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Miniatures Adventure => Medieval Adventures => Topic started by: Captain Blood on August 29, 2011, 09:47:16 PM

Title: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on August 29, 2011, 09:47:16 PM
Here are my Condottieri di Milano, fresh from a narrow victory (finally!) in Steve Dean's latest painting competition…  ::)

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_24_49_0.jpg)

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_24_49_1.jpg)

They’re all from 28mm Perry components – mainly the Mercenaries / Wars of the Roses boxes - but I also used the free ACW Zoauve command sprue which came with Miniature Wargames a few months back… (Waste not, want not  ;))

Il Capitano and Il Piccolino.

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_24_49_3.jpg)

The Captain is made from standard components in the Mercs box - but using the ACW officer’s head, with the kepi peak shaved off and a bit of melted sprue stuck on top then shaped to create a kind of Phrygian cap - a plausibly Italianate medieval look?

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_24_49_2.jpg)

Il Piccolini - the dwarf - is the result of sticking a leftover pair of legs onto a leftover torso following an earlier conversion… I thought the leftovers were too short to be of any use, but then I thought: dwarf! Why not?
His glaive is a conversion using one of the extra polearm heads in the Mercs box.

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_24_49_4.jpg)

Standard bearer and trumpeter. The trumpeter uses another of the Zouave heads, slightly doctored. Happily the fashion for turbanned headgear doesn’t seem to have changed much between Medieval times and the ACW. Apart from that, and a slight adjustment to his free hand, he’s made from the standard WOTR components.

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_26_50_0.jpg)

The standard bearer uses two of the arms from the Zouave command sprue… Just right for that flashy, one-handed, Italian flag-waving routine. The flag is hand-painted on tomato puree-tube foil. I’m afraid the livery is entirely invented. I have no idea what Milanese mercenaries were wearing in the late C15th. Button-counters, you may now tut.

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_26_50_1.jpg)

Handgunners. These three are all from standard components from the Mercenaries box. In fact, I’ve only just now noticed that I’ve used the same pair of arms on two of these – which goes to show what a slight difference in alignment / attitude can make…

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_26_50_2.jpg)

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_26_50_3.jpg)

Crossbows and ‘The Killer’. Again built from standard parts, although with one or two minor modifications - like the sword strapped across the crossbowman’s back, and a slight slice off ‘L’Assassino’s’ left hand to take his buckler…

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_27_22.jpg)

(http://leadadventureforum.com/gallery/9/577_29_08_11_10_26_50_4.jpg)

Anyway, all in all, a lot of fun to make - especially cannibalising the free Zouave command parts.

I continue to be impressed by the versatility of these plastic figure kits if you come to them with an open mind and a sharp knife   :)

I’ve been eyeing the new Perry Ansar box, and wondering about hybridising a few Marsh Arab heads onto medieval bodies to make some Balkan mercenaries...

But on the whole, I think I might just finish what I’ve got in train and wait for the WOTR mounted Men-At-Arms box, which will open up a whole range of glorious new possibilities   :D
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Mr.J on August 29, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
You continue to amaze me, your modelling and painting is superb! Bravo.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Phil Robinson on August 29, 2011, 09:59:17 PM
Congratulations, Richard. Knew you could do it, well done and well deserved.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Calimero on August 29, 2011, 10:09:37 PM

Great work Richard 8)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: vikotnik on August 29, 2011, 10:28:04 PM
 :-*
The moment I heard that the Perrys were bringing out some plastics, I instantly knew that we were going to see some outstanding stuff from your hands!

Excellent choice of colour, perfectly executed and brilliant basing.
Kudos.


...again.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: OSHIROmodels on August 29, 2011, 10:32:14 PM
Well done Richard, a certainly deserved win  8) :-*

Any paticular reason why the dwarf has the biggest weapon  lol

cheers

James
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Mason on August 29, 2011, 10:43:15 PM
 :o :o :o :-* :-* :-* :o :o :o

Absolutely amazing brushwork.
So smooth.

Choice of colours is astounding.
Only a true genius could pull that colour scheme off without looking like Zippo's Circus had come to town!

Excellent subtle conversion work too.

The bases are just so well done as well, complimenting your fantastic paintjobs.

Wow, Wow, and bloody WOW!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: theoldschool on August 29, 2011, 11:12:51 PM
About time too! Superb brushwork Richard.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: khartoum2 on August 30, 2011, 12:04:37 AM
Fantasitc figures and an awesome paint job - love the details re the conversiosn you make it all sound so easy (if only for us mere mortals)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Dr Mathias on August 30, 2011, 12:13:46 AM
Very, very impressive.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: ARKOUDAKI on August 30, 2011, 12:31:11 AM
Capt, you are far far too talented for your own good!  :-* :-* :-*Great looking figs and ones I was happy to vote for on the SD Forum.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: bulldogger2000 on August 30, 2011, 03:29:28 AM
Not my time period, but those are amazing!  Very nicely done!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Cadet13 on August 30, 2011, 04:13:01 AM
I love the expression on the captain's face! Excellent coversions.  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: magokiron on August 30, 2011, 05:30:58 AM
Just SPLENDID!  :o  :-*

Those Perry plastics are going to see A LOT of uses with WHFB Empire and Brettonia gamers, moreover if some of them see your WONDERFUL conversions and pain jobs.

Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Driscoles on August 30, 2011, 06:03:41 AM
Magnificent job on the miniatures. Il Capitano looks a bit like you...Was that intended ?
Great idea with the Dwarf. The way the Killer is assembled makes him look very cool and the way he moves expresses "Look out danger is coming "
Anyway...good luck for the competition and a salute from Germany !
Björn
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: dodge on August 30, 2011, 07:16:24 AM
Yay you won  :D

those are excellent though,

brilliantly executed  :D

dodge
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: janner on August 30, 2011, 08:48:45 AM
These are horrible, I've no idea how you won.

Let me take them off your hands to spare you further shame  ;)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: oxiana on August 30, 2011, 08:55:00 AM
Always a treat to see what's fresh from the Captain's table.   :D

Wonderful stuff Richard – and congratulations on your first win over at Steve Dean's. Brilliant.  :-*
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Keith on August 30, 2011, 08:55:54 AM
Brilliant stuff Captain, always knew you had it in you to take the chequered flag!

I loved this entry because it combines the best of single figure and unit entries. Each figure is a gem and the whole lot are almost too much  :D.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Plynkes on August 30, 2011, 09:01:47 AM
Of course, the colours are all wrong. Milan is red and black stripes, Inter is blue and black stripes. You don't mix blue and red on the same Milanese.

Only joking! Another triumph. Spectacular.

I especially like "The Killer" or "The Human Corner Flag" as I like to call him. Wish I had a hat with a flag on the top. Where can you get those?
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Bugsda on August 30, 2011, 09:38:55 AM
Plastic fantastic, conversion drastic, big up ya chest Bro!  8)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Hammers on August 30, 2011, 09:43:01 AM
This is another demonstration how a 'clean paint job' will really make a miniature fly. You've really got it down Richard. I should add that I have failed to say so recently but you prove it all the time.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on August 30, 2011, 10:22:52 AM
Thank you boys  :)
I really appreciate your generous comments and your moral support.

Plynkes, I think the flags on the helmets was mainly a Burgundian thing. Like team leaders (so the enemy knew who to shoot at, presumably). Darned silly I think, and I've cut most of them off, but it did rather seem to fit on this chap with his... 'Come and kill me if you think you're hard enough' kinda attitude  ;)

Bjorn - any resemblance between the miniature of Il Capitano, and the artist, is purely coincidental...  ::)

R.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: valleyboy on August 30, 2011, 10:55:33 AM
What a treat
They are fantastic :o
You continue to astonish me with the quality of your work
How the hell do you do it
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Malamute on August 30, 2011, 10:57:21 AM
What can be said other than what's been said already. How about you git...! ;)

Awesome stuff ;D
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: JollyBob on August 30, 2011, 11:03:34 AM
Another exceptional unit. Well done on the win.  8)

Think Ill just quietly shuffle my awful muddy-looking figures back into their box... no point competing against this!  :o
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: lasgunpacker on August 30, 2011, 11:42:23 PM
Truely lovely, and like many I am waiting to see what you do with the mounted Men-At-Arms.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: killshot on August 31, 2011, 02:50:35 AM
Beautiful work!!  :-* :-*
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Malatesta on August 31, 2011, 03:00:25 AM
Let me join in the chorus of praise: extraordinary work!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Marine0846 on August 31, 2011, 03:25:13 AM
Great work by "The Master." Your painting is a special treat to behold. Thank you. May I ask how long do you usually spend painting a figure. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Heldrak on August 31, 2011, 06:09:49 AM
Congratulations on the win! I love the red-and-blue and I love those striped trousers...!!!  :-* Any tips on those?
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on August 31, 2011, 02:21:57 PM
Thanks again, all  :)

May I ask how long do you usually spend painting a figure. Thanks for sharing.

Honestly, that's a very difficult one to answer, partly because it depends on the figure of course, but also because I rarely sit down and paint a single figure - I usually paint in batches of 5 or 10 at a time. Plus, I only ever sit down to paint for a couple of hours here and there - rarely in longer sessions. So progress always feels pretty slow.

I suppose, for a single figure of medium difficulty - i.e. several different colours, surfaces, textures, weapons and equipment, but not tartan or camo etc, it's probably somewhere between an hour and 90 minutes. But you know, sometimes they go well, and it's quick and easy painting - sometimes it just doesn't work as you want it to, and you can spend 10 or 20 minutes doing and redoing just one little bit of a figure before you get it just right...

It's hard to generalise  :)

Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on August 31, 2011, 02:29:58 PM
I love the red-and-blue and I love those striped trousers...!!!  :-* Any tips on those?

Oops. Sorry, Michael - missed that question...

Stripes are actually pretty easy to do provided you've got a steady hand... They look a lot more impressive than they actually are!

Basically, all I do is paint and highlight the whole garment (leggings in this case) in the 'ground' colour of the fabric first - then just paint on stripes!
Get a stripe a bit too fat? Never mind - just touch it in with the opposing colour until they look more or less even.
Then highlight the stripes you've just painted, picking up on any folds and creases...
You might then find that your 'feature colour' stripes are highlighted a bit more intensely than your 'ground colour' stripes - so now go back and add a bit more highlighting to the latter.

I think what makes stripes look so effective is just the exaggerated high contrast between the stripes, and small spots of paint picking up on the highlights.

Plus you have to pick nicely contrasting colours, obviously...  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Ray Rivers on September 01, 2011, 02:21:57 AM
Late to the party here... August is a very busy month for us tourist folks.

Anyway... CONGRATULATIONS!

Fantastic display of art at it's finest.   :-* ;D :-*
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: ZeroTwentythree on September 03, 2011, 10:24:36 AM
Beautiful and inspiring figures!

Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Helen on September 03, 2011, 10:41:38 PM
Oh, I'm so late to this convention, nevertheless, out standing modelling and painting Richard on this condotteri band. Beautiful colours an a well deserve win.

Cheers,

Helen
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: carlos marighela on September 03, 2011, 10:46:17 PM
Sensational work Capt.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Remington on September 03, 2011, 11:13:37 PM
Blimey! Those are some serious beauties! Well done, Cap!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Sangennaru on September 03, 2011, 11:56:51 PM
Davvero Meravigliosi!

Being part of the Milan population i feel honoured to have been represented in your work!
The conversions are great, i really love all of them!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on September 04, 2011, 12:53:04 AM
Thank you all  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: abhorsen950 on September 04, 2011, 10:34:58 AM
Stunning work, truly brilliant!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Silent Invader on September 04, 2011, 12:00:48 PM
I've been away and watching a (mostly) text-only LAF from my phone..... I saw this thread go up and, dare I say, was looking forward to my return to see the images in all their glory.  Wonderful.

PS: Most interesting and useful article (again) in WS&S - great to see it in print; BTW your colours are even more effective in print..... here's hoping that WS&S will publish a WOTR battle report, with a mass of your figures and terrain.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on September 04, 2011, 01:37:58 PM
Cheers Steve  ;)


PS: Most interesting and useful article (again) in WS&S - great to see it in print; BTW your colours are even more effective in print..... here's hoping that WS&S will publish a WOTR battle report, with a mass of your figures and terrain.

Hmmm. Is that WS&S issue 55 again or 56? (Is 56 out? If it is, I didn't know... Nobody tells me anything  ;))

Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Silent Invader on September 04, 2011, 01:53:03 PM
Hmmm. Is that WS&S issue 55 again or 56? (Is 56 out? If it is, I didn't know... Nobody tells me anything  ;))

Issue 56.  Picked it up on Thursday at a WHS.  This issue has a bit too much ACW for me (aren't I fussy  :D) but the highlights include a nice barn tutorial by Paul Darnell, an interesting D100 discussion piece by Rick Priestley and your own technically and aesthetically most pleasing article.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: white knight on September 08, 2011, 09:02:50 AM
I love your painting and colour choices. 8) :-*
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Phil Robinson on September 08, 2011, 10:59:31 AM
Just picked up WSS, nice article Richard, just the ticket.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Argonor on September 08, 2011, 11:12:23 AM
Everytime I see some of you minis, my first thought is 'Photoshop', but as I've seen a bunch of your WotR in the flesh, I know it to be untrue.  :)

I still wonder how you manage to bring out the colours so bright and vibrant in the photos, but I think I'll just have to pull myself together and get on with experimenting with a lightbox....  ::)

Sometimes I also wonder, if I should just send all my gaming minis in painting commission instead of trying to accomplish anything...  lol
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on September 08, 2011, 08:17:55 PM
Thanks Gents

Everytime I see some of you minis, my first thought is 'Photoshop', but as I've seen a bunch of your WotR in the flesh, I know it to be untrue.  :)

Actually Niels, you're right, there is an element of photoshop, insofar as I hit the 'fix levels' button on every picture I take. This lifts the brightness, contrast and colour across the board, auto-corrects any white-balance or exposure problems, and so on. I think this is only fair, bearing in mind that I'm showing the figures at many times their actual size. At actual size, the colour and contrast on each figures is intense. But once you've taken a picture of the figure and blown it up to several times its actual size, the image starts to wash out. Auto-adjusting the levels gives you a closer match to what the actual figure looks like in the flesh.

But no, there's no photoshopping of the figures themselves. That's just how they're painted  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Hammers on September 09, 2011, 08:34:08 AM
Thanks Gents

Actually Niels, you're right, there is an element of photoshop, insofar as I hit the 'fix levels' button on every picture I take. This lifts the brightness, contrast and colour across the board, auto-corrects any white-balance or exposure problems, and so on. I think this is only fair, bearing in mind that I'm showing the figures at many times their actual size. At actual size, the colour and contrast on each figures is intense. But once you've taken a picture of the figure and blown it up to several times its actual size, the image starts to wash out. Auto-adjusting the levels gives you a closer match to what the actual figure looks like in the flesh.

But no, there's no photoshopping of the figures themselves. That's just how they're painted  :)

A camera is nothing like an optical organ, so I think one owes iit to one's self to adjust photos closer to how one perceives the real thing.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Sangennaru on September 09, 2011, 08:55:35 AM
A camera is nothing like an optical organ, so I think one owes iit to one's self to adjust photos closer to how one perceives the real thing.

I totally agree with that.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Argonor on September 09, 2011, 10:24:07 AM
Photoshop has an automatical solution for 'levels' now? I remember, when I had WXP with PS5, I think, that I had to manually slide some buttons to adjust outputs.

Can't make my old Photoshop run on 64 bit Vista, though, so I'm stuck with GIMP for the time being (which works OK for most tasks, but is a little unwieldy).

Well, well - the first step is still to get a proper quality photo to work with, I guess.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Prof.Witchheimer on September 09, 2011, 10:25:35 AM
wonderful, Richard, the mix of Perry's sculpting work and your vibrant colours is always a pleasure!

A camera is nothing like an optical organ

You're really scary sometimes, did you know that?
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: OSHIROmodels on September 09, 2011, 12:21:47 PM
You're really scary sometimes, did you know that?

 lol

Quote
so I think one owes it to one's self to adjust photos closer to how one perceives the real thing.

I do like this comment though  :)

cheers

James
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Silent Invader on September 10, 2011, 07:21:24 PM
Damn you Capn'B........ I've succombed and bought a box of the Mercenaries  :o   :D
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on September 11, 2011, 01:14:58 AM
Excellent news, Steve. I'm looking forward to seeing what a man of your ingenuity and converting experience can make of such raw material  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Silent Invader on September 11, 2011, 12:44:02 PM
Excellent news, Steve. I'm looking forward to seeing what a man of your ingenuity and converting experience can make of such raw material  :)

You're a gennelman that's for sure!  ;)

What is certain is that I will be both inspired and guided by your good works.  :D
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Mapleleaf on September 12, 2011, 03:37:32 PM
WOW  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bravissimo !!!!!!!!!!

Really great work   and a deserved win.  You area an artist sir  !!
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Tzigane on January 26, 2014, 06:02:28 PM
I am terribly sorry for this horrible thread necromancy, but I just wanted to say that you have inspired me to buy a set of those Mercenaries, and created a Tilean (the Warhammer Fantasy equivalent of medieval Italy) warband for Mordheim!

:D
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on January 26, 2014, 06:10:23 PM
I am terribly sorry for this horrible thread necromancy, but I just wanted to say that you have inspired me to buy a set of those Mercenaries, and created a Tilean (the Warhammer Fantasy equivalent of medieval Italy) warband for Mordheim!

:D

I'm glad you like them :)

If you have a couple of hours spare (!) check out my other long-running Perry plastics thread http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=40936.0

There are some more Milanese mercenaries towards the end of that thread too. Think I now have about 20 of them all told...
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: DeafNala on January 26, 2014, 06:32:08 PM
WONDERFULLY WELL DONE! The BEAUTIFUL colors you chose are how I envision the Renaissance. AND your FANTASTIC brushwork & LOVELY bases breath life into the minis....truly inspiring creations.
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Atheling on January 28, 2014, 03:33:20 PM
Richard,

I actually missed seeing anything from the last comp on the SDF but I've got to add my congratulations and say that I'm glad that you won as the comp is supposed to be based on painting, which is sometimes overlooked!.

Well done and keep the flag flying for Late Medieval stuff.

Darrell.

Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Captain Blood on January 28, 2014, 04:56:56 PM
Thanks Darrell. As it happens, they won Steve's competition several contests ago, but thanks anyway :)
(They're only back here now thanks to a little well intentioned threadomancy... )

I haven't managed the same feat in ensuing competitions, and I sat the last one out too. Got a bit weary of what sometimes seems rather contrary voting - although I guess beauty is always in the eye of the beholder, and one man's manifestly superior painting competition entry is another man's dog's breakfast...  ;)

Anyway, we'll see how things pan out next time round...  :)
Title: Re: Condottieri di Milano - Perry plastic conversions
Post by: Atheling on January 28, 2014, 06:52:49 PM
Thanks Darrell. As it happens, they won Steve's competition several contests ago, but thanks anyway :)
(They're only back here now thanks to a little well intentioned threadomancy... )

I've been away for that long?  :o

Quote
I haven't managed the same feat in ensuing competitions, and I sat the last one out too. Got a bit weary of what sometimes seems rather contrary voting - although I guess beauty is always in the eye of the beholder, and one man's manifestly superior painting competition entry is another man's dog's breakfast...  ;)

That's sometimes the impression I got. I'm of the opinion that the miniatures should be presented as they are- no backgrounds, no added extras etc. That way it's possible to 'judge' the painting without prejudice. to be honest I haven't put anything into the comp for a very long time- with my last entry I think I was pipped by one point by you if I remember correctly(?).

Quote
Anyway, we'll see how things pan out next time round...  :)

Any clues as to what you plan on entering?

Darrell.