Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Age of Myths, Gods and Empires => Topic started by: Prof.Witchheimer on February 09, 2012, 07:00:47 PM
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Thinking about Roman merchant caravan.
how did Roman (wealthy ones) travel? I've found that Roman carriage reconstruction. Something like that? Or was it more for less moneyed people?
(http://www.bible-history.com/ibh/images/fullsized/roman-carriage.gif)
Or rather using litter?
(http://www.vroma.org/images/raia_images/romanlitter_sketch.jpg)
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No help with your question, but if you want some more mundane carts in your caravan, 1st corps do a decent enough roman driver and cart:
(http://www.1stcorps.co.uk/online_shop/images/AAO01.jpg)
http://www.1stcorps.co.uk/online_shop/product_info.php?cPath=201_205&products_id=2477 (http://www.1stcorps.co.uk/online_shop/product_info.php?cPath=201_205&products_id=2477)
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yup, this is rather nice and quite useful, thanks!
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For freight carts, the one posted by White Knight looks splendid, and has the added bonus that it doesn't look too Roman in style, so could reasonably be used as well for Celts or "Celtised" Germans (i.e. those settled on the West bank of the Rhine that had regular contact with the highly-civilised Celtic peoples of Gaul, Southern Germany and the Alpine region).
As for the wagon you posted, this would indeed be a luxury vehicle, and presumably used predominantly on good Roman roads in pacified provinces (so, Germania Superior, or the agri decumati from the early second century AD, which obviously is too late for your project). Those vehicles were robust, but not as rugged as simpler vehicles.
Also, Wargames Foundry sell an excellently-sculpted four-weel cart, which is sold with Celt and Roman wagon crews:
Celt Version (http://wargamesfoundry.com/other_ranges/single_packs/carts/any/celtic_four_wheeled_cart_gpr011/?sector_id=) "Roman" Version (http://wargamesfoundry.com/other_ranges/single_packs/carts/any/ancient_large_four_wheeled_cart_gpr015/?sector_id=)
This is a very good model, and quite large - as with most Foundry stuff, it is a bit on the pricey side, but I have one which I bought for my EIR army back in ye olden dayes, and I would say it is worth the price. It looks very clean and "orderly", and so might fit the concept of a Roman trade caravan better than the equally nice, but more frugal cart from 1st Corps.
Overall, you might look into getting one of those coaches for the merchant and maybe his secretary freedman to travel in, and some different carts for the freight. That said, I don't know if any company makes a Roman travel coach, so you might have to get a custom body scratchbuilt (*wink*) to use with some oxen. However, depending on how historically-accurate you want your project to be, you might take a look at the "armoured coach" Commodus and Lucilla travel in at the beginning of "Gladiator". That one takes some Hollywood Liberties(TM), but looks quite reasonable given that we don't have that many sources except engravings and some archaeological finds.
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This is a very good model, and quite large - as with most Foundry stuff, it is a bit on the pricey side, but I have one which I bought for my EIR army back in ye olden dayes, and I would say it is worth the price. It looks very clean and "orderly", and so might fit the concept of a Roman trade caravan better than the equally nice, but more frugal cart from 1st Corps.
like this one? ;)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/mordheim/witchtown_wagon_02.jpg)
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like this one? ;)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/mordheim/witchtown_wagon_02.jpg)
Duh and lol. lol
Should have assumed you had that one known and sorted, but dang my hankering for completeness.
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That roman wagons from the museum in köln ?
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That roman wagons from the museum in köln ?
Yes.
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Well, after some research I think I'm going for the litter for my travelling merchant. Something like this:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/ancient/roman-litter.jpeg)
or this (54 mm from El Viejo Dragón):
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/ancient/roman_litter_54mm.jpeg)
Any ideas for 28mm slaves and a lying roman?
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Any ideas for 28mm slaves and a lying roman?
Warlord has someone reclining for dinner, but now that I check, it's a woman. Still tis page of "Roman accessories" has a rich merchant, househld slaves, a cart and a pack mule, so it may be of use:
http://store.warlordgames.com/roman-accessories-69-c.asp (http://store.warlordgames.com/roman-accessories-69-c.asp)
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Ral Partha have a litter but it is for a Sorceress and has female litter bearers.
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Ral Partha have a litter but it is for a Sorceress and has female litter bearers.
Yes, I've got that one since ages. Actually a really cool set but way too small.
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like this one? ;)
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/mordheim/witchtown_wagon_02.jpg)
Is that still available from Foundry? I was looking through their website and couldn't find it.
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Is that still available from Foundry? I was looking through their website and couldn't find it.
just click on the links in Chris' post
Celt Version (http://wargamesfoundry.com/other_ranges/single_packs/carts/any/celtic_four_wheeled_cart_gpr011/?sector_id=) "Roman" Version (http://wargamesfoundry.com/other_ranges/single_packs/carts/any/ancient_large_four_wheeled_cart_gpr015/?sector_id=).
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1st corps cart is very nice but it is 25mm not 28mm?
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The 1st corps ancient Greeks I have are 28mm in any case.
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just click on the links in Chris' post
Oh, thanks!
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Any ideas for 28mm slaves and a lying roman?
have you seen that one from 1st corps :
http://www.1stcorps.co.uk/online_shop/product_info.php?cPath=133_134&products_id=1831 (http://www.1stcorps.co.uk/online_shop/product_info.php?cPath=133_134&products_id=1831)
or theses from Warlord :
http://store.warlordgames.com/roman-balearic-slingers-contubernium-66-p.asp (http://store.warlordgames.com/roman-balearic-slingers-contubernium-66-p.asp)
or from Crusader or any manucfaturers with light infantry like :
http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=19&cat=1&sub=2&page=1 (http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=19&cat=1&sub=2&page=1)
http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=398&cat=1&sub=30&page=1 (http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=398&cat=1&sub=30&page=1)
http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=600&cat=1&sub=40&page=1 (http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=600&cat=1&sub=40&page=1)
http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=661&cat=1&sub=46&page=1 (http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/prod.php?prod=661&cat=1&sub=46&page=1)
With some conversions, you 'll get some porters
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brilliant hints, thank you!
these are great porters, indeed:
(http://www.crusaderminiatures.com/images/img398.jpg)
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When I made my 17th century litters I had to convert porters and realized how few left handed spearmen miniatures there are out there.
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When I made my 17th century litters I had to convert porters and realized how few left handed spearmen miniatures there are out there.
agree :)
but it looks like two of them (on the pic) could be easily converted to left handed porters
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i found an another solution for you but with some conversions work, but this time with left porters :
(http://www.outpostwargameservices.co.uk/images/Web%20Photos/inca/openlitter.jpg)
Cut off the heads for more roman ones and the job is done !!!! lol
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That looks cool, pretty good idea, indeed, thanks!
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nervisfr, Like the bath tub! ;)
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i have just remember about this at Bear Den Miniatures :
(http://www.bearsdenminiatures.com/pics/inca4.jpg)
(http://www.bearsdenminiatures.com/pics/AZ12.jpg)
You can ask them to sold the porter only. I have done that for their eskimo range where i order the dogs team only.... :P
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The below porter team would make an appropriate part of a Roman litter. Though not sure about the quality of the sculpts. Would be good to see them unpainted.
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(http://www.bible-history.com/ibh/images/fullsized/roman-carriage.gif)
My prayers have been answered, the coming Roman coach from Warlord :-*
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Well, after some research I think I'm going for the litter for my travelling merchant. Something like this:
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/ancient/roman-litter.jpeg)
or this (54 mm from El Viejo Dragón):
(http://leadadventureforum.com/images/ancient/roman_litter_54mm.jpeg)
Any ideas for 28mm slaves and a lying roman?
Perry plastic Ansar would do perfectly for the slaves. Even have some shaved heads on the sprue
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what about a roman car in leather cabrio style?
http://www.medienwerkstatt-online.de/lws_wissen/vorlagen/showcard.php?id=14422&edit=0
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The roman litter by the example :
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-KZGjNCWk2Sg/TWnZr_zswfI/AAAAAAAAAq4/XXcDe2eCSSc/s1600/jc.jpg)
Seem not to so easy to walk with, isn't it ?
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Yeah I wouldn't imagine any one traveling over great distances on one of those litters.
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The Roman Traveling Coach from Warlord has been released! It's pricey at $40 USD though... Too rich for my blood :/
(http://www.warlordgames.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/WGH-IR-76-Roman-Travelling-Coach-a-150x150.jpg)
LINK: Roman Traveling Coach (http://www.warlordgames.com/us-store/roman-travelling-coach.html)
Thanks
n.
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Nice. I don't think it's too pricey though - no-one is going to buy more than one so unit costs rise up. Nice piece.
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Yes, this is a lovely piece and I am surely going to buy it.
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Yes, this is a lovely piece and I am surely going to buy it.
For you paint job, look at this before starting :
(http://www.bdnet.com/img/couvpage/43/9782205049435_pg.jpg)
the picture is coming from "Les voyages d'alix" collection title : Rome (2)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51TW4Y5AF7L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
This kind of books are very useful to find inspiration and full of ideas for conversions....
and there is a lot of subjects :
http://bd.casterman.com/catalogues_list.cfm?Page=1&CategId=1195&OwnerID=1184&PeoplesID=&Order=Title (http://bd.casterman.com/catalogues_list.cfm?Page=1&CategId=1195&OwnerID=1184&PeoplesID=&Order=Title)
From an another comics i found this (title : Les aigles de Rome"). I'll use it for a conversion work on a roman litter project with an umbrella bearer :
(http://imageshack.us/a/img35/1267/rometransport.jpg)
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Definitely pretty much colourful! Just my cup of tea, after painting of all the LAM landsknechts :) thanks for the pics.
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here we are, a 28 mm litter for my roman Projet. :D
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5589/14907474030_4a23771959_z.jpg)
and
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5557/14907474670_1850ca1115_c.jpg)
see all the project right here, in this topic (http://leadadventureforum.com/index.php?topic=63629.0)
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I've just finished a course on the archaeology of Portus, the port complex for Rome and the topic of trade and transport came up both there and also in a great book I found called "The Western Frontiers of Imperial Rome" by Drummond and Nelson (ISBN-13: 978-1563241512 - great background on how the frontier "worked" and an interesting comparison with the American West for those who like their campaigns to have depth!!)
The typical heavy goods "wagon" used by the romans was a two wheeled affair which cut down the load which could be pulled but also the number of oxen required. A light weight wagon with 4 wheels and drop sides pulled by mules was also used.
Both we banned from cities at night.
A very common way of transporting goods was by Mule (or Camel) train. These could probably carry more goods with less of a human team needed to look after them.
Hope that helps a bit.
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The bearers are supposed to be strong, that litter is looking very heavy :) Good work, Eric, well done, nice conversion as usual.
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thanks prof,
8 bearers woould be better but i was too exited to finsih the work.
roman medics could help the stamina of the slaves........or bodybuilding ! ;)
cheers
Eric
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Hey guys,
In a few days, this topic will be provide with some news stuff .
lol
be aware
???
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And here is a transformed roman coach from warbases.
Since me and Eric had the same idea we thought on doing our own versions and place them here.
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Great !
but you go very far in the details.
;D
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Here i am with my version of the wagon, presented by Lucius, for our little contest with my friend Rui about the Warbase (http://war-bases.co.uk/ACCESSORIES/Carts-Wagon?limit=25) Western Van :
(http://war-bases.co.uk/image/cache/data/CARTS/carts%20006%20(640x427)-500x500.jpg)
I repeat that my goal is to provide something close to the reality but not a hyper detailled model.....
The wagon is very good and easy to build, even whitout plan...
I have too many projects to do and so little time snifff :'( :'( :'(
Wa are gone from this :
to this :
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7785/17648698253_054ffbdbf5_c.jpg)
(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8891/18265510622_0b2673e670_c.jpg)
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7733/18269303305_88785f81bb_c.jpg)
(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8843/18265514462_9199016c26_c.jpg)
and with a horse from Front Rank Miniatures for comparison scale :
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7790/18081543360_fbbe6372c8_c.jpg)
(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8821/18242866546_a205b8c23d_c.jpg)
Enjoy
Eric
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It came up nicelly Eric.
From what you made the windows?
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Both nice conversions
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It came up nicelly Eric.
From what you made the windows?
thank you Rui.
My windows come from Warbase window set (10 for Ł1.00 !!!!!) I cut one in 2 parts. These 2 parts are on the wagon now.
Simple and furious , isn't it ?