Lead Adventure Forum
Miniatures Adventure => Future Wars => Topic started by: Elbows on July 05, 2014, 04:22:46 AM
-
Hey all,
I've been a long-time Battletech fan. I suppose that's odd since I've always despised the game itself (the classic hex version). When I was younger my love for Robotech inevitably led to me to other big stompy robots. I picked up a bunch of technical readouts back in the mid-early 90's. I read a dozen of the novels and really enjoyed the fluff and setting. I enjoyed several of the earlier Mechwarrior games up through college when the franchise all but disappeared.
I've seen a recent resurgence under Catalyst Games (the fourth or fifth owner/version of the company). I picked up a copy of the new revised 2014 starter box and was so pleasantly surprised with the better mechs that I picked up a couple more boxes. I'm a huge fan of the 3025-3050 and then I lose all interest in everything later. The question is: I have the mechs, I have some old technical readouts, and I love the setting = how do I play Battletech?
I dislike the clunky very poor design of classic Battletech. I hate IGOUGO, and I hate the distinct damage of the weapons etc. I haven't been impressed with what I've seen from the Alpha Strike demos I've seen. I'm aiming to run 4-12 mechs per side. Artillery/aerospace/vehicles are optional and I'm fine with them being represented by abstract or off-board mechanics. I'm 100% opposed to points/tonnage matched tournament style gaming. I'm far more interested in scenarios/skirmish level games with uneven forces and objectives etc.
So, what game rules would you suggest as a stand in? I have 70+ plastic mechs, a hoard of Robotech Kickstarter mechs slated to arirve (which can represent an additional 12 types of Unseen mechs), and I even have a box of Dougram collectors minis which will represent MORE Unseen mechs. I'll be gaming 3025-3050 only.
Thoughts?
Agis, does your Victory Decision work with enough detail to run a Battletech game?
-
I find myself exactly where you are, although I've read closer to 50 novels now, and I'm in the process of building to scale mechs in 1/100 scale.
I'm well into the biggerisation of the 3rd mech in line now (all old japanese model kits in differing scales. I'm also interested in the pre-clan invasion era, so all of these are unseen for now. Maybe later, I will convert /scratchbuild original designs).
Other than having a vague plan of putting the mechs on hex bases, I have not thought about how to game these yet. Plan is between 1 to 3 lances per side, with eventual infantry, AFV and air support.
I agree on the clunkiness of the original rules, but I always very much liked the idea of damage allocation. The novels were all written with the original gameplay in mind, so aiming for and blasting off an opponent's right arm PPC should be possible.
But there are many usable rule sets out there, so until I've got enough models to actually game with, I'm just reading around to see what others are doing. So far I've not seen anything that tickled my actuators though...
-
With all the people looking for alternative rule sets to play battletech I am surprised I haven't heard about some third party attempt at it.
I hear more then a few people use armored grid Mech attack rules for quick games with battletech miniatures. The rules are written with their own paper models in mind but are open enough to use other models. (I have used em3 mechs with it)
-
Yeah I want the Battletech feel (slow stompy, overheating, ammo explosions etc.). I'm more interested in the Robotech Kickstarter on the way, but since they're now the same scale - I figure terrain will serve double duty and I can then use a bunch of the Robotech figs (if they scale close enough).
I want to introduce a lot of simplified elements (dropship effects, tactics, command strategies, off-board support, ambushes, random mechanical breakdowns) so as always I'd consider some additional decks/tables.
Unfortunately Catalyst seems to be on a "buy a million books" policy and I'd like to avoid buying a half dozen PDFs, or a dozen technical read outs etc. Alpha Strike seems to really over-simplify a lot of stuff to an almost extreme level. I suppose I'm looking for something between the two. I'd like to avoid having to make my own game (not that I'm against it..it's just very time consuming).
Rather frustrating.
-
I'd like to avoid having to make my own game (not that I'm against it..it's just very time consuming).
Rather frustrating.
I know that feeling, sometimes your looking for a game and its absurd how there isn't anything out there.
If you end up going the make your own route please do so on this forum, seems like there are more people on here who are looking for what your describing who would be supportive and if nothing else it would be interesting to watch the process.
-
That's the problem. I enjoy making games, but if I go through all the work to do it, I might as well sell it - not something I can do with Robotech or Battletech. I wouldn't be opposed to hosting something at conventions for fun, but it's a ton of work just for me and some friends. lol
I suppose the easiest thing would be to find a game which has a "build a mech" mechanic and abuse the piss out of it. Scurv, does "Junk" have that feature?
-
I had thought about some sort of adaptation of the Warmachine rules, as those also have damage allocation on Warjacks. There apparently also are Colossal rules for machines the size of battlemechs.
But other than that (and the aforementioned papercraft rules), I really haven't given it much thought yet...
-
I think Total War features rules for hexless games.
-
Have a look at "Future War Commander". Link: http://www.blitzkrieg-commander.com/default.aspx?Area=FWC (http://www.blitzkrieg-commander.com/default.aspx?Area=FWC)
6mm FWC is one of the more commonly played games at my gaming club. We don't often play with anything larger than a super-heavy tank but the rules for mechs/titans are all there, plus you can download the cost calculator (for free) and customise your whole force.
It also includes rules for many of the things you mentioned; orbital strikes, off-table artillery strikes, fast air (& on-table gunships), ambushes.
I'm sure there must be reviews or game overviews on youtube or elsewhere.
-
Yes it does.
In fact it has stuff for building your own infantry (rednecks on foot) Vehicles (rednecks in pickups and camaros.) and Mecha (beer powered mecha made out of scrap.) Which if you think about it fits the jury rigged nature of the mechs of the era you are gunning for.
As for battletech itself it runs fine up to lance on lance and after that its not apples. The same deal with Junk™ I suspect. With BT adding vehicles is a disaster as is aircraft in my opinion. They are too overpowered and useful.
The best BT rules are the old white book ones which are 24 pages long. It has all the stats for the unseen mechs and runs well up to lance on lance.
If you want dozens of mecha on the table then I would use rules not based on mecha but based on a sci fi skirmish game with about 30 figs a side. The big question is how many mecha do you want on the table and how fast should it run?
I think you hit the nail on the head. The 'problems' with BT are similar to ones with Car Wars, ironically of the same age more or less. Car Wars is a great game, when you keep it to car, cycle and even 18-wheeler. Once the game added tanks and planes and boats it was dead. A simple game of auto combat with a reasonable choice of weapons and it was great as a simulation of auto combat. Add in too much, and it was a headache.
In the same way, BT is a simulation of giant robot combat, not of giant robot warfare. What I mean is, it's detailed enough to allow a player to run 2-4 mechs comfortably and to a sufficient level of detail that they are quite individualized. But when you want to run a few lances of mechs, that's a different scale altogether, and one that the system was neither made for, nor could accommodate.
I really like BT and found a guy at my club who wants to play. I plan to paint up some Black Widows for a classic scenario. To me, like with Car Wars, it's the best way to enjoy the game.
-
At this point I'm leaning toward making my own game. My old Robotech rules were actually what turned into my Old West rules (basic mechanics) and I think I might go back to a version of the Robotech rules but for Battletech. It handled 6-12 mecha fine per side...even in a larger scale.
I'll use the stats from the TROs...but very simplified. I'd like to be able to handle up to 10-12 mechs per side. I think I'll keep infantry/artillery/AT etc. to a strategy or event deck. The more I think about my old Robotech the system the more I can see it working for Battletech.
-
Argh...it's just time consuming. Besides lightning fast anime mecha are easier to interpret. Trying to capture the clunky mechanics of the Battletech universe is more difficult. I suppose it'll be good to start work on - because if the Robotech miniatures game is garbage when it comes out I'll have to do the same thing (sigh).
Perhaps I can figure out a reasonable set of rules which can be easily adapted to both. I'll be sharing terrain (one of the only reasons I bothered buying Battletech mechs anyway). I've been reading some technical read outs and scribbling stuff down - even received some Dougram Gashapon which fit the scale enough to be used (yay more unseen!).
-
Someone recommended this to me
http://armorgridgames.blogspot.co.uk/2010/03/armor-grid-mech-attack.html
Played a couple of games with my son, worked really well.
I added a couple of extra weapons for the BT feel and made a few alterations.
Biggest problem was looking at the effects of heat
-
Hmmm...cheap. I might download one and check it out. Thanks!
(though I admit while jogging tonight I did think of a solution to one of my main mechanic problems...so it got the wheels turning)
-
cripes, now you guys got me thinking about CBT.... and at a time when i'm getting comfortable with my airbrush to bang through those mechs... jammer! :D
-
Silly question: are there any good battletech community forums? The official forum is...terrible.
Can anyone recommend a community which is less 40K-tournament-players-esque? The official forums are borderline depressing, and far too stat/tournament heavy. Perhaps a forum dedicated to old school battletech or simply fluff?
-
Part from country-specific ones, the only big one I know of is Lords of the Battlefield.
-
Silly question: are there any good battletech community forums?
http://www.lordsofthebattlefield.com/ is the one i hit most often. There are a slew of them out there. Try LotB and see what you make of it.
Grimm
-
REAPER have an own rule system to go along their macha minis: CAV.
I have been interested in this for a long time because it seems less book-heavy than Battletech. I eventually bought the rule book. Now they offer the rules as a FREE download from their website: https://www.reapermini.com/Games/CAV
-
Thanks guys, I've joined the LOTB forum and will check out the CAV rules.
-
I'd be willing to share my Goalsystem RoboFire rules draft with folks. Let me know if you want to take a look at them.
Once SuperSystem and Warband: Goalsystem Fantasy Skirmish are done, I think RoboFire would be next on my list.
-
Just be careful with the CAV rules - the book and the site downloads are (I think) different versions (Book - CAV 1, PDF - CAV 2). Prefer the original book version, but that's just me.
-
Just be careful with the CAV rules - the book and the site downloads are (I think) different versions (Book - CAV 1, PDF - CAV 2). Prefer the original book version, but that's just me.
What would be the main differences between the two?
-
Thanks guys, I've joined the LOTB forum and will check out the CAV rules.
Remember two things. LotB and CAV rules are two separate things.
Also, over on LotB watch out for Zac, AKA AVA MANGO TWO. He has been out sitting in the sun for a long time awaiting someone to post something. He has been eying up this plump roach for some time as a meal. The roach moved on so Zac has been looking for other sustenance so watch your back. :-)
Grimm
-
You might check out Alpha Strike one more time but buy the Companion. It really makes the game feel complete to me by adding alot of detail and changing some of the sillier rules of the initial incarnation.
-
Will do. This project is not a priority (in fact it's about 3rd or 4th on my "to do" list) so I'll be perusing rules, websites and forums for quite some time before anything gets put on the table. I'm sure I'll get around to it.
-
I'd also give Alpha Strike a go. I've played several games now using those rules and my group here quite like them.
;)
-
I'm in a similar boat. I love the BT universe, but not the rules. A few comments on 2 rulesets I've played and 2 I haven't
Alpha Strike.
Only played it a couple times, but I like it. it's quite abstract, but when you want a game with 10,20 or more units on the table it's an excellent option. Though streamlined, it has the feel of the BT universe.
Mech Attack
A favorite of mine. It's plays about the same scope of BT and functions well with 5-10 or so units per player. It has most of the BT universe elements (customizability/construction, heat, damage grid, varried weapons, etc) but plays in about 1/4 the time. Has rules for infantry and vehicles. The only thing it lacks is jump jets, though it could be house-ruled.
I use it in 10mm with rebased Mechwarrior Dark Age miniatures and 28mm with large mech models.
Send me a PM if you'd want to have the statlines for some for some of the mechs I've done up.
CAV
I've not played it, but alot of folks speak especially well of it. 3 versions.
CAV (1) The only version that was ever in print. Rulebook and the 2 Journals of Recognition are still available for a reasonable cost from Troll and Toad,
CAV 2 Only available as PDF. Still available for download from Reaper
CAV: Strike Operations. Currently in development. The beta rules might still be available via the reaper website. Rumored to be released via a kickstarater with mechs in the PVC "Bones" materials that have already been shown online.
GRUNTZ 15mm
Another ruleset that I've not played, but have read. A really nice production and is reported to be very well playtested with a very active author. Looks more crunchy than Mech attack, but nicely done with some mechanics similar to Warmachine. The author has actually said before that it was intended as a replacement for Battletech.
-
Someone recommended this to me
http://armorgridgames.blogspot.co.uk/2010/03/armor-grid-mech-attack.html
Played a couple of games with my son, worked really well.
I added a couple of extra weapons for the BT feel and made a few alterations.
Biggest problem was looking at the effects of heat
I'm curious what weapons you added beyond the ones in the rules?
And yep, a good set of rules for playing w/ the young'uns, in my experience.
-
Having only dabble in Jovian Chronicles Lightning Strike, I know nothing about the previous game, but is there any love here for Heavy Gear?
I see DP9 is gong to try, One More Time.
Doug
-
And yep, a good set of rules for playing w/ the young'uns, in my experience.
Not bad for adults and conventions either…
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2014/05/mech-attack-battle-report-from-little.html