Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => The Conflicts that came in from the Cold => Topic started by: Arlequín on May 17, 2012, 11:08:48 PM
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I got my copy of this through the post today and while it wasn't quite what I expected, I can still say I was pleased. As you might expect, as it covers several conflicts, it doesn't go into great depth, but sufficiently so for most people's needs as regards using it to play Force on Force.
It covers the Congo (60's), The Portuguese Colonial Wars (60's-70's), Rhodesia (60'-70's), South Africa's Wars (70's-80's) and 'More Recent Wars', which concentrates largely on Sierra Leone. For your money you get conflict/faction specific 'special rules', 'Fog of War' cards, organisational details and vehicle stats.
I've gone into a little more depth here (http://arlequinsworld.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/erm-whoops-and-force-on-force-bush-wars.html), but as a general aid for Force on Force, it's well worth the money imo.
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I'm glad to hear that it's been released. I've been looking forward to this book. :)
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Thanks for the review.
Been thinking about picking up the book.
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Thanks for the review Arlequin, my copy is on it's way as a birthday present end of the month so I woh't be seeing it quite yet. Nice to hear it's covering the main conflicts I have in mind and it'll give me the proverbial boot to get on with all those projects!!
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I downloaded the PDF version as some holiday reading and to be honest, I'm disappointed with this offering but maybe I expected too much.
The section on the Portuguese Colonial Wars is pretty poor IMO. Very little real detail on the TO&Es, some of whicht appears erroneous and none at all on the cavalry units or dragoons. No vehicle stats either, which is a pity as the Portuguese fielded some unique vehicles.
The section on the various guerilla groups is very poor.I have a couple of texts which give the organagrams for the various opposition forces, PAIGC, FRELIMO, the MPLA. I'll make a point of transcribing them here when I get back to reference material.
Some of it can probably be slated to mis-translation, some to fitting the game mechanics but over all I think the research is subpar. OK, you can say that paper organisations are rarely used but then why does FoF go to such trouble to give the paper orgs for other forces?. Give the actual orgs then let gamers play with them is to me the best solution. The authors of the previous offering on Vietnam similarly fucked the pooch when it came to the Australians.
The gaming scenarios in the Portuguese scetion weren't terribly exciting and are all fictitious or rather, as they say in Hollywood, 'based on a true story'. Bit disappointing. Still, I'm quite happy to create my own so that's not a biggie for me.
Like Jim I would have liked to see a broader range covered but that's probably impossible given production costs. I would have thought something like Kolwezi in 1978 would have made perfect FoF gaming fodder and Biafra would probably have been a better choice than the earlier part of the Congo Wars.
Sadly gamers wanting to use this as start point for there own research are going to be disappointed. The bibliography is piss poor and very shallow. Whilst it probably doesn't reflect the extent of source materials used it is none the less irritating for those who want to read further. A goodly chunk, no surprises here, is made up of refs to Osprey MAA books.
I'm sure the Rhodesian and South African bits are ok, that's the real focus of the book although from my perspective I find it amazing that the Portuguese get very little credit for their innovations.
It's OK but for my purposes I'm distictly underwhelmed.
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But for us casual gamers who can't be bothered on the precise facts and just wishes to indulge in bingespending on miniatures, it's alright? :)
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'Spose so but then the point of these things is that they purport to represent some form of historical accuracy.
Of course you could play the game using the organisation of your local boy scout troop, using figures you've fashioned from cardboard and tinsel and create scenarios based on episodes of Dancing with the Stars. More power to those who do, I say
:D
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I sort of took the view that as a starting point into the conflicts, it did its job. There's no depth to it, I'll agree, but to get people putting figures on the table and then hopefully going off and reading up on it as their interest develops it's the ticket. I was a bit underwhelmed at the sources used too and you can't really blame translation either, as one of the authors of the Osprey 'Portugal' book is Portuguese iirc.
A whole book could have been done on any of the wars and you can also argue that South Africa's forays into Angola in the 80's were conventional operations rather than a 'Bush War' as such too. They've gone for a broad overview of several conflicts, which inevitably has a cost to content.
I do think the choice of wars was largely dictated by what Osprey have in their library and it shows in the Congo section as there is no pretty art work to go with it. I thought the scenarios were fine and the first Portuguese one quite a departure in its subject matter, although I wonder how many people will buy the figures for it.
Had the whole book been done on the Portuguese Wars, I think I'd be as disappointed as I was with the Osprey title to be honest... to read about the Portuguese Army's organisation for a page or so and then to be told 'but that wasn't used in Africa' was frustrating to say the least.
I didn't pick up on that there was no Portuguese vehicle list till Carlos mentioned it, although most of the vehicles can be taken from the other lists... the inclusion of the 'Rooikat' seems ambiguous too, as even the notes say that it wasn't used during the Border War.
Point taken about the organisations and I'd really like to see the ones Carlos has... I've spent many hours looking for them myself! FoF does normally make a point of showing the paper organisations, but I've found myself that material for these are often hard to track down and many are often full of fantasy or a wargamer's 'wants', rather than reflecting reality. So I'm willing to excuse 'Bush Wars' for not committing itself to following that course by making its own up.
I still think it is a good addition to FoF for these sort of conflicts, but yes it could always have been better, covered more suitable ground and provided enough material for several books, rather than one catch-all supplement.
But for us casual gamers who can't be bothered on the precise facts and just wishes to indulge in bingespending on miniatures, it's alright? :)
Yes imo :)
Of course you could play the game using the organisation of your local boy scout troop, using figures you've fashioned from cardboard and tinsel and create scenarios based on episodes of Dancing with the Stars. More power to those who do, I say
:D
You swore you'd never tell about all that!
;)
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Awaiting my copy with rather less enthusiasm now :(
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in Africa' was frustrating to say the least.
You swore you'd never tell about all that!
;)
Oops! Well I would have stayed shtum had you not decided to go that extra yard in brinkmanship and create an Anne Widdecombe in lycra figure. You only have yourself to blame old boy! :D
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<snip>
Biafra would probably have been a better choice than the earlier part of the Congo Wars.
Funny you should mention that, I need to brush up on that conflict for work purposes...
Gracias,
Glenn
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Greeting all.
I was the lead author on the FoF Bush Wars project. I'll try to answer a few of the concerns that some have voiced here.
Aside from the short chapter introduction, I did not write any of the Portuguese Colonial Wars material, so I really cannot speak to the reasearch. But I can say that our author on that section was not a native English speaker, so that might account for some of the issues that have been pointed out here and elsewere. I regret any factual errors that might have crept in.
Yes, it does apear that we gave only modest coverage to each conflict and I agree that we could have written a whole source book on any of the wars we featured in the book. I would have loved to have written an entire book on Rhodesia as that's my "pet period" (and to a lesser extent South Africa and the Congo) of this genre but the multi-conflict aproach was what we went with in the end. We did had five different conflicts to cover and less than 150 pages to do it. The idea behind the work was to give a basic introduction for new gamers to the genre of post-Colonial African conflicts rather than detailed coverage on any one war, with some basic background material, painting guide, example scenarios, etc. I hope that the book acomplished that goal.
Now for a few specific comments:
you can also argue that South Africa's forays into Angola in the 80's were conventional operations rather than a 'Bush War' as such too
I fully agree. That was actually one of the reasons we chose to cover the South African Border War as it highlights one of the forms that post-colonial warfare in Africa took. It wasn't all just low intinsity/counter-insurgency actions after all. There is a world of difference between it and say the Congo Crisis. Once again, this was to give a wide variety of choices to the gamer.
it shows in the Congo section as there is no pretty art work to go with it
Again I agree. Osprey really does need a title on that war! Sadly, I did not have access to any painted examples of the excellent Britannia Congo figures for use in illustrating that section untill after it went to press. Thus that chapter is the sparcest in the pretty picture department. As it was one of the sections I was actual author on, I do regret that. Ah well.
the inclusion of the 'Rooikat' seems ambiguous too, as even the notes say that it wasn't used during the Border War.
I included games stats for the Rooikat in case someone wanted to field one in their own "what if" type scenario. The same could be said for the inclusion of T-55s in the Rhodesian vehicles list. It's such a cool vehicle, it seemed a shame to leave it out....that and the QRF Rooikat model is such a pretty piece!
Anyway, that's enough for right now. Thanks for the feedback and comments. I'll watch this thread in case anyone has any more questions about the work.
Martin
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No questions, just a big Thank You for taking the time to clarify some points raised in this thread. It's always great to hear it straight from the author, a close communication between producers and customers is what makes this hobby great.
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Thanks for the feedback and comments.
You can't keep all of the people happy all of the time... :)
I think whatever was included there'd be someone who would have been expecting something that was left out, and you'd have ended up with a five volume work, which still wasn't complete to everyone's satisfaction. I was actually surprised to see the Congo in at all to be honest, as I'm aware there is no Osprey book to draw art from, so more power to the team for that!
The only real disappointment for me was the omission of some 'Bush Wars' specific campaign rules, along the lines of the old ones in the original 'Ambush Valley'. Why that was I don't know, especially as when I went to my new copy of Ambush Valley, I realised they hadn't made the cut there either.
Given that there was a page limit and in all likelihood that there will only ever be one book that covers Africa, I don't feel that any pages were wasted and each period got pretty much an even share... South Africa and Rhodesia got the most, but then more information is readily available and accessible for them. They are also on the whole more popular (probably partly for the same reason). While I might have preferred more on a single topic amongst those offered, so would every one else with their pet period too.
If I was wielding the editor's sword, I would have quite selfishly cut it all off at about 1978-ish... imo after that point the wars in Africa changed into something else entirely. Biafra and the early part of the Angolan Civil War would be shunted into 'Bush Wars' and me and probably four or five other people would have been over the moon with that. I would have pushed to have the SA Bush War, along with the Ogaden-Eritrean Wars and whatever else happened after 1980 in a separate book. I suspect that Bush Wars and the second book, if it ever saw the light of day, would have suffered commercially as a result however.
I still think Bush Wars is a good addition to the AA range and certainly don't regret buying it. I also appreciate you taking the time to drop by and add your opinions too!
:)
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Maybe some fans will create supplements that fill the omitted rules and background info and put it up on the Ambush Alley website :)
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I was certainly impressed with the book. It is impossible to do justice to the historical background in a book of this nature so for me it's all about the scenarios, which by and large look pretty good.
Now where can I get my hands on a 28mm T54/55 that isn't a plastic kit?
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On Ebay. Search for T-55. You'll get about half a dozen vendors all in China.
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On Ebay. Search for T-55. You'll get about half a dozen vendors all in China.
I think you'll find those are real ones... lol
Kidding... this one (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Russian-T-55-Tank-Military-Diecast-T55-/120915376959?pt=Diecast_Vehicles&hash=item1c271e3b3f#ht_2047wt_1344) is 1/43, but with die casts it could go either way scale-wise.
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I think you'll find those are real ones... lol
Kidding... this one (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Russian-T-55-Tank-Military-Diecast-T55-/120915376959?pt=Diecast_Vehicles&hash=item1c271e3b3f#ht_2047wt_1344) is 1/43, but with die casts it could go either way scale-wise.
Actually, it scales out to about 1/50. I have a platoon's worth and I measured them. (Ok so I'm a prat, I know :)) They're perfect for 28mm figures and you can just respray them without stripping or priming. The one real improvement you can make is to swap the AAMG for the Eureka one but the one that comes with the model is perfectly OK.
I'm a little curious about the whole lost in translation thing, it doesn't really seem to fit with information provided. The paper org and 1970 reorg of the PAIGC's armed forces is fairly easy to source albeit Frelimo and the MPLA marginally less so. The basic TO&Es also seem to fly in the face of a fairly well known commentary by Spinola regarding the relative fighting power of Portuguese vs PAIGC forces in Guine.
Oh well. It looks nice at least.
I see they seem to have shelved their plans for the title on Central and South American conflicts. Probably just as well, caling it Contra didn't bode well for the subject matter and given the nature of much of the fighting in El Salvador and Guatemala............ ::)
I did have a giggle about the Amazon blurb which promised scenarios set in Brazil. Christ knows what they meant by that, probably 'get the baddy' scenarios inspired by playing Call of Duty.
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Computer games as historical source. ::)
Lovely. :-[
Wikipedia at it's worst level. >:D
South/Central America sounded interesting to me.
Gracias,
Glenn
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I see they seem to have shelved their plans for the title on Central and South American conflicts. Probably just as well, caling it Contra didn't bode well for the subject matter and given the nature of much of the fighting in El Salvador and Guatemala............ ::)
I did have a giggle about the Amazon blurb which promised scenarios set in Brazil. Christ knows what they meant by that, probably 'get the baddy' scenarios inspired by playing Call of Duty.
You've given me visions of scenarios where the police chase loggers around the rainforest! lol
All joke to aside, have any modern conflicts even happened in Brazil...?
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Carlos, I'm sincerely sorry if our level of historical accuracy in the Portuguese section disappointed you. That section was written by a Portuguese national and English is not his first language. Although his English is quite good, Martin and I occasionally had to interpret his exact meaning and any errors probably result from that. I'm sure he'll address the questions on his presentation of Portuguese organizations at some point.
I feel as if you may have taken offense at the section, as you seem to be a little upset with us (we do not design scenarios after playing Call of Duty - in fact, we don't even play Call of Duty, and we certainly don't use wikipedia as a source for anything but occasional amusement ;) ). I apologize for any offense you took away from our handling of the topic and assure you it was not our intent to slight ether the subject matter or you.
We have a widely international fan base, with a surprising number of customers in Portugal. Our intent was to provide a short section of scenarios that might capture the interest of non-Portuguese gamers who might not be aware of the Portugal's fascinating military experiences in Africa. We thought it best to use a Portuguese author for the subject as he would have more access to historical resources than we would. We're not experts on the subject, obviously, so if any errors were made we were in no position to spot them (not to be argumentative, I'm still not certain there are errors - there may simply be differences of historical opinion between you and our author). I hope that some players can overlook any errors we've made and still enjoy the scenarios, scenarios we hope will inspire more interest in area that is somewhat neglected by wargamers in general.
If you have better (or just different) organizations that you would like to share with others, please send them to me at shawn@ambushalleygames.com and I'd be happy to share them with our players by posting them on our website. Likewise, if you have scenarios that you feel would be more illustrative of this conflict, we'd love to share those with our players as well.
On the topic of Brazil, btw, we've had requests from several players, including a couple in Brazil, for scenarios involving police raids against drug lords in the Rio favelas. Our game can be used for much more than major military operations, after all. ;)
Best wishes to all,
Shawn.
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Shawn,
No need to apologise. I own the core rules, its earlier iteration and three of the genre specific supplements. On the whole I'm quite happy with FoF. It's largely responsible for renewing my interest in playing skirmish level modern games and for that I'm genuinely grateful. You can be proud of the system you have produced. If it sounded as if I was carping then, I'm sorry, I really do like the system.
I'm quite happy to share what information I have. I don't pretend to be an expert but I have read reasonably widely on the subject and I can read Portuguese ( just as well or reading the paper would be a really fucking tiresome affair ;D) I did make a start on your forum and I will provide what I have both there and here when I get back to my reference material, which currently is on the other side of the world. In the interim, might I suggest anyone interested in the subject takes a look at this site, which provides a handy overview of the conflict, including some TO&E information may be found here.
http://www.guerracolonial.org/home
I have more detailed sources but this is a very useful website for starters. Even if you don't read or speak Portuguese, most web translators will prove adequate in providing a transliteration.
With regards to Brazil, well that's a matter of taste I suppose. Wargamers are a truly tiny community in Brazil. Due to the associated costs it's a near certainty that anyone who games in Brazil is relatively privileged. Perhaps not surprsingly many people in that particular strata of society dont have a great deal of empathy with their less privileged bretheren. Oddly enough, I suspect I've had more contact with the poor on their home turf than many upper class Brazilians.
For me, it's a somewhat vex subject. Whilst I have zero tolerance for traficantes (I was quite happy when the police shot Matematico last week) I know people who live in these communities and I've been fortunate enough to visit a number. I also know a few members of the police, mostly in Salvador. For me, a gringo, albeit with extensive and deep connections here, it's not a topic I have much desire to game. For starters it's a pretty complex subject, shades of grey exist on both sides. It's becoming a bit old hat anyway, at least in Rio. The continuing roll out of the UPP program has seen dramatic reductions in the sorts of scenes depicted in Tropa de Elite or Cidade de Deus. I'm not at all troubled by current levels of security here, although Salvador, sadly has become appreciably more dangerous in recent times.
I couldn't imagine you would want to produce scenarios for the Mexican drug wars, the LA riots or clearing operations in the projects in NY or NJ. Something about being a little close to the bone.
Anyway congrats on the system. Happy to provide whatever positive contribution I can.
Regards.
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You've given me visions of scenarios where the police chase loggers around the rainforest! lol
All joke to aside, have any modern conflicts even happened in Brazil...?
Since the Second World War not a great deal. Brazil provided troops to the US occupation of the Dominican Republic in 1965 (Operation Powerpack). Brazil is the lead nation and most significant contributor of troops to the UN stabilisation mission in Haiti. The permanent commander of the UN ops in Haiti is Brazilian. Brazil has also contributed troops and police to various other UN peacekeeping and observation activities, including East Timor.
Domestically? There was a limited rural guerilla campaign against the dictatorship in the early 'seventies, mostly in what is now Tocantins. Not much gaming potential there I'm afraid. If you are interested, then the best book on the subject is Morais and Silva's Operação Araguaia.
There was considerable urban guerilla activity in the late sixties by the ALN, MR-8 and others which had some level of success (my nom de plume is a an odd tribute). The biggest coup was the capture of the US ambassador and the release of 18 prisoners of the dicatatorship in exchange. Not especially gameable. As it happens, this week President Dilma inaguarated the Truth Comission to look into human rights abuses under the ditadura.
In recent years the army has been involved in ops along the border against traffickers. The airforce has been involved in bombing jungle landing strips of the same. The army and marines have been occasionally used to support police operations. Earlier this year, the Fuzileiros Navais supported Operação Choque de Paz in Rio, deploying AFVs whilst the police occupied and established police outposts in Vidigal and Rocinha. The army has been involved in similar ops before but on the whole the military has been shy of getting too involved in part because of the corrupting influence of drug wars.
Then there are the paramiltary operations by various state police forces against criminal activities. The most famous of which is Rio's BOPE (the SF battalion of the state police). The two biggest grossing local films in Brazil featured the BOPE. BOPE are probably the most experienced operators in urban combat in the world. For years it's been a day in, day out affair for them. BOPE are part of the states Policia Militar but similar units exist in other states and also in the Policia Civil and the Federal Police. There's also a National strikeforce made up of members of different state PMs. They were involved in operations against traficantes in Catete, just this week. Apart from the drug busts the most notable incident was that a pigeon crapped on the state minister for public security. lol
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Computer games as historical source. ::)
Don't knock them, I had a group of 'historically apathetic' kids asking about the Cuban Missile Crisis, Castro and Kennedy, after playing 'Black Ops' and I know of a teacher who has used Assassin's Creed to bring medieval Florence to life for his students. Bland books and lectures don't cut it with many of today's kids and you have to use teaching aids where you find them!
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Shawn, no insult intended to your efforts. If my despise of some sources in Wikipedia seemed to reflect on you that was unintentional.
As for wikipedia, well I research for a living and I will continue to reject work from contractors that depict a building footprint from wikimapia with a "second source" from wikipedia quoting the wikimapia source.
Crowd sourcing has intense value ins some scenarios (even our line of work as it has evolved since 9/11,) but wikipedia has to be confirmed by two reliable, independent (not one copying/pasting the first source,) sources before I use it professionally and only then as a tertiary source.
Wikipedia is an awareness thing but as a serious source it is "highly variable" in accuracy and reliability. Never say never, perhaps, but never as a primary or secondary source. Lives depend on correct identification of targets versus no-strike facilities (ask our "sister agency" about Chinese embassies...) and, while they did not use wikipedia, I find wikipedia fine for awareness purposes only.
Gracias,
Glenn
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Greetings all,
Sorry for the delay getting on the forum.
As one of the authors, namely responsible for the scenarios on the Portuguese Colonial and Border Wars is time to also answer some questions.
First this was a project that grows up as we start to talk with the group, encompassing projects as Operation Barras in Serra Leone, plus Congo, Portugal Colonial Wars, Rhodesia and Border wars.
Soon Shawn was establishing a goal of 20 scenarios, creamed in a mere 150 pages volume.
While at first this was easy, soon the list grows up to some 30 scenario projects, plus the TO&E and background – so something had to go out.
After tying all up, we have to cut things, making decisions and sometimes sacrificing data and info.
I accept that I prefer to give more scenarios than expanding TO&E in most cases simply on paper, as on the field things tend to be different, but any one is free to post here or on the AA Forum any TO&E you feel like and consider relevant.
I agree that my language can be dry – not easy when not a native English speaker and using a more formalized writing language (I’m an archaeologist by trade) – and for that I must ask your pardon.
It’s also my mistake not to include some bibliographic references for the Portuguese Colonial Wars, even if those I’ve used where mostly in Portuguese, and not always easy accessible outside Portugal.
On the scenarios, I could have use the very same ones I helped write and play tested for the B’Maso system, but that wouldn’t be fair for Shawn and the team, also I had choose some generic scenarios based on most common operations on former Portuguese colonies, but as that was the path of Martin, I prefer a different choice.
As far as the scenarios were concerned all – with exception of the one set in Guiné – were real ones, with just some data modified, and where gathered from several previous participants on the operations – Portugal still have reconciliation with is past, and start to published some veterans memories and Retornados stories.
Are they relevant? Yes, they are! are they common? Except the first scenario (very limited in time) yes!
Let’s admit one thing, most actions in the Portuguese Wars (and perhaps on all asymmetric conflicts) are «a one side show» - ambushes, raids and patrols – where for most part one of the sides didn’t detect the other, and when they did, with was too late for someone. Not exactly a balanced game for two or more gamers, only fun for solo, but if someone disagree, again is free to post some scenarios.
Then main idea behind this supplement – and I will loved to write a part II – is to give an idea of the conflict in Africa, getting beyond the concept of a Iraqi or Afghan type of war, with the insurgents replaced by Africans rebels.
Portugal made a «poor man» fighting against the liberation movements, both sides weren’t particularly well equipped, so a “light Infantry” fighting it was, but even so, some new tactics where develop based on foreign examples, and by their part also giving ideas for other armies in similar conflicts.
Some of the fighting in south Angola between SADF and FAPLA were the biggest tank battles in the continent after WW2, this conflict ranged from anti-insurgency aspects to a formal conventional conflict.
Could we have done more? Yes! If we have more pages available, or perhaps a smaller scope supplement, but I believe if we have done that people were also complaining it.
Thanks for your time
Jose “Faustnik” Ventura
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Welcome to the forum Jose and I'm sorry your first post is an explanation. :)
I can not speak for anyone else, but I did not find your English 'dry' at all. I thought it was well written and I have seen far, far worse from native English speakers! I do think it was a mistake to include what you did in the bibliography... to me that implies that you based your research on them, which is clearly not the case. Personally I would have given my sources, even if they were not in English... to deal with another language when researching is the reader's problem, no?
You have hit the mark with your assessment of the appeal of the wars though. It was a 'poor man's war' and the Portuguese were without all of the technology and fire power present in Vietnam. This makes it a far more appealing option to game to me. The language barrier and scarcity of material outside Portugal makes it really difficult to obtain accurate information, so many of us rely on second and third hand information and trust in the person telling us about it.
As I've said before, I was happy with what I got... but I would also have paid for a whole book just on the Portuguese! ;)
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José,
Bem-vindo ao LAF! Obrigado pela sua reposta, foi muito gentil e como dizem, gentileza gera gentileza. Estou curioso para saber quais as fontes que você usado em escrever o capítulo sobre a Guerra Colonial. Pode de escrever os nomes dos livros?
abraço
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Jose “Faustnik” Ventura,
Dude, as someone who does research myself I can say that working in another language (my employer, because of a dearth of native speakers, wants us to work in machine translation - gag - of Hausa lately... seriously?) is a real chore for me and no apologies are needed for your efforts to bring all the history into one book in English. It's always easy to want more or to want the author to have spent more time on the our personal interests but a wide-ranging book like this will seldom (never?) cover everyone's interest like they want.
I am sure the team you worked with found more data then could fit into the book's space/format limitations. Isn't that the way it usually is? Either not enough (at least in the researcher's native language) or too much information found? With this one work alone you have surpassed the production of many of us.
Now, on to the next research project!
Gracias,
Glenn
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José,
Welcome to LAF! Thanks for your response, it was very kind and as they say, kindness generates kindness. I'm curious to know what sources you used in writing the chapter on the Colonial War. You can write the names of the books?
We have this itty bitty rule about posting in inglesa*. ::)
*¿Eu sei, eu sei, mas o que você pode fazer? ;)
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Thankee kindly brother Jim.
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We have this itty bitty rule about posting in inglesa*. ::)
*¿Eu sei, eu sei, mas o que você pode fazer? ;)
Well, yes. Although free machine translation (as much as it loses so much of the meaning in the context,) gives - usually - the essence of the meaning.
But rules are rules.
Gracias,
Glenn
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Translators do make life easier, but imagine if everyone posted in their own language and maybe you had to click to translate, at best, say every other post? Especially as you say, the spirit of the post is often lost in literal translation... take abraço for example.
:D
I'm invariably amazed on here at the skill of some people whose first language isn't English and by the same token grateful of the lack of ridicule when I'm forced to communicate in anything but...
:)
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Lads,
First thanks for the warm welcome
Now about some bibliography on the Portuguese Colonial Wars, and filling a missing area, were we go…
In 2000 Aniceto AFONSO and Carlos de Matos GOMES published the first non-official History of the Colonial Wars, published in Portuguese, by Editorial Notícias, by now a hard to get publication – and heavy, being around 3 Kg - which includes official reports, veterans accounts and modeling aspects.
(http://entre-paginas.com/portal/images/stories/guerra%20colonial.jpg)
Until them you could only rely on the «Livro Branco da Guerra Colonial» produced by the Portuguese GHQ.
In 2008 and 2009 GOMES & AFONSO published another’s series of booklets «Os Anos da Guerra Colonial»
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_rStsnVQGhFc/Sa5hMtm_m2I/AAAAAAAAAXA/9VC8CNc1_Hw/s400/DSC01598.JPG)
Each related to a year of the conflict, and mostly with veterans accounts, even having some pictorial reconstructions of some battles & Operations, similar to the ones from Osprey. Unfortunately only in Portuguese and by now only available on second hand bookstores or EBay.
(http://fotos.sapo.pt/B2ed81VPEReOfd2ZcLtD/)
Another source of info are….. the veterans themselves, mostly using their sons (some of them wargamers) or by direct contact (I’m a former servicemen from an Armoured unit, so it helps), sadly most of their info will be lost soon, if not published.
While I know that some 10 years ago, a well known portuguese reporter, manage to put on tape more than two hundred hours of veterans accounts, these were never made public, sadly an important info in all aspects of the war.
For the hardware, I’m most oblige to my former commander and military mentor Fernando Salgueiro Maia, which wrote the first and only history of the Portuguese Armoured Forces and their equipment, sadly never published.
Hope this was of some help, any more questions just ask, I will make my best to answer them
Jose “Faustnik” Ventura
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José ;)
The second series of books - «Os Anos da Guerra Colonial» - has been compiled in one book and it's still available:
http://www.fnac.pt/Os-Anos-da-Guerra-Colonial-1961-1975-Aniceto-Afonso/a329754?PID=5&Mn=-1&Ra=-1&To=0&Nu=2&Fr=0
44€ for more than 800 pages is still a good deal.
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José,
You served under the legendary Salgueiro Maia? I'm most impressed, he's something of a hero to me.
I have some of those titles. Ancieto and Gomes' title is a goldmine. I've said it before on an earlier thread but this really is the best single volumne item for the gamer. If you look closely at that one the TO&Es and OBs for the PAIGC, Frelimo and MPLA are all laid out in the book and they seem to be confoirmed by other sources. I'm mildly surprised they didn't make it into Bush Wars but perhaps that was an editing choice. It's also still in print I oredreda copy from Portugal and it travelled to the other side of the world with a postage tab of only 12 euro. I suspect a mistake ws made somewhere. :)
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José,
You served under the legendary Salgueiro Maia? I'm most impressed, he's something of a hero to me.
A good commander and excellent instructor (in 1978) - I've tried to introduce him to wargaming, but to him the roll of dices weren't a easily accepted concept.
A+
Faustnik