Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => VSF Adventures => Topic started by: Mancha on August 10, 2010, 05:43:47 AM
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Hi All,
I want to ask for your help to plan upcoming Hinterland Miniatures releases. Let me begin by describing what I have, and the immediate two upcoming releases.
What I have available to purchase:
1) The Princess: Single-figure miniature
2) Command Pack: Five-figure group
3) Firing Line: Five-figure group, getting ready to fire
4) Unit Builder: Six-figure group (in two poses), firing
Upcoming releases (in a month or so, I hope):
1) Skirmishers: Five-figure group, rushing forward
2) Maxim Crew: Three-figure group, firing Maxim
So the question is what’s next? I would love your input.
Let me begin by saying that at the moment, cavalry, while obviously necessary, are just too expensive for me. I will do them eventually, but I cannot just yet. That said, I have instructed Paul (assuming he’s willing) to get to work on a mounted version of the Princess herself. You can assume that that will be in the next wave, following the skirmishers and the Maxim crew.
I have a number of ideas for “fun” miniatures. These are things that fit into the army, but aren’t particularly necessary. Examples include casualty figures, guards, bathers, medics, etc. While I hope to eventually get to these, I also need packs that are indispensible to the gamer. In short, I need things that people will need to buy. This is where I hope you can help me. When looking to buy an army of the VSF/WWI variety, what do you need next?
I look forward to your ideas.
Jason/Mancha
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Being an historical type I'm not interested so much in the VSF idea of an army of female hussars, but more the original germ of Prussian princesses that started it all off. In that vein I'd love a figure of Kronprinzessin Cecilie so Viktoria Luise has a friend to discuss girly stuff with:
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y40/Plynkes/Viktoria-Luise-Cecilie.jpg)
Her husband the Kronprinz "Little Willy" in his army uniform (both fancy parade and the one he wore in the war) would be cool too, but is probably straying too far from what you had in mind for your range.
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Cavalry, riding side saddle
ooops just noticed you wont be doing them yet.
How about Heavy Artillery? campaign uniforms with backpacks and pouches?
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Bathing lady hussars for me ;D
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I agree with Plynkes that the Kronprinzessin Cecilie (as pictured) would be a wonderful mini.
Overall, from my VSF perspective, I have loads of choice for normal infantry units. What I seek is "abnormal units." Stuff that isn't out there or been made.
The sharpshooters recently posted by Froggy caught my eye, but there are only three different figures and would need head swaps. I would buy something like that, either Prussian or American British. ;)
Sharpshooters thread:
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=21446.msg261383#msg261383
Really good klanks also seem to be hard to come by. I don't like the ones from Eureka and the ones from Ironclad are kewl, but are a bit small by my tastes. Something in between the two. Big and awkward looking but with neat weapons.
A really heavy rocket unit could be very useful...
Something like this from Yankeepedlar01 (but perhaps a bit more bulky and VSF'ish):
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=18725.msg226110#msg226110
A unit with "special weapons." Thorbjørn Nielsen's Prussian Unfindbarium Jagers come to mind:
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=14864.0
Just some ideas...
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A unit with "special weapons." Thorbjørn Nielsen's Prussian Unfindbarium Jagers come to mind:
http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=14864.0
That is an idea that I can get behind!
As for cavalry, is it the cost of sculpting horses that is a concern? The commercially available horses from ebob could be an option: http://www.ebobminiatures.com/products/horses.htm
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I plan on (when I order) going all Girl Genius and Narbonic with them, so less strictly V and more SF. I can make clanks and over-the-top weapons so I'm afraid my suggestions are less helpful, but that's what I'll be doing.
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I agree with pretty much all of what Ray has suggested :)
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Oh, come on Nick!
You're one of the Kings of VSF in these parts... certainly you have an idea or two.
Put on your electro-magnetic mind machine and let the sparks fly... :D
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I would like to see some Russian themed automatons and maybe a steam babushka
I would also like some male cossacks dancing to entertain the princess.
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An artillery crew is my first desired add-on. Cannon are common, but good-looking crew is not necessarily so.
And Ray is spot on with the desire for 'special weapons' - something adequately techno-illogical.
And, for those of us who make 'nefs, some with goggles and flight gear.
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I would suggest that since you've started a business based on marketing a unit of dismounted hussars, that mounted figures are a necessity! I may be in the minority, but the lack of mounted figures is what has kept me from ordering.
Let me begin by saying that at the moment, cavalry, while obviously necessary, are just too expensive for me. I will do them eventually, but I cannot just yet. That said, I have instructed Paul (assuming he's willing) to get to work on a mounted version of the Princess herself.
I assume by "too expensive" that you're referring to the horses. Have you considered selling the riders only, and making them compatible with another manufacturer's horses? The Ebob ones mentioned earlier come to mind. Also, Castaway Arts has very nice horses (and sells them individually to boot). Given the uniform, make sure they're riding side-saddle!
That said, if you'd like to stick with the women warrior theme, how about some Amazonians?
(http://www.cmhg.gc.ca/cmh/book_images/high/v3_c3_s03_ss02_01.jpg)
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Like Tommy said, I wouldn't mind if you were to branch out to other female troops. Like something from La Guerre au Vingtième Siècle or something. Or even units dressed in retro-futuristic uniforms (from a Victorian lense). Kronprinzessin Cecilie would also be good. There is need for a lady in a pickelhaube.
Also, Chairface makes an excellent suggestion.
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I appreciate all of your input so far, and I hope you'll keep it coming.
Unfortunately, when creating something one wishes to sell, it's necessary to make sure the product has some universal appeal. Female hussars are obviously at something of a disadvantage from the start. This is what's kept me away from VSF-like weaponry. As they are, the Hinterland minis could be wedged into a variety of genres, including WWI (albeit, a weird variety), Pulp, Colonial, Victorian, and VSF. My fear is that I have to maintain this cross-genre adaptability. For this reason, I am reluctant to make specifically VSF weaponry. If there were a way to make a conversion pack, I would certainly consider that.
While Princess Cecilie's look just never appealed to me much, I have to agree that it might be impossible to avoid her. Perhaps she will be the personality in the wave following the mounted Princess.
Cavalry is a must, I know. My plans, as a couple have suggested, are to use eBob horses. These still ain't cheap, especially as I'll still have to pay to have horse equipment and (side-) sadlery added. We'll see how the mounted Princess does, and maybe after that...
I was just looking at Brigade's WWI offerings the other day and it ocurred to me it would be fun to construct an artillery crew for a Krupp gun. That's definately something to consider. I also find the idea of snipers kind of appealing.
Of the new suggestions, the one that appeals to me most is some sort of cold-weather pack, for use as tank crew or in balloons. These would probably have a WWI pilot look to them, with plenty of goggles and mittens. I'll have to get out the sketchpad and start drawing fashionable ladies' attire again. :)
Please keep the ideas coming.
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I think I may be getting the wrong end of the stick (not for the first time :)) - so could I check that it is your intention to produce female figures to expand the range or are you open to suggestions of any sort?
I received the command pack today and am looking fprward tp the release of the skirmishers and Maxim
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I'd completely forgotten how lovely the figures were, so had a squizz to refresh my memory. The command pack looks lovely by the way.
Pilots/Tank crew...
What about despatch riders, Cyclists, a sniper in a particularly floral ghillie suit, a first Aid post with male nurses...
Also what about shirtsleeve order? Some slightly, ahem, more butch types for use as heavy artillery crew?
Swappable heads with the Pikelhaube might be a smart way to go too, producing just the Kaiserine as a character figure?
Just some thoughts...
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- so could I check that it is your intention to produce female figures to expand the range or are you open to suggestions of any sort?
I'm glad you ask. For the time being, I am looking to expand the current range. In effect, I want to stick with the current uniform, rather than starting a new army.
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For World War One, I would like to see more early war German national troops. Like Wurttemberg Line, Jagers and Mountain troops (a really cool unit), as well as Bavaria and Saxon troops. Their unifrom cuff and cuts and equipment were often different than the standard Imperial German line forces. Maxim crews, officers and the like as well as line troops for the above would be appreciated as well. An added bonus would be that early war units would be able to cross over into both VSF and Colonial periods. Prof
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I like the shirtsleeve gunners idea. I've been trying to figure out a way of showing some cleavage in the army, without it being completely gratuitous.
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Mancha,
I've been considering purchasing them and using them for some sort of fictional White Russian unit in Back of Beyond. It would be nice to see some Red opponents for them-I think (Ignatieff would know better) that the Reds did field some sort of women's workers rifle battalions during the Revolution. Not sure if they got to Back of Beyond, but if I've already made the leap of an all girls White group, its not much of a stretch to include Reds lol
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I like the idea with the cyclists... not too many of them around.
The short sleeve "we have busts" order for artillery sounds smashing as well.
I'd also think a bit about doing some mini's with the hats slightly at an angle. Dunno why, but I always liked women who wear a hat tilted. :o
For the "Special Weapons" perhaps you could do a "weapon conversion pack" ala Thorbjørn Nielsen's group. The pack could be used to mod any miniature with a rifle and thus serve both SF and VSF at the same time.
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I like the butt nekkid lady hussars idea - retaining their dinky little fur hats and pelisses obviously... :P
Oh, sorry, I think I'm on the wrong website... ;)
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I've been looking at those Dixon bicycles on and off for a few months now. They appeal to me, although it's hard to imagine what my hussars would do with their skirts to ride cycles.
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I like the butt nekkid lady hussars idea - retaining their dinky little fur hats and pelisses obviously... :P
I know! There's gotta be a way to pull that off. (pun intended)
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In the late 1890's bikes were all the rage, especially for "emancipated women."
(http://bicycleapparel.com/images/man/1894WomBike.jpg)
Check out this link:
http://bicycleapparel.com/womens.html
It could also solve your "butt nekkid" problem, if you wish... ::)
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Nice pic, Ray. I've saved that in a folder of vintage bike pics I've been saving up.
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I would like to see some artillery crew too (either for a WWI piece or a gun like Ironclad’s Electric Cannon). A pack of vehicle crew (with some half figures) would be nice… and what about a pack of mechanics? All female of course…
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I like the idea of Mechanics/Engineers. Also, cold weather/aircrew figures would be cool.
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I can already see a great many uses for the existing range - as soon as I have reduced my lead/plastic mountain a bit, I'm going to order some for a specific use concerning WWWII - believe it or not.
Later, I'll probably use them and others some for some VSF, too. :)
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I like the cyclist idea too!
Something like this might be appropriate too.
(http://talkingsquid.net/blogpix/duocycle.jpg)
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I MUST!!!! agree with Tommy 20. Those Canadian Amazonians were a real unit and we gamers in the Great White North would love to have some. The Space 1889's would likely want them as well.
Please Please PLEASE!!!!!
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Here's what I have in mind:
.- princess Luise sitting (in the manner of the original photo) I would say smoking (I do not know if she actually did but I like the idea). Plus a courrier delivering message, plus a female hussar typing on some typing machine and maybe a guard.
.- during the end of 19th c. early 20th german students used to duel a lot. So, here it is: A couple of female hussars duelling (with swords), plus a couple of aides or so. Nice excuse to show some cleavage, too. They could be in light dress/shirts etc.
.- a set of female hussars: bathing, cleaning etc they also could enjoying themselves (wenching / feasting) , another excuse for cleavage etc. A nice addition could also be a set with a couple of males and females in bathing suits of the era, plus some gents and ladies in summer dresses and hats
.- a set of women in light dress/undress status, as being hastily gathered to defend and could be used in a sort of partizan / civilian /just awaken hussars role.
.- cyclists and motorcyclists, vehicle drivers, pilots, zeppelin crew. mountaineers, explorers. skiers etc etc : good idea.
Leaving aside the hussar themed women I could also suggest:
.- medics, nurses, doctors etc (there is somewhere a photo of two women wearing a slouch hat with the description of "doctors in colonial service") These could be for home and colonial fronts.
.- police constables
.- cantinieres
and lots of other suggestions!
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If you are allowing variation of uniforms (shirtsleeved artillery crew for example) then how about a detachment for colonial service?
Same jacket but in trousers either jodphur type with long laced up boots with socks at the top or ordinary trousers tucked into "jackboots".
A different type of hat (sort of bush hat also like worn by the German East Asia Brigade).
Perhaps also carrying a bit more equipment (back pack with blanket roll).
Of course eventually we are going to want some suitable opposition - how about some female British infantry in early war dress (you could call them Thomasinas!).
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I MUST!!!! agree with Tommy 20
Me too - another vote for the Canadian Amazonians. They feature inthe Space 1889 rulebook.
Not so sure that some of the 'wants' suggested would make financial sense. Semi naked hussars bathing can only have a very limited market - even if they are showing their cleavage. ;)
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(http://talkingsquid.net/blogpix/duocycle.jpg)
I've got a few of these photos tucked away as well. Would be a cool, fun idea. Attaching the side wheels might be something of a challenge though.
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.- princess Luise sitting (in the manner of the original photo) I would say smoking (I do not know if she actually did but I like the idea). Plus a courrier delivering message, plus a female hussar typing on some typing machine and maybe a guard.
I like this idea, as I've had something of a similar one. The typing machine would certainly be unique.
I appreciate all the ideas. Some of them have certainly struck a chord. Please keep them coming.
For the time being, I want to build on the current army, although perhaps with some variations of dress. However, I'm sure that sometime in the future the Hinterland ladies will need an opponent.
I wonder if anyone else has ever considered starting a miniatures company? You Canadians, as a form of national pride, should pool funds and commission those Amazonians. I'd be happy to discuss the ins and outs of getting such a venture started. I think I got Hinterland started for about $2,000, spread out over a number of months, and going mostly toward sculpting commissions and casting.
Please don't regard this as being a dismissal of the Amazonians idea. It's just that if I ever got around to it, it would be pretty far in the future.
Back to Hinterland, would casualty markers of some sort be important? Do people buy dead and wounded minis?
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Same jacket but in trousers
Bite yer tongue! No self-respecting lady would go out in public in trousers!
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Not so sure that some of the 'wants' suggested would make financial sense. Semi naked hussars bathing can only have a very limited market - even if they are showing their cleavage. ;)
What if they didn't show any cleavage?
(http://www.hayesotoupalik.com/images/DSCF1411.jpg)
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Back to Hinterland, would casualty markers of some sort be important? Do people buy dead and wounded minis?
That’s odd. I don’t have any problem with almost any kind of figures but somehow I find the idea of female casualty figures to be a little over the top… but maybe that’s just me?
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See, what I liked about this line was that it respected its subject matter under period circumstances...
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Here are a couple of poses that are more subtle that outrightly wounded figures.
(http://www.vam.ac.uk/images/image/32441-large.jpg)
(http://images.easyart.com/i/prints/lg/1/4/144073.jpg)
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Bite yer tongue! No self-respecting lady would go out in public in trousers!
Ah but these are extraordinary ladies - prepared to make that extra sacrifice for the greater good of bringing the true Teutonic way to the heathen (and co-incidedentally expand the German empire)
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Here are a couple of poses that are more subtle that outrightly wounded figures.
Swooning instead of wounded? I like it. :)
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Swounded? ???
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Swounded? ???
I was considering introducing special rules for such a unit. Enemies may not fire upon the ladies unless they are either automatons, aliens or heathen swine. Civilized troops must engage them in hand to hand combat at penalty in order to disarm and subdue them in a non-disgraceful manner.
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What if they didn't show any cleavage?
[img]
Don't turn this into Hintern-land ;) lol
I'd say, no matter what is done next, as long as it is corresponding with the existing range, it should be OK. Even non-fighting stances and such, as they can be easily used in skirmish/adventure style Pulp or VSF games.
I'm very much looking forward to ordering some of these and getting my brush on them (I have a very distinct colour scheme in mind), and the more useful figs there are in the range before I'm ready to order, the larger my order will probably be :D
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How about a pack of figures standing at attention? That could be helpful too, eh?
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How about a pack of figures standing at attention? That could be helpful too, eh?
Guards! Or Inspection.....
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I too like the idea of the Canadian Amazon Battalion. In general I would like to see the same kind of figure packs that you have already done but with a different national style of uniform ie: France, perhaps female Zouave/chasseur types, Italian style Femal Bersaglieri/Carabinieri or British with female Grenadier Guards/Highlanders etc
I am sure whatever you do will look great.
Andrew
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horse holder and empty horses, for the skirmish lne.. pack horse with a broken down 08 maxim and ammo boxes
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horse holder and empty horses, for the skirmish lne.. pack horse with a broken down 08 maxim and ammo boxes
Also very useful. I really can't think of much you could do that would not be interesting (apart from the semi-nudes.... I'm not into vignettes....)
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I do like the idea of artillery crew in shirtsleeve order to complement the current range, but I'd also second the suggestion for campaign dress, possibly both literally and figuratively. Perhaps looking like they have been tramping through the jungles of Darkest Africa or Venus, which would provide a reasonable excuse for some décolletage to be on view or even for them to show a bit of leg! ;)
Pete
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When I do cavalry, I'll definately do a horse-tender. That'll be an interesting pack. Maybe I'll offer them a-la-carte, with the ability to buy as many horses as one wishes.
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If you are going into the more obscure areas a telegraph operator and telegraph laying team would be different. As would be a medical team, female doctors were rare but not unknown. Prof
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If you are going into the more obscure areas a telegraph operator and telegraph laying team would be different.
And I was so proud of my field-telephone operator. :(
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If you are going into the more obscure areas a telegraph operator and telegraph laying team would be different. As would be a medical team, female doctors were rare but not unknown. Prof
the field telephone is already done..
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And I was so proud of my field-telephone operator. :(
Ahh but the telegraph was so much more elegant and old school. Prof
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Ahh but the telegraph was so much more elegant and old school. Prof
would they have operated both concurrently?.. if we are going all signals on this a heliograph might be nice as well and a semaphore and telescope set??
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Why not all the comm's options?
You can buy what fits your desires for communication.
Gracias,
Glenn
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Why not all the comm's options?
You can buy what fits your desires for communication.
Gracias,
Glenn
agreed though a horse holder and the dismounts' horses might be more immediate use..
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Jason,
I would like to see;
Trench raiders (broomhandles,sabres et cetera. A sculpt of a gunfighter Louiser ie two broomhandles would be fantastic.
A sniper team,rifle 'scope and a spotter.
Of course the naked/bathing and so forth would be jolly nice as well,naked women with a pelisse over the shoulder ,ahem,really does it for me............... :o ;D :-*
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Jason,
I would like to see;
Trench raiders (broomhandles,sabres et cetera. A sculpt of a gunfighter Louiser ie two broomhandles would be fantastic.
A sniper team,rifle 'scope and a spotter.
Of course the naked/bathing and so forth would be jolly nice as well,naked women with a pelisse over the shoulder ,ahem,really does it for me............... :o ;D :-*
were cavalry carbines much use for sniping? or are we going outside the Huzzar thing?
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... maybe but so far the "regular troop" figures already available have Mauser rifle
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agreed though a horse holder and the dismounts' horses might be more immediate use..
Actually, I quite agree.
Gracias,
Glenn
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... maybe but so far the "regular troop" figures already available have Mauser rifle
they looked a bit short to me..
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Mounted wimmin!
Sitting side on, of course. :)
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they looked a bit short to me..
Probably the Genteel Ladies' version.
Gracias,
Glenn
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Having looked through my bits box and had ideas, I must emphatically request some mounted figures, sitting sidesaddle, and able to be purchased without their horses. I want to use these as VSF Martians, riding sidesaddle on various other non-horse creatures.
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Having looked through my bits box and had ideas, I must emphatically request some mounted figures, sitting sidesaddle, and able to be purchased without their horses. I want to use these as VSF Martians, riding sidesaddle on various other non-horse creatures.
Ohhh! I think they would look great on six-legged Martian panthers (or tigers, depending which species is native to the red planet). Not so sure about lizards, but in any case, I'd love to see your take on it.
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I have just received my command pack today. Great!
As for this thread, I really would like to see the "fighting power" of this wip female army augmented before a number of "specials" (same investment as rank & file, but slower on return) see the light. So I'm with the cavalry or (motor)bikes, Jaegers etc. These would sell in multiples and provide you with more cash faster.
Rudi
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Probably the Genteel Ladies' version.
Gracias,
Glenn
That is a great idea! I rarely mount figs on the mounts they come with for VSF.
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I was considering introducing special rules for such a unit. Enemies may not fire upon the ladies unless they are either automatons, aliens or heathen swine. Civilized troops must engage them in hand to hand combat at penalty in order to disarm and subdue them in a non-disgraceful manner.
Engage in hand to hand combat with ladies? Without a proper introduction? Hardly the behavior of civilized troops. ;)
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I’ve been reading these posts pretty carefully, making notes when something appeals to me, and thinking about alternatives and plans. I initially thought the idea of separate riders was pretty brilliant. However, and not to be unsympathetic to customer desires, I just don't think I can do riders that are separate (and separately available) from their mounts. I'm looking into this idea, but I envision all sorts of problems with it. First, there are cost problems. I suspect that two-part sculpting commissions are more expensive. Similarly, I think that two-part castings are more expensive. And I know for a fact that making horses and riders available for separate purchase will be more expensive. While I don't need to make money on Hinterland, I would very much prefer not to lose money on it.
Second, there are problems of where to separate the casts. The fact that these ladies are riding sidesaddles will introduce previously unknown compatibility problems. In particular, what, exactly, would be the two parts: (A) horse with sidesaddle, and separate rider; (B) horse, and separate rider with sidesaddle; or (C) horse with sidesaddle and rider's legs, and separate upper torso? For variability, I was considering going with option C. However, option C clearly wouldn't achieve the object of mounting the riders on other mounts. Option A would require that the person wishing to mount the riders on different mounts sculpt a sidesaddle for these mounts (while perhaps removing an existing saddle). Similarly, option B would require that alternative mounts not already have saddles, or that these saddles be easily removable.
Here’s the important thing to consider: Options A and B, while attractive to the modeler who is comfortable with knife and putty, wouldn't have much appeal to the average gamer, who simply wishes to buy a mini, slap it on a base, and paint it. Sadly, while I am attracted to the idea of allowing converters to mount my Hinterland minis on any mount, I have to consider financial realities and the average buyer. I hate to appear mercenary and cavalier, but please think about this: If it were your money, and you hoped to at least break even, which type of cavalry do you think would have the greatest likelihood of earning sales?
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Do the rider as one piece with the saddle, and the horse as a seperate piece. As an example of castings done that way:
(http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m400861_99110203097_FayEnchantressMain_445x319.jpg)
(http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m400771_99060203089_BretonnianDamselStaffFootMountedMain_445x319.jpg)
(http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1182139_99060207145_VCLahmianFootMountedMain_445x319.jpg)
(http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1182134_99060207144_VCLahmianStaffFootMountedMain_445x319.jpg)
While I'd prefer to be able to buy the riders seperate, I appreciate the costs from sculpting etc may make that unfeasible. I already have a rather large pile of horses from various manufacturers that have had their riders realocated to VSF uses, what's a few more? :)
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Options A and B, while attractive to the modeler who is comfortable with knife and putty, wouldn't have much appeal to the average gamer, who simply wishes to buy a mini, slap it on a base, and paint it.
I disagree.
Option A - horse with sidesaddle, and separate rider is pretty much the industry standard for cavalry. Almost every manufacturer casts the saddle on the horse and has the rider separate. It is the mini of choice of the average gamer.
A couple points.
The hussars, like the photos of the Princess, should have a saddle cloth. Like all good hussars, the saddle cloth should be large and pointed at the end. Having a saddle cloth, as is the historic norm, means essentially, the saddle and saddle cloth will need to be sculpted onto the horse. THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT, if you want them to look like real hussars.
The saddle itself is actually very small, and given that the hussars will be wearing their skirts, you won't see any of the left side of the saddle (including the two pommels) and very little, if any, of the right. The right side of the saddle (the side that will be seen) is almost non-existent. So for folks wishing to mount their hussars on "other than horses", the amount of modding, is so very small that even someone like me, all thumbs, could easily make it from green stuff.
Here is a picture of the Princess from the right side... you don't even see any part of the saddle!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/lavaslair/Princessright.jpg)
And here she is from the left side... again, no part of the saddle is visible and you can only just barely make out the left foot.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v732/lavaslair/Princessleft.jpg)
Here is a standard saddle:
(http://www.equusite.com/articles/basics/images/basicsEnglishSaddle.jpg)
Compare that to a standard sidesaddle (there is almost nothing to it if you exclude the pommels).
(http://www.damensattel.org/images/Sattel/sattele.gif)
Here is a link on how sidesaddles are made:
http://www.damensattel.org/6Sattel/Teile/TeileDS-E.html
In sum, go with the industrial standard... Horse with saddle and separate rider, that is what the average gamer expects. The saddle parts needed to be sculpted are minimal (the side flaps), but the real importance here is having a cool hussar saddle cloth.
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While I fully agree with the aesthetic attraction of the side saddle they would be good for a parade pose but useless in the charge. But it is VSF so who cares!!!! :D
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The hussars, like the photos of the Princess, should have a saddle cloth.
For British hussars (at least in the princess' time), shabraques would be limited to the officers. Did German hussar troopers have them?
Absolutely agree with everything else Ray posted. Horse with saddle, separate rider.
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Option A would be my preference. Horse with saddle, seperate rider.
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Perhaps voluminous skirts will solve the problems I envisioned. I'll certainly consider all my alternatives before having cavalry made.
By the way, while the pointed saddlecloth (shabraque) was used on parade, a much more ulilitarian sadlecloth and saddle were used on campaign. While I intend my mounted Princess to have the pointed version, other cavalry would have the more usual, square saddlecloth.
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Alot of people seem to like the idea of side saddle cavalry. Perhaps you don't need to sell horses at all. If you sold side saddle figures designed to fit on another manufacturers horses eg: front rank http://www.frontrank.com/lev4_2_11_0_Napoleonic_Horses.asp or perhaps for perry plastic horses then the cost of getting the figure sculpted would/should be the same as a foot figure and then if someone wanted to place them on Raptors etc then they could do so. Just a though.
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Alot of people seem to like the idea of side saddle cavalry. Perhaps you don't need to sell horses at all. If you sold side saddle figures designed to fit on another manufacturers horses eg: front rank http://www.frontrank.com/lev4_2_11_0_Napoleonic_Horses.asp or perhaps for perry plastic horses then the cost of getting the figure sculpted would/should be the same as a foot figure and then if someone wanted to place them on Raptors etc then they could do so. Just a though.
If the saddles' metal is thin (= flexible) enough in the right place, one might bend'm in- or outwards (worked with the old Hinchliffes) to fit the horses of a number of manufacturers (or raptors for that matter). Just adding to your idea...
Rudi
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Cavalry would be nice, as would conversion packs, but I suppose that all depends on cost and ease of production.
Personally I'd like a gun crew and some sergeant models.
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Upcoming releases (in a month or so, I hope):
1) Skirmishers: Five-figure group, rushing forward
2) Maxim Crew: Three-figure group, firing Maxim
Mancha, do you have an update on this? Your fans (ok, at least this one fan) are/is fairly eager.
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Mancha, do you have an update on this? Your fans (ok, at least this one fan) are/is fairly eager.
Well, the masters were supposed to be on their way to me early this week. I just wrote to my caster asking after their status. Once I get them, I will okay them and return them for final casting. Probably another couple weeks - sigh. :(
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Mancha, do you have an update on this? Your fans (ok, at least this one fan) are/is fairly eager.
It is not just you, Froggy. I, too, am waiting with bated breath.
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Me too :D Hinterland Hussars. Hinterland Huzzah !
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Mancha, did you see the new ebob horses with tackle that just came out?
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Chairface has found the solution!
The ebob horses are state of the hobby, and certainly appropriate for 19thc/early 20thc riders. You could utilize them a number of ways:
1) Have six riders sculpted, and direct customers to ebob to buy their mounts (they come in packs of six).
Pros: Easiest & cheapest solution for you, quickest way to get mounted figures on the market, VSF'ers who want to mount figs on other beasties need not buy horses.
Cons: Customers must purchase mounts separately, no officer's horse w/shabraque.
2) Have seven riders sculpted, license one of ebob's horses & add shabraque, direct customers to ebob to buy the remaining mounts.
Pros: Minimal expense for single altered sculpt. VSF'ers who want to mount figs on other beasties need not buy horses.
Cons: Customers must purchase mounts separately.
3) Have six riders sculpted, license all of ebob's horses & add shabraque to one.
Pros: Good horse sculpts, cheaper than sculpting from scratch, able to sell complete packs of cavalry.
Cons: Most expensive option (although still cheaper than starting form scratch).
I've no doubt that there are a myriad of pros & cons I haven't considered, but food for thought!
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Option 1 is my favored one, since I plan on using non-horse mounts.
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I appreciate the feedback. I'll start by saying that when I have cavalry I completely intend to use eBob's horses. In fact, I've already purchased a license for one for the mounted Princess.
I'll continue by saying that I simply cannot imagine releasing riders without horses (despite the wishes of some to use alternative mounts). I just can't do it. The idea of saying, "Here are my riders - go to someone else for mounts" strikes me as being sort of irresponsible and...what's a good word?...self-effacing. Additionally, because my riders will be mounted side-saddle, my horses will need some special tackle. I cannot fail to meet the needs of my unique riders. Because I personally like variation, I will probably need to offer a couple to a few different horses.
What I see myself doing is following the Empress/Anglian model of releasing a pack of three horses and riders. I will probably start with basic troopers, in some kind of charge/gallop. There will be three different horses and three different riders, allowing a variety of combinations of horse and rider. I will probably follow this release with a mounted Command pack. This will also have three different riders, but will use the original three horses.
Because I will be reusing the three horses, I will probably need to have horses and riders be on separate molds. The advantage to this is that I would be able to supply only riders to people like Froggy who wish to mount the ladies on raptors, giant flys, dinosaurs, sand walkers, etc. :)
I've finally gotten my mind around this idea that cavalry are an absolutely essential part of my little army. However, they're still a very expensive commission. If the next round of releases (the maxim and skirmishers) sells well, perhaps I'll bite the bullet and ask Paul to make an initial cavalry pack. Please be aware, however, that even if I gave Paul the commission today, the release would be pretty far in the future.
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I got time...
But at 56, not a looot of time. lol
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I think that the fact that you are planning ahead is the most important, so we have something to look forward to aswell and not just sit in the dark not knowing if anything will be released in the future.
I like all the packs so far, but I still need to get the command pack.
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I cannot wait!!
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Greetings
let's see .. you could also make a cannoness and or loader, a field medic, a hussar equivalent to a sniper(ress?), then the field cook of course.
You could also portray the hussars at rest (picture a vignette: one hussar wringing out her hair with both hands while another is sipping some tea (or coffee). :D Imagine one doing a sabrage while the other mends her uniform, hat, stockings whatever ;)
Okay ... I probably won't see those miniatures, but they would surely attract the eye and make for something different.
Jo
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Thanks for your input. A gun crew is definately on my list of wants. Strangely enough, a field medic is already made, but waiting for other minis to make up a pack. The vignette you describe is very much like one I've had in mind for a while. You're probably right when you say you won't see them, at least for a while anyway, as I feel I need to complete the main army "requirements" before going off into noncombatants.
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Because I will be reusing the three horses, I will probably need to have horses and riders be on separate molds. The advantage to this is that I would be able to supply only riders to people like Froggy who wish to mount the ladies on raptors, giant flys, dinosaurs, sand walkers, etc. :)
Woohoo!
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A gun crew is definately on my list of wants. Strangely enough, a field medic is already made, but waiting for other minis to make up a pack.
Hmmmm... I'd better start putting aside some cash. I have a feeling that these have to be on my top-3 list for future purchases, along with WF Shock Troops, and AC57 rules + greasers ands zeds...
Especially as I intend to use some of the hussars for the same project as some of the shock troops... :D