Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => VSF Adventures => Topic started by: Fjodin on May 06, 2010, 07:11:29 AM
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(http://www.diggerhistory.info/images/uniforms2/defenders-empire.jpg)
Why VSF? Because you can see airships, early planes and zulu war era uniform!
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Hey there is a boy scout on the left ???
Nice picture
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Hey there is a boy scout on the left
I can't help thinking that the sneaky side of Baden-Powell's plan was to create boys ready for military service.
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I can't help thinking that the sneaky side of Baden-Powell's plan was to create boys ready for military service.
'Heres your badge for giving johnny foreigner a taste of cold steel'
I can imagine scouts in a VSF setting now.
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I can't help thinking that the sneaky side of Baden-Powell's plan was to create boys ready for military service.
I didn't see a smiley face so I guess that "comment" was intentional. >:(
Maybe Scouts (Been there, done that, got the Eagle badge) just enjoy the setting (Nothing like the Sierra Nevada Mountains, Death Valley at night, or the beach - sand, rocky, or cliffs - at sunrise to remind you that there is life outside "the city,") the skills, the comradeship, and a touch of history. :-*
Life is an adventure, not a conspiracy. 8)
Now :o if you want a conspiracy for a game setting... there are so many insanely twisted thought processes from the Real World (patent pending) that you should ever run out of "good" ideas. lol
Gracias,
Glenn
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In VSF games, you simply must refer to him as Sir Robert Bathing-Towel.
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In VSF games, you simply must refer to him as Sir Robert Bathing-Towel.
Which makes him sound particularly fruity in connection with the scouts :D
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Even at the time it was published, wags such as we tittered at the double entendre in the title of his book "Scouting for Boys." Assuming smutty things about people isn't a new phenomenon. :)
Yes, he did want to instill Edwardian morals into little boys, and teach them valuable military skills so they could be the next generation of warriors, but there was nothing sneaky about it. He was quite honest in that regard. He also wanted them to have fun, doing the kind of out-doorsy stuff he loved doing. He wanted them to enjoy themselves as well as learn useful skills. It wasn't a secret conspiracy, most people at the time would have seen nothing wrong in it. It was before the catastrophe of 1914-18 changed the way many people thought about war. A different time.
Incidentally, this rather cool poster from the Great War was created by Baden-Powell...
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y40/Plynkes/BadenPowellposter.jpg)
(Note the boy scout passing ammo to the Tommy.)
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Well said Plynkes. Initially Baden Powells thought so. Remember that scouts were in practise formed to use boys in non combattant military service. This tradition was still carried at least in the periphery of europe, like greece. Actually boy scouts were used in some early 20th c. conflicts, in most cases collecting goods for the army but in some cases were used in scouting/reconnaisance and even intelligence duties.
I give you some of my experience on scoutism.
I was a boy scout in late 60's in Greece and indeed the main intention was, to train kids for their military future, at least for boys. (the motto of the time was something like for "King, country and religion"). In the scopes of scoutism as per the official book we had then, as far as I remember was stated: " to prepare young boys for their military service". I left scoutism early, just on the outbreak of the dictatorship we had then, so I had little time spend with them.
Some 30 years later both my kids joined boy scouts (though my younger is a daughter! since in the 90's scoutism, at least here, was open for both sexes) and we found that this militarism was minimal. They learned lots of skills (cooking, camping, surviving) and enjoyed themselves. They both left scouting at the age of 18-19, but what they learned helped them in their years ahead. To the time, I think that scoutism proved most useful for my son. He has, already, spent some months in Sahara (and in other places like greek locations and Cyprus) doing palaentological excavations and his learned skills helped him very much. Next August he will join the army for his compulsory military service, but I do not know yet if scoutism will help him or not.
Both nice posters.
boy scouts with their montana hats and shorts would be a nice addition for a british Victorian-Edwardian SF army.
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Why VSF? Because you can see airships, early planes and zulu war era uniform!
Not really VSF. There's no fiction at all. Historical inaccuracy, but no SF...
It is a very cool image though. Where is it from?
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boy scouts with their montana hats and shorts would be a nice addition for a british Victorian-Edwardian SF army.
Sold by the Perry twins under their Mafeking set.
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Sold by the Perry twins under their Mafeking set.
never seen a photo of the minis.
Is there any pic?
I think they have side caps and no montanas.
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Next August he will join the army for his compulsory military service, but I do not know yet if scoutism will help him or not
We have a few Cypriot boys living in the UK avoiding this...........
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never seen a photo of the minis.
Is there any pic?
I think they have side caps and no montanas.
You're right, they do have side caps, sorry. Left hand side of this pic.
(http://www.perry-miniatures.com/images/Mafeking%202/BP%20addressing%20cadets.JPG)
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We have a few Cypriot boys living in the UK avoiding this...........
usually cypriots enter military service at the age of 18 and then go for studies, so some might already have served.
In greece enter military service around 19/20 yoa but students can graduate first and then join the army. My son just graduated from University and because he wants to travel for postgraduate studies he thinks that it is better to go and serve this year just finish this obligation, too.
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Not really VSF. There's no fiction at all. Historical inaccuracy, but no SF...
It is a very cool image though. Where is it from?
Fair's fair, science fiction CAN derive from fully non-fictional parts, and merely be in the anachronistic juxtaposition of those parts. A simple example of dinosaur-riding cavalry should suffice.
Of course, those uniforms existed, could be used ceremonially, at the times those devices existed, and you might have seen both together during jubilees and the like.
The best juxtaposition is adjusting those parts until they suggest a common world. The poster does a good job of inciting my already fevered imagination in that direction.
Doug
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Thanks for the photo.
Akula somewhere has a photo of them painted in black as BUF cadets! (And a nice painting, too)
An now I remember: they do not wear shorts!!!
Let's hope that someone would release a set!
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Well said Plynkes. Initially Baden Powells thought so.
***heavy snippage***
We all should probably give Conquistador slack; I remember as a youngling making allusions to the militaristic nature of boy scout costume and rituals, probably quite cruelly at the time.
I now beg forgiveness.
It was certainly less than appropriate to the organization at the time; the US was in some upheaval, and we were having one of our semi-regular searches for identity. Some of the wounds could be quite deep.
Still, if you go to a certain Baden-Powell Wiki entry:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Baden-Powell,_1st_Baron_Baden-Powell
...it's easy to infer that the title 'Scouting for Boys' was actually a reference to recce training. I think fairly, and I think you'd have a difficult time getting, were he still alive, an apology from his Lordship. He was acting only for King and Empire, of course.
Doug
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There's no fiction at all. Historical inaccuracy, but no SF...
Just curious as to what you find inaccurate. Those uniforms were used on home service well into the 20th Century.
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LAF'er Dan has some converted Scouts for WW2
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3112/2570290254_52b0a3cc02_o.jpg)
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=4642.msg68816#msg68816 (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=4642.msg68816#msg68816)
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Just curious as to what you find inaccurate. Those uniforms were used on home service well into the 20th Century.
There are planes, so the picture is from after 1912 (when the RFC and RNAS were formed). Kneeling chap who looks like he's come straight from filming "Zulu" is not wearing a home service uniform, as he has a Victorian tropical sun helmet on. By 1912 these things had gone the way of the Dodo, replaced by the Wolseley. In 1912 that red uniform would be reserved for full parade or walking out dress (khaki for everyday home service wear after 1902), so he should have some kind of cap on (or whatever else is peculiar to his regiment), not an out-of-date sun helmet.
You did ask. :)
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You did ask. :)
Yes, I did, and I was serious. Thanks for the response!
I can't tell from the image if the kneeling fellow's helmet has a spike or not. There was a white version of the home-service helmet, albeit VERY briefly, and I don't recall when.
-Tommy
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There was a white version of the home-service helmet, albeit VERY briefly, and I don't recall when.
I suspected there might be, but it was the best I could come up with in answer to your challenge. I considered it a fun "Where's Wally?" style diversion for a few minutes to try and find something wrong in the picture. :)
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LAF'er Dan has some converted Scouts for WW2
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3112/2570290254_52b0a3cc02_o.jpg)
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=4642.msg68816#msg68816 (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=4642.msg68816#msg68816)
Scouts with Bren Guns and the like, oh what has the world come too! Cool conversion Dan.
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..and the rifles are out of date. They should have Lee-Enfields, or even SMLE, post 1908, by this stage.
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I was in the cubs and then the scouts in the early to mid 1970s, but got thoroughly fed up with camping and cleaning dixies (pots and pans blackened on an open fire, insides coated with burnt grub). I left and joined the Army Cadets. That was much more to my liking - military training, firing guns, someone else did the cooking and cleaning up etc etc. That could account for the fact that I'm still in the military some 33 years later!!
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I was in the cubs and then the scouts in the early to mid 1970s, but got thoroughly fed up with camping and cleaning dixies (pots and pans blackened on an open fire, insides coated with burnt grub). I left and joined the Army Cadets. That was much more to my liking - military training, firing guns, someone else did the cooking and cleaning up etc etc. That could account for the fact that I'm still in the military some 33 years later!!
You must be an officer because when I served we seemed to do nothing but clean lol
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..and the rifles are out of date. They should have Lee-Enfields, or even SMLE, post 1908, by this stage.
You must have damn good eyes, cause I can't tell what those indistinct rifles are meant to be. :)
What would you say they were?
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Not sure, but they look like bolt action but they don't have the box magazine of an LE.
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The Highlander,by the look of the bit above the trigger looks to me like a Martini-Henry.The picture is a bit like those Knotel prints,widely inaccurate and everyone (well almost) will use it in 100 years time as an example of the British Army circa 1912. The interesting thing is,it is just an propaganda picture......so not too much debate really needed........... o_o
"Of course the army used Martini-Henrys in 1912,that picture says so".