Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Captain Blood on January 04, 2010, 04:38:01 PM
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My first painted figure of 2010 – and it’s plastic! :o
This first figure was really a colour test, to check out the livery scheme for my first Wars Of The Roses household – an entirely fictional creation: The Earl of Tandridge.
I’ve made up and primed 14 figures so far - one command sprue and one 'bow and bill' sprue.
There are clearly a lot of variants possible in head / body combinations – less so with the arms. The bow-armed arms tend to only go in pairs (different types of sleeves, see) whilst the way the bill-armed hands / arms have been made, means they effectively have to be used as they come.
Which is a bit of a criticism, because all the billmen are going to look rather samey, whichever head and body combination you put the arms on… :?
Still, they are remarkably beautiful little figures, with good, sharp, raised detail, fantastic period character, natural, realistic poses, and wonderful attention to detail.
I’d give them a comfortable nine out of ten.
On the down side, only three complaints.
1. They are perishin' TINY. They may technically be 28mm tall - but they are extremely diminutive in stature. All the things I’m used to painting on chunky 28mm metals, are extremely difficult to paint in this ‘scale’ – hands, faces, belts, bootstraps, accoutrements etc. All titchy and almost impossibly fiddly. Maybe I’ll get used to them, but I'm worried that if I paint a box of 40 of these, never mind a whole army, I’ll end up going blind. It really reminded me of painting 20mm Airfix figures.
2. There's a pronounced mould line on many of the components. It's (fairly) easily removed with a sharp craft knife - but scraping does leave some unsightly hairyness, so you need to be careful before you prime. It’s a particular problem on those heads where the mould line runs straight down the middle of the face. Scrape away the mould line down the nose, over the lips and down the chin, and you can very easily lose the features as well. To my astonishment, the prep on these figures - including clean up and assembly - took me longer than with metals (where I simply take the Dremel to them).
3. The heads fit onto the bodies via a shallow ball and socket joint. Too shallow in fact. Because most of the helmets have a rim sticking out the back, if you mounted the head ‘as is’ into the socket of the collar, the tendency will be for most of your figures to end up looking down their chests to a greater or lesser extent. I found minor surgery necessary to take a slice off the back of the collar and hollow out the socket a little more, allowing the head to sit square, or – if you wish – chin up slightly.
Anyway, here's the first of 14... See what you think.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/4/577_04_01_10_5_25_17.jpg)
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I rather likes it. :)
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That is a lovely paint job - very, very striking.
One question, which has nothing to do with the painting. Are the feet on the large size?
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2. There's a pronounced mould line on many of the components. It's (fairly) easily removed with a sharp craft knife - but scraping does leave some unsightly hairyness, so you need to be careful before you prime. It’s a particular problem on those heads where the mould line runs straight down the middle of the face. Scrape away the mould line down the nose, over the lips and down the chin, and you can very easily lose the features as well. To my astonishment, the prep on these figures - including clean up and assembly - took me longer than with metals (where I simply take the Dremel to them).
that's what I hate on plastic.
Though top painting job, Captain, like it too.
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Great pant job and review Richard. You're really going over to the dark and plasticky side now!
On the 'chunkiness' side of things, apart from them being a bit fiddly, do they fit in well with your metal 28s? OK? Or a touch of the Perry plastic ACW farmhouse about them (technically in the correct scale, but look a bit small next to most 28s)?
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Lovely stuff Richard :-* :-*
You give us all the moans then produce this, you are at it lol
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That is a lovely paint job - very, very striking.
One question, which has nothing to do with the painting. Are the feet on the large size?
There's nothing wrong with large feet.... ;)
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:-*
Super job, Capt'n!
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Nice paint job, still building mine as I have some other items that require painting first, like some ECW muskets, then ECW sakers x 2, then a an ACW artillery piece and then following that some competition pieces for Salute, may try and paint some for Salute.
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Thanks all - I should say that I heartily recommend them (if your eyes are up to it).
Just pointing out what I found to be the issues, which you might want to be aware of...
;)
On the 'chunkiness' side of things, apart from them being a bit fiddly, do they fit in well with your metal 28s? OK? Or a touch of the Perry plastic ACW farmhouse about them (technically in the correct scale, but look a bit small next to most 28s)?
Actually Paul, because they are more or less right height-wise, the difference in stature alongside metal 28mms doesn't really notice at all. In fact standing the finished archer alongside my recently completed Foundry Zulus, he actually stands a fraction taller than most of them.
So yes, I'd happily use these plastic figures alongside metals.
Not that I have any metal figures for this period... :D
But I'm guessing you are thinking cut-price conquistadors! Late C15th... Just about right :)
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1. They are perishin' TINY. They may technically be 28mm tall - but they are extremely diminutive in stature. All the things I’m used to painting on chunky 28mm metals, are extremely difficult to paint in this ‘scale’ – hands, faces, belts, bootstraps, accoutrements etc. All titchy and almost impossibly fiddly. Maybe I’ll get used to them, but I'm worried that if I paint a box of 40 of these, never mind a whole army, I’ll end up going blind. It really reminded me of painting 20mm Airfix figures.
I'll have to agree with this particular bit! because it was also my impression when I've started to paint their ACW plastics, I even had to use a thinner brush than the one I'm used to in order to paint the details correctly. Although I think the chunkier bits on the metal minis are easier to paint the Perrys are really doing a great job with their plastics!
oh! by the way.... Excellent painting ... but then again, I wouldn't expect anything different from you :D
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And this is just a colour test :o Shame on you Richard, I'm sure you're capable of better than this ;)
Beautiful work and a good write up that includes interesting things wrong with them. It's a shame about the mould lines along the face, I've had metals with that and it's one of the most unwanted jobs I don't want when cleaning and preping.
I heard people complain about the lack of dynamism in Perry figures but I have to say, they are the most realistically posed of all the manufacturers.
cheers
James
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Very nice, thx for the effort of writing this up. You have created a serious dilemma for me: I've got 2 boxes on the shelf, but already too many projects running for the moment... :D
Rudi
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Thanks for the review. Some fair points of criticism, although nothing to stop me from purchasing some (as soon as the Perrys release something more usable for Continental conflicts of this period). :D
I think the tiny details are a consequence of designing models as 3-ups. That's what makes them outstandingly realistic on the one hand, but on the other hand sets them apart from chunky though clearly detailed miniatures we're used to. As long as eyesight is well I prefer this 'new realism' style.
Anyway, looking forward to the complete installment. :)
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absolutely excellent painting, once again
nice review of the figures too
very much looking forward to seeing the rest :D
dodge
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Real good paintjob, but I don't like the figure. What happened to the perrys? It's only GW plastic, and not fantastic...
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very nice please more .
I realy wish to see these figures.
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Seriously gorgeous :-*, your picture could cost me money.
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Have had a snowbound weekend, which has allowed me to press on with a few more Wars of the Roses figures. These damnable little plastic chaps are so lovely that they have diverted me from my second batch of Zulus. Who'd have thought it...
First up, Roger de Brassey, Earl of Tandridge. (Any medievalists out there thinking of telling me that poleaxes didn't have decorated handles - see my face... does it look bovvered? ;))
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_10_01_10_1_47_20_1.jpg)
Another bowman...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_10_01_10_1_47_20_3.jpg)
Bloke with a big spear...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_10_01_10_1_47_20_4.jpg)
The retinue so far (don't worry - it will grow!)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_10_01_10_1_47_20_2.jpg)
And finally, not quite finished basing yet, but thought I'd show you my first stab at a conversion. In fact my first plastic conversion since I last modelled Tamiya figures 25 years ago!
I cannibalised one of the scabbarded swords and a sword and buckler, to make - well, a sword and bucklerman :)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_10_01_10_1_47_20_0.jpg)
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these Perry sculpts are so damn good..and with your painting they're just unbeatable.
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Nice work Captain 8)
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I love these new sculps and combined with your paintjobs they are simply gorgeous!
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Thank you gentlemen :)
Despite my reservation about fiddliness, I have to say these are simply superb figures. I think that what it is, is that these guys actually look like soldiers - tough, purposeful, natural poses. As opposed to the caricatures we're all rather accustomed to in most metal ranges - even the ones I like! ::)
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Yes they are a treat to see, I really like the sword and buckler. I might snag the idea when mine finaly get here in the post.
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Especially love the figure and paint job on Roger. Brilliant.
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:-*
Splendid. You're right about the poses - the second bowman handling the quiver is brilliant, very natural.
Nice conversion too, but there's no way he'll be able to see to fight with that visor down ! ;)
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Can't add anything that hasnt been said already, but wanted to say beautiful as always :)
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The fruits of today's labours... Gradually building up the retinue ;)
Ralph de Brassey, younger brother of Roger, Earl of Tandridge, and his personal banner carrier.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_16_01_10_11_00_37_0.jpg)
Then a couple of pole-armed ruffians...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_16_01_10_11_00_37_1.jpg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_16_01_10_11_00_37_2.jpg)
And, for completeness, the retinue so far...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_16_01_10_11_00_37_4.jpg)
And finally, colour test for my second retinue, the Earl of Crowhurst's...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_16_01_10_11_00_37_3.jpg)
Stop me when you tire of these...
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No keep going! I am enjoy all the eye candie, and besides I need to see how the Earl of Crowhurst's retinue turns out, becase it takes a real man man to ware pink :-*
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Hi Richard, Inspiring as always, but can you please tell me more about the grass you use and were does one purchase this grass. It really provides charm to the base and miniature.
Thanks,
Helen
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Great looking figures Richard. Did you hand-paint the flag and the little emblems on the figures? Thanks for sharing...
Regards,
Hitman
8)
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Your skill at applying the brush is always superb! The colors are always vibrant and lively! Thanks for showing these.
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Just fantastic , so colourful
love the way this is building up
dodge
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Thanks all.
Hitman, yes, the flags and livery badges are handpainted. The badges are rather tiny, hence very simple designs! :)
Cheers
Richard
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Hi Richard, Inspiring as always, but can you please tell me more about the grass you use and were does one purchase this grass. It really provides charm to the base and miniature.
Thanks,
Helen
Ooops - sorry Helen, nearly missed your question there...
I guess you're referring to the grass 'tuft' - it's made by Silflor, although Noch make them as well. They come in a variety of sizes and shades, and basically you just peel them off the backing sheet and stick 'em on (although I always use a spot of superglue, just to be on the safe side).
Not sure where you'd get them in the Antipodes, but someone's bound to sell them. I get mine from Antenociti here in the UK. Link to the catalogue pages below.
http://www.barrule.com/Workshop/scratch%20builders%20paradise/Silflor.html
They aren't cheap, but used judiciously they do give a very nice effect, and a sheet of the things with a few hundred tufts on it will last for a long time!
The other 'grass' is just a mix of spring static grass and flock.
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Very very beautiful painting! And the first time i see the miniatures too, they are very nice, even more so when you think of their plastic state...
Would you happen to know how well they would compare scalewise to Dark sword's GRRM line?
http://www.darkswordminiatures.com/grrm.htm (http://www.darkswordminiatures.com/grrm.htm)
They would work perfect as henchmen to some of the heroes!
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Stunning! Really love these models and youve done them justice.
Im watching closely.
Steve
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Ooops - sorry Helen, nearly missed your question there...
I guess you're referring to the grass 'tuft' - it's made by Silflor, although Noch make them as well. They come in a variety of sizes and shades, and basically you just peel them off the backing sheet and stick 'em on (although I always use a spot of superglue, just to be on the safe side).
Not sure where you'd get them in the Antipodes, but someone's bound to sell them. I get mine from Antenociti here in the UK. Link to the catalogue pages below.
http://www.barrule.com/Workshop/scratch%20builders%20paradise/Silflor.html
They aren't cheap, but used judiciously they do give a very nice effect, and a sheet of the things with a few hundred tufts on it will last for a long time!
The other 'grass' is just a mix of spring static grass and flock.
Thanks Richard very much on the reply. They do indeed provide that little extra effect that goes along way in the overall desire in which you are trying to achieve.
Thanks,
Helen
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Super figures and fantastic painting as usual, Richard.
:-*
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Nice figs Cap! The blue and orange look good together and the motley mixture of pants and jackets suits the era. Top shelf work on the banner as well. Good stuff all around!
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A few more finished...
I'm now onto the retinue of Crowhurst.
First, Gilbert Foyle, Earl of Crowhurst.
I've done a minor conversion on Gilbert, having cannibalised another sword and buckler, to turn him into this pose (having had his poleaxe smashed earlier in the battle, he's resorting to good old-fashioned knightly measures...)
If the Perrys are out there listening (probably not) - one request - please, more bucklers in the next plastic set, plus a few spare assorted weapons? It really would hugely improve the conversion potential of these wonderful figures.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_14_2.jpg)
Next, a couple of the bowmen of Crowhurst...
Mak the Gormless...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_14_1.jpg)
Hal Fletcher...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_14_0.jpg)
And if you think Hal looks a bit gay, well he's meant to, since he's the Lord's catamite as well as his gamekeeper. ;)
So here's the modest retinue of Crowhurst so far...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_14_3.jpg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_14_4.jpg)
And finally, here's the array of East Surrey taking shape. Slightly bigger than actual size...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_24_01_10_3_14_59.jpg)
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Wonderful. Swoon.
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:-*
Magic, Capt'n!
War of the Roses doesn't seem to grab a lot of people, but I've always loved it. In fact I do believe I still have tons of the Foundry's figures hidden somewhere. I especially like the mounted knights.
What are you using as sources for painting the chaps up?
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I used to love the WotR board game "Kingmaker." It would be so cool to play that game but fight the battles as tabletop wargames rather than using the game's own combat system. But someone else would have to paint all the figures. The period interests me, but somehow painting the figures for it does not appeal at all.
Great stuff, Blood.
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Stunning brush work, you've got a very nice style, very fresh and crisp looking :-*
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Thanks chaps :)
Yeah - I used to love Kingmaker too. Still got it in a cupboard. I ought to dig it out and nick some of the livery ideas for other retinues...
Scrope to Masham!
What are you using as sources for painting the chaps up?
Truthfully Ray, I am just making up colour combinations and badges that appeal to me ( I am a very poor sort of historical wargamer, because I really always prefer something which looks the part to something which is accurate... )
But the various retinue names are based on villages and manorial names in the area around where I live :)
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Truthfully Ray, I am just making up colour combinations and badges that appeal to me ( I am a very poor sort of historical wargamer, because I really always prefer something which looks the part to something which is accurate... )
But the various retinue names are based on villages and manorial names in the area around where I live :)
Sounds good enough for me.
What did some folks use to say... "if they didn't exist.. they should have." ;)
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Fantastic painting and I like the figures to.
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Hey Capt Blood are you also working on a back ground for your Earl of Crowhurst and Earl of Tandridge?
I like the paint so far, and the joke about Foyle and his boy toy.
And how did you decided on the Tree for Tandridges Banner?
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omg those are just brilliant :-*
the whole retinue looks just the ticket
very very good 8)
dodge
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Hey Capt Blood are you also working on a back ground for your Earl of Crowhurst and Earl of Tandridge?
I like the paint so far, and the joke about Foyle and his boy toy.
And how did you decided on the Tree for Tandridges Banner?
Only a sketchy background in the back of my mind ;)
The whole area is covered in oak trees... Just seemed like the kind of badge someone from round here would have :)
omg those are just brilliant :-*
Thanks Rog.
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Actually, I wanted to wait with the purchase of the new Perry WOR figures, but after I see your superb paint job ... :)
Verry very good work!!!!!
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Great show again. :-*
Since you've obviously overlooked my comment over at Steve Dean's, please excuse my repeated questions: How many bucklermen could one approximately make out of one of those boxes? And which arms did you use? I spotted a bracer (?) at one of your conversions, so that makes me think of possibilities to avoid as much bowmen as I can (I've just minor to no use for them in my Continental army).
Thanks in advance; I'm looking forward to your next additions.
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Gorgeous!
I really want to take a look at some of these in the 'flesh' next month in York.
Your painting could be a deal breaker!
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Thanks chaps :)
Sorry Mad Doc - I must indeed have missed your question over at Steve Dean's...
There are a measly six sheathed sword and buckler combos in the box, and 40 figures. So you're never going to be able to convert more than a handful into sword and bucklermen.
Yes, many of the left hand bow arms are in positions which lend themselves to adaptation for a buckler, so that's easy enough.
The difficult thing is the sword hand. There being no bare swords provided (so you have to shave down one of the many sheathed swords included) and only two or three 'open' right hands in poses that lend themselves. That said, I'm sure that with more major surgery, some of the polearm hands could be drilled and opened to take a sword, but I haven't tried that yet.
But yes, if you were determined, you could certainly get six sword and bucklermen out of every box of 40.
Let's hope that in the second boxed plastic set (pikes, crossbows and handguns supposedly), they also include a few more loose weapons and shields.
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I don't know if this is useful for any of you conversionists out there but Essex Minis do a whole bunch of loose weapons/shields etc, including bucklers and swords. Might mean you can get a bit more from these minis without cannibalising them too much!
Here's a link anyway...
http://www.essexminiatures.co.uk/frames25equip.html
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Thanks Mr J :)
Might feel a bit weird putting metal bits onto plastic figures, but it's a good idea!
Cheers
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Its only weird the first time. try it, you will like it... lol
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Right who is drawing straws to nip round Mr Bloods house to break fingers on his painting hand before the next LPL ::)
Lovely as usual
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Another unit with pink items :o
I think the Cap'n might be the only person in the world who could get away with using that colour and still make his figures gorgeous lol
These are certainly the best plastic figures I've ever seen and are far better than the vast majority of metals!
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Well, I have to leave these for a little while now, to think about the LPL themed entries instead ;)
Meanwhile, here's another quick n' dirty conversion...
Just thought I'd see how easy it is to make these Perry plastics into dead people...
Not bad, I don't think :)
Such fun...
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_30_01_10_2_14_58.jpg)
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Excellent work Cap'n.
Perfect for "disorder" markers or whatever. Affordable for something largely "peripheral" to most games too :D
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What! He was turning his back on the enemy when he got shot? Coward! ;)
Nice little conversion Captain :-*
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Or he got shot by his own side ?
Treachery or incompetance ?
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OUCH!
I bet that hurt! :D
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Ow you know that would take a few mins to kill him to, sucks to be that guy
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I just got 2 box's in the mail! :D
2 hours of studies and then time to start cuting and glueing. :)
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Enjoy!
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Here are a few more shots of my latest Perry plastic Wars of the Roses figures - my team for last week's round of the LPL...
This is the retinue of Sir John Osney of the Manor of Outwood.
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_35_51_0.jpg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_35_52_1.jpg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_35_52_2.jpg)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_35_52_3.jpg)
And here's the array so far - about half the box done :)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_35_52_4.jpg)
And slightly closer...
The men-at-arms
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_37_09_0.jpg)
The bills
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_37_09_1.jpg)
The bows
(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/5/577_18_03_10_2_37_09_2.jpg)
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Really nice Captain. Are all the command figures from the box show here? I mean what do you have left to build is it only regular billmen and bowmen?
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Well, we'd expect nothing less than this level of gorgeousness! Great stuff, Richard.
I still think that the blue & orange standard looks like it has a giant bunch of celery as its heraldic device. In a good way though...
;D
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Really nice Captain. Are all the command figures from the box show here? I mean what do you have left to build is it only regular billmen and bowmen?
Well there are 4 'official' fully plate armoured command figures (with various arm and helmet options) included in each box. I have used three of the bodies here so far. But there are also several part-armoured bodies too - a couple of which I've used here. So I reckon you could get 8 'knightly' looking characters out of a box at a push. The rest would be bills / bows (plus conversions like sword and bucklermen and casualties). Next up, I'm going for a few low-grade peasant types... ;)
I still think that the blue & orange standard looks like it has a giant bunch of celery as its heraldic device. In a good way though...
;D
Yes, it does a bit. More like broccoli I reckon though :D
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Stunning mate realle excellent job still.
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Very nice! Your earlier effort was enough to get me to order a box even though I had nothing else for the period. I painted up three and while not as nice as yours I was very pleased with the figures. I plan to pop one in the lineup every now and then as a pleasant diversion when I need a break from Napoleonics. So many thanks for that!
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Gorgeous!!
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Excellent sculpts by the Perry's! Fantastic painting :) :)
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How could I overlook this!
Lovely painting!
I like the background you're creating for each retinue...
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At first I thought Sir John's livery was rather bizarre, but the colours actually work very well together :-*
What with these and the pink-coated ECW figures, you certainly can't be accused of using a boring conformist palette ;)
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They are brilliant!
Would it be possible for you to post a picture of one of them besides another mini for scale?
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I used to love the WotR board game "Kingmaker." It would be so cool to play that game but fight the battles as tabletop wargames rather than using the game's own combat system. But someone else would have to paint all the figures. The period interests me, but somehow painting the figures for it does not appeal at all.
Great stuff, Blood.
Ditto
Perhaps a 28mm gameboard with painted character models representing the nobles rather than the fiddly game counters
Cheers
Andy
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Thanks chaps. I can only tell you that (having overcome my initial reservations) they are the most delightful figures to model and paint.
Would it be possible for you to post a picture of one of them besides another mini for scale?
Sue, when I get a chance (and daylight) in the next day or two... :)
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Thanks chaps. I can only tell you that (having overcome my initial reservations) they are the most delightful figures to model and paint.
Sue, when I get a chance (and daylight) in the next day or two... :)
Long days you have in the UK ;) lol
Sorry for the resurrection, I was looking for cabbage....
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yeah! me too! :)