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Miniatures Adventure => Future Wars => Topic started by: Daeothar on January 10, 2022, 05:44:07 PM

Title: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: Daeothar on January 10, 2022, 05:44:07 PM
This idea had been brewing for the longest of times; build a completely period correct Rogue Trader Space Marine army. But for the life of me, I couldn't decide on which chapter to paint.

Dark Angels? I already have a 3rd/4th edition force in dark green. My very first RTB01 army was a black Dark Angels one (in glorious monotone enamel), which I sold off when I went to uni. Painting another black army sounded pretty easy, but to have two separate Dark Angel forces would be overdoing it a bit I felt.

Blood Angels? I loved the more orangy look the White Dwarf RTB01 army had, but those were a large inspiration for my own 5th edition own chapter, the Fiery Lions, with their orange armour and blue helmets (and shoulderpads; a slight deviation ;) ), and again, two of the same was a bit much.

I already have a Rogue Trader 1.5 (just before 2nd ed.) Imperial Fists army, so yellow was out too. A shame really, because I liked the idea of doing a Lamenters army.

Looking at the spectrum, only blue and purple were left unused. Purple was out, because it's just too evil a colour, and I still have Emperor's Children ambitions for my Renegade miniatures.

Which left blue, which meant Ultramarines. Luckily not the posterboy variety yet, but the more grim and feral Rogue Trader variant. I liked the thought of this, but wasn't really stoked for some reason.

And then it hit me; white!

And then combined with my favourite colour; green (the Mantis Warriors also didn't make the cut because of the green Dark Angels, but they too were pretty enticing).

In other words: the Mentor Legion.

Luckily Mason decided to Space Shark with his project, so we don't have two similar forces growing on the LAF simultaneously.

So, with the chapter settled on, I took to selecting a first squad of marines, cleaning them up, removing mouldlines, basing them and priming them in grey.

Which is where this picture has captured them:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion01.jpg)

Since then, I've applied the green, using a dark grey undercoat and about 3 layers of Coat d'Arms Dark Green. I chose this because it has just the right hue (it has some very slight blueish tint to it) to match the Mentor Legion artwork in White Dwarf 98.

Here, I am in the middle of applying Wolf Grey to the (to be) white parts of the armour, leaving the primer as shading in the recesses. The three on the right have been done, but in the picture the effect is really subtle...

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion02.jpg)

The face on the unhelmeted plasma marine reminds me of Dolph Lundgren for some reason btw...  lol

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion03.jpg)
Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 10, 2022, 05:51:07 PM
Mentor Legion are completely RT old school  8)

Looking forward to this  :)
Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: Storm Wolf on January 10, 2022, 07:25:56 PM
Thumbs up from me :-*

Knowledge is power  ;)
Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 11, 2022, 12:43:31 PM
Which left blue, which meant Ultramarines. Luckily not the posterboy variety yet, but the more grim and feral Rogue Trader variant. I liked the thought of this, but wasn't really stoked for some reason.
Crimson Fists? Rainbow Warriors? I guessed you were going to mention Ultramarines, but I'm shocked these two didn't get a mention given the subject!  ;D

Anyway, good choice on the Mentor Legion, and it looks like a good start too. I'll be watching with interest! :)
Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: Storm Wolf on January 11, 2022, 01:19:47 PM
I also think the Mentor Legion colour scheme served as the inspiration for Buzz Lightyears colour scheme?? lol

(https://i.imgur.com/gAri0wh.jpg)

and

(https://i.imgur.com/pxQCCXa.jpg)

 ??? ;)
Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: Daeothar on January 12, 2022, 10:59:27 AM
Cheers guys :)

Crimson Fists? Rainbow Warriors? I guessed you were going to mention Ultramarines, but I'm shocked these two didn't get a mention given the subject!  ;D

Oh, you're so right. I did think of them, but both had a few things going against them. Crimson Fists would be a Fists successor, and I already have a force of the Imperial variant. But to me, they are the OG Space Marine chapter, due to the Rogue Trader cover art. Rainbow Warriors were only mentioned in a black and white illustration in Rogue Trader if I recall correctly, and there they had an issue with the Sisters, so they would not sit well together in the display cabinet  ;D Also; I didn't fancy having to paint those elaborate helmet stripes on each and every single marine... :D

Speaking of which: I was going to paint my version of the Mentor Legion with the rank markings, as seen in the little red Space Marine Painting Guide:

(https://33.cdn.ekm.net/ekmps/shops/sprubitz/images/space-marine-painting-guide-1989-rogue-trader-2128-p.jpg?w=693&h=1002&v=1)

But most other incarnations and RT period marines, I see with the helmet stripe system.

So what to do? I'm pretty partial to the red booklet (it's been my bible when it comes to iconography on space marines pretty much since it came out), but the stripe system seems to be even older, and it's even depicted in the White Dwarf 98 Mentor Legion artwork...

Title: Re: Daeothar's Mentor Legion
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 12, 2022, 11:43:39 AM
Crimson Fists would be a Fists successor, and I already have a force of the Imperial variant. But to me, they are the OG Space Marine chapter, due to the Rogue Trader cover art.
Yeah, for me too really, followed stupidly closely by the Blood Angels since they seemed to feature in every other piece of Space Marine art from the period. Mind you, as I have some modern CF and BT, I did consider making my "Codex: Ultramarines" force IF instead, to complete the trifecta; I chose to stick with UM in the end though, as I have sooooo many characters for them!

I totally get doing another "Fist Successor" chapter though (and I why I didn't raise the Executioners from the Badab War as another "blue" schemed chapter, since they are founded from the Fists' lineage too).


Rainbow Warriors were only mentioned in a black and white illustration in Rogue Trader if I recall correctly, and there they had an issue with the Sisters, so they would not sit well together in the display cabinet  ;D Also; I didn't fancy having to paint those elaborate helmet stripes on each and every single marine... :D
Yeah, it was only a tongue-in-cheek suggestion!  lol  That said, I'd get some custom decals made professionally for the prismatic stripes if I were ever to do them (...which I won't, since I've never felt any inclination to do their chapter).


Speaking of which: I was going to paint my version of the Mentor Legion with the rank markings, as seen in the little red Space Marine Painting Guide:

But most other incarnations and RT period marines, I see with the helmet stripe system.

So what to do? I'm pretty partial to the red booklet (it's been my bible when it comes to iconography on space marines pretty much since it came out), but the stripe system seems to be even older, and it's even depicted in the White Dwarf 98 Mentor Legion artwork...
Hmm, why not do both? Veteran squads in the older markings, regular squads with the newer ones. Custom decals, or perhaps very thin custom 3D-printed rank plates glued on might make this a bit easier than doing it with a brush?
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion
Post by: Daeothar on January 16, 2022, 03:28:22 PM
Thanks Major :)

I'm glad to report that the first squad is ready. Well... I call it ready, but I know I still have to tidy up the base rims and those tactical arrows on the shoulderpads are pretty bad, so they'll require a redo, but overall, I'm calling it for these guys.

I've caved, and I've gone with the Rogue Trader book style of helmet stripe rank system. That means no Lieutenants or Lieutenant Commanders, but it is the OG way of marking Space Marines, so I went with it.

As you can tell, I'm not using the WD98 article's Mentor Legion shoulderpad design, which incorporated the owl's head design with a flag design, in a black circle, with or without veteran marking. ANd that was it.

These markings were meant for Mentor Legion sent out to assist others Imperial forces as tutors, instructors and veteran cadre. But since I plan on doing more than just one squad, I've gone with a bit of an amalgation of WD98 and the Painting Space Marines booklet.

Meaning my Space Marines will sport the Mentor Legion symbol, with the role symbol underneath or behind it. Those being Tactical, Assault and Devastator. This also means no weapon badges (luckily, as those are tiny! ).

I'm also adapting the practice of reversing a shoulderpad's colours for veterans, as displayed on the Veteran Sergeant. I will also probably give him a back-banner later on, once I've decided on the style...

A groupshot:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion10.jpg)

Sergeant:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion04.jpg)

Marine 1:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion05.jpg)

Marine 2, with Heavy Bolter:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion06.jpg)

Marine 3:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion07.jpg)

Marine 4:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion08.jpg)

Marine 5, with Plasmagun:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion09.jpg)

And finally, for kicks, a shot of the entire squad being deployed outside of an Imperial outpost:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion11.jpg)

And I suppose some of you might be wondering why I painted 6 Marines in this first squad, instead of going with 5 or 10. This has to with their transport, which, going by the numbers, should then be a Razorback, right?

Well kind of.

It'll be a Rogue Trader classic, but I need to work on some stuff first before I can actually show it off. But this is the very next thing on the workbench!

Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Storm Wolf on January 16, 2022, 03:58:49 PM
Excellent work!

I am on something of  a 3rd edition/RT kick myself at the moment, but nothing like as fancy as yours.

Keep up the good work

Glen
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 16, 2022, 05:59:57 PM
Love Ďem  8)

Resisting the temptation to toddle off to eBay and get some  lol
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Mr Tough Guy on January 16, 2022, 06:01:47 PM
Those look great mate!

I don't think the helmet stripes and the rank badges from the painting guide are mutually exclusive, I've been working on a RT Space Wolves army myself and I decided to do both the helmet stripes and rank badges though not necessarily at the same time. And you can always do the rankbadge on the shoulderpad or arms or legs. I'm also mixing several types of helmet stripe, from the full stripe to just a stripe on the nose, so I will probably do one with just a stripe on the nose and a rank badge on the brow at some point.

Have you thought of doing the weapon markings on the shoulderpads? I've only painted one squad so far, but all my bolter marines have the bolter marking from p169 of the RT book. Think that's something that would fit right in with your marines, but I can understand not doing it, because it's fiddly as fuck to do.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: hubbabubba on January 16, 2022, 10:25:04 PM
Tidy work, well done.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Blackwolf on January 16, 2022, 10:35:51 PM
Cracking!
My Space Sharks do without rank identification,itís whose got the biggest sword  lol
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 17, 2022, 12:41:14 AM
These are lovely, especially as white is such an unforgiving colour, and never mind on old models with so-so casting. Very well done!  :-*

Resisting the temptation to toddle off to eBay and get some  lol

...Same!  :D

Especially after seeing these, Mason's, Curis', stone-cold-lead's...

Yeah, I've been good and resisted so far!  lol
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Elbows on January 18, 2022, 12:29:53 AM
Mentor Legion (the proper, original one) is the best legion.

The original fluff, lore and game rules were freakin' outstanding and then GW did nothing with them...made their logo a lame red eagle head...and they faded into obscurity.  Their rules (in that White Dwarf the picture was clipped from) are very cool.  They have access to all kinds of crazy tech, and their cadre go out and train and study war in every aspect.

You could take Mentor Legion cadre to lead other marine squads, etc....even from different chapters.  Loads of really cool fluff and ideas that were just binned.

PS: The bolter targeting web and the slow-motion time freeze wargear were kinda nuts... :D
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Daeothar on January 18, 2022, 09:22:12 PM
Thanks all, guys; your replies are much appreciated :)

@ Storm Wolf: 3rd ed is my personal favourite of all editions. Mostly because that's when I actually started playing 40K actively. I consider 4th to be a refinement of 3rd, with all additional Chapter Approved and Index Astartes articles hardbaked into the basic rules. I have several 3rd/4th ed armies myself.

@ Mr Tought Guy: I already have 2 Space Marine armies where I've used the Painting Guide rank system, which I why I decided to go with the stripes this time.

However, the WD98 article only mentions the Tutor squads sent out to assist other Imperials. I've created some head canon where those markings are only used for those Tutor squads, and regular rank markings are according to those in the Rogue Trader book, in combination with the special markings, such as veteran, dedication, seeking glorious death, etc, are taken from the ubiquous little red booklet.

I find the shoulderpads a bit empty right now though, so I might go for weapon badges after all. Problem is, not all weapons are included in the RT illustration, and there's no further mention of them anywhere (at least as far as I could find). So I'll have to invent several myself.

That's not too arduous though, and I will probably make them into tiny little waterslide transfers, to make my life a little easier.

Also, I feel some squad numbering ought to be in order, as right now, apart from the sergeant (once he gets his banner), no squad identification is possible.

@ Blackwolf: That always is an option, yes lol

@ Elbows: I absolutely feel you there; the test annex instructor chapter take on them was pretty sweet. I suppose I can always still detach a squad for that purpose. In this regard they were a bit like the Legion of the Damned, who you could also add to an existing force with a single squad.

Personally, I always loved the whole testbed platform aspect of the fluff. They're basically asking for all kind of esotheric tech to fieldtest.

And even though I must regretfully admit to never have actually played Rogue Trader, I've read all the books, so I can see that the abilities those technologies granted were pretty cool 8)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Daeothar on January 19, 2022, 08:12:07 AM
As a teaser, because I could no longer contain myself after last night's succesful printing of my first ever 3D design, here are all the components required for the first of my Mentor Legion vehicles.

A 100 internets for the first who can identify the vehicle...  :D

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion13.jpg)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - First squad done!
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 19, 2022, 10:56:31 AM
As a teaser, because I could no longer contain myself after last night's succesful printing of my first ever 3D design, here are all the components required for the first of my Mentor Legion vehicles.

A 100 internets for the first who can identify the vehicle...  :D
Well, I mean, if you're going to make the deodorant hover tank, you're going to need two plastic spoons as well...  ::)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - WIP Vehicle
Post by: Daeothar on January 19, 2022, 11:13:33 AM
You're obviously correct. I suppose it wasn't too much of a challenge, considering the topic of the thread anyway  lol

And they're on their way. I found the exact double medicine spoon required, but they are apparently only sold in the UK. So I had to shell out for 5 of them to be shipped over here...  ::)

For some reason I found myself having the sudden urge to recreate Rick Priestley's Grav Attack vehicle last October. And I not only wanted to make one, I wanted to do a tribute to the original by replicating it.

There are plenty of really nice examples of vehicles inspired by the original, but none that faithfully reproduce it. Now, I'd like to state beforehand that the original was meant to inspire, and was never intended to be an actual standard. I believe mr. Priestley wanted to show what could be done with a bit of inspiration (and anti-transpiration, obviously) in a time when GW didn't have any vehicles in their product line, and didn't have the capacity to either.

But this thing has become such an icon of the Rogue Trader era, that I thought an actual tribute to the original was in order.

So the first thing I did was pour over the few available pictures of the vehicle, to try and identify each and every part. I pretty soon identified that most of the parts used were actually from a Zoids kit called the Guysack (yeah; I know...  lol ). But the launcher and other small boxy part were a bit more of a challenge to locate.

Eventually I found that they came from a larger Zoids kit, called a Redhorn. And while searching for the required parts, I came across a local Zoids collector who happened to have a huge bitsbox, and he was able to sell me everything I was still missing (I had, in the meantime already bought me a broken copy of that Guysack kit).

So that was the Zoids bits sorted, but the deodorant bottle was more of a challenge. Preferences have changed and most brands have long since changed over to either spray cans or  roller type dispensers. The stick variant has gone completely out of fashion.

But then I discovered that there is a whole community of people who make their own deodorant. Who knew? And Amazon actually offers batches of 10 or more empty deodorant stick containers! So I found the correctly shaped ones and ordered them.

Big disappointment though when they arrived; they were only 8cm tall, so only a little of half the required length. They did not completely go to waste though, since the wheel on the bottom came in handy later on, and my wife, having heard of the whole DIY deodorant scene is now curious to see how that works, so she has claimed dibs on the remaining bottles  :D

So, seeing that it was nigh on impossible to find the correctly shaped bottle, I suddenly realized: I recently got a resin 3D printer, so why not print one instead?

But to accomplish that, I would need to first learn how to 3D draw. Now, I have done some work with Sketchup in the past, painstakingly recreating a room at work (long story; let's just say that it was required at the time), but I also realized that it was not the perfect tool for what I wanted.

So a digital artist friend of mine suggested to go with Blender. It's free and almost an industry standard. But that learning curve...  :o

I realized that if I wanted to get the result I was after within a reasonable timeframe, I'd need something simpler. So I went back to the web based free Sketchup version and started to tinker around with that.

In the end, the whole bottle is just a couple of really basic geometric shapes, and I managed to get it all done, in two parts, in only two afternoons of work. The most difficult part was the opening for the bottom wheel and the curved corners at the top (or front of course).

The entire model was built with 2mm thick walls, which had to be done manually because of the simplicity of the application. But it worked.

Sort of.

Because somewhere in the process of converting the proprietary Sketchup files to STL format (done by exporting the files to STL from Sketchup), or the slicing process in Chitubox, almost the entire hollowed sections of the shapes were changed into solid blocks. Something I only noticed when checking on the actual printing.

Not a big problem, since it's not visible on the outside. It does add quite a bit of weight to the model though.

Also, the bottom and top surfaces were originally closed off, and there was a hole for the wheel axle to fit through on the bottom. None of those features transfered to the physical print though. Also, a strange recess appeared on the front part (on both top and bottom sides). It's just a shallow indent that was not in the orginal design at all (see picture in my previous post).

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion12.jpg)

But I'm not an expert on these things by far, so I wouldn't know how all of these things came to be.

One feature that did survive is the recesses I put in to accomodate two magnets in the bottom to meet up with a flying stand. However, with the added weight, it remains to be seen if the envisioned magnets will be up to the task now.

And yes; the curved surfaces are facetted. This is due to the limitations of Sketchup and the amount of polygons it can add (maybe the paid version could; I don't know). But I anticipated this and added some extra thickness to the walls to accomodate sanding the curves smooth.

Because in the end, I just wanted a replica of the original deodorant stick; everything else would have been manual work anyway. Would I have been able to source the original sticks, I would have gone with those. The 3D print is simply there to fill in a gap in the parts list that appeared impossible to fill.

I'm aware that the print is nowhere near perfect, but it'll probably work for my purposes.

Now I'll print another pair of these, because I had been planning two vehicles (I also have the parts for two), so when the medicine spoons arrive, I'll have everything required to create two iconic Grav Attack vehicles, that'll count as Razorbacks in this army :)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - WIP Vehicle
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 19, 2022, 11:29:17 AM
If it makes you feel any better, I saw somebody on eBay a few months ago trying to sell one for a ridiculous amount of money, and somebody else who was selling the components to make one yourself for not much less.

As an aside, it tickled me to see that the recent/current FW Custodes tank is an obvious nod to that original home-made Grav Attack Tank.  :P
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: zemjw on January 19, 2022, 01:41:16 PM
There are still some stick deodrants out there. Gillette Endurance is one such - link (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Gillette-Endurance-Antiperspirant-Clear-70ml/dp/B07SJ6HY3B)

They're 65mm wide, 25mm deep and 110mm tall. The end cap is shaped differently, though.

I always meant to make one, so curious to see how this turns out.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: Daeothar on January 19, 2022, 02:29:37 PM
There are still some stick deodrants out there. Gillette Endurance is one such - link (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Gillette-Endurance-Antiperspirant-Clear-70ml/dp/B07SJ6HY3B)

They're 65mm wide, 25mm deep and 110mm tall. The end cap is shaped differently, though.

I always meant to make one, so curious to see how this turns out.

Cheers.

And yes; I did find several. But in order to make a faithful representation, exactly the same (or nearly exactly the same) bottle is required.

The ones I did find were all off in size, dimensions or shape. Loads had curved surfaces, while I was looking for flat sizes instead. Or the tops were flat instead of rounded. None matched the shape as used by mr. Priestley.

It absolutely was the style of the era, and it changed over the years. I asked around at a renowned pharmacy here, and the woman knew exactly what I meant. They used to carry them too. About 30 years ago...

And since I'm a stickler for detail (which one has to be if one wants to build a replica after all), it was either up to months of searching and loads of luck, or to have a go at it myself. So I went for the 3D challenge instead  :)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 19, 2022, 04:05:27 PM
Old school with a modern twist. I like it  8)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: llisos on January 20, 2022, 08:04:22 AM

You will be the envy of many of us who write here.

Those of us who like oldhammer have always wanted to build a grav tank exactly like Rick Priestley's.

Congratulations!
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: YPU on January 20, 2022, 09:24:12 AM
Daeothar has a resin printer now? oh no what madness this way lies.

I love that your using it to recreate a classic scratch build to replace missing parts, that's just an absolute perfect marriage of new and traditional there.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: Daeothar on January 21, 2022, 10:52:32 AM
Thanks guys :)

Daeothar has a resin printer now? oh no what madness this way lies.
lol Oh, you don't know half of it :D

BUt I'm only a well meaning absolute beginner; I bow down to your 3D skills; I've got a long way to go before I can create stuff even half as good as yours...

I've wet-sanded the two hull halves to get rid of the polygons and this worked perfectly. It's hell on standard sanding paper though, so halfway I switched over to belt-sander paper, and that's rugged as F, so I'll use that from the start next time.

Added advantage is that the whole shape has been keyed for primer at the same time.

Funny though how back in the day Rick Priestley did his utmost best to get rid of the smoothness of the surface of his bottle by rought sanding it and adding VIM to his basecoat to add more texture, while I'm trying to get it as smooth as possible lol

I will be going over it with a fine grit sandpaper later on (also wet, obviously), to get rid of the obvious sanding traces.

Now I'm repairing some of the areas where the print went off from the design. I mentioned the solid blocks inside, which will at least give me a good base to attach everything to.

But my design originally contained closed off walls on the front and rear surfaces as well (for the rear hull) and a closed off rear surface for the front portion.

The idea was to sand the front wall of the rear portion to the correct angle (the original has the front sloped downwards ever so slightly. It took a second good look at the available pictures to realize this, and of course I need to incorporate this in my replica).

But since the front is now open, I needed to improvise.

I first sanded the remaining edges at the correct angle, and then added a plasticard spacer by layering pieces until I was the correct hight. I then superglued this in place.

This will give a solid surface for the glue to take when attaching the front. However; I will also be pinning both pieces together, right through that spacer, into the solid resin for added strength.

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion15.jpg)

I then turned my attention to the rear.

This was supposed to be closed off too, as you can see in the Sketchup picture up in the thread. So I made a couple of filler pieces, which will be supported by the solid resin block in the center of the hull. I even made it so the pieces will be slightly recessed, just like I designed them :)

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion16.jpg)

Finally, I have filled in the two mysterious slots in the nose section (top and bottom) with some strips of plasticard. They've been textured by scribing a diamond pattern in them, so they will give more purchase for the Apoxy Sculpt I will be using to fill the gaps and make everything as smooth as intended.

Then there is a repair required on the side of the nose. This occurred when I Used too much force in the wrong place when prying the print off the build plate. The resin was still uncured and soft, and therefore gave in when I tried to lever the print off ::)

Another lesson learned, that...

Anyway; I'll be using Apoxy Sculpt here as well, but to limit the amount of material required, I put in a simple plasticard filler base.

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion14.jpg).

That's it for now, but stay tuned for more progress... :)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP
Post by: YPU on January 21, 2022, 11:30:06 AM
Thanks guys :)
lol Oh, you don't know half of it :D

BUt I'm only a well meaning absolute beginner; I bow down to your 3D skills; I've got a long way to go before I can create stuff even half as good as yours...


Oh the fun of understanding the weird idiosyncrasies of your cad program of choice, cause they never work the way you want them to. I think I've heard people say they design stuff in ketchup at x10 size so you get a finer mesh output, and then shrink it in the slicing software so you have less visible polygons to sand off.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 21, 2022, 01:11:52 PM
Not to diminish your efforts or learning, but out of curiosity I had a quick search for "stick deodorants for men", and here in the UK at least they still seem to sell that kind of product.
Mitchum Advanced Powder Fresh Anti-Perspirant Deodorant Stick is just about a perfect match, for anybody else who might fancy making one, and they seem to retail around £3.5-5.0 each. There are other brands too, some of which have slight contours or textured sections that would probably make the final vehicle a bit more interesting.

Anyway, just thought I'd mention it for interest. :)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: Daeothar on January 21, 2022, 02:37:57 PM
Major, thanks for looking, but I have to disagree there  :)

Yes; there are still sticks being sold, even though the majority of non-spray on deodorant is rollers these days. I did find plenty of them, but all the shapes I've encountered to date (including the ones you pointed out) are off.

The Mitchum ones you found for instance do not have flat sides, but rather curved surfaces. And I've seen people make interesting fascilisms of the original with them, but exactly the same they're not.

It's like I said; the flat shape as used in the original was a product of its time, and taste and design language have changed over the three decades since then.

And just because I can be absolutely analy retentive when it comes to details at times, it irked me that I could not source the exact shape anymore, while I was attempting to make an exact replica of the original. And that's why I went for the designing and printing option.

Which is proving to be an interesting learning experience as well  :D
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: Major_Gilbear on January 21, 2022, 03:03:45 PM
Ah, you mean these an elliptical oval cross-section, rather than a round-ended flat oval? I see - I couldn't tell that from the images of the products I found, but I'll take your word for it.
Also, nothing wrong with being fastidious!  ;)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: NotifyGrout on January 21, 2022, 03:45:16 PM
I'm really loving this. I've been itching to get my old Warzone stuff out of storage, and those models share a case with my RT marine collection.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: Daeothar on January 21, 2022, 05:25:16 PM
Ah, you mean these an elliptical oval cross-section, rather than a round-ended flat oval? I see - I couldn't tell that from the images of the products I found, but I'll take your word for it.
Also, nothing wrong with being fastidious!  ;)
Your wording is a lot better than mine, but yes; it's all about the cross section!  :)
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP2
Post by: Daeothar on January 27, 2022, 11:15:30 AM
While still waiting for the spoons to arrive, I've taken to slowly prepping the bottle/vehicle for the final placing of the rest of the bits.

This means that I've now finished sanding the surface smooth and ironing out any faceting on the curves. Remaining is the rounding off of the bottom/rear edge, which I will probably do today.

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion19.jpg)

I've placed the rear/bottom gapfillers, and puttied over the gaps in the hull sections, and sanded those flush with the surface as well. Some I had to do twice, since the Apoxy Sculpt did not grip the underlying surface as well as it should. I did the second attempt with ProCreate, heavy on the dark component, and this took much better. And because it was harder  due to me going heavy on the gray, it cut and sanded just as well as the Apoxy.

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion17.jpg)

Then I drilled holes for the pins to hold both hull halves together, so they can now be dryfitted.

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion18.jpg)

A good thing, because I had to go in and file/sand down one part of the recessed area between the two halves because it almost sat flush with the front part of the hull there. But this too worked  out pretty well in the end.

A lot of effort just to reproduce what in essence was just a piece of trash, but here we are...  :D

Then I started on the decals, but for some reason Photoshop crashed just as I was finishing up (of course without saving progress along the way). Three hours of work down the drain, and I've not built up the courage and motivation to start on that chore again...  :?

So the only thing still left to do before I can proceed with assembly was the prepping of the Zoids bits by removing the mould lines from all components and filling several hollow areas, which were probably moulded like that to save some material/weight.

I have not bothered with the parts that get glued flush to the hull, but the two tanks(?) flanking the turret did have those unsightly gaps on the undersides, so those were filled and shaped. Just like a couple of attachment holes (for pegs on other parts on the Zoids constructs) on the other parts.

The magnets for the bottom are also still en-route, so until I receive those, I will have to be patient now. Luckily, the mail man dropped off another couple of Marines just now, so I might perhaps start on the second squad :)

Then again; I start a new job next Monday, so hobby time might end up to be so limited that there won't even be time for that... ::)

And just because I can, here's a shot of the assembled hull. The slanted nose section can now be seen well:

(http://www.d1-games.com/ForumPics/Gaming/MentorLegion/MentorLegion20.jpg)

Oh, and then there's this thing I've been pondering on for quite some time: the original has panel lines painted on, but I have the opportunity to actually scribe them. Should I go that route, or should I stay 100% true to the original? I'm leaning towards scribing them, as it will look better, and I've already gone ahead and drilled the main gun's barrel and filled holes and gaps in the Zoids parts. Both things Rick did not do on his original...  :-X
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: OSHIROmodels on January 27, 2022, 11:20:54 AM
As itís an updated version, Iíd scribe them on (itíll make it easier to paint as well).
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: BeneathALeadMountain on January 27, 2022, 12:03:57 PM
Definitely scribe them on if you have the patience- a homage can be better (thought out and executed) than the original.

BALM
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: Curis on March 07, 2022, 06:11:14 PM
I'm watching this with eager eyes!  Your dedication to the right type of spoon, and gathering up the Zoid parts is inspirational.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: Daeothar on March 08, 2022, 11:49:08 AM
Cheers :)

The project is a bit on hiatus at the moment because of starting a new job, getting hit with COVID Delta and also because I'm pondering what to do with my (first) grav vehicle after a series of mishaps during scribing the panel lines.

See; I'm used to the relative softness of polystyrene when scribing, and the ABS-like resin I used for the print is rock hard. So there were many, many slips and other accidents during the scribing process, which stalled halfway through, disgusted as I was with the very sub-par results.

Also, because it's harder, I broke one of my finer scriber points, so I took to using a more heavy duty one. This worked (bar the slippage), but I fear the resulting lines are way too broad now.

So I'm contemplating re-doing the entire design, scaled up quite a bit (according to YPU's suggestion), and then adding the panel lines into the design. This way they will be uniform on both vehicles (I'm still planning to do two), and I can control just how deep and wide they get. Also; making them across complex curves may be a bit less difficult this way (this is where I struggled the most).

But I'm still gathering up courage to restart the entire design from scratch (no pun intended lol ).

As an aside; the spoons have finally arrived :D I've already prepped/split one to be used as both the turret and the cockpit.

In the meantime though, I've started painting the second squad of six and having fun with them. Pics to follow shortly.
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: Curis on March 21, 2022, 10:20:44 PM
Not that I'm delighting in your misery, but I saw you were going to scribe and felt envious because I don't have any of the tools to do that.  So secretly glad that reworking the 3D model is the way you're going there.

And get well soon!
Title: Re: Rogue Trader Mentor Legion - Grav-Attack Vehicle WIP3
Post by: Dr Mathias on March 22, 2022, 03:02:04 AM
Cool project :)

Always liked the Mentors.