looking.... plastic partisans and plastic soviets....
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FreakyFenton on May 08, 2021, 06:14:43 PM
The Wargames Atlantic kit for partisans is a good base, however you will need to provide soviet style weaponry. And maybe a few headswaps.

Apart from that, great bit of modelling with a nice blend of modern (printing) and classic (scratchbuilding) techniques! Top job.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Ultravanillasmurf on May 08, 2021, 06:26:37 PM
Excellent.

Reminds me of "The Sniper" model in the Osprey T34 modelling book (though I think that lacked an engine).
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 08, 2021, 06:42:20 PM
Thanks :) I'm enjoying kit-bashing again, I probably enjoy that more than scratch build and printing.   

My second t-34 arrived so I've now got a pair... Obviously I now need a third. 

This one has no engine deck but the rear plate will be partially fitted (missing the access hatch and most of the bolts!). I'm also going to put a red banner over the missing engine deck (come adrift in one corner to show off the engine obvs  ;) )

The engine is now modded so it's a single block and all the fiddly wires are attached and printed too

I've ordered some WG Atlantic partisans and I've got a load of Soviet rifles and assorted bits left over.  I wasn't planning a Stalingrad force but now I'm pondering a full table... Don't tell the wife... :o
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 08, 2021, 07:32:07 PM
I'm now pondering getting the laser cutter fired up and cutting hull panels so I can make T-34 hulls being built in the factory....
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 08, 2021, 07:40:47 PM
So the model kit actually comes with a recess for the engine already? What goes in that space in the regular model? Or is it just there on the friendly (and reasonable) assumption that some modellers will want to kitbash?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 08, 2021, 07:51:10 PM
 lol If only... that's after chopping! 
There is a handy internal bulkhead in the lower hull but the rest is chopped out.   
The engine deck is likewise one piece and needs cutting back.  It's not that bad, there is a line to follow at least, it's also flat so I rough cut with a jewelry saw then file/sand flat.

(https://www.kitreviewsonline.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Rubicon-Models-T-34-76-6.jpg)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 08, 2021, 07:54:40 PM
OK so quite taken by the idea of empty hulls, problem is they are automatically welded (ground breaking tech at the time) so I can't really do partially built hulls as thye were in the (Big complex) machines mostly.  Though a hull in a turn over jig does appeal... 

(https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/yuripasholok/765139/239872/239872_original.jpg)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Smokeyrone on May 09, 2021, 03:39:36 PM
A great looking build - and now with even more detailing!

Me too, with the engine exposed it really brings home how small the fighting compartment is


Lol, just scratchbuilt that engine for a captured German t-34 and KV-2 in 1/35


BTW, to learn EvERY detail of  t-34, buck up, drop 40 dolluhs, and build the AFV Club T-34 with full interior.

I can now make a full interior on a 1/56 model using scraps, without measuring, after doing the AFV
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 09, 2021, 03:42:36 PM
Cool, any more pics of the whole thing?

I've recently done a captured KV1 and KV2 in tropical colours for the invasion of Malta
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Smokeyrone on May 09, 2021, 03:45:25 PM
Cool, any more pics of the whole thing?

I've recently done a captured KV1 and KV2 in tropical colours for the invasion of Malta

Yes, hang on, ill do it right now
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Smokeyrone on May 09, 2021, 04:05:49 PM
Decided against airbrush, hand pInted for fun.  Too dark, but ill drybrush it lighter. :)

Hope you can see interior, very bright Fla sun today
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 09, 2021, 04:27:41 PM
Nice.  If you've access to a resin printer I made the German ammo rack for the KV2.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 09, 2021, 09:35:11 PM
lol If only... that's after chopping! 
There is a handy internal bulkhead in the lower hull but the rest is chopped out.   
The engine deck is likewise one piece and needs cutting back.  It's not that bad, there is a line to follow at least, it's also flat so I rough cut with a jewelry saw then file/sand flat.

the lower hull picture was what I was referring to. It's hard to see in your photo of the assembled lower hull (sans engine), and the sprue picture just shows the lower hull halves side-on. The transverse bulkhead is what made it seem like it was all part of the original lower hull model. So you just cut away the rear of the lower hull behind the bulkhead to create the recess, but ordinarily the lower hull's top surface is level all the way back and the bulkhead is just a structural brace underneath?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 09, 2021, 09:54:52 PM
Correct.  there is a double bottom as it were with reinforcing cross members too. 
It forms a strong chassis for the whole thing, overkill IMHO.
You can see it on the sprue pic the rightmost lower hull pic shows it.

Also the rear of the upper hull needs to be cut if you want to remove the back plate.  The back plate is separate (Providing for early and late back plates) but the upper hull has a solid bulkhead still (Again for strength I guess?)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Smokeyrone on May 09, 2021, 10:15:46 PM
Nice.  If you've access to a resin printer I made the German ammo rack for the KV2.

Lol, thanks.  I built one, but it fell off during pictures.  Got a great deal on Verlinden ammo cases for it
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 10, 2021, 05:21:49 AM
Yes it's a bit fragile, I should have made it a bit more overacale.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 10, 2021, 02:55:14 PM
Second tractor factory T34
Just the commander to paint.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 10, 2021, 05:35:44 PM
That second one is posh, with hatches and everything!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 10, 2021, 08:41:46 PM
And a helmet!  Obviously got to the parts bin first.  Note the colour of 29s driver's hatch...

Or, working in a similar industry the goalposts moved.

Commissar:
Get tank 29 out now!  Take bits you need off number 126.

Ten mins later...Commissar again:
Right good work on 29 lads, does 126 still start?  Good...  We need you in 126 now!  I know that hatches are on 29 but we've painted a slogan on it instead!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 10, 2021, 08:47:14 PM
Ivan takes command.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 11, 2021, 06:43:53 AM
For the last one I'm going to pop the engine deck off again but this one has had a significan 'inconvenience' as my Italian colleagues would describe it.  Therefore it'll get a slab of applique armour welded over the front glacis.  Something like this but more crude.  Probably cut from another T34
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 14, 2021, 07:08:48 PM
Getting out of hand as usual
Full Stalingrad table in planning obvs
Rusty T34 hulls for the main hall. Just need another 25 or so...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on May 15, 2021, 07:07:29 AM
Brilliant project Richard  :-*
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Tim Haslam on May 15, 2021, 07:35:15 AM
Very cool, better than Berlin table.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 15, 2021, 07:44:04 AM
By the way, I read that at the time of the fighting close to the Stalingrad Tractor Plant, freshly made tanks with crews of factory workers went into battle from the shops. The tanks were not painted. It was only bare armor with technological markings.
Well, the militia from the factory workers will also be appropriate on the table.

(http://forkettle.ru/images/video/istoria/WOW/8/18.jpg)

(http://volga-kaspiy.ru/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/2ea7f8b57c3ac2b28f9219cd424214d6_xl.jpg)

(http://pbs.twimg.com/media/DlRx35HWsAAdRCe.jpg)

(http://ds04.infourok.ru/uploads/ex/0aea/000dc689-819b667a/2/hello_html_49fe4b70.jpg)

(http://iskra-dnr.ru/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/11-107.jpg)

(http://pbs.twimg.com/media/D47uspDW4AAwP1I.jpg)

(http://waralbum.ru/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Stalingrad_1942_author-E_Evzerihin.jpg)

(http://maxpark.com/static/u/article_image/14/11/08/tmpZ4yuaf.jpeg)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Gunner Dunbar on May 15, 2021, 07:46:15 AM
How many T-34 kits had to die to supply all those hulls?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 07:53:27 AM
Thanks, the bare metal tanks are legendary... But there seems to be little consensus on if they really existed in bare metal. 

My interpretation is they were damaged tanks returned to fight. 

I've some factory militia in progress too :) wargames Atlantic partisans with various weapon swaps.  Couldn't use a quarter of them as they have obvious zip up jackets which doesn't really fit!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 07:53:41 AM
How many T-34 kits had to die to supply all those hulls?

None ;)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 07:55:26 AM
For reference each hull costs about 50p in resin and takes 10 hours
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 15, 2021, 07:57:27 AM
Stalingrad Tractor Plant is one of the main manufacturers of T-34s. So it will probably be the hulls of the new tanks. Although, of course, the plant was also repairing damaged tanks, being in the immediate zone of hostilities.
Although I do not think that there were very many of them, since the battlefield then often remained with the opponents, and even only damaged or faulty tanks had to be left on the territory occupied by the Nazis.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 15, 2021, 08:01:39 AM
By the way, pay attention - one of the workers in the photo is armed with a tank machine gun. There should have been a lot of them in the factory warehouses.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 08:03:18 AM
Very possible but there isn't much consensus.  My assumption was these were in the process of being repaired (brought in for engine damage rather than battle damage) so didn't require much effort to get them moving.

Good point on the DT28 but bolt action doesn't allow them  ::)
Iight swap a couple in anyway
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Harry Faversham on May 15, 2021, 08:04:43 AM
Very much yes to that. On my first visit to Bovington Tank Museum,
I & a mate prized ourselves into the (thankfully) cut-away turret of
their Pz III.   I was in the commander's position. I would have said,
'sat' but that would imply some degree of comfort. The guns recoil
would have come very close to my stomach, honest I'm not that fat.

As an aside, I asked my mate to have a look out of the vision block
next to him, & tell me what he could see. His reply was, 'If I didn't
know we're parked next to a Jagdpanther, I would not be able to
tell you there is a Jagdpanther parked beside us!'.
Wargamers please note this level of visability.

We did the same at Bovvy in the early 70s. I sat in a Pz. IV, co-driver's seat, very claustrophobic. Just below the hatch was a thing like a dinner plate fitted to a sprung arm that swung over yer melon. I was told it was for pressing your head into to brace yourself while firing the machine gun...
in them days I was right into tanks, but couldn't get out of that one fast enough!

:?




Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Gunner Dunbar on May 15, 2021, 09:11:29 AM
For reference each hull costs about 50p in resin and takes 10 hours

Ah, cool, where did you get the stl? Good idea.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 09:19:59 AM
I drew it  lol

Before long I'll probably have a kit form T34....
I'm planning on a bare turret next....
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 15, 2021, 07:57:26 PM
We did the same at Bovvy in the early 70s. I sat in a Pz. IV, co-driver's seat, very claustrophobic. Just below the hatch was a thing like a dinner plate fitted to a sprung arm that swung over yer melon. I was told it was for pressing your head into to brace yourself while firing the machine gun...
in them days I was right into tanks, but couldn't get out of that one fast enough!

:?
So much for the Pz IV's reputation of having better ergonomics than its contemporaries!  lol

Or maybe the others were even worse... we know that the improved, larger turret for the 85mm gun was a massive upgrade for the T-34's crew.

But then again Shermans had huge amounts of room inside because they were the size of a small house (and Lees/Grants were even worse for being huge!), so I really am wondering where this Panzer reputation comes from...  ;D
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 15, 2021, 08:14:12 PM
Is it perhaps that, despite the lack of room they were easier to control?  ie no need for a hammer to shift gears...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 16, 2021, 02:16:15 AM
If you are interested in comparing the qualities of the Sherman and the T-34, I recommend reading the book by the Russian tanker who fought on the Sherman: 
Commanding the Red Army’s Sherman tanks. The World War II memoirs of Hero of the Soviet Union, Loza Dmitriy. Translated and edited by James F. Gebhardt. Published 1996 by University of Nebraska Press in Lincoln. 173 p. ISBN 0-8032-2920-8.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 16, 2021, 08:29:12 AM
Ok so the table plan is congealing.  Just ordered 25m of 3x3mm abs plastic angle.  I'm going to make a jig and build roof trusses.  I could laser the trusses but they always look laser cut.  Also the ABS will be stronger and with heat can be twisted like iron one would.  Still working on how to do lots of corrugated iron...
I'm pondering a DIY vac form over a 3d printed master...  However I can't use the oven to heat it, that would be suicide :o

I'm also looking at how to make lots of bricks.  I'm thinking a 3d printed positive mould, then latex negative mould (cheap and easy) then orange/brown/black coloured plaster.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 16, 2021, 08:33:04 AM
Just ordered 25m of 3x3mm abs plastic angle.

:o

I love the gigantism that your projects always come to !
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 16, 2021, 08:38:09 AM
Lol.  Well the trusses will be 9" each side and probably 18" in the middle.  So around 4 500mm lengths per full roof truss.  So that only gets me around 10 trusses.  That said they will be smashed down as I always find things like roof trusses in place annoying and fragile. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 16, 2021, 10:02:21 AM
Quote
I'm pondering a DIY vac form over a 3d printed master...

Perhaps it makes sense to use for the manufacture of corrugated iron - thin aluminum foil for baking, shaping it on homemade rollers (similar to jewelry). To make the profile rollers themselves using 3D printing?

Something like that:

(http://umeha.3dn.ru/_pu/86/96785610.jpg)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 16, 2021, 10:08:33 AM
I thought of that but it's just too fragile.  I do have some thicker pewter foil somewhere but I can't find it....

I was thinking vac form should do sheets complete with overlaps and fixings in one go...  Might be being over ambitious though...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 16, 2021, 07:59:50 PM
By the way, I just want to say that your painting of those rough hulls is fantastic. Very tricky to get that in-progress metalwork look without the item looking too clean or too dirty. How did you manage it?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 16, 2021, 09:10:14 PM
Happy accident lol
Halfords grey undercoat
Lifecolour brown
Vallejo Mech Rust Texture
Flory models sand
Vallejo rust pigment dusting.

I used to work in a narrow boat yard so there was a lot of raw unfinished steel and welding. 
The welds were always shiny and the plate surface mottled and rusty.
Admittedly it wasn't third best Russian armour plate!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 08:39:04 AM
Second batch done. Need to place them on a table see how they look.  I've got another 5 hulls printed.  Plan is to make turrets in the same state, maybe cast wheels too.  This is obviously the goods recieving shed (before it was bombed) hence the stored part finished components ;)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: carlos marighela on May 17, 2021, 10:50:59 AM
 >:(
Thanks, the bare metal tanks are legendary... But there seems to be little consensus on if they really existed in bare metal. 

My interpretation is they were damaged tanks returned to fight. 

I've some factory militia in progress too :) wargames Atlantic partisans with various weapon swaps.  Couldn't use a quarter of them as they have obvious zip up jackets which doesn't really fit!

Try these. Designed specifically for the job.

https://www.eurekamin.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=87_126_840_859&products_id=13238

Nice work on the T-34s btw.

Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 11:52:56 AM
Saw them, the only thing that puts me off is the random figures provided, I really don't like duplicates.  I know they will try and send different poses but... :?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 11:53:34 AM
Militia
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on May 17, 2021, 12:23:50 PM
Are they the new Wargames Atlantic Partisans?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 12:29:12 PM
Yes with various head swaps and weapon swaps.  There are about 15 more with rifles.  Ideally I'd swap out the generic rifles for moisin nagants but it got too difficult so I left them.  They will be various shades of brown, dark blue and grime.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 04:36:52 PM
Armour upgrade
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 17, 2021, 08:33:32 PM
Armour upgrade

 lol
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 17, 2021, 09:23:09 PM
"That way comrades! Obviously I'd come with you but I've got to direct the other comrades...  "
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: brunei35 on May 18, 2021, 07:32:27 AM
Does
Quote
Ideally I'd swap out the generic rifles for moisin nagants but it got too difficult so I left them.
mean Warlord plastic arms - the non padded jacket variant - do not fit the Atlantic torsos?

Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 18, 2021, 08:03:36 AM
Not easily no, all the Soviet arms have jacket cuffs which don't match the jackets and the rifle arms don't fit very well.  The German arms work better (the flag bearer has German arms)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: brunei35 on May 18, 2021, 09:46:02 AM
Thanks Rich for clarification
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 18, 2021, 12:18:50 PM
Factory militia started
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on May 18, 2021, 02:48:03 PM
They look good, Richard.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 18, 2021, 03:05:07 PM
Ta :)

12 done, 12 to go.  15 rifles, the rest with mixed grenades, handtools and/or weapons
I'll probably mix in some regular soviet infantry to make the numbers up.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 18, 2021, 05:46:56 PM
That's genius. Is the STL for the T34 hull available commercially? My Anycubic Photon got very jealous seeing that print..

It's still working on a Semovente 90/43 - 3 hours to go... 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 18, 2021, 06:24:04 PM
I'll try and sort it later once this ankle biter finally sleeps...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 18, 2021, 07:13:31 PM
Hull and Engine can be found here: https://www.wargaming3d.com/product/t-34-hull-and-engine/

LAF Exclusive Discount code: GKUQUVDR valid until the end of June ;)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 19, 2021, 12:40:10 PM
6 to go. 
There is a little bit of disco going on with one of them but I decided to leave him  lol

I also think they would suit a rebellion in the 1970s...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 19, 2021, 01:00:50 PM
Hull and Engine can be found here: https://www.wargaming3d.com/product/t-34-hull-and-engine/

LAF Exclusive Discount code: GKUQUVDR valid until the end of June ;)

OK, I just ordered, and got a hull and the fuel and oil tanks...in two downloads, no engine... ??
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on May 19, 2021, 01:01:04 PM
They look like they could go from 1920s Peaky Blinders up to 1970s IRA.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 19, 2021, 02:44:37 PM
OK, I just ordered, and got a hull and the fuel and oil tanks...in two downloads, no engine... ??
Apologies, I'll have a look when I finish work. Looks like I uploaded the wrong file!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 19, 2021, 05:29:03 PM
Finger trouble - correct file now uploaded - apologies!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 19, 2021, 06:22:09 PM
Unfortunately, the fuel & oil tanks have now disappeared from my downloads, but no engine has appeared.

It might well if I was to reorder, but apparently it wants me to pay again.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 19, 2021, 06:23:09 PM
I'll send you the files direct. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 19, 2021, 06:51:18 PM
6 to go. 
There is a little bit of disco going on with one of them but I decided to leave him  lol

I also think they would suit a rebellion in the 1970s...

Took me a while to spot the one, but now of course...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvS351QKFV4
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 11:07:53 AM
Third and final T34 WIP
Can you tell what's special?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 21, 2021, 11:32:28 AM
It has a very big gun, and all its armour plate?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 21, 2021, 04:12:01 PM
Third and final T34 WIP
Can you tell what's special?

Apart from the additional welded glacis plate?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Mick_in_Switzerland on May 21, 2021, 04:15:42 PM
The gun looks exceptionally long.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 04:17:33 PM
Close enough :)
It's a 57mm gun and it's got extra armour welded on the glacis

The idea is it's a battle damage repair and I read somewhere that there were 57mm guns left over from the first cancelled T-34/57 project.  Good enough for me.

(https://images.app.goo.gl/m45bsndRBY6ggaLa7)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 05:10:36 PM
The three
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 05:12:16 PM
The militia

Just need to work out bases.  My other Soviets are on clear bases but cutting these off will be hard work...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 21, 2021, 05:21:26 PM
The three

Definitely don't want to be the guys in the middle tank.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 05:24:22 PM
I'll take the T-34/57
Longer range and a full compliment of roadwheels plus another 40mm of armour on the front!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: FramFramson on May 21, 2021, 07:40:53 PM
Can you tell what's special?

It's got an engine deck  lol
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 21, 2021, 07:42:40 PM
It's got an engine deck  lol
lol

This was the first one to be repaired, the were running out of bits for the next two!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 22, 2021, 07:20:28 PM
Ok the original plan was 10mmm foambaord for the walls, I've used it before and it's ok, I've also got a load.  Problem with it is it's a pain to cut neatly and it's a bit fragile.  Plan B is fire up the laser.  Stick brick paper to 2mm MDF and cut the profiles.  It's a lot stronger and I'd use 2 outer layers around a third inner layer of scrap.  The middle doesn't need to be solid just enough to support the walls.  I'll add buttresses and so on to give it more depth. 

I'm waiting for a load of ABS angle to make roof trusses and collapsed roof structure too
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 25, 2021, 02:23:44 PM
The core of the factory force is complete, the rest will be in standard Soviet uniforms

(https://scontent.fman4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/191763818_10159433916091774_7081974989849727298_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=-Vw8pSwz6GwAX_-RyK9&_nc_ht=scontent.fman4-1.fna&oh=31e64e7092b729b0132276aafa481183&oe=60D108DA)
(https://scontent.fman4-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/190591204_10159433916761774_3531223073676594299_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=ncMBpneyq9MAX-MiYvB&_nc_ht=scontent.fman4-2.fna&oh=d953777dc7f7747421fdfab3ceb910f0&oe=60D2C984)
(https://scontent.fman4-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/190888176_10159433920536774_1659486167557219229_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=HESg8ABuZ7sAX_dAj2E&_nc_ht=scontent.fman4-2.fna&oh=ff266f1bafac3d7ef01cb8d694b49c4e&oe=60D23807)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 25, 2021, 02:50:50 PM
Great stuff. I eyed off the Wargames Atlantic 'Resistance' figures in the local games store on the weekend, but held off, as I wasn't sure how well they would fit with the rest of my Volksturm, mainly Warlord metals. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 25, 2021, 04:09:53 PM
They scale well with warlord plastics.  They are a little less heroic but similar heights.  They should mix with the metals fine.  Biggest problem is only 2 rifles per 4 men and one man has an obviously zip up jacket...  Other weapons are stens and pistols.  Will take some work to make volkssturm I'm afraid.  The German arms holding rifles don't fit very well without trimming and filler.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 25, 2021, 04:31:01 PM
Thanks for that. I do have a bunch of plastic weapons from other sprues, so I should be able to kit them out appropriately with Mausers, MP44, and all sorts of other goodies. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Ultravanillasmurf on May 25, 2021, 05:23:57 PM
Very nice work on those figures and vehicles.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: carlos marighela on May 25, 2021, 11:19:45 PM
Indeed they have all come out beautifully. The little tractor in particular is a gem.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: CapnJim on May 26, 2021, 01:43:39 PM
Lovely work.  Just lovely.  And that's an interesting use of the WA partisans. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 26, 2021, 06:34:37 PM
Thanks all!

Obviously now I'm looking at expanding the 24 I've got to a full force of factory workers....  I'd need a lot though!  Maybe just another 24...  With an 'escort' of NKVD perhaps?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 26, 2021, 10:21:22 PM
Thanks all!

Obviously now I'm looking at expanding the 24 I've got to a full force of factory workers....  I'd need a lot though!  Maybe just another 24...  With an 'escort' of NKVD perhaps?

In Chain of Command you would be looking at a platoon of workers so 3 or 4 squads plus an HQ, perhaps with security detail, and support options. Treat as Green troops but Stubborn and maybe add a team of snipers/tank hunters? The T34 would soak up plenty of support points.. 😀
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: cuprum on May 27, 2021, 12:10:50 AM
You can make a "militia" squad. This is how the police were called in the USSR.
The uniform is similar to the army uniform in everything, but had a different color.
In the front-line area (including in Stalingrad), "extermination detachments" were formed from the police to fight saboteurs and guard various objects. When the front approached, they often joined the active army. In Stalingrad, they took an active part in the battles of the first period.

(http://deduhova.ru/statesman/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/milicia-09-20.jpg)

(http://topwar.ru/uploads/posts/2016-11/1478677118_340011.gif)

More details here:

http://army.armor.kiev.ua/forma-2/milicia-09.php
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: carlos marighela on May 27, 2021, 01:03:30 AM
I like the idea of having the militia arrest the Germans. A bit of exotic colour is always a good thing. I once converted a figure to make a Soviet Army traffic regulator. He's yet to make it on to the table but I love him none the less.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Will Bailie on May 27, 2021, 01:44:44 AM
I like the idea of having the militia arrest the Germans. A bit of exotic colour is always a good thing. I once converted a figure to make a Soviet Army traffic regulator. He's yet to make it on to the table but I love him none the less.

Haha, love it.  "Is that true then, he's a peeler, 716, come to arrest the Zulus Hitlerites!"
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: dbsubashi on May 28, 2021, 12:07:44 AM
Perhaps a paper corrugated for the corrugated metal?
Uchida 8.5-inch Straight Corru-gator Paper Crimper https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003WM78B2/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_24DZNWMB641VX3EZW2TH

Though the Fiskars version has metal rollers and can do light cardboard.

There is also the core-U-gator, for doing scale metal corrugation, but probably too small a work surface for roofing a factory...
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on May 28, 2021, 12:14:23 AM
There's always the ultra cheap toothpaste squeezer

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-1oGs_1GXb3M/YHSvbzs95cI/AAAAAAAAFbE/y-sMHIKdeA83Yf-bpAP83bzwYoraHKRZQCLcBGAsYHQ/s807/villa5.png)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 28, 2021, 06:09:06 AM
Tha KS, I've tried the tube squeezer but the corrugations are too big.  I've got a selection of commercial stuff from 4D.  Corrugated card, plasticard, aluminium and lead.  At the moment Slater's plasticard is winning.  Though the rest will find uses :)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: carlos marighela on May 28, 2021, 07:52:12 AM
I find that because the corrugated aluminium stuff isn’t so robust that it’s best used in small pieces for things like bases and scatter terrain. It’s also fiendishly expensive.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: has.been on May 28, 2021, 09:14:44 AM
many years ago I used some corrugated bits for a ruin.
They came from a DIY shop & were for joining two bits of wood.
About 40mm long & serrated on the leading edge. You were
supposed to abut the two bits of wood, place the serrated edge
in contact with the wood, so that it crossed the join. Next, minding
your fingers, whack the flat top wiv a 'ammer (technical instruction).
Needless to say I NEVER joined bits of wood with the ones I bought.
They were however only really useful on ruins & debris piles.

Nowadays I use ribbed rubber matting. Stuff that used to be placed
under manual type-writers  to reduce vibration. I am down to my last
few bits, (See attached photos to show how it looks) must find a new
source.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 29, 2021, 07:41:56 PM
CM: The ali was £6 a sheet, not too bad.  I'll probably end up doing the same with all the test pieces, snipping into small bits and scattering them about.

Has Been: I know the wood joint things you mean.  Nasty things!

Im playing with the crane gantry at the moment... not very happy with it yet....
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: CapnJim on May 29, 2021, 10:14:52 PM
Been watching this thread, and keep meaning to leave a comment or 2... ::)

Love the T34s, and the WA partisan-based militia.  Especially the tanks. But then again, I'm a former tanker, so I love anything tank-related... :D 

Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 30, 2021, 06:25:51 AM
Ta :)

Been playing with the gantry but I'm not happy with it yet.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: fred on May 31, 2021, 06:47:39 PM
Been playing with the gantry but I'm not happy with it yet.

You’ll only be happy with another 10’ of it!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on May 31, 2021, 07:17:24 PM
Working on it... lol

Might have accidentally ordered another 20 sheets of MDF

I'm up to ten sections now, 3 of which are ruins.  The factory is planned as 8 sections long, but one each side is an office block. 

Once the supplies arrive I'll do some more ruins.  I also need to sort out one end which will also be in ruins
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 10, 2021, 11:58:19 PM
More
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 11, 2021, 12:02:01 AM
I basically ordered one of every corrugated option I could do d.  I finally settled on this corrugated card by 4d models.  Cut into 40x20mmm sheets and stuck to a.laser cut MDF frame then with plastic angle glued to that.

I'm also now planning a water towers for one of the corners of the main hall (aka sniper tower) and a ruined tower for the other corner. 
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on June 11, 2021, 12:11:51 AM
I basically ordered one of every corrugated option I could do d.  I finally settled on this corrugated card by 4d models.  Cut into 40x20mmm sheets and stuck to a.laser cut MDF frame then with plastic angle glued to that.

I'm also now planning a water towers for one of the corners of the main hall (aka sniper tower) and a ruined tower for the other corner.

And knitting a T(34) Cosy?
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: CapnJim on June 11, 2021, 03:26:10 PM
I'm liking where this is going.  Tank porn! :)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 12, 2021, 10:09:15 PM
My accidental reserves have made it across the Volga. 
36 old metals, no idea the manufacturer. 
Around 15 partisans (some who have now had beret-ectomies), 2 potential NKVD officers, 6 in Adrian helmets who are going to be the dregs of the factory firefighters, 4 very obvious Frenchmen or Tommies who will be thrown back.
The rest are a bit too military for factory workers (Mostly because of their puttees) so they will become student officers thrown into the maw.

I need to rebase them and then see where that leaves me.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: MaleGriffin on June 14, 2021, 09:03:41 PM
It just keeps getting better and better!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 14, 2021, 09:45:57 PM
Started on the reserves

First the factory fire department.  No idea if there was one but they are based on what I've gleaned of Soviet firemen from the 1930s.  Plan canvas uniforms and brass helmets.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 14, 2021, 09:46:32 PM
The general factory militia
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 14, 2021, 09:46:55 PM
Few more (poor lighting and flash and wet ink!)
7 more to go... 

I've a load more plastic partisans on order to make AT teams on order
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 17, 2021, 06:26:29 AM
Found some more... And my second box of partisans arrived to be made into AT teams.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 17, 2021, 01:04:51 PM
NKVD morale improvement is in progress, please remain calm.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 21, 2021, 09:44:13 AM
Some museum pieces for the Factory Militia

A M1910 122mm howitzer and a pair of M1927 76.2mm regimental guns
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Magos Kasen on June 21, 2021, 11:45:02 AM
These are all absolutely superb mate!
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Digits on June 21, 2021, 11:55:17 AM
Yup…agreed and I’m worried I may be tempted on to the Eastern Front! Lol

Great work
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 21, 2021, 11:57:03 AM
Thanks  :)

The M1927 I got a bit carried away with the details
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on June 21, 2021, 02:22:57 PM
Those look excellent, are they 3d printed?  And if so.. where woul done find such STLs?  (And I wish I could find 3d print crew figures... having to convert a dwindling stock of plastics gets wearing.)
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 21, 2021, 02:26:29 PM
Yes all 3d prints

The 122mm is a comission test piece so unavailable but the 76.2mm is available below.  Resin print only though as some of the bits are tiny! 

https://www.wargaming3d.com/product/soviet-russian-m1927-76-2mm-regimental-gun/

I don't do crews, these are Empress SCW nationalist 88 crew

Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Shahbahraz on June 21, 2021, 02:29:20 PM
Lucky I have a Photon S then,  lol  - bookmarked for when the first pay comes through from the new contract.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 21, 2021, 02:31:29 PM
 :D

I printed at 0.03mm layer height, I don't usually bother but as it was a relatively small print I tried it.  Very happy with the result.

Going to draw some ammunition and crates at some point.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on June 23, 2021, 10:38:19 PM
Well as usual things got out of hand...

I've nearly finished building the Stalingrad factory militia!  Just a few left to paint...

6 twelve man militia teams (including two unarmed men per squad)
1 eleven man NKVD team
1 NKVD MMG
2 light mortars (37mm spade mortars)
3 AT rifles
2 two man tank hunter teams
1 Lt plus runner
1 commissar plus assistant
2 light howitzers (M1927 76.2mm regimental guns)
1 medium howitzer (M1910 122mm howitzer)
3 factory T-34
1 factory tractor

To be painted:  15 rifles, 3 AT rifle teams, 2 light mortar teams, and a few gun crews. 

I'm working on printing two or three gun limbers
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on August 11, 2021, 08:59:19 AM
Well they are finally done.

998 point Bolt Action force for the Bolt Action Welsh Open in September.

2nd Lt and assistant
Commissar and assistant
12 man free squad
12 man people's militia squad
12 man people's militia squad
12 man people's militia squad
12 man people's militia squad
12 man people's militia squad
11 man NKVD with 4 SMGs
1 Medium MG
2 man tank hunter team with SMG
2 man tank hunter team with SMG
1 AT rifle team
1 AT rifle team
1 light mortar team
1 light mortar team
1 T34 with factory crew
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: David H on August 12, 2021, 12:32:20 PM
I have just read through the entire thread and love the concept. Its been executed perfectly, what a great range of vehicles and figures you have created.
I hope the Welsh Open goes well, and look forward to your next project.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on August 12, 2021, 05:43:58 PM
 lol I'd be amazed if I'm not last!  Not plays in 2 years I reckon!

I'm not quite finished with this project yet, I've scaled back the table plan to just the factory, so I need the corner towers and some scatter for the inside.  It'll be jammed into my terrace table and it can be a little piece of Preston - Strand road works to be exact.
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: carlos marighela on August 12, 2021, 09:26:50 PM
Ah yes, the famous fight for the Tractor Factory Bisto Factory ……Arkwright Mill.  :D
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on August 12, 2021, 09:31:28 PM
 lol
In Lancashire so it was planes, trucks, tanks and cloth round here

All gone but the planes (and they keep my lights on)

Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: Rich H on January 18, 2022, 10:27:30 AM
The Militia have been rounded up again and will be shipped off to Lincoln early Feb.
Slight change as I can use the Tractor Factory Selector so making a few tweaks
18 Dice, not as many men (Only 60 infantry: the NKVD and free squad have been removed) but it will have a full compliment of 3x T34s this time :D
Title: Re: ChTZ T-34 Stalingrad
Post by: MaleGriffin on January 18, 2022, 03:34:59 PM
Amazing collection! Absolutely brilliant!