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Other Stuff => Workbench => Topic started by: Hawkeye on November 10, 2009, 07:46:03 PM
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Hello all,
I'm posting this in order to draw on your collective wisdom and experience concerning the issue of gaming mats and tables. So, here's the situation. I am slowly reaching the point where enough of my Old West buildings have been painted that they need a surface to be placed on for gaming. I've been scouring the net looking for different gaming mats, as I want a dull desert yellow board, but I have two problems.
1) I'm uncertain whether I want a mat that I can simply roll out for games (as this would be easier to store), or whether I want separate boards.
2) If I do go down the mat route, I want one that's not going to crack, or lose its surface texture, if it's rolled up for storage.
One thought I've had, which falls somewhere in the middle of the various options open to me, is to get the Zuzzy Sulfur Fields mat, and then cut it and glue it to 2x4 foot board sections so that the boards can be stored. I've also looked at some fabric mats online as well, but I suppose the bottom line is that I want the mat to look good, have some surface texture, and be durable.
I know that there is a third option - sand and paint the boards myself - but I've always found that sort of gaming surface to be very tough on painted minis, which is why I'm thinking of a cloth mat, or the latex rubber Zuzzy mat. In my mind, they would be far more forgiving to my minis when they inevitably take a tumble.
So, do any of you have any advice, or any experience concering the Zuzzy mats, or any fabric mats, for that matter? Any help at all would be appreciated, as I really want to get a board together for these buildings (and minis!), and get some photos taken to put up on the forum!
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I am VERY interested in this topic as well Hawkeye and I find myself pretty well at the same stage.
I have looked at commercial rolled mats and have found them a little expensive.
Personally I'd like to avoid the sanded boards, because of storage concerns.
I'd love to know what are the best methods of making a durable cloth/canvas, textured or at least believably painted game mat DIY.
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Good to know that there are others in the same position as me, Sultana. Storage is an issue for boards, it's true, but it also becomes an issue for roll-up mats if the surface gets damaged from rolling it! I don't want to just leap into this, as I'd like to be able to get my board (or mat), and not have to worry about it again for a long time!
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Zuzzy matts look very nice, and seem to have some very attractive properties. Do you really need to cut them up and glue them to boards? It seems, from accounts, like they lay very flat and firm on a table since they are latex.
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I have had the same struggle for years and I think the solution is....
WALLPAPER!!!!!!!
I have found wallpaper with structure that looks like sand, like cobblestones etc. I havenīt decided if I will glue it directly to the IKEA tables or if I will glue them to plywood or hardboard. This will solve the town and desert needs. For grass I will use green felt. For special projects I will build smaller separate terrainboards.
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I've stuggled with this issue, Hammers. For me, it's a question of being able to set up either a 4x4 board OR a 4x6 board. I'm notoriously clumsy, and if there's a gaming board with a gaming mat hanging over the edge (say on a 4x4 table), I will almost inevitably snag against it and pull the whole thing (models, terrain, and myself) onto the floor. The boards seem safer to me. As an index of my calamitous clumsiness, I've had three surgeries since May, and I'll be having a fourth in December, all from different accidents and general unluckiness. Now that I'm older and (a bit) wiser, I've been trying to be a little more careful!
The important question, though, is this: are the Zuzzy mats nice enough to justify the expenditure? They look fantastic, I have to admit.
EDIT: Traveller - I use textured wallpaper for the bases of my Mordheim buildings to represent cobbles, and while I like the look, it's not as durable as I'd like - hence my interest in the latex rubber gaming mats, or fabric ones. I'm planning on really going to town with my Western town!
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What about static grass terrain paper glued to 52mm polystrene insulation board? They are lightweight and reasonably compact and the static grass won't scratch your minis.
PS: Sorry to hear about your surgeries!
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I'm just a few steps behind you. I just received some miniatures and started painting and built one shop so far, working on a saloon as we speak. I've already decided a mat for myself. It will canvas cloth from a fabric store. Its sandy colored, looks nice, folds up well, and can be draped across any surface and instantly turn it into a sandy south west locale.
When I used to play Pirates of the Spanish Maine, both my friend and I bought blue cloth and drew nautical symbols etc on them with sharpies. It was a simple solution, and made impressive results among other gamers.
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Thanks Silent Invader - and the static grass mat is not something I've ruled out. I've noticed that the static grass tends to rub off a bit over time, which would be the only thing that puts me off them.
Nomadik - good to hear you're on the Old West trip as well. I'm enjoying not just painting the minis, but also building the terrain! Like you, I have considered fabric from a fabric store (in a suitable colour), and had planned to take a look for some this weekend.
Lots of ideas here, though - anyone have one of the Zuzzy mats? I'm really interested to know what people's thoughts on them are!
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A cheap solution I used was to buy some faux suede in a light tan for my desert gaming needs and some dark blue faux leather for my water/naval gaming needs (Both from ebay, when I lived in the UK. Haven't looked in N America, yet, but I'd like a green mat, soon).
You can texture the suede by flocking/adding sand/paint fx (I haven't done the whole mat, but have tried some tests, and it looks ok and holds up pretty well, I'll do the whole thing, one day ;)), and you can paint the faux leather to look like the ocean (dark greens, whitecaps, whatever you like).
I've also cut off around 12 x 60 inches from the faux leather and made modular rivers/ponds to lay across the tan mat.
The fabric is usually 50/60 inches wide, and you can get it as long as you like!
I sometimes lay the 'ocean' on the table first, and make an island or coast by ruffling up the tan mat on top of it.
The bonus is that they roll up and can be stored vertically in the game cupboard (wrapped around a dowel).
Cheap and cheerful, and very convenient.
Edit: To say that they are upholstery fabrics, so quite tough, with a good woven backing; not lightweight fabrics for clothing, etc.
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I've done it the easy way and the hard way. For a quick, easy, cheap board that is easily stored, go to a fabric store and buy some felt in the relevant colour. Lay it out and use spray cans to give it a shift in colour and texture (the texture doesn't really change it just looks that way due to the changes in colour). If you want to you can glue it to boards (which I have) or leave it loose.
It's surprisingly effective once you add the scenery.
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I've noticed that the static grass tends to rub off a bit over time, which would be the only thing that puts me off them.
Very true, especially if it gets wet! To get over this I spray mine with a matt sealer that (so far) has held it together. :)
I should also mention that you can get shrinkage and creasing when pasting it, though there are ways to deal with this.
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I've done it the easy way and the hard way. For a quick, easy, cheap board that is easily stored, go to a fabric store and buy some felt in the relevant colour. Lay it out and use spray cans to give it a shift in colour and texture (the texture doesn't really change it just looks that way due to the changes in colour). If you want to you can glue it to boards (which I have) or leave it loose.
It's surprisingly effective once you add the scenery.
Great idea, or I have used an old bed sheet that I scrounged from somewhere, it was beige to start with, I sprayed it with various sand/earth colours, dipped it in a bucket of coffee and tea bags and when dry it turned out surprisingly well and has served as a desertscape for years.
I have recently made my own boards from the pink and blue polystyrene sheets, but as you say storage is a problem .
I own one of the grass mats from Antenociti's Workshop -
http://www.barrule.com/workshop/gaming%20mats/gaming%20mats%20for%20wargamers.html
I am very happy with it, it sits rolled up on top of a cupboard and so far has been very useful, no problems with losing flock or cracks. They also do a sand one which I was sorely tempted with.
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As an index of my calamitous clumsiness, I've had three surgeries since May, and I'll be having a fourth in December, all from different accidents and general unluckiness.
That's rough, brother! I am myself know as a scourge of anything standing erect on a table, but I have to receive surgery because of it.
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Some great ideas here - thanks for the feedback everybody!
Supercollider - that's a good idea, in fact. Faux Suede would be a bit more robust than felt, but it would still be forgiving on miniatures.
Dewbakuk - I've been thinking of felt (you know, in a manly wargaming way), and I like the idea of misting/spraying with suitable colours of paints to break up the colour and give it the appearance of texture. Great idea (and with some drybrushing here and there, as supercollider suggests, it would really enhance the textured look).
Malamute - thanks for the Antenociti's Workshop link, and for the recommendation - I'll look into it as an option. I like the sound of what you did with the sheet - it sounds like what Dewbakuk and Supercollider are suggesting too, so that's three reasons to do it!
Hammers - thanks. Yes, I have a reputation for disaster, in and around the gaming table, and it's actually something that I think of when I plan tables and playing surfaces. For example, I use the GW City Fight plastics, and convert them by covering over the silly excessively sci-fi features to make mausoleums and so on. It makes nice terrain, but those spiky bits on the balconies and so on are VERY sharp. I stabbed myself so badly once, reaching for a model, that when I jerked my hand away the whole building came with it. THE PAIN! THE PAIN! Most of the injuries I suffer are from sporting accidents, though, or at least they used to be (tennis - broke my elbow, and, without realising it, ruptured a disc in my neck - that needed surgery this summer, about eight years after I actually had the accident. Kick-boxing - dislodged the ulnar nerve in my left elbow throwing a punch. You could see it popping loose under the skin for years. Hurt like hell, but didn't realise that it was a real problem, causing nerve damage, until some ten years after the incident. Result? Another surgery this summer). For these sorts of reasons, I really want a solid, safe, secure gaming table, preferably with some sort of foam padding in case I fall over! I don't mind telling people that my surgeries are the result of a fall playing tennis, or a kick-boxing injury, but I can't imagine trying to explain that it's an old wargaming wound!
Thanks again for all the ideas everybody!
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I use a blanket, one of those fuzzy lap kind, with a dessert camaflage print. It works for old west with my cowtown buildings on it. Or for Northwest frontier or the Sudan for colonials.
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I use a canvas mat that originally had been painted with green latex paint and then covered in grass flock. Last year I had Alfrik resurface the whole thing and it came out very nice. He's got a breakdown of the process here:
http://armoredink.blogspot.com/2009/04/reviving-game-matt.html (http://armoredink.blogspot.com/2009/04/reviving-game-matt.html)
It rolls up nicely and I have not had any appreciable loss of texture and it comes out at least once a month to be played on.
For my western town buildings I made built up araes for the buildings to sit on out of masonite. I put boardwalks down one or two sides and then gave the open areas a coating of artists gel medium to give it a smooth but dirty texture. Painted brown with some grassy areas defined by flocking it works really well.
(http://rotanddrivel.com/IMG_0425.jpg)(http://rotanddrivel.com/Conquest2006%20008.jpg)
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For these sorts of reasons, I really want a solid, safe, secure gaming table, preferably with some sort of foam padding in case I fall over! I don't mind telling people that my surgeries are the result of a fall playing tennis, or a kick-boxing injury, but I can't imagine trying to explain that it's an old wargaming wound!
Thanks again for all the ideas everybody!
Consider gaming in one of these:
(http://www.boysstuff.co.uk/images/prod_zoom_center/sumo_suit_centre_500_93429.jpg)
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Excellent, Hammers! That should take care of things!
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Hawkeye, I followed the same path as Supercollider. I had the luxury of playing on other people's game tables for many years, so wasn't under any time constraints when making up my mind about my own playing surface. Then I saw upholstery material that looked like suede leather in a fabric store named Joann's. The store brand was frequently selling for 40% to 50% off. I made several trips and ended up with enough medium green, tan, and blue-grey to cover a 6ft x 12ft table in each color, with patches of other shades of sand (for beaches), yellow and brown for croplands and roads.
The faux suede upholstery cloth that I bought came in about 54in width (4.5ft), and I had it cut to six foot lengths. Even on sale the material was two to three times the cost of plain untreated and unflocked felt. But I thought it worth the price for the following reasons:
1. Unlike felt, it doesn't need to be treated or flocked to keep from threading out or snagging mini bases.
2. It lays very flat, is very flexible, and drapes nicely over anything underneath.
3. It doesn't smell like treated or painted or flocked felt.
4. It is washable, and I've already been able to clean off a mark I accidentally made with blue ink.
5. The faux suede can have a two tone effect, as the material looked stlighty different when it is brushed in a couple of directions.
6. The material looks fairly organic and comes in a variety of earth tones.
7. It rolls up pretty well on a tube, any wrinkles being not detracting from the look.
8. With a few rocks and brown lichen scattered about, the tan colors are just the ticket for the old west. Personally, I prefer a tan shade with a slight pinkish tint for the ground color in my favorite part of the Old West, the four corners area and Southeast Utah.
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Thanks, Warren - I'm going into Wichita this evening, and one thing on my list was to check out some fabric stores, so I'll look into the faux-suede option. It sounds like it might be just what I'm looking for!
Skrapwelder - thanks for the link and info (your buildings and board look great, by the way!)