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Miniatures Adventure => Age of Myths, Gods and Empires => Topic started by: sgzleada71 on January 31, 2022, 12:55:47 PM

Title: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: sgzleada71 on January 31, 2022, 12:55:47 PM
I'm looking at doing a squad of Corinthiana Hoplites and I'm wondering if anyone is aware of a specific shield design/ motif that is iconic, or at least commonly used,  in Corinth ?  In the way that we recognise the  ie  Spartan Lambda,  Athenian Owl, Theban club ...
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: has.been on January 31, 2022, 01:08:36 PM
I know one City State used the Trident, don't know
if that was Corinth though.
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: tikitang on January 31, 2022, 01:34:17 PM
Wikipedia says:

The Upper Peirene spring is located within the walls of the acropolis. "The spring, which is behind the temple, they say was the gift of Asopus to Sisyphus. The latter knew, so runs the legend, that Zeus had ravished Aegina, the daughter of Asopus, but refused to give information to the seeker before he had a spring given him on the Acrocorinthus." According to legend, the winged horse Pegasus drank at the spring, and was captured and tamed by the Corinthian hero Bellerophon.

Also, an image from the same article depicts what I think is a coin from the city, showing Pegasus on the tails side:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File%3ARavel_1008.2.jpg

So, how about Pegasus?
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: tikitang on January 31, 2022, 01:53:30 PM
Typing in Corinth Shield into Google Images produced this result, so I think I am on the right track...

(https://slm-assets.secondlife.com/assets/9298437/lightbox/Corinth_Pegusus_Greek_Hoplite_ADD_SIGN.jpg)
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Easy E on January 31, 2022, 03:46:47 PM
Well, this is a really loaded question.  You see, it really depends on what time period we are talking about?
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Jjonas on January 31, 2022, 07:17:44 PM
As shown (above) Corinth has an association with the Pegasus so it is a a common patron hero symbol. I use it for some of my Corinthian models.
Other Greek symbols are common as there is no real uniformity- unless you wish to build your units that way. Later on there were episodes of uniform shield colors and designs, but to real idea that personal gear would conform to that. The shield guide below has many common styles used by Corinth.

Below is my "Corinthian" Victrix general.

Roger Payne illustration of Corinth suburbs, just for fun.

Coins of city states as well as vase art gives a clue to the common symbology of a city state. Mantinea used tridents. Argives used octopi and serpents. Thebes had clubs. Athens the owl. None of these symbols would be 'uniform'.

https://www.wildwinds.com/coins/greece/corinth/i.html

Luke Ueda-Sarson's excellent web resource has been inspiring folks for many years:

http://lukeuedasarson.com/Greek_shield_patterns_1.html

My heroes of Greece page slowly evolves and has some city state ideas, although my Aristeus of Corinth page is not complete yet.
https://ancientbattles.com/HeroesOfGreece/HeroesOfGreece_title.html




Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Easy E on January 31, 2022, 08:32:28 PM
Yes, my thought was to not get hung up on it as each Hoplite tended to personalize their own shield emblems, and any uniformity was very late in the period. 

Interesting to note that Corinth was also a very active sea power as well.  Athens gets all the press, but Corinth was no slouch in that department either.
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Jjonas on January 31, 2022, 08:53:36 PM
I agree. Corinth was a sea power. Maritime symbols and items of commerce would be on my radar for my Corinth brigade.
Dolphins, ships, and stuff like that.
Corinthian hoplites were relatively wealthier than most. That’s another factor to weigh in.
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: carlos marighela on January 31, 2022, 09:03:49 PM
Well, while I don’t like to talk about o timão, there is of course a fairly famous motif.
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: VonAkers on January 31, 2022, 09:58:17 PM
sgzleada71
Mate no one is really sure what the Shield Emblems were.
Having had a Stupid amount of Hoplites recently painted , here are  my thoughts.

Want Corinthian  Hoplites , easy paint up or use shield transfers, and "Theme "the unit by having a couple of Pegasus horses in Front Ranks , couple of Tridents , as a nod to their Maritime heritage.
However dont make them all the same , these were Citizen Hoplites , supplying their own equipment , and they were not uniform , or all had the same shield emblems  , mix it up a bit .
Spartans are the exception here , and look better more uniformed .
Lastly mute the colours down , I have seen wonderfully painted figures , painted so brightly they look like the Walt Disney Hoplites  ... yuck
Hope this helps
Cheers
Ps Only the front 2 ranks really matter as well , cant see more than that
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: has.been on January 31, 2022, 11:30:28 PM
Quote
However dont make them all the same , these were Citizen Hoplites , supplying their own equipment

Good point. Think about modern football (soccer) supporters.
They:-
Provide their own 'equipment',
Tend to follow a (Club) theme e.g. Red & White or Blue,

Yet look at a crowd & you will see:-
Wild variation as to the main colours,
some with this seasons shirt design,
some with shirt designs from years ago,
some with the Away coloured shirt &
a few with no colours showing.
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Jjonas on February 01, 2022, 12:26:58 AM
The re-enactors like things bright and shiny, just like Apollo wants them.
I defer to them and like bright colors mixed with simple black designs on bronze backgrounds.

https://images.app.goo.gl/fYkfy2vtateTJxha8
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Fremitus Borealis on February 01, 2022, 01:42:19 AM
Good point. Think about modern football (soccer) supporters.
They:-
Provide their own 'equipment',
Tend to follow a (Club) theme e.g. Red & White or Blue,

Yet look at a crowd & you will see:-
Wild variation as to the main colours,
some with this seasons shirt design,
some with shirt designs from years ago,
some with the Away coloured shirt &
a few with no colours showing.

Yep, this is a brilliant analogy!
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: sgzleada71 on February 01, 2022, 03:09:26 AM
Thanks all for your  generous input .   I'll use the Pegasus as the 1o logo and a variety of others to keep the historical authenticity decent  :) 
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: carlos marighela on February 01, 2022, 06:12:22 AM
Good point. Think about modern football (soccer) supporters.
They:-
Provide their own 'equipment',
Tend to follow a (Club) theme e.g. Red & White or Blue,

Yet look at a crowd & you will see:-
Wild variation as to the main colours,
some with this seasons shirt design,
some with shirt designs from years ago,
some with the Away coloured shirt &
a few with no colours showing.

Some years ago I wanted to paint up the Portuguese Colonial garrison in Rio de Janeiro circa 1710.  The uniform colours are described by Fragoso but there are no existing examples of their colours or any descriptions thereof. We do know the typical windmill style flag was popular with the Portuguese but there is no definitive source on colour or design. I decided that the simple hack was to use the bandeiras from the various modern day samba schools which mostly use the windmill pattern. Nobody can argue they aren’t correct and they are in keeping with the theme (sort of).

Using that logic, an anchor and oars logo from the football club isn’t that far from the beaten track. At least it isn’t Fluminense.  :D

By the by I’m nicking that analogy to football supporters, it’s brilliant!
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: SteveBurt on February 01, 2022, 10:12:42 AM
The trident I think is associated with Megaera. Pegasus will look good, although it is a lot of work to paint; I’m sure someone does transfers which can be used
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: has.been on February 01, 2022, 10:59:03 AM
Quote
Yep, this is a brilliant analogy!
Thanks, I helped out at a school for 12 years & as my loves
are History & Art I was often trying to find ways of 'getting
the idea' over to pupils.

Quote
By the by I’m nicking that analogy to football supporters, it’s brilliant!
Feel free, glad you like it. :)
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Jjonas on February 01, 2022, 03:41:34 PM
The trident I think is associated with Megaera. Pegasus will look good, although it is a lot of work to paint; I’m sure someone does transfers which can be used

Or make your own on your inkjet. I find that often the commercial versions available don’t fit my needs for repeated designs.

https://www.ancientbattles.com/HeroesOfGreece/AncientBattles_Homebrew_Transfers.html

Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: sgzleada71 on February 02, 2022, 09:11:21 AM
Thanks  Jjonas.  Nice tutorial.   I've done my own shield transfers w decent results.   I do find that some come out fine but others very smudged.   I've not worked out why. Same printer and paper each time.  Anyhow cheaper and more satisfying than commercial transfers. 
Title: Re: was there an iconic CORINTHIAN SHIELD motif ?
Post by: Jjonas on February 03, 2022, 12:29:04 AM
I’ve found the biggest measure of success or failure is how much or little my clear coat covers. I tend miss the ends so now I try to really cover the whole sheet. The plastic acrylic coating is what keeps them from just dissolving so thicker is the side to err on I think.